Topic: ... (Read 4586 times)

I was just able to completely read through this thread (took awhile but definitely interesting) and I have to side with DjVoodo on this one. turtlehurricane/theturtleisalive, like it's been mentioned before, it would be far easier to trust your side of the story if you can provide some proof of sending the gold back. Anything really, a tracking number, receipt, email correspondence with Amazon, or let a trusted escrow into your Amazon account to verify that the order status is "Returned", "Return in progress", or something similar to that.

Also, I'm sure I wasn't the only one to see the copy-paste spam posts you were making yesterday to bump up over a dozen old threads involving Quickseller. I think a ban for that was totally justified, because this forum has rules against spamming. I don't believe your banning had anything to do with Quickseller, but rather breaking forum rules that you should have known (you're a Hero member so you've been here awhile, you should have known the rules).

You said a few posts back that you'd call Amazon in the morning and receive proof of returning the gold that you weren't supposed to receive. Did you ever end up doing that? Right now it looks like you posted that message, went on a spamming spree about Quickseller, and then received a ban on your main account. In the last couple of posts this thread has really gone downhill, good luck with making your new forum and all but I'm sure if you are able to provide solid proof that you returned the coin to Amazon, or are in the process of doing so, Quickseller will rethink his rating (I talked to him about this and he told me this). I suspect that your ban is temporary, so providing proof of shipping the coin back is in your best interest. You could have the red flair removed from your account and just move on with things.

And finally what i aim for. The last posts of turtle show's his true character. This is what i told you from beginning, that he is just a corp full of shit, that only looks for gain, with any price.

I'm glad i manage to reach my goal and show what turtle is maid from.

Good luck sucker and i hope in this time i will meet you and than i will show you something that you will never imagine. We are not so far away than you think and i have the advantage to know who you are.

The posts here have been do give you negative for last business, what will happen to you if i will ever see you in front of me, can imagine that, really.

Calm down; just show us proof that you said Amazon was getting for you with the whole gold shipping. It's simple: give us the information and everything will return to normal. There's literally no reason for you to pull out like this (unless you were a scammer, but I'm not accusing you of anything as of right now).

If I had to pick a side in this one, 2 pages ago it would have been turtle, now having said that it's not a clear case, therefore the feedback that QS left was entirely justified. It clearly stated the issue along with the statement that it would be removed when the evidence asked for was provided, that wasn't an unreasonable position or request.

You should have left it alone at that point, provided the proof within a few days and it would have removed and there would be no damage to your reputation.

Sadly instead of taking the easy option, you decide to spam multiple other threads and that is probably the reason you were banned by a mod, not by QS, now you are making personal attacks which is not going to make things better.

You created the account you are posting from over a year ago...

You might have been able to log into your theturtleisalive account, then either post or PM some kind of documentation that you sent the coin back

I do think the kind of behavior you are engaging in is confirmation of my theory about you.  

Edit: I don't see what the fact that you were banned while you were sleeping has to do with anything LOL

I am not sure why you are making empty threats against me that have a decent chance of getting you arrested.

I also don't see why you don't simply provide some kind of evidence that you actually sent the coin back to Amazon....that really would probably be the simplest solution

Even though Amazon did not give you a label, you would have had to buy one yourself (or maybe you just bought a stamp if it only was worth $9 and was small in size), but the point is that postage needed to be purchased. Regardless, this does not match turtle's story that he was told to return the coin in it's original packaging.

For the packaging that a $1,300 gold coin is going to come in, an actual shipping label (for a parcel) is going to have to be used (as opposed to a stamp) if sending via USPS.

Even in the extremely unlikely event that a tracking number is 100% unavailable for the shipment of the coin back to Amazon, there would be some kind of other documentation that Amazon actually received the coin....something on his Amazon account, an email confirming this fact, anything.

I told him (via PM) that I would reevaluate my rating if he could provide some evidence that he returned the coin:

I believe that this behavior is very similar as to what happened in this case, as well as the case when he had a dispute with segveg, even to the point that turtlehurricane opened his own scam accusation against segvec regarding the incident.

---

Regardless of what ends up happening in this case, anyone considering to deal with turtlehurricane in the future should absolutely use escrow.

In case it's relevant.  I can add that I was sent the wrong product which I purchased on amazon by a sender this January.  In my case, it was a 9$ product, so it wasn't very expensive (it was a case for a tablet, when they should have sent a case for a phone), in any case, what happened is that I wrote to them and they sent me the right case.  I asked them to send me some sort of shipping label.  They said "we don't do that, just send it back to me at your own expense and we'll reimburse you".

I write this just to say that I don't think it's true that amazon always sends you a label.  I was not sent a label in this case.

This story is obviously false based on the fact that turtlehurricane is stating he sent the items back in the original packaging. Amazon needs to be informed you are sending the item back and they provide you with a label+packaging. I have had to return 2 items back to them in the past few months, let alone another few times over the years. You can't just send it back. They track it and send an email instructing you on what to do

And now guys to see how honest he is, I told you in my other posts that he helped with my LBC account, help that i paid for $350. Now he made complain with LBC that i stole his identity.

How low can you be doing this? So he scam me for the 845 (total 975) plus 350 i paid for his service it's a total of $1,325. Nice job dude, you are the most honest people in the world, i hope to not find such serious guys like you never, LOL.

You deserve all the negative you can get from this community. This community help you build your trust, you piece of shit that you are.

I hope this will be a lesson for me and for everybody.
When you are dealing with a shit guy, always use escrow. Doesn't matter how honest he appear, if you doubt his character, ALWAYS use escrow, because in the end you will be scammed.

I live in the United States and can walk into pretty much any big store here and purchase 15 different types of prepaid cards. Prepaid cards have not been outright banned here so not really sure where you got that info from.

The Dollar General in the town next to me has all sorts of options, hell I can reload my prepaid bank card right at the counter.

My friend, also an American, said this when asked how hard it is to find a prepaid card.



My wife uses prepaid Visa cards constantly on Amazon to order all sorts of things.

What is really suspicious on both accounts is that these Amazon Giftcards are being sold really really cheap compared to their original value AND they were used to buy Gold which is pretty much another currency.

guys, I told you how I would do it.

take the fraudulent codes to a trusted 3rd party and let them verify with amazon.

also, it doesn't matter if turtlehurricane used the fraudulent cards or not, as this is for amazon/law whatever to decide. I mean they would know if a user bought stuff with stolen codes and take action.

Am I the only one who thinks the whole business setup is Fishy^tm?

DjVoodoo obtains 3 Amazon Gift Cards (AGC), worth $500 each from Mr. X
DjVoodoo "sells" these AGC to turtlehurricane for BTC3.75 (BTC3.75 was worth less than $1125 on August 4th 2015)
turtlehurricane uses the cards to purchase a $1300 golden coin from Mr. Y
turtlehurricane sells the coins for $1300 (no profit?) to Mr. Z
turtlehurricane "pays" DjVoodoo 75 70 65% of $1300 ($845)
turtlehurricane keeps 25 30 35% of $1300 ($455)
turtlehurricane keeps the unspent $200 in their amazon account ?!

This is what I can read from this thread. It raises so many questions with me.

Maybe I have just never ordered things they send via USPS. Either way I know that the lowest class of mail that is shipped via parcel including tracking service. It would also be in Amazon's best interest to purchase insurance for something that costs $1,300....

I've received multiple orders the past week from Amazon through USPS. They also use FedEx smart shipping or something like that, where FedEx receives but USPS delivers or maybe that was UPS not FedEx, can't quite remember so will check up on that.

I've always received a tracking number though when sending back.

Out of all the times I have ordered things from Amazon, I have never once received anything via USPS. It was mostly FedEx, but sometimes UPS.....

I'm just reading through and saw this so will drop in some info pertaining to the USPS.

I have worked for the USPS and can go ahead and tell you that shipping had to be paid for the return of that box

There are only 4 ways that you got out of paying shipping.

1. Amazon mailed you a return package with shipping paid for. This is ruled out as you said you returned the original item.
2. Amazon emailed you a pre-authorized shipping code for you to print out and stick to the box which would be payable by them upon its pickup from the drop box or post office.
3. The item was shipped to the wrong address in which it will be returned to its sender.
4. Someone else, a friend or family member, paid the shipping for you.

The USPS cannot and will not return a package to the sender unless postage is paid.

People would be more willing to believe you if you could provide some proof that you shipped the gold back to Amazon... Right now it's just your word saying that you shipped it back, when Amazon uses trackable parcels for their shipments. You should have a tracking number and receipt from dropping it off at the post office. I've mailed plenty of packages through pre-paid Canada Post and I've always received a receipt confirming the drop off when I give it to the post office worker. Even though I'm in Canada, I suspect things work similarly in the States with USPS.

If you don't have a tracking number then you should have an email conversation with Amazon discussing the returning of the gold, from what I see you haven't posted any proof of that either. If for some reason you don't have that, you could always let a trusted escrow into your Amazon account to prove that the status of your gold order is returned, or similar to that. But like I said, it's difficult to believe you with no solid proof that you returned the gold purchased from Amazon.

The fact that the cards were fraudulent and that they were sent by DjVoodoo has not been proven.
The only other time I left you a negative rating was because of this incident, and that was hardly a false negative rating (you took a PayPal MyCash cash but did not pay for it). I did remove the negative rating once you resolved the issue. Since you have insisted so many times that you returned a $1,300 gold coin to Amazon, I will revisit my rating once you can give some kind of documentation to support this. 

I just do not understand the lack of a receipt or proof of shipping an item... especially gold. If you did not pay for shipping then you had a prepaid label? You can not walk into USPS/UPS/FedEx and be like "Amazon said mail this...thanks bye".

Finally, someone that can see the picture in this shit, LOL.

Plus, i found something similar to my problem and surprise who iss the negative part?

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/turtlehurricane-ripped-me-for-1000-resolved-854105

@turtle - Surely you at least got a tracking number when you sent the coins back, correct? If not then how would you have handled a dispute with Amazon that the coins did not arrive? Also if not then what exact service did you get when you sent the coins back?

Show me proof the coin was sent back and i will stop everything, if not you owe me 1300 (price of the coin) x 0.65 = $845. PERIOD
I never said that the codes are fraudlent. With that guy the problem was his account, it was a new account he tried to load $2000 and he got his account locked by amazon. I resolved the issue with my 2 codes and paid him back. IT was other situation.

For our deal the conclusion is next and the way to resolve it is very simple:

I gave you 3x500 codes, you used 1300 to buy Eagle gold coin, problems appear, you resolve it, coin arrived, problems again appeared.
   - I accept this

Than you said to resolve the last problem i need to send the coin back and i kindly ask you to show me proof that it was sent back, than is when you sent prt sc with the e-mails (that doesn't show you sent the coins back) and than i know that you didn't sent the coin back. That is when i lost my trust in you and i start to think you scam me.

Now after all this happen you should simply show the proof that you sent the coin back and i was the sucker in all this story, but it end that you are the scammer here.

I did expect this from you and i wanted to ended before this happen, but i was to stupid, listening to your requests and my guy requests and i said, what the hell, one more time and i'm done. Indeed i'm done with you but with a lost of $845.

The community, still not believe this and don't want to see the proofs, outside quickseller that is objective, i would say "very" objective, but the english grammar will not take it. LOL, the rest are seeing a hero member accusing a newbie. Problem is i'm newbie here, but not a newbie at all.

IN EVERY COUNTRY FROM THIS WORLD IS NOT POSSIBLE TO SEND VALUE IN ENVELOPE WITHOUT A RECEIPT.

http://s11.postimg.org/xafkohnm7/image.jpg

Showing that i respect my word and my business partners when shit can happen. Also having my user id showed here, from LBC, you can check my feedback for over 200+ transaction with 70 people.

https://blockchain.info/tx/d5287049c466f62fd9092c030f7ca40fec5dad3e0c0c2e7464f6a6d38c27b172

favdesu, this matter here is about, that turtle keep the coin, that he obtain from that "fraudlent" codes and that he didn't pay my share. If he sent the proof that the coin was returned, it was no problem, i would never open nothing against him.

How can i call amazon and ask them, look did a guy zachary...blablabla, return the coin to you?

Quick questions for you guys:

1. If i buy one item on ebay, paying with ebay gift cards, the item is shipped and received, means the seller of the item got the payment. In the mean time, the cards value are canceled, but i already got the item. Now the question, to whom i return the "value" (item or payment???!!!)??

2. In this case, if i would send it back trough US post, there must be a tracking number and a paper, PHYSICAL PAPER, showing that i sent something trough them. Am i right?

Amazon will show that an item as returned, you should be able to prove that. Amazon does not just accept a return without giving you some sort of proof they received it.

This is why I never buy discounted gift codes!

I think turtle needs to provide some kind of evidence that he actually returned the coins. Right now he has acknowledged that he received the coins but claims to have returned them. He has also claimed that keeping the coins would have resulted in him having to pay an additional $200, and while I have no way of verifying this one way or another, it is not something that I believe.

I also do not see where DjVoodo had admitted that the gift cards were fraudulent, he says that if one was fraudulent then they all would have been because the source of the cards was the same in all cases.

The fact that there is a claim that the terms of a trade were changed after the fact for one of the first trades from a long time ago is very concerning.

what I don't get is why DjVoodo doesn't ask Amazon for a clarification on said fraudulent codes? first thing I would do as a seller...

it doesn't really matter how your customer used the cards, if they're fraudulent it's his business to deal with consequences.

Best solution would be to ask a trusted escrow to investigate and ask amazon for a statement on the codes.

The agreement was like this:
I give him 1500 in amazon codes, that means 3x500, he redeem the cards, order the gold coin, receive it, sell it and ONLY than i will get my btc.

This agreement worked for over 10 coins (i really don't know exactly, because we did sometime twice a week this, sometimes once per week, for the last 2 months). The amazon cards always came from same guy, so if one is fraudulent, than all was, in  this case turtle should be in jail for at least 1 month now.
The rate was like this .65 for me .35 for him. We start doing this at .75 for me but when first order came, he change the agreement at .70 with my btc at him, so i couldn't disagree, because he was paying me that anyway, and before second he do it .65. Now i was selling amazon on lbc on .70, but because i have honor and i like to keep my old connections (we worked before on ppmc codes), i lower the rate at .65. So his rate was under the LBC rate. IF you want on LBC to find the high rate ok, but behind the scene on LBC there are other rates, because they allow trusted user service and the listings are hidden from the rest of the users. He knows very well my rate on lbc, because i gave him acces to my account when he help me there.

And as quickseller said above, if he got the coin, he must pay per agreement, because all the steps have been fulfill.

The other thing that i didn't pay attention because i didn't want. Amazon will never ask compensation, i did check this, so there is no $200 fee penalty. In the worst case they close your account and do legal steps against you..


So MR. Zachary Gruskin, you did subestimate my intelligence, based on my kindness and that i always tried to work with you lowering my rate, but all this turn against you and this forum now knows what dickhead you are now.


It was so simple to not get this headache by sending proof that the coin or payment was returned and all this never exist. But as you keep the coin for you and didn't want to pay me, you will get this shit all over.

As i said, he got the coin and he keep the money. There is no proof that he sent it back. This means that he is to greedy and he will scam you at the first chance that will have, outside that will always re-negotiate the rate in his favor, doesn't matter if you are some old business partner. This guy is just another junk in this world and i'm very sorry that i worked so long with him, because i was 100% that this will end bad for me one day.
I had the feeling before giving him the last amazon codes, but i said, c'mon the world is not so bad as you think, but it is.
The world will fuck you at first sign of weakness, LOL.

The date on the receipts you posted is August 4, 2015 and the date on the email from Amazon is August 5 with a timestamp of ~3 AM. Why do you think someone was so willing to buy an AGC with cash in order to pay a $150 premium when they could have sent a WU payment or made a cash deposit and paid a ~$20 premium at the most (that would be ~10%)? I honestly think the premium you were charging and the time between the date on the receipt and the time they were redeemed means that you knew very well what was going on with the AGC.
I don't entirely disagree with this statement, although to be fair to your trading partner, I think you should cite this law.
What exactly was the agreement. I wouldn't think there would be a specific clause regarding fraudulent cards, although the agreement may have included other terms that may show one of you being in the wrong/right

And how long would LBC hold the gift cards in escrow for you to potentially receive this email?
I think you knew the source of the gift cards when you redeemed them. I also think that if you were able to receive some kind of value from the gift cards then you owe him the BTC that you promised, this is regardless of if the cards were fraudulent.
I think the first part is speculation. I think you should cite a specific law regarding the second part. Congratulations on the 3rd part.
Maybe next time you should use escrow. But you do not accept escrow on the forum because the escrows are anon....so you instead insist on your trading partners they send first while you stay anon

In this case you are lucky the Bitcoins were not released. I personally have received fraudulent gift cards before and its a huge pain in the butt and a process. Luckily you were not scammed out of the Bitcoins!

What was the agreement specifically? Under what conditions would he give you the 3.75BTC?

I understand that he had acknowledged that he received the gold coin, however I also acknowledge that there may be risks to keeping some kind of product after paying for such product with a fraudulent gift card (assuming it is true that the gift card is in fact fraudulent).

I am not familiar with the accounting system at Amazon nor am I familiar with how merchants are paid. I would assume that it would be something along the lines of that amazon advises the merchants that they are okay to sent a product at a certain point and would guarantee payment at that time. Also that if amazon needs to process a refund/return then the merchant would not receive such payment.

I would acknowledge that the merchant was at one point paid, however the question remains if they have still been paid. The question also remains if turtle is able to document the fact that he in fact returned the gold coin. I would also question the "$200 markup" that turtle is claiming he would have had to have paid if he kept the coin, this really does not make sense to me.

I would also like to question turtle (again) as to what exactly he was expecting when he was agreeing to sell his bitcoin at a ~$150 premium above the market rate when he was receiving gift cards that were supposedly purchased in cash very recently....

This whole thing is giving me a headache lol. As a third party person, I would be happy to investigate on behalf of both members to find out what actually happened.

Yes that happen on LBC and when the guy provide enough proof showing it was invalid, i sent him back the coins, FROM MY WALLET, LBC wallet was 0 AND I CAN SHOW THAT. So if i wanted i could close the wallet and not send back to that user almost $700, and yes you help me in that matter.
I didn't denied that is possible for amazon to send you that e-mails.

I WANT THE PROOF YOU SENT THE COIN BACK, that cannot be done, i explained in my posts above, why, this means that you must sent the cash back to amazon and doing it by US post, that is absolutely NOT POSSIBLE.

luciann, i never gave him carded cards, and he know that very well. You cn check the picture HE uploaded and see that are cash, also if you want you can call the store and verify the receipt.

Yes, i deny, because from same guy we bought over 10 coins without any problem, this means over 15k in amazon codes.
And he knows very well this, the problem is i clean my inbox with the texts showing this and showing how he ask for more codes from my guy. This was my fault. Until than the problem is not in my affirmations, it is in his affirmations, that re not the same from 1 hour to another.

Guys read again top to bottom his posts.
Maybe i'm not a hero member here, but at least i don't lie and i don't play the victim role.
When i open this i knew that i lost my money forever, but at least i knew that i will teach some other newbies to not deal again with this scam.

Our agreement, is our history for the last 6 months we did business together, always with hassle, but we did over 50k in business, all together.

I post in my first reply the turtle... text messages print screens to me, showing he received the coin by his affirmation, plus, quickseller, how can be ubsustantiated, if he is saying that the coin was sent back? LOL. Clearly he had the coin in hands, this means, the merchant got paid, so the problem was at amazon, because in this story, in the end, amazon got screwed by what turtle is saying. 3.75 btc at 250 that was the btc 2 weeks ago, if not higher, means aprox 975, that is .65 from 500 amazon card.

The cards have been paid cash 100%, receipts are showing that, pictures being HD, can be verified at the store.

Now, how can you send something, with big value without a receipt? I think someone is not seeing the big picture here. Don't you see that his words don't connect, if you will follow all the posts plus the print screens i took to his texts? HE is saying to me and to first posts here, that the coins was sent back to amazon, now was sent to merchant. LOL

Talk about some luck on your account not being permentantly suspended or anything..

Cause that real hassle would start, esp when you want to purchase stuff in the future.

But yeah, if the funds are fronzen less then that he prob got a carded card. In the future though, its better to just buy a smaller amount to see if the suppliers cards dont go bad and measure your risk.

Do either of your have any kind of agreement that you can show that would document the terms of the trade? From the looks of it turtlehurricane has pictures of codes that are potentially fraudulent. He also apparently also loaded those codes onto either his or someone's amazon account and received some kind of gold coin after spending the funds from those codes.

turtlehurricane claims that the fraudulent codes were from DjVoodoo and that he returned the gold coin back to amazon. However this appears to be unsubstantiated, is there any kind of documentation to show that amazon actually received this gold coin back?

DjVoodoo claims that the merchant who sold the gold coin has received payment from amazon, however this seems to be unsubstantiated and would be contradictory to turtlehurricane's claim. He also claims that he does not know anything about the cards being fraudulent.

The trust rating from DjVoodoo to turtlehurricane claims that he sent $1,500 worth of AGC in exchange for 3.75BTC, which works out to $400/BTC. The highest the $/BTC price has been in the last two months is $316 on bitfinex. I am curious to know why exactly that someone would be willing to part with his gift cards for such a low price.

There are two separate problems here:

DjVoodo: do you deny it was a stolen code or a code obtained with a stolen credit card or any other illegal means? Are you recognizing that accusation? How exactly did you get that code? Were you surprised at all with the news that Amazon cancelled that gift card?

turtlehurricane: please post the receipt you got when you sent that item back. Also any emails or other communication with the seller. I'm sure you got something.

ARE YOU RETARDED???!!!!

HOW TO SEND GOLD COIN TO AMAZON, IF YOU BOUGHT IT ON AMAZON, FROM SOMEONE SELLING THERE, PLUS THE PROBLEM IS WITH AMAZON, NOT WITH THE COMPANY YOU BOUGHT THE COIN. THEY DID GET THE PAYMENT,BECAUSE OTHERWISE THE COIN WASN'T SHIPPED.
FIRST STRIKE

AMAZON SAYING THE CODES ARE INVALID, LET'S SAY SO, WHERE IS THE E-MAIL STATING THAT YOU NEED TO REPAY THEM BACK?
SECOND STRIKE

WHAT YOU SENT BY EMAIL? MONEY IN ENVELOPE TO AMAZON? THEY DON'T ACCEPT CASH BY MAIL, REALLY THEY DON'T. ABOUT THE GOLD COIN I JUST TAKE THAT POSSIBILITY OUT AT MY FIRST STRIKE.
AND STRIKE THREE.

Now guys, i'm aware that i will never receive my money back from this dickhead, but nobody should use this guy again for online payment, without escrow. This is what i had to say.
I prove, once again, based on his affirmation this time, that he is just a low life, that is ruled by money.
And his next step will be to give me negative feedback. Please check time that i told him i will write the scam accusation and the time that he post, his scam accusation.

How innocent you are, you honest bitcoin dealer, LOL. I'm sorry that i don't have all our conversations to show people who you really are, plus i'm not first who say that you have a shady character. I was so stupid that i continue to work with you after our first fight. I should stop there, when you retrieved your feedback and you didn't want to pay me anymore, because i was yelling at you and told you the naked true about yourself.
And that time was no problem with any code and also was second time when you did that, first time, for one ppmc he paid me after 5 days and when i told him i will leave him scam accusation, instead of .75 rate he sent .60, as punishment that i threat him.

If it was sent back, must exist a paper. I did request that from 2 days ago. Show that paper and i will apologize and take* all the critics.

i.imgur.com/2m6ugei.jpg - this is the first picture i post

And another one, showing that i was fair and i asked for the proof that he refund the payment. I said to him to show me proof that the payment was sent back and he said, i did it by mail. C'mon, we are speaking about amazon.com. You can't send payment back by mail, LOL.

i.imgur.com/DJPthVF.jpg
i.imgur.com/8IOrbi7.jpg

Your image is invalid, please update/edit this so we could have a better view on this scam accusation. I am not sure what is happend here at this moment.

Regards,
Joust

Edit: this some clear evidence...

HE forgot to said that he received the product(gold coin) and that he sold it and got the money, but never send it back.

http://imgur.com/2m6ugei

...