Topic: 100% Way to STAY SAFE if you SELL on LocalBitcoins and Nice 30% Mark-up (Read 3067 times)

^ What he said, lol

I'll throw in my 2 bits...

1. I will warn that this method is through local bitcoins, not eBay. eBay will let the buyer win for almost anything. PayPal however has very limited coverage but it is their "seller guarantee" and you must make sure that the address on the ID from buyer, name match the PayPal account. Then you just click to ship item right in PayPal and it will fill in the address. They can't claim it didn't arrive, they signed for it. Now, also it is an important step to include on the invoice. RARE COIN. I cannot accept refunds and returns once you have accepted the document. Now, the other thing is... keep your selling limits low to prevent a huge loss if they figure something out. Usually what these guys do is steal a PayPal (won't work here as you will get ID) or they do a ton of trx in a few days and then claim unauthorized...  Well, they won't be able to with your sale. I had a folder ready... copy of invoice, copy of their ID. When PayPal sent me the chargeback email, I went straight to PayPal and uploaded... ID, Invoice, and delievry confirmation... all 4 times the money was back in my accoount same day. It cannot be unauthorized in this case and even if they convince their bank or PayPal... PayPal owes you.  

2. You are sending signature required Priority Mail and all it contains is a penny or dime. 1 in a few thousand might get lost but you would have a case against USPS for your "error" coin. Remember, the person paid more for instant delivery too. If they paid for 3 day (half mine did) you are fine because you lose no btc.

3. I never said use ebay so go read my method again. With PayPal, you are covered here. Your claim is he replaced the error with a plain penny and you were nervous he might try something which is why you did signature required and why you put on the invoice... no returns or refunds once item has been turned over into his  hands. He would have to open the box with USPS at door and then decline it... so you just don't release the btc.

1) I had someone try to claim that the item was not sent. As long as you use tracking, you're covered. Buy postage via Paypal for extra security. The buyer can't dispute the tracking info or say the address was incorrect that way as Paypal issued it all themselves!

2) This one is genuine, so pick something replaceable. Self-printed giftcards or paper wallets work great for this as both can hold any value and both are cheap to replace and cheap to mail.

3) Most scammers ignore ebay choosing to go directly through paypal and will say the charge was "unauthorized". Withhold leaving them feedback until 90 days have passed if you're worried about them going through ebay instead. If it's a direct paypal payment then this won't tend to be a worry.

Thanks for taking the time to write all that out, but just as I thought, not 100% guaranteed. I already quickly found 3 loopholes that could potentially lose you the dispute. I'll point them out so you can further tweak your method:

1) Scammer can file a claim that he never received the item, but just an empty package. Oldest trick in the book of ebay scams.

2) It's rare, but there's a small chance the package gets lost. You're responsible for lost packages. Sure you can send out a replacement, but they could potentially win on the basis that it took too long to arrive.

3) Scammer can dispute that the item was not as described. If you send an error penny, they can claim it's a normal penny. There are many people that collect numismatic coins, it's very easy to prove that the coin is not a valuable error coin.

Yeah... I have an online store or two and stopped using bank accounts a year or two ago. I probably have about $300 or so going in and out every day. The debit card is actually found by going to paypal.com/prepaid.  It has easy instant transfers from PayPal to the card and then you use it at an ATM like normal and if I recall the limit is $400 per day ATM withdrawal. Another nice thing is that PayPal can't pull from it. Example... you are paid $400 to PayPal, you go to the prepaid site and do a direct move from PayPal to the debit card. ( I do recall now that the max daily pull from PP is $300. Then, say the next day there is a Charge-back on the tranaction... you will have your $100 taken but they cannot touch the $300 you moved along.

It is a life saver for me since I use the prepaid card as my bank and pay bills from there and pull cash from there. I am not a huge PayPal fan but they work well if you use them right. 

(You posted your reply in the wrong space). It has been a long time since I have had a paypal account.

What limits are placed on the debit cards? Can they be used to withdraw cash from an ATM?

Well, I am just trying to pass it on because I helped a few people who are legit and at the same time blocked some scammers. Hopefully it helps to teach them they can't douchebags all their lives.  But re: PayPal... you know you can get a PayPal debit card for free?  Unless you have a fake PayPal or something in which case this wasn't meant for you.

Have a good one.

well I guess my next concern is that you would have difficulty getting the money back into your personal bank account or back into Bitcoin. Depositing large amounts of money into a personal account is a quick way to get your account closed and few people accept PayPal as payment for Bitcoin 

It doesn't matter- look at PayPal and their rules.  As long as you mail it to the PayPal address... you are covered 100%

I don't understand half of it. But maybe it will benefit others. Thx

Very interesting. although I would think they could still claim their account was hacked the first time and only signed for the package/letter because they were the addressee on such package

I'll just tell everyone and you can tip if you'd be kind. If you follow this exact layout then you will make extra money so I'd appreciate a tip. If not, more power to you!  Enjoy the method. As I stated, PayPal has not so much as questioned this method at all... make it clear to the buyer before the trade and they are toast if they do a charge-back.

First, you want to make four listings.  (For example: Bitcoin Price is $300)

1. First Time Traders with you "Instant Delivery"  $605
2. First Time Traders with you "3 Day Release"  $405
3. Repeat Traders with you "Instant Delivery"  $455
4. Repeat Traders with you "3 Day Release"  $355

The prices have reason. You can charge whatever you want but here is why I price in this fashion.

1. Believe it or not, I've had one of these purchases and he didn't charge back. Line of thinking is simple... can't lose if he charges back. 2x BTC price + $5 shipping
2. $100 upcharge (had a ton of these) +$5 Shipping
3. Repeat buyer (makes it tough for them to report unauthorized) as long as you make sure their initial order is complete. (see below)
4. Repeat Buyer 3 Day Release (little worry) but you must ensure the first order is 100% done.

-Now when a buyer opens a sale, I first make sure that their PayPal matches their ID. Ask for ID and the email address of their PayPal to send an invoice.
-Now find out which option they chose... and make sure they understand the details.

First thing you do in ALL cases is go to PayPal and send an invoice that is for an "error penny" whatever year you have at home.
The invoice states. 1983 D Error penny  $300
In the notes: You are understanding that upon delivery of the item, I do not accept returns or refunds as this is a unique error coin. Once package is in your possession, I can not accept the return.

1. Then you send the invoice and wait to get paid. When you are paid, mail the penny First Class Signature Required TO THE ADDRESS ON PAYPAL. It is $3.66

2. Pop your penny in the box and mail it off.

3. Now did your buyer pay instant  or 3 day?  If 3 day, wait until you get the signature required. If instant...

4. This is even better...   Go release the coins

So, you are 100% covered on any claim.

1. The invoice was sent to the users email account

2. He paid it and sent a sent his ID.

3. You shipped him an error penny. Tangible item of value with signature required

4. Receiver signed AT THE PAYPAL address on file

Even Instant Payers I sent a coin to....  Reason- You now have a home address.

So, the mailman just makes them sign before they open it so it is never return because your contract

The guys that did try and do an unauthorized....  lost of course. I was covered because I filled all the gambles. 

- DO NOT send to the 3 day people until they receive the penny and sign

If by chance an instant buyer has not signed for package after 5 days, report him

That's it... If I had money right t now, I'd be doing it again as with this, I made $800 profit from 10 sales.

Questions?

Yes, I want to learn it, tell me through PM but I can't promise you that I will send you any 'pocket change'. I might if I like it or I might not if I don't.

If is tolking about paypal, skrill, neteller and others hi-reversible methods," I CAN THANK  YOU SOME POCKET CHANGE "
if is tolking about bank transfer , reload cards , or non reversible methods (PM BITCOIN WM) i just thank you , and nothing more

Foolproof* 

It may work well, but I highly double it's a guaranteed 100% that you'll win. It's paypal we're talking about here.

Nope. That's why I am saying my method is full proof.  You are charging more and the scammers may come at you but you never have to worry. Who cares if you get the scammers, I've made it so they cannot win

Sorry no such thing is 100% safe. That place is teaming with scammers. If you deal enough on there, you'd know.

And the fact that you did transactions that opened yourself to a 40% chance of getting charged back ain't that safe to begin with. Rather than getting chargebacks and fighting it, you can change your method to minimize reversals.

I have been selling on Local Bitcoins for a year or so. Not many transactions... maybe 50 but I have been trying different methods and I have it down now. My last 10 transactions, 4 were filed chargeback within a month and I won all 4 cases without any issue at all.

If anyone is interested in that info, I'd give it away and you can thank me some pocket change to 18ovrcRVwrvDk1tu2PA645aTqGyfqVfZXc

Not sure if people want that info...  let me know. I'll tell you how to list the ad and how to handle start to finish.