Topic: 2011 Casascius 1 BTC Holo Error (Read 3204 times)

I'll offer 2.5BTC for it.

It's very difficult to get an idea of what the coin actually looks like, and the condition it's in from those pictures.  The flash unfortunately takes away from any ability to see the condition of the coin under normal light.  At least the holo looks intact and good.

bump

Good call out. I can take it easy for a while. The reason for the repetition is that it's been hard to get answers out of people, instead I get hassled for even thinking against the flow.

My bad, just thought you were thinking my sources were questionable or unreliable.

But anyways, this post has been very educational and the both of you have contribute to a great discussion.

What makes you say that?  I simply said I was happy to see people mentioning uberbills and then I was asked who mentioned uberbills...  It is a great site, but it's function is as a Coin Analyzer.  I believe naypalm himself would tell you that getting exact numbers on each series of Casascius Coins is an ongoing effort... 

In any event, if people would bother to read my post explaining why the error coin is worth more instead of attacking me that the s2 had less produced (which I never disputed, so it's odd I'm being repeatedly lectured over it), they would see that the numbers are a moot point.

I'm sorry the error coins go for more than the series 2.  Let me just back up and say that it is a mystery of why that is, and we can all let this for sale thread continue.

Og, you are forgetting that the uberbills site takes the data directly from Casascius' txt file which contains ALL the possible Casascius coin address.

I think we'll all be winners, those of us who have these for a while...any year, denomination, etc.

Personally I like the gold/silver coin more than the all silver coin. I think the people who say otherwise are silver bugs and that's alright too.

When you combine rarity and good looks, a lot of money will be at play.

You've lost sight of why this started. Who said anything about Uberbills, the data is from Casascius Full List --> http://casascius.com/fulllist.txt. Have you ever been to the link? Can you read in the first few lines that:

• The first 11,000 belong to series 1 coins with inkjetted holograms with the "CASACIUS" error
• The next 1,000 addresses belong to series 2 coins with windowed holograms

The first bullet proves my point that there are 11,000 error coins, and thus they are not nearly as rare as other coins issued. The second bullet implies that the number of series 2 2011 1BTC coins totals 1,000.

I asked why 1 coin of 11,000 would be more valuable than 1 coin of 1,000? Still with me?

Your first response to that was good, I think you said it was the historical nature of the coin, first run an all. Sounds logical to me. The rest of your posts turned in to nonsense and either outright lies about the other comments/analysis made or a clear indication that you don't read well (the latter of which is fine, if that's the case.)

I'm not questioning what you believe in, I'm just asking why you believe it. That's it. (And to be completely fair to me, I was never asking you personally.)

Thanks to JustBTCme for wanting to go through the numbers. I think everyone reading this is more educated now. And better education keeps us all from getting scammed, paying too much, or getting paid to little.

Here are my reasoning behind the numbers.

1. Some coins were funded at different times even though a certain number are minted. For example, the 25 BTC gold plated coins were funded well into 2013 but only a limited number (562 coins stamped with 2011 date) were minted. As is the case with the 2011 1BTC error coins - Casascius states that a maximum of 11,000 of these coins with the S1 holograms were produce but as we all know many were funded well into 2012.

2. We just don't know the exact distribution of S1 and S2 coins, for example, in the 2011 1 BTC error coins. We do not know how many were tossed away during those early phase when BTC were worth a few dollars.

3. As Casascius has stated, the split between S1 coins and S2 coins for the 25 BTC coins are evenly split, more or less. Thus, the reasoning behind a 50/50 split between the other error coins (5 BTC coin in particular.)

These are very crude estimates but I believe it is reasonably accurate.

Check the part of your quote that is in bold...  Obviously counting only the coins funded in 2011 is not accurate, as even the error coins were being funded 6 months after that.  Hence, the data is not accurate.  

I don't need to pitch my Nasty coins...  I was just answering your question guy.  Next time don't ask questions you don't want to know the answer to if you are going to get emotional.

I am glad that people are quoting uberbills.com.  The iOS App I created for the site should go live in Apple's App Store in the next 48 hours.    

Og, I did a control F search for "aren't correct" on this great data and couldn't find those words together, anywhere. It's amazing how blatantly you make s*it up! His numbers come directly from the Casascius website - there's no better, more factual source. I'm surprised you're not agreeing with me, after all it would make a great opportunity for you to pitch your nasty poser coins. Of course, you're entitled to a different opinion, i might not agree with you but that doesn't mean you're "incorrect".

This is getting silly, but that's just my opinion. Godspeed man.

Sure they can.  Your opinion is that the gold/silver 10BTC coin is more valuable.  That is not correct, as you will not be able to find a single person willing to trade an all silver coin for a silver/gold, and will struggle to find someone willing to sell one at all.  Whereas you can find members trying to force feed the silver/gold ones down your throat on these forums.  

You asked the question as to why the first physical Bitcoin was more valuable than the more "rare" 2nd one.  I answered your question and then you chose to argue with me.  You can read my answer, take it in, understand it, and no longer have to ask yourself the question, or you could continue to argue with the mentality that the market of people investing thousands of dollars into these coins is wrong and you are right.  Your choice.  Don't shoot at me for explaining the situation so you could understand it and no longer need to ask yourself the question.  Asking questions about things to get a better understand and then getting angry with the person who spells it out for you is illogical.



I never even claimed there are less 2011 errors than the series 2.  I said the error is more sought after (hence it's rarity in the marketplace and higher price tag) because it is not only the first physical Bitcoin, but is also the only Casascius error coin.  I am however regretting responding to your question and educating you on this reasoning, because it is clear you weren't looking for an answer, but were just crying that you can't afford one of these coins.

Great analysis! But I'll leave it to OgNasty to thoroughly scrutinize you "just spouting numbers," errr facts.

By the way, opinions (by definition) can never be incorrect.

Although there are 2011 S2 1btc coins that were funded 2012 and beyond, I only counted the ones funded in 2011.

Here is my top 7 list of the most rare coins and the approximate population of each:

ranking, name, population, #active

1. Casascius 1000 BTC 2011  Gold coin :  3

2. Cassascius 25 BTC 2011 S1, S2 : approx. 150 of each version

3. Casascius 10 BTC 2012 S2 Gold/Silver, All Silver: approx. 190 of each version

4. Casascius 5  BTC 2012 S1, S2: approx. 400 of each version

5. Casascius 1 BTC 2013 S3 Gold/Silver: 700 total.

6. Casascius 1 BTC 2011 S2: approx. 1000 funded between 2011-12-31 and 2011-11-13

7. Casascius 1 BTC 2013 S3 Silver: 1300 total


For the 2011 s1 1BTC I don't know how many are still active, only that 11,000 total were made. For the 2013 1 BTC, 0.1 BTC, and 0.5 BTC I have no information on the maximum population on these coins.

My data is crude and mainly relies on www.casascius.uberbills.com and statements from Mike Cladwell. For example, Mike stated that for the 25 BTC coin, the S1 and S2 are more or less evenly split. His post can be found on this forum I just don't have the link at hand right now.

Anyone want to correct or add to what I have?

Perhaps you should re-read my posts and learn instead of just spouting numbers to back up your incorrect opinions.

Also, the only people who think that the gold/silver coins are worth more than the all silver coins are people who don't own the all silver coins...

First, the first run was 11,000 coins (with errors), the second run of 2011 stamped coins (regardless when funded) is around 1,000. (Source: Casascius full list) That's significantly fewer coins that what most would consider a "slightly less issued next version."

Second, you contradict yourself in the second point when you use the example that "gold/silver 10BTC coins are worth as much as all the silver ones" to illustrate that my thought process is wrong because the gold/silver 10BTC coins ARE more valuable than all the all silver coins. Or perhaps you mis-typed and meant to say the "gold/silver 1BTC coins"? Which, some on this forum would strongly debate that the gold/silver 1BTC coins are more valuable, citing specifically the lower run numbers (700 vs. 1300).

That said, I don't have a specific opinion here, I'm just trying to understand what's driving the huge valuations. Maybe it's still the "wild west" of trading these physical coins, so there isn't a ton of rhyme or reason behind it. I mean there are people here trying to sell Lealana coins for over 4 times the mark up or valuation that the 2011 or 2013 Casascius 1BTC (series 2) are going for!

A large driver in traditional numismatic pricing is the rarity of the coin, it's literally what drives different values of the same coin from two consecutive years. Historical value (e.g., first run of the first Casascius coins ever) is also a big driver of value. I just don't think you or anyone can ignore one because it doesn't align what you believe or own.

Then that count is not accurate.  Casascius was still funding 2011 error coins well into 2012...  I had a 2011 error coin that was funded in June of 2012...  Thinking it is as easy as downloading a .txt file to get the actual numbers is a mistake.  I know there are people doing the actual work to try and get the correct numbers, but insinuating that the very first physical Bitcoin won't be as valuable as the slightly less issued next version is as ludicrous as insinuating that the gold/silver 10BTC coins are worth as much as the all silver ones...  Rarity isn't the only thing collectors consider, as I mentioned in my prior post...

I really wanted to know exactly how many 2011 S2 1BTC coins were made so I went to http://casascius.uberbills.com and counted how many 2011 S2 1BTC are still active.

THERE ARE APPROXIMATELY ----1000--- 2011 S2 1btc casascius coins still active in the wildBTC. Although there are 2011 S2 1btc coins that were funded 2012 and beyond, I only counted the ones funded in 2011.

Good perspectives and comments, thanks for indulging the question by someone (me) who's new to this.

@justbtcme, Mike's "full list" (https://www.casascius.com/fulllist.txt) indicates it might be as low as 1,000, that is if he was only producing 1btc coins (not .5, etc) in 2011. The list would help get us part way to understanding exactly how many 1 BTC 2011 Series 2 coins are out there. It was this period where he didn't categorize the first three digits of the blockchain (am I using that term correctly?). If we copied this list into excel we could filter down what we know aren't the 2011 Series 2 coins to arrive at a gross number (active + inactive).

Don't get me wrong, I think the error coins are very cool and this historical value (to me) far exceeds the physical error. I would have loved to be at some Occupy event getting handed the first physical, loaded series of bitcoins. And I know I likely would have tossed it in a jar and forgot about it...but what a story to share if you had one of those, if it was handed to you for free.

It will be interesting to see if the price will shift towards the more uncommon coins once the collectors do more research on these casascius coins and realize the rarity of other coins.

I think the hype of the first halo error coins will die down along with the prices and collectors will want to pay a higher premium for the coins that they rarely see on the market such as the 10 BTC Gold/Silver, 25 BTC gold-plated, 5 BTC nickel S1 + S2 .

Supply and demand will play a role but I think the rarity factor will hold more weight for coin collectors.

Well, the very first physical Bitcoin was the error coin.  Thus, people who want to own the very first physical Bitcoin want the error coin.  That adds to the value.  There is also only one error Casascius hologram.  Thus, people who want to own an error coin want the error coin.

You are only looking at the supply to suggest value.  You need to look at demand as well, since where supply meets demand is what sets the price.  Error coin is much higher demand than 2011 series 2 coins for the reasons listed above, therefore it's value is higher despite it's supply.

When Mike first made these coins they were intended as a way to introduce people to bitcoins. As such, many were given out for free or were bought by people who gave them away to family and friends or even complete strangers.

The reason IMO that the 1 BTC 2011 S1 coins are so valuable is because we really don't know how many still exist or were toss away when these things were worth very little, forever gone. The ones that are still around are probably in pretty bad shape and very few if any are in MINT state (MS-68)

I recall a Occupy Wall Street event where some anonymous person were handing out free casascius coins or placing them in the donation boxes. Many were also given away at various bitcoin conferences.

Although I do agree that the 2011 S2 NON-HALO ERROR are MUCH MUCH more rare few people seem to notice this fact.

Can someone confirm this ? I would like to know the exact number produce, my guess is a few hundred at most. They were only produce for a few weeks until the new 2012 coins came out. 

No, that tells me how interested I was, personally, in BTC or Casascius back in 2011. It means nothing about the value the coin commands to a collector.

The interesting thing, I think, is that despite the "coolness" of the error, these are one of the most common coins minted by Mike. In terms of rarity, 2011 series 2 coins should be more valuable.

It's also interesting that when I ask these questions about valuation no one seems to be able to offer a reasoned or structured answer...perhaps this indicates a valuation problem (as people try to auction these off for up to 7BTC each?)

How many do you own?  That should tell you how rare it is.

So far you have 13 posts, 99% moaning about coin prices -

https://bitcointalksearch.org/user/possum577-351490

I'll resurrect this one for a question.

How are these going for so much when there's 11,000 of them in existence?

That's hardly rare considering how many coins Casascius created.

bump!

Exactly,  many such 3-4 btc sales happened when the bitcoin value hovered at much higher prices than where it is now.

Clean and not graded 3-4BTC.. If you get a really nice grade like MS-66 - MS67 they can go upwards of 7BTC

I don't agree. The 2013s are going for 2.5-3. While it is true that graded coins are getting a higher premium, this coin is in phenomenal condition. It's been in a case ever since being received.
If I don't manage to sell it I will send it in for grading myself.

maybe hes some pervert and he like to use coin for sexual purpose. Who knows. I saw at discovery a show about a guy who kiss the bikes... and slept with them

so who knows

i think 5 btc is still alittle to high, i think they been going for around 3btc maybe more if graded high

Price lowered. BUMP

No sex?!? I have no idea what you are talking about.

there's no sex in it. this coin is weak.

I have PMed you.

bump

Some Casascius coins are regarded collector's items. In particular, the 2011 Series 1 coins show a mispelling in the hologram (Casacius instead of CasaScius) and as a result production was stopped in favor of a Series 2 coin with the hologram spelled correctly.

Why do you ask 6-7 BTC for it when it says that it is 1 BTC? I am a bit confused.

Lovely piece of work ,i am very interested in this, however i can only offer 3-4 btc. If you are interested please let me know..

It looks lovely

I hope you will get your price! or even more

good luck!

Kind regards!

Lost a bunch of coins on MtGox recently. I know I deserved it. I know I should have seen it coming.
All this doesn't change the fact that I'm down and need to reel in some coins.

I'm willing to part with my baby, a 2011 S1 Holo Error. I was planning to mail it into ANACS but at this point it's probably better to sell.

Coin is in spetacular condition and ships inside coin holder. I accept usage of buyer's choice of escrow at his expenses. I have all documentation attesting its authenticity and am willing to answer any questions you may have via PM.

I'm looking to get 6-7 BTC (BTC price is lower than what it was months ago) but am willing to entertain offers. PM me if interested.