Allow newbies with merit to post images

Veleor

legendary

Activity: 1484

Merit: 1655

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: UserU on September 09, 2020, 09:26:28 PM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Maybe we make requirement more strict to significantly reduce abuse possibility, such as :
1. Must earned at least 3 merit and have at least 15 activity (which means they must active at least for 2 weeks)
2. Must earned at least 6 merit

Even so, only very few newbie (who're not spammer) who can enjoy the benefit.

~

I agree the example number of merit/activity i mentioned above might be too strict, but 1 merit is simply too low IMO.

I think this is a reasonable proposal to raise the required number of merits from one to three or six.
In the past month ~ 80 newbies received more than 3 merits, according to ddmrddmr resource.
Among these newbies: 11 copper members, 1 banned user, 2 members with a negative trust.

\|Merit	\| Username	\| Year Registered	\| Activity	\| Trust	\| Other
\| 33	\| cryptograffiti	\| 2014	\| 10	\|	\| Copper Member
\| 21	\| Mircea Popescu	\| 2011	\| 9	\|	\|
\| 18	\| anonymixer	\| 2020	\| 9	\|	\|
\| 16	\| coinforensics	\| 2020	\| 3	\|	\|
\| 15	\| OroroMunroe	\| 2020	\| 10	\|	\|
\| 14	\| naufragus	\| 2019	\| 18	\|	\|
\| 12	\| Chiefmonkey	\| 2016	\| 29	\| +	\| Copper Member
\| 12	\| Avery_39	\| 2020	\| 20	\|	\|
\| 11	\| PokerShares	\| 2020	\| 13	\|	\| Copper Member
\| 11	\| JuleAdka	\| 2020	\| 9	\|	\|
\| 10	\| ParadoxFox	\| 2020	\| 4	\|	\|
\| 10	\| Listing.Help	\| 2020	\| 17	\|	\|
\| 10	\| btcduster	\| 2020	\| 19	\|	\|
\| 09	\| TheVeryBigBean	\| 2020	\| 5	\|	\|
\| 09	\| synthylover	\| 2020	\| 10	\| +	\| Copper Member
\| 08	\| valentin.raich	\| 2020	\| 4	\|	\|
\| 08	\| sinazizi	\| 2019	\| 28	\|	\|
\| 07	\| TheMagnat	\| 2020	\| 2	\| +	\|
\| 07	\| OtherMacMan	\| 2020	\| 3	\|	\|
\| 07	\| Nergon	\| 2020	\| 12	\|	\|
\| 07	\| M1chlCZ	\| 2019	\| 13	\|	\|
\| 07	\| Eppo Leemburg	\| 2020	\| 10	\|	\|
\| 07	\| ADAMA_NOW	\| 2019	\| 11	\|	\|
\| 07	\| 0xB10C	\| 2017	\| 8	\|	\|
\| 06	\| saturent	\| 2020	\| 14	\| —	\|
\| 06	\| ImTheBoss	\| 2017	\| 4	\|	\|
\| 06	\| DonBirb	\| 2020	\| 6	\|	\|
\| 06	\| Disruptivas	\| 2020	\| 9	\|	\|
\| 06	\| cottora	\| 2019	\| 18	\|	\|
\| 06	\| coinsbox	\| 2020	\| 28	\| +	\| Copper Member
\| 06	\| CardCoins	\| 2020	\| 27	\|	\|
\| 05	\| ZmnSCPxj	\| 2018	\| 9	\|	\|
\| 05	\| willstnKeks	\| 2018	\| 27	\|	\|
\| 05	\| V4n3ss4	\| 2020	\| 5	\|	\|
\| 05	\| V_Champion	\| 2020	\| 2	\|	\|
\| 05	\| oikos	\| 2020	\| 17	\|	\| Copper Member
\| 05	\| NFTeaPlease	\| 2020	\| 13	\|	\|
\| 05	\| lane.c.wagner	\| 2018	\| 21	\|	\|
\| 05	\| heropanda	\| 2020	\| 21	\|	\| Copper Member
\| 05	\| bababubu	\| 2020	\| 3	\|	\|
\| 05	\| ashfame	\| 2020	\| 17	\|	\|
\| 05	\| arandon	\| 2020	\| 17	\|	\|
\| 05	\| ahctpacer	\| 2020	\| 7	\|	\|
\| 04	\| themandarin	\| 2018	\| 17	\|	\|
\| 04	\| polarityexchange	\| 2020	\| 20	\|	\| Copper Member
\| 04	\| oneofakind_new	\| 2020	\| 6	\|	\|
\| 04	\| ochados	\| 2018	\| 4	\|	\| Copper Member
\| 04	\| jpp	\| 2011	\| 14	\|	\|
\| 04	\| jod8589	\| 2020	\| 4	\|	\|
\| 04	\| jdn_ldn	\| 2017	\| 24	\|	\|
\| 04	\| impact.affiliate	\| 2020	\| 17	\|	\|
\| 04	\| HobbyMinor	\| 2020	\| 5	\|	\|
\| 04	\| Go-Overt	\| 2020	\| 14	\|	\| Copper Member
\| 04	\| Flevio23	\| 2020	\| 2	\|	\|
\| 04	\| Fellane	\| 2018	\| 21	\|	\| Copper Member
\| 04	\| eusebiot	\| 2018	\| 14	\| —	\|
\| 04	\| Doctorv5000	\| 2017	\| 5	\|	\|
\| 04	\| Collier1	\| 2020	\| 14	\|	\|
\| 04	\| BTC_Mouse	\| 2020	\| 9	\|	\|
\| 04	\| abdulodoi	\| 2020	\| 14	\|	\|
\| 04	\| abdallahbtc	\| 2019	\| 1	\|	\|
\| 03	\| zeroknowledgeproofs	\| 2018	\| 27	\|	\|
\| 03	\| Volzhanin	\| 2017	\| 28	\|	\|
\| 03	\| tiagocs	\| 2017	\| 27	\|	\|
\| 03	\| tardy	\| 2019	\| 16	\|	\|
\| 03	\| stakecenter.co	\| 2020	\| 8	\|	\| Copper Member
\| 03	\| Somar44	\| 2020	\| 20	\|	\|
\| 03	\| SANihal02	\| 2020	\| 23	\|	\|
\| 03	\| Prom_ZA	\| 2017	\| 18	\|	\|
\| 03	\| peevekos	\| 2020	\| 7	\|	\|
\| 03	\| msafi	\| 2020	\| 8	\|	\|
\| 03	\| mfagundes	\| 2020	\| 4	\|	\|
\| 03	\| LibertyRemains	\| 2014	\| 13	\|	\|
\| 03	\| kurgak	\| 2017	\| 11	\|	\|
\| 03	\| KEBKR	\| 2018	\| 28	\| +	\|
\| 03	\| fatrattombala	\| 2020	\| 3	\|	\|
\| 03	\| dakiller322	\| 2018	\| 5	\|	\|
\| 03	\| cryptomarcianos	\| 2020	\| 10	\|	\| Banned
\| 03	\| confusedidiot	\| 2020	\| 4	\|	\|
\| 03	\| beau540	\| 2020	\| 1	\|	\|
\| 03	\| crispymaxim	\| 2020	\| 0	\|	\|

actmyname

copper member

Activity: 2562

Merit: 2510

Spear the bees

Quote from: Insanerman on September 11, 2020, 08:31:02 AM

Though you are suggesting some perks and beneficial to the newbies that are good posters, it would simply be a hard task for them with such ceiling of standards.

Jr. Member is already a 1 merit requirement: I would say that earning 3 merit is not a difficult task, especially across the minimum 2 week maximum 4 week interval for users to spend waiting in activity periods.

(If you join and post right before an activity period changes, you minimize the waiting time, and conversely if you post directly after the change you maximize the wait time)

Insanerman

sr. member

Activity: 1162

Merit: 450

The only problem here is that there are newbies whom wanted to posts images while cannot wait for their activity to reach junior member. As long as you post with 30min and up interval for atleast 10 times a day, you can be easily reaching the Jr. Member rank for a week, and also if you are a good poster and helpful to be worth merited.

Quote from: ?? on ??

Maybe we make requirement more strict to significantly reduce abuse possibility, such as :
1. Must earned at least 3 merit and have at least 15 activity (which means they must active at least for 2 weeks)
2. Must earned at least 6 merit

Even so, only very few newbie (who're not spammer) who can enjoy the benefit.

Keep in mind that theymos did mention this:

Quote from: theymos on June 24, 2018, 10:16:59 PM

Limiting newbie participation is very harmful for a community. Newbie jail will never return: I consider the newbie-jail period to have been extremely damaging to the forum. When barriers to participation are too high, then the best people often just won't go to the trouble of joining, and the people who are willing to jump through the hoops are often people who aren't good for the community: people with nothing better to do, scammers, get-rick-quickers, etc. Having a permanent newbie jail policy would improve things a lot in the short-term, but would end up being a fatal poison to the community.

Though you are suggesting some perks and beneficial to the newbies that are good posters, it would simply be a hard task for them with such ceiling of standards.

cryptoaddictchie

legendary

Activity: 2268

Merit: 1379

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Quote from: ?? on ??

1. Must earned at least 3 merit and have at least 15 activity (which means they must active at least for 2 weeks)
2. Must earned at least 6 merit

This is quite rare for a newbie to earn but its a good range or idea. But to be honest, I think if they are badly needed to post images, they could resort to mostly suggested here. Purchase copper membership, but having an option like this could somehow be beneficial to newbies who dont usually do services if they used newbie accounts. Typically these newbies buying the membership usually have business here but what you suggested is cool for average users who dont belong to this criteria.

Quote from: ?? on ??

Even so, only very few newbie (who're not spammer) who can enjoy the benefit.

Better termed is "rare" out of hundreds.

Quote from: UserU on September 09, 2020, 09:26:28 PM

Have to sometimes think from a newbie's perspective too. If a simple thing such as posting an image is made too difficult, he/ she would not even want to hang around.

Its not that it makes it hard but a system could filter real deals on all newbies. Though the suggestion is very strict I think it helps on differentiating the true users from spammers.

UserU

hero member

Activity: 2128

Merit: 532

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Maybe we make requirement more strict to significantly reduce abuse possibility, such as :
1. Must earned at least 3 merit and have at least 15 activity (which means they must active at least for 2 weeks)
2. Must earned at least 6 merit

Even so, only very few newbie (who're not spammer) who can enjoy the benefit.

I feel the current one is sufficient enough. Gain 1 Merit, be active for a while to post images.

Have to sometimes think from a newbie's perspective too. If a simple thing such as posting an image is made too difficult, he/ she would not even want to hang around.

After all, those with malicious intent would be caught anyway, sooner or later.

jademaxsuy

full member

Activity: 924

Merit: 221

In my opinion it is not needed because the only problem I have seen with the sample below were users inactivity. They just received merits and after that done nothing to increase their activity. We could not blame the forum for this because of low activity when in fact it could be possible to increase it. Well just going to leave it that way for now which is not really necessary. Anyway, if it really needed for a user to add image in his post then it is enough to write a note that the image should be view to get a clearer picture or to get the message OP wanted to share.

However, the sample really shows a rare case of incidents in receiving a merit of a single post. It was really fun to watch those creative users who made it. Clearly shows that the forum has users with exceptional skills.

Poker Player

legendary

Activity: 1372

Merit: 2017

I don't see the point. I was a newbie until recently. I tried to post an image and couldn't. Then I googled and found out I wasn't going to be able to until I reached junior member (or until I bought copper membership). I waited for a while and became junior member so I started posting images.

I imagine this was set this way to avoid trolling/spamming.

Images are not crucial for this forum, it doesn't matter that some newbies have to wait a little bit to post images.

TheUltraElite

legendary

Activity: 2898

Merit: 1253

So anyway, I applied as a merit source :)

The copper membership is there to allow a newbie to "buy" the ability to post images. This generates some income for the forum too.

Now if you think a newbie who has been merited quite a few times is worthy of being able to post images, we have the higher rank for that. Is that not thus a redundant suggestion? When they reach Jr. Member rank they can post images anyway, why lower the merit-bar for that?

tranthidung

legendary

Activity: 2310

Merit: 4085

Farewell o_e_l_e_o

Images can be abused and if they already earn merit (one at least) they will be able to show images later when ranking up to Junior Members. About one month of waiting since date of registration is not too long.

Quote from: theymos on September 06, 2015, 03:35:15 PM

Due to abuse, newbie-posted embedded images are now disabled on these pages:
< ... >
Disabled images get transformed into links automatically. When the poster becomes a Jr member, the images that he tried to post previously will automatically be re-enabled (though there might be a few minutes of delay).

This extends to all past posts as well as future ones.

Unofficial solutions

Readers / viewers can see Newbie's images if newbies know the method to post their images.

On imgur.com, after you upload image, you will have to click on:

Copy Link -- Get share links -- Some options to choose:

Share Link
HTML Embed
BBCode (Forums)
Markdown (Reddit)

If they choose the third, they can not display images anyway and need quotes for users at higher ranks to display images in quotes. Fortunately, with this option, their images will automatically displayed later when they rank up to Junior Member at least.

If they choose the first option, viewers can see their images at their post history. Images are shared by Share Link option will be displayed on Newbies' post history page. The inconvenience is: you have to go to post history and scroll down to that post to see images. Fortunately again, with newbies they don't have many posts (excludes spam newbies).

You can check. Cheesy

Rengga Jati

hero member

Activity: 2142

Merit: 670

Hire Bitcointalk Camp. Manager @ r7promotions.com

First, the rule is a rule. This of course has been carefully considered before why the requirement to be able to post pictures is Jr. Member.
In this case, maybe the emphasis is not just getting 1 merit, but more on the member's contribution at least in the vulnerable time during which the activities are fulfilled and become Jr. member. Here, we cannot say that the newbie is successful because he has earned 1 merit. We should not only take a look at the merit but also the other posts they make. it could be that someone creates a new account here and makes a great post and sends their sMerit to the account. This is not an accusation, but one example.
In my opinion, this should not be debated. As long as the newbies are good posters and good members, I am sure that they will obey the rules and have no objection to this. They can casually provide an image link so other people can quote the link or click the image link to find out what the member has to say.
And so far, it doesn't matter.
Even some of the users you quote don't mind. And after I look and check the members, it looks like they get a lot of merits from anniversary events, not from posts that are contributed to the forum. so, it cannot be used as a standard.

Sanugarid

full member

Activity: 1442

Merit: 153

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Quote from: Lucius on September 08, 2020, 07:56:01 AM

1 merit shouldn’t be proof that someone isn’t a spammer or that they don’t have bad intentions, and a restriction by an admin is certainly not some hasty decision.

1 merit isn't enough for them to prove their realness, as what you said it can be abused by some members here. There was reason why Theymos restricted posting images from newbies, and I know that was a smart move to avoid being shilled. If you would try to let them post pictures, the forum would look so annoying. Just leave a link of the image that will redirected to a webpage, that's already enough and we understand it.

sujonali1819

legendary

Activity: 2436

Merit: 1189

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I do not also agree with this. Most of the newbies are alt of someone recently. They just create an account and do the bounty. They don't care about their rank. Only very rear newbie come here to promote there websites or other services, they are serious-minded and there is no problem to buy the copper membership. But yes we may ask to consider less the copper membership price (if it would high,to be honest, I don't know the recent fees). I am agreed to with you who have said that newbie will increase the spam if they can post image from the biggining. Yes, right. Even they don't care to increase the post quality if they publish image without copper/merits. So if the rules remain unchange atleast some newbie will try to make one quality post to hunting one merit.

bob123

legendary

Activity: 1624

Merit: 2481

Quote from: Rikafip on September 08, 2020, 09:54:23 AM

Question is, how often newbies create such a quality content that them posting images cause huge inconvenience on mass scale?

The answer to that probably is never.
If a newbie wants to promote a legit service and needs to post images for that, they will simply buy a copper membership.

But newbies who don't want to buy one, most likely don't post quality content which requires the ability to post images.
Ranking up isn't that hard if you aren't just spamming.

The Sceptical Chymist

legendary

Activity: 3528

Merit: 7005

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Quote from: AB de Royse777 on September 08, 2020, 07:44:09 AM

to be honest most of the newbies are spammers without any clue.

And that's been true for years, unfortunately. Since most noobs are only here to participate in campaigns/bounties, I doubt a lot of them care about their ability to post images. In addition, and as already mentioned, it isn't hard at all for a Newbie to earn a single merit. My guess is that most have been referred to the forum by friends or other people they know, and they can easily pick up one merit from someone they know--without having to earn it. That's why you'll see a lot of Jr. Members with 1 merit even though they registered here months ago (or even longer).

I'm all for freedom of speech out in the real world, but on a discussion forum like this that acts as a magnet to attract spammers, idiots, and scammers, I strongly support being more restrictive when it comes to Newbies (and even Jr. Members) rather than less restrictive. New members can wait to have the privilege of posting images, and if it's an inconvenience then it's something they'll just have to deal with.

Rikafip

legendary

Activity: 1722

Merit: 5937

Quote from: Veleor on September 08, 2020, 07:17:15 AM

The restriction on posting images creates a lot of inconvenience not just for newbies who posting quality content, but also for other Bitcointalk members who cannot immediately see pictures from newbies on the forum

Question is, how often newbies create such a quality content that them posting images cause huge inconvenience on mass scale? From what I could see in my time here on the bitcointalku forum, situations like that doesn't happen often.

Regarding your examples from that anniversary contest, that was heavily abused and there were
many alt accounts made just for that purpose,trying to get either money or easy merit.

I was newbie user not so long time ago, and I don't remember being annoyed by inability to post images. On the contrary, I've even saw it as some kind of reward for reaching Jr Member rank, and I wouldn't be surprised if other once newbie members felt the same.

crwth

copper member

Activity: 2940

Merit: 1280

https://linktr.ee/crwthopia

I don't think receiving merit would be enough. They could just link an image from a trusted source and let the readers read from there—no need to be able to post new images.

What I thought about when I read this is that "Are posts with images more likely to receive merit than those who have not?" . I think the answer to this question is true; those with images have a greater chance of receiving merit compared to those who have none. No concrete backed statistics on this one; maybe someone could collect data for this?

If they want, they could buy the Copper Membership and then earn merits. At least in that way, they are helping the forum as well.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.24371150

The Cryptovator

legendary

Activity: 2408

Merit: 2226

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Nah, I do not agree with OP. It will increase more spam on the forum. I know there are a few high-quality newbies, but the percentage is very very low. Most likely it will no more than 1% at all. So it would be an advantage for spammers. Just let them spend more time on the forum at least become Jr. Member, so he will learn about the forum culture. If someone needs to post some important image, then they could buy a copper membership. I am not blaming that quality newbies are alt if someone, but shouldn't give advantage for spammers.

LoyceV

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Merit: 16489

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Quote from: Veleor on September 08, 2020, 07:17:15 AM

If a newbie received at least 1 merit, then I suppose the probability that s/he is a spammer is low.

But if a spammer would want to spam bad image, anyone with a few sMerit could create many accounts that can do this.
In topic where it's relevant (for instance on Collectibles), there's usually someone who quotes the post to show embedded images. I don't think this is much of a problem.

Lucius

legendary

Activity: 3234

Merit: 5637

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Quote from: Veleor on September 08, 2020, 07:17:15 AM

If a newbie received at least 1 merit, then I suppose the probability that s/he is a spammer is low. Therefore, I believe that it is necessary to remove the Activity requirement, so that any user who received at least 1 merit could freely publish pictures.

Below are several examples when newbies with merit were unable to post images due to their low activity:
#msg52979733
#msg53004703
#msg53059918
#msg18130760

The first three examples are obviously someone’s alt accounts created just to participate in a contest - because all three became inactive after that - and the activity is at least easy to accomplish - while 4 example is a member who ceased to be active in 2017. All of them could very quickly and easily become Jr. Member only if they wanted to - I doubt that the impossibility of the posting pictures distracted them from that.

1 merit shouldn’t be proof that someone isn’t a spammer or that they don’t have bad intentions, and a restriction by an admin is certainly not some hasty decision.

Jet Cash

legendary

Activity: 2814

Merit: 2472

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Posting redundant images in non-social threads can be really annoying, and disrupt the thread. Putting the poster on ignore doesn't always help, as some dick-piece may quote the image, or even nest it. Newbies coming from social media platforms where text creation may be an insurmountable challenge, can bring their bad habits to this forum.

AB de Royse777

legendary

Activity: 2464

Merit: 3878

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I always side for freedom and have equal opportunity but to be honest most of the newbies are spammers without any clue. Someone who is serious can easily wait for them to be a Jr. member. The example you brought are some exceptions only. I, too, hate to see images by clicking on the links but I guess that's a collateral damage we have to accept.

By the way, although it does not make sense for a forum member to buy copper membership unless they have any business but one can always buy a copper membership to allow themselves to post an image.

Pffrt

sr. member

Activity: 1372

Merit: 322

Merit is a partial requirement beside activity. Both are equally important.
Newbie was disallowed to post image because of abuse, I think people with 1 received merit can still abuse it since receiving 1 merit is quite easy. And having more than 28 activity doesn't take much time too.

Veleor

legendary

Activity: 1484

Merit: 1655

Rêlêå§ê ¥ðµr MïñÐ

Quote from: theymos on September 06, 2015, 03:35:15 PM

Due to abuse, newbie-posted embedded images are now disabled on these pages:
- Topic display
- Recent posts / patrol
- Previews
They're not currently hidden in PMs or on some other pages (like a user's "show posts" page), though I might change that later if it seems necessary.

Disabled images get transformed into links automatically. When the poster becomes a Jr member, the images that he tried to post previously will automatically be re-enabled (though there might be a few minutes of delay).

This extends to all past posts as well as future ones.

The restriction on posting images creates a lot of inconvenience not just for newbies who posting quality content, but also for other Bitcointalk members who cannot immediately see pictures from newbies on the forum.

If a newbie received at least 1 merit, then I suppose the probability that s/he is a spammer is low. Therefore, I believe that it is necessary to remove the Activity requirement, so that any user who received at least 1 merit could freely publish pictures.

Below are several examples when newbies with merit were unable to post images due to their low activity:
#msg52979733
#msg53004703
#msg53059918
#msg18130760

Topic: Allow newbies with merit to post images (Read 459 times)