ANN threads shouldn't be self-moderated

huup

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Activity: 292

Merit: 16

Quote from: joniboini on September 24, 2019, 12:59:20 AM

Quote from: huup on September 23, 2019, 06:24:01 AM

I wish our thread was self moderated. ....

Scam accusations are not moderated. Just do what suchmoon suggested, start a new one.
Which rule said 'scam spamming' is forbidden btw?

Hi,

While searching for answers we found this guideline created by our moderater:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/unofficial-list-of-official-bitcointalkorg-rules-guidelines-faq-703657

where we found these two examples

Quote

Examples:

1. Such posts as "SELL SELL SELL", "I agree", "+1", "Support", "Watching", "Interesting", "LOL", "SCAM", "LEGIT", "FAKE", other one word posts, posts consisting mostly of swearing, quote pyramids, useless introduction threads, threads about a topic already recently discussed in several other threads.

Quote

Q: Do you moderate/delete (possible) FUD, accusations and untrue information?
A: No. We don't have enough time to check every single piece of information and verify the validity of the sources. Also, just like scams - too much room for bias and abuse.

However, trolling isn't allowed. If a user is habitually posting obviously false nonsense ("obviously false nonsense" to an outsider, NOT to someone who follows or is involved in the discussion) just to stir up trouble, then it's considered trolling, which is prohibited. Such cases should be thoroughly documented in the report though (There are tons of reports that just say "trolling", but moderators don't have time to look through each user's post).

tranthidung

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Farewell o_e_l_e_o

Quote from: pandukelana2712 on September 23, 2019, 01:55:08 PM

Seriously? Is there chopper member exist here?

Yes, one of them is hilariousandco

I think now it is time to look back the ANN thread of theymos, when he enabled the option for self-moderated threads.
From which, there are two main objectives of self-moderated threads:

Owners only want to collect posts that reply to them, not to others in their self-moderated threads.
Posts reply to other respondents (not threads' owners) will be judged by owners and delete or not delete will depends on their perspective as well as their mood.

Basically, there is nothing wrong if a user posts in a self-moderated thread and minutes or hours later see that post deleted. It is the 'worst' case that poster should aware of at beginnings.

Quote from: theymos on March 13, 2013, 08:52:59 PM

In most sections, you now have the option of marking topics self-moderated when creating them. In self-moderated topics, the OP can delete replies. The option for enabling this is under "additional options". Topics cannot be converted to self-moderated topics after creation.

There are no rules to self-moderation. In self-moderated threads, replies belong to the OP. In other threads, replies belong to the respondents individually. Think carefully about whether you want to reply to a self-moderated topic, as your post may not be given due respect.

Tell me if there are any bugs. If this ends up not working out well, I might remove it.

joniboini

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Quote from: pandukelana2712 on September 23, 2019, 01:55:08 PM

Selfmoderates is not used for deleting every post contrary to OP.

This depends entirely on the OP. Sure, a good OP won't do that, but some will do.

Quote from: huup on September 23, 2019, 06:24:01 AM

I wish our thread was self moderated. ....

Scam accusations are not moderated. Just do what suchmoon suggested, start a new one.
Which rule said 'scam spamming' is forbidden btw?

pandukelana2712

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Activity: 728

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BountyPortal Supporter & Hhampuz is my manager

Quote from: Lafu on September 04, 2019, 02:08:06 PM

-snip-
Selfmoderated Threads can be done with min of 5 Merits or something like that and also maybe Chopper Members can do it !
Would be nice if that gets inplemented from theymos !

Seriously? Is there chopper member exist here?

Selfmoderates is not used for deleting every post contrary to OP.
I ever discuss about it on my local board.
The conclusion of my discussion, OP can delete the user posts if the posts are repeat another post above (spam) or the post have bad language/behaviour (nice project, good luck, profitable work, etc).
Otherwise, if the user posts have contrary with OP, they must discuss till have conclusions and agreement. They must show valid proof and literary.

suchmoon

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https://bpip.org

Quote from: huup on September 23, 2019, 09:20:02 AM

Excellent excellent. so while you found one repeating post which is made on whole pages full off repeating post (which i find rebuttal) we agree that this isn't exactly approved on?

There is a lot more than one. And whataboutism is a dumb defense strategy, typical for scammers. Create a self-modded thread and rot there. Forum rules still apply in self-modded threads though so you might want to read up on it.

huup

member

Activity: 292

Merit: 16

Quote from: suchmoon on September 23, 2019, 08:18:18 AM

Quote from: huup on September 23, 2019, 07:12:00 AM

Yes I have read the rules. What is it exactly you mean where we don’t follow the rules? And where the rest we complain about are according to the rules? And you also thanks for a civil conversation.

You haven't. You multipost like crazy, and that's not even accounting for all your sockpuppets. Most of your "rebuttals" are low-value garbage. There is some copy-pasta as well:

Quote from: ?? on ??

In case anyone would have missed it.

2019 will be a great year for Bankera.

XRP recently added to the exchange and a lot off updates are coming up for the exchange.
More coins/tokens to be added in the coming weeks.
Cards are coming back.
Loans recently launched
Iban opening up.
They are opening offices in multiple EEA
Marketing starting soon! (with known youtubers)

Quote from: huup on August 10, 2019, 06:54:02 AM

i case anyone would have missed it.

2019 will be a great year for Bankera.

XRP recently added to the exchange and a lot off updates are coming up for the exchange.
More coins/tokens to be added in the coming weeks.
Cards are coming back.
Loans recently launched
Iban opening up.
They are opening offices in multiple EEA
Marketing starting soon! (with known youtubers)

Excellent excellent. so while you found one repeating post which is made on whole pages full off repeating post (which i find rebuttal) we agree that this isn't exactly approved on?

Quote from: JollyGood on September 12, 2019, 04:37:32 PM

Quote from: mosprognoz on September 12, 2019, 04:09:42 PM

Quote from: minotawr on September 12, 2019, 12:37:39 PM

I'm Lithuanian myself. I remember long time ago i was searching for Spectrocoin office. This one:
UAB Spectro Finance
Vilniaus g. 31
Vilnius LT-01402
Lithuania
And guess what? It does not exists. I asked some people in that building, but they never heard about spectrocoin.
And the telephone +44 20 3769 5474 is fake too.

Great news. Fake addresses, fake promises... The word FAKE is very closely associated with bankera.

Yes the number for sure is fake, I dialled it to test.

Another thing, the address they gave for the UK is a mailing address - they do not have an office there: Kemp House, 160 City Road, London EC1V 2NX

It costs around 100 EURO a year to get permission to use that address as a company mailing address and that address is shared by many companies: https://yourvirtualofficelondon.co.uk/

According to this link there are over 1000 companies that have used the same address as a "mailing address" but have never actually existed there, it just looks nice to put on websites and company documents to fool people in to thinking they are a big company with an office in London, UK: http://www.ukaddressbook.uk/a/kemp-house-152-160-city-road-london-ec1v-2nx

Thankfully the Spectrocoin/Bankera drama is falling apart as they are now being scrutinised more and more

Quote from: JollyGood on September 12, 2019, 04:57:25 PM

Quote from: JollyGood on September 12, 2019, 04:37:32 PM

Quote from: mosprognoz on September 12, 2019, 04:09:42 PM

Quote from: minotawr on September 12, 2019, 12:37:39 PM

I'm Lithuanian myself. I remember long time ago i was searching for Spectrocoin office. This one:
UAB Spectro Finance
Vilniaus g. 31
Vilnius LT-01402
Lithuania
And guess what? It does not exists. I asked some people in that building, but they never heard about spectrocoin.
And the telephone +44 20 3769 5474 is fake too.

Great news. Fake addresses, fake promises... The word FAKE is very closely associated with bankera.

Yes the number for sure is fake, I dialled it to test.

Another thing, the address they gave for the UK is a mailing address - they do not have an office there: Kemp House, 160 City Road, London EC1V 2NX

It costs around 100 EURO a year to get permission to use that address as a company mailing address and that address is shared by many companies: https://yourvirtualofficelondon.co.uk/

According to this link there are over 1000 companies that have used the same address as a "mailing address" but have never actually existed there, it just looks nice to put on websites and company documents to fool people in to thinking they are a big company with an office in London, UK: http://www.ukaddressbook.uk/a/kemp-house-152-160-city-road-london-ec1v-2nx

Thankfully the Spectrocoin/Bankera drama is falling apart as they are now being scrutinised more and more

Quote from: JollyGood on September 12, 2019, 05:07:04 PM

Quote from: gorbal on September 12, 2019, 01:30:59 PM

Exchange 24H Volume = 3 000 https://www.coingecko.com/en/exchanges/bankera

Token 24H volume = 25 000 https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/bankera/

They provide fake volumes and fake company details too

Fake phone number, fake address in the UK. They do not have an office there: Kemp House, 160 City Road, London EC1V 2NX

It costs around 100 EURO a year to get permission to use that address as a company mailing address and that address is shared by many companies: https://yourvirtualofficelondon.co.uk/

According to this link there are over 1000 companies that have used the same address as a "mailing address" but have never actually existed there, it just looks nice to put on websites and company documents to fool people in to thinking they are a big company with an office in London, UK: http://www.ukaddressbook.uk/a/kemp-house-152-160-city-road-london-ec1v-2nx

Quote from: JollyGood on September 12, 2019, 05:10:30 PM

Quote from: gorbal on September 12, 2019, 01:28:21 PM

Quote from: JollyGood on September 12, 2019, 01:11:51 PM

And this exchange is supposed to be the centrepiece attraction of the whole Bankera ecosystem?

It has $3000 in 24 hour trade volumes, how can anybody take this useless "project" seriously?

And just compare the rates with other exchanges. Nobody with clear mind will trade on that exchange. Just two words. GREEDY SCAMMERS

Yes they are greedy scammers

but they need sock-puppets to pump their propaganda in their threads

Bankera = SCAM

Spectrocoin = SCAM

Quote from: JollyGood on September 12, 2019, 05:15:16 PM

These scammers from Spectrocoin/Bankera have been exposed

Fake phone number, fake address in the UK. They do not have an office there: Kemp House, 160 City Road, London EC1V 2NX

It costs around 100 EURO a year to get permission to use that address as a company mailing address and that address is shared by many companies: https://yourvirtualofficelondon.co.uk/

According to this link there are over 1000 companies that have used the same address as a "mailing address" but have never actually existed there, it just looks nice to put on websites and company documents to fool people in to thinking they are a big company with an office in London, UK: http://www.ukaddressbook.uk/a/kemp-house-152-160-city-road-london-ec1v-2nx

So no defence provided by the sock-puppet team that are pumping Spectrocoin/Bankera:

JohnnyBTC197
Bankera
huup
SpectroCoin_support

Quote from: JollyGood on September 12, 2019, 05:18:33 PM

I will add these super scammer evil pathetic imbeciles from Spectrocoin/Bankera to my Scam Alert thread: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/scam-alert-list-created-by-jollygood-5146438

Fake phone number, fake address in the UK. They do not have an office there: Kemp House, 160 City Road, London EC1V 2NX

It costs around 100 EURO a year to get permission to use that address as a company mailing address and that address is shared by many companies: https://yourvirtualofficelondon.co.uk/

According to this link there are over 1000 companies that have used the same address as a "mailing address" but have never actually existed there, it just looks nice to put on websites and company documents to fool people in to thinking they are a big company with an office in London, UK: http://www.ukaddressbook.uk/a/kemp-house-152-160-city-road-london-ec1v-2nx

So no defence provided by the sock-puppet team that are pumping Spectrocoin/Bankera:

JohnnyBTC197
Bankera
huup
SpectroCoin_support

Quote from: JollyGood on September 12, 2019, 05:26:29 PM

Fake phone number, fake address in the UK. They do not have an office there: Kemp House, 160 City Road, London EC1V 2NX

It costs around 100 EURO a year to get permission to use that address as a company mailing address and that address is shared by many companies: https://yourvirtualofficelondon.co.uk/

According to this link there are over 1000 companies that have used the same address as a "mailing address" but have never actually existed there, it just looks nice to put on websites and company documents to fool people in to thinking they are a big company with an office in London, UK: http://www.ukaddressbook.uk/a/kemp-house-152-160-city-road-london-ec1v-2nx

Quote from: JollyGood on September 13, 2019, 04:04:47 AM

Quote from: JohnnyBTC197 on September 13, 2019, 12:37:46 AM

I am wondering why they are starting all over again with the same stuff we had over and over again before Huh

Regarding the offices (we had this topic before...):

There is lithuanian TV documentation regarding Fintech and Blockchain in Lithuania showing
Bankera and their offices.

You can see the full documentation with even more of their offices here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8KS-F4Z7eE&t=623s

But the whole documentation is probably faked like the moon landing Wink

And also Lon Wong, the former president of the NEM foundation, had a due dilligence at one of their offices in the very beginning:

His tweet regarding the office (with picture): https://twitter.com/2017lon/status/908334221013471232

Why wonder? The answer is clear... you are a sock-puppet belonging to the Spectrocoin/Bankera scammers

100 EURO a year is all it costs to receive mail at the UK 'office'. You and your ilk are a bunch of pathetic imbeciles.

Quote from: JollyGood on September 13, 2019, 04:57:50 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: JollyGood on September 12, 2019, 04:37:32 PM

I asked many times to post a video from bankera's office taken by simple mobile phone, but of course my request was rejected by bankera scammers.

I added both Bankera and Spectrocoin to my scam alert signature and also them along with their sock-puppets to my Scam Alert thread: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/scam-alert-list-created-by-jollygood-5146438

Quote from: JollyGood on September 13, 2019, 05:53:04 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: JollyGood on September 12, 2019, 04:37:32 PM

I asked many times to post a video from bankera's office taken by simple mobile phone, but of course my request was rejected by bankera scammers.

Bankera/Spectrocoin are scammers that use mailing addresses to pass off as their own company office address.

Their UK phone number is dead - just like their project

Their sock-puppet accounts can post here as much as they want with repeat large images from repeat posts made many months ago but they will not be able to stop those of us that want to expose the Bankera/Spectrocoin scammers

I added both Bankera and Spectrocoin to my scam alert signature and also them along with their sock-puppets to my Scam Alert thread: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/scam-alert-list-created-by-jollygood-5146438

Quote from: JollyGood on September 13, 2019, 12:23:24 PM

Quote from: kruglikov on September 13, 2019, 10:56:15 AM

Quote from: JollyGood on September 13, 2019, 09:45:42 AM

Does anybody know how many millions the Spectrocoin/Bankera scammers stole from the ICO?

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.52066448

Thank you for the information.

The Spectrocoin/Bankera scammers stole millions. I wonder how many of those funds can be traced back to their hideout in Lithuania?

SCAM

suchmoon

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Merit: 8909

https://bpip.org

Quote from: huup on September 23, 2019, 07:12:00 AM

Yes I have read the rules. What is it exactly you mean where we don’t follow the rules? And where the rest we complain about are according to the rules? And you also thanks for a civil conversation.

You haven't. You multipost like crazy, and that's not even accounting for all your sockpuppets. Most of your "rebuttals" are low-value garbage. There is some copy-pasta as well:

Quote from: ?? on ??

In case anyone would have missed it.

2019 will be a great year for Bankera.

XRP recently added to the exchange and a lot off updates are coming up for the exchange.
More coins/tokens to be added in the coming weeks.
Cards are coming back.
Loans recently launched
Iban opening up.
They are opening offices in multiple EEA
Marketing starting soon! (with known youtubers)

Quote from: huup on August 10, 2019, 06:54:02 AM

i case anyone would have missed it.

2019 will be a great year for Bankera.

XRP recently added to the exchange and a lot off updates are coming up for the exchange.
More coins/tokens to be added in the coming weeks.
Cards are coming back.
Loans recently launched
Iban opening up.
They are opening offices in multiple EEA
Marketing starting soon! (with known youtubers)

nutildah

legendary

Activity: 3010

Merit: 8114

Quote from: huup on September 23, 2019, 07:12:00 AM

Yes I have read the rules. What is it exactly you mean where we don’t follow the rules? And where the rest we complain about are according to the rules? And you also thanks for a civil conversation.

The main 2 reasons why posts get deleted are:

- consecutive posting in a thread: bumping a thread by posting 2 times in a row. If you wrote the last comment in a thread, edit your comment if you have something new to say, don't post a new comment.

- spam / off-topic: posting stuff that has absolutely nothing to do with the topic. In my experience, even if a post has just 1% to do with a topic, it will be considered on-topic and won't be removed.

Pretty much any sort of racism, sexism, hate speech or other distasteful talk is allowed here, so long as it isn't violating any laws (for example, no threats to commit personal harm).

You can even make outlandish claims about being extorted without any evidence to back them if you want, and the mods will not remove them. Wink

huup

member

Activity: 292

Merit: 16

Quote from: suchmoon on September 23, 2019, 07:06:33 AM

Quote from: huup on September 23, 2019, 06:24:01 AM

I wish our thread was self moderated.

Lock the old thread, start a new one.

Quote from: huup on September 23, 2019, 06:51:20 AM

The feeling that starts to rise is that the admins are in it to.

Sure, admins care so much about your scammy shitcoin... you should consider reading the rules perhaps.

Yes I have read the rules. What is it exactly you mean where we don’t follow the rules? And where the rest we complain about are according to the rules? And you also thanks for a civil conversation.

suchmoon

legendary

Activity: 3654

Merit: 8909

https://bpip.org

Quote from: huup on September 23, 2019, 06:24:01 AM

I wish our thread was self moderated.

Lock the old thread, start a new one.

Quote from: huup on September 23, 2019, 06:51:20 AM

The feeling that starts to rise is that the admins are in it to.

Sure, admins care so much about your scammy shitcoin... you should consider reading the rules perhaps.

huup

member

Activity: 292

Merit: 16

Quote from: ahmadakbari on September 23, 2019, 06:30:33 AM

Quote from: huup on September 23, 2019, 06:24:01 AM

I wish our thread was self moderated. We have so much scam spamming we can’t even read normal messages anymore and the admins refuse to act on it. I see the problem that deleting negativity isn’t good. But our thread is completely taken over with: insults, personal threads, discrimination. Homophobia and scam spamming which is all forbidden. Multiple users have complained and try reporting it on multiple levels. Nothing happens. I know now the discussion is being held to not engage with this platform anymore as it is lacking the professionalism.
It’s a shame, so yes I would definitely vote for self moderation.

You can simply report any post you want to moderators. Posts containing links, advertising and any kind of spam will be deleted by moderators just after they are seen.

Yes it should be like that. But I think we have reported it more then 100 times now between us as users. The feeling that starts to rise is that the admins are in it to. Nothing happens even worse. They start deleting our rebuttal.

ahmadakbari

full member

Activity: 602

Merit: 116

Quote from: huup on September 23, 2019, 06:24:01 AM

I wish our thread was self moderated. We have so much scam spamming we can’t even read normal messages anymore and the admins refuse to act on it. I see the problem that deleting negativity isn’t good. But our thread is completely taken over with: insults, personal threads, discrimination. Homophobia and scam spamming which is all forbidden. Multiple users have complained and try reporting it on multiple levels. Nothing happens. I know now the discussion is being held to not engage with this platform anymore as it is lacking the professionalism.
It’s a shame, so yes I would definitely vote for self moderation.

You can simply report any post you want to moderators. Posts containing links, advertising and any kind of spam will be deleted by moderators just after they are seen.

huup

member

Activity: 292

Merit: 16

I wish our thread was self moderated. We have so much scam spamming we can’t even read normal messages anymore and the admins refuse to act on it. I see the problem that deleting negativity isn’t good. But our thread is completely taken over with: insults, personal threads, discrimination. Homophobia and scam spamming which is all forbidden. Multiple users have complained and try reporting it on multiple levels. Nothing happens. I know now the discussion is being held to not engage with this platform anymore as it is lacking the professionalism.
It’s a shame, so yes I would definitely vote for self moderation.

Onuohakk

member

Activity: 672

Merit: 29

I see nothing wrong with self-moderated post on ANN thread. If you have any difficulties about their vision or purpose, you asked question for clarification. That's why the self-moderated topic are been created for answers

libert19

hero member

Activity: 2520

Merit: 952

If any Ann contains only positive statements in comments, also those spammy comments, "nice project" then it should be red flag in itself.

Every thing has two sides, positive and negative.

I would leave it as it is.

hosseinimr93

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Activity: 2380

Merit: 5213

Quote from: hd49728 on September 06, 2019, 10:06:39 AM

Patrol: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=recent;patrol
No-bounty: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=recent;patrol;nobounty. You can find spam posts outside bounty threads.

The links you posted are really helpful. Before your post, I didn't know there is possibility of having the last posts all in one page. I would like to know if it is possible to have these posts excluding bounty threads and posts made on local boards.

dkbit98

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Quote from: hd49728 on September 06, 2019, 10:06:39 AM

Thanks

I am well aware of those links

hd49728

legendary

Activity: 2044

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Not your keys, not your coins!

Quote from: dkbit98 on September 06, 2019, 09:51:22 AM

Do you know how many topics and posts I reported just few days ago
that created malicious virus spreading topics and post?

Who knows? It is your personal favorite work. Shocked

You don't need to actively post in any board or sub-board in order to report spam posts. You can spend a few minutes a day to visit two pages:
Patrol: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=recent;patrol
No-bounty: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=recent;patrol;nobounty. You can find spam posts outside bounty threads.
Skimming posts at two pages will save time, rather than skimming topics.

NJB18

sr. member

Activity: 663

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I agree on this. But if this cannot be changed then my stand remains that ANN moderated threads aren't reliable and truthful enough. People can create separate accusation threads though there is no assurance that ANN participants can see it without doing extra research.

dkbit98

legendary

Activity: 2212

Merit: 7064

Quote from: hd49728 on September 06, 2019, 09:47:21 AM

Do you know how many topics and posts I reported just few days ago
that created malicious virus spreading topics and post?

It was not posted on Bounty section.

PS
Restrictions I proposed are for SELF-MODERATOR topics and Newbie accounts

hd49728

legendary

Activity: 2044

Merit: 1018

Not your keys, not your coins!

Quote from: dkbit98 on September 05, 2019, 04:13:28 PM

Are we going to see some serious conversation regarding forum rules changes??
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/writing-a-welcome-message-5036308

I don't think so, because the forum has changed positively over months, after the appearance of merit system. I don't call that spam has entirely eliminated, but it has been reduced dramatically. I do believe that if we ignore all spamming Proof of Authentication posts from bounty threads, the level of spam significantly decreased.

To make sure the industry of signature advertisements won't be destroyed, please give your hands to find bad/ spam posts and do reports.
Cleaning up the house in Bitcoin/ Altcoin/ Gambling Discussion boards
Since 2018, what did you contribute to prevent signature ads removed globally?
I emphasized the importance of community users' contributions, and I do hope that users will support it.

TheUltraElite

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Activity: 2898

Merit: 1253

So anyway, I applied as a merit source :)

Quote from: dkbit98 on September 05, 2019, 04:13:28 PM

Are we going to see some serious conversation regarding forum rules changes??

You may but you should know that your opinion is only an opinion and not going to bring an immediate change in the system. Having a conversation is good but having a hope is false optimism. I have seen many many useful suggestions posted here but the decision of admins is what matters. You will have to wait for them to decide on this. Any attempt to force them a hurried decision only ends up in you thread getting ignored. Wink

Quote

Can we here some DT members opinion about this?

DT members and forum administration are not the same. This decision depends on the forum administration and you will just have to wait for them to decide what is good for the forum the freedom of speech for everyone.

Saisher

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Quote from: hosseinimr93 on September 04, 2019, 12:02:56 PM

Every day, some new ANN threads are created in the forum. Many of these ANN threads are self-moderated. In my opinion, posting self-moderated topics shouldn't be allowed on "Announcements (Altcoins)".
In most cases, they make the topics self-moderated to be able to delete any post complaining them. Instead of deleting the posts, they should report the posts and posts are deleted only by moderators.
I know there are many spams in these topics. They can be only allowed to delete the posts that are made by newbies.

I agree on you they are quick to delete negative posters in their thread, because investors may find out that they are running a dubious project, they even hire bumpers and shillers, I never trust announcement thread created by newbies that are moderated, this could mean they are hiding something.

dkbit98

legendary

Activity: 2212

Merit: 7064

Are we going to see some serious conversation regarding forum rules changes??
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/writing-a-welcome-message-5036308

I would really want to see Newbies have restriction to create self-moderated Topics.

Can we here some DT members opinion about this?

Theb

hero member

Activity: 1680

Merit: 655

Quote from: LoyceV on September 05, 2019, 06:47:05 AM

Quote from: Theb on September 05, 2019, 06:23:44 AM

From what I know LoyceV also have reported that they are making their ANN threads self-moderated because they also delete the post bumps being createdby them or bump services.

I haven't seen that "in the wild". It would be very obvious since theymos added a deleted-post-counter on top.

If I would create an ANN-thread, I would want it to be self-moderated to delete spam. One solution would be to only allow users with more than (say) 300 good reports to create self-moderated threads, but that goes against the forum's mission to be as free as possible.

My bad, I was actually referring to this topic you have posted a while back and maybe the point that I have missed is that the post being deleted are coming from the posters itself and not the OP deleting it manually because their ANN threads are self-moderated. To be honest I myself don't see any workaround when it comes to the option of having self-moderated topics without affecting all parties, maybe if we add in a strike system for the user abusing their self-moderated topics then we can actually remove the user's right to use it entirely.

hosseinimr93

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Quote from: hd49728 on September 05, 2019, 07:52:58 AM

Really? I have not seen theymos wrote about that or did I miss it? If theymos announced about that, and you knew where he posted it, please share me link to that post.

Here is the post made by Theymos in 2014

Quote from: theymos on January 27, 2014, 01:11:50 AM

Most giveaway threads are no longer allowed in the Alternate cryptocurrencies sections. From now on, posting or replying to such threads could result in being banned. Existing threads will be locked.

Specifically, you are not allowed to give people any incentive to post insubstantial posts in your threads. You can't offer to pay people who post their addresses, usernames, etc. You can do giveaways off-site and link to the giveaway page in a thread, but you can't give people any bonus for replying to your thread.

Similar threads are already restricted to Games and Rounds in the non-altcoin sections, but the giveaway-related post volume is so high in the altcoin sections that I've decided to just ban them entirely here.

What I has made it bold was ignored until August 2017 when mprep made the post below on August 19, 2017
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/incentivising-posting-within-one-or-more-threads-is-not-allowed-2103690

As I remember on that day many bounty threads all were deleted simultaneously. Not only the threads that had been considered bonus for replying to their thread. Theymos deleted all bounty threads that had asked participants to make posts on their ANN.
Before that time bounty managers used to force participants to make a certain percentage of their post on their ANN thread. For example bounty hunters had to make 10 posts which 2 of them must be on their ANN thread.

If I am not wrong discussions about that policy started from the post below.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=434310.580

hd49728

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Quote from: hosseinimr93 on September 05, 2019, 07:16:14 AM

Theymos finally deleted all the bounty threads that were forcing participants to reply to their threads. This caused number of useless posts on ANN threads to decrease.

Really? I have not seen theymos wrote about that or did I miss it? If theymos announced about that, and you knew where he posted it, please share me link to that post.
Bounty threads only relate to bump, and spam, to keep their bounty thread stays on top. In that trash subboard, without bumping threads will be hurried by other threads.
ANN threads with self-moderation mostly abused to censor posts that don't satisfy threads' owners. E.g. telling about proofs of scam.

hosseinimr93

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Quote from: hd49728 on September 05, 2019, 06:55:40 AM

I do agree with using 300 good reports as pre-requisite to be able to create self-moderated thread.
I don't know at start, self-moderated threads born in the forum for which kind of original purposes, but in my opinion, there are only main purpose:
- To avoid spam, delete trashposts from spammers to keep high quality threads as clean as possible.
Unfortunately, over time, bad guys, includes scammers abuse self-moderated threads for their shady targets.
That suggestion makes sense because scammers usually don't spend time to report bad posts, especially 300, just to create self-moderated threads. They mostly create new account, buy Copper membership or buy hacked accounts (high ranks). 300 good reports looks good, but I don't think it will solve issues, because there are demands, there are market, and we might see a new market with 300+ good-report accounts

You are completely right about the purposes of creating self-moderated topics. But in ANN threads, some threads are made self-moderated for other reasons. Spamming the thread usually doesn't matter to them. They just want their thread to be kept on top of other threads.
I remember in most of the bounties, participants used to be forced to make certain number of posts on ANN threads. Spamming doesn't matter to them. Theymos finally deleted all the bounty threads that were forcing participants to reply to their threads. This caused number of useless posts on ANN threads to decrease.

hilariousetc

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I would disagree. I think they should be allowed to moderate their own threads as they see fit, even if that can lead to abuse, but if that happens people are within their rights to complain about it or start their own thread to discuss the abuse. Personally, I would much rather have coins moderate their own threads rather than rely on mods to do that for them. Self-moderating does come in handy when you're being attacked by trolls or spammers and sometimes people may not be breaking the forum rules by doing so so it's better not to rely on staff to clean up their problems (and they wouldn't get involved if it doesn't break the rules).

DaveF

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Quote from: hd49728 on September 05, 2019, 06:55:40 AM

I do agree with using 300 good reports as pre-requisite to be able to create self-moderated thread.
I don't know at start, self-moderated threads born in the forum for which kind of original purposes, but in my opinion, there are only main purpose:
- To avoid spam, delete trashposts from spammers to keep high quality threads as clean as possible.
Unfortunately, over time, bad guys, includes scammers abuse self-moderated threads for their shady targets.
That suggestion makes sense because scammers usually don't spend time to report bad posts, especially 300, just to create self-moderated threads. They mostly create new account, buy Copper membership or buy hacked accounts (high ranks). 300 good reports looks good, but I don't think it will solve issues, because there are demands, there are market, and we might see a new market with 300+ good-report accounts

Reported posts is not a good test, many people don't report threads at all. So that is not a good way IMO.
The other issue I see is a known good poster (lets call him DaveF) wants to launch his own coin. Let's call it DaveCoin.
I want to have 2 separate accounts. This one and the DaveCoinAdmin for launching and discussing that coin. It's a publicly known alt but is 100% new.
So, now I can't mod my own thread?

-Dave

hd49728

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Not your keys, not your coins!

I do agree with using 300 good reports as pre-requisite to be able to create self-moderated thread.
I don't know at start, self-moderated threads born in the forum for which kind of original purposes, but in my opinion, there are only main purpose:
- To avoid spam, delete trashposts from spammers to keep high quality threads as clean as possible.
Unfortunately, over time, bad guys, includes scammers abuse self-moderated threads for their shady targets.
That suggestion makes sense because scammers usually don't spend time to report bad posts, especially 300, just to create self-moderated threads. They mostly create new account, buy Copper membership or buy hacked accounts (high ranks). 300 good reports looks good, but I don't think it will solve issues, because there are demands, there are market, and we might see a new market with 300+ good-report accounts

LoyceV

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Quote from: Theb on September 05, 2019, 06:23:44 AM

From what I know LoyceV also have reported that they are making their ANN threads self-moderated because they also delete the post bumps being createdby them or bump services.

I haven't seen that "in the wild". It would be very obvious since theymos added a deleted-post-counter on top.

If I would create an ANN-thread, I would want it to be self-moderated to delete spam. One solution would be to only allow users with more than (say) 300 good reports to create self-moderated threads, but that goes against the forum's mission to be as free as possible.

hd49728

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Quote from: Distinctin on September 05, 2019, 06:33:56 AM

You just have to trust the OP in that matter, somehow, self moderated thread will also help the thread clean but on the negative side, it could be viewed as non transparent thread. IMO, I like ANN threads that are not self moderated but the penalty of spamming should be harsh like banning instantly if it's really intentional so these people will not abuse the thread.

It is hard to trust any new teams, new born projects in crypto. Time, only time can verify their trustworthy and capacity to build up good projects and good ecosystem. I don't see problems if my posts in ANN threads deleted by owners. It will be somewhat signals of likely not good projects. So, I think it is good because owners give me free signals to stay away from their projects and I would like to say thanks to them.

Distinctin

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You just have to trust the OP in that matter, somehow, self moderated thread will also help the thread clean but on the negative side, it could be viewed as non transparent thread. IMO, I like ANN threads that are not self moderated but the penalty of spamming should be harsh like banning instantly if it's really intentional so these people will not abuse the thread.

NeuroticFish

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On the other hand, I've seen unmoderated threads that get full of garbage from trolls.
The truth is in the middle, somewhere. Maybe OP should have to ask permission from moderators to make his thread self-moderated and the permission can also be lost under some conditions. But I don't know if the forum software allows this and it would mean extra work for the mods.

Theb

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Quote from: The Sceptical Chymist on September 04, 2019, 12:31:28 PM

Quote from: rosezionjohn on September 04, 2019, 12:22:04 PM

abusing self-moderation to censor and/or cover their scammy/shady projects

This snippet above is the only problem I can see with self-moderated ANN threads, and I have no doubt whatsoever that some projects will do this. On the other hand, if you've ever seen one of these ANN threads you'll realize that about 95% of the posts there should be deleted.

The only question I have is whether the shitposts are being paid for by the project in order to bump the thread. If that's the case, then there's no reason to have a self-moderated thread, because then you know damn well that the OP isn't going to delete anything except for posts he doesn't like. I have a sneaking suspicion that most ANN thread starters love the bumping garbage posts.

From what I know LoyceV also have reported that they are making their ANN threads self-moderated because they also delete the post bumps being createdby them or bump services. I know a lot of newbies got nuked back then but I don't know if this kind of tactics still continues now. So really giving them a self-moderated topic as an option for their threads is a lot of advantage for them. The only problem here is removing the self-moderated threads would also affect projects who are always under the attack from members trying to damage their reputation.

tranthidung

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Quote from: dkbit98 on September 04, 2019, 12:29:41 PM

I proposed earlier that Brand New and Newbie account should not be even allowed to create new Topics (they can still create posts),
BUT if that is to drastic for many people, then Newbies should NOT be allowed to create Self-moderated Topics

It is not fair and not what theymos aims at. There is no newbie jail, and newbies have rights to create their topics, includes self-moderated ones.
I mentioned about it in my above posts:
- Sell-moderated topics have: total posts deleted, and how many users have posts deleted.
- Scam accusation is a good tool.
- Trust & different kind of flags.
If there is something should be consider, I think of:
- An option (as same as PM option) that users can choose to see threads created by Newbies or not. Ignore newbie thread option. If a user choose that option, s/he does not see threads created by newbies, but if those newbies rank up, their threads will be automatically visible.

TheUltraElite

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So anyway, I applied as a merit source :)

It would be great if ANN threads would not be self moderated if the cause you are referring to is scams. However we have two methods to combat this currently:
1. We are shown the number of deleted posts on that self modded thread as well as the total merits that those deleted posts recevied. Now it is not possible to call out a scammer and get merits on your post before they are deleted by the OP.
2. Create a "Scam Accusation" thread to explain why you think the person is scamming others and possibly add a newbie flag. Someone who got scammed might come up with enough evidence to construct a Type 3 Flag.

CryptopreneurBrainboss

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Self moderated thread aren't that bad especially when your competitors try to create fud by spreading wrong information on your ANN. When competitors uses alts or paid users to attack other projects, here's when a self moderated thread comes in handy. As for scam projects taking advantage of the feature, we have the trust and flag system to warn forum members about the shady activities of any project. You don't have to keep posting on their thread.

A self moderated ANN thread also offers the OP an opportunity to keep the discussion on the thread professional, avoiding offtopic discussion and their likes. Personally I hate reading through an ANN then encountering offtopic unnecessary discussion.

tranthidung

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Farewell o_e_l_e_o

I don't have bad feelings about self-moderated ANN threads.
Sure it is not a good signal of one project, but I don't think ANN threads can harm anyone.
If you think a project is a scam one, let's make a scam accusation with proof. I don't see mandatory reasons to post in their ANN threads, just to show proof of their scams.
For self-moderated ANN threads, above topic title, you can see the line:

Quote

"This is a self-moderated topic. If you do not want to be moderated by the person who started this topic, create a new topic. (X posts by Y users deleted.)"

Paying attention on X, and Y figures, then you can have an overview on how serious they censor posts in their threads.

In some boards, like Goods, Currency exchange, I agree that self-moderated threads should not be allowed.

Saisher

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Quote from: dkbit98 on September 04, 2019, 12:29:41 PM

It will only make a lot more work for moderators.
I proposed earlier that Brand New and Newbie account should not be even allowed to create new Topics (they can still create posts),
BUT if that is to drastic for many people, then Newbies should NOT be allowed to create Self-moderated Topics
multiple also

I agree with this one, newbies are the one that's creating new ICO announcement thread and they want it moderated so no one can post negative feedback on their project, I believe ICO or new announcement should be unmoderated so people can judge and can give a fair opinion about the project.

hosseinimr93

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Quote from: rosezionjohn on September 04, 2019, 12:22:04 PM

It is still helpful overall I think. It's supposed to combat spam only but if you believe someone is abusing self-moderation to censor and/or cover their scammy/shady projects, I believe you can always create a scam accusation/reputation thread. I don't know if you were able to witness how a fellow was confronted for deleting messages and hiding his human rights foundation scam.

If I believe that a project or a token is a scam, I would certainly make a new topic on "Scam accusation" thread. But some times only I want to make a complain. for example I complain about how they are conducting the ICO, bonuses, KYC, exchanges, etc. The ANN thread is the best place to talk about these issues. It's not convenient to make a new topic.

Lafu

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+10

Would be nice that New user cant make self moderated thread so they cant delete things like when you post in there thats the ANN is fake or have Malware in it or such other things
like Scam or else !

Selfmoderated Threads can be done with min of 5 Merits or something like that and also maybe Chopper Members can do it !
Would be nice if that gets inplemented from theymos !

Will helping a lot Users for bust Spammers and Scammer !

stompix

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Quote from: rosezionjohn on September 04, 2019, 12:22:04 PM

It is still helpful overall I think. It's supposed to combat spam only but if you believe someone is abusing self-moderation to censor and/or cover their scammy/shady projects, I believe you can always create a scam accusation/reputation thread.

Just as The Pharmacist said, but I don't have only a suspicion about, I'm pretty sure Tongue

.

Let's be a bit more realistic here, no OP is going to delete useless posts when those are actually helping his ICO or Altcoin announcement to be on the first page in that section, they all know that if they delete those they lose a lot of bumps and spammers would avoid them, go to others topics and bumps those instead.
Probably less than 0.1% of the authors out there care about quality and not about keeping the topics spammed and alive on the first page.

As for the ever invoked motive of "FUD", there are only a few coins, again some 0..something percent where FUD is not actually reality.

LE
Took me 2 minutes:
Self-moderated topic:
http://archive.fo/fGQQv

Quote

brilliant project ,i like this
Amazing nice t project ,i like this
we believe this project has good future
very interesting project

Not that the two liners in the topic were something else...

The Sceptical Chymist

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Quote from: rosezionjohn on September 04, 2019, 12:22:04 PM

abusing self-moderation to censor and/or cover their scammy/shady projects

This snippet above is the only problem I can see with self-moderated ANN threads, and I have no doubt whatsoever that some projects will do this. On the other hand, if you've ever seen one of these ANN threads you'll realize that about 95% of the posts there should be deleted.

The only question I have is whether the shitposts are being paid for by the project in order to bump the thread. If that's the case, then there's no reason to have a self-moderated thread, because then you know damn well that the OP isn't going to delete anything except for posts he doesn't like. I have a sneaking suspicion that most ANN thread starters love the bumping garbage posts.

dkbit98

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It will only make a lot more work for moderators.
I proposed earlier that Brand New and Newbie account should not be even allowed to create new Topics (they can still create posts),
BUT if that is to drastic for many people, then Newbies should NOT be allowed to create Self-moderated Topics
multiple also

rosezionjohn

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It is still helpful overall I think. It's supposed to combat spam only but if you believe someone is abusing self-moderation to censor and/or cover their scammy/shady projects, I believe you can always create a scam accusation/reputation thread. I don't know if you were able to witness how a fellow was confronted for deleting messages and hiding his human rights foundation scam.

hosseinimr93

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Every day, some new ANN threads are created in the forum. Many of these ANN threads are self-moderated. In my opinion, posting self-moderated topics shouldn't be allowed on "Announcements (Altcoins)".
In most cases, they make the topics self-moderated to be able to delete any post complaining them. Instead of deleting the posts, they should report the posts and posts are deleted only by moderators.
I know there are many spams in these topics. They can be only allowed to delete the posts that are made by newbies.

Topic: ANN threads shouldn't be self-moderated (Read 856 times)