Argentina and Bitcoin - Why has there not been a switch?

polynesia

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Quote from: lyth0s on August 03, 2014, 07:52:39 AM

Yeah their import restrictions are brutal. Only way I'd see the people of Argentina being able to easily get bitcoins is for a bitcoin company to startup in argentina that ALSO gives a kickback to the government. IE the company charges market price + their own fee + small extra fee for kickback to government. That way the more people that buy bitcoin with the peso, the more money the government also makes. Otherwise I don't see their government approving any outflow of pesos to other stores of value.

The people of Argentina would probably go for this type of business model....considering that their inflation this year will probably be >30%, I'd doubt they would mind a 2% extra fee as a government kickback in order to offset the inflation that will take place on their peso.

Essentially the government agreeing to replace the peso by BTC, and then taxing the people. Cheesy

lyth0s

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Quote from: Divinespark on July 30, 2014, 04:37:32 AM

Argentina's new import restrictions to limit outflow of capital and other measures ironically also contribute to making it hard to get your hands on btc in Argentina

Yeah their import restrictions are brutal. Only way I'd see the people of Argentina being able to easily get bitcoins is for a bitcoin company to startup in argentina that ALSO gives a kickback to the government. IE the company charges market price + their own fee + small extra fee for kickback to government. That way the more people that buy bitcoin with the peso, the more money the government also makes. Otherwise I don't see their government approving any outflow of pesos to other stores of value.

The people of Argentina would probably go for this type of business model....considering that their inflation this year will probably be >30%, I'd doubt they would mind a 2% extra fee as a government kickback in order to offset the inflation that will take place on their peso.

Este Nuno

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amarha

Well, as everyone knows Bitcoin is not even close to being accessible for the average person yet.

It would take at least one major private company in Argentina to offer a full-package Bitcoin service so that people could use and spend BTC as easy as they could any other money.

Divinespark

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Argentina's new import restrictions to limit outflow of capital and other measures ironically also contribute to making it hard to get your hands on btc in Argentina

Swordsoffreedom

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Quote from: mooncake on July 29, 2014, 02:47:34 AM

I believe most are not aware of bitcoin.

For those who are aware. I believe they do not know enough.

That and the government being who they are must be trying their hardest to restrict any outflow of money
That includes bitcoin and related digital currencies

tabnloz

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Are the bondholders who took Argentina to court are led by Paul Singer, one of the most infamous 'vultures' in America? I've read that the bondholders only hold about 1.6% of the debt and that Singer bought the debt up post default in 2002?

These 'vultures' are the guys who buy bad /forgotten / unpayable debts for pennies on the dollar and then charge off to the world court to force them to be paid in full.

An example would be if Kenya gave Congo 100000 tractors in 1980 and were to be paid back $10m. Over time Kenya realises they will never be able to recover the full $10m due to the state of the Congolese economy and so the loans / debt are forgotten....until these vulture companies come in and offer to buy it for a fraction of the cost. They buy it, then head to the World Court to demand it be paid in full. For more info read Greg Palast 'Vultures Picnic'.

Much of the time, the money donated or gifted to these poor countries for aid etc ends up being paid to these megarich assholes.

So, I'd say good on Argentina if they refuse to pay off the bondholders (and good for btc).

keithers

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Quote from: Brewins on July 29, 2014, 06:25:49 AM

Most bitcoiners are in developed world, and still they are a negligible fraction of the population.

If Argentina goes Ecuador and bans bitcoin, then they will have a stake of coins and no chance to sell them, under the risk of them being confiscated.

That is the catch 22 about BTC. All these people in the top few % (financially speaking), are always talking about how BTC will be great for underdeveloped, 2nd and 3rd world countries...but how are the people in these countries supposed to sell the BTC when they need to?

spazzdla

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Tomorrow will be VERY EXCITING for Bitcoin and the BRICs.

ibittunes

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In developing countries few have home internet, they have cheap mobi phones they can use at internet cafes.

Example Indonesia, the weekly wage is 10 to 12 USD a week

Yet you have lots of people using the net, via net cafes

So they get a cheap phone cable of wifi and they can twitter and FB and whatever

These are ideal countries for bitcoin, since most cannot enter the western banking system for legit CC's

So free bitcoin wallet, they go to local bitcoin seller and buy 1 or 2 bucks of btc in their currency, then they can use it to do inexpensive digital downloads and whatever

That is the highest growth future of all net companies, getting into the 85% of the world considered 'developing'.

Daniel91

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Quote from: devphp on July 29, 2014, 09:54:01 AM

Those who know about bitcoin:

Because they are poor and don't have any wealth to store, and for the little savings they might have they prefer dollars, because dollars are most liquid and everyone accepts them (google the story on the last argentinian crisis from 14 years ago, it's been quite popular, this dude was telling how they managed to survive there) .
And because they can't buy anything with bitcoins domestically, thus don't see much value in them.

But I would bet most argentinians don't even have internet access to even hear about bitcoin.

Yes, I think this are very good point.
For accepting and using Bitcoin the are some pre- conditions (in my opinion) like that most homes have Internet access, regular income, understanding of English and stable society (without risk of financial collapse).
It seems Argentina is not good country for Bitcoin right now.

devphp

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Those who know about bitcoin:

Because they are poor and don't have any wealth to store, and for the little savings they might have they prefer dollars, because dollars are most liquid and everyone accepts them (google the story on the last argentinian crisis from 14 years ago, it's been quite popular, this dude was telling how they managed to survive there) .
And because they can't buy anything with bitcoins domestically, thus don't see much value in them.

But I would bet most argentinians don't even have internet access to even hear about bitcoin.

boraf

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Bitcoin may replace credit card but it isn't designed to replace fiat.

Brewins

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Most bitcoiners are in developed world, and still they are a negligible fraction of the population.

If Argentina goes Ecuador and bans bitcoin, then they will have a stake of coins and no chance to sell them, under the risk of them being confiscated.

TaunSew

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There's no incentive among Argentine holders to educate their own countrymen. There's an issue here in critical mass. Few people in the world are willing to exchange $USD or Euro for Argentine Pesos. If even 2% of Argentina raced out to buy Bitcoin they would outstrip suppliers.

mooncake

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I believe most are not aware of bitcoin.

For those who are aware. I believe they do not know enough.

waldox

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in a recent andreas video he says argentina is close to another collapse
if 1% in argentina switch to bitcoin thats another 2 billion in market cap

lyth0s

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So Argentina is in financial trouble and I'm sure the people of the country know that Hyperinflation is/will take place (perhaps 40% this year). My question is, why haven't they switched over to using Bitcoin as a means of a store of wealth and also for use in transactions for goods/services in their own communities? It seems like such a simple solution (assuming they have smart phones).

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/07/29/us-argentina-debt-insight-idUSKBN0FY09U20140729?feedType=RSS&feedName=businessNews

Topic: Argentina and Bitcoin - Why has there not been a switch? (Read 1447 times)