Armory - Github - BSA - FBAR | Bitcointalksearch.org

goatpig

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Quote from: harlequininja on December 13, 2021, 05:56:02 AM

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These guys are used to building resumes, not hiding their identity.

Do you think this could become a problem in the long run for Bitcoin?

Back in 2005 I believe, the NSA started a program with the purpose of enrolling US IT companies to spy on their users. Only Yahoo resisted (a bit), everybody else played along. The public got to learn about this thanks to Snowden's revelations, years later. It is a lot harder to corrupt a FOSS project cause the code is out there. It's even harder with Bitcoin cause even if you manage to force trash in the node's implementation, you can't force users to run that code. I think Bitcoin correctly deals with this issue, and while governments can pressure devs, it will only lead to a generation of devs that will protect their identity thoroughly.

I expect it's too late to do this now. The only thing the US will achieve by harassing Bitcoin devs at this point is to drive them out of the US.

harlequininja

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These guys are used to building resumes, not hiding their identity.

Do you think this could become a problem in the long run for Bitcoin?

goatpig

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Armory Developer

Quote from: harlequininja on December 11, 2021, 02:30:22 AM

I was always wondering why so many developers aren't protect their anonymity although it is obvious that sooner or later they will become easy to target pressure points.

Bitcoin attracted a lot of people with a well established background in academic and/or Silicon Valley. These guys are used to building resumes, not hiding their identity. There is also this culture of transparency in the FOSS space, which extends to using your real name. And unless you are as careful as Satoshi, it's unlikely you could effectively hide your identity being active in this space for a decade.

harlequininja

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That sweet, sweet race to the bottom...

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Jonas Schnelli
@_jonasschnelli_
You may ask, why step down now? What happened?

Sometimes, interests shift and you can’t do much about it.

On top, I feel that the legal risks for Bitcoin developers are increasing year by year (which can be stressful).

New contributors should join anonymously (it’s tricky).

I guess you are right....and the pressure is building up....as it seems.
I was always wondering why so many developers aren't protect their anonymity although it is obvious that sooner or later they will become easy to target pressure points.

goatpig

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Armory Developer

That sweet, sweet race to the bottom...

harlequininja

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This is the latest proposal form the European Union

https://eur-lex.europa.eu/resource.html?uri=cellar:0a4db7d6-eace-11eb-93a8-01aa75ed71a1.0001.02/DOC_1&format=PDF

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The proposal contains a provision preventing traders in goods or services from accepting cash
payments of over EUR 10 000 for a single purchase, while allowing Member States to
maintain in force lower ceilings for large cash transactions. This ceiling does not apply to
private operations between individuals. The Commission must assess the benefits and impacts
of further lowering of this threshold within three years of application of the proposed
EN 11 EN
Regulation. The provision and custody of anonymous crypto-asset wallets are prohibited.
Companies that are not listed are prohibited from issuing bearer shares and are required to
register those shares. The issuance of bearer share warrants is only allowed in intermediated
form.

The proposal passed the next level in the bureaucratic process of accepting the proposal in will now be send to parliament.

https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2021/12/01/anti-money-laundering-council-agrees-its-negotiating-mandate-on-transparency-of-crypto-asset-transfers/

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The modifications introduced by the Council in its position streamline and clarify the Commission’s proposal, in particular by introducing requirements for crypto-asset transfers between crypto-asset service providers and un-hosted wallets.

dkbit98

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Quote from: goatpig on August 15, 2021, 02:08:43 PM

I don't know what the US government could do tbh. I'm not American, my country doesn't extradite to the US (or Polanski would have long been yeeted back) and the first thing I did when I took over Armory was to remove all of the phone home code. Therefor, I don't have any info for any regulator or hacker to steal.

They don't have to arrest or extradite you. Same thing happening in China will probably happen in America and other western countries.
You see how they are banning people on all platforms, started with facebook, twitter, youtube and now it's moving on reddit, so I won't be surprised if they start to ban people and devs from github (read microsoft) soon.

Quote from: goatpig on August 15, 2021, 02:08:43 PM

Government is rife with petty tyrants and pencil pushers, whose greatest fantasy is flexing on genpop. There's always been a gap between that "utopia" and the reality on the ground. Case in point, bitching at silicon valley for backdoors in CPUs, phones, messaging apps, cryptography itself even. For well over a decade.

Governments are worst parasites ever, and they will grow bigger and bigger until people decide to change some things or until they self-destruct.
This utopia actually looks a lot like dystopia for genpop, and it gives governments more power and control.
If they can control what you do on your iPhone (because they care so much about children ), I wonder what's next?

Quote from: goatpig on August 15, 2021, 02:08:43 PM

Bitcoin is built so that we won't have to ask permission from unrelated 3rd parties anymore.

They won't give up without a fight, and they are afraid of Bitcoin because they can't control it, but my theory is that they will try to abuse and allow Bitcoin until they create centralized digital currencies.
Wallets should move or clone everything from github to some self hosted alternatives.

goatpig

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Armory Developer

Quote from: harlequininja on August 15, 2021, 06:45:38 AM

Any thoughts on the current infrastructure bill?

I don't know what the US government could do tbh. I'm not American, my country doesn't extradite to the US (or Polanski would have long been yeeted back) and the first thing I did when I took over Armory was to remove all of the phone home code. Therefor, I don't have any info for any regulator or hacker to steal.

Government is rife with petty tyrants and pencil pushers, whose greatest fantasy is flexing on genpop. There's always been a gap between that "utopia" and the reality on the ground. Case in point, bitching at silicon valley for backdoors in CPUs, phones, messaging apps, cryptography itself even. For well over a decade.

I've elected to let these clowns do their thing and I'll go about my business. Bitcoin is built so that we won't have to ask permission from unrelated 3rd parties anymore.

harlequininja

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Any thoughts on the current infrastructure bill?

goatpig

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Armory Developer

Quote from: NotATether on June 04, 2021, 03:52:26 AM

I fail to see the benefit of moving the repo to another third-party repo.

It would be one element to consider in a set of variables while researching the topic. Don't get me wrong though, if I was to invest time reviewing 3rd party hosts, the main criteria would be DevOps.

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With regard to Android America managed to restrict the access for China pretty drastically. On top of that, the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wassenaar_Arrangement (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wassenaar_Arrangement) was just loosened. This doesn't mean that they can't revise the changes. Especially if regulators pretend its for the sake of securing sovereignty over China. I know its a stupid argument, but that's how politics work and I suppose that's in the interest of the wider crypto-community to stay ahead of this regulatory arms race.

Google is deeply intertwined with the US federal government. That gives them great privilege, but it also gives the US plenty of leverage on them. A better example of the type of relationship that exists between the regulator and the populace would be the prohibition era, the war on drugs, silk road and and the likes. Government can easily clamp down on regulated markets. It has a long history of utter failure when it comes to shoving those regulations down the throat of private individuals.

Not only would it be hard for them to intervene in the development of FOSS of the participative/non profit kind; even if they managed to force code in there, they wouldn't be able to force the populace to run it. With that in mind, I do agree that it's better to be ahead of the curve on these matters. I simply find this particular one a lesser threat.

harlequininja

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Quote from: NotATether on June 04, 2021, 03:52:26 AM

I fail to see the benefit of moving the repo to another third-party repo. The argument that Github is Microsoft-owned isn't strong enough because in the majority of cases, regulation will either be affecting all these tech giants, or none of them.

Bitcoin is a very unique enterprise. All the other techgiants that have to do with payment services are strongly regulated. Bitcoin's immutability is only guaranteed by its opensource base.

harlequininja

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Quote from: goatpig on June 04, 2021, 03:02:47 AM

Quote from: harlequininja on June 04, 2021, 02:36:41 AM

In the face of BSA/FBAR and other countries like Germany beefing up there regulations, are there any plans to move armory to a depository that is not controlled by regulators best friend Microsoft.... e.g. Gitlab?

I don't mind mirroring the repo on Gitlab, but I can't do that trivially. I'd have to research the topic properly first.

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just a matter of time until they start to try to regulate the development of wallets and its developers

Regulate development of a free open source wallet with no profit model and not even donations? Good luck with that.

I guess they could put a gun to my head and force me to add code in there to track the users, but nobody has to run that code (nor do I expect they will).

With regard to Android America managed to restrict the access for China pretty drastically. On top of that, the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wassenaar_Arrangement was just loosened. This doesn't mean that they can't revise the changes. Especially if regulators pretend its for the sake of securing sovereignty over China. I know its a stupid argument, but that's how politics work and I suppose that's in the interest of the wider crypto-community to stay ahead of this regulatory arms race.

NotATether

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bitcoincleanup.com / bitmixlist.org

I fail to see the benefit of moving the repo to another third-party repo. The argument that Github is Microsoft-owned isn't strong enough because in the majority of cases, regulation will either be affecting all these tech giants, or none of them.

goatpig

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Armory Developer

Quote from: harlequininja on June 04, 2021, 02:36:41 AM

In the face of BSA/FBAR and other countries like Germany beefing up there regulations, are there any plans to move armory to a depository that is not controlled by regulators best friend Microsoft.... e.g. Gitlab?

I don't mind mirroring the repo on Gitlab, but I can't do that trivially. I'd have to research the topic properly first.

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just a matter of time until they start to try to regulate the development of wallets and its developers

Regulate development of a free open source wallet with no profit model and not even donations? Good luck with that.

The primary vector for government regulation is businesses, which is a primary proxy to one's pocket. There is neither a business nor a pocket involved here. What are they gonna do, throw me in jail cause I won't produce the emails and BTC balance of Armory users? There is no registration scheme nor phone home code in Armory. I don't put out supernodes for people to query blockchain data from, you have to run your own Core node to user Armory. This information simply does not exist in a centralized fashion, anywhere. There isn't even a door for them to get their foot through.

And don't think this is just a speculative scenario on my part. I know first hand of other wallet developers that have received summons from the government to out their users. There is simply no information to be had with Armory, no license to revoke, no red tape to throw at me.

I guess they could put a gun to my head and force me to add code in there to track the users, but nobody has to run that code (nor do I expect they will).

harlequininja

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In the face of BSA/FBAR and other countries like Germany beefing up there regulations, are there any plans to move armory to a depository that is not controlled by regulators best friend Microsoft.... e.g. Gitlab? If the value of Bitcoin continues to rise it is probably just a matter of time until they start to try to regulate the development of wallets and its developers

Topic: Armory - Github - BSA - FBAR (Read 203 times)