Topic: Best Non-KYC Methods for converting fiat -> Bitcoin? (Read 326 times)

If selling to a person, technically you can consider that 100% anonymous. Even if they see you, they don't know who you really are. You could wear a disguise, if you are concerned the other party will somehow recognize you. This would be a good option if A. more people were willing to do it and B. there was a feedback system to reduce the risk of getting robbed/hurt/killed.

LocalBitcoin now requires KYC to use, so it's not anonymous. Alternatives listed like LocalCryptos, LocalCoinSwap, LocalMonero, Agoratrader, etc. can be 100% anonymous, but only under certain conditions like mailing cash with a different or no return address.

I prefer to go with cash in person. There are so many local exchangers these days that you can do business with face to face. I even know a lot of them and I have their number which I use to contact them on WhatsApp whenever I want to change Fiat to Bitcoin or Bitcoin to Fiat.

This is clearly the best for me because doing business with most of them is really quick and I also get to gain much from it since they are buying and selling at a better rate than when I am making use of a well known or a big exchange. Another way that I also exchange my Fiat to Bitcoin is by making use of exchanges online such as localbitcoin.comorpaxful.com.

If you’re selling it to a person you don’t really have full privacy because who you are selling it to knows you. And if you decide to make use of a Bitcoin ATM, and the ATM happens to have cameras that monitors users, then it’s also possible that you don’t have any privacy at all.

So, I think the only platform here that is 100% anonymous when you are making use of it is localbitcoin.com, because with LocalBitcoin you just send to the buyer or to the seller and they don’t really know who you are, and before sending to them you just rely on the ratings and reviews that you have seen on their profile to do business with them. And your privacy will be maintained when you make use of this means.

Exactly. The risk is in this case that you sell to a scammer which has stolen an account and later the legitimate owner of the bank account reports the trade to the authorities, which can get your bank account frozen and you'll be charged for money laundering and fraud. This has happened to several Bitcointalk forum members.

Regarding risks, there are however big differences between a fiat -> Bitcoin operation and a Bitcoin -> fiat operation.

For a fiat -> Bitcoin operation P2P services like Bisq you generally do not put your bank account at risk (the only case being that you're transferring money to a stolen account a scammer uses for money landering purposes, but that's not very frequent). The risk is here that in theory your counterparty could allege they haven't received your bank wire. However this is mitigated by the security deposit Bisq requires, like BrianH has already wrote, so I would consider this operation of relatively low risk. At least the scammer can't win anything in this case, only lose.

But a P2P/Bisq Bitcoin -> fiat operation is highly risky. Not only because of the risk for your bank account as I wrote above, but also because scamming "this way around" faking proof for the escrower is at least a little bit easier. That's why for Bitcoin -> fiat I recommend indirect methods like those I mentioned in this post. Or buy the things you need for your everyday life directly with Bitcoin if there are shops accepting it in your region.

I would say that if you want to cover your traces then selling them through local bitcoins is easy though and there could be some Bitcoin ATM's that might not have cameras installed to have look upon you unlike the regular bank ATM which keeps you under full supervision.Selling them in person is also best as only buyer and seller knows each other regardless of any third party so this option also suits me.

Thanks for all the great suggestions! AgoraDesk looks very active. I updated the first post.
This is not true at all.
There are no id requirements for Bisq.
Bisq locks the trader's funds and an additional deposit in a multi-signature wallet. It is nearly a trustless transaction.
If they try to steal your money, you can submit the transaction to a Bisq third party moderator. The moderator volunteers their time and is paid by the platform.
If the moderator determines the trader tried to steal from you, you receive your funds back and their deposit.
The main trust required is in the open-source software itself.

Biggest challenge with 100% Non-KYC is that generally at least 1 person knows who you are - the buyer.

1% fee is decent amount for the anonymous trade but as you said it's not really recommended for trading big volume. The real risk is which trader we are dealing with because p2p exchanges filled with scammers who will send real money but from a hacked bank account so whoever dealing p2p should make sure the funds are coming from the owner not from third party that is where the again identify will be broken.

Localbitcoins.com used to be a popular site for p2p trades. It was reliable not until they change their rules but does the rules wont make the site useless? Because, the site supposed to be focused on p2p and requiring a KYC would instantly kill this feature. Localbitcoins wont now differ to a centralized exchange but I understand why they do this.

It is popular and it could have been attacked by scammers which can easily get away because they are totally anonymous. Non KYC sites are for low volume trades but they should not increase the fees because it is for low volume trades anyway? All the users are not rich enough to afford paying more in the fees.

Thank you, @jossiel, for posting the recommended list of escrows here. It is indeed important to be thorough in reviewing the terms of any transaction to avoid any conflict in the future. I hope this would be useful for those looking for an escrow to be able to do P2P trading.

Well that's tricky. It seems we have only limited options as mentioned in the OP. If you would have asked for converting the bitcoin to fiat with non-kyc then there are bunch of ways for the same. I mean, one could simple convert the bitcoin to amazon vouchers, then based on that get gold bars or gold coins from amazon and once received just sell it to the gold smith. This is amazing way to do in India. Since in India peeps are fan of Gold due to traditional value anyone can easily buy it from you. Thus easily converting the bitcoins to real asset.

May be this option can be used in reverse way to buy the bitcoins I guess. 
Using the Gold, selling it to the crypto-come-gold lover and then buying the crypto with the same.

Since many countries are not blessed with the bitcoin ATM, we do need alternative ways to do it.

And if somebody is planning to trade with someone on the forum and having hard time finding an escrow for their deal.

Here's the Recommended bitcointalk escrow services

There are still many of them that are active until now. But just be sure that you're aware of the terms that they have before proceeding on dealing with someone.

Thanks for sharing this list as I have found it really difficult to find a reliable exchange for P2P trading especially for crypto to fiat, it was good when localbitcoin.com was not enforcing the KYC but eventually it started forcing KYC on us to do KYC and those exchanges which don't mandate KYC either have higher fees or else volume will be too low.

Hoping to find a better exchange with high volume and lower fees in this list.

Localcryptos is a p2p like Localbitcoins with No mandatory KYC for registering but I don't feel there is enough good volume compared to the LBC and Paxful but if no KYC is your priority then its a choice available for you and who knows your country fiat may have enough volume. But read the terms of traders as well before opening a trade because a trader can ask to verify identify which is allowed by the platform.

You have a good point @jossiel, and I agree that resorting to availing the service of a forum’s escrow would make this P2P transaction a safer alternative instead of doing KYC. With regards to escrow on other platforms, it would be really hard to find that is guaranteed to be safe and trustworthy, so you have to stick with what you know that’s more guaranteed.

A bit more complicated, but should work even in jurisdictions where it's hard to find safe non-kyc direct exchange methods:

1) Buy the quantities you desire of any good which is massively sellable, preferably a virtual good (e.g. tradeable gift cards).
2) Sell these goods for Bitcoin.

This has the advantage that it doesn't put your bank account in danger, as you never will connect the "bank space" with the "Bitcoin space" directly.

Another one which may work but its usefulness depends on the electricity price:

1) Buy a powerful PC for CPU mining.
2) Mine any altcoin where CPU mining still works.
3) Change the altcoin to Bitcoin via a P2P exchange.

It doesn't matter if the coins are massively devaluated - in this case, its difficulty should also be pretty low. The only important thing is that there is a liquid market which doesn't require KYC (preferrably a DEX/P2P exchange).

If electricity price is high, you may be lucky with a HDD mining coin like Burst, or even an HDD renting blockchain like Siacoin.

That's the first idea that came to my mind. But what if both parties don't agree to each other terms?

In the forum, this is possible through an escrow. But what if he's going to do that with any other platform? That's where the question will start unless there's the same service made by reputable people from that platform.

But to be honest, it's hard to find those trustworthy people in a P2P in other platforms that's why it's still good to rely on the forum's escrow.

Aside from P2P, we also have decentralized exchanges that does not ask for a KYC although decentralized exchanges might now work very well compared to centralized exchanges that are smooth enough and is also very secure.

Some trusted P2P sites are already mentioned above for the op to check. I don't really recommend to find sites on youtube because they can be misleading and only doing it for promotions or to scam people. P2P trades doesn't needs kyc but it can be very risky because you never know the reputation of the people your dealing with. This is why it is advised that we must use a trusted escrow before doing any trades.

Person to person trade is the best method to convert your Fiat to Bitcoin it can easily avoid the KYC and as long as it safe to trade with that particular person but one of my alternative is the Bisq.Network it is easy to use, no KYC and registration and lastly it is open source project.

 Perhape p2p will be the best solution if you don't want kyc for converting your btc. But a friendly reminder because it's too hard to find some legitimate platform nowadays due to some frauds around the internet. So if i were you watch some video tutorial in youtube probably it help you to find legit platform or sites. just read some feedbacks and of course don't fall easily and always seek for more specific information to prevent scammers..

You will agree with me that this method is not convenient, and you will also agree with me that by this method, you have automatically KYCed yourself, because you've meet the person face to face, he knows you and in the process of exchanging cash and bitcoin, he or she will end up getting one or two information about you.
I don't know about this method so I won't comment on it.
 

You will hardly find any ATMs or( fully put), bitcoin ATMs any where around the world without security cameras, even when there are no CCTV cameras around, the machines come with their own built in cameras with some time is hard to notice, but it's there.

It all depends on the country one is living in, like in my country, it's currently very hard to find a means to convert fiat to crypto with out any form of kyc, though some kyc, like level 1 kyc on Remitano only required a phone number verification, with this, you can buy bitcoin with our local currency but at a very limited daily capacity or quantity.

There are some businesses selling crypto cards without KYC.
And here there are 2 categories:
1. Known crypto-card businesses' non-KYC cards which are fewer and fewer and have extremely small lifetime top up amount.
2. Cards offered basically for extra fees on other peoples' name. I don't know them that good and one has to be very careful since it's a risky and gray area (at best) business, it may worth mentioning, since afaik at least one such business does exist and it doesn't scam its users.

I'm not a fan of KYC,but any platform that doesn't require ID verification should be considered shady and you should use it at your own risk(with great caution).
Almost all fiat-to-BTC traders would require you to upload ID,even if they are using a platform like Bisq.
The best way would be to find some really trusted BTC/fiat trader and somehow earn his trust,by being honest and never trying to scam him.
You shouldn't rely on platforms and methods.You must find trusted people and build connections with them.
This is a business between people,not between platforms and companies.
Trust is everything in this business.

Your question remembers me on both topics below.
Maybe if it's explained too long, after all, it's been explained below.

Maybe, you want to see it.

You may find additional information here about ATMs and countries that do not apply the KYC method.
Topic: Buying Bitcoin with no KYC verification

Or this one.
There it seems, it's more fiat to Bitcoin.

You can choose non-KYC platforms to use but they don't allow you to trade or trade partners don't agree to trade with you at high value.

So if you are planning to trade with big capital, you will have to do it many times. It is only matter if you have big capital. For small one, go ahead with them, no issue at all.

Check some from https://kycnot.me

These days your chances of finding a Bitcoin ATM which doesn’t require a copy of your passport/drivers license is slim. And same with meeting face to face with someone.

The Bitcoin ATM varies by countries however many these days only let you use them if your KYC in some way or another. If you are going to KYC you might as well just use an exchange like Coinbase.

Face to face now is not popular due to all the exchanges out there. It’s more safer and convenient. Many stopped doing P2P trades after they heard on the news of someone getting hurt while doing a Bitcoin transactions in person.

It seems that the trust wallet would be the best option they do not have KYC verification and Coinomi use 3rd party simplex that accepts debit/credit card.

Anyway, adding this I found a big list of exchanges without KYC required and other P2P exchanges.

Check them here https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/--5270416

Cash in person and remitano can work for you to get cashout your money without KYC while ATMS may require strong KYC and after that the ATMs without cameras are also not available in the whole world as if they remain without camera then nothing will remain in it within a day. I mean robers get the benefit.

How about a close wallet that has multi coins support, swap your Bitcoin to altcoin and then convert to fiat?
Like Trustwallet or Coinomi wallet, maybe you can hide your identity from converting Bitcoin to fiat.

I tend to agree with these exchanges and yes, P2P exchanges are good for anonymity.
But it always expecting that there's a high fees that must be covered.

Yep, I'll leave here some that I usually mention whenever this question appears :

• https://hodlhodl.com/
• https://localbitcoins.com/
• https://bisq.network/

Be aware, however, that you'll always end up paying a higher fee in these trades since you have to "cover" the anonymity that they give you...

I think there might be some cexes that have p2p options that don't require kyc (potentially sites like best change but I haven't used them so don't know how trustworthy they are - they've advertised here though and I've looked at their site).

There are other sites similar to local bitcoins that don't require kyc too.

Bitcoin ATMs[1] could be a good way as well. The fees are obviously a bit higher compared to the methods you mentioned, but it is still a good solution if you want to avoid verifying your identity.

EDIT: I see that you just added the ATMs, so to answer your question, yes. There are a lot of ATMs that don't require KYC, you just need a phone number to use them. I don't think there are ATMs without cameras though since that's always going to be needed for increasing the user's limits (if they want to) or to scan the buyer's QR code and send him the funds.

[1] https://coinatmradar.com/

What are some of the best ways to convert fiat to Bitcoin, without having to provide identification to a third party?

Ideally something that would work in high volumes, electronically and at low cost of conversion.

Some methods:
*Cash in person
*Money orders
*BTC ATMs without KYC or security cameras (are there any?)
*Bisq (various methods)

What else?

Update with others:
*Mining
*Reselling goods
*AgoraDesk
*LocalMonero
*LocalCryptos
*Remitano
*https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5270416.0