Biden plan would overhaul 151-year-old mining law, make companies pay royalties

zasad@

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on October 01, 2023, 09:31:59 PM

Quote from: zasad@ on October 01, 2023, 06:35:26 AM

What's the point of eating food if you end up going to the bathroom with dollars instead of toilet paper?

because toilet paper at this point in time is cheaper to use? if that ever became not the case then I think you know what would happen.

Quote

We live in a time of change, when the old financial system is collapsing, and no one has yet proposed a new global financial project. Or America will find a new way to write off at least half of its debts, because the other half of the US government debt belongs to American citizens and companies.

If the Democrats by themselves can open the southern border and let millions of people flood into the country without any documentation or anything then trust me they can find a way to write off all their debt. It wouldn't have to be LEGAL you understand. They would just do it. Kind of like how they did this open border thing. Shocked

At first they were flying them in under the cover of darkness away from the prying eyes of the public but that could only last so long...

Debts can only be legally written off through default. The ratio of government debt to US GDP unfortunately does not reflect real data, because all countries' GDP is greatly overestimated for statistics. Practically nothing is produced in the financial sector, so the 2022 GDP of 25 trillion can be reduced by 40-50%.

larry_vw_1955

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Quote from: zasad@ on October 01, 2023, 06:35:26 AM

What's the point of eating food if you end up going to the bathroom with dollars instead of toilet paper?

because toilet paper at this point in time is cheaper to use? if that ever became not the case then I think you know what would happen.

Quote

We live in a time of change, when the old financial system is collapsing, and no one has yet proposed a new global financial project. Or America will find a new way to write off at least half of its debts, because the other half of the US government debt belongs to American citizens and companies.

If the Democrats by themselves can open the southern border and let millions of people flood into the country without any documentation or anything then trust me they can find a way to write off all their debt. It wouldn't have to be LEGAL you understand. They would just do it. Kind of like how they did this open border thing. Shocked

At first they were flying them in under the cover of darkness away from the prying eyes of the public but that could only last so long...

zasad@

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 30, 2023, 09:03:07 PM

Quote from: zasad@ on September 30, 2023, 08:12:33 AM

According to the latest 2021 data, the US budget is 6.8 trillion dollars, and taxes collected are 3.8 trillion dollars.

but what's the point of printing money if you plan to take back half of it? just print half of it to begin with and don't take anything. same end result right?

Quote

If you print that many dollars every year, it will soon be cheaper to wipe your ass with dollars.

that's about how much the us dollar is worth at this point. soon to be even more worthless...

This already looks like trolling

What's the point of eating food if you end up going to the bathroom with dollars instead of toilet paper?

We live in a time of change, when the old financial system is collapsing, and no one has yet proposed a new global financial project. Or America will find a new way to write off at least half of its debts, because the other half of the US government debt belongs to American citizens and companies.

larry_vw_1955

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Quote from: zasad@ on September 30, 2023, 08:12:33 AM

According to the latest 2021 data, the US budget is 6.8 trillion dollars, and taxes collected are 3.8 trillion dollars.

but what's the point of printing money if you plan to take back half of it? just print half of it to begin with and don't take anything. same end result right?

Quote

If you print that many dollars every year, it will soon be cheaper to wipe your ass with dollars.

that's about how much the us dollar is worth at this point. soon to be even more worthless...

zasad@

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 29, 2023, 11:19:01 PM

Quote from: zasad@ on September 29, 2023, 06:55:28 AM

There are global accounting standards on the basis of which experts evaluate various global companies, their value, and so on.
But why is all this for individuals? Why do they need to know what value added tax is?
The state should be interested in individuals engaging in business, because this greatly reduces social costs. It is more profitable for the state for a citizen to do business rather than stand in lines for social benefits.

what i don't understand about taxes/royalties/whatever you want to call them. why not just instead of making people hand over their printed paper money. just print more of it so you don't need to ask them for theirs. what is the real difference? a little increase in inflation maybe? well if so then just don't print as much of it in the first place subtract off the amount of it you would be asking them to turn back in and then you don't need to collect taxes at all. just a thought.

Don't you really understand how economics works?
Bankers rule the world through global organizations such as the IMF and the Bank for International Settlements, the largest rating agencies, and all central banks are subject to their rules. If a country behaves badly, regulators deprive it of loans, and there is a crisis, and then a change of government.

According to the latest 2021 data, the US budget is 6.8 trillion dollars, and taxes collected are 3.8 trillion dollars. If you print that many dollars every year, it will soon be cheaper to wipe your ass with dollars.

larry_vw_1955

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Quote from: zasad@ on September 29, 2023, 06:55:28 AM

There are global accounting standards on the basis of which experts evaluate various global companies, their value, and so on.
But why is all this for individuals? Why do they need to know what value added tax is?
The state should be interested in individuals engaging in business, because this greatly reduces social costs. It is more profitable for the state for a citizen to do business rather than stand in lines for social benefits.

what i don't understand about taxes/royalties/whatever you want to call them. why not just instead of making people hand over their printed paper money. just print more of it so you don't need to ask them for theirs. what is the real difference? a little increase in inflation maybe? well if so then just don't print as much of it in the first place subtract off the amount of it you would be asking them to turn back in and then you don't need to collect taxes at all. just a thought.

zasad@

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 29, 2023, 12:30:18 AM

Quote from: zasad@ on September 28, 2023, 05:48:52 AM

In Russia people say: “There are a lot of laws and it’s impossible to know all the laws.”
Do you know what an analogy is? If I don’t want to read long instructions, I can ask for a tax return from a partner with approximately the same tax situation and fill it out according to the sample. Of course I read some pages of long instructions when filling out a tax return.
I know the principles of taxation and if errors in the tax return do not affect the amount of tax, or affect only slightly, then in my country there are no penalties for this. They will call me to the tax office and give me a deadline to submit an amended return and pay additional tax.

probably but i think albert einstein has a famous quote about keeping things as simple as possible but no simpler than necessary i guess that doesn't apply to countries taxing their citizens though huh? maybe you can find the quote.

what's wrong with just a flat tax so everyone pays the same percent no matter if they are an individual or business? then you could reduce your tax code down to one sentence and save alot of trees in the process. of course that would put alot of tax "professionals" out of work. so they wouldn't want that.

There are global accounting standards on the basis of which experts evaluate various global companies, their value, and so on.
But why is all this for individuals? Why do they need to know what value added tax is?
The state should be interested in individuals engaging in business, because this greatly reduces social costs. It is more profitable for the state for a citizen to do business rather than stand in lines for social benefits.

larry_vw_1955

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Quote from: zasad@ on September 28, 2023, 05:48:52 AM

In Russia people say: “There are a lot of laws and it’s impossible to know all the laws.”
Do you know what an analogy is? If I don’t want to read long instructions, I can ask for a tax return from a partner with approximately the same tax situation and fill it out according to the sample. Of course I read some pages of long instructions when filling out a tax return.
I know the principles of taxation and if errors in the tax return do not affect the amount of tax, or affect only slightly, then in my country there are no penalties for this. They will call me to the tax office and give me a deadline to submit an amended return and pay additional tax.

probably but i think albert einstein has a famous quote about keeping things as simple as possible but no simpler than necessary i guess that doesn't apply to countries taxing their citizens though huh? maybe you can find the quote.

what's wrong with just a flat tax so everyone pays the same percent no matter if they are an individual or business? then you could reduce your tax code down to one sentence and save alot of trees in the process. of course that would put alot of tax "professionals" out of work. so they wouldn't want that.

zasad@

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 27, 2023, 08:19:52 PM

Quote

Here is an example of instructions for filling out a personal income tax return in Russia.
You will find more than 50 pages there. I sent such declarations to the tax office, but did not read these instructions Smiley
https://www.nalog.gov.ru/rn77/about_fts/docs/11684003/

you didn't read it so you could be breaking the law and just not know it. is that how you want to live your life is not knowing all the rules you're supposed to be following ? Shocked

In Russia people say: “There are a lot of laws and it’s impossible to know all the laws.”
Do you know what an analogy is? If I don’t want to read long instructions, I can ask for a tax return from a partner with approximately the same tax situation and fill it out according to the sample. Of course I read some pages of long instructions when filling out a tax return.
I know the principles of taxation and if errors in the tax return do not affect the amount of tax, or affect only slightly, then in my country there are no penalties for this. They will call me to the tax office and give me a deadline to submit an amended return and pay additional tax.

larry_vw_1955

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Quote from: zasad@ on September 23, 2023, 11:33:02 AM

It seems to me that people in the USA are more afraid of tax inspectors than the police. I'm right?

police carry guns and sometimes here in the USA they kill innocent people. by accident. for whatever reason. lawsuits might get filed but you can't bring someone back from the dead...

alot of times though the people that get shot by the police are people that were doing something they shouldn't have been and that put the police officer on a heightened sense of security. but i still don't think they should shoot at someone unless they get fired on first...

Quote

Here is an example of instructions for filling out a personal income tax return in Russia.
You will find more than 50 pages there. I sent such declarations to the tax office, but did not read these instructions Smiley
https://www.nalog.gov.ru/rn77/about_fts/docs/11684003/

you didn't read it so you could be breaking the law and just not know it. is that how you want to live your life is not knowing all the rules you're supposed to be following ? Shocked

zasad@

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 24, 2023, 07:40:58 PM

Quote from: zasad@ on September 24, 2023, 07:53:07 AM

What's so complicated about US tax law? Declaring cryptocurrencies is quite clear and there are already many good services.

if everything is so simple why do they need 50 page pdf files for instructions on how to fill out a single form? With hundreds if not thousands of such forms. Obviously you have no idea about how complex their rules are.

Quote

I know that in the USA tax forms do not change for decades,

wrong. they change all the time. they used to have one big form 1040 then they broke it up into a crapload of smaller forms that just makes things more confusing and complicated but i know you don't anything about that... Shocked

Quote

but in Russia declarations change every year and sometimes several times a year.

they literally have to have huge book length pdf files for instructions for some of the forms the IRS does. because things are so complicated it takes that long to explain but i know you dont realize that having never been here and subject to that situation.

You write as if it’s my fault that the US has such harsh tax laws.
Here is an example of instructions for filling out a personal income tax return in Russia.
You will find more than 50 pages there. I sent such declarations to the tax office, but did not read these instructions

https://www.nalog.gov.ru/rn77/about_fts/docs/11684003/

It might be easier to sell tomatoes, I’m sure tax returns are easier in this business, or see how your colleagues solve this problem.

Poker Player

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Quote from: philipma1957 on September 24, 2023, 10:12:18 PM

Yeah if there is a demand some supply will show up 🆙 in some part of the world. But it would be a crime and you could be jailed for having the item.

BTC can be greatly hurt by major countries if they choose to do it.

That's for sure. If we want Bitcoin to be massively adopted and the price to continue to rise we need favorable regulations and inevitably the use of centralized entities to buy and sell it is going to continue. With the current usage it is not going to magically happen that people are going to become aware and move to an exclusively P2P use.

Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 22, 2023, 11:10:15 PM

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Any ban is a sign of weakness. I talk to Europeans and they themselves say that if their government bans cryptocurrencies, they will go on strike.

no one here is going on any type of strike against the government i can guarantee you that. they're too busy with other things.

Not a chance. Nowhere in the world would people go on strike if they banned cryptocurrencies. Except for workers of some companies that had to close and things like that, but nothing massive for sure.

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 21, 2023, 10:06:09 PM

Quote from: zasad@ on September 21, 2023, 05:31:22 AM

Bitcoin has already become popular and it is not profitable to fight with it.
You can fight by closing exchanges, but as experience shows, where there is profit, there is a shadow market.

if exchanges were outlawed then people wouldn't be able to use their bank accounts to buy and sell bitcoin. pretty much tanking the price of it. but i think that's the least of bitcoin's worries because i don't see amazon letting people pay with bitcoin. or ebay or anywhere. seems like it hasn't really become useful form of payment yet. which is probably why regulators haven't paid alot of attention to it. yet. but the more places it is used the more regulations as we all know...

Yeah if there is a demand some supply will show up 🆙 in some part of the world. But it would be a crime and you could be jailed for having the item.

BTC can be greatly hurt by major countries if they choose to do it.

larry_vw_1955

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Quote from: zasad@ on September 24, 2023, 07:53:07 AM

What's so complicated about US tax law? Declaring cryptocurrencies is quite clear and there are already many good services.

if everything is so simple why do they need 50 page pdf files for instructions on how to fill out a single form? With hundreds if not thousands of such forms. Obviously you have no idea about how complex their rules are.

Quote

I know that in the USA tax forms do not change for decades,

wrong. they change all the time. they used to have one big form 1040 then they broke it up into a crapload of smaller forms that just makes things more confusing and complicated but i know you don't anything about that... Shocked

Quote

but in Russia declarations change every year and sometimes several times a year.

they literally have to have huge book length pdf files for instructions for some of the forms the IRS does. because things are so complicated it takes that long to explain but i know you dont realize that having never been here and subject to that situation.

zasad@

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 24, 2023, 12:32:20 AM

Quote from: zasad@ on September 23, 2023, 11:33:02 AM

It seems to me that people in the USA are more afraid of tax inspectors than the police. I'm right?

it depends on what law you're breaking Cheesy

but maybe both are in need of reform. police get paid a huge amount of money and that's all funded by taxpayers. and yet they have attitudes. figure that. tax law is way too complex and if it all got thrown in a trash dumpster and lit on fire that would be a wonderful bonfire...

What's so complicated about US tax law? Declaring cryptocurrencies is quite clear and there are already many good services.
I know that in the USA tax forms do not change for decades, but in Russia declarations change every year and sometimes several times a year. And if you have a company, then you need a good accountant. But on the other hand, if you are self-employed or an individual, then the tax inspectors will pay the least attention to you.

larry_vw_1955

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Quote from: zasad@ on September 23, 2023, 11:33:02 AM

It seems to me that people in the USA are more afraid of tax inspectors than the police. I'm right?

it depends on what law you're breaking Cheesy

but maybe both are in need of reform. police get paid a huge amount of money and that's all funded by taxpayers. and yet they have attitudes. figure that. tax law is way too complex and if it all got thrown in a trash dumpster and lit on fire that would be a wonderful bonfire...

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 22, 2023, 11:10:15 PM

Quote from: zasad@ on September 22, 2023, 07:26:18 AM

larry_vw_1955, what country are you from? It is very interesting to me.

I'm in the USA.

Quote

In Russia, drugs, weapons, prostitution, and currency exchange for large sums are prohibited, but all this is available in any small city of 50,000 or more people.
Bans don't work in Russia; they're useless. Thanks to global sanctions, Russia is now experiencing an economic boom.

police love busting people for drugs, weapons and prostitution here. they set up sting operations and everything go to elaborate lengths to bust people so they can get a nice news story written about them. meanwhile they don't do anything about public safety and robberies and murders and rapes. because those don't make them any money.

Quote

Any ban is a sign of weakness. I talk to Europeans and they themselves say that if their government bans cryptocurrencies, they will go on strike.

no one here is going on any type of strike against the government i can guarantee you that. they're too busy with other things.

Quote

Yes, banks can prohibit payments, but most likely they will kill many other businesses at the same time, which will be an even more severe blow to the economy.

i would say that bitcoin is kind of like the stock market to most people here in the usa. they hear it being talked about maybe here and there but don't really think of it doing anything. just something you can buy like a stock. but you can't really use it to do anything...

I don't think the police need special operations because everyone already knows who sells drugs, where the illegal casinos are, and where the illegal currency exchanges take place.
I want to talk badly about the Russian police. The work of the police has become more transparent, and people come there who want to help people, and not earn money from bribes.
It seems to me that people in the USA are more afraid of tax inspectors than the police. I'm right?

larry_vw_1955

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Quote from: zasad@ on September 22, 2023, 07:26:18 AM

larry_vw_1955, what country are you from? It is very interesting to me.

I'm in the USA.

Quote

In Russia, drugs, weapons, prostitution, and currency exchange for large sums are prohibited, but all this is available in any small city of 50,000 or more people.
Bans don't work in Russia; they're useless. Thanks to global sanctions, Russia is now experiencing an economic boom.

police love busting people for drugs, weapons and prostitution here. they set up sting operations and everything go to elaborate lengths to bust people so they can get a nice news story written about them. meanwhile they don't do anything about public safety and robberies and murders and rapes. because those don't make them any money.

Quote

Any ban is a sign of weakness. I talk to Europeans and they themselves say that if their government bans cryptocurrencies, they will go on strike.

no one here is going on any type of strike against the government i can guarantee you that. they're too busy with other things.

Quote

Yes, banks can prohibit payments, but most likely they will kill many other businesses at the same time, which will be an even more severe blow to the economy.

i would say that bitcoin is kind of like the stock market to most people here in the usa. they hear it being talked about maybe here and there but don't really think of it doing anything. just something you can buy like a stock. but you can't really use it to do anything...

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 21, 2023, 10:06:09 PM

Quote from: zasad@ on September 21, 2023, 05:31:22 AM

Bitcoin has already become popular and it is not profitable to fight with it.
You can fight by closing exchanges, but as experience shows, where there is profit, there is a shadow market.

if exchanges were outlawed then people wouldn't be able to use their bank accounts to buy and sell bitcoin. pretty much tanking the price of it. but i think that's the least of bitcoin's worries because i don't see amazon letting people pay with bitcoin. or ebay or anywhere. seems like it hasn't really become useful form of payment yet. which is probably why regulators haven't paid alot of attention to it. yet. but the more places it is used the more regulations as we all know...

larry_vw_1955, what country are you from? It is very interesting to me.
In Russia, drugs, weapons, prostitution, and currency exchange for large sums are prohibited, but all this is available in any small city of 50,000 or more people. Bans don't work in Russia; they're useless. Thanks to global sanctions, Russia is now experiencing an economic boom.

Any ban is a sign of weakness. I talk to Europeans and they themselves say that if their government bans cryptocurrencies, they will go on strike.

Yes, banks can prohibit payments, but most likely they will kill many other businesses at the same time, which will be an even more severe blow to the economy.

larry_vw_1955

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Quote from: zasad@ on September 21, 2023, 05:31:22 AM

Bitcoin has already become popular and it is not profitable to fight with it.
You can fight by closing exchanges, but as experience shows, where there is profit, there is a shadow market.

if exchanges were outlawed then people wouldn't be able to use their bank accounts to buy and sell bitcoin. pretty much tanking the price of it. but i think that's the least of bitcoin's worries because i don't see amazon letting people pay with bitcoin. or ebay or anywhere. seems like it hasn't really become useful form of payment yet. which is probably why regulators haven't paid alot of attention to it. yet. but the more places it is used the more regulations as we all know...

zasad@

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 20, 2023, 11:52:59 PM

Quote from: zasad@ on September 20, 2023, 09:31:46 AM

The main problem with Bitcoin is that it can no longer be quickly exchanged for cash in many countries. And if you manage to exchange it for cash, then with this money you cannot buy real estate, a car or deposit large sums into bank accounts.

well yeah, if they can cut bitcoin off from making it easy to convert it into fiat then they've pretty much destroyed bitcoin.

https://www.coinbase.com/blog/a-call-to-action-mobilizing-52-million-crypto-owners-into-an-army-of-1
A Call To Action: Mobilizing 52 Million Crypto Owners Into An Army of One Million Advocates For Change

Bitcoin has already become popular and it is not profitable to fight with it.
You can fight by closing exchanges, but as experience shows, where there is profit, there is a shadow market.
Therefore, states are actively fighting cache and reducing its amount to a minimum.

One example from Russia. The regulator prohibited banks from selling currency. The bank could only sell the dollars and euros it bought from citizens. The shadow market for exchanging rubles for stablecoins immediately grew.

larry_vw_1955

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Quote from: zasad@ on September 20, 2023, 09:31:46 AM

The main problem with Bitcoin is that it can no longer be quickly exchanged for cash in many countries. And if you manage to exchange it for cash, then with this money you cannot buy real estate, a car or deposit large sums into bank accounts.

well yeah, if they can cut bitcoin off from making it easy to convert it into fiat then they've pretty much destroyed bitcoin.

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Quote from: philipma1957 on September 16, 2023, 08:18:02 PM

Quote from: zasad@ on September 16, 2023, 10:29:02 AM

Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 16, 2023, 01:58:47 AM

Quote from: zasad@ on September 15, 2023, 06:20:21 AM

According to local reports in New Delhi — where the group members are attending a two-day summit — the framework will facilitate information exchange between countries beginning in 2027."

just what everyone needs. their home country or any country snitching on them to other countries about their crypto activity...before long they'll be asking if you have a bitcoin wallet on your phone or anywhere. and you need to declare it if you're travelling. so they can see how much money you have. then you become a criminal if you lie. a bitcoin fugitive!

By then it will probably be very difficult or expensive to travel

What I'm saying is that it's all about interaction procedures, which may not be as effective as it seems at first glance.
But all the bans only make crypto users smarter, and governments will have to spend a lot of money on control.

If they want to stop the could. It would be costly and you would need the vast majority of countries to agree to ban it.

Fortunately I doubt that most countries would agree to a ban.

They might agree to a tax setup and if you are in one of the high tax countries you will need to move.

Money wise btc and the other coins are not big enough for this to happen.

No government can ban or stop Bitcoin, and it is not required. All movements of coins are very easy to control and it is not profitable to close such a casino.
The main problem with Bitcoin is that it can no longer be quickly exchanged for cash in many countries. And if you manage to exchange it for cash, then with this money you cannot buy real estate, a car or deposit large sums into bank accounts.

larry_vw_1955

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Quote from: Poker Player on September 16, 2023, 06:25:28 AM

It sounds too conspiranoid to me but I'm not saying you're not right, although for me the most likely scenario is that they will continue printing more and more, with some timid balance sheet reduction and periods of rate hikes like now until they can't take it anymore and we go back to full non stop printing.

the more they print the more worthless everyone's paper money is and bitcoin might go up in "usd value" but if the usd can't hold its value then it doesn't mean much. people will need to be making $100 per hour at minimum wage to afford their non stop printing. Shocked

Quote

Next year is a presidential election in the USA, isn't it? I would bet that they will casually lower rates.

maybe they'll raise the federal minimum wage to something that people could afford to buy an apple with.

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Quote from: zasad@ on September 16, 2023, 10:29:02 AM

Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 16, 2023, 01:58:47 AM

Quote from: zasad@ on September 15, 2023, 06:20:21 AM

According to local reports in New Delhi — where the group members are attending a two-day summit — the framework will facilitate information exchange between countries beginning in 2027."

just what everyone needs. their home country or any country snitching on them to other countries about their crypto activity...before long they'll be asking if you have a bitcoin wallet on your phone or anywhere. and you need to declare it if you're travelling. so they can see how much money you have. then you become a criminal if you lie. a bitcoin fugitive!

By then it will probably be very difficult or expensive to travel

What I'm saying is that it's all about interaction procedures, which may not be as effective as it seems at first glance.
But all the bans only make crypto users smarter, and governments will have to spend a lot of money on control.

If they want to stop the could. It would be costly and you would need the vast majority of countries to agree to ban it.

Fortunately I doubt that most countries would agree to a ban.

They might agree to a tax setup and if you are in one of the high tax countries you will need to move.

Money wise btc and the other coins are not big enough for this to happen.

zasad@

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 16, 2023, 01:58:47 AM

Quote from: zasad@ on September 15, 2023, 06:20:21 AM

According to local reports in New Delhi — where the group members are attending a two-day summit — the framework will facilitate information exchange between countries beginning in 2027."

just what everyone needs. their home country or any country snitching on them to other countries about their crypto activity...before long they'll be asking if you have a bitcoin wallet on your phone or anywhere. and you need to declare it if you're travelling. so they can see how much money you have. then you become a criminal if you lie. a bitcoin fugitive!

By then it will probably be very difficult or expensive to travel

What I'm saying is that it's all about interaction procedures, which may not be as effective as it seems at first glance.
But all the bans only make crypto users smarter, and governments will have to spend a lot of money on control.

philipma1957

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'The right to privacy matters'

Quote from: Poker Player on September 16, 2023, 06:25:28 AM

Quote from: philipma1957 on September 14, 2023, 02:08:42 PM

They won't be able to tax it in that manner.

But you may be taxed on it in many other ways.

The U.S.A. taxes and taxes and taxes and taxes. Plus they don't pay the budget off year after year after year.

This is the point. Is anyone surprised by this? Politicians have an insatiable voracity for spending, usually those on the left more, but many on the right as well. Just look at the expansion of the global debt by countries.

https://www.usdebtclock.org/world-debt-clock.html

Quote from: philipma1957 on September 14, 2023, 02:08:42 PM

It is only a matter of time for this to end.

Well, I've been hearing this for a long time. Some people have been saying it since 1971 and it's been a long time since then. In the end, it will be a matter of time, but it won't affect me much if it ends in 200 years.

Quote from: philipma1957 on September 14, 2023, 02:08:42 PM

I suspect the idea of turning the left against the right causing great conflict among most people is their master plan to bail on all the debt they made since 2001.

It sounds too conspiranoid to me but I'm not saying you're not right, although for me the most likely scenario is that they will continue printing more and more, with some timid balance sheet reduction and periods of rate hikes like now until they can't take it anymore and we go back to full non stop printing.

Next year is a presidential election in the USA, isn't it? I would bet that they will casually lower rates.

Yeah rates are going to drop maybe spring 2024. Not next week most likely they pause next week then go up in November.

I have watch a lot of cycles of Fed tighten every one ends with a bust out. So we have not had the bust out. So they are not

done. I do think the mining tax for coins issue in this thread won't happen. As they will not be able to say the internet is federal property. If we ever get one world wide government it could happen.

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Quote from: philipma1957 on September 14, 2023, 02:08:42 PM

They won't be able to tax it in that manner.

But you may be taxed on it in many other ways.

The U.S.A. taxes and taxes and taxes and taxes. Plus they don't pay the budget off year after year after year.

This is the point. Is anyone surprised by this? Politicians have an insatiable voracity for spending, usually those on the left more, but many on the right as well. Just look at the expansion of the global debt by countries.

https://www.usdebtclock.org/world-debt-clock.html

Quote from: philipma1957 on September 14, 2023, 02:08:42 PM

It is only a matter of time for this to end.

Well, I've been hearing this for a long time. Some people have been saying it since 1971 and it's been a long time since then. In the end, it will be a matter of time, but it won't affect me much if it ends in 200 years.

Quote from: philipma1957 on September 14, 2023, 02:08:42 PM

I suspect the idea of turning the left against the right causing great conflict among most people is their master plan to bail on all the debt they made since 2001.

It sounds too conspiranoid to me but I'm not saying you're not right, although for me the most likely scenario is that they will continue printing more and more, with some timid balance sheet reduction and periods of rate hikes like now until they can't take it anymore and we go back to full non stop printing.

Next year is a presidential election in the USA, isn't it? I would bet that they will casually lower rates.

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Quote from: zasad@ on September 15, 2023, 06:20:21 AM

According to local reports in New Delhi — where the group members are attending a two-day summit — the framework will facilitate information exchange between countries beginning in 2027."

just what everyone needs. their home country or any country snitching on them to other countries about their crypto activity...before long they'll be asking if you have a bitcoin wallet on your phone or anywhere. and you need to declare it if you're travelling. so they can see how much money you have. then you become a criminal if you lie. a bitcoin fugitive!

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 14, 2023, 11:34:15 PM

Quote from: zasad@ on September 14, 2023, 09:53:41 AM

What is Bitcoin according to US law?
The SEC did not call Bitcoin a security and, according to recent court decisions, Bitcoin is recognized as a commodity.
But it seems to me that I am being deceived. Bitcoin is not money, but why are FATF regulations the same as for money transfers applied to all cryptocurrency transactions over $1,000?

i think you may be confused. they don't want bitcoin to be treated as just one thing they want it to be treated as different things in different situations so they can control people in lots of different ways. still i don't think it's against the law to fly into an airport in the usa with more than $10,000 worth of bitcoin in your little android bitcoin app. but i could be wrong. you might need to declare it to customs or get locked up.

I think that it is difficult to confuse any person with good knowledge, because he will not obey stupid laws and follow idiotic instructions.

One more important moment at the g20 meeting
https://cointelegraph.com/news/g20-moves-forward-international-crypto-framework
"Leaders of the 20 biggest economies in the world — collectively known as G20 — are pushing for a speedy implementation of a cross-border framework for crypto assets.

According to local reports in New Delhi — where the group members are attending a two-day summit — the framework will facilitate information exchange between countries beginning in 2027."

larry_vw_1955

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Quote from: philipma1957 on September 14, 2023, 02:08:42 PM

They won't be able to tax it in that manner.

they could if biden stays in office long enough. he would do anything if they put it in front of him...

Quote from: zasad@ on September 14, 2023, 09:53:41 AM

What is Bitcoin according to US law?
The SEC did not call Bitcoin a security and, according to recent court decisions, Bitcoin is recognized as a commodity.
But it seems to me that I am being deceived. Bitcoin is not money, but why are FATF regulations the same as for money transfers applied to all cryptocurrency transactions over $1,000?

i think you may be confused. they don't want bitcoin to be treated as just one thing they want it to be treated as different things in different situations so they can control people in lots of different ways. still i don't think it's against the law to fly into an airport in the usa with more than $10,000 worth of bitcoin in your little android bitcoin app. but i could be wrong. you might need to declare it to customs or get locked up.

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'The right to privacy matters'

Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 14, 2023, 01:22:12 AM

https://apnews.com/article/biden-mining-law-minerals-pay-royalties-lithium-gold-155556bba3eaa4c0fdb7b37e76150eee

The Biden administration is recommending changes to a 151-year-old law that governs mining for copper, gold and other hardrock minerals on U.S.-owned lands, including making companies for the first time pay royalties on what they extract.

how long until they get the idea to force usa based bitcoin miners to start paying royalties on the bitcoin they "extract"? i'd say not too long. Shocked

here is how you'll know when that happens. there will be a line on your tax return that says "Did you mine any bitcoin in the past year?"

They won't be able to tax it in that manner.

But you may be taxed on it in many other ways.

The U.S.A. taxes and taxes and taxes and taxes. Plus they don't pay the budget off year after year after year.

It is only a matter of time for this to end.

I suspect the idea of turning the left against the right causing great conflict among most people is their master plan to bail on all the debt they made since 2001.

zasad@

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Quote from: avikz on September 14, 2023, 09:32:24 AM

Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 14, 2023, 01:22:12 AM

how long until they get the idea to force usa based bitcoin miners to start paying royalties on the bitcoin they "extract"? i'd say not too long. Shocked

I don't see it happening ever! Mining gold and mining bitcoin are two different things. Government can impose taxes on Bitcoin mining but can't impose royalty on it. Also I believe Bitcoin is considered as a digital security in US. Have you ever seen royalty is imposed on security?

But a government can do whatever they want. However, imposing royalty on Bitcoin mining doesn't make sense!

What is Bitcoin according to US law?
The SEC did not call Bitcoin a security and, according to recent court decisions, Bitcoin is recognized as a commodity.
But it seems to me that I am being deceived. Bitcoin is not money, but why are FATF regulations the same as for money transfers applied to all cryptocurrency transactions over $1,000?
Such standards are not yet everywhere, but this is only for now.
If the government wants to evict miners from the country, it will find a way to raise taxes and come up with other problems.

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Quote from: larry_vw_1955 on September 14, 2023, 01:22:12 AM

how long until they get the idea to force usa based bitcoin miners to start paying royalties on the bitcoin they "extract"? i'd say not too long. Shocked

I don't see it happening ever! Mining gold and mining bitcoin are two different things. Government can impose taxes on Bitcoin mining but can't impose royalty on it. Also I believe Bitcoin is considered as a digital security in US. Have you ever seen royalty is imposed on security?

But a government can do whatever they want. However, imposing royalty on Bitcoin mining doesn't make sense!

zasad@

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I think that an additional tax of 4-8% will not kill the economy, as they write in the articles, and will not force people to buy resources in other countries, although if the United States buys more resources on foreign markets, then prices for Europe will be more expensive. In Russia, the mineral extraction tax has been in force since 2001 and this tax is much higher.

larry_vw_1955

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https://apnews.com/article/biden-mining-law-minerals-pay-royalties-lithium-gold-155556bba3eaa4c0fdb7b37e76150eee

The Biden administration is recommending changes to a 151-year-old law that governs mining for copper, gold and other hardrock minerals on U.S.-owned lands, including making companies for the first time pay royalties on what they extract.

how long until they get the idea to force usa based bitcoin miners to start paying royalties on the bitcoin they "extract"? i'd say not too long. Shocked

here is how you'll know when that happens. there will be a line on your tax return that says "Did you mine any bitcoin in the past year?"

Topic: Biden plan would overhaul 151-year-old mining law, make companies pay royalties (Read 304 times)