Topic: Bitcoin can be gainful for a deplored economy. (Read 498 times)

Rising prices of imported goods in foreign currency are the result of supply and demand, not inflation. Few people import, therefore they can rise the prices given the demand is actually increasing, due to the shortage of local production. Of course all importers will tell you stories about customs, taxes, and the hyperinflation eating their profits so they need to rise prices to keep their business afloat, but in the end is lack of competition thanks to a socialist (distorted) economy.

Bitcoin is a deflationary currency, as a main currency it should only be used in countries willing to adopt Austrian economics. The USD like most fiat currencies manipulated by governments IS inflationary, because the main stream Chicago school of economy (and Keynesians) teach how fearful deflation is. So they actually try to induce a steady inflation of about 2% per year by various means, including printing more.

Truth is deflation is good, when combined with Austrian economics. Austrians do not let bubbles form in the first place, therefore there are no crashes. All these bubbles are the result of fractional reserve banking, which Austrians ditch in favor of full reserve banking. Yes Maduro kinda gave the order to do that, but without a free economy and the rest of the Austrian measures, its useless, specially within a socialist economy.

Most people don't even understand how a full reserve bank works so I'll explain it to you quickly: If you open a savings account, they have to keep 100% of your money, they cannot loan it to anyone unless you move it to a special loaning account. Unless you do that, the bank should charge you a fee for keeping all your money in their vault, instead of you getting interest rates. If you move your money to the loaning account, you understand the risk that you might lose it should the bank goes bankrupt. Also while being loaned, it won't be available to you until the loan ends or is cancelled due to other factors. Done correctly you should never lose any money but instead earn a bit of interest. In Venezuela something very similar is called "plazo fijo" (term deposit). Of course this would also need changes to bank law and their operations. I think many bankers don't even truly know how this system works, but they should take a look.

While the main stream economics want you to take debts to invest which in turn creates profit and growth and more people take more debt, etc; Austrians want you to save your money first, and then you invest from your own savings instead of getting in debt. And you will by your own motivation, knowing your money is actually increasing its purchase power everyday, so you will only spend what you must, and keep the rest.

This is very much like contrasting the Chinese and American cultures. A Chinese would rather spend 15 years living in a humble house and saving to buy a new one, while the American would take a loan get the new house now and then spend 30 years paying it back... Yes the Austrian way is "boring" and slow, but firm and solid. While the alternative is the roller-coaster that makes bubbles and crashes.

Take only Bitcoin but don't implement Austrian economics, and its not going to help much. That is not too different from adopting another country's money.

Yes, every participant of bitcoin or crypto trading and investment that succeeded in gaining profit on its investment has automatically generated more money for the economy of the participant’s country of residence.

Most traders will still cash out some of their profits and convert it to fiat, which they save in the bank for the bank to use, or spend it within the country’s market, and as more money comes in to the market of the country, the higher their economy grows. I still don’t understand why government would not just give support to something that will benefit them as a whole.

currently bitcoin has indeed been beneficial for economic growth, for example many people whose economic level has increased because they have joined in the crypto currency trading. so that it helps the country increase the income per capita of the community.
and indirectly it has helped improve the country's economy.

agree, bitcoin is a decentralized cryptocurrency or digital currency that allows no influence on the crisis that happened. that way bitcoin will have the ability to continue to increase in accordance with the demand that happen. this is very good for an economic growth or helping economic growth to keep the crisis from happening globally

I think it would help a lot in blockchain ways and not currency ways. We already have a lot of countries who are basically third world and having issues, reaching to those people is the biggest expense ever. I have read somewhere that 70% of all charity money towards African poor people goes towards reaching that money to those people instead of directly to that people, you can just write money on bank to someone who is eating leafs in Yemen, those people do not have access to technology the way we do.

If you can actually build a blockchain infrastructure which is just mobile phones basically than they could have better chance, just one time payment from charity or something to make sure every house hold has one mobile phone than all money can directly go to people in need. That is why I think blockchain is the savior of these people who are living under harsh conditions and not bitcoin itself, it could be any coin but it has to be blockchain based.

Just to add, one of the problems of these countries are basing their debts outside of their own currency. The amount they owe to whatever currency they decided to base their debts are directly proportional with the amount they had to pay. It will undoubtedly increase overtime and the dire results will show.

Bitcoin, on the other hand doesn't promise anything about gains but you will surely lose more if you put money in here. Its about time we stop thinking that if they did this and that, something will change.

Although bitcoin is the latest technology in the world of finance rather than perfect money created by the government, however its immediate benefits can truly be felt by many parties because bitcoin does not favor one currency only meaning globally it can be exchanged for national currencies any country. So what Goldman Sachs Zack Pandle and Charles Himmelberg say is true because bitcoin has met the standards for these criteria.

Undoubtedly, bitcoin can be (and has been) a reliable store of value in those countries whose economies have suffered considerable economic crises, as in the case of Venezuela, and that is why some dictatorial regimes are making efforts to veto the use of cryptocurrencies in their territories, or have failed to create a national "crypto", such as the Venezuelan "Petro".

Fortunately, none of these attempts has worked, and bitcoin continues to be sought out assiduously by people from these countries, but unfortunately its technology has not been available to the great unprotected masses of the poorest sectors.

If they are talking about countries who currently have hyperinflation like Venezuela then they might be wrong about it, you see in places just like this even any foreign currency is affected when use in that country, just by having a foreign currency doesn't mean it will be immune to inflation in that country. You see inflation here affects two things aside from the devaluation of money you will also encounter the increase in price for goods which is common when the supply runs out. So this means even let say the US Dollar is backed by its country it doesn't mean that it's value for that country will be the same all through out. Their statement might be partly through but it cannot be applied to all countries' respective economies.

Just take a look at reuter's article on how the US dollar was affected even if it was a foreign currency in Venezuela.

this field of Crypto market says that everyone can be gainful using this opportunity so making the chances is not in our hands but using the opportunity is always been important to gain the success so my opinion is field is not only useful for making the money but holding our self confidence to the future is always filled with the hands of cryptocurrency field.

big time is mostly used for creating a changes in anyone's life so the economic situation always depends on the money only so it definitely change is it when its development was increased to a good level.

Until now I only see positive thing in bitcoin usage. Bad news that spread are mostly about crime that done by some people. Maybe that experts at goldman sachs is right, also I think nations with unsteady economy need bitcoin because it can help their citizens to become wealthier so it economy can be stronger.

Any country that is smart will know that fighting Bitcoin is just wasted effort. You either cash in by being a part of it or you lose revenue by banning it. I mean,,, even you should look at Thailand they allowed crypto but will impose such high taxes, but in the end at least businesses have an outlet and yes, the state gains something out of it. And you are absolutely right, if you run,,, things catch up with you, one day sooner or later!

In both Zimbabwe and Venezuela, it was the wealthy who used bitcoin (they had access to smart phones, the internet, and a reliable power generator attached to their homes).

The poor use dollar bills, because you don't need any tech to use them. Zimbabwe even legalised the use of dollars, euros and pounds because they reckoned that allowing people to use them stabalised the country.

I think bitcoin can be a solution for people to avoid inflation, with the decentralisation bitcoin won't be too affected by global crisis and it could help people to get a better life, by providing more job opportunities when the economic collapsed, but I don't think bitcoin could be the solution to solve the crisis problem, it could be  a temporary solution

Seems like people like Goldman has been opened for new solutions in the economic issues. But, i was just thinking. If it is neccessarily to use bitcoin to solve such economic crisis, how will it can be of help if the price of btc immediately fluctuates? We are not talking about the technology given by btc, but OP emphasized the reasonable methods of installment using btc payments.

 We all know that btc is volatile, thus can also be put into consideration. Don't get me wrong, but I was just thinking if it can be really an aid to one's economic situation if the price is not stable.

I disagree, I believe it's just an option because there are ways to help the collapsing economy, like increasing the business opportunity to enter in a country, or solve the corruption within the government as that one could be major reason why an economy will collapse.

Bitcoin on the other hand is still new or at its early stage, we cannot be certain that it will have bigger demand in the future, and like we witness in the past, it can dump hard because manipulation is still happening.

I think that this is one of the things where bitcoin can really make an impact, on a grassroot level.

There are countries previously hit by hyperinflation where its citizens were essentially forced to either barter (which is extremely inefficient), or transact with worn and torn dollar bills that are incredibly hard to obtain and were often illegal. Just look at Zimbabwe, and Venezuela in recent memory.

BTC not only can be used as a store of value in these times when a fiat currencies have collapsed, it can also function as a currency, which is something that gold and silver can do but doesn't do as well as bitcoin given its inconveniences.

It is indeed gainful for a country with unstable economy only if Bitcoin will continue to grow. For my point of view, a volatile kind of currency can carry the economy up and it also has a tendency to bring it down. So it's better not to totally rely on Bitcoin but instead make it an option to regain momentum in terms of financial aspects.

Governments already can't pay back their debt.

Look at the US for example, no amount of printing can halt the rate at which their debt is increasing day after day. All they can do is inject trillions in their economy to delay the process of seeing their economy implode, but that's obviously going to K.O. you in the long run.

Essentially, they can still print money with Bitcoin in place. All they have to do is build on top of Bitcoin the way Tether has done it. They can issue as many tokens as they wish. Currently we don't know how much fiat there is in circulation, but that's totally different in case they do have built their currency on top of Bitcoin. There is no way to cheat.

Crashes can still happen with Bitcoin-based economies. Markets still fluctuate and Bitcoin would essentially just be another moniker for fiat in the case of 2008, however, it would have had a different series of events leading up to the market crash.

Notionally, it could be argued that Bitcoin would be worse for a failing economy because the government wouldn't have any ability to pay its debts (in the form of printing money) and would be stuck in a bad economic position for a lot longer. Don't get me wrong, backed currencies (and Bitcoin, by extension) are a boon for an economy's health, but it doesn't fit within the current system that we have. There is a desperate need for a restructuring of the world economy before backed currencies can become viable, and sadly not a lot of countries want to undertake that paradigm shift.

I think the allowance and regulations of bitcoin alone could create a lot of tax income for any country, if you are from a country that is in need of fresh money to increase the GDP and give your public a chance to actually survive then creating a cryptocurrency economy will help you a lot by paying you taxes on the crypto income which will in return used for the betterment of that public.

Even companies overseas that are not living under relax regulations for bitcoin or any other crypto will COME to your country just because you have better tax regulations. That will be the savior of any countries economy if only they could take advantage of that but I doubt anywhere big will do that now and all small ones are looked too unstable to test something like that for now.

Bitcoin is not an option in a collapsing economy, but it is a solution. It is the nature of Bitcoin to fix the problem of conventional currency and conventional economic system. The technologies within Bitcoin allow a completely decentralized system based on a trustless system. That makes the currency are way ahead better than conventional currency, systematically, and in term technologies.

Bitcoin can be a great help.  Government welcoming Bitcoin also welcomes all the project associated with it.  Imagine a country that caters every Bitcoin start up in its domain?  That will solve unemployment, elevate the people kind of living and give more revenue to the government. 


Well with the nation progress comes development, who knows. maybe a possible crypto start up that tackles electric shortage and create electric supply will be established in such kind of environment.

not only this but kind can also helpful for anything to be successful when it comes to the country play the support of government legally then it will be the most useful economic changing currencies in all the time and I trust it will be successful in the future.

Also, don't forget the power cuts in Venezuela - that would make it hard to use crypto.

When a country really goes to pot, paper money, especially US dollars, is the only useful money to have.

They feel more secured with something they can hold and see physically. We can't blame them though because if I was in their shoes, then I would feel scared as well. They are just afraid of committing themselves again with something they are not certain of. However, their country is surely doing something about it to get them to trust crypto again. Let's just hope that it'll turn out well as time goes by and hope that crypto will play an essential part of it.

That would be ideal, but doing that has to be under-wraps, as the only legal payment for employer and employee here is either the garbage fiat or the garbage centralized token and neither is wanted.

Next best is getting the garbage fiat and exchange it for bitcoin asap, and then when you need to buy things, change it to fiat for the smallest possible amount. Of course the major volume of transactions are not people using it to survive hyperinflation, but those trading who are mostly outside the country, as people within the country are too impoverished for this.

Of course this all breaks if internet or power fails, which is sadly becoming more and more frequent. March was a nightmare and things are looking very grim on a national scale.

With the economy destroyed as it is, no jobs within the country are worth getting at this point, but the de-facto gov wants to take a cut from any money coming from abroad people are struggling to obtain to survive. So naturally, ways for avoiding the State meddling are sought by the people.

I don't think like that because it will very useful in all type of positions in the people because I have getting a lots of income from this Crypto investment and Bitcoin will be the most valuable thing in my mind so it can definitely been giving Aate pass access to everyone.

Yes, that is true, and we cannot deny that bitcoin really helps the economy for those who use it, and besides that bitcoin can realize desires that were previously impossible.
and the transaction process is very easy and safe to exchange bitcoin to fiat or real money to be able to buy whatever you want, bitcoin really helps a lot of things and I hope that with the progress of bitcoin there will be more and more to adopt and accept in all countries that Bitcoin can help the economy of their society.

Apparently only the top 1% in venezuela understand and use bitcoin.

Most Venezuelans are trying to get their hands on dollars and have more faith in the dollar. I think this is because bitcoin has lost so much of it's value since Dec 2017. Imagine if you were a venezuelan who bought bitcoin at the top - it would be like a tragedy on top of everything else that has gone wrong for them.

Indeed, what most people think here looks easy and fast so that everything requires precise and very precise calculations in placing Bitcoin as Fiat's replacement international currency for the future, which might occur with better regulation so that Bitcoin will have a decent position in government, right? No wonder cryptocurrency is still not good and who says cryptocurrency is very stable from Fiat? it's just a faint shadow without seeing the current market reality, I think everything you need to count is not as easy as what you are talking about here.

Take the printing of money as an example - Most 3rd world countries are not printing their own fiat currency and they are using a foreign printing press and minting services to do this. All of this come at a very high price, so they are paying lots of money for their citizens to use cash.

Bitcoin is mined at ZERO cost to these nations and citizens can get access to these coins without the limitations of having to wait for their own government to print or mint their local currencies.

The fact still lies in whether other countries are going to accept it or not. Big countries considering bigger in terms of economy GDP and population compared to Venezuela which are fed by other countries to side with them may not take the same stance. We have the cold war countries still having sides and they dont want their opposition to gain hands. World politics here is pretty dicy and what the next step will be in entirely speculation.

Some countries can develop a deflationary system in their residing fiat currency and not shift to bitcoin. By all means shift to bitcoin is easy to say but tough to implement considering that an entire country economy is going to run in it.

This is why I think my country supports cryptocurrency though not literally legalized but they implemented regulation and for me it is the sign that they accept it or they might see some potential in crypto for the unstable economy. But what if a country's economy is backed by Bitcoin? Just like any country where their fiat money is backed by gold just to make sure they can prevent economic or financial crisis.

It's already proven, just look at Venezuela and Zimbabwe crisis, crypto or bitcoin is being used as leverage for their countries hyper-inflation.

Other nations are also looking at crypto to circumvent sanctions like Iran or Venezuela and to an extend Cuba. And even a lot of third world nation specially around Asia, bitcoin is very popular because it gave them economic freedom.

Bitcoin definitely has a use as a store of value for people in countries like Venezuela, it might have additional practical applications for other countries, however, they would be somewhat more limited. Especially when the country doesn't have reliable internet access, or at least lacks an infrastructure network to maintain uninterrupted daily activities. If employers and their employees can come to an agreement on the type of pay they receive, Bitcoin might be substantially better than the fiat alternative, doubly so in inflation-prone nations.

It's a saver of a country that's economy is collapsing, especially the hyper inflation, like venezuela where we know some of the people their are relying on bitcoin to save their money from hyper inflation. It could be the same with other country and those who think that the future economy could collapse, they can bet on bitcoin now.

Bitcoin is really a big remedy to a shaky economy. If bitcoin would go and change every users life in a certain country, it will surely have a big impact in the growth of an economy. People who pay taxes through it and the adoption of bitcoin is an advantage in each country. If every country would accept bitcoin, I'm sure that it will help the global economic growth.

And perhaps with that report from one of the leading banks in the world, people will stop wondering whether bitcoin is really doing something good for this world or just adding up to the evil points this world already has. Venezuela and now Argentina are the finest examples on how useful bitcoin is for the citizens of the mentioned countries which are currently experiencing extreme currency devaluation due to their poor economy. This is not 2013-2015 anymore which bitcoin is only used for drugs and other illicit materials; bitcoin is already helping the world.

Indeed bitcoin and crypto can help and economy, if people get money from crypto and after cashout to fiat and buy things with can help economy from tax, but some governments will not accept so easy bitcoin adoption.

As indicated by the report of Goldman Sachs, Bitcoin and other digital forms of money can be a decent option in contrast to the national cash for nations with an unsteady economy.
Experts at Goldman Sachs Zack Pandle and Charles Himmelberg said that advanced monetary standards and, specifically, Bitcoin, can turn into a reasonable methods for installment in nations where conventional cash isn't adequately given.