Topic: Bitcoin comes first and blockchain comes later (Read 570 times)

Everyone is free to make an opinion based on what he wants and what he thinks. It is undeniable, that the birth of Bitcoin has had a major influence on the popularity of Blockchain, so many companies and state agencies have adopted blockchain to improve the quality of their work system. Does this mean they should thank Bitcoin or the creators of Bitcoin, I don't think so.

It is very important to know the truth of history to provide a good education for users and future generations. And the history recorded by writing usually becomes an acknowledgment that is considered valid by the general public, Sample case; as written by iv4n or published by wikipedia. Things like this will be a reference by people who study Blockchain or Bitcoin.

Personally, I don't mind the differences and debates that arise in public. But it becomes important when it comes to educating someone, and I appreciate every process of Bitcoin and blockchain being born, including the people involved.

In my opinion blockchain came before bitcoin. Bitcoin has made blockchain more widely used. blockchain is a distributed ledger that allows users to maintain immutable, immutable records distributed across a network.bitcoin created in 2009 and built on blockchain technology.Bitcoin was created as a digital, decentralized currency, the main idea is to create an independent and decentralized electronic payment system based on mathematical and cryptographic proofs.

From a technical point of view, blockchain is known as the underlying technology of Bitcoin, and Bitcoin is the first application of blockchain.
 
Bitcoin and blockchain are equivalent to the relationship between the table and wood. People first discovered a beautiful table, and later discovered that the material of the table is a good wood, and it can also be used to make chairs, cabinets and boxes.

The blockchain technology appeared earlier, but it was defined as a block after Bitcoin. There are a lot of information on this.

No matter whether it is a mobile phone or a computer, we all know that there must be a system first, and then various APP applications can be developed in the system.

But this is not the case with blockchain and bitcoin. The first bitcoin was born in 2009. In 2015, six years later, the concept of blockchain became available.

Before the concept of blockchain was invented, people used bitcoin (lowercase b) to represent bitcoin, and Bitcoin (uppercase B) to represent its underlying technology, which is what we are talking about now.

In fact, I don’t care about the order of Bitcoin and blockchain. What I care about is the mature future of Bitcoin. Bitcoin will no longer be questioned, criticized, perished, exaggerated, or exaggerated. Ignore, no longer be called a scam, etc.

I think people need to remember lessons of the past. When I first came into Bitcoin 4/5 years ago, there were all these movements that supported Ethereum and all the other smart contract platforms like NEO, Waves, TRON etc.

And everyone said Dapps would rule the world and Flippening would prove it.

Blockchain, not Bitcoin.

They all know how wrong they were now. If Bitcoin doesn't succeed, blockchain won't.

Thank you for your wonderful reply. First of all, I read this article carefully and understand its main point. Here I continue to elaborate on my point of view.
 https://101blockchains.com/history-of-blockchain-timeline/

In this article, it summarizes the history of blockchain and defines the earliest birth of blockchain in 1991.


But in my opinion, this article is a retrospective of history with current viewpoints. We are now accustomed to the concept of blockchain, so when we traced the history of blockchain, we positioned it to 1991.I respect these two scientists, Stuart Haber and W. Scott Stornetta. I very much approve of their work, and Satoshi  also quoted their papers in the Bitcoin white paper. I also found the manuscript of this paper. The core idea of ​​this paper is how to time stamp documents. Satoshi  referred to some of their thinking about timestamps. In their paper, there is no complete concept of blockchain. There is also no independent block chain concept. The core point is the specific knowledge of the timestamp.

At the same time, there is no independent concept of blockchain in Satosh's Bitcoin white paper. What he created is a peer-to-peer electronic cash system. This is the Bitcoin network. Satosh did not define this system as a blockchain.

Blockchain has become an independent concept, and it has become an independent technology after Bitcoin's underlying technology has been verified. Everyone found that the underlying technology of Bitcoin could not be overcome, could not be tampered with, could not be controlled, and was completely decentralized, and no one could intervene. As a result, technicians gradually abstracted and summarized the underlying technology that supports the Bitcoin network, forming a complete set of blockchain technology. To this day has formed our prosperous crypto world. Many times, some governments will advertise that blockchain is a very good technology, but Bitcoin is a very bad currency. But most people don't know that if there is no Bitcoin, there will be no blockchain technology we have now.

At first glance it might seem like chicken and egg argument. However, in this case I do agree with OP on the basis of creation blockchain, because without Bitcoin, blockchain would serve no purpose.

Source: https://101blockchains.com/history-of-blockchain-timeline/

As you can see, there was a concept of blockchain before Bitcoin... You can also read that:

Nice article, you can read about the evolution of Blockchain too:

1. Evolution of Blockchain: Phase 1- Transactions 2008-2013: Blockchain 1.0: Bitcoin Emergence
2. Evolution of Blockchain: Phase 2- Contracts 2013-2015: Blockchain 2.0: Ethereum Development
3. Evolution of Blockchain: Phase 3- Applications2018: Blockchain 3.0: the Future

Do you still think that Bitcoin was before Blockchain? Or maybe you think this article is misleading?

What I want to express here is that when Satoshi Nakamoto created the Bitcoin network, there was no concept of blockchain. What he built is the operating network of Bitcoin and called it "A Peer-to-Peer Electronic Cash System." So Bitcoin itself belongs to a system. Three or five years after the birth of Bitcoin, technical personnel in the existing society discovered the power and indestructibility of the Bitcoin network. Countless hackers have tried to steal Bitcoin to no avail. The underlying technology of Bitcoin has been verified. Later, on the technology of the underlying technology of Bitcoin, the scientific and technical personnel summarized a brand new technology, named it the blockchain, and then step by step we have the now prosperous crypto world.

Ordinary people who are new to cryptocurrency only understand about investing, the advantages of bitcoin and how to make a profit. they do not understand about the technology behind the cryptocurrency. They don't find out in detail. Blockchain makes cryptocurrency a decentralized platform and blockchain also becomes a ledger that will properly record all types of transactions. blockchain can be developed for other types of platforms besides cryptocurrencies, even china will create their own blockchain and is in development stage.

Logical thinking! I always point out that Bitcoin is created on Blockchain technology when I explain it to some people, so it's why this topic and the OP point of view is a bit confusing for me... simply Bitcoin is built on something, and that something is Blockchain... so it must come first!

I guess that only Satoshi can answer this question... what was the first thing that felt on his mind, Bitcoin as Bitcoin, or technology that can be described as a data structure that holds transactional records while ensuring security, transparency, and decentralization in the same time! We can try to guess what it was, but if we follow the logic it would be Blockchain first, and later Bitcoin... after all that, we have many others that used the same technology to create something different!

Practically it's not possible! A product can born earlier than its underlying technology. That's the reality! However if you say that the concept of bitcoin was formed first and then Satoshi formulated the concept of blockchain, that may be a possibility. But when the actual product (bitcoin) is build and published, the underlying technology (blockchain in this case) mush have been built before the actual product. It can't be the other way around because technically it is not possible to build bitcoin earlier than blockchain. Can only happen during the conceptualization period, not during implementation!

Governments restrict Bitcoin and not blockchain because Bitcoin is decentralized and cannot be under their control, whereas blockchain is a technology that can be used to create a centralized cryptocurrency or to do something that is not even related to finance.
But Bitcoin and Blockchain, IMO, come together at the very same moment, since there was no time when Bitcoin existed, but it wasn't blockchain-based, right? And in terms of applicability, blockchain has a higher potential because it can be used for all sorts of data, not just financial transactions. But Bitcoin is to date the best application of blockchain.

For the fact Bitcoin operate on blockchain network there might be no need arguing about which comes first since both are actually relevant in the new era of digital transperancy both for defi projects and other trust system that operates on the blockchain technology network.

Blockchain as a case study doesn't just Operate on Bitcoin alone meaning it still has other projects that relies on it for transperancy and as such Bitcoin is one of those projects. Bitcoin might have given birth to blockchain technology for which other projects emanated from but the bottom line remains Bitcoin operate on blockchain network.

It is very common that people tend to go after bitcoin but they hardly understand why it is so valuable and the technology that drives it. The main reason why bitcoin exists is because of the blockchain. I believe it is because of a lack of knowledge and awareness among the people and investors.

many people think that blockchain and bitcoin are the same, they make an analogy between the two terms, just different words with the same meaning. indeed bitcoin cannot be separated from blockchain, because blockchain is a device that can move bitcoins with the advantages of a blockchain system

When Satoshi Nakamoto created Bitcoin, there was no concept of blockchain. In Bitcoin's white paper, the concept of blockchain has never appeared. Bitcoin is a peer-to-peer electronic cash system. This system is what I call the Bitcoin network. The concept of blockchain technology is a technology that later generations discovered that the Bitcoin network is unbreakable, and then refined on the basis of the principles of Bitcoin technology. We can't just say that the blockchain is in the front and Bitcoin is in the back just because there is the concept of blockchain in the back.

I totally agree with this view Bitcoin comes first and blockchain comes later.The blockchain technology is based on the underlying technology of Bitcoin .Also is based on  the stability and reliability of its technical logic.The opposite view that block chain comes first and Bitcoin comes later  is just the excuse used by many governments to ban Bitcoin.

The corporations are rapidly distancing themselves from it. Last i heard, both IBM and Microsoft have cut down their teams that were working on their "enterprise" blockchain solutions. The reason, i think, is not that blockchain is mostly snake-oil as you say, but because blockchain isn't meant for corporations.

Blockchain as a technology is effective and can truly create network effects but the problem is that Bitcoin has become the sole aspiration for everything and everyone. Everybody wants to be the next Bitcoin. Nobody wants to explore that how some other application built on an open, decentralized network can benefit society. We no longer see those initiatives in blockchain because making a lot of money through false promises has become so much easier.

The problem isn't that blockchain is snake-oil, the problem is that blockchain is too good for its own good.

from the information I got that Blockchain was the first to be created compared to Bitcoin. Blockchain was first created by someone famous as Satoshi Nakamoto in 2008, then Satoshi Nakamoto implemented Blockchain as a core component of Bitcoin. With Blockchain, bitcoin became the first digital currency that was able to overcome double-spending without the need for a trusted authority and has been the inspiration for many other applications.

Wonderful reply. This is what I want to express in this article. Before the real birth of Bitcoin, the existing human society did not master the blockchain technology. When Bitcoin was born, various hackers attacked the Bitcoin network. But to this day, the Bitcoin network is still operating normally. The underlying logic of Bitcoin technology has withstood the test. Therefore, more technical personnel conducted in-depth research on the implementation of Bitcoin technology, and summed up a technology from it, and named it blockchain technology. So I say that Bitcoin is the father of the blockchain, there was Bitcoin first, and then the blockchain.

Buddy, use less of punctuation marks so your posts could be read and understood without much difficulties. Bitcoin and blockchain aren't similar, Bitcoin is a currency while blockchain is the platform that makes the operation of decentralization possible.

Actually they both need each other as without the development of Bitcoin it seems impossible before to get a decentralization system functioning nevertheless the blockchain technology can function without bitcoin but that can be said about the later currently unless some new technology comes up in the future.

Bitcoin was the first project that implemented the blockchain technology successful, resulting to a decentralized currency that we have inferior coming up today in their numbers. Without the success of Bitcoin, I doubt there would have been all the hyped surrounding the blockchain technology.

The blockchain industry need all of them to grow, not only Bitcoin but Bitcoin is a backbone of this industry.

It is not correct for all blockchains. Monero is a private and anonymous blockchain. Governments want to trace and break privacy, anonymity of Monero transactions but they have yet succeeded.

Each blockchain has different usecases and a cryptocurrency is part of one blockchain. Altcoins can have no usecases if they are scam coins.

I used to think the same thing before but as I learn more about blockchain tech and how it is highly adapted by other projects, I doubt that what you are saying is true. Blockchain is something that other peoples project can modify while bitcoin is a project that runs in blockchain technology. Blockchain can standalone in itself with other projects

Let me answer together. Yes, we look at Bitcoin and blockchain from now on. They are combined and cannot be separated. They are perfect as a whole. What I want to emphasize here is the birth process of Bitcoin and blockchain. Before the birth of Bitcoin, there was no blockchain in human civilization. Neither the concept of a blockchain nor a complete blockchain technology product exists. When Satoshi Nakamoto created Bitcoin in 2009. Different scientific and technical personnel conduct in-depth research on the realization principle of Bitcoin. It slowly verified the feasibility and unbreakability of Bitcoin technology. Then, according to the realization principle of Bitcoin, this technical system was extracted step by step, and it was named the blockchain. I believe that some of the early participants of Bitcoin may understand the specific meaning I want to express. In 2013, no one mentioned blockchain at all. The concept of blockchain has been widely mentioned around 2015.

They go side by side. And there's no need to argue which comes first because they are invented on the same period. The other one will not exist without the other. And what is the significance when the other comes first? I don't think there's really point of arguing on this topic. Blockchain is the digital ledger of transactions so it is important for bitcoin itself. This will give you idea what are the early transactions made in btc network. Without blockchain, we won't know the history of bitcoin.

as a beginner I am still very new to what is called.bitcoin and block.chain. and I will learn how from the performance of these.two things.although we all know that this has.almost similarities.that can.be used for both, because blockchain.will not emerged.without bitcoin because bitcoin is fundamentally.very different from the internet, blockchain.was created.to keep track of bitcoin activity.

It can't be separated. Bitcoin and Blockchain or altcoins with Blockchain have an attachment and need each other. Blockchain becomes a ledger that will record every transaction made and the transaction is transparent and can be seen by anyone and cannot be deleted. Blockchain is like an Android system where applications run on that system. Bitcoin is arguably only one application of the blockchain system and there are many other applications ( Altcoins).

In the past few days, I also learned about Bitcoin. Not long ago, I also thought about the relationship between Bitcoin and blockchain. Many novices should not know their relationship.
This is what I learned: Bitcoin and blockchain are complementary, and if there is no Bitcoin, no one knows about the blockchain. Many people now talk about blockchain when they talk about digital currencies. When it comes to blockchain, Bitcoin will definitely be talked about. In 2009, the Bitcoin created by Satoshi Nakamoto and the genesis block were naturally linked together, forming a whole with two sides. In a sense, the coin chain is integrated. This theory is particularly reasonable.

Well, blockchain was created for the purpose of keeping trqck record on bitcoin activities. I guess there is no need to elaborate which comes first because in the first place blpckchain is already part of plan to integrate in bitcoin system. The project bitcoin has been plan prior to implementation and also had made some thorough run through before it has been introduce to public for consumption or put to good use.

Wonderful reply. In my opinion, before Bitcoin was really born, there was a corresponding technology. Whether it is database technology, distributed storage technology, or encryption algorithm technology. They all exist separately as a single technology. But Satoshi Nakamoto combined them with the concept of decentralization through consensus algorithms. Eventually Bitcoin was created. This is the creation from zero to one. The difficulty here is not the technology to build Bitcoin, but the ideas and concepts that combine them. This requires a multi-disciplinary knowledge reserve. Then three to five years later, the Bitcoin network has withstood various attacks and tests. Its underlying technical logic has been verified. Then mankind summed up a distributed storage and governance technology based on the technical characteristics of Bitcoin, and called it a blockchain.

In my opinion bitcoin and blockchain are two different things, because internet is a way through which you can take a lot of information and blockchain is not in a sense like that. So, in early time the bitcoin was not taken as serious as today, therefore I thought you are right.

The term "Blockchain, the techology" was mostly introduced to capitalize on the idea of Bitcoin without actually acknowledging Bitcoin. The reason for this is that Bitcoin by it's very nature can not be controlled by a single party, and that's something neither governments nor cooperations like. They don't want to use a platform, they want to be the platform. If cooperations could they'd force people on their own version of "Internet, the technology" and arguably they've largely succeeded.

But as ranochigo pointed out, blockchains, or rather blockchain-like structures have existed for quite a while before Bitcoin. Git, for example. But nobody would call a Git Repository a Blockchain because that'd be stupid. Or rather, because it's missing a critical component, that is, a decentralized and secure consensus algorithm such as Proof of Work. But most "Blockchain, the technology" projects seem to largely ignore the consensus part of the equation, hence why they fall a bit flat.

Bitcoin is not a first digital currency but it is the first successful cryptocurrency and truly decentralized. It changes the world and bring blockchain technology to the world.

Bitcoin means decentralization with public ledger that is done on a blockchain. They are mutually interacting with each other and make up Bitcoin. The blockchain technology and its ecosystem that we have seen nowadays were contributed a lot from Bitcoin and satoshi. Others are early core members and early bitcoin adopters.

Yes, there are some articles referenced in the Bitcoin white paper. I have read all these articles. But these materials are fundamentally different from the ideas expressed by Bitcoin itself. Satoshi Nakamoto magically combined some mature technologies and created Bitcoin from 0 to 1. The difficulty here is not to implement the Bitcoin code, the most difficult thing is to build the ideas and concepts of Bitcoin.

In the first five years or even ten years before the birth of Bitcoin, Bitcoin was only recognized by a very small number of geeks. In the eyes of most government agencies and ordinary people, it is a bubble and a scam. Until these two or three years, more and more people discovered that the Bitcoin network was almost destroyed or breached. The value of Bitcoin has been revealed to the world step by step. More and more people have begun to recognize Bitcoin. At the same time, the vast majority of people who buy bitcoin now do not understand the intrinsic value of bitcoin, they just want to make money from bitcoin.

In addition, what I call Bitcoin software is perfect  from the beginning. The main point is that its core technical framework has not undergone major changes until now. Whether it is distributed nodes, encryption algorithms, or consensus mechanisms, Satoshi Nakamoto planned at the beginning of the white paper. It has not changed to this day. Of course, some minor code bugs must exist in the software development process, but this does not affect the perfection of the Bitcoin system at the beginning of its design.

The code behind it isn't obscure nor that complicated. The concept is what matters, the code really doesn't. If you want to dabble in it, you have to have some degree of technical competency. Even to this day, most people either have zero understanding or some misconceptions about how it works. The fact that it was conceptualized so early basically means it would've been developed with or without Bitcoin, sooner or later. Whether it gets any adoption is an entirely separate issue, considering the cost of implementing it, it probably isn't very great for the companies without all the PR. Cryptocurrencies popularized the idea of it and companies are jumping on the hypechain, that's all.

Obviously, there would be no way to tell whether my statement is true or not.

Blockchain wouldn't appear without Bitcoin. It would be nothing more than a very obscure programming pattern barely used anywhere, and the only people who know about it would be some guys from stackoverflow. It only exists as we know because of the huge marketing campaign created by altcoins and blockchain companies that tried to sell it as the next big thing.

Actually it is not true, if you look back and try to search you will find that the concept of the blockchain technology was created way back in the early 1990sn, bitcoin is a use of this network, as bitcoin is cryptocurrency that was first made its first transaction back in 2009, and up until 2014 blockchain was only used for cryptocurrncies like bitcoin and ethereum, where it became usable in a wide variety of things and it still has a potential to grow even more.

I think the two are inseparable otherwise you will likely not have safe/good Bitcoin. It's more like fruits and the nutrients in them ... You can't say I like the fruits but not the nutrients. The fruits were built for the nutrients for our enjoyment and health.    Those who dislike the nutrients will probably drain the fruits off nutrients and fill it synthetic stuff or things that fruits are not designed to contain

Not really. The idea was actually born quite a bit earlier, in the late 90s. Just check the references that Satoshi made in the whitepaper. Bitcoin was never really treated as a scam, if you actually read the whitepaper then you'll know what's going on.

Satoshi didn't conceptualize the idea of it, he basically combined the various ideas; b-money, distributed ledgers, etc into Bitcoin AND made it work. I have no doubt that even without Bitcoin, Blockchain would've appeared sooner or later but without all the hype. Blockchain is mostly just a snakeoil. Corporations love to use it with their sentences, makes them sound cool and brings some nice PR.

This isn't accurate. Satoshi consulted several people who conceptualized something similar. Check out B-money.
Come on, check the code from the first iteration first. It is neither complete nor perfect.

Oh boy. This is wrong too.

Your answer is exactly the question I emphasized. First of all, Bitcoin is fundamentally different from the Internet. What the Internet mainly does is the transmission of information, and what Bitcoin realizes is the transfer of value. They are two completely different dimensional technologies. At the same time, blockchain and Bitcoin were not born at the same time. In my opinion, in the first three years or even five years before the birth of Bitcoin, there was no concept of blockchain at all. At the same time, Bitcoin was treated as a scam at that time. Until various technical personnel continued to study the technical principles of Bitcoin, and finally extracted the blockchain technology from the realization of Bitcoin.

In my opinion, the internet was the beginning of the technological revolution and at that time, it was thanks to the internet that new ideas such as BTC were born. in 2009 Satoshi Nakamoto launched BTC with its blockchain network. BTC is the first pioneering virtual currency and with the blockchain has been perfected to help BTC move in the blockchain space with ease. In other words, BTC and blockchain were born together to interact and support each other.

We see Bitcoin and blockchain in many places, but most of us do not know their relationship. Coupled with media reports from different governments, it is easier to confuse the relationship.

We can often see this media view: Bitcoin uses blockchain as the underlying technology. Seeing this sentence, for the vast majority of ordinary people, they will definitely confuse the relationship between Bitcoin and the blockchain. They would think that blockchain technology was born first, and then Bitcoin was born. This is why many governments ban Bitcoin but not blockchain. They will advertise that blockchain is a very good and very advanced technology. But Bitcoin is a very risky asset and a bad thing.


Now that I write this topic, I just want to emphasize this point: Bitcoin was born first, and then blockchain technology. Rather than the first-born blockchain technology, the second-born Bitcoin. I think this is a very important point, and it is necessary for us to spread it to all friends around us who are concerned about Bitcoin.In 2009, Satoshi Nakamoto created Bitcoin and the Bitcoin network began to operate. Then in the following three to five years, scientific and technological personnel in different countries analyzed the underlying technology of Bitcoin. Discovered the stability and reliability of its technical logic, and finally concluded the blockchain technology based on the operation law of the Bitcoin ledger.

Without the birth of Bitcoin, there would be no current blockchain technology. This is also fundamentally different from the birth of the Internet. The birth of the Internet was gradually iteratively born in the thirty to fifty years of the development of human computer networks. Yes, it was born by iteration, not overnight. It is gradual and gradually improved. It is gradually established with the upgrading of technology from generation to generation.But the birth of Bitcoin is fundamentally different. Bitcoin was created by Satoshi Nakamoto like a pioneer. Before the birth of Bitcoin, there were also some related research and explorations of electronic money. Satoshi Nakamoto also explored them to some extent. However, the principle and implementation of Bitcoin itself are fundamentally different from them. At the same time, from the first day of Bitcoin's birth, its code logic itself is almost complete and perfect, even impeccable.

Until today, Bitcoin has still not found any major loopholes, and the Bitcoin network has been operating stably for 12 years without major upgrades. This is almost a miracle in the history of software changes. It is precisely this that supports the entire prosperous crypto ecosystem.Therefore, Bitcoin is the perfect gift that Satoshi Nakamoto brought us. It can be said that Bitcoin is the father of the blockchain, not that the blockchain is the father of Bitcoin.

This is my opinion, what do you think?