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Topic: Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today13 December 2017 (Read 600 times)

sr. member
Activity: 476
Merit: 256
don't worry. Bitcoin price has fluctuated sharply in recent days. because the price rises too fast and strong so we need to have the appropriate price adjustment. and today the price of Bitcoin has jumped back, this makes me not worry about the price decrease in the previous days

sr. member
Activity: 882
Merit: 282
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary
I did not see this but thank God Bitcoin is now above  $17,500. The recent upward movement is a plus to bitcoin and I think we should hope that bitcoin hit  $20,000 before 31st of this December. I think the corrections we are going to  have is going to be a light one and price may not get back to  $15,000 again before end of this year. Bitcoin making a corrections should be something we should expect as that empowering it to gather a momentums for future movement.
member
Activity: 102
Merit: 10
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary

doping 1000$  must be like correction because price now about 16,000$ and this less than 20% or even 30%

why we all see bitcoin will rising up all time and never bacd down or correction.
sr. member
Activity: 2016
Merit: 283
today price bitcoin increase again, that's a good news right? just keep hold your bitcoin and don't panic selling.. rising and falling bitcoin prices are common, so don't panic and don't scared.. keep optimist bitcoin will reach $ 20K until the end of year..
perhaps that is a good news to everyone. And that's right we need to hold and dont sell early cause this is not the right time sell anf as we noticed  bitcoin still fighting to surge maybe soon it will jump again to 18k before year end.  Unless if there's new correction again to stop bitcoin .but im hoping that it will never happened again.  Instead it wil continue to increase. 
full member
Activity: 490
Merit: 100
today price bitcoin increase again, that's a good news right? just keep hold your bitcoin and don't panic selling.. rising and falling bitcoin prices are common, so don't panic and don't scared.. keep optimist bitcoin will reach $ 20K until the end of year..
sr. member
Activity: 281
Merit: 250
Bitcoin has dropped by more than $1,000 in the space of 24 hours in the past. Heck, BTC has both risen and dropped by amounts greater than that. BTC isn't predictable and the recent price swings have shown this. Don't take the change as a big indicator. It's way too early to tell anything.

Never lose time with bitcoin drops and price decrease. It will dominate the whole structure forever. Try to find promising altcoins which will bring you nice return in short term.
full member
Activity: 266
Merit: 151
First crypto index traded as a token!
Nobody here worries about this small drop of just $1000. It's a normal thing, happens all the time. With even bigger swings. But as a matter of fact, we see some stabilisation. After the CME launch of bitcoin futures next week, there might be a rise. Then after a week or 2, a correction will follow. The price has gone up too fast, that's only because big investors pumped like crazy. Soon they will cash out, that's when we should be worried.
member
Activity: 98
Merit: 10
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary

bitcoin increase more than 8,000$ not dropped 1000 USD
it is few hope to down more
legendary
Activity: 3192
Merit: 1348
Bitcoin has dropped by more than $1,000 in the space of 24 hours in the past. Heck, BTC has both risen and dropped by amounts greater than that. BTC isn't predictable and the recent price swings have shown this. Don't take the change as a big indicator. It's way too early to tell anything.
full member
Activity: 350
Merit: 106
Bitcoin is very volatile asset and there are many rapid ups and downs. If these kinds of move are scary you, It may be the case that bitcoin is not an appropriate asset for your character. When you hold BTC you have to be ready to bear huge loses. 
member
Activity: 182
Merit: 10
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary

Here comes the drop. There is nothing to worry about, just chill. Think it is a blessing in disguise since bitcoin is giving us the opportunity to buy before it pumps so high and so fast again.
legendary
Activity: 1526
Merit: 1179
That's exactly what makes me wondering as these kind of price pump and dump is common with crypto coins but why do these users lose their mind with a simple price pump as bitcoin has surged for more than 100% in last couple of months but worried about just a dump of 10% which is jut temporary
The reason for people to start panicking is that they didn't buy at previous levels, but just at the recent peak. From there they don't care about how much Bitcoin has gone up in value prior to their buying moment.

The only important thing for them is how the market moves once they finally bought Bitcoin, which is at peak levels mostly. If the market starts dropping, they fear that they will lose more, and for that reason start selling.

It's an attempt for them to prevent even higher losses, but they always buy back in once the price has gone back up again, which only results in them ending up with a lower number of coins ~ buy high sell low is destructive.
hero member
Activity: 826
Merit: 501
Nothing to worry about. Since the price is so high it has become "normal" that the price drops or rises a thousand of dollars or even more is not that dramatic. So that is no reason for panic but the great ground for trading,,especialy on daily basis and to make nice profit. Always look at the price dumps as opportunity to make more money in the future.
There's no significant issues that creates panic right now because we are now experiencing a normal fluctuations trend, and I think it has been stabilized at $17k to $18k. That's why the profit isn't just nice but more than it can be describe as brilliant, and the long term holders now been looking after how they will dump 40% of their investments.  But not the total of the profit being capitalized from their fiat savings being converted to btc, well that's a clever idea about spending what is left after saving.
sr. member
Activity: 644
Merit: 252
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary

Because of the fork yesterday, I already expected that bitcoin price will drop. I am not monitoring bitcoin price since last week, but after reading your post I am not surprised at all. Like of what everybody believe, I also believe that the drop is normal. Drop is not only for any other crypto currencies out there but also for bitcoin. It is possible because the price of bitcoin is not fix at all.  The only impossible is, if that bitcoin will only pump and will not drop. So I think you or we do not need to be scary, and no need to worry. Let us just ignore this thing because sooner or later it will recover and pump again.
full member
Activity: 518
Merit: 103
I think this will depend on how we are as investors, if you are so happy if you see the value of your bitcoin going up around 10 folds, but will be worried with a drop of 1000 usd, i think bitcoin may not be the right investment for you, bitcoin's value is a record high, not all assets or currencies had attained a value like what we are seeing wih bitcoin right now, people who are new to bitcoin needs more learning experience and realize that a drop of 1000 usd will be a normal thing in the upcoming months, since bitcoin is highly volatile, they may need to increase their knowledge and not just go with the trend.
sr. member
Activity: 623
Merit: 262
When worried about such drops all you should do is zoom out the chart and look at the bigger picture. Then you'll understand that there's nothing to be afraid of, it's normal for all crypto currencies to do so.

That's exactly what makes me wondering as these kind of price pump and dump is common with crypto coins but why do these users lose their mind with a simple price pump as bitcoin has surged for more than 100% in last couple of months but worried about just a dump of 10% which is jut temporary and there are panic sellers and panic creators instead of focussing on these kind of dumps we should look at a broader picture as you said like whenever there is a dump it is followed by a pump.
member
Activity: 198
Merit: 10
When worried about such drops all you should do is zoom out the chart and look at the bigger picture. Then you'll understand that there's nothing to be afraid of, it's normal for all crypto currencies to do so.
legendary
Activity: 2912
Merit: 1068
WOLF.BET - Provably Fair Crypto Casino
Nothing to worry about. Since the price is so high it has become "normal" that the price drops or rises a thousand of dollars or even more is not that dramatic. So that is no reason for panic but the great ground for trading,,especialy on daily basis and to make nice profit. Always look at the price dumps as opportunity to make more money in the future.
hero member
Activity: 1666
Merit: 753
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary

No idea what the reason is. Probably just panic dumpers dumping their coin because they haven't seen profit for a few days now or profit takers wanting to make money and pull out their investment from bitcoin because it rose so fast.

Either way, i'm holding for now. $20k is going to happen soon and it's just a bad idea to dump this soon i think.

A $1k dump is actually only around 6% right now which isn't that big of a deal honestly, especially for cryptos since they are just so volatile. No need to panic at all.
newbie
Activity: 27
Merit: 0
If only the crazy bitcoin up, in fact, more than a short period of decline even more horrible
sr. member
Activity: 588
Merit: 257
Bitcoins rolldown by $1000 is not a big deal. After a high of $17300 last week, these corrections are expected. Even dropping by $1000 bitcoin has recovered the same day more than $900. This is a normal process. Actually it is chance to earn more money for bitcoin traders. Bitcoin traders buy on every fall and sell on every rise. When China banned bitcoin, it has dropped nearly 20% a day but recovered soon and now crossed a record mark.
newbie
Activity: 101
Merit: 0
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary
I think this very normal to crypto currency, don't panic, consider carefully about market, volume etc
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 0
I think it is just temporary since there are sayings that bitcoin is a bubble. Not a good time to lose hope because there are many supporters of bitcoin that could buy and make the demand high again.
newbie
Activity: 9
Merit: 0
i only can enjoy the other's happiness. (others = people who play with it)
member
Activity: 119
Merit: 14
Kawa
While Bitcoin price remained unchanged, all top altcoins are growing! Looks like futures return Bitcoin on the earth.
If BTC price won't grow in the coming days it will be bigger drop.
newbie
Activity: 4
Merit: 0
trader needs to pay holiday few next weeks, drop 1000 usd is not big deal. big thing will happen next years, many of us predict that bitcoin hit 132216.00 CNY by 2018
newbie
Activity: 182
Merit: 0
I just want to say this is wrong thinking, check toady it's to be 1 bitcoin = 16000 usd above & price increase continuously i think bitcoin will be 20000 end of this year.
full member
Activity: 336
Merit: 102
No reason to worry now. $1000 drop is less than 6% or $17k. For bitcoin it is perfectly normal, just a minor correction. I was not worried by the previous one, which was more than 15%. Moreover, I was relieved to finally see it after that crazy uninterrupted surge from $10k.
full member
Activity: 798
Merit: 104
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary
By now it shouldn't be stranger to see Bitcoin drop by as much as $1000 within 24 hours, because it does climb up by even much more within the same time frame. At the high it presently is, profit taking looks appealing and a good number of such is enough to pull the price down, so it's nothing to worry about, Bitcoin is rather becoming more formidable with each passing day.


I don't think there's something we should worry about this price drop. Bitcoin has climb at its peak and even it will drop it is still expensive over dollars. For sure in the coming days it will rise again because its price is really fluctuating. Just monitor its chart every now and then.
newbie
Activity: 66
Merit: 0

sometimes the price will go up and down depending on how interested in a coin. here the pump happens on bitcoin and now there is a dump but if meliht from last price it is down but all will be back as before so do not worry for it
hero member
Activity: 1134
Merit: 517
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary
By now it shouldn't be stranger to see Bitcoin drop by as much as $1000 within 24 hours, because it does climb up by even much more within the same time frame. At the high it presently is, profit taking looks appealing and a good number of such is enough to pull the price down, so it's nothing to worry about, Bitcoin is rather becoming more formidable with each passing day.
sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 250
Why is there something to worry about? I would worry about the fact that it increased by 3000 $ in a few hours a few days ago. This is quite normal and will even drop if we see the price 4x lower. The sometimes volatile spike and then very quickly makes me more nervous than the fact that it fell by 1000 $ somewhere. Also remember that Rise does not exist without Fall .... Bitcoin has its ups and downs but generally nothing to worry about because its price goes up in the long run. I bet at this time next week it will not only recover but also achieve a new all time high. Obviously the price has reached the resistance and therefore the pullback and drop of $ 1000 while it is around $ 16K + this is a regular occurrence in the possible trading after a pullback or this price correction will break the resistance and push up to $ 20,000 in the next few days.
sr. member
Activity: 244
Merit: 250
Lol. More possible if BTC will grow up to 20k, than drop to 1k)
member
Activity: 322
Merit: 12
The universal answer to this topic (for any crypto really)

"Look again"
Need to be patient and positive  as Bitcoin will surely gain it's price back and will continue to go beyond expectations.
hero member
Activity: 2604
Merit: 816
🐺Spinarium.com🐺 - iGaming casino
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary

you don't need to worry about this, you only need to wait for the price increase back soon. yes, bitcoin has dropped $1000 but I am sure that there will be a time for bitcoin to get increase again. I think this is just another correction for the price and many investors trying to buy bitcoin at the price now. soon the price will increase and I hope that you can buy bitcoin too at the lower price.
full member
Activity: 329
Merit: 100
AGATE
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary
Do not worried when bitcoin is dropped due to hard fork is coming DEC 15. After the hard fork bitcoin will pumped again.
sr. member
Activity: 420
Merit: 250
As the price goes higher and higher, you will see larger and larger swings. It's better to observe those things in percentage. At the moment focus seems to be on Ethereum which has seen the tremendous growth in the past few days so my guess is that those occurrences are related.
full member
Activity: 1022
Merit: 127
Make a difference, make it better.
Where have you been these last days, bitcoin went from $11,000 to 17000 in less than a week and then back to 14000 in 24 hours. It seems that is pretty normal that fud and corrections and realization of profits in the market play its role on driving the prices up and down, since there is not a regulator, the market is the only authority that makes the prices and the high volatility.
newbie
Activity: 6
Merit: 0
We don't have to worry about it now, because the volatility of Bitcoin is being something normal ... in the previous two years a drop or a raise of 100 US dollars matters a lot for the Bitcoin community but nowadays 1000 USD is really nothing because we are sure that it will raise again according to some research made by some specialists.
When we have to worry ? When it is about 5000 USD drop or more the danger bell in beating.

That's fine dude, it's just a correction.
newbie
Activity: 30
Merit: 0
It is always funny to see that 1000$ price increase in a day is taken as a normal thing, but same drop is considered as something which cannot happen. We are at very high price level with indicators shouting that correction move is inevitable. In the long term BTC will obviously go up, but I will not be surprised if we see price below 5k$ in the upcoming months or even weeks. Crypto are well known of their high volatility and you cannot be scared if you see your balance in $ decrease by more then 20% in one day.
copper member
Activity: 630
Merit: 2614
If you don’t do PGP, you don’t do crypto!
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary

You are absolutely right.  Bitcoin is worthless!  SELL!  SELL!  SELL!  Or better yet, send your bitcoins to me; my address is in my signature.  I will not be scared to hodl them.

What you really need to understand is that Bitcoin doesn’t give a damn about you, the special little snowflake.  Bitcoin doesn’t need you.  Big money is moving into Bitcoin now.  If you don’t like Bitcoin, then dump it now and go be poor.  Someday, you will miss Bitcoin.  Bitcoin will never miss you.
member
Activity: 299
Merit: 10
Bitcoin has its ups and downs but it's generally unnecessary to worry because its price goes up in the long run. Do not look at the price, but its presentations. This is very normal in the crypto world sometimes above or below within 24 hours need not worry.
full member
Activity: 476
Merit: 100
www.daxico.com
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary

Nothing to be scared off even if it plummets down to 8,000$ because bitcoin has known for coming back whenever its price is compromised. If that ever happened, i will wait until when it will stop from falling down before I invest so i can buy more with my money at a lower price so that the moment bitcoin starts to rise, it will be a paradise.
newbie
Activity: 196
Merit: 0
This happens all the time, watch the chart and you will see. A few days ago it dropped $3k in a very short time. The chart is very volatile and some people even say that with the CBOE futures it is going to get even MORE volatile. If you have weak hands you probably dont want to sit behind your screen all day checking out the charts, if that is the case you are better off forgetting about it.
full member
Activity: 462
Merit: 100
https://saturn.black
Hi, probably I am from a parallel universe, at 14 December we have here Bitcoin still at ~16K $ how you doing there? We have here Donald Trump as president of the Unated States, I swear I am saying true, I know you dont belive me, but there is no time for this, just quickly tell me to buy or to sold, please!

Ok, just have watched the news, this isn't funny indeed.
member
Activity: 546
Merit: 24
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary
Don't be afraid that bitcoin price will loose its value. In economics, it is too normal. Law of demand and supply indicated that the price will be affected when demand and supply move. If you are going to analyze this, it decreases 1000usd because of its demand goes down and the supply can sustain the demand. We have not to worry. Bitcoin is under control.
full member
Activity: 812
Merit: 101
I've predicted it, that at the end of the year bitcoin will decrease. so I need not worry.
my consideration is year-end holidays, so it will be a lot of bitcoin users who sell it for a vacation.
and when after the holiday is over, bitcoin will go back up again.
full member
Activity: 234
Merit: 100
It's turtles all the way down!
Not really anything to worry about, most coins (especially bitcoin) fluctuate an easy 10% a day at least because of how volatile this is. Now, if there's a constant net fluctuation down, then I would start thinking about changing your investment strategy. But even then, bitcoin is a beast and hardly anything has made a dent in the price recently.
legendary
Activity: 2478
Merit: 1360
Don't let others control your BTC -> self custody
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary

So scary, a currency has lost like 6% of its value in a dump, but it has gained over 100% in this last week alone! They say there are no stupid questions but there certainly are some childish and naive ones. If someone gives you $100 and a week later comes and says he's in need and wants $10 back, should you be worried, or happy that you still got $90 for free? Damn you scared cats!  Grin
newbie
Activity: 64
Merit: 0
That is nothing to worry about, BitCoin has his ups and downs. I believe it will hit more than $20.000!
full member
Activity: 759
Merit: 105
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary
What a lucky day for those people who bought at that day they can get a good profit today. That was a quick buy and sell though, whoever that person is he knows how to trade well. It takes a good instinct for that someone who can guess the possibilities of the price.
member
Activity: 195
Merit: 10
A few hour bitcoin go up and down for this is because when bitcoin go up people selling their bitcoin. But when go down people buy bitcoin to wait for some growth and do the same process.
full member
Activity: 210
Merit: 100
We don't have to worry about it now, because the volatility of Bitcoin is being something normal ... in the previous two years a drop or a raise of 100 US dollars matters a lot for the Bitcoin community but nowadays 1000 USD is really nothing because we are sure that it will raise again according to some research made by some specialists.
When we have to worry ? When it is about 5000 USD drop or more the danger bell in beating.
full member
Activity: 228
Merit: 100
The universal answer to this topic (for any crypto really)

"Look again"
member
Activity: 267
Merit: 10
Bitcoin has its ups and downs but is generally unnecessary to worry as its price goes up in the long run. after a continuous uptrend, it is fair if a bitcoin price correction has occurred. But this is not to worry about, because the price will rise again.
sr. member
Activity: 518
Merit: 250
That phenomenon is not actually new because it seems very normal.But according to its value graph.It didnt even drop at that rate.Maybe before posting such stuff,you must provide some proofs.And also,how come the "1000" usd will be back again in 16000?Maybe theres something unreliable with your post.By doing some research about its graph,the most highest drop in deceber 13 2017 was 15,000 usd.
member
Activity: 630
Merit: 24
This is a normal process,Just  imagine,In another situation everyone would be millionaires.The market of digital currency depends on many things.The main factor:people and sometimes they are afraid of losing money and they make decisions without the  real facts, they just listen artifically created news and cann’t differ what is truth,but this is not only thing, defining of price.sometimes,there are real problems and I hope it will be fixed.
sr. member
Activity: 2842
Merit: 326
Vave.com - Crypto Casino
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary
Definitely the price has hit a resistance and therefore pullback and drop  $1000  while it ranges at $16K+ this is a regular occurrence in trading probably after this pullback or correction the price will break the resistance and push up to $20,000 in few days ahead.
sr. member
Activity: 742
Merit: 253
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary
Why is there something to worry? I would worry about the fact that it rised by 3000$ in some hours some days ago. It's pretty normal and will be even annivercary if we see price 4x lower. These sometimes stable and then very quick jump makes me more nervous than the fact that it fall by 1000$ somewhere. Also remember that Rise doesn't exist without Fall....
very nervous when looking at rising bitcoin prices, and then falling within just a few hours, a high risk at stake on current crypto trading. very in pity if we are stuck in the vortex of unstable prices,
sr. member
Activity: 616
Merit: 250
CryptoTalk.Org - Get Paid for every Post!
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary
You better get used to it, the price of the coin will only get larger over the years. The people that have Bitcoin will not be that sorry when they see the price increase.
sr. member
Activity: 294
Merit: 252
LOL

Were you not scary and worried when bitcon went up by $3,000 in 24 hrs ?  Grin Grin
 and why now ,when it falls just a $1000
Anything too much and too soon..will not sustain
member
Activity: 574
Merit: 11
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary

nothing critical, be calm
sr. member
Activity: 382
Merit: 250
Well, after continuous upward trend, it is quite natural that correction in the bitcoin price has taken place. But these is not need to worry about, as the price would go up again.


I reckon it will hit 20 000.00 This year still, and if not because of those selling before Christmas, maybe January/February.
Last weekend the price took a nasty correction already so i thought it was done.
Lets see how it goes.
Its struggled to pass 17k and remain there this week.
member
Activity: 172
Merit: 11
Some owners of large amounts of bitcoin may also be the owners of large amounts of altcoin, they sell bitcoin solely to buy altcoin, in the hope that their altcoin has a stable price and rises in price from the previous level.

Do not panic and be surprised at the bitcoin price changes, the more panicked and bandwagon sell bitcoin it will also affect the bitcoin price as well.

Stay calm and endure, but all also depends on you, follow-up panic can make you satisfied or even vice versa Smiley
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 100
Decentralization shall be the end of the Old World
Its half a trillion dollar worth of market cap now,  with Bitcoin dominating 300 billion,  there are many people in the world who are constantly buying and cashing out. These fluxtuations are nothing compared to the market cap.

Also,  if you have noticed, since bitcoin is stabilizing over the last couple of days, money is pouring back again into altcoins.
hero member
Activity: 2352
Merit: 905
Metawin.com - Truly the best casino ever
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary
Why is there something to worry? I would worry about the fact that it rised by 3000$ in some hours some days ago. It's pretty normal and will be even annivercary if we see price 4x lower. These sometimes stable and then very quick jump makes me more nervous than the fact that it fall by 1000$ somewhere. Also remember that Rise doesn't exist without Fall....
sr. member
Activity: 700
Merit: 275
I don’t think that there is anything scary in that one. The price has been fluctuating like this since few weeks. I mean we have seen more than 2K USD plus and minus in one day so it’s nothing as compared to that one. I believe you are desperate about the prices a lot due to fluctuating nature and your investment at risk.

Just to motivate you, keep your investment in place as bitcoin may come down but it will go even higher than current rate surely.
newbie
Activity: 99
Merit: 0
Ignore the Drops, I bet It will increase. Its better to hold as much coins as you can They will rise no doubt. Bitcoin is Unstoppable Wink
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 0
What has me worried is how stable Bitcoin has been the past week... Look at the chart, it looks broken from Bitcoins usual wild price swings.
member
Activity: 378
Merit: 17
Well, after continuous upward trend, it is quite natural that correction in the bitcoin price has taken place. But these is not need to worry about, as the price would go up again.
full member
Activity: 182
Merit: 106
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary

Bitcoin has its ups and downs but it's generally nothing to worry about because it goes up a lot over the long term. I bet by this time next week it will not only recover but also reach a new all time high.
member
Activity: 129
Merit: 11
Blockchain enthusiast
Don't look at the price, but the percentage. And this is very normal in crypto world. 15 % up or down in 24 hours shouldn't worry you.
sr. member
Activity: 382
Merit: 250
hi , is there something to be worried about here since Bitcoin has dropped 1000 USD today , very scary
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