Topic: Bitcoin miners energy usage has exceeded 50%, where is Elon? (Read 495 times)

Correct hehehe. I replied with Elon's picture to express this, however, I am not quite certain why it was deleted by a moderator. Someone reported it, I reckon. Moderators much of the time are not very strict in the forum.

Also, this picture is very annoying which makes this also very funny hehehehe.



In any case, the hate on cousin Elon's appears to have started after his guest appearance on Saturday Night Live. If anyone has seen it, he clearly made it appear that our community is only made up of nerdy cryptobros and moonbois.

I see no harm in getting people reminded that Elon is full of shit and that he is an opportunist who doesn't care about bitcoin but for some reason you get triggered every time someone mentions him.


We certainly don't and that's one of the things that annoys me aroiund here, mods rarely (if ever) merging duplicate threads.

Anyone can open a topic about anything, including the OP about his great idol who did so much damage to Bitcoin with his senseless decisions, but the fact is that such discussions lead nowhere because we are talking about a man whose word is not something to be trusted and that is proved countless times.

In addition, do we have to have one topic in each board about whether Mr. Mars will change his mind or OP could learn one of our local sayings that says "promise makes a fool happy".

Will Elon Musk keep what he said or not?

If he truly gonna change his mind after this event, I can say that he is really a man of his word and people shouldn't bash him for sharing some opinions regarding cryptocurrencies and economics in general because he is just sharing based on his experiences. But if he once again makes some invalid reasons, then we can say that this guy doesn't seem to deserve to earn our trust because what he is doing is just mind manipulation and all he thinks is the advantage of his company and investment, he doesn't deserve to advise people based on his personal propaganda.

But given the context, it's not about "changing payment methods", nor is it about "the increasing ease of buying Bitcoin today". It's about efficiency. Why would I, a fiat earner, buy Bitcoin merely to use it to purchase a car? I could buy the car using my fiat directly. Why the few extra steps unless I'm incentivized to do them, like perhaps a 30% discount on the car if I use Bitcoin?

A case when a person has no choice but to use Bitcoin is if his/her computer is compromised by ransomware which requires payment in Bitcoin. Or if a Heroine addict can't get Heroine anywhere except the Dark Markets, would be another good illustration of payment in Bitcoin. Another case would be if someone doesn't have a credit card, but he/she wants to gamble in an internet casino. But Tesla, or an iPhone, or another common item that can be purchased for fiat, those markets are very efficient that there's no need to use Bitcoin.

or probably Elon will then say that when it is 90% then he will buy.

We all know Elon and he is kind of unpredictable. Maybe he said that but he didn't mean it or let's say he just forgot about it and was not able to read the news about Bitcoin. Whatever it is let's just wait a couple of months or years to see if Elon will see that news because he is a busy person and for sure he has no time for this information unless someone tells him otherwise. We know that he has bigger projects outside of cryptocurrency so let's just wait and see if he will really buy.

Musk is sending satellites into space all the time because his Starlinks are getting destroyed. I've read that he's lost more than 200 of them already. How long is this going to last?
I say sending electronics up to burn in the atmosphere is stupid, just like sending cars into space.

Making fake "green" cars that use power cells made in China that cannot be recycled is also stupid. Musk acts like he's so good for environment. Were those Teslas that caught fire and burned good for air, Mr Musk?

Musk isn't going to endorse bitcoin, unless he sees a way to promote himself and his company in this.

Why do we even endorse the opinion of a person who sent a car in space just for fun, and who was deliberately trying to convince people to buying a dog coin? As if he's the good paradigm. He accepted bitcoin for Tesla and something miraculous happened. Who gives a shit.

But then, yeah. We remind ourselves that the overwhelming majority is into it for the sweet profit, so Elon's opinion is important.  

Of course the ideal situation is when you also earn Bitcoins, e.g. if your salary is partly paid in BTC, and/or if you are a service provider accepting BTC. Then the "Bitcoin circulation" aspect would come naturally: You could spend a part of the Bitcoins in things like a Tesla car, and you'll get them back (albeit getting back what you paid for a car it may be quite slow, but Tesla cars aren't directed at the lower middle class). I'm aware that this isn't the norm today.

Another case: Particularly in market situations when you have already made some profit with your BTC, it makes sense to spend part of them if you can satisfy a necessity, like a car. I think particularly producers of high-priced goods like cars can direct their efforts to that public: early adopters or those who are "in" at least since the bottom of the last bear market. You'll not always have (in addition to the BTC) the fiat to spend it on such a good, and in this case it may make sense to simply spend the BTC, and if you like to buy back some BTC, then you can do it.

I don't think "changing between payment methods" is that much of a hassle. People do it all the time, transferring between different bank accounts, using ATMs, etc, so re-buying BTC if you have a good exchange partner isn't much of a problem. And again: if you're a Bitcoin bull, strengthening the currency ecosystem is adding value to BTC, so why not simply do it? You can even get social prestige (e.g. posting your Tesla you bought directly with BTC on Twitter, pardon X).

And there is another aspect: Buying BTC has become increasily easier than selling them, due to AML/KYC regulations (proof of source for BTC you received, etc.). So if you have some BTC from old investments in ICOs or altcoin trading for example, which are difficult to track because the exchanges where you traded don't exist anymore, then a purchase of a good may be a good way to spend them. That may be not the case with cars as car sales are regulated in many countries, but with other goods it isn't a bad idea. The re-bought BTC instead can be tracked well and it will be much easier to provide a proof of source for them.

As you said, Elon will probably ask for a lot of data and have it checked. There are some names or institutions that will ensure movement in times when the market is so stagnant. I think Elon is one of these names. That's why such names are always needed in the crypto market.

Elon will not have as big an impact on crypto as before, but I still believe he will be an important figure for crypto.

I think Musk is likely to question the data and ask for a thorough review or something before jumping into Bitcoin again. To be fair, while I want to believe more than 50% of mining is eco-friendly, I'm not sure if I do. It's great if this is the tendency, but t's unclear from the article what sort of data was cited, where it came from, how accurate it might be etc.
In any case, I think Musk has lost much of its influence after all the atrocities he did to Twitter, so I don't think his opinion would have as big an impact on the price as it used to.

People are spending their bitcoins on all kinds of stupid things (e.g. ordinals) so make no mistake, there would be those interested in spending some on Tesla too. Hell, when I imagine an average crypto millionaire, I have a picture of a douchebag driving Tesla in my head.


This summer I financed a long and very active vacation that lasted a month strictly via bitcoin. So yeah, people are willing to spend bitcoin on all sorts of things.


I might missunderstood OP, but I think this topic is more about calling out (and making fun of) Elon than begging him to accept bitcoin as he promised.

But that would be inefficient. Why re-buy the "wasted Bitcoins"? Why not merely use the fiat to directly buy the car instead of using your Bitcoin, then replacing the Bitcoin? That's why it doesn't make sense that users do "Fiat -> Bitcoin -> Purchase" unless you absolutely have no choice but to use Bitcoin, or if you truly earned the Bitcoin you spend, like Laszlo.

This forum is becoming some kind of fun club of Mr. Mars, and it seems to me that some people have his picture above their bed and pray to him every night to post some tweet and say that he loves Bitcoin again. It all looks so pathetic that one wonders if we have sunk so low that we are calling on various rich people to save Bitcoin because without them it will die 499 times in the last 14 years.

Will people ever understand that there was never even a question about where the energy comes from, that is, how green or dirty it is - and even if we could prove without any doubt that Bitcoin uses 100% energy from renewable sources, that would not change anything in the minds of those who have some completely different goals and don't care at all about something like Bitcoin.

Why not, my holiday is over, and I'm looking at 8-hour flight back home in the evening so I have all the rights to be so, right?

The thing is I don't like disinformation.
I don't care if it's from the guys I like I hate it, if somebody can't find real arguments and data and has to resort to this kind of bs, then sorry, call me a hater but I won't applaud knowing I'm a lied in my face and shut up just because it's good for the price of my investment.
When I know Mara is managing 2cents/kwh because it has bought an entire coal plant, when Riot is buying half of the entire generation from a gas powerplant, when Stronghold is burning coal residue and tyers at its newly acquired powerplant while no f*** large farm is running entirely on solar or wind then don't come with this kind of greenwashing at me.

This is the same bs as Google being carbon neutral because...it pays for carbon credits. Lol!


Why not?

Nothing is wasted for nothing if Bitcoin network becomes bigger and stronger with time.

The Pizza of bitcoins trade of laszlo is only part of Bitcoin history but it is important to help Bitcoin gaining noise and attention in early years. It helpfully contributed to Bitcoin survival and with time, laszlo's trade and other traders, initiatives in community combined together to make Lindy effect bigger. The effect is know with gold and now we are witnesses for it with Bitcoin. The effect is mentioned in The bullish case for Bitcoin that should be one of bedside books for Bitcoiners.

I'd liked the article linked in the OP to be referenced with more data. However it mentions Daniel Batten, who conducted the Beest study from February which comes to similar conclusions (52%, considering renewable + nuclear) and is not based on Bitcoin Mining Council data but simply enriches the CCAF study with some independent research.

Generally however I don't think there's much to doubt about the general order of magnitude of the numbers. In the worst case we'd be talking about a few percentage points, but the 37% CCAF reported is very likely outdated.

HODLers can instantly re-buy the "wasted" Bitcoins. Or maybe they want to take some profits with less KYC hassle involved. They can re-buy partially then. In any case, they're strengthening Bitcoin's "use as a currency" ecosystem and make Bitcoin's value proposition stronger, which could benefit them in the long term.

Think about Laszlo in 2010. He "wasted" lots of BTC but strengthened the ecosystem, and I'm sure he got the 10.000 BTC back very fast (via mining, etc.).

 

It's not 2012 anymore when people were so idealistic and never thought Bitcoin would hold actual value of more than $20,000 per coin. Why would any HODLer waste their Bitcoin on a car that would merely start to depreciate in value right after it goes out of the factory? Tesla might probably convince HODLers if the company gave a 50% discount for all car purchases through Bitcoin, but to offer the same deal as fiat, DEFINITELY NOT. My Bitcoins are more valuable than any car for sale.

Musk never cared about bitcoin or its energy consumption or the environment for that matter. All he cared and still cares about is more power and more money. He started making positive statements about bitcoin because he thought he could influence the market and make a profit, and similarly he reversed his position and started spreading FUD because he again thought he could influence the market and make profit. Same as his involvement with shitcoins such as Dogecoin.

Besides, I don't even think people would even use the bitcoin payment option even if they wanted to buy Teslas
Bitcoin is much too valuable to exchange for a car. It's not like they are cheap either, you'd have to pay 2-5 bitcoins!

Elon Musk was used in this discussion because he promised that his firm would start accepting Bitcoin if mining becomes environmentally friendly. The OP quoted a research that has proved that miners are diversifying to more green energy making mining less harsh to the environment. So the discussion now is will Elon fulfill his word to start accepting Bitcoin?


Elon Muak is not a man that keeps his word,  I support that the community shouldn't take his word seriously. He publicly said he would never sell his coin but he did. He promised to step down as CEO of Twitter if a poll result suggested that but he failed to keep his word. Any investor who is focused on manipulating the market because of profit-making is not needed in the Bitcoin ecosystem.

@Ale88. Did much of the bitcoin community not cheer for cousin Elon when he declared that Tesla was buying bitcoin and also announced that it would accept bitcoin payments? What happened? Do we not like cousin Elon anymore?

Also, if acceptance of bitcoin will not help increase sales and revenues of any retailer then it would not be seriously accepted. It might be larply accepted, however.

Guys, seriously, why are you so obsessed with Elon Musk? The only thing he does is manipulating the market, we really don't need people like him in the bitcoin community. Of course it would be great to have some big retailer accepting bitcoin but if the price we have to pay is dealing with a crazy guy, no thanks, I prefer things to move slower.

Hehehe do not be so serious and angry. No one is expecting cousin Elon to change his mind and immediately orders his executives in Tesla to begin accepting bitcoin as payments again. The reason is Elon knows no one would buy a Tesla or any car using their bitcoin unless it was a larpy publicity for bitcoin to hype their investment.

I believe he knows better than we do  .  I agree that it is not a marketing tool but Elon Musk just made Bitcoin his marketing tool and there are lots of naive people who fell for it.

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Let us give Elon Musk some time to comprehend the current hash rate and realize his promise but I do think he will keep his promise though.  He is a businessman so I think he will only do things that will benefit his pocket and accepting Bitcoin will give his company a new set of audience.

Musk only does what is profitable for him. Even if he is buying do you really think he will announce it publicly? That could lead to a pump and he will be forced to buy at a higher price. So rest assured, most probably he will secretly buy and then announce he bought after some time. After the price will go up he will also secretly sell again and tweet something negative about Bitcoin. Been there done that.

I don't see how Elon is responsible or inclusive in this issue of miners energy and the percentage exceeded. Sincerely, mining should be consiya skill and for some a job or should I say a source of income that is dependent on output.

Elon is merely interested in how to invest in building apartments on Mars at the moment and anything that offers no future value to him is worthless. BTC offers him value but he doesn't want to acknowledge that hence why he launched his Doge coin and perhaps stopped Tesla from accepting BTC as payments for transactions.

Well he hard his time in the past and that was when headed the announcement of his company's removal of Bitcoin as payment for tesla products,  but then also a short while from that time thenthing happened,  bitcoin price recovered significantly and when Elon musk sees that he can't manipulate Bitcoin to cash in on his gains.

He shifted attention to dogecoin we're he hard a bag load of the coin and went ahead to name himself dogecoin daddy,  but he couldn't achieve such freedom with Bitcoin and that is why he most time speaks ill of Bitcoin even without any knowledge of how bitcoin works.

I wonder why exactly do you think that he doesn't understand it. Just because he sold it last year? Also, we can't push others from using BTC just because we don't like someone.

Mr. Musk should stay away from Bitcoin as long as he does not understand it. Bitcoin is not a marketing tool for rich idiots.

I don't know, but I personally feel that bitcoin doesn't need Elon or tesla to succeed, and neither does it need any of these two to trigger the next bull run.

Even if bitcoin sustainable energy increases by 100 percent, we don't need Elon or tesla to start accepting bitcoin to make bitcoin grow again, after all, since several months ego Elon announced that tesla will stop accepting bitcoin for tesla purchases, bitcoin after dropping for a while have continued to grow, this means that, the future or bitcoin is not in the hands of one man or one company.

I find it interesting, and maybe even suspicious, that this "revelation" from Bloomberg is coming out now. Given how quickly things change in the modern economy, its hard not to wonder why this data was released and what it was meant to do. Analyst Jamie Coutts might seem to paint a bright picture of Bitcoin's future, but we should be careful.

Could this be a cover for bigger players in the background who are quietly pulling the strings and changing how people see things? Many people were surprised when Elon Musk tried to get into the Bitcoin market before and then quickly left. If Tesla jumps back on the train, it could be part of a larger, more complicated game. My advice is to doubt everything, especially if it sounds too good to be true.

This is indeed promising news and as an advocate for EnvirOmint protection, I am delighted to learn it. I hope that the trend towards Bitcoin miners using renewable energy sources continue to grow, further reducing environmental impact of cryptocurrencies mining. Regarding pledge of Elon Musk to purchase Bitcoin once renewable energy usage exceeds 50% mark, we are all looking for his actions to validate his commitment. Historically his involvement in crypto industry has led to market fluctuation, and his exit from positions, raising questions about sincerity of his intentions.

Elons public announcements were done to deflect peoples attention. he did not want to be accused of inciting pumps in a market due to favouring bitcoin, whilst secretly he does and always has favoured it

the thing is he "emissions" commandments were empty of content because on a percentage bases. DOGE (the other coin he mentions) uses more % of fossil fuel based energy than bitcoin ever did

DOGE is based on home hobby mining where residents have no control of their energy sourcing. people do not move home just to mine a meme coin. however even as far back as 2013 many ASIC farms purposefully choose locations to start ASIC farm mining bitcoin due to the energy source reasons

That's a good question, but not the right place to ask. I hope he will be true to his words, even tho I'm not gonna spend my BTC there ( I simply don't have enough ).

Let's wait and see what Elon says after he reads information from analysts from Bloomberg.
But I doubt that Elon will return to supporting bitcoin and start accepting bitcoin payments again, especially since we know that he always easily replaces his statements.
However, if he does receive bitcoin payments again, is he prepared for the current fluctuations in bitcoin prices?
If he really wants to collect more bitcoins from sales, he can return to accepting bitcoin payments and not care about bitcoin price fluctuations.
Besides, it seems that Elon is now relaxing and enjoying his weekend by playing poker

I agree he has the proven capability of influencing the crypto market, if he honors his word then the current market condition will change. We can only wait and watch when Tesla will start accepting Bitcoin. If he is bluffing then the Bitcoin community would look like fools who were begging him to accept Bitcoin.

He is also a businessman and a good one, he will look into the current scenario before taking any decision. The positive outcome of this news would be that Bitcoin emission is going down and the hash rate is increasing. A piece of positive news now might trigger a short-term bull run before the halving.

Why would Elon even care?
I love how we have 100 topics about this but nobody actually reads the article, because the title is enough, right?


So it's an analyst expressing his opinion, there is no real data, just claims based on other people's claims!

Kind of ironic how everyone can get excited about this when just the other week we had this:
A crypto-mining company in Pennsylvania is seeking to burn tires to produce bitcoin, prompting an outcry from residents and environmental groups.

If the so-called Bitcoin mining council would really wanted to prove they used 50% renewable they would have done a simple thing, talk bout this this:
https://www.warren.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/Seven%20Cryptominers%20Responses%20to%20Senator%20Warren.pdf

Stronghold:


Greenidge


The others didn't want to mention it are claimed they are just busing energy provided by the grid and!

So, in a letter addressed to a US Senator, not a single member showed any proof of mining directly with renewables, all the renewable energy comes from the grid, so it would be simply stupid at this point to call an industry greener than another when they are consuming the same thing.

Elon is stupid cunt but this greenwashing must also stop!

This was the very statement made by Elon Musk 2years today about his decision to stopping the use of Bitcoin for an alternative emission free cryptocurrency for buying of his Tesla motors due to the negative effect of fossil fuel used by Bitcoin miners on the environment. So if this news happens to be true that Bitcoin now uses a more cleaner and safer energy source for mining Bitcoin (i.e. use of Solar energy & wind). Then, i see no reason why he @ Elon Musk would decline to accept BTC for the second time, even though he is known to be the godfather of Dogecoin & meme tokens.

Elon is a businessman at heart. I understand that he takes whimsical decisions at times but he understands business. So he won't do any such things that could potentially hurt Tesla. Accepting Bitcoin as a payment method has a downside to it due to extreme price volatility and that's a huge risk. Is he ready to accept the risk - that's the question!

Let's hope he delivers on his promise! But I don't see this happening anytime soon. It requires a lot of changes in Tesla if they prepare themselves to accept Bitcoin as a payment method.

Bitcoin is here since 2009 and where was Elon Musk in 2009 and a few years later?

He was not in Bitcoin community until the last bull run since 2020 or a bit sooner but he observed Bitcoin silently. He made noise in the last bull run but his love is not only for Bitcoin, but Dogecoin and more related to money. He loves money, what can help Elon making more money, he loves it.

Elon is also very chaotic with his mind and he does not care what the crowd talk about him. Expecting Elon to come back and response about what he said in the past is unrealistic and even he come back, answer, it will be just non sense answer.

As much as Elon is advocating for cleaner green energy from the crypto energy, this isn't only about bitcoin getting onboard but looking at the use of sustainable energy so that the next generation doesn't suffer because the damage to our environment is extensive.

And btw, this carbon emissions/sustainable energy fight is one sided...Elon Musk's EVs are the culprits for this knowing very well electricity generation has a Carbon footprint trail and with increased production and use of these vehicles means more damage done to our environment and the man needs to walk the talk.

Otherwise, Elon being the type that loves the controversy am pretty sure he will oblige to accept BTC payments with his companies.

Last time I remember someone named John Mcafee claimed to do something rarely seen by any living human being, I don't know if he managed to do that? Lol.
One thing about rich people you should know, they would never do anything to endanger their wealth, in fact all they do is making sure to increase their wealth and get richer.

Do you think someone like Musk, talk about stuff randomly with no agenda? He already knows all the analysis data about bitcoin energy usage for the next 10 years, so when he promises you something it's because he has a plan to make more money for himself!

Fuck this cunt. Bitcoin don’t need Elon’s money. Elon needs bitcoin. He may not need it now but when the whole world adopts it, he won’t have a choice. However, Elon is not dumb too. He will probably buy btc before the mass adoption happens. Actually he probably already has thousands of coins in his personal stash and since he doesn’t have to declare it to the public, we will never know the truth. One way or another, Elon is pretty insignificant in the grand scheme of things. If he wants to get piece from the action that’s fine but if he doesn’t, he may duck right off.

I don't know if Elon cares. Or should we care whether he cares or not? Or it's perhaps better if Elon leaves Bitcoin alone.

It seems that all these calls on Elon Musk to take a look at Bitcoin mining's energy usage once again and reconsider accepting Bitcoin payment once more for Tesla or even reinvestment on Bitcoin are merely subtle ways of begging, "come on Elon please, push the price up!" It might not be about adoption or whatever.

There were negative remarks made against Elon just as there were against Buffet and Bill Gates and others who prefer not to shill for Bitcoin. Sometimes, they seem nothing more than bitter attacks against rich personalities whose money won't bring Bitcoin's price higher.

As a matter of fact the entire scheme of if to accept Bitcoin or not is a profit based one.with Bitcoin being volatile digital asset, Elon will definitely estimate his chances of profit or loss if he adopts Bitcoin for purchases and if these odds according to his thesis will not yield profit he will not accept Bitcoin.

I guess it's obvious that Elon Musk just used Bitcoin as his clout for his company during our the last bull run. Take advantage of it and then later sells their stash to take over Twitter, now X.

And it's not rocket science though, we have our own thread here: by @fillippone, Debunking the "Bitcoin is an environmental disaster" argument.

And I doubt that this whole sustainable energy mix for bitcoin will be the next narrative for the next bull. It might be the whole "Bitcoin Spot ETF approvals" in the future that we might see waves of institutional investor pouring their money in the market. Or even rich oil money from Middle East could also be possible.

If he's a man of his word, just give it time. I'm pretty sure Elon Musk is not the type of guy to watch Bitcoin hashrate actively and is updated with news like this, or Bitcoin-related news in general.

Or maybe he's going to make some excuse like the data isn't accurate lmao.

This is only according to an analyst from Bloomberg. However, if this is confirmed real information then the question from the community should be will cousin Elon support his statement and begin accepting bitcoin payments in Tesla again?

Tesla also should start buying again hehehe.



The Bitcoin network, with its continually increasing hash rate, has seen a corresponding decrease in its emissions intensity, according to recent reports from Bloomberg. Analyst Jamie Coutts explained that this trend is contrary to most other industries and could potentially trigger the next wave of institutional investment.

Data cited by Coutts on Monday revealed that the sustainable energy mix for Bitcoin has been steadily rising since 2021 and now exceeds 50%. This increase in sustainable energy use has resulted in a slower growth of emissions relative to the network's expansion. Coutts noted that the evolving relationship between Bitcoin network growth and the global push to transition from fossil fuels could "catalyze a wave of institutional and even sovereign investment capital."

Read in full https://finance.yahoo.com/news/bitcoins-sustainable-energy-mix-surpasses-060305672.html