Bitcoin split risk, a real question | Bitcointalksearch.org

williamuk

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Quote from: babar123 on July 16, 2017, 03:46:34 PM

Hi, I wanna know, if bitcoin would split, and if you would ahve a short in any exchange like kraken or coinbase, during the split, how would u close laterthis position, ? would you need to rebuy the both chain ? or only one ? im not sure to understand that, thanks for your help (i just short to hedge my btc in wallet)

I can't remember where I read about this but you end up short both coins. You need to check with the ppl who lend you the coins you short

williamuk

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Quote from: eindbaasje on July 16, 2017, 04:04:52 PM

What about Tether USDT. Could it be the ultimate safe-zone? Any tether can be exchanged in BTC available during a dip. Just saying, it's there for everyone to use.

I used tether during the last bitcoin fall and it worked fine for me. Never off more than 1% from cash

JNiks_ZLisa

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Quote from: babar123 on July 16, 2017, 03:46:34 PM

Hi, I wanna know, if bitcoin would split, and if you would ahve a short in any exchange like kraken or coinbase, during the split, how would u close laterthis position, ? would you need to rebuy the both chain ? or only one ? im not sure to understand that, thanks for your help (i just short to hedge my btc in wallet)

https://poloniex.com/press-releases/2017.03.17-Hard-Fork/

deisik

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Quote from: mrcash02 on July 16, 2017, 03:58:54 PM

It's adviced to withdraw all your funds from exchanges before August 1. With ot without HardFork you should do it.

Each exchange/site/wallet/service will act as they want about the situation. Some of them can choose what fork to follow (don't giving you the chance to choose it), others can give you the chance to choose what fork you want to follow...

It's complicated especially if you don't understand the technical part, so the advice from the experts of this forum and of general BTC experts is to withdraw all your Bitcoins to a desktop wallet, any wallet which you have access to your private keys, keeping you money safe.

Or you can take the safest route

And convert your Bitcoin stash to fiat (say, the US dollar). Somehow keeping bitcoins even in cold storage doesn't look like a very safe approach at all to me. Indeed, no one will be able to steal your coins and deprive you of the coins from any alternative Bitcoin blockchain if such should emerge, but you are here for keeping your wealth intact, right? And with Bitcoin, that may no longer be a viable option. And as a somewhat risky way, you can choose a major altcoin. I, for one, chose Litecoin specifically with this aim in mind

senin

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Specialists advise to abstain from transactions and store crypto currency in their wallets, from which there are personal keys. If the money is on the stock exchanges, it is also better to transfer it to such a purse. It's safe to protect against all surprises.

ImHash

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Quote from: mrcash02 on July 16, 2017, 05:43:55 PM

Lol, didn't know about it. so will I have my Bitcoins "doubled"?

Example: I have 1 Bitcoin now (pricing $1800), after the hypothetical HardFork I will have 1 BTC on chain A (pricing let's say $2000) and 1 BTC on chain B (pricing $500). Then will I have $2500 total to spend as I want?

I think that I heard some where that Satoshi will perform break dance for us if we order him to do so Cheesy

But seriously bitfinex will give a bonus of 2 virgins on every bitcoin you deposit there plus the same amount of BTU.
Nothing of sorts, bitcoin's value will decrease under $1500 and the other coin will have a price not greater than $400 and as the current price going down those estimated prices will follow the same pattern.

European Central Bank

legendary

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Quote from: eindbaasje on July 16, 2017, 04:04:52 PM

What about Tether USDT. Could it be the ultimate safe-zone? Any tether can be exchanged in BTC available during a dip. Just saying, it's there for everyone to use.

tether is a junk token created by a company with history of creating junk tokens. no one should be putting any faith in it.

as for the original question, exchanges won't list an offshoot chain without replay protection. if that isn't there it could turn to dust. i think enough people are incentivised to keep it all on one chain even if they hate each other. the alternative is oblivion.

mrcash02

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Quote from: darkangel11 on July 16, 2017, 05:27:06 PM

Quote from: mrcash02 on July 16, 2017, 05:00:30 PM

If so, you don't need to worry because your Bitcoins will be like freezed. You will have Bitcoins on both chains, exactly the same amount you had before. Let's say you have 1 Bitcoin, so you will choose if you want 1 Bitcoin on Chain A or Chain B, when you choose one of them all your Bitcoins on the opposite will disappear.

No, coins never disappear. You can spend on one chain or on both at the same time!
If you don't make a choice you'll probably be spending on both chains, but you can use only one of the chains if you like and coins on the other one won't vanish. You will still have them, but each chain will have its own independent value, so it's possible that one of your coins will be worth $500 and the other one $2000.

Lol, didn't know about it. so will I have my Bitcoins "doubled"?

Example: I have 1 Bitcoin now (pricing $1800), after the hypothetical HardFork I will have 1 BTC on chain A (pricing let's say $2000) and 1 BTC on chain B (pricing $500). Then will I have $2500 total to spend as I want?

darkangel11

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Quote from: mrcash02 on July 16, 2017, 05:00:30 PM

If so, you don't need to worry because your Bitcoins will be like freezed. You will have Bitcoins on both chains, exactly the same amount you had before. Let's say you have 1 Bitcoin, so you will choose if you want 1 Bitcoin on Chain A or Chain B, when you choose one of them all your Bitcoins on the opposite will disappear.

No, coins never disappear. You can spend on one chain or on both at the same time!
If you don't make a choice you'll probably be spending on both chains, but you can use only one of the chains if you like and coins on the other one won't vanish. You will still have them, but each chain will have its own independent value, so it's possible that one of your coins will be worth $500 and the other one $2000.

Haladay

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Quote from: babar123 on July 16, 2017, 03:46:34 PM

Hi, I wanna know, if bitcoin would split, and if you would ahve a short in any exchange like kraken or coinbase, during the split, how would u close laterthis position, ? would you need to rebuy the both chain ? or only one ? im not sure to understand that, thanks for your help (i just short to hedge my btc in wallet)

If you ask to me, the short positions are very risky in cryptocurrency market. You can get USDT if you don't wanna go with bitcoin but getting short instead will bring you a huge risk.

You can get USDT and wait for price to get low so that you can buy more bitcoin with your capital.

babar123

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are you sure ? i thought that it was different with etc and ethereum, and u had your coin in both chains, at the same moment... so if bitcoin would split you would get two bitcoins, one on each chain ?it is kinda complicated... i am not sure what you say about choosing one chain and the other getting erased is right

mrcash02

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Quote from: babar123 on July 16, 2017, 04:33:14 PM

what i say is : if you buy one bitocin and u put it on an electrum personnal wallet, then you short one bitcoin on an exchange. How can this be risky ? the bitcoin on your wallet will give you any chain you want from it, if i understand right. And the short, that you will have to rebuy, will be cheaper than sum of the both chain in any case, in worst case coinbase could ask to repay both chain, price of chain1+ price of chain 2 ? but it wasnt the case whne etc happened, because noone knew etc would be created right ?

so, whats the risk exactly with having one bitcoin shorted on exchange during 1 august, what could happen as a matter of fact exactly

I think this "short" thing isn't clear... What do you mean by "short"?

Don't know if I understood, but seems you think your BTCs in exchange will turn into money (proportional to the price on that moment), so you fear when you want to choose one Bitcoin chain you will have to buy it and depending the price you will have less Bitcoins than before. Right?

If so, you don't need to worry because your Bitcoins will be like freezed. You will have Bitcoins on both chains, exactly the same amount you had before. Let's say you have 1 Bitcoin, so you will choose if you want 1 Bitcoin on Chain A or Chain B, when you choose one of them all your Bitcoins on the opposite will disappear.

babar123

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what i say is : if you buy one bitocin and u put it on an electrum personnal wallet, then you short one bitcoin on an exchange. How can this be risky ? the bitcoin on your wallet will give you any chain you want from it, if i understand right. And the short, that you will have to rebuy, will be cheaper than sum of the both chain in any case, in worst case coinbase could ask to repay both chain, price of chain1+ price of chain 2 ? but it wasnt the case whne etc happened, because noone knew etc would be created right ?

so, whats the risk exactly with having one bitcoin shorted on exchange during 1 august, what could happen as a matter of fact exactly

Iranus

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Quote from: eindbaasje on July 16, 2017, 04:04:52 PM

What about Tether USDT. Could it be the ultimate safe-zone? Any tether can be exchanged in BTC available during a dip. Just saying, it's there for everyone to use.

Tether is weird. It hasn't actually been pegged to USD for ages, and USD isn't pegged to anything either. There's two layers of screwing you over - Tether themselves, and the US government. Might as well just go straight to fiat, or into something safer like precious metals for long term.

Quote from: babar123 on July 16, 2017, 04:03:41 PM

1)I understand, but I dont get what can be the risk in having some bitcoin in your wallet, and same amount of bitcoin shorted on an exchange.

I don't get what you're talking about. Having BTC on an exchange is risky because the exchange is holding it for you. It's likely that the exchange will just give you whichever chain is expected to do better or whichever one you already held, and ignore the other one. You just need to hold your coins in a wallet where you control your private keys.

Quote from: babar123 on July 16, 2017, 04:03:41 PM

2)And i would like to know whats the risk with a short on an exchange during 1 august.

Well, it's mainly to do with what you'd be exchanging the fiat back into when you close your position.

If the exchange lists both chains, great - you can deal with both of them. However, you were probably just shorting the legacy chain, which is where it gets confusing. You'd really be better off not getting lost and closing your position to withdraw your coins to your own wallet.

Quote from: babar123 on July 16, 2017, 04:03:41 PM

3)Also, is it dangerous to have fiat on an exchange during that period ?

Not any more than it would be in another time, as long as you don't have any BTC debts to pay (an open short position).

eindbaasje

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What about Tether USDT. Could it be the ultimate safe-zone? Any tether can be exchanged in BTC available during a dip. Just saying, it's there for everyone to use.

babar123

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1)I understand, but I dont get what can be the risk in having some bitcoin in your wallet, and same amount of bitcoin shorted on an exchange.
2)And i would like to know whats the risk with a short on an exchange during 1 august.
3)Also, is it dangerous to have fiat on an exchange during that period ?

mrcash02

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It's adviced to withdraw all your funds from exchanges before August 1. With ot without HardFork you should do it.

Each exchange/site/wallet/service will act as they want about the situation. Some of them can choose what fork to follow (don't giving you the chance to choose it), others can give you the chance to choose what fork you want to follow...

It's complicated especially if you don't understand the technical part, so the advice from the experts of this forum and of general BTC experts is to withdraw all your Bitcoins to a desktop wallet, any wallet which you have access to your private keys, keeping you money safe.

shams

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I am following this post I also want the answer for this question you raised a good question. But my advice is before this hard fork we should close all the pending positions and wait for the hard fork or anything else happen than start trading again.

babar123

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Hi, I wanna know, if bitcoin would split, and if you would ahve a short in any exchange like kraken or coinbase, during the split, how would u close laterthis position, ? would you need to rebuy the both chain ? or only one ? im not sure to understand that, thanks for your help (i just short to hedge my btc in wallet)

Topic: Bitcoin split risk, a real question (Read 935 times)