Bitcoin Trusts | Bitcointalksearch.org

Aanuoluwatofunmi

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Quote from: tread93 on March 01, 2023, 10:38:55 PM

Just for the sole intent of your heirs, I really wish that there was a solid and fool proof way to leave legitimate BTC to your kids in some custodial solution.

There are many means to doing this but what you should be mindful of is thay why should it be in a custodial means when we have a non custodial channel of doing so, choosing a custodial could means the asset may not get to the intended targeted period before everything got bursted from using a centralized exchange or hot wallet for this purpose, this could be the ever worst decision one could go for in trying to secure the future while it's already destroyed as at present.

ancafe

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Quote from: tread93 on March 01, 2023, 10:38:55 PM

Just for the sole intent of your heirs, I really wish that there was a solid and fool proof way to leave legitimate BTC to your kids in some custodial solution. Something that was protected by like a time vault or something. And I hate to say it but one thing that Yogg did with those time locked bitcoin wallets were really cool, but obviously you see the risk to doing something like that. Anyone who put money into that solution has all their funds locked and Yogg is long gone at this point.

If it allows you to survive another 50 years, but who would have thought that tomorrow, next month or year we will leave the earth. One thing that still makes my mind wonder to this day is how to make it easier for heirs, but actually there is no formula or way they can do it if this happens to us in the near future. Especially for they those who don't know the assets we have and that means from now on we have to introduce them.

Quote from: tread93 on March 01, 2023, 10:38:55 PM

I wrote something on a Bitcoin Life Insurance policy before but honestly what i'm looking for is really more so found in something that of Grayscale Bitcoin Trust. Although that isn't the real deal bitcoin its still nice to have the same or similar market exposure. But even with that, its just lacking so much control. I just wish we had more solutions for use cases like this. Not that it really matters for me. Lord willing in I have a least 50 more years on this earth and by that time maybe we will have figured so much out!

Save phrases and sign messages, sign transactions and whatever you need as proof of ownership we have done, so what if the heirs don't have the ability to reach all of them on that access and maybe for now there aren't many solutions, hoping that in the future it will be easier. If something you think is what we think too because in my opinion the heirs are the full holders of the assets that we have and it should be important for us to think about this solution.

tread93

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Quote from: CryptSafe on March 02, 2023, 07:22:57 AM

Quote from: cryptoaddictchie on March 02, 2023, 12:59:54 AM

I think we cant say passing yo your inheritance secretly isnt legitimate since Bitcoin is decentralized and not property of government though converting it to fiat might require some taxes so its still a buzz fot being legit.

The better way is to teach your children when they become bigger how to use or unlock it on their own so they knew how to get your money when you died or accidentally gone. Or yet tell someone you trusted like close family member to keep that also and give it to your kids if ever something happened on you.

OPs idea is quite alright but I believe as time goes on there would be innovation of such kind. Back to heir to bitcoin, I believe every parents have that one child that is very close to them which they could trust to be able to handle situations in their absence or not. Atleast, telling that child the whereabouts of your digital assets example bitcoin could help alot because if something happens to you as the holder of the asset, your family can be able to assess it and maybe use it for better purpose in the running if expenses but it will be bad that you had such a digital asset and yet no one knows about it after the owner must have passed on and if the family might be in need or support for survival mean while their father had such amount in bitcoin stashed up some where without the knowledge of the family. It is very bad though. I would advise as a father, do well to tell that child of yours dear to you of the whereabouts of your assets so they could keep track of it based on your written instructions.

Agreed, someone would do well with a set of instructions. I still think a treasure map of some sort would be so fitting, leaving clues that only your heirs would know. Some kind of Cypher or something that leads to the "treasure" but then again if you died and they lost it or forget about it then there goes the lot. I do think that in regards to a trust or another way to successfuly transfer the knowledge of the whereabouts of the coins to your heirs securely and successfully thay these types of solutions will come with time.

franky1

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multlsig is bitcoins true "trust"

imagine it as a 4 of 5 multisig(4 out of 5 trustee's)

you have 1 key
your wife has 1 key
child one has 1 key
child two has 1 key
your Will has 1 key

while you are alive if wife+kids combined their 3 signatures. nothing happens
none of your family can sign solo to release funds

but you plus family can move funds
or
your family+Will reading can move funds

obviously while alive you dont sign a tx that unfairly shares funds if family send you a raw tx in their favour(against your favour)
and the Will reader will sign only a tx that fairly distributes funds the way your Will dictates they be distributed

as for "living trusts"
as i said it requires all four people to agree(the trustees) on who the beneficiaries are
no single user can
(well if you made the multisig you too could keep the fullset of keys you give to family)
however for a fair system letting family make their own keyset and hand you only the public key to create the funding address, means no one, including you has the full set of privkeys from the start

m2017

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Perhaps, over time, new solutions will appear in order to pass on bitcoin as an inheritance, but at the moment, I can’t imagine anything else than passing on the seed-phrase. Transfer btc to a trust? Are you seriously? It seems that the stories about the FTX are still fresh in the memory, and you are proposing this. Why deprive yourself of one of the main advantages of bitcoin? No, no and NO. Only p2p: from the owner to the heir.

dimonstration

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Why do you need it if you can just do it physically. Just have a vault and store your private including your will that will state how to use Bitcoin and you want to part it. Get an attorney and notarized it so that it will be legally acknowledged in the future in case the time comes when your heir will use it. A notarized last will that indicate how you split your earnings to the heir and a private key on the vault is already good to have a peace mind on passing your Bitcoin to your heirs.

This is what I’m planning once I already save enough Bitcoin for my future heirs.

kryptqnick

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I see the appeal of time vaults and such, but I'm not a fan of such solutions. The reason is that it's very hard to predict the future and its needs. Who knows, maybe by the time someone is able to access the funds, Bitcoin is made worthless by quantum computing. Or maybe something major happens that disrupts the connections of people all over the world to each other. Or, simpler, there's a family emergency and money could really help to solve it, if only it wasn't locked at that point and unavailable to everyone who might want to use it.
So IMO, it's better to trust people that they won't use the money unless they have to or not give them access at all if you can't trust them with that.

CryptSafe

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Quote from: Smack That Ace on March 02, 2023, 08:04:25 AM

Quote from: cryptoaddictchie on March 02, 2023, 12:59:54 AM

The better way is to teach your children when they become bigger how to use or unlock it on their own so they knew how to get your money when you died or accidentally gone. Or yet tell someone you trusted like close family member to keep that also and give it to your kids if ever something happened on you.

I've used your method for my kids, and it's the best I've found to be reliable, even if we had some legacy services, I wouldn't be able to trust a third party. I can't trust banks or lawyers, I would rather trust my wife and relatives. Currently, my kids are too young to teach him bitcoin, but I have shared all the private keys with my wife and brother, they are the most trusted people with me.

A nice move mate, trust no one but your family and it a must and should be a priority to you. I heard you mentioning lawyers, I do not take such sensitive situations as regards my financial standing with respect to my Crypto assets to Lawyers as they have ways to get at you. I am always very alert of one requesting for my financial details when you are not in any way related to me or my heir. I find that too sensitive to disclose to anyone not to talk of revealing my passphrase or private keys to anyone.

cryptoaddictchie

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Quote from: Smack That Ace on March 02, 2023, 08:04:25 AM

I've used your method for my kids, and it's the best I've found to be reliable, even if we had some legacy services, I wouldn't be able to trust a third party. I can't trust banks or lawyers, I would rather trust my wife and relatives. Currently, my kids are too young to teach him bitcoin, but I have shared all the private keys with my wife and brother, they are the most trusted people with me.

Yes thats better I guess. Blood is thicker than water no matter what kind of trust you gave to anyone reputable as long its involve huge amount of money, you cant trust them. At least with our family members they can be trusted enough not to double cross us especially if we are talking about big inheritance and a skeptical and sensitive case like cryptocurrencies.

Smack That Ace

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Quote from: cryptoaddictchie on March 02, 2023, 12:59:54 AM

The better way is to teach your children when they become bigger how to use or unlock it on their own so they knew how to get your money when you died or accidentally gone. Or yet tell someone you trusted like close family member to keep that also and give it to your kids if ever something happened on you.

I've used your method for my kids, and it's the best I've found to be reliable, even if we had some legacy services, I wouldn't be able to trust a third party. I can't trust banks or lawyers, I would rather trust my wife and relatives. Currently, my kids are too young to teach him bitcoin, but I have shared all the private keys with my wife and brother, they are the most trusted people with me.

CryptSafe

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Quote from: cryptoaddictchie on March 02, 2023, 12:59:54 AM

I think we cant say passing yo your inheritance secretly isnt legitimate since Bitcoin is decentralized and not property of government though converting it to fiat might require some taxes so its still a buzz fot being legit.

The better way is to teach your children when they become bigger how to use or unlock it on their own so they knew how to get your money when you died or accidentally gone. Or yet tell someone you trusted like close family member to keep that also and give it to your kids if ever something happened on you.

OPs idea is quite alright but I believe as time goes on there would be innovation of such kind. Back to heir to bitcoin, I believe every parents have that one child that is very close to them which they could trust to be able to handle situations in their absence or not. Atleast, telling that child the whereabouts of your digital assets example bitcoin could help alot because if something happens to you as the holder of the asset, your family can be able to assess it and maybe use it for better purpose in the running if expenses but it will be bad that you had such a digital asset and yet no one knows about it after the owner must have passed on and if the family might be in need or support for survival mean while their father had such amount in bitcoin stashed up some where without the knowledge of the family. It is very bad though. I would advise as a father, do well to tell that child of yours dear to you of the whereabouts of your assets so they could keep track of it based on your written instructions.

ethereumhunter

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The only thing I can think of if I want to leave the bitcoins as an inheritance to my kids is to keep the wallet keys in a really safe place and teach my kids how to use the wallet, including selling the bitcoins. The Bitcoins that are in the wallet will be safe, no one will know but myself, and no one will be able to access the wallet except me until the time comes for my children to access it later.

I don't want to leave my assets on an exchange, be it a centralized or a decentralized exchange because it's insecure and there's no guarantee that the exchange will stay there until my kids are grown and can use crypto properly. We can prepare a legacy about the existence of bitcoin that we prepare for our children and explain in more detail what we have not explained to our children. I think that's enough because we have taught them basic lessons about using bitcoin.

Cryptomiles1

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I don't know how reliable this would be but is better to have them under your (our) custody and they come of age then we hand them over, inasmuch you are still alive I believe your children would still meet you and grow too well to way you could handover everything to them. Then lastly, engaging family members like mother's, uncle. Maybe when you have gone of age and you think your children are too small or young to handle it, their mother could take or your most trusted relative.

justdimin

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Quote from: cryptoaddictchie on March 02, 2023, 12:59:54 AM

I think we cant say passing yo your inheritance secretly isnt legitimate since Bitcoin is decentralized and not property of government though converting it to fiat might require some taxes so its still a buzz fot being legit.

The better way is to teach your children when they become bigger how to use or unlock it on their own so they knew how to get your money when you died or accidentally gone. Or yet tell someone you trusted like close family member to keep that also and give it to your kids if ever something happened on you.

I think it would be legit as long as you pay the tax for it, it's the not tax paying part that would confuse all the trouble. If you leave your children bitcoin, you could just leave the information with your lawyer, and they are bound by law to protect it, and find some super rich lawyer which would not care about stealing your money, and they could just give it to your children when they die, and then your children could cash it out if they want to.

However, "most" of the time when parents die their children are already 30-40-50 years old, sure there are unfortunate cases where parents die when their children is just a child, but aside from those, it would be smarter to give your kids your wealth when they are younger so they could have a good life.

cryptoaddictchie

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I think we cant say passing yo your inheritance secretly isnt legitimate since Bitcoin is decentralized and not property of government though converting it to fiat might require some taxes so its still a buzz fot being legit.

The better way is to teach your children when they become bigger how to use or unlock it on their own so they knew how to get your money when you died or accidentally gone. Or yet tell someone you trusted like close family member to keep that also and give it to your kids if ever something happened on you.

hd49728

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Not your keys, not your coins!

Quote from: tread93 on March 01, 2023, 10:38:55 PM

Just for the sole intent of your heirs, I really wish that there was a solid and fool proof way to leave legitimate BTC to your kids in some custodial solution. Something that was protected by like a time vault or something. o much out!

With Bitcoin, proof you need is a private key to sign a message, sign a transaction, sweep a wallet, that's all you need as proof of ownership. If you keep your private keys safely, it is against threats and time and it will be reserved for your children as their inherited fortune from you.

Quote from: Don Pedro Dinero on March 01, 2023, 11:18:15 PM

There may not be many solutions today, but I am sure there will be in the future, but as you say, most of them will be custodial. But once inherited, your children will be able to withdraw them to their hardware wallets. If you want creative ideas on the subject that can be applied today, I would move this thread to the corresponding technical board, where I am sure they will be able to help you.

It's terrible if you have an account on a centralized exchange, KYC, leave your bitcoins there and award it to your children. You don't know when you will pass away and when your children will inherit it from you. Meanwhile, that exchange can be seized by government, can be hacked and file a bankruptcy or can make a scam exit.

If those fiascos happen, no way for your children to get those bitcoins.

franky1

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bitcoin has multisig and time locks
no need for a middle man custodian

there are multiple ways to implement things without the need of some bank manager/estate proxy/custodian

...
as for grayscales "trust"
the shares you buy are not btc. heck they are not even fixed to a set value of btc. the value of a share changes too much..

the "trust" has a reserve of ~633k btc. but these btc are not held in some multisig of multiple people who administrate the decisions. they are on >800 legacy funded transactions keys meaning one entity has control to move funds.. thus not really a "trust"

usually a trust is a team of trustee's/chairmen that have to combine in agreement of requested purpose to move funds out to a beneficiary

but GBTC does not do that. they simply have value on legacy keys which coinbase has control to move it at for any reason coinbase could choose/deny, it only takes one person(bad security)

Don Pedro Dinero

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Quote from: tread93 on March 01, 2023, 10:38:55 PM

Just for the sole intent of your heirs, I really wish that there was a solid and fool proof way to leave legitimate BTC to your kids in some custodial solution. Something that was protected by like a time vault or something. o much out!

There may not be many solutions today, but I am sure there will be in the future, but as you say, most of them will be custodial. But once inherited, your children will be able to withdraw them to their hardware wallets. If you want creative ideas on the subject that can be applied today, I would move this thread to the corresponding technical board, where I am sure they will be able to help you.

tread93

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Just for the sole intent of your heirs, I really wish that there was a solid and fool proof way to leave legitimate BTC to your kids in some custodial solution. Something that was protected by like a time vault or something. And I hate to say it but one thing that Yogg did with those time locked bitcoin wallets were really cool, but obviously you see the risk to doing something like that. Anyone who put money into that solution has all their funds locked and Yogg is long gone at this point.

I wrote something on a Bitcoin Life Insurance policy before but honestly what i'm looking for is really more so found in something that of Grayscale Bitcoin Trust. Although that isn't the real deal bitcoin its still nice to have the same or similar market exposure. But even with that, its just lacking so much control. I just wish we had more solutions for use cases like this. Not that it really matters for me. Lord willing in I have a least 50 more years on this earth and by that time maybe we will have figured so much out!

Topic: Bitcoin Trusts (Read 220 times)