So if take this into account, the high withdrawal fee while transferring bitcoin out to electurm wallet again, still the binance is the cheapest option or eXch can be used instead ? The advantage i feel with eXch is that it is an instant exchange where this conversion can be done without moving the coins in and out of exchanges.
Topic: Bitcoin Wallet supporting swaping (Read 348 times)
I think you are aware that trying to facilitate the process of any exchange (including BTC to USDT) without any type of middleman is an impossible task. Using exchanges is one thing but fees involved can take their toll when withdrawing therefore did you consider posting about it in the forum to see if you can make a deal with a reputable member: Currency exchange
After converting to Monero, why would we need to move that monero a bit before moving it back to bitcoin ? Since Monero is a privacy coin, once converted to monero, there should be no way to further trace the coins.
Chainalysis and I think it was German authorities managed to de-anonymize some users who were using monero a few months ago. I don't know the specifics of that case and what private information they discovered, but I think the de-anonymization was achieved by adding malicious monero nodes to the network that those individuals connected to. If you connected to such malicious nodes, you would probably be able to destroy the trail with new Tor identities and making new transactions, hoping that you avoided those and other malicious nodes with the new transactions. Someone who knows more about this will chip in with a better explanation.
Monero is a privacy coin and you can use it to wipe the digital tract of your crypto. Swap bitcoin for monero (not on a CEX), move that monero around a bit, and swap it back to bitcoin eventually (also not on a CEX). It's like mixing your coins and getting completely new bitcoin with a new history.
After converting to Monero, why would we need to move that monero a bit before moving it back to bitcoin ? Since Monero is a privacy coin, once converted to monero, there should be no way to further trace the coins.
Secondly, coming back to OP, converting all the bitcoins (if the number is large) to stable coins can be risky too because the stable coins can't be trusted for long-term holdings. For example, we have tether issues and the risk of de-peg to a dollar is always there. USDC or DAI all come with such risk. We have seen what happened to UST (Luna Stable coin). Also BUSD was considered a good stable coin but is no more.
The problem with XMR is that it is not available on centralized exchanges. Once you convert to XMR, how will you convert to USDT ? OP needs to be in stable coins as he needed to buy back Bitcoin once it crashes.
Monero is available on some centralized exchanges but not all. For example, you can still trade it on Kucoin, Kraken, HTX, Bitfinex, MEXC, Gate.io, etc. But if you are expecting to find it on the likes of Binance or Coinbase, then you are out of luck.The people who swap bitcoin for monero do it for other reasons than those who swap for stablecoins. If you are trying to protect yourself in a bear market, swaping your bitcoin for monero wouldn't make much sense. Almost all altcoins follow the movement of bitcoin, so your monero will fall alongside of bitcoin and maybe even more. This is when it makes more sense to swap to a stablecoin.
Monero is a privacy coin and you can use it to wipe the digital tract of your crypto. Swap bitcoin for monero (not on a CEX), move that monero around a bit, and swap it back to bitcoin eventually (also not on a CEX). It's like mixing your coins and getting completely new bitcoin with a new history.
If you want to exchange assets without a middleman then there are almost no options for that. All of the exchange functions use some company's API inside the box.
In addition to that, I haven't heard of a wallet that allows you to swap programatically. Exchanges support this feature, but no wallet seems to be able to do that.
In addition to that, I haven't heard of a wallet that allows you to swap programatically. Exchanges support this feature, but no wallet seems to be able to do that.
If you want to swap BTC and XMR then just use UnstoppableSwap. Light, efficient, and does the job well.
The problem with XMR is that it is not available on centralized exchanges. Once you convert to XMR, how will you convert to USDT ? OP needs to be in stable coins as he needed to buy back Bitcoin once it crashes.
Centralized exchanges (not limited to Binance) are the cheapest option for you because their business is designed for massive trading, i.e. to buy/sell Bitcoin multiple times, while instant exchange are just exchanges, not meant for trading, so they set high fees and earn money this way.
I suggest you to check fees of each exchange (Binance, Coinbase, Kraken and so on) and make a decision but to be honest, I think you won't find a significant difference unless you deal with hundreds of thousands.
I suggest you to check fees of each exchange (Binance, Coinbase, Kraken and so on) and make a decision but to be honest, I think you won't find a significant difference unless you deal with hundreds of thousands.
The fees for the centralized exchanges are almost similar and i do not think there is any significant difference. I think OP should use binance if he resides outside the US as that is the most trusted exchange. Within the US, Coinbase may be a better option.
I had a dream where I had an electrum wallet with that ability, really 
No, please. Let's leave Electrum be just as simple and good as it is, without any bloatware and unnecessary "features".
If people want centralized "wallets", let them switch there, knowing the big warning sign. And leave Electrum just... be a clean wallet.
1. Not your keys, not your coins.
2. They'll ask you to submit KYC and you know, your information is not protected in their hands.
3. They might freeze your account for no reason.
Now imagine an Electrum wallet where you can exchange Bitcoin to USDT without 3rd parties. How will that technically be possible? I don't know, that's why it was in my dreams
I also had a dream involving the Electrum wallet, but unlike yours, in my dream Electrum had a completely renewed and fluid UI
You were using Sparrow in your dreams, mate, not Electrum. Just kidding.Exactly true, I have no issues with KYC or Centralization, I want the conversion to be easy way and the cheapest. After reading all the replies, i have narrowed down my options, I will either go with eXch.cx (as a few people recommended it) or go with my original option of moving the bitcoins to Binance exchange and perform the conversion (if that is the cheaper). Both of these platforms are trusted but I need your help to find out which is the cheaper of these two options ?
Centralized exchanges (not limited to Binance) are the cheapest option for you because their business is designed for massive trading, i.e. to buy/sell Bitcoin multiple times, while instant exchange are just exchanges, not meant for trading, so they set high fees and earn money this way.I suggest you to check fees of each exchange (Binance, Coinbase, Kraken and so on) and make a decision but to be honest, I think you won't find a significant difference unless you deal with hundreds of thousands.
If you want to swap BTC and XMR then just use UnstoppableSwap. Light, efficient, and does the job well.
OP wants to swap his bitcoin for USDT.Regarding UnstoppableSwap, have you had a chance to use it yourself? I have seen a few recommendations for this service but never heard feedback directly from a person who has used it. I know that it's a standalone app, but does it require that you run your own node(s) to run? It's P2P, but is it similar to Bisq and requires you to be online at all times for your order to remain active and for the trade to go through, and is there enough liquidity there?
Just because a wallet allows you to swap does not mean it's done in a decentralized way.
Exodus, Trustwallet, Bitget, OKX, etc. all these wallets swaps are done using their CEX, or a third party service like Changelly etc.
If you want to do BTC -> USDT in not only KYC free way, but also decentralized, then I believe Thorchain is what you're looking for here. Give it a read.
Exodus, Trustwallet, Bitget, OKX, etc. all these wallets swaps are done using their CEX, or a third party service like Changelly etc.
If you want to do BTC -> USDT in not only KYC free way, but also decentralized, then I believe Thorchain is what you're looking for here. Give it a read.
If you want to swap BTC and XMR then just use UnstoppableSwap. Light, efficient, and does the job well.
So if take this into account, the high withdrawal fee while transferring bitcoin out to electurm wallet again, still the binance is the cheapest option or eXch can be used instead ? The advantage i feel with eXch is that it is an instant exchange where this conversion can be done without moving the coins in and out of exchanges.
I adjusted my reply to your needs. I would never recommend Binance or a traditional CEX over eXch, but you said you don't mind doing KYC and using popular CEXs.Bitcoin transaction fees aren't high right now. If you pay 4-5 sat/vByte, you are probably looking for a confirmation in the next 1-2 blocks unless something changes. Binance should be cheaper. eXch is an instant exchange, but you still have to make an on-chain transaction to deposit your coins to it. The 0.5% you pay is a fee for the swap and the withdrawal transaction that moves the coins back into your address.
Try to calculate all the fees to see what makes more sense to you.
- Consider the initial fee for the deposit transaction to Binance or eXch.
- Subtract 0.1% from the deposited amount as trading fees if you are going to use Binance.
- Subtract 0.5% from the deposited amount as total fees if you are going to use eXch.
- Subtract the Binance withdrawal fee.
Make a similar calculation as if you wanted to swap your stablecoin back to bitcoin. I assume you weren't planning to leave your crypto in Binance in the meantime.
That should give you an estimate of how much you would spend on various fees and which option allows you to save more money.
If you are looking for the cheapest option and you are not concerned with KYC and arbitrary coin freezes, AML and SoF checks, then Binance looks like the better option between the two. Their trading fees are 0.1% or lower depending on your account (VIP) status. At eXch, you will pay 0.5%. You will also have to account for Binance's withdrawal fees, but those are on the lower end on all blockchains except for Ethereum. However, when the time comes to swap your stablecoin for bitcoin again, you will pay much more than needed to withdraw your bitcoin from Binance back to your Electrum wallet.
So if take this into account, the high withdrawal fee while transferring bitcoin out to electurm wallet again, still the binance is the cheapest option or eXch can be used instead ? The advantage i feel with eXch is that it is an instant exchange where this conversion can be done without moving the coins in and out of exchanges.
Exactly true, I have no issues with KYC or Centralization, I want the conversion to be easy way and the cheapest. After reading all the replies, i have narrowed down my options, I will either go with eXch.cx (as a few people recommended it) or go with my original option of moving the bitcoins to Binance exchange and perform the conversion (if that is the cheaper). Both of these platforms are trusted but I need your help to find out which is the cheaper of these two options?
If you are looking for the cheapest option and you are not concerned with KYC and arbitrary coin freezes, AML and SoF checks, then Binance looks like the better option between the two. Their trading fees are 0.1% or lower depending on your account (VIP) status. At eXch, you will pay 0.5%. You will also have to account for Binance's withdrawal fees, but those are on the lower end on all blockchains except for Ethereum. However, when the time comes to swap your stablecoin for bitcoin again, you will pay much more than needed to withdraw your bitcoin from Binance back to your Electrum wallet. Hopefully, you won't have any issues and Binance won't find "dirt" on your bitcoin. But FYI, that can happen depending on where the coins came from.
Exactly true, I have no issues with KYC or Centralization, I want the conversion to be easy way and the cheapest. After reading all the replies, i have narrowed down my options, I will either go with eXch.cx (as a few people recommended it) or go with my original option of moving the bitcoins to Binance exchange and perform the conversion (if that is the cheaper). Both of these platforms are trusted but I need your help to find out which is the cheaper of these two options ?
Well in that case, it will be cheaper for you to move funds on the exchange (binance) and convert your bitcoin into USDT. One thing common in both cases you will have to bear the fee to transfer funds(bitcoins) to binance or exch.cx.
However you will only pay a minimal trading fee in Binance but at eXch, you will charged at least 0.5% or 1% on every conversation. Secondly at Binance or any centralized exchange, you will get the updated current rate of btc but at eXch, the rate of conversion will be slightly lower than the market rate of Bitcoin.
I would not swap Bitcoin to stable coins and hold them, they can always be frozen or banned by regulation, so it's better to use real fiat currencies instead.
No I would not do that because first of all, Bitcoin has no legal status in my country, so converting into fiat means i have to do P2P and get the money in the local bank. Even if i found a safe way to do this P2P, you just cannot trust the local banks to keep a big amount with them. USDT is a much better option in my opinion.
Maybe he wants to save some money on transaction fees and not have to transfer the coins out of his current wallet, pay network fees, pay exchange fees, and again pay network fees to move the coins back into his chosen wallet.
Exactly true, I have no issues with KYC or Centralization, I want the conversion to be easy way and the cheapest. After reading all the replies, i have narrowed down my options, I will either go with eXch.cx (as a few people recommended it) or go with my original option of moving the bitcoins to Binance exchange and perform the conversion (if that is the cheaper). Both of these platforms are trusted but I need your help to find out which is the cheaper of these two options ?
Regarding the OP's question, why do you need to use a wallet that has built-in swap? It doesn't matter if you do the swap through the wallet app or access a swap website/app, you will depend on a third party anyway, since most are centralized.
Maybe he wants to save some money on transaction fees and not have to transfer the coins out of his current wallet, pay network fees, pay exchange fees, and again pay network fees to move the coins back into his chosen wallet. Bitcoin network fees have gone up a little bit recently, but it's nothing serious. Besides, I would rather pay a bit more and make a few extra transactions to use a safe swap service than try to save a few bucks and use a semi-scam service that portrays itself as no-KYC, which has a history of seizing coins. 
What are my options where i can perform this task in a decentralzied way ?
I would not swap Bitcoin to stable coins and hold them, they can always be frozen or banned by regulation, so it's better to use real fiat currencies instead.For short term swap to stable coin I would use Aqua wallet that enables swap of BTC to L-BTC and L-USDT on liquid chain, but again I would only hold this short term.
Be careful with many ''swaps'' inside wallets that use third party exchanges, I have seen more reports of coins getting seized this way.
As for real decentralized exchanges you can use Bisq and BasicSwap.
I had a dream where I had an electrum wallet with that ability, really
What you are looking for is impossible. Bitcoin is another thing that stands alone and USDT is also another. The only way to exchange Bitcoin is only possible by using a centralized exchange or a decentralized exchange.
Your only option is 3rd party apps. You can have Trezor or Ledger wallet and swap via inside the wallet but still, you depend on 3rd party. I think this guide will look interesting for you but I want to remind you that it's not what you won't and you won't find it because such a thing doesn't exist but have a look at this: trezor.io/learn/a/exchange-crypto-in-trezor-suite
I also had a dream involving the Electrum wallet, but unlike yours, in my dream Electrum had a completely renewed and fluid UI, similar to apps like Trezor Suite. Maybe this is because I've been waiting for the taproot update for Electrum for a long time.What you are looking for is impossible. Bitcoin is another thing that stands alone and USDT is also another. The only way to exchange Bitcoin is only possible by using a centralized exchange or a decentralized exchange.
Your only option is 3rd party apps. You can have Trezor or Ledger wallet and swap via inside the wallet but still, you depend on 3rd party. I think this guide will look interesting for you but I want to remind you that it's not what you won't and you won't find it because such a thing doesn't exist but have a look at this: trezor.io/learn/a/exchange-crypto-in-trezor-suite
Regarding the OP's question, why do you need to use a wallet that has built-in swap? It doesn't matter if you do the swap through the wallet app or access a swap website/app, you will depend on a third party anyway, since most are centralized.
In any case, if you are going to swap something, you don't need to change wallets, unless you really want to, so you can use wallets like hardware wallets like Trezor or software wallets like Stack Wallet.
I recommend eXch.cx, because they are efficient and fast.
You can visit their ANN to learn more about the project.
...the cheapest solution can be move the coins to exchange, perform the exchange. Binance is no doubt the best option but mexc is another choice in case OP does not want to do KYC.
MEXC portrays itself as a no-KYC exchange but that can change very quickly. The need for identity verification is part of the user agreement you agree to when you sign up. If their checks find anything suspicious with your coins, they will surely freeze your account and request information about you and the source of your money. If OP's coins are in any way connected to a service with a "bad risk rating", you can throw the no-KYC claims out of the window. I know that you were asking about decentralized exchanges and centralized services, but I would still suggest you try out eXch. Make sure you don't use one of the many fake websites that appear every now and then. eXch will allow you to swap your BTC for USDT on the Ethereum blockchain, minus a 0.5% fee (not counting transaction costs of your deposit transaction). The benefits include no KYC, no AML checks, and no unfair treatment of bitcoin. eXch accepts all bitcoin, without assigning risk ratings or considering certain coins to be "dirty" and "unworthy" to be exchanged.
I would also recommend OP to use eXch as they are the best right now and also cheap as compared to others in the market however the cheapest solution can be move the coins to exchange, perform the exchange. Binance is no doubt the best option but mexc is another choice in case OP does not want to do KYC.
Another important thing that i usually recommend that one may use any service for this swap but do not move all the coins in one go. He should swap in parts either at eXch or centralized exchanges.
I know that you were asking about decentralized exchanges and centralized services, but I would still suggest you try out eXch. Make sure you don't use one of the many fake websites that appear every now and then. eXch will allow you to swap your BTC for USDT on the Ethereum blockchain, minus a 0.5% fee (not counting transaction costs of your deposit transaction). The benefits include no KYC, no AML checks, and no unfair treatment of bitcoin. eXch accepts all bitcoin, without assigning risk ratings or considering certain coins to be "dirty" and "unworthy" to be exchanged.
Bisq does not do USDT trades, only BTC and XMR
There is usdt trading and but is basically buying and selling. Bisq wouldn’t work perfectly for this. What I think OP needs is not even swapping but more of bridging because there is no usdt on bitcoin blockchain. Only centralized exchanges can actually do this effectively, decentralized platforms charges alot, so OP should simply use the centralized ones that do not require KYC, like the exch.cx or use one platform called the ChangeNOW which I have used before but wasn’t satisfying because it took a ample of time before the transaction dropped.
You can send to decentralised exchanges like Bsq and others where they don't ask you for KYC, but the only thing there is that you will spend some fee for the transactions.
TrustWallet is not an open source wallet, and it's a multi-wallet; if not, it's also one bitcoin wallet that has the swap option in it. Aside from that one, I have not seen any of the good recommended wallets here with such features.
TrustWallet is not an open source wallet, and it's a multi-wallet; if not, it's also one bitcoin wallet that has the swap option in it. Aside from that one, I have not seen any of the good recommended wallets here with such features.
Bisq does not do USDT trades, only BTC and XMR
I'm not aware of any wallets that directly let you swap bitcoin for USDT. As some members already said, that sort of thing tends to happen through centralized exchanges or third party services. You could consider using a decentralized exchange (DEX) platforms that allow you to swap Bitcoin for other cryptocurrencies or tokens, including USDT. However, DEXs can be kinda tricky to use compared to centralized exchanges. And sometimes their fees are steeper. Personally, I use exch.cx since it's a non-KYC exchange and the rates seem fair to me.
I had a dream where I had an electrum wallet with that ability, really
No, please. Let's leave Electrum be just as simple and good as it is, without any bloatware and unnecessary "features".
If people want centralized "wallets", let them switch there, knowing the big warning sign. And leave Electrum just... be a clean wallet.
I am storing my bitcoin in Electrum wallet. I am sure when bitcoin will cross 100K or above, we will see a small correction or a cool off period and one can sell some of the holdings and buy back again. Electrum does not allow to swap the coins to USDT and i do not want to transfer my bitcoin to centralzied exchanges for converting to usdt and then back to bitcoin later.
What are my options where i can perform this task in a decentralzied way ?
I had a dream where I had an electrum wallet with that ability, really What are my options where i can perform this task in a decentralzied way ?
What you are looking for is impossible. Bitcoin is another thing that stands alone and USDT is also another. The only way to exchange Bitcoin is only possible by using a centralized exchange or a decentralized exchange.
Your only option is 3rd party apps. You can have Trezor or Ledger wallet and swap via inside the wallet but still, you depend on 3rd party. I think this guide will look interesting for you but I want to remind you that it's not what you won't and you won't find it because such a thing doesn't exist but have a look at this: trezor.io/learn/a/exchange-crypto-in-trezor-suite
You can send to decentralised exchanges like Bsq and others where they don't ask you for KYC, but the only thing there is that you will spend some fee for the transactions.
High fee is also needed for swapping. I mean bitcoin to other coin swap vice versa. Also as OmegaStarScream stated, they are not decentralized but centralized. What I do not like is how those wallets are all close sources. I prefer to make use of a decentralized or non-KYC exchanges than to swap. 
I am storing my bitcoin in Electrum wallet. I am sure when bitcoin will cross 100K or above, we will see a small correction or a cool off period and one can sell some of the holdings and buy back again. Electrum does not allow to swap the coins to USDT and i do not want to transfer my bitcoin to centralzied exchanges for converting to usdt and then back to bitcoin later.
What are my options where i can perform this task in a decentralzied way ?
What are my options where i can perform this task in a decentralzied way ?
I have used exch.cx a lot of times, and it works for what you want. It will convert BTC to USDT. It also works for USDT to BTC.
https://exch.cx/
It is a centralized exchange, but they do not ask for any KYC and they are very reliable.
You can check their announcement here:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=577207.msg64768677;topicseen#new
You can send to decentralised exchanges like Bsq and others where they don't ask you for KYC, but the only thing there is that you will spend some fee for the transactions.
TrustWallet is not an open source wallet, and it's a multi-wallet; if not, it's also one bitcoin wallet that has the swap option in it. Aside from that one, I have not seen any of the good recommended wallets here with such features.
TrustWallet is not an open source wallet, and it's a multi-wallet; if not, it's also one bitcoin wallet that has the swap option in it. Aside from that one, I have not seen any of the good recommended wallets here with such features.
Just because a wallet allows you to swap does not mean it's done in a decentralized way.
Exodus, Trustwallet, Bitget, OKX, etc. all these wallets swaps are done using their CEX, or a third party service like Changelly etc.
If you want to do BTC -> USDT in not only KYC free way, but also decentralized, then I believe Thorchain is what you're looking for here. Give it a read.
Exodus, Trustwallet, Bitget, OKX, etc. all these wallets swaps are done using their CEX, or a third party service like Changelly etc.
If you want to do BTC -> USDT in not only KYC free way, but also decentralized, then I believe Thorchain is what you're looking for here. Give it a read.
I am storing my bitcoin in Electrum wallet. I am sure when bitcoin will cross 100K or above, we will see a small correction or a cool off period and one can sell some of the holdings and buy back again. Electrum does not allow to swap the coins to USDT and i do not want to transfer my bitcoin to centralzied exchanges for converting to usdt and then back to bitcoin later.
What are my options where i can perform this task in a decentralzied way ?
What are my options where i can perform this task in a decentralzied way ?
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