bitfinex lending | Bitcointalksearch.org

dothebeats

legendary

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Quote from: clementinal on October 06, 2015, 09:46:49 AM

The rates are becoming lower, and lower .. any reason for that?
Even USD rates are affected

I personally think that this has something to do with the hack they had experienced. They had been a great platform since its heyday, it's just this recent times that they looked like they will pull something Mt Gox-like.

deisik

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Activity: 3514

Merit: 1280

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Quote from: clementinal on October 06, 2015, 09:46:49 AM

The rates are becoming lower, and lower .. any reason for that?
Even USD rates are affected

The end is near, winter is coming

clementinal

newbie

Activity: 36

Merit: 0

The rates are becoming lower, and lower .. any reason for that?
Even USD rates are affected

deisik

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Merit: 1280

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Quote from: johnyj on August 10, 2015, 09:13:46 AM

Quote from: deisik on August 10, 2015, 08:47:22 AM

Quote from: johnyj on August 10, 2015, 08:14:19 AM

Quote from: deisik on August 10, 2015, 08:01:11 AM

You are assuming that 1.5 million dollars now able to buy only 1 bitcoin will actually buy it, which I doubt

I believe that those 1.5 million dollars have some real irreplaceable usage that must be carried out by bitcoin, regardless of exchange rate. For example I'm doing all my international transactions using bitcoin, saving me lots of time and money. (Of course I can also use litecoin to do the transaction, but the ecosystem of litecoin is magnitudes worse than bitcoin)

You are thus assuming that someone buying the last bitcoin (wtf) will have someone else on the other end of connection who will now sell this bitcoin at the same rate of $1.5M per BTC, meaning that someone else's counter-party will have that irresistible desire to buy it at that rate, right?

Your scheme seems to be highly implausible

Even it is the last bitcoin, that's still 100 million satoshi, e.g. 1 satoshi worth only 1.5 cent. The unit used is irrelevant, why people are still buying and selling gold at market price when it cost 35 million dollars for 1 ton of gold?

That would be equal to resetting Bitcoin completely as a whole new money (when there is only one bitcoin left). It would work out in 2008, but not today when there are a lot of alternatives, doing just the same what Bitcoin does, but better, faster, and cheaper (and I guess safer)...

In short, nobody would care (about your stash of 21M coins)

maku

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Quote from: AtheistAKASaneBrain on August 10, 2015, 08:21:34 AM

Im still yet to see a viable lending business. It seems everything is either a scam or has pathetic return rates that make the risk not worth it.

How scam lending sites or services works? I thought - they have to lend YOU money. If this first step is already scam, how exactly they want to fool people into believing they are legit?

johnyj

legendary

Activity: 1988

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Beyond Imagination

Quote from: deisik on August 10, 2015, 08:47:22 AM

Quote from: johnyj on August 10, 2015, 08:14:19 AM

Quote from: deisik on August 10, 2015, 08:01:11 AM

You are assuming that 1.5 million dollars now able to buy only 1 bitcoin will actually buy it, which I doubt

I believe that those 1.5 million dollars have some real irreplaceable usage that must be carried out by bitcoin, regardless of exchange rate. For example I'm doing all my international transactions using bitcoin, saving me lots of time and money. (Of course I can also use litecoin to do the transaction, but the ecosystem of litecoin is magnitudes worse than bitcoin)

You are thus assuming that someone buying the last bitcoin (wtf) will have someone else on the other end of connection who will now sell this bitcoin at the same rate of $1.5M per BTC, meaning that someone else's counter-party will have that irresistible desire to buy it at that rate, right?

Your scheme seems to be highly implausible

Even it is the last bitcoin, that's still 100 million satoshi, e.g. 1 satoshi worth only 1.5 cent. The unit used is irrelevant, why people are still buying and selling gold at market price when it cost 35 million dollars for 1 ton of gold?

deisik

legendary

Activity: 3514

Merit: 1280

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Quote from: johnyj on August 10, 2015, 08:14:19 AM

Quote from: deisik on August 10, 2015, 08:01:11 AM

You are assuming that 1.5 million dollars now able to buy only 1 bitcoin will actually buy it, which I doubt

I believe that those 1.5 million dollars have some real irreplaceable usage that must be carried out by bitcoin, regardless of exchange rate. For example I'm doing all my international transactions using bitcoin, saving me lots of time and money. (Of course I can also use litecoin to do the transaction, but the ecosystem of litecoin is magnitudes worse than bitcoin)

You are thus assuming that someone buying the last bitcoin (wtf) will have someone else on the other end of connection who will now sell this bitcoin at the same rate of $1.5M per BTC, meaning that someone else's counter-party will have that irresistible desire to buy it at that rate, right?

Your scheme seems to be highly implausible

AtheistAKASaneBrain

hero member

Activity: 770

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Im still yet to see a viable lending business. It seems everything is either a scam or has pathetic return rates that make the risk not worth it.

johnyj

legendary

Activity: 1988

Merit: 1012

Beyond Imagination

Quote from: deisik on August 10, 2015, 08:01:11 AM

You are assuming that 1.5 million dollars now able to buy only 1 bitcoin will actually buy it, which I doubt

I believe that those 1.5 million dollars have some real irreplaceable usage that must be carried out by bitcoin, regardless of exchange rate. For example I'm doing all my international transactions using bitcoin, saving me lots of time and money. (Of course I can also use litecoin to do the transaction, but the ecosystem of litecoin is magnitudes worse than bitcoin)

deisik

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Merit: 1280

English ⬄ Russian Translation Services

Quote from: johnyj on August 10, 2015, 07:56:10 AM

Quote from: deisik on August 10, 2015, 07:42:25 AM

Quote from: johnyj on August 10, 2015, 07:15:25 AM

I want to borrow 21 million bitcoins and hold them in my cold storage vault, and the price will go to infinite Grin

Of course I can not return them with an interest, so some kind of default is going to happen, but anyway the lenders will not care due to their coins now worth much more

If you borrow all the coins, their value will be next to nothing, right? Therefore you needn't borrow all the coins, but just enough to halve their price, buy the rest and return the loan with interest...

Wash, rinse, repeat

How do you get that conclusion Wink

Suppose that the daily coin net supply on market is 5000 coins, and at an exchange rate of $300, there are daily capital inflow of 1.5 million dollars. If I borrowed all the coins in circulation and left with only 1 coin on the market, those 1.5 million dollars will only be able to buy 1 bitcoin. If I leave only 0.001 bitcoin on market, bitcoin will worth 1.5 billion

You are assuming that 1.5 million dollars now able to buy only 1 bitcoin will actually buy it, which I doubt

Quote from: johnyj on August 10, 2015, 07:56:10 AM

I'm not going to sell even one satoshi of borrowed coins, because when bitcoin is worth 1.5 million dollars, I can buy anything with bitcoin. And the lender will not care that I returning only 90% of his coins

I'm not telling you to sell bitcoins, you should actually buy them! Then repeat

johnyj

legendary

Activity: 1988

Merit: 1012

Beyond Imagination

Quote from: deisik on August 10, 2015, 07:42:25 AM

Quote from: johnyj on August 10, 2015, 07:15:25 AM

I want to borrow 21 million bitcoins and hold them in my cold storage vault, and the price will go to infinite Grin

Of course I can not return them with an interest, so some kind of default is going to happen, but anyway the lenders will not care due to their coins now worth much more

If you borrow all the coins, their value will be next to nothing, right? Therefore you needn't borrow all the coins, but just enough to halve their price, buy the rest and return the loan with interest...

Wash, rinse, repeat

How do you get that conclusion Wink

Suppose that the daily coin net supply on market is 5000 coins, and at an exchange rate of $300, there are daily capital inflow of 1.5 million dollars. If I borrowed all the coins in circulation and left with only 1 coin on the market, those 1.5 million dollars will only be able to buy 1 bitcoin. If I leave only 0.001 bitcoin on market, bitcoin will worth 1.5 billion

I'm not going to sell even one satoshi of borrowed coins, because when bitcoin is worth 1.5 million dollars, I can buy anything with bitcoin. And the lender will not care that I returning only 90% of his coins

deisik

legendary

Activity: 3514

Merit: 1280

English ⬄ Russian Translation Services

Quote from: johnyj on August 10, 2015, 07:15:25 AM

I want to borrow 21 million bitcoins and hold them in my cold storage vault, and the price will go to infinite Grin

Of course I can not return them with an interest, so some kind of default is going to happen, but anyway the lenders will not care due to their coins now worth much more

If you borrow all the coins, their value will be next to nothing, right? Therefore you needn't borrow all the coins, but just enough to halve their price, buy the rest and return the loan with interest...

Wash, rinse, repeat

johnyj

legendary

Activity: 1988

Merit: 1012

Beyond Imagination

I want to borrow 21 million bitcoins and hold them in my cold storage vault, and the price will go to infinite Grin

Of course I can not return them with an interest, so some kind of default is going to happen, but anyway the lenders will not care due to their coins now worth much more

dreamspark

hero member

Activity: 798

Merit: 1000

Quote from: thezerg on February 28, 2015, 10:20:07 PM

Quote from: brokenchair on February 22, 2015, 08:48:09 AM

The rates are garbage, but if a loan, or whatever it is called closes early, would the lender still get paid the interest for the day lended? (ex you loan 1 btc, the swap closes in an hour, do you still get 0.02 percent or do they screw you)
The rates are such crap it seems kind of pointless as I could probably make more money off of a $1 scalp than lending for an entire month, but if early closing still gives you interest it is not that bad during times where you don't have a strong stance on a position.

I emailed them about this last year. There ought to be a minimum charge (or another way to think of it is a minimum time) because the proceeds don't even pay for your time to click "offer swap" if it closes in an hour. And also I have seen people manipulate the rate by grabbing and then releasing all the swaps. This drives the swap % up.

Maybe if other people also complain something will be done about it.

You get paid for at least an hour even if the swap is immediately closed which doesn't happen all that often.

To work around this use an autolending bot that relends instantly if a swap is returned. This requires no effort from you and ensures your funds are lent out as much as possible.

clementinal

newbie

Activity: 36

Merit: 0

LTC BTC swap return rates are garbage, but USD return rates are quite allright.

since finnex has halted withdrawal for my account for the time being, by playing with swaps ive managed to squeeze out few houndred bucks

thezerg

legendary

Activity: 1246

Merit: 1010

Quote from: brokenchair on February 22, 2015, 08:48:09 AM

The rates are garbage, but if a loan, or whatever it is called closes early, would the lender still get paid the interest for the day lended? (ex you loan 1 btc, the swap closes in an hour, do you still get 0.02 percent or do they screw you)
The rates are such crap it seems kind of pointless as I could probably make more money off of a $1 scalp than lending for an entire month, but if early closing still gives you interest it is not that bad during times where you don't have a strong stance on a position.

I emailed them about this last year. There ought to be a minimum charge (or another way to think of it is a minimum time) because the proceeds don't even pay for your time to click "offer swap" if it closes in an hour. And also I have seen people manipulate the rate by grabbing and then releasing all the swaps. This drives the swap % up.

Maybe if other people also complain something will be done about it.

clementinal

newbie

Activity: 36

Merit: 0

if you have tons of coins laying around you probably could squeeze few bucks out of it

brendan.f

newbie

Activity: 9

Merit: 0

Quote from: brokenchair on February 22, 2015, 08:48:09 AM

The rates are garbage, but if a loan, or whatever it is called closes early, would the lender still get paid the interest for the day lended? (ex you loan 1 btc, the swap closes in an hour, do you still get 0.02 percent or do they screw you)
The rates are such crap it seems kind of pointless as I could probably make more money off of a $1 scalp than lending for an entire month, but if early closing still gives you interest it is not that bad during times where you don't have a strong stance on a position.

well i played around with finnex, and to be honest even at flash return rate most of the time the coins just lay there. most of the time the loan isnt for the time period you would want, and the return is fixated on return time, not the time you were expecting it to be available.

brokenchair

member

Activity: 109

Merit: 10

Lmao why you don't dick around with lending, missed major quick short opportunity for a few dollars with my coins on bitfinex being lended Cry

Got my sell off on cbase though Wink

brokenchair

member

Activity: 109

Merit: 10

The rates are garbage, but if a loan, or whatever it is called closes early, would the lender still get paid the interest for the day lended? (ex you loan 1 btc, the swap closes in an hour, do you still get 0.02 percent or do they screw you)
The rates are such crap it seems kind of pointless as I could probably make more money off of a $1 scalp than lending for an entire month, but if early closing still gives you interest it is not that bad during times where you don't have a strong stance on a position.

Topic: bitfinex lending (Read 3391 times)