Author

Topic: Blockchain.org question: (Read 469 times)

legendary
Activity: 2562
Merit: 1414
April 09, 2015, 10:02:24 AM
#6


-snip-
Thanks for the responses.

I am using blockchain.info

I'm not sophisticated enough to understand all of what you both describe, but " There actually is no "from" address on the protocol level a transaction always refers to an old transaction and not to an address." sounds to me like there is no need for a 2nd wallet - If I start a new anonymous account with this business and send funds from the same wallet I used to use with the 1st account, they wouldn't know I am the same person, as "There actually is no "from" address...".

Correct?


Since you are not a tech guy, Ill explain it in a simpler words to your question from the bolded part, or you can read shorena's details explanation

If you create a wallet B and send some funds from wallet A, there will be a transaction ID to wallet B from wallet A, some people will only thought this as a normal transaction or maybe some people will be suspicious about this, so if you would like to stay anonimous with wallet B, you will have to send fund to the wallet B, not from wallet A directly but rather using some mixing service or send it from an exchanger

copper member
Activity: 1498
Merit: 1528
No I dont escrow anymore.
April 09, 2015, 02:19:43 AM
#5
-snip-
Thanks for the responses.

I am using blockchain.info

I'm not sophisticated enough to understand all of what you both describe, but " There actually is no "from" address on the protocol level a transaction always refers to an old transaction and not to an address." sounds to me like there is no need for a 2nd wallet - If I start a new anonymous account with this business and send funds from the same wallet I used to use with the 1st account, they wouldn't know I am the same person, as "There actually is no "from" address...".

Correct?

Not exactly, please ask again if the below explanation is not good enough either. Its crucial for your privacy to understand how a transaction is created.

While there technically is none, blockchain.info (and other block explorers) still shows an address the bitcoin "came from". What you want to avoid is that you have two address in the "from" section, as seen from the TX I linked above this happens easily. It was actually the first TX I looked at when opening bc.i. The way blockchain.info (short bc.i) works makes it almost impossible for you to avoid this as you have next to no influence on which "from" address shows up. Maybe it helps if you understand how the "from" address appears.

Let say received bitcoin on a certain addresses, lets call them A and B. You got 1 BTC on A and .5 BTC on B, your overal balance is 1.5 BTC. If you want to spend bitcoin you refer to the transactions you received them with. These are called unspend outputs as they are the output of a transaction you received and you did not spend them yet. You are now free (as long as you have the needed private key) to use them as inputs in a transaction that creates new outputs for someone else or yourself. Now if you want to spend 1.2 BTC you have to use both outputs received on A and B as input because either are too small alone. This will result in a transaction that uses two inputs shown as "from" addresses A and B and creates two outputs one with 1.2 for the person you are paying and one with .3 for the rest back to yourself. We assume no fee here to keep the numbers simple. Thus while there are no "from" address this transaction would still show anyone that cares enough to look into it that you (not personally, but as a concept) control both addresses.

The problem with bc.i is that you have no say in which unspend outputs are used as inputs AFAIK. The "Custom" option allows you to limit this somewhat as you can select an address the coins are send "from". But even if you could hand select the inputs like e.g. with bitcoin core you still have the problem that neither A nor B are big enough to create an 1.2 BTC output. You could create a transaction that sends the output from A to C and a second transaction that send the output from B to C as well. Now you have both "on" the same address and can create a transaction with a single "from" address. This would however require a wallet that allows handpicking inputs. To make this even more complicated bitcoin core creates a slightly different transaction when sending to an address within the same wallet, I suspect bc.i does this as well. This is harder to see, but it would still link addresses A, B and C to eachother.

The easiest way I see to avoid all this hassle is to use "Shared Coin" with every transaction and keep the "donate .5%-1%" in place to make sure the amounts do not match.
newbie
Activity: 11
Merit: 0
April 09, 2015, 01:48:26 AM
#4
I cancelled my anonymous account with a btc business. Was using blockchain.org as my wallet.

If I open a new anonymous account with the same business, still using blockchain.org as my wallet, will it be apparent that I am the same person due to the funds I send there coming from the same blockchain.org wallet as the first account?

Anotherwords, in general, does blockchain.org use a recurring address for my wallet when I send funds, so it identifies me?
Or is it sent with different identifiers everytime as far as the address it's being sent from?


If Blockchain does use the same identifying address when funds are sent out from my wallet, then does blockchain.org allow me to open a 2nd (or more) wallet?
This would solve the identifying problem, wouldn't it? (other than my ip addy).

First of all, blockchaininfo does not care if you open up 100 or 1000 wallet there and transferring the BTC across the address, so you dont need to worry about being "identified" or whatsoever
It will just show a connection between each adress

i.e you got 3 wallet

wallet A = 1ABCD
wallet B = 1EFGH
wallet C = 1WXYZ

blockchain does not care if you open up these wallet, but if you sending BTC across each of that wallet with the same input, someone might notice that these 3 wallet are linked and use by someone, nothing really to worry about if you do not conduct something bad


Some of us worry even though we dont have something to hide, because we have something to protect.

#1 be careful that you are using blockchain.info and not something else, e.g. .org

An example of what arallmuss said above would be e.g. this TX[1]

It uses inputs "from" 5 addresses. There actually is no "from" address on the protocol level a transaction always refers to an old transaction and not to an address. It is commonly accepted that the person behind this controls all 5 private keys for the addresses in question. The easiest way to avoid this is with blockchain.info is to use their CoinJoin feature aka SharedCoin. It will mix your transaction with others.

You could also use a new account and move all your funds with a single CoinJoin transaction.


[1] https://blockchain.info/tx/5ef3a073b890a463514b8324f69829e4d48e6ac73600e06347a00c25bdca64b4


Thanks for the responses.

I am using blockchain.info

I'm not sophisticated enough to understand all of what you both describe, but " There actually is no "from" address on the protocol level a transaction always refers to an old transaction and not to an address." sounds to me like there is no need for a 2nd wallet - If I start a new anonymous account with this business and send funds from the same wallet I used to use with the 1st account, they wouldn't know I am the same person, as "There actually is no "from" address...".

Correct?
copper member
Activity: 1498
Merit: 1528
No I dont escrow anymore.
April 09, 2015, 12:54:47 AM
#3
I cancelled my anonymous account with a btc business. Was using blockchain.org as my wallet.

If I open a new anonymous account with the same business, still using blockchain.org as my wallet, will it be apparent that I am the same person due to the funds I send there coming from the same blockchain.org wallet as the first account?

Anotherwords, in general, does blockchain.org use a recurring address for my wallet when I send funds, so it identifies me?
Or is it sent with different identifiers everytime as far as the address it's being sent from?


If Blockchain does use the same identifying address when funds are sent out from my wallet, then does blockchain.org allow me to open a 2nd (or more) wallet?
This would solve the identifying problem, wouldn't it? (other than my ip addy).

First of all, blockchaininfo does not care if you open up 100 or 1000 wallet there and transferring the BTC across the address, so you dont need to worry about being "identified" or whatsoever
It will just show a connection between each adress

i.e you got 3 wallet

wallet A = 1ABCD
wallet B = 1EFGH
wallet C = 1WXYZ

blockchain does not care if you open up these wallet, but if you sending BTC across each of that wallet with the same input, someone might notice that these 3 wallet are linked and use by someone, nothing really to worry about if you do not conduct something bad


Some of us worry even though we dont have something to hide, because we have something to protect.

#1 be careful that you are using blockchain.info and not something else, e.g. .org

An example of what arallmuss said above would be e.g. this TX[1]

It uses inputs "from" 5 addresses. There actually is no "from" address on the protocol level a transaction always refers to an old transaction and not to an address. It is commonly accepted that the person behind this controls all 5 private keys for the addresses in question. The easiest way to avoid this is with blockchain.info is to use their CoinJoin feature aka SharedCoin. It will mix your transaction with others.

You could also use a new account and move all your funds with a single CoinJoin transaction.


[1] https://blockchain.info/tx/5ef3a073b890a463514b8324f69829e4d48e6ac73600e06347a00c25bdca64b4
legendary
Activity: 2562
Merit: 1414
April 09, 2015, 12:32:58 AM
#2
I cancelled my anonymous account with a btc business. Was using blockchain.org as my wallet.

If I open a new anonymous account with the same business, still using blockchain.org as my wallet, will it be apparent that I am the same person due to the funds I send there coming from the same blockchain.org wallet as the first account?

Anotherwords, in general, does blockchain.org use a recurring address for my wallet when I send funds, so it identifies me?
Or is it sent with different identifiers everytime as far as the address it's being sent from?


If Blockchain does use the same identifying address when funds are sent out from my wallet, then does blockchain.org allow me to open a 2nd (or more) wallet?
This would solve the identifying problem, wouldn't it? (other than my ip addy).

First of all, blockchaininfo does not care if you open up 100 or 1000 wallet there and transferring the BTC across the address, so you dont need to worry about being "identified" or whatsoever
It will just show a connection between each adress

i.e you got 3 wallet

wallet A = 1ABCD
wallet B = 1EFGH
wallet C = 1WXYZ

blockchain does not care if you open up these wallet, but if you sending BTC across each of that wallet with the same input, someone might notice that these 3 wallet are linked and use by someone, nothing really to worry about if you do not conduct something bad
newbie
Activity: 11
Merit: 0
April 08, 2015, 11:01:04 PM
#1
I cancelled my anonymous account with a btc business. Was using blockchain.org as my wallet.

If I open a new anonymous account with the same business, still using blockchain.org as my wallet, will it be apparent that I am the same person due to the funds I send there coming from the same blockchain.org wallet as the first account?

Anotherwords, in general, does blockchain.org use a recurring address for my wallet when I send funds, so it identifies me?
Or is it sent with different identifiers everytime as far as the address it's being sent from?


If Blockchain does use the same identifying address when funds are sent out from my wallet, then does blockchain.org allow me to open a 2nd (or more) wallet?
This would solve the identifying problem, wouldn't it? (other than my ip addy).
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