BlockMasters.co is probably artificially increasing their 'current estimate'

CreamyG31337

member

Activity: 113

Merit: 10

Thanks for posting this info. I enabled blockmasters in awesome miner just to check. Currently it's suggesting
1) Mine an x16r coin myself (baseline / 100% profit)
2) mine lyra2re2 on nicehash (89% of baseline profit)
3) mine x16r on blockmasters (88% of baseline profit)

It's a pain to specify fees in awesome miner so this doesn't take those into account... but anyways, it seems reasonable. Maybe a bit low. I'm pretty sure all these pools that convert coins for you will screw you in that step anyways, so I'd certainly expect to make a bit less, unless you factor in the fact that crypto bridge is a piece of shit and can lose your coins for days.

PoRNo-MoRoZ

newbie

Activity: 13

Merit: 0

lyra2z:
http://grafana.phun.ru/d/8whL-Ximk/algos?orgId=2&from=now-24h&to=now&refresh=1m&var-pool=All&var-algo=lyra2z
http://grafana.phun.ru/d/7YD7rpWik/coins?orgId=2&from=now-24h&to=now&refresh=1m&var-pool=All&var-algo=lyra2z&var-coin=ALPS
http://grafana.phun.ru/d/7YD7rpWik/coins?orgId=2&from=now-24h&to=now&refresh=1m&var-pool=All&var-algo=lyra2z&var-coin=GIN

PoRNo-MoRoZ

newbie

Activity: 13

Merit: 0

Bitcore:
http://grafana.phun.ru/d/8whL-Ximk/algos?orgId=2&from=now-24h&to=now&refresh=1m&var-pool=All&var-algo=bitcore
http://grafana.phun.ru/d/7YD7rpWik/coins?orgId=2&from=now-24h&to=now&refresh=1m&var-pool=All&var-algo=bitcore&var-coin=All

PoRNo-MoRoZ

newbie

Activity: 13

Merit: 0

Now c11:
http://grafana.phun.ru/d/8whL-Ximk/algos?orgId=2&from=now-24h&to=now&refresh=1m&var-pool=All&var-algo=c11
http://grafana.phun.ru/d/7YD7rpWik/coins?orgId=2&from=now-24h&to=now&refresh=1m&var-pool=All&var-algo=c11&var-coin=SPD

Looks like any block found by blockmasters increasing their 'current estimate' for corresponding coin and algorithm.

PoRNo-MoRoZ

newbie

Activity: 13

Merit: 0

Most x11 coins 'fixed' (but may 'reappear' I guess).
Now same stuff happens with phi:
http://grafana.phun.ru/d/8whL-Ximk/algos?orgId=2&from=now-24h&to=now&refresh=1m&var-pool=All&var-algo=phi
http://grafana.phun.ru/d/7YD7rpWik/coins?orgId=2&from=now-24h&to=now&refresh=1m&var-pool=All&var-algo=phi&var-coin=FLM
http://grafana.phun.ru/d/7YD7rpWik/coins?orgId=2&from=now-24h&to=now&refresh=1m&var-pool=All&var-algo=phi&var-coin=LUX (not much)

PoRNo-MoRoZ

newbie

Activity: 13

Merit: 0

PoRNo-MoRoZ

newbie

Activity: 13

Merit: 0

Update: take a note - they continue 'modding' their pool, currently I see they altering 'current estimates' in 'currencies' API answer.
This is not a big problem, cuz profit switching software mostly using 'status' API answer (atleast I don't know any software using 'currencies' for profit switching).
They say it's 'advanced calculations' and software devs are okay with that, but in my opinion it should be done as seperate, new value.
Illustration:
https://i.gyazo.com/289aec160b7a992e32983cc566cdcf41.png
RVN for last 24h. Their line is yellow. Basically they have 'baseline' like other pools and adding some mod on each block found by their pool with slowly fading.
This effectively raising their 'current estimates' higher than any other pool (except zpool, but this is for seperate thread and I didn't talked to them yet, but I will).

Update: I edited opening post with additional info.

I'm watching this situation and will leave an additional post if something will change.

PoRNo-MoRoZ

newbie

Activity: 13

Merit: 0

update: they made a big update and now their estimates lower than every other pool.
I'm wondering why not same level, but whatever.

HardBlockMiner

jr. member

Activity: 224

Merit: 2

Quote from: PoRNo-MoRoZ on May 23, 2018, 05:53:17 AM

in my opinion it shouldn't require any manual adjustment from USER side

This exactly. The pools that are doing this are cheating to draw people over using software like nemo's and awesome. It's phony bullshit so that the pool gets more hash and pops more blocks and the pool owners can make more from fees.

The people who pay for it are the miners mining a less profitable pool.

PoRNo-MoRoZ

newbie

Activity: 13

Merit: 0

in my opinion it shouldn't require any manual adjustment from USER side

RivAngE

full member

Activity: 728

Merit: 169

What doesn't kill you, makes you stronger

If you're using NemosMiner you can put a percentage of difference between the pool's reported estimates and the real estimates.

Officially you can do that by going to the CONFIG folder and editing the POOLS file, but that doesn't seem to work for me.
What I did instead in order to add a 15% penalty to Zpool (my estimation) was changing the "zpool.ps1" (and "zpoolplus.ps1" in my case) by changing the mathimatical expression next to the variabl "Price" on line 42.
I made it into "Price = $Stat.Live*0.85" which means whatever price Zpool shows is reduced by 15%.

PoRNo-MoRoZ

newbie

Activity: 13

Merit: 0

update: they lowered values, but it still higher

integrale

full member

Activity: 144

Merit: 100

Eager to learn

something looks to confirm my guess , noticed when i use Nemos-miner switching software surprisingly most profitable algos should be on Blockmasters pool hmmm..

thx for your investigations good job Dude keep on

cheers integrale

HardBlockMiner

jr. member

Activity: 224

Merit: 2

Thanks for the heads up.

From your monitoring software it looks pretty bad for them. I'll be curious to see what they come back with, since it's all right there showing that they're inflating the estimates.

PoRNo-MoRoZ

newbie

Activity: 13

Merit: 0

tl;dr:
BlockMasters pool is probably aritificially increasing 'current profit estimate' values, so profit switching software tends to use it.
'currencies' (coins) 'current estimates' is ~10% higher (was 50%), and 'status' (algos) 'current esimates' is ~50% higher.
Their actual payouts are about same as other pools, but client-base raised not in fair play.

Update: they did a big update and now their estimates are lower than any other known pool (they fixed it after some time, so estimates roughly are same like other pools).
~~PROBLEM SOLVED~~

Update #2: they continue 'modding' their pool and now their 'current estimates' for 'currencies' API answer is 'advanced calculations' - basically regular 'current estimate' + mod for each block found by pool.
~~NOT A BIG PROBLEM~~

Update #3: they 'expanded' their 'advanced calculations' to 'status' API answers (currently only on x11).
SAME SH?T - ARTIFICIAL INCREASE ON CURRENT ESTIMATES ON ALGORITHMS

Full story (really long):

Part 1, '24h avg bug and changing mining software' (can safely skip this, this is some kinda intro):
Hi there, my name is Alexander aka 'phear' and I'm pretty newb in crypto-mining, but I'm pretty experienced IT system administrator and IT enthusiast overall.
My 'engrish' is also not best, but you will probably understand everything I will write next.
I registered on bitcointalk specially for making this thread.
I was using 'Awesome Miner' with '24h avg' estimates and most of time best algos for me was x16r/x16s with RVN and PGN coins respectively.
To get better understanding 'what's going on' with my mining I made a monitoring solution that tracks values of yiimp pool's API answers and draws graphs from it (that's another story, maybe as seperate thread later).
With my monitoring I noticed some odd behavior with '24h avg' values jumps.
RVN and PGN known changing their difficulty not too often, like once in a few days.
Since last PGN diff change 6 days passed and diff dropped from ~1600 to ~400 - this caused instant 'current estimate' raise - that's okay and predictable.
Oddly, but 'AM' started mining x16s and this is actually okay for me, since blocks are popping really fast, but remember, I was on '24h avg', so it shouldn't been happen.
After about 6 hours diff raised to previous level or even higher - so it's not worth to mine anymore, but 'AM' keeps mining it, but this is predicted behavior, cuz '24h avg' is, well, averaged value over last 24h.
I investigated further and found that '24h avg' instantly raised at diff drop too.
I reviewed yiimp sources and made a conclusion that since diff didn't changed in last 24h - yiimp took single diff value from last 24h, and this value was single new low diff at ~400 - that's caused instant '24h avg' raise.
After diff raised to old level in less than 24h - yiimp now had not single diff value, but atleast 2 - 'low' and 'high', and averaged them correctly, so '24h avg' estimate slowly faded away, as it should.
Here is 2 screenshots illustrating this:
https://i.gyazo.com/1e4b5e94602dc5080b71039c65d74744.png
https://i.gyazo.com/bf34342e603a02e4c0d755917cc8d0e3.png
Take a look at 'diff' graph on first screenshot (3rd row, 2nd column) and then take a look at 'actual 24h' on second screenshot (2nd row, 2nd column).
This leads me to idea that I either need to build my own 'profit switching' software that's can handle such scenarios or atleast try some other software.
So I decided to switch my mining software.

Part 2, 'NemosMiner and BlockMasters':
So I picked Nemos since I heard it's 'plus' profit switching algorithm is really a decent one.
With software change I decided to take a look at all options and decided to check all available pools that's supported by Nemos.
Surprisingly one pool is placed on first positions all the time with some astonishing profits. And yes, this pool was BlockMasters.
So I let my miner work on it, so I can finally buy a Lambo.
After some time I checked what I actually raised and values dissapointed me alot and I moved to another pool.
To get better understanding I added BlockMasters to my monitoring and after some time I saw something weird in graphs - all BlockMasters 'current estimates' was roughly 50% higher than other pools.
I joined BlockMasters discord and wrote as a joke on their #support channel (at this point I was thinking it's a bug or something similar): "you guys cheating ? your 'current estimates' are 50% higher than other pools".
Surprisingly fast their staff wrote me in private something like: "hi, is there a problem with our estimates?".
So we had a conversation where I pointed them that they probably have some kinda bug or something similar and they said they will check and fix it ASAP.
Next day (or day after this) I noticed 'current estimate' was decreased, now it was roughly 10% higher than other pools BUT only in 'currencies' API answer (that's coins).
'current estimate' in 'status' API answer (that's algorithms) remains the same - roughly 50% higher than other pools, so for profit switching software nothing is changed cuz they using only 'status' API call.
Here is 2 more screenshots that illustrated this (I picked bitcore and BTX cuz it's single coin algo and diff changing pretty slowly, but this can by tracked with any algo and coin):
https://i.gyazo.com/8eb192ae2f9d05f260a3558de90222b0.png
https://i.gyazo.com/0cc0be8df60d99b78c4fbbed2783a960.png
Take a look at top left graph, on first screenshot yellow line is BlockMasters, on second screenshot cyan line is BlockMasters.
I also noticed that they had hidden 'current estimate' for algorithms on their site (but not in API) - this is suspiciously too.

Part 3, 'public reveal':
Days keeps passing and nothing was changed so I decided to remind them of this situation.
Appearantly they do care, cuz staff easily starting private conversations with me about this case, but they claiming that everything is okay and they not fooling anyone.
Since I have some knowledge 'how yiimp works' I know that it's literally one-line change to fix this, so it's easy, but they still didn't changed it and claiming "it's in our ToDo", "we're a small team", "we're working on big update" and blah-blah-blah...
If so - this thread will not harm their reputation, right?
If not - it's up to you guys to investigate further and made a decision, I just wanna everyone 'play without a cheats'.

NEW: Part 4, 'messing with currencies estimates':
After all this shitstorm they did a big update to their front-end and at some point their estimates was even lower than any other pool (by ~10%).
I mentioned them about that and they did fixed that - their estimates became as any other pool, and that was good (I though FINALLY).
There was also 'bug' with 'shares' counter drops, but this is 'pool policy' and I can't require to change it (PPS/PPLNS/etc stuff).
But after some more days they did another small update, that messed up 'currencies' API 'current estimates'.
Now this value is basically some kinda 'baseline current estimate' + modificator for each block found, that slowly fading away to baseline (check image below).
This is not a big problem, since software mostly using 'status' API answer, but still it's potential bomb to do same trick - raise client base in not fair play.
Since nobody else altering 'estimates' so ridiculously (previous situation with 'status' API and 150%) - i'm 'attacking' only their pool.
Since I'm 'attacking' only their pool - they searching for a 'reason' and thinking I'm some kinda "black PR agent of other pool" (Zergpool, read below), but infact I'm not.
You should also note that at some point of time I had a moderator status in Zergpool discord (and because all this story I asked pinpin to remove it from me and he did).
Here is short story of how I got this moderator: I started mining from march this year and used Awesome Miner with all pools selected with 'current estimates' for profit switching.
Somehow Zergpool raised most satoshis for me and I focused on it to get payout faster. I was really active in discord trying to help other people with info that I learned in process.
So I think pinpin (Zergpool admin) noticed that I'm a) really often active and b) doing nice job helping people. So he gave me a moderator.
You should also note that first 2 comments in this thread is from Zergpool discord moderators. They know me and I discussed with them all this stuff prior posting it on this forum.
I can agree that this is suspiciously, but this is not a real problem. The problem is that BlockMasters altering their 'current estimates' in different variations and raising their client base not in fair play.
Now BlockMasters in every conversation claiming that I'm affilated with Zergpool. Basically trying to point my (and everyone else) attention to another problem(s). This is cheap trick.
Fact - their 'current estimates' in 'status' API answer was ~150% of any other pool.
Fact - their 'current estimates' in 'currencies' API answer currently is higher than any other pool.
Fact - they refusing to seperate their 'advanced calculations' to new seperate value in 'currencies' API answer.
Illustration of situation:
https://i.gyazo.com/289aec160b7a992e32983cc566cdcf41.png
It's 'current estimate' graph for last 24h for RVN coin. BlockMasters line is yellow. It's correlating nicely with 'shares' and 'block found' changings.

P.S.: here is links to my monitoring interactive graphs you can play with.
http://grafana.phun.ru/d/7YD7rpWik/coins
http://grafana.phun.ru/d/8whL-Ximk/algos

Topic: BlockMasters.co is probably artificially increasing their 'current estimate' (Read 536 times)