Topic: [Boxing]: WBC Explores Possibility Of Remote Scoring For Upcoming Fights (Read 207 times)

Quote from: Baofeng on May 12, 2020, 07:43:22 PM

What do you guys think? Is this feasible?

Honestly, for me it might be feasible. Actually, judges can have more ability to see the fight blow by blow on this set up since there will be no blind spot at all. For this reason, judges can deliver fairer verdicts. But of course it will only become possible if there would be high quality cameras on every corner of the ring including top view. But then again, doing such events is still not advisable at this moment. However if this is the only way they found to cut their losses then why not Cheesy

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MCobian

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I really understand that the WBC wants the boxing match to start again soon, and I'm sure we as boxing fans want it too. But with the
idea of judges accessing live video of the fight it's not a good idea, because I have a hard time imagining judges in a different place.
If this is done there will be many shortcomings, from technical issues to atmosphere boxing will not be fun. Better to be patient until
the spread of the corona virus can be stopped and the vaccine can be found, then the boxing match can be started again. Rather than
forcing to start a match without the presence of judges is very strange.

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Quote from: 7788bitcoin on May 12, 2020, 06:58:39 PM

Quote from: 7788bitcoin on May 12, 2020, 06:58:39 PM

I forgot to include this one, we all know that boxing is business and there are a lot of politics behind it. Mauricio and his father the late Jose Sulaiman will not have in power if there are no boxing politics. So maybe this is one reason why they want to protect their judges first and have them score outside of the ring. Let's see how they will overcome this kind of scoring if ever they stage a fight during his pandemic.

Is there any major fights they are planning to put together, but having judges score via video conference is not that bad but we need to have regular judges too, most of the time the judges in boxing comes out with shady results and hence extra judges via live video feed would be a perfect situation to overcome all these shitty judges issues, but putting everyone behind a live video feed will be a bad decision.

I'm not sure if there's any major fights using this scoring method, but there are talks about Golden Boy Aims For July 4 Return, Would Consider Canelo Fight Behind Closed Doors. This is going to be interesting as we all know that Canelo is the new cash cow in boxing. WBC has it's form of guidelines, but there should be at least a unified rule if ever boxing continues in this pandemic.

Well if they are targeting a unified rule then I doubt that they can come up with in the next two months and implement it and let Canelo be the test subject. Of course, we like the attitude of those governing bodies in boxing trying to come up with one set of rules, but with boxing politics it might take some time, in my opinion. Maybe Golden Boy is losing lots of money (who wouldn't?) that's why they are getting everyone on-board and push the fight in July.

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I forgot to include this one, we all know that boxing is business and there are a lot of politics behind it. Mauricio and his father the late Jose Sulaiman will not have in power if there are no boxing politics. So maybe this is one reason why they want to protect their judges first and have them score outside of the ring. Let's see how they will overcome this kind of scoring if ever they stage a fight during his pandemic.

Is there any major fights they are planning to put together, but having judges score via video conference is not that bad but we need to have regular judges too, most of the time the judges in boxing comes out with shady results and hence extra judges via live video feed would be a perfect situation to overcome all these shitty judges issues, but putting everyone behind a live video feed will be a bad decision.

I'm not sure if there's any major fights using this scoring method, but there are talks about Golden Boy Aims For July 4 Return, Would Consider Canelo Fight Behind Closed Doors. This is going to be interesting as we all know that Canelo is the new cash cow in boxing. WBC has it's form of guidelines, but there should be at least a unified rule if ever boxing continues in this pandemic.

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Quote from: stadus on May 08, 2020, 06:03:22 PM

I forgot to include this one, we all know that boxing is business and there are a lot of politics behind it. Mauricio and his father the late Jose Sulaiman will not have in power if there are no boxing politics. So maybe this is one reason why they want to protect their judges first and have them score outside of the ring. Let's see how they will overcome this kind of scoring if ever they stage a fight during his pandemic.

Is there any major fights they are planning to put together, but having judges score via video conference is not that bad but we need to have regular judges too, most of the time the judges in boxing comes out with shady results and hence extra judges via live video feed would be a perfect situation to overcome all these shitty judges issues, but putting everyone behind a live video feed will be a bad decision.

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WBC is a big boxing organization. It involves some of the big names. They aren't that dumb to just push on something that they are not fully prepared.

Yes, still risky but that's the part of slowly back to business with lots of considerations. As you know, their workers also need to get back on work.

For me, just let them proceed, and let's see if that will be successful or not. They will not be approved after all if the Medical Dept. sees something wrong on their proposals.

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The pandemic will take some time the boxing industry should do something so many livelihood are defending on it, if the fights that used this guidelines proved to be successful, then every country can also do it in their local boxing events, no industry should die in this pandemic, we only need to find ways to safeguard ourselves and personnel while continuing our business.

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Interesting. Does the onsite personnel include referees?
Well, guess they'll have to make this model very hard to abuse. The seclusion thing kind of makes this less transparent and easy to manipulate. The seclusion area will probably need to be built with transparent materials or/& have cameras focused on the personnel

robelneo

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I don't see any problem with scoring even if its online as long as people understands and accept the new system being in place.
This is just to give fights for the people during this pandemic, so I don't think people would still ask more or the normal one because this better than not being able to watch boxing at all, what the promoter has to ensure is the safety of the boxers and people involve, and this fight could take place.

There are a lot of issues in judging when the judges are live, the judges will only see to it, that the fight will be fair even if the fight is remote, some experts analysis proves that remote judging can be accurate because they can see the fight in a replay and in many angles, but of course, I want to see how things will go after at least five fights judging on the remote.

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Quote from: Darker45 on May 07, 2020, 10:39:25 PM

Let's see how they will overcome this kind of scoring if ever they stage a fight during his pandemic.

I don't see any problem with scoring even if its online as long as people understands and accept the new system being in place.
This is just to give fights for the people during this pandemic, so I don't think people would still ask more or the normal one because this better than not being able to watch boxing at all, what the promoter has to ensure is the safety of the boxers and people involve, and this fight could take place.

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WBC (World Boxing Council) headed by Mauricio Sulaiman of Mexico, is thinking are explorer the possibility of using remote scoring if ever they will have a sanctioned bout in this Covid-19 pandemic.

Of course, there are still a lot of concerns here, but maybe, just maybe this will work if ever boxing will continue in this crisis. What do you guys think? Is this feasible?

I don't think this is feasible. This is probably just the greedy Sulaiman losing patience on when to earn his next easy money. He better wait for the perfect time for boxing to resume smoothly and safely.

I forgot to include this one, we all know that boxing is business and there are a lot of politics behind it. Mauricio and his father the late Jose Sulaiman will not have in power if there are no boxing politics. So maybe this is one reason why they want to protect their judges first and have them score outside of the ring. Let's see how they will overcome this kind of scoring if ever they stage a fight during his pandemic.

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Quote from: DarkDays on May 07, 2020, 04:38:45 PM

WBC (World Boxing Council) headed by Mauricio Sulaiman of Mexico, is thinking are explorer the possibility of using remote scoring if ever they will have a sanctioned bout in this Covid-19 pandemic.

Quote

The WBC is attempting to do its part to limit its number of onsite personnel. The “Remote Official Judging” rollout calls for its officials score WBC-sanctioned bouts either live from home or in a secluded area elsewhere, in lieu of being seated ringside on three separate sides of the ring as is normal industry standard. Judges will be required to wear headphones under such a plan, with the workflow as follows:

- Judges access live video/audio of the fight
- Judges and WBC Supervisor log into a secure WBC portal
- Judges score each round in real-time
- Commission and WBC Supervisor finalize results and hand to ring announcer
- WBC Supervisor transposes electronic scores to hard copy master sheet
- Scores feed to site admin consolidated report

https://www.boxingscene.com/wbc-explores-possibility-remote-scoring-upcoming-sanctioned-bouts--148698

Of course, there are still a lot of concerns here, but maybe, just maybe this will work if ever boxing will continue in this crisis. What do you guys think? Is this feasible?

Looks feasible to me as long as they can implement it correctly and the game will result is fair they can go on with it, people need to watch something entertaining while in lockdown and the sports events producers need to keep their business going, it's a win-win situation for all concerns.

DoublerHunter

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^ This option will not work for judges are one of the most important staff in every game. They probably face a lot of challenges if they will continue the plan like the credibility of the result for judges may only have a limited view on the game aside from possible technical issues. It may sound humane for the intention is favorable to the livelihood of all the concern however it may only be projected as a fabricated game that will give doubt to all viewers. Nevertheless, these are safe from COVID-19.

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Quote from: tabas on May 07, 2020, 03:20:12 PM

They have a solution for the judges but how's the two fighters? there's no social distancing for the both of them. I appreciate that they're making a solution how they can continue a fight but they should also be concerned to their boxers.
And for the scoring, they have to take time reviewing the match quickly.

These people are punching each other in the face, trying to knock each other out cold.

I really don't think they are worried about coughing and sneezing on each other in the fight.

To be honest, I don't think I've ever seen a boxing match where the fighter sneezes. You would think that at some point in a 36 minute fight that at least one of the competitors would sneeze.

Now that I think of it, haven't seen much coughing either. Are boxers immune to the flu? /s

Yes, they'll punch each other but the saliva that might get out of them will be the medium of transfer. Cases that were reported are not actually about sneezing or coughing and they were unaware that they're infected because of the saliva leak from someone they have met. And when we talk, there's saliva leak that comes out.
And these boxers are prone to it, I'm not saying that they are infected but we don't know their contact tracing. I'm just worried about them and if you think that's just the least concern, good luck to this fight then.

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Quote from: Oilacris on May 07, 2020, 05:20:32 PM

Quote from: DarkDays on May 07, 2020, 12:53:07 PM

I don't see what the big deal is, this might actually be better for the sport.

If you think about it, judges sit ring side and only see part of the action, they're completely oblivious to everything they don't see, unless the ref points it out.

With the correct camera angles, judges should be able to do a better job of scoring the fight fairly. Which might help avoid some of the robberies we've seen in the past (ahem Fury vs Wilder I)

This should be the case with every boxing match, whether remote or not tbh. Judges should use all the info available to them, not just what they can see within their limited perspective.

Its still different if judges are on the ring side rather that on having that remote scoring.Well, cameras can be put up in all angles but doesnt mean that it would give out
the same perspective compared when you are beside on the actual fight.

It seems that they cant just wait anymore and do find out solutions just to make these fights happen or resume.I dont know if majority would agree to this kind of set
up but on my part, they should wait up for this pandemic to be over and watching boxing on remote scoring isnt really that convincing for me.

In most fights (particularly fights with Tyson Fury in them), you will find that boxers will take advantage of the limited perspective of the judges.

They'll try to choke their opponent when he's in the refs blind spot, and you'll sometimes even see thumbs in the eyes and leaning on the ropes and rabbit punches when nobody can see.

Many fighters definitely try to use this blind spot to their advantage, so I don't see why it shouldn't be eliminated.

Maybe to make it fairer, they could have a single judge ringside, then three more watching remotely.

Or at least position the three judges in various angles around the ring, rather than side by side.

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Quote from: coin-investor on May 07, 2020, 11:07:19 PM

The organization is looking for every possible option and scenario to push for the fights they are sanctioning because so many people's livelihood depends on this organization and all they mentioned are good options but they should first do a dry run before going to big events they can do 3 fights to see if all the workflows will be completed correctly and with no error before going to big events.

What I am concern is that the scoring should not be done remotely, we only have 3 judges in boxing if I am not mistaken, so I guess the scorers the boxers and the trainers could all be in the same venue, but there's no fans because when we say fans, that's a lot in numbers.

If Taiwan were able to make it possible, then maybe we can follow their model.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/05/world/asia/taiwan-baseball-coronavirus.html

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Quote from: Yaunfitda on May 06, 2020, 08:19:24 AM

WBC (World Boxing Council) headed by Mauricio Sulaiman of Mexico, is thinking are explorer the possibility of using remote scoring if ever they will have a sanctioned bout in this Covid-19 pandemic.

Quote

The WBC is attempting to do its part to limit its number of onsite personnel. The “Remote Official Judging” rollout calls for its officials score WBC-sanctioned bouts either live from home or in a secluded area elsewhere, in lieu of being seated ringside on three separate sides of the ring as is normal industry standard. Judges will be required to wear headphones under such a plan, with the workflow as follows:

- Judges access live video/audio of the fight
- Judges and WBC Supervisor log into a secure WBC portal
- Judges score each round in real-time
- Commission and WBC Supervisor finalize results and hand to ring announcer
- WBC Supervisor transposes electronic scores to hard copy master sheet
- Scores feed to site admin consolidated report

https://www.boxingscene.com/wbc-explores-possibility-remote-scoring-upcoming-sanctioned-bouts--148698

Of course, there are still a lot of concerns here, but maybe, just maybe this will work if ever boxing will continue in this crisis. What do you guys think? Is this feasible?

The organization is looking for every possible option and scenario to push for the fights they are sanctioning because so many people's livelihood depends on this organization and all they mentioned are good options but they should first do a dry run before going to big events they can do 3 fights to see if all the workflows will be completed correctly and with no error before going to big events.

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Quote from: Yaunfitda on May 06, 2020, 08:19:24 AM

That's not fun and that's not what people like to see, as a fan of boxing, I'd still love to see the crowd and judges near the boxing ring to score the match, that is the normal one and that set up gives us a lot of entertainment despite watching them live on TV only.

Yes, but we are in a pandemic right? Of course their first priority is not to have fans around.

Of course I understand that there is no fans, I am just saying it's not fun to watch games like that, maybe you have different opinion but that is my opinion, however if the fight will happen with the propose set up, I might try to watch and let's see how I would feel watching it.

They are making ways to continue making money, but not the way to give people full entertainment.

I think what they wanted to do is let boxing continue during this crisis.

The intention maybe good but I think it's the right thing to do at the moment.

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Quote from: dothebeats on May 07, 2020, 04:27:51 PM

WBC (World Boxing Council) headed by Mauricio Sulaiman of Mexico, is thinking are explorer the possibility of using remote scoring if ever they will have a sanctioned bout in this Covid-19 pandemic.

Of course, there are still a lot of concerns here, but maybe, just maybe this will work if ever boxing will continue in this crisis. What do you guys think? Is this feasible?

Sharing my couple of Sats. I did not read the article, though.

I don't think this is feasible. This is probably just the greedy Sulaiman losing patience on when to earn his next easy money. He better wait for the perfect time for boxing to resume smoothly and safely.

How many times has it been said that watching at ring side is a world different from watching from a screen? How many times have wannabe analysts, judges, and commentators been admonished for protesting and insisting on their own views and scoring outcome because judging the match from TV is really incomparable to judging it live and right in front of your eyes?

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They would have to make do with limited angles and POVs in order to score the boxer's performance in a round. It may not be the most difficult thing to do but it will certainly provide lots of lapses in the scoring and may not even be just and fair to either side of the ring. Also, the boxers, referees, cameramen and technical staff are in the same room, so why not get the judges in the room as well if they really want to push through with this? All industries are hurting, and I don't know why boxinf associations are still trying to make something work knowing that it is a contact sport and there is a possibility of virus transmission within the room where they want to hold this event.

They cant wait much more thats why they are proposing things as long these events would push through by these means.

When it comes to lapses or missed scores then its understandble.Come to think even if they are on beside the ring, mistakes
do still happen.

Why they cant just sit just like other sports organizations do?

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Quote from: DarkDays on May 07, 2020, 12:53:07 PM

Of course, there are still a lot of concerns here, but maybe, just maybe this will work if ever boxing will continue in this crisis. What do you guys think? Is this feasible?

If they are planning to open boxing and wanted to put events in empty stadiums like UFC is planning to do this weekend they are do and have the option of remote scoring but i think UFC is going with the same stipulation with everything including judging and the only difference is empty stadiums. The success of the upcoming UFC event will determine whether other individual sports can start their schedule.

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I don't see what the big deal is, this might actually be better for the sport.

If you think about it, judges sit ring side and only see part of the action, they're completely oblivious to everything they don't see, unless the ref points it out.

With the correct camera angles, judges should be able to do a better job of scoring the fight fairly. Which might help avoid some of the robberies we've seen in the past (ahem Fury vs Wilder I)

This should be the case with every boxing match, whether remote or not tbh. Judges should use all the info available to them, not just what they can see within their limited perspective.

Its still different if judges are on the ring side rather that on having that remote scoring.Well, cameras can be put up in all angles but doesnt mean that it would give out
the same perspective compared when you are beside on the actual fight.

It seems that they cant just wait anymore and do find out solutions just to make these fights happen or resume.I dont know if majority would agree to this kind of set
up but on my part, they should wait up for this pandemic to be over and watching boxing on remote scoring isnt really that convincing for me.

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It would be funny how they will cope up when there will be technical difficulties during the match or there are unexpected power interruption Grin

Yes, this is another issue that they need to look at as well. Grin

I don't know but I think the plan is kinda stupid. if they let boxers do it, judges might as well be present there. How many judges are there in a boxing match? Not that many and they can be seated far from each other as they watch and score.

Only 3 judges.

Quote from: tabas on May 07, 2020, 03:20:12 PM

I also wonder why they're willing to risk the fighters while being cautious about judges' health? If they are not ready, they should just wait until the V is somewhat contained.

Maybe they think that judges health are very important that's why they wanted them to be on the priority list that needs to be protected. I agree that they should be present to judge the fight live.

Perhaps a "test fight" first and then see how it goes. But high profile fights specially with WBC belt on the line, those judges need to be present in the arena because it might cause another judges scoring controversy.

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They have a solution for the judges but how's the two fighters? there's no social distancing for the both of them. I appreciate that they're making a solution how they can continue a fight but they should also be concerned to their boxers.
And for the scoring, they have to take time reviewing the match quickly.

These people are punching each other in the face, trying to knock each other out cold.

I really don't think they are worried about coughing and sneezing on each other in the fight.

To be honest, I don't think I've ever seen a boxing match where the fighter sneezes. You would think that at some point in a 36 minute fight that at least one of the competitors would sneeze.

Now that I think of it, haven't seen much coughing either. Are boxers immune to the flu? /s

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They would have to make do with limited angles and POVs in order to score the boxer's performance in a round. It may not be the most difficult thing to do but it will certainly provide lots of lapses in the scoring and may not even be just and fair to either side of the ring. Also, the boxers, referees, cameramen and technical staff are in the same room, so why not get the judges in the room as well if they really want to push through with this? All industries are hurting, and I don't know why boxinf associations are still trying to make something work knowing that it is a contact sport and there is a possibility of virus transmission within the room where they want to hold this event.

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They have a solution for the judges but how's the two fighters? there's no social distancing for the both of them. I appreciate that they're making a solution how they can continue a fight but they should also be concerned to their boxers.
And for the scoring, they have to take time reviewing the match quickly.

DarkDays

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I don't see what the big deal is, this might actually be better for the sport.

If you think about it, judges sit ring side and only see part of the action, they're completely oblivious to everything they don't see, unless the ref points it out.

With the correct camera angles, judges should be able to do a better job of scoring the fight fairly. Which might help avoid some of the robberies we've seen in the past (ahem Fury vs Wilder I)

This should be the case with every boxing match, whether remote or not tbh. Judges should use all the info available to them, not just what they can see within their limited perspective.

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It would be funny how they will cope up when there will be technical difficulties during the match or there are unexpected power interruption Grin

I don't know but I think the plan is kinda stupid. if they let boxers do it, judges might as well be present there. How many judges are there in a boxing match? Not that many and they can be seated far from each other as they watch and score.

I also wonder why they're willing to risk the fighters while being cautious about judges' health? If they are not ready, they should just wait until the V is somewhat contained.

I don't know why boxers can fight but judges cannot attend the match, boxers are on the risk here not the judges, so why they are absent, I agree that if there's power interruption, the match will be stopped, this is something that they should be addressed and besides they cannot see the best angle and the whole situation and they might give a wrong decision, it's really a stupid idea.

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That's not fun and that's not what people like to see, as a fan of boxing, I'd still love to see the crowd and judges near the boxing ring to score the match, that is the normal one and that set up gives us a lot of entertainment despite watching them live on TV only.

Yes, but we are in a pandemic right? Of course their first priority is not to have fans around.