Topic: brazil sanctioned law that taxes online betting in the country (Read 575 times)

Guys, thank you for every post of solidarity, I didn't expect so many comments criticizing this new arbitrary tax in brazil.

We are truly going through a troubled time with this current government, which no longer disguises the insatiable desire to plunder the brazilian people, they no longer even use the argument that it's to finance the basic social services offered by the government to the population, because see that the people are accommodating and do not revolt to the point of creating a mobilization that damages the government's image.

As our @criptoevangelista friend said, it's a good thing we have Bitcoin and other and freedom tools based on crypto, as it's one of our only means of defense against these arbitrary measures.

Unfortunately, the current Brazilian government wants to raise more and more money, to continue spending until infinity, thankfully there are cryptocurrencies and casinos that use cryptos, so that a person can continue to manage their finances without depending on anyone. Governments just want easy money from other people's work, nothing more.

OP just like you are making this post and laughing, that is same way I'm laughing as well like what the f*ck is this? 15% on winnings? I won't even play to win again self let me see how they will get the 15%. For betting companies, paying taxes is important because they basically makes a lot of money from gamblers but for bettors I think it's just so funny.

[quote
Summary of the story: the government wants to be our partner only in gains, but in losses, we alone are forced to bear the financial losses. Very convenient, right?
[/quote]
Normally, government taking taxes doesn't really implies that they are doing so only when the individual or organization is making profits so far as they are running such business in the country they are to pay taxes, the area am only frowning at them is taking taxes from bettors winnings like it is very ridiculous i must say.

Are you seeing what I am seeing?

This looks like a great way to discourage the gambling addiction that most people have.

I can't help but think that the government of Brazil must have seen many cases of addiction among its people in the country, maybe there are suicide cases here and there because of gambling.

This is a well-orchestrated solution to battle gambling addiction, I can't say it wrong since this is what the government of the country wants for its people, and if I am right about the mess that gambling have caused to Brazil citizens then this isn't entirely bad as many people might think.

At least in my country, if I'm not mistaken because I've only used cryptocurrency casinos and never bothered with those casinos, you're taxed when you withdraw. Thus, if you deposit $100, win $1,000 but keep it in the account, you're fine to use the balance as you please. Thus, if you end up losing all $1,000, then you don't have to pay taxes, because you've practically haven't yielded any income.

You can use cryptocurrency casinos, and you can remain fully under the radar if you're using decentralized services for deposits and withdrawals.

Whatever the government does, it won't hurt. The government always shares in the profits and never in the losses. The government must enforce the law to tax gambling platforms in Brazil as it will generate millions of dollars in government revenue. If millions of dollars are collected in government revenue from gambling platforms, the government will not stop this law at all. There is no such law on gambling platforms in my country but gambling is still officially illegal in my country. Although gambling is officially illegal in my country, people still participate in gambling secretly. Since gambling is illegal in my country, we are at a great advantage because the government does not have to pay any additional taxes. But I don't like to apply such laws on gambling platforms because the government will deduct tax from you on profit and not compensate you on loss. If the government would give you some money back for losing bets on gambling platforms then maybe I would accept this law as good.

but if you look at what the brazilian government is doing, it is much better than my country. because gambling here is completely illegal, you are not allowed to gamble either online or offline. but the funny thing is that most people here understand what slots and various other types of gambling are, because even though they are illegal, they still operate behind the scenes and are backed up by the officials here. so the casinos pay security money to these corrupt officials so that their business can run smoothly, and the money will go into the private pockets of these officials to enrich themselves. so i think that it is better to impose such a tax than to leave it alone and do nothing regarding gambling operations.

So this means that if you bet 1000$ in a month, you will be taxed on that 1000$ ? If you lose half of the amount, you still have to pay the tax on the amount you placed the bet. But in case you win 5000$ from this amount, now the tax will be on 1000$ or 5000$ as the tax is usually on the income  Therefore i am unclear here as the gamblers will pay the tax on their profits or on the amount they will use to bet on ?

Secondly, people can bet using online platforms and pay with crypto and can avoid the taxes. The tax authorities can only monitor the deposits, withdraws and gambling activities on the physical casino or online casino operating within the taxed country. Is it so 

Well, can't you do that already through cryptocurrency casinos? It's awful to hear OP lose such a large percentage of your own earnings due to Brazil's taxation laws. However, as alani123 has previously stated, you also have to pay taxes for any gambling winnings over €100 in Greece; they're automatically deducted when you withdraw, to be precise. It's a shame, because they're immediately taking a decent chunk of your earnings. Fortunately, cryptocurrency casinos still remain under the radar, and provided that you withdraw to a service that has its own debit card, such as Crypto.com, you can theoretically avoid losing money to taxation.

Well... Brazil being Brazil and unfortunately having one of the highest tax in the world!

Brazil has potential for growth in online betting, but due to events it is difficult for the country to develop in this area, in other words, the government wants to take its share and tax it.
I believe that this type of attitude from the government will only scare away bettors and reduce betting in the country.

This will force gamblers and platforms to go underground in order to evade taxation. That's a steep tax to pay on, and I don't think it's fair for the gamblers to give that big of a share of their winnings to the government. Imagine the government taking a huge cut on your income tax, and still taking another huge cut on a bet you risked yourself to win. It's daylight robbery, and something that people should oppose.

Then again, they can easily use the 'legal reason' why they're doing this. This taxation does not help make the gambling scene legal at all. If anything, it promotes more illegal platforms to flourish because of the tax associated with gambling.

Don't think of this as your country messing with your shit (although in a manner of speaking it does look like they are messing with your shit) when the main intent of this is to deter people from gambling. As much as the government wants to earn from casinos and gambling taxes, they still know that it's way better for a citizen to be employed and productive, which gambling couldn't provide by a longshot. So in that regard,  they impose these hefty tax laws upon the people not only to bag more money which, in an ideal world, is used to make the country a safer and more livable place (although let's be real here, we all know this money's getting into someone's pockets) but at the same time it also deters people from gambling, cause now you guys are thinking that even if you win a lot, your country's going to take its piece of the pie no matter what, and you did all the heavy lifting so what gives, yeah?

I can see the vision of why they did this, and if successful, this could be emulated by other countries as well especially those with high crime rates and people who are subjected to gambling, prevention is better than rehabilitation and cure at the end of the day.

Yet, taxing a win alone is still better than taxing a loss because a loss alone is already devastating and how much more if we will pay another for its tax? I think I will lose my mind with this one but before I do, I will now avoid gambling because I still love my self and the people around me. As of now, I'm still lucky that my country don't have such law about gambling but as usual, I am not lucky enough on most my gambling sessions.

Governments are powerful that they can do whatever they wanted to do even if it's already against us. For the most part yes, betting is one source of the government but usually, only the betting operators are being charged by a tax here and not the players. Regulating something which are decentralized is a hard thing to do and when it comes to age restrictions, they better do that to young individuals than the older ones.

OP, what if you gamble with crypto from there?
Will you be taxed twice? tax from gambling profit and capital gains tax when exchanging crypto for cash there?
It would be terrible if you had to be taxed twice, in total could be almost half of the total winnings.

I have a friend from Brazil and he said he must pay 15% tax when exchanging crypto to fiat.
But he never gambled, only trading, so he was only subject to capital gain/loss tax.

This is a classic government overreach. Taxing bettors and firms 15% on winnings, 12% on revenue? Just call it a money grab.

President Lula, whom I respect, gestures with this tiny winnings exemption up to R$2112. But ignoring loses? Thats unfair, guys. Very awful policy. When things go well, the government takes its cut, but citizens pay when they dont? Thats crook.

Countries must discover smart methods to make money, I know. Taxing the betting sector without considering wins and losses? Losers use that method. Its fair play and not stifling businesses or customers. Regulations are important, but other countries should encourage the sector, not merely see dollar signs on every wager. Instead than breaking things, we should construct them.

That's how a government works they want you to share what you have, not only on winnings, on losses on casinos but also from all taxable profit and sales or everything where you are making a profit, they don't care about your losses they only care about your gains.

Your government only taxes you here in our country, the government manages the casinos and many profitable gambling platforms, they get all the taxes and they all get the profits.

Can we do something about it, can we complain, I'm ok with it as long as the profit and all the taxes are being used for the welfare of the citizens, here in our country corruption is so rampant that you have a hard time accepting all these taxes.

That's always been the case with the governments. Every business owner has that hidden special(!) partner that collects one third of every penny you make and don't give a shit about what you lose, the government. Government thugs come to collect their extortion money every year if you made any profits. They don't care what happens to you if you went bankrupt or dying from hunger. Like I said, this is not even a fair partnership. It is a privileged partnership.

You are not alone, every business in the world suffers from the same taxation rules.

The bad news is, this current system doesn't look like it is going to change any time soon.

You can't compare to legit business to gambling as they are exactly different.

When you are running a business, the success rate is high or say most of the people doing business are profitable but would only differ on profit since some are so blessed that they were able to grow their company overtime. However, gambling is quite different as we don't treat it as a business, in fact, most of us gamblers are losing money which makes casino being so profitable, so taxing our winning but neglecting our losses is just unfair to me, government are not anymore doing their job which is to server what's good for the people as gamblers are also peopel which has the right.

That's really how it goes with the government. If it's about gains, they're are there whether it's from gambling or any other source. What you have to do is to just adjust and you can't do anything with that policy imposed by the government because that's how they always be, they are there with our gains but if it's about our losses, you can't take anything on them. The taxes are increased and the same goes for income taxes which can be said with the gambling winnings. Taxes are the blood line of a country's economy and sadly, we don't like it if the government is corrupt or from a developing country which is known that the people doesn't really benefit from the taxation that they're getting from their own people. So, for you to accept this matter is to maximize any benefit that you are eligible from the government.

I disagree with you. The government done care if you lose or win in gambling, they have given a tax on betting, and it will stand. It is left for the gambler to choose if he is to quit or continue if he can't afford those taxes. There is no difference on those on putting taxes on people with kiosk shops and trucking businesses to casino sites. They don't earn make much money from the business, but they pay their taxes whether they make profit, or they make loses.

Because you are still lucky being allowed to gamble because the government can banned gambling in your place.

there are regulation in my country but this is not the same as what your government is doing yet we are not taxed in online gambling(NOT YET) because now that so much online gambling platform is coming here and there then for sure sooner there will be taxes .

this is not alternative but a legit collection .

Nothing new here as many other countries follow the same logic as they tax only the winnings.This law is implemented where I live from a long time now and this is not a developed country although it sells itself as a working to be a developed one.There is one huge difference though compared to Brazil,in here only amounts of 10.000 dollars and up are taxed and they tax it at 10% which is still a big amount to be taxed.

there is nothing wrong with paying taxes especially since people are making money here, but just like you said, the 15% tax they will impose is too much especially if a person only gambles once and the amount of money they will use in gambling is not that much. There are also good sides to what they will do, maybe in this way the possibility of addiction will be lessened for a person because if the tax is that high, some of the people will be forced to stop gambling, depending on the person's behavior and the level of its addiction. I just hope that the taxes they get from the players go to the right place because nowadays, there are many government employees who have no fear of the law and are doing face-to-face corruption.

it should have been a different ball game if they hard taxes both your losses or wins both taxing your wins alone puts all the gamblers is a major disadvantage because it literally means that your average win is still to your disadvantage because after loosing so many games and then a win that's to be a sort of compensation for all the ones you've lost now have to be shortened by the government.

That's the issue with the over regulatory nature of any system that's subject to government's control. They always feel that they can will everything to whatever angle they wish to which is a major problem. Should betting become a source of revenue for the government? It's only a clueless government that lacks what to put her attention into that will be after gamblers earnings. In my country, they've made several statements in the house of senate to bring out laws that will regulate the rate of decentralized gambling but it hasn't worked so far. The only thing they've been able to do which is not a big deal for me is regulate the age range of individuals that are old enough to engage in gambling.

They make this rules, I'm sure they'll put some controls here to ensure that people will be paying. They need to get that 15% no matter what, but if they can't implement that well, it will only be useless. If they really want to ensure a collection of tax from the winning bettors, they should consider making the casino as a withholding tax agent, that means, in behalf of the winning bettors, they'll deduct that tax from their winning and they'll be the one who would report it to the government together with their tax due on a separate report.

I believe that online casinos/crypto-casinos will be the main alternative for Brazilian bettors, and that this arbitrary decision by the government will be a shot in the foot in the medium-long term resulting in the opposite effect, instead of increasing revenue, it will decrease it, as bettors will migrate to unregulated platforms and online casinos that are not registered here in the country.

The current government is thirsty for citizens' money, but what are they doing with so much money to always want more and more?


No Odohu, the government isn't at all concerned about discouraging bettors, if that made sense, they'd run some kind of campaign encouraging bettors not to bet or something like that, but as a lot of money circulates especially in recent years with the increase surreal of sponsorships from sports betting companies in brazilian football (around 60 or 70% of clubs sponsorships are done by sports betting companies), there was an increase in both interest and finance in the betting sector in the country and the government unintentionally wasting time, saw the opportunity to tax the sector absurdly.

Haha. Sounds very government to me.

To OP is the winning bet is automatically taxed on the gambling platform like deducted win receive by the gambler or individual gamblers will need to declare this winning on their internal revenue office? Because if this is not automatically taxed, then gamblers will just ignore it. There are many loopholes to avoid this actually especially if using a crypto-related casinos.

This sounds more to me like the government indirectly discouraging people from gambling because in a nutshell,  it makes gambling rarely profitable as you will be remitting any profit you manage to make to the government. If I place 10 bets and win only 3 and I'm taxed in the 3 bets that I won, what happens to the bets I lost? Is this not simply increasing the loss of the gambler? This simply means that the government is saying don't gamble and if you insist,  if you didn't lose your money to the bookies,  we will take it from you... whichever case, the loss is on the gamblers and only few will escape.

What happens to taxing only credits to bank accounts? This is the effective way to tax and not to tax individual bet slip.

As it is, everyone intention to make money from betting and they are also taking the whole risk by themselves without the help of the governments or any third-party to help them in the losses or any problem, they encounter during the time of the prediction, I don’t see any reason why the government will come in on the profit they have seen, and the government don’t even care about their losses are past sometimes they have encounter loss more than the profit they just got that is what they government have to consider and the 15% they are taking is very high. It’s not advisable for them to do that.

They will see the outcome of this regulation, instead of getting the collection to increase, it will likely result to the opposite as gamblers would not gamble anymore due to this high taxes. As a result, when the numbers of gamblers reduced, the income of a casino will reduce, so I think this is not a well thought law that eventually will be revise as you said.

Good that it already happen to other country, they could have make it as a reference before finalizing the law so there's no need to revise anytime soon.

It reminds me of the regulation they made in Spain in 2012 if I remember correctly. At the beginning they didn't allow you to include the losses for the tax calculation either, but it is something that lasted half a year I think, and they had to modify it. So I guess that in Brazil they will modify it too.

The government usually wants to develop the country by imposing taxes to know the source of income of the people. Citizens will not have anything hidden through taxes the government will know all their information brazil is set to approve a tax reform that protects the purchasing power of the most disadvantaged groups through partial refunds. Considering increasing the reform budget to reach 100% of the population in any case through a specific tax which will therefore be a complete exemption for those who spend less and partially spend. It will be difficult for the government to tax crypto gamblers because everything in crypto is done online and the information is private.

Taxes are suppose to be for the development of a country, they need funds to make it happen. Corruption is another thing, as regardless on where the funds are coming, but if the officials that are running the country, it will still end up on their personal pocket. Taxing gambling sites and gamblers at the same time, that's too much, no love for gambling on them and I think only those who are addicted would allow that to happen to them since 15% from winnings is just too huge considering we are not even winning most of the time.

So this is where gambling is just for purely fun, we don't expect to win as taxes will kill our bankroll.

The fear of corruption and misappropriation of funds is a concern in many countries.  Imagine hard-earned money going towards politicians' pockets instead of public services. The distinction you draw between supporting taxation for public good and opposing it for personal gain is insightful.  The ideal scenario is citizens contributing to a system that benefits everyone, not just a select few.

The desire for transparent government spending is crucial.  Imagine clear information about how tax dollars are allocated, fostering trust and encouraging responsible tax collection. The potential benefits of responsible tax collection are undeniable.  Funding essential public services, infrastructure projects, and social programs can improve the lives of citizens.  Imagine improved roads, accessible healthcare, and educational opportunities made possible by responsible tax allocation.

The situation in Brazil, where some areas lack basic infrastructure, highlights the need for effective use of tax revenue.  Imagine directing resources towards development projects that bridge the gap between urban and rural areas, improving the quality of life for all.

Tax from when it came to existence have always been the government's source of income and will always be. Diversion of of public funds by government officials is one thing that's majorly affected the development of many countries but with my knowledge of how transparent the Brazilian government have been over the years and the ability of the country's security agencies to prosecute public office holders who decided to embezzle public funds, I don't think the primary reason of this particular policy concerning gambling companies and payment of taxes has anything to do with the personal interest of government officials in the country.
Corruption is without doubt one of the problems of Brazil as a country but the recent technology advancement in the country have made it very difficult for the country's politicians to embezzle money without being caught. I think it's absolutely a good thing to place tax on the gambling companies because they've been gaining from the public and should be mandated to pay taxes

Can gambling taxes be a source of revenue for development, or are they simply another tool for corrupt officials to enrich themselves? Imagine a scenario where a significant portion of this tax revenue gets diverted away from public services and into the pockets of a few.  Such a scenario would undermine the very purpose of taxation.

The concern about corruption in developing countries plagued by embezzlement is well-founded.  Without strong institutions and transparent governance, tax revenue can become a target for exploitation. However, dismissing taxation entirely throws away a potential source of income for public services.  This revenue could be used to improve education, healthcare, and infrastructure, benefiting everyone.

No question about taxes, every government in the world impose it, as it plays a crucial role in the development and overall well being of a country. However, I think it's too much for a bettor to have this kind of tax bracket. I mean some of us wants to gamble and have some fun, then it could be a double black eye for us if we are going to lose and then pay taxes? Or even if we win though, it will not be 100% as the hands of the government are already there when you cash-in your winnings. Probably the government wanted to curb gambling in Brazil, but for gamblers, it seems this is not fair if we are just talking about taxes. There are other ways for the government to get extra money, but not in the hands of gamblers. Just tax the operators or the casinos, not the players.

TBH, I just based it from op's post which I'm assuming is a local -- corrupt politician + not counting losses and 15% tax imposed regardless of the amount


Thanks for the input!

I personally like education more as an approach to gambling prevention which includes mental health awareness and mandatory integration of responsible gambling features, etc. because people have to realize what is wrong at some point.

Taxing like in brazil sounds like they just wanna get a slice of the pie.

15% is too much for small-time bettors. They know for the fact it's an unfair number.
When it gets tougher the government will really exercise its laws to make money.  But this would also mean that your government will allow more casinos built in your cities right?  Your president better have plans for those who get addicted.

From what I heard Lula is a populist president who won by landslide so I guess the majority of the people in Brazil agree with his laws.

I completely agree with you on this, Mate. Taxing bettors on their profits while ignoring their losses can be extremely unjust, and it is not a system that fosters fairness or equity. It appears that the government is setting individuals up for failure by taxing them regardless of the magnitude of their wins. I believe there are several other possible solutions to this problem, such as a system in which losses can be subtracted from gains before taxes are imposed.

It's true. Doesn't matter how much the gambler profited from gambling, he will have to pay 15% taxes to "Papai Lule" (Daddy Lula, in gender-neutral pronoun), nevertheless. That is a very harsh regulation, because even towards cryptocurrencies there is a minimum monthly negotiation size to be taxed. Below that line, it's tax free. Now regards gambling, it's much worse.

So much love comes with a price... This is the government of the love, as their marketing says. What is theirs belong to them, and what is yours also belong to them!

I'm on the same country, therefore I face the same regulations. Let's hope Bitcoin gambling can help gamblers to evade this bullshit. It's rare enough to profit from gambling, and once a gambler finally achieves doing this, he still has to give a big slice of the cake to the government. Governments are constantly trying to increase their sources of income, and now they are focusing the digital world in order to do so, especially now that sports betting are so popular in the country. The eyes of the politicians must really shine...

Until a while ago, the sports betting and casino sectors were not so popular and did not attract so much attention in Brazil
However, in 2022 / 2023, Brazilian soccer was invaded by advertising campaigns from casinos and bookmakers, and not only that, interest has also increased and many people with access to a smartphone and internet are betting in a very easy and simple way, which was not the case before

This has attracted a lot of attention from the government because they are missing out on millions in taxes, so they have acted quickly to implement this law
Now it's a question of how they're going to monitor it, since if the person doesn't draw on fiat, it's quite difficult

The way this law of taxation for gamblers is designed is quite unfair. I am not from your country, but in my opinion, the tax is not supposed to be applicable in such a way that gamblers should pay 15% of only the winnings they get. In such a case, I will say that the government is selfish because they don't care about the losses that gamblers are going to encounter. 

If such a law should be passed, I suggest that the 15% be taken from the money that the gambler wants to stake and not from their winnings. For example, if I want to stake $10, let 15% be taken out for taxation, and I will be left to only stake $8.5, which, if I win, will not pay tax again. That will be more fair than the already agreed-upon law. 

I am not against taxation, the money to support a country is supposed to come from somewhere, I guess, specially if we are talking about a government is which functional and takes care of the hardships of the people. Anyways, even though I think that way I do not think it is fair for gamblers to have to declare only their wins when comes to casinos and betting, the citizens of Brazil should also be able to declsre their losses due to gambling, so the government is aware of those losses and make exceptions on the taxation of such person, you know. I think there is a similar thing like that in the United States, where people is supposed to declare both their income and also their losses, so they get money in return from it.

It may be a sample of the inability of the Brazilian government to actually make exceptions on the taxation of gambling, for the sake of increasing the in flow of cash to the treasury.
Taxing gambling earning had always been a sensitive topic, in my opinion. Since we are talking about taking money from the good luck of others, it is as if the government had a stake on our own money and they will always get cash when we get lucky, but won't offer a hand with we blow it.

Rather unfair. I wonder how much of that money will end up in centers of rehabilitation for the gambling addicted population of Brazil...  

each country sets the laws they want, but there are countries that greatly exaggerate their laws, from what I saw of this law, in addition to the value of taxes being higher for the player in relation to the owner of the gambling company, there is also Another point that I disagree with is the rules for having betting houses in Brazil, as I could understand, the Brazilian government will require that a sports betting company be obliged to have a Brazilian citizen as the owner of 20% of the company, or If a sports betting site wants to obtain a license to operate in Brazil, then that sports betting site will only be given a license that proves that the sports betting site has Brazilian citizens with 20% shares as owner of the sports betting site.

Also from what I can understand, sports betting companies will have to pay 30 million Brazilian reais for the government to grant an exploration license. I honestly wonder which sports betting company would want to sell 20% of shares to a Brazilian person and still pay 30 million reais to the Brazilian government to obtain a license, 30 million reais is 6 million dollars, which sports betting company Will you pay 6 million dollars to operate in Brazil? imagine that I am an American citizen and I have my own sports betting company in which I own 100%, I want to expand my business to Brazil, I arrive in Brazil and read the laws and in the laws I see that I have to have a Brazilian partner, because I am forced to sell 20% of my company to a citizen of Brazil? and then I see that I must pay 6 million dollars in fees to the government to obtain a license valid for 5 years

It's not a lifetime license, it's something that every 5 years the company must pay 6 million dollars, I don't know if I'm misunderstanding the points of this law, but I read it all on this website which is in Portuguese and English:

https://www.mattosfilho.com.br/en/unico/regulating-sports-betting/

In my opinion, it is clear that the Brazilian government does not like sports betting and much less are they concerned about their people, they focused on making money and advantages with sports betting companies that want to operate in Brazil, and it is obvious that politicians and Brazilian rich people with political influence will pressure foreign betting companies that want to operate in Brazil to sell their shares to them, because only then will the foreign sports betting company have the chance to have a license and at the same time as the government of Brazil Brazil will make money from the 6 million dollars that the sports betting company pays in fees to the government. I highly doubt there will be many foreign sports betting companies that will do this

If they had taken account of the losses of the gambler it would have been nice - right now it feels like they want to pretend as if gamblers do not exist when there's a loss but as soon as they win they'll rush in to collect their tax not even calculating if the win has covered the previous loses that was experienced.

Fortunately for me, this type of regulation is not in my country although there was news about banning sports betting in my country it was all talk nothing was done. But if taxes like this are introduced in my country I'll have to reduce my activity and look for a means to still bet without conforming to such brutal regulation.

Am surprised to read such because in my country, I don't think I have heard of such even as it a major endeavor for those who are both employed and unemployed, male or female, young or old but seeking alternative source of income to live a better life.
This is unfair by the Brazilian government unless winning there is easy and more frequent than losses.

Also, the government might be trying to discourage more participation in gambling or betting hence why they are regulating it by taxing and don't care about the losses that might be incurred by the gamblers who may have either borrowed to gamble/bet or used monies meant for something else to gamble/bet.

Last I checked, your country also taxes and regulates crypto currency and the Nubank does allow funds to be transferred to cryptocurrency exchanges both within and outside the country that adhere to the Brazilian central bank policies. There's also cryptocurrency offices and ATMs in Brazil.
What am trying to say in summary is that your government has used the system of taxing every sector to get funds to improve the nGDP of the country. Am sure you have a better economy than many of the inflation ridden countries currently.

No I do not have a problem with such tax implementation.

Taxes are the lifeblood of the government- without such, the government machinery will render incapacitated in order to provide any security, benefit, and projects to the nation. As you can say, tax implementations have this reciprocal relationship with its citizens- the people will pay their corresponding taxes and the government will provide benefits due to such payment thereof. In an ideal world, this can greatly benefit all as this would result to a win-win situation to both the people and the government.

The problem lies on how tax is implemented and executed. There are instances where tax can be a tool to destroy, as said by the late Chief Justice Marshall.¹ While this may be the case, still, tax implementation is a necessary function for the government.

In its implementation to gambling, taxing such platform is severely needed due to its rising popularity. This can bring tons of revenue to the government; and in return the latter would provide more opportunities to its citizens.

---

1 https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/17/316/

It's still too early to say, but I can tell you that the population will not feel an improvement or receive a return from these taxes, the majority of this money collected is distributed among high-ranking government officials, as well as personal possessions of Brazilian politicians (i.e. corruption).

To give you an idea, I'll leave here the links that show what the current government is doing with the tax money collected, even with the increase in taxes, in less than 2 years in government, it managed to reverse the improvements in government management previous one (here is democracy where the president is chosen by vote by the people every 4 years) in less than 2 years of government.

Link 1, Link2.

Exactly, you hit the nail on the head.

This is too complicated, gambling is not even a winnable venture and yet people are paying 15% in every winning? That's insane, this law is not for the security of people or a casino, it's mostly to discourage gamling and would kill the industry soon.

I believe the right way to tax here is that the government will tax a casino on their monthly or daily income as casino wins most of the time if not all the time, so they can really pay taxes coming from their income. What would happen if a gambler will pay taxes? This scenario will happen.

Say a gambler has $1000 total bankroll used for gambling.

Day 1 he wins $500 less 15% =$15 goes to the gov (running balance $1485)
day 2 he loss $500.. no tax of course. ( running balance  $985)....

See, you are break even and yet you already loss $15.. and that's just taxes, what if we are betting in sports here where we get 1.90 odds, more like 10% juice for the house, so if you bet $1000, you'll win $900 only ( you loss $10), and that $900 will be tax by 15%..... no, no, no... This is too much of a tax.

That's not good when government is trying to look for ways to tax their people and they see the potential of gambling, your taxes for winning is 15%, here a lottery winner will have to bear 20% tax coming from his winning, on losses we don't have that yet maybe because the government is the one running some gambling platform here like lottery and physical casinos.

Our country is not that rich compared to gambling friendly countries where you don't have to pay for your winnings and your losses, but on third world country or where the country is very populous they need to find a source of income and revenue to sustain their services to their citizen.
If you're a gambling is a blessing if you're living on Europe where taxes in gambling is free.

In my country, there are no special regulations in the betting sector because all forms related to online betting are prohibited in my country.
I think it would be a good step for the government to collect revenue from online gambling because the circulation of money in online gambling is very large. But it would be better if the government did not impose too large a tax on online gambling.

A law that is contrary to naturally justice is harmful to the people and should not continue. If government wants to tax on winning then they should also compensate losing.



It is not fair on gambler, the government should face the agents or casinos who on a daily bases gets income accruing from losers money 


None that I know of. I have not seen gamber who won his game and he is paying for tax, no I don't think so but I believe the company agent should pay tax as income tax like a company operating in the country.


No I don't think so. To win gambling bet is not easy and so to charge tax on winning isn't fair because who takes care of losses when the gambler loses.

What a load of bullshit, that's what happens when politicians get so obsessed with getting money out of people that they end up thinking with their asses instead of their brains when drafting a law. I hope there is a law regarding poker that considers what happens at the tables as chips and not real money, if not I can already see that no poker player will be able to be a winner in Brazil, so the professionals will have to emigrate. For the rest of the casino games, even if they are EV games, the fact that they tax you when you win and do not allow you to deduct your losses means a much worse return than before.

I predict that there will be a significant drop in the revenue of casinos in the country. Let's see if they come to their senses and modify the law in the future.

The government wants to knows and will collect the sources of income from its citizens and used the data for their advantage in the term of apply tax for their citizens. That's happen in many countries so the government asked their citizens to gives explanation from their citizens about their incomes and the funds. That's normal happens to their citizens so they can't do anything excepts gives informations to their governments.

The government doesn't wants to knows about if their citizens lose their money and will takes tax from the winners. But for crypto gamblers, they will find out how they can hide their winnings, especially if they can convert their coins from one to another so they don't have to tells about their winning

The government will always want to take a cut of people's money, I guess, if people are playing at casinos with cryptocurrencies, what's the point of declaring that? leave your money in your wallet and everything is fine, no one has the power to take the money from your wallet.

If you are going to buy something using the profit from betting, try offering the seller to pay in cryptocurrencies, the seller will certainly not stop selling because of this, after all everyone wants money. It's good that it helps with the evangelization of bitcoin.

Actually, imposing taxes in country for the legality of gambling is something that can help the development of state finances and can usually be used for social purposes such as charity, aid or other positive things.
It just that some government people take advantage of the situation by imposing unreasonable taxes for personal interests or taking advantage of the imposition of taxes within country.

Gambling is an industry that involves lot of money circulating in it and gambling business owners who successfully develop will get huge profits from this business so that if there is tax then it is clear that the real tax must be borne by the gambling business owners.
Application of winnings tax to gamblers is actually just very sad thing, we gamble is full of risks and lose money which we should be able to accept ourselves, but when we win we are subject to winnings tax every month.
Clearly this is an unfair government system policy and with policy like this I think there will be more and more gamblers who avoid taxes at all costs.

I think all countries tax those casinos physically or online. The thing is, it's okay to pay taxes in order to bet or play gambling legally, and that's normal. What is not right is the percentage of taxes the government gets from the casino owner and its customers. I think the percentage is unreasonable, but again, what can we do right? The only thing we can do is accept it, or else we can't gamble or bet peacefully, right? About the fact that the government is not with us when we lose, it's common sense. What could the government do if you lose a bet? give you money? We don't have a choice; that's how the system works. If you don't want that, then find an illegal gambling site or an illegal casino so you will not be taxed when you win a gamble, but I bet you can gamble at peace.

Although the government aims to increase the legal security and revenue, it seems unfair that bettors are taxed on their winnings without consideration for their losses. It's also concerning that tax applies regardless of the size of winnings. The government should be balance and have fair taxation policies.

Yeah, it's highly regulated in here, and there are probably some changes coming on our regulations soon, buts for now we have only one betting agency owned by our government. Taxes on winnings are free, and jackpots are rather low, because of consumer laws and because lots of revenue that comes from betting goes to different kind of finnish charity organizations, for mental health organizations and such. Data for that is transparent. So we see winnings as pre-taxed, and we are fine with that. But what comes to taxing on winnings, it's tax free on whole EU.

Brazil is quite corrupted according to any world corruption rankings, so i am not sure how your laws are developed, but in here proposals or directives for taxes are more like guidelines, and could be changed and polished. For a brief moment we had tax laws for crypto trading that didn't cover financial losses. but as that caused outrage, they had to revisit the guidelines and make then sensible. And to me your law proposal seems just unfinished, and not thought out. It isn't convenient for either party in a long run.

I would probably be angry about taxing if our government was highly corrupt, but for now i am happy to pay extra, to have less corruption and for free public services we can trust. And taxes are one way to fight corruption, but that requires transparency, and to some that transparency for AML laws might seem invasive and government spying on them.

Sorry to say but it seems like Brazil can now only survive on the money the government makes from casino taxes it seems.  

15% from gamblers and 12% from casinos, isn't that looking like corruption on its own? Because this amount is alarming as if it's the only way the country can grow, this is a lot of money, imagine if Brazil has a million gamblers as a minimum.

If I am living in Brazil I will have to stop gambling because it's the most targeted for the Brazilian government right now, and if this tax is shifted to other things like businesses then it's a calling to leave the country behind.

Hearing that yours @porfirii is even up to 25% is disheartening, in my country gamblers don't pay any taxes but the casinos do pay heavily on tax settlement, which I believe is the way it should be, casinos are always making money, and they can afford it.

I don't know Brazil so well but from the article, it is state in there that some of the taxes for companies will be divided between areas such as education, health, tourism, public safety and sport. I presume the OP is a Brazilian, he should be in the best place to tell us if there has been improvements in the Brazil's education, health, tourism, public safety and sport sector since the passing of the law.

At first I thought aim was to reduce gambling addiction like one of the taxes in Australia but I was wrong. The president of Brazil has gone on a taxing spree. He is taxing everything and anything. And it is going to disproportionately affect the poor and middle class, with nearly 80% of income going towards taxes.

Yes, same here (Spain), but the rate is also higher than what the OP said for Brazil (ranges from 20% to 25% here).

If the OP is a gambler, I'm sorry to hear that from now on he will have to pay if he is successful if he was used to don't care about it. Financial management of gamblers is always hard, and having to add this new requirement to the equation complicates things even more.

The gambling sector in my country is regulated and gamblers also pay tax. But the difference is that you can fill your gamble losses as expenditure and get tax reductions. The government shouldn't only gain from tax will they will not also partake of the losses.

The government has the constitutional right to seek for means of making more money to enable it to meet the needs of its citizens. But such laws should be fair and not one-sided. These policymakers should take into consideration that gambling is risky and people have been losing funds before they finally got a win. Tax should be calculated after deducting total expenses from the win.

Here in my country too the taxation works the same, there is no compensation for the loss we made but taxes will be cut down from the rewards straight away and if I am not wrong that's how taxation on gambling works in most part of the world. From individual perspective it seems unfair to collect taxes in every possible way from their citizen but they say it will be used for the development of the country thus including yourself too.

It's not security, they just want more ways to get money for themselves through taxes, that's how they do things in most country right? I would only support this kind of thing that the government does when I know that the money that's being taxed is being used to fund projects that benefit the many without harming any person then I'd gladly pay my taxes but if I don't see any welfare programs, public works and other government programs that help the general population then I would definitely never ever support it because that would only mean that I'm going to be enabling more money being pocketed by corrupt officials and that doesn't sit right with me in any shape or form. Brazilian government is probably needing all the money that they can get to use it on some public works that have been overbudget, I've heard that there's some parts of the country that are so bad that it's difficult to live in it.

Brazil is a great betting market, and in the world of poker they create excellent traffic. In these parts, Brazil is always the country that has the most players, both online and in person.

Regarding the matter, OP, it is not a surprise, it is something that has been happening, and in fact I would say that Brazil is very late. Countries like Spain are strict with the subject of betting, in that sense, one can see the emigration of high rollers to other latitudes in Europe where even the profits from these tax concepts are ridiculous for the payment of taxes.

In my case I have to pay taxes on my gross income. Casinos have taxes around 30% to 45%.(+`/-)

I also asked myself the same thing, but the government is the government, the important thing is to tax, it doesn't matter who pays the bill.

Reading each of your opinions, I see that the majority finds it absurd how much brazil wants to charge in taxes, but friends, this will only encourage bettors to migrate to casino hosted in other countries, 'cause how can the government prevent the traffic from these users to other countries?

This will only make bettors find better alternatives to continue betting, consequently they'll get to know cryptos and voila, it's done. At the end of it all, the government will collect less (laffer curve), with crypto like Bitcoin, LTC, etc. we can transfer and receive from any place in the world.

That's not a huge cut considering the average tax levied on gambling around the world. Generally, it's casino operators that are subjected to much more tax and a 15% individual tax on win is not huge. And I don't think it's taxed for every win on bet for casino gaming but for overall amount won on a sitting. Because it could be difficult to calculate that and the person might be charged more than it ever gambled. It's not a bid deal to give 15% of the extra money you are walking away in few hours.
Taxing casino would not only increase the revenue of the government but also makes the gambling industry transparent.

Although not an online gambling site, the same thing is happening here near us. The cockpit. I've received news from their patrons that the winning amount is already cut by 10 - 15 percent. And of course, they are getting more money from the business itself which we don't know how much.

I was shocked for a bit to hear how much money they are taking from the patrons, I mean you will not even feel the profit if you don't bet large to one rooster because of the tax. Still, there are many people who gather in the place.
It will depend though if there will be changes in the city. In our case, I've seen new roads being established, streetlights being installed and the city hall itself was like a futuristic building. So, I guess the money that they get from the cockpit is going to something good, that's why you won't see people going against it.

I think it's just fair for gambling companies to be taxed. And I also think it's just fair for gambling winnings to be taxed. But there should be a higher threshold below which winnings are exempted from taxes.

There are also existing tax regulations in my country as regards gambling winnings. I think it's even harsher here save for the fact that our government is very weak in terms policy implementation.

If I'm not mistaken, all winnings big and small coming from gambling will be taxed. Small winnings are subject to ordinary income tax. Winnings above ₱10,000 ($178.23), however, shall be subject to 20% tax. Now, that's harsh.

Right? If casino taxes are that low, at least make them pay the player's winnings tax out of pocket too. It's not gonna cost them that much. Some of their most played games like slots have crazy high house edge so they get like 3 to 5% of their turnover as profit. Which should be millions of dollars in each given day. From that they could comfortable cover the winnings taxes of gamblers.

It's so odd that governments will go the extra mile to tax players but leave huge entities such as online casinos unscathed when it comes to taxes. Hopefully the scales will be tipped sooner than later. Lula is supposedly a leftist and he should have thought of taxing corporations more before people.

I can understand the 12% tax on revenues for gambling businesses but the 15% on the individual is insane. At least there's a set minimum amount that would be taxed but why is the rate too high for ordinary sports bettors? Most of them are not making profits from gambling so that part doesn't make sense to me.

It's fucked up that people who gamble need to pay 15% if they won but casino companies only need to pay 12%. though casino revenue is big it still doesn't change the fact that they will still charge higher to their average citizen compare to the companies. it is quite sad.

Government being government. Always scheming and on the lookout for how they could raise revenue through more taxation. I’m all for paying taxes especially when I’m reassured through seeing social amenities working fine.  I don’t think I’ll feel obligated in any way to pay such a tax.
Increasing legal security isn’t likely the lead point on why this tax was brought about. Perhaps this could also be an avenue to reduce the rate of gambling in the country and if so, I doubt it would make any significant change.

It’s crazy one would have to be paying a certain amount of your winnings to the government.

Honestly, posting here in a pseudonymous account, I'm not afraid to say that gambling in crypto is for me a way to avoid such ridiculous law. Greece has a better GDP per capita than Brazil and yet over here if you win above 100 EUR in gambling you're immediately taxed.

It's crazy that governments will try to tax the working man so much and even get in our wallets when we might get a lucky break through gambling. 15% might be considered on the low side for gambling profits but rightly so as OP puts it, it doesn't take into account losses in many occasions. The ruling parties should focus on dismantling generational wealth and the ultra-rich heirs instead of getting so deep in the pockets of people that live paycheck to paycheck.

I've heard at least mr. Lula's government is doing many things to prevent corporations from getting tax cuts and actually raised some taxes for big capital holders. Which is a step in the right direction for these matters. If I was a Brazilian I'd play with crypto and keep my gambling profits untaxed without any remorse. The billionaires need to pay their fair share too. Make them pay 15% of their wealth and then I'd pay up too.  

I'm not against taxes as long as it's not gonna be pocketed and the taxable scenarios as well as the tax percentage are made in respect of each possible cases. Sadly, I don't think this is what's happening here.

But with gambling being stigmatized, I wouldn't be surprised if the goverment think of the high taxes as a morale boost for them. Simultaneously, they're not completely banning the industry so they'll be keeping the usual part of the cash flow from operators  

But in the coming months or year, we'll see how many players will shift to off-shore betting sites lol.

So in total the government is getting  15% + 12%=27% of each bets across all the casinos operating in Brazil region, well many of the under developed countries have seen taxation as means to embezle citizens money even though the government's are headed by corrupt politicians who may have ranged their ways into power and are living large on the common wealth of the countries.

I am not against taxation,  but what makes in implementation worrisome in some situations I the way and manner at which those at the helm of affairs manage those resources to serve the betterment of the whole instead of just sharing among the few.

I guess we should be ready for more regulations in time to Come because most of the countries around the world are just waking up to the issue of taxation and many are taking a more aggressive approach to it.

Sorry, they make the rules and can bend it to their favour anyhow they like. What I think about this is that they are doing this to discourage gambling addiction. Thus in addition to other risk management strategies individuals in Brazil who bet will add the government's 15% as a factor and know they will manage the risk of losing a part of their winnings.
I expected that the tax on gambling operators would be higher like 20% since they make more money than the individual. Of course they house always wins.
In my country, we do not have the same tax although I wish something like this existed. Gambling is not regulated so any person with a smart phone can create an sign up and deposit money into a casino to bet.
I would only agree if they review the impact of this law in the gambling industry after 5 years and it actually curbed gambling addiction. Isn't this the goal of the law?

Since last year, here in my country (brazil), it has been discussed by the senate and from what I researched, in 2024/jan the law came into force that taxes bets of any nature involving online and physical bets. (link)

The purpose of the law is to increase legal security in the betting sector in Brazil, (taxing revenue from bettors for the government? LOL)

In nutshell: bettors will have to pay 15% on the winnings received from any bets, regardless of whether the reward is small or large, and companies will have to pay 12% on revenue.

This is for physical bets or bets made online.

Lula (thief corrupt president) vetoed income tax for winnings from bets of up to R$2112 (~425 USD) per month.

The funny thing is that he didn't take into account the loss that bettors have before calculating the tax (that's a lot of bullshit).

Summary of the story: the government wants to be our partner only in gains, but in losses, we alone are forced to bear the financial losses. Very convenient, right?

What do you think of this? Is there any regulation in the betting sector in your country?

Do you think the government should really collect alternative sources of income from its citizens such as online gambling?