Do they get paid more than cops?
Its been a few years but last time I was a student put out by teacher strikes teachers here were paid more than cops
Topic: Chicago Teachers Have the Highest Salary in The States. Yet, they are on strike (Read 2836 times)
September 13, 2012, 02:49:42 PM
September 13, 2012, 02:43:03 PM
To be fair, the cost of living in Chicago is high, and some of their gripes are legit (e.g., lack of air conditioning in a room full of rambunctious 6-year-olds) but yeah, this is awful. My wife is* a public school teacher, and even she thinks this is awful. Then again, she lives by the "It's all about what's best for the kids" motto about as strictly as anyone could.
And yeah, education reform is in order, and charter school experimentation should be a part of this process. But I think we need to stop over-obsessing on standardized testing (and the concomitant pedagogical necessity to "teach to the test" and demand lots of rote memorization), and look at what Finland's been doing over the last few decades, i.e., focusing on the critical-thinking and problem-solving skills that help one negotiate todays career-oriented (as opposed to "job"-oriented) economy.
*Or, well, was. She just got laid-off due to savage cuts to public education in our state. All teachers with less than four years of experience got axed (layoffs determined by seniority; we sure wish we could get that $700+ we gave the union back). Gym, art and music classes may be eliminated entirely, at least temporarily.
And yeah, education reform is in order, and charter school experimentation should be a part of this process. But I think we need to stop over-obsessing on standardized testing (and the concomitant pedagogical necessity to "teach to the test" and demand lots of rote memorization), and look at what Finland's been doing over the last few decades, i.e., focusing on the critical-thinking and problem-solving skills that help one negotiate todays career-oriented (as opposed to "job"-oriented) economy.
*Or, well, was. She just got laid-off due to savage cuts to public education in our state. All teachers with less than four years of experience got axed (layoffs determined by seniority; we sure wish we could get that $700+ we gave the union back). Gym, art and music classes may be eliminated entirely, at least temporarily.
September 13, 2012, 12:33:58 PM
I disagree with the laws that give unions special powers. I don't disagree with unions themselves - heck, if people want to band together and all go on strike at the same time, more power to 'em. But their jobs shouldn't be preserved (unless the employer chooses to preserve them).
That said, I recently accepted a state/unionized job. Even though I don't agree with it, doesn't mean I won't reap the benefits of them while they're still around (and my tax dollars are helping to pay for them)!
That said, I recently accepted a state/unionized job. Even though I don't agree with it, doesn't mean I won't reap the benefits of them while they're still around (and my tax dollars are helping to pay for them)!
September 13, 2012, 09:51:30 AM
If Chicago teachers were producing results this would make sense to pay them the most AND to have public unions. I have family working in the public education system, so I want them to be taken care of, but its a complicated issue. Why not just OLPC kids and let them learn on their own? khanacademy FTW! At any rate something else needs to be tried. Lets get the cost down and the results up. Its the INFORMATION age, how hard can it be to trick kids into learning? Just put some math into WoW so they can get a golden griffen (or whatever other bullshit).
oh, and for those of you who haven't seen it, Waiting for Superman is a documentary that looks at public education in the US. I found it hard to watch, but well worth it.
oh, and for those of you who haven't seen it, Waiting for Superman is a documentary that looks at public education in the US. I found it hard to watch, but well worth it.
September 13, 2012, 09:48:45 AM
I have only thing to say, public unions shouldn't be allowed. Otherwise strike away.
September 13, 2012, 09:46:18 AM
http://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=211410
It's understandable why the teachers are so desperate to keep their jobs and benefits. They will literally die without hundreds of dollars of pills every month to keep their self-induced diabetes at bay.
They have absolutely no skills that any employer would pay for, and even if they could get a job flipping burgers they'd never be able to afford their meds.
It's understandable why the teachers are so desperate to keep their jobs and benefits. They will literally die without hundreds of dollars of pills every month to keep their self-induced diabetes at bay.
They have absolutely no skills that any employer would pay for, and even if they could get a job flipping burgers they'd never be able to afford their meds.
September 13, 2012, 09:41:29 AM
Yes! because until we are all poor, no one is truly free! 
The education system, the students and the taxpayers are being turned poor in this case.
September 13, 2012, 09:02:43 AM
Yes! because until we are all poor, no one is truly free!
September 13, 2012, 08:58:31 AM
Public sector unions are going to devour everything in their path like a plague of locusts.
September 13, 2012, 06:16:50 AM
I mean those teachers must really care about the education of their students. Look at all this time they are spending not teaching them.
September 13, 2012, 02:57:07 AM
I forgot if double posting, or being accused of editing is worse, but I ate a bit of my post, and plum forgot to add that I've never seen that Waiting for Superman movie, so I have no opinion on that, and I'm still looking for examples of Chicago teachers being sent to jail and then having a job waiting for them.
ironically EDITed for grammar typos but also
ironically EDITed for grammar typos but also
September 13, 2012, 02:44:34 AM
they arent allowed to fire them........ read up on the fucked up laws. even if they get sent to prison they have a job waiting for them when they get out usually. the process to fire a teacher is next to impossible. someone needs to change those laws and get rid of the bad teachers. i watched a documentary about it (waiting for superman) (i think???) they turned down a 50% base pay increase that couldnt be reduced in exchange for the ability to hire/fire teachers based on performance so that we would be left with GOOD teachers. the union was offered a 10% pay increase to even consider the offer and take it to a vote. THEY TURNED IT DOWN THOSE MOTHERFUCKERS.
Except for teachers not being able to be fired I agree with everything you say right up until THOSE MFers. Teachers get fired all the time, unfortunately it's usually for sex or drugs, and not repeated
How do you propose teachers get rated and reviewed? I've turned down pay increases because they relied on performance reviews that were either unspecified or too unpredictable. Just cause all my students do well on a test doesn't mean I'm a good teacher, for instance. To me you would have to track the students far beyond the 1 year a specific teacher has with a child.
Absolutely, bad teachers need to be offered training, and if they still can't cut it after about 3 years, then it would be great if someone who could do the job better would stand up and do it.
But hating on teachers and their benefits. How about we work to make sure everyone has these benefits.
September 13, 2012, 01:46:26 AM
I think public sector unions will be my sole reason for voting republican this year
September 13, 2012, 01:44:09 AM
they arent allowed to fire them........ read up on the fucked up laws. even if they get sent to prison they have a job waiting for them when they get out usually. the process to fire a teacher is next to impossible. someone needs to change those laws and get rid of the bad teachers. i watched a documentary about it (waiting for superman) (i think???) they turned down a 50% base pay increase that couldnt be reduced in exchange for the ability to hire/fire teachers based on performance so that we would be left with GOOD teachers. the union was offered a 10% pay increase to even consider the offer and take it to a vote. THEY TURNED IT DOWN THOSE MOTHERFUCKERS.
September 13, 2012, 01:41:03 AM
We elect people to deal with public unions.
If teaching is such a secure job with tons of benefits and paid vacations then why isn't everyone trying to be a teacher?
If teaching is such a secure job with tons of benefits and paid vacations then why isn't everyone trying to be a teacher?
September 13, 2012, 01:03:40 AM
Fire them all!
There are plenty of unemployed Americans (~10%) that would love to have a cushy, secure job with tons of benefits and paid vacations.
There are plenty of unemployed Americans (~10%) that would love to have a cushy, secure job with tons of benefits and paid vacations.
This would be pretty much the best thing ever. I really hope it happens, but it never does.
Reagan did it. He knew the only way to deal with communist union thugs is to take them out back and shoot them!
Peace through Strength
September 12, 2012, 11:46:00 PM
Fire them all!
There are plenty of unemployed Americans (~10%) that would love to have a cushy, secure job with tons of benefits and paid vacations.
There are plenty of unemployed Americans (~10%) that would love to have a cushy, secure job with tons of benefits and paid vacations.
This would be pretty much the best thing ever. I really hope it happens, but it never does.
September 12, 2012, 11:42:16 PM
Fire them all!
There are plenty of unemployed Americans (~10%) that would love to have a cushy, secure job with tons of benefits and paid vacations.
There are plenty of unemployed Americans (~10%) that would love to have a cushy, secure job with tons of benefits and paid vacations.
September 12, 2012, 11:11:31 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=ywNfLJjOs1g
Tell me why, why should public sector workers be able to unionize when 1) the taxpayer can't directly negotiate with them and 2) the state has no incentive to pay these teachers a reasonable wage for both the taxpayers and the teachers -- at least until the taxpayers take out the pitchforks and strike as well?
Tell me why, why should public sector workers be able to unionize when 1) the taxpayer can't directly negotiate with them and 2) the state has no incentive to pay these teachers a reasonable wage for both the taxpayers and the teachers -- at least until the taxpayers take out the pitchforks and strike as well?
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