Topic: Cloudbet scammed me for 1BTC (Read 629 times)

You have a very vivid imagination. I didn't say it's your fault for receiving marketing emails. I said it's your fault if you gamble, be it on Cloudbet or any other regulated or non regulated gambling site. Whose fault do you want it to be, mine, God's? 

Sure they can, and they probably are. But your decision to gamble or not lies on you, not Cloudbet.

You have to make up your mind. I was jealous and spiteful of your ability to gamble away 2 Bitcoin a few posts ago, remember? Now, you are saying I am one of them. I am either a jealous c**t or a Cloudbet team member.

Sad as that may be, what do you want me to do about it? Anything I do to myself is my fault, and anything you do to yourself is yours.

So once again it’s my fault I’m receiving marketing emails now lmao even after everything? Guessing cigarette companies can also walk into primary schools and promote ciggies and it’s the schools fault for not locking the front  gate.
Cloudbet just can’t do anything wrong in your book can they? Sounds like I’m talking to the Cloudbet guys here under an alias or someone who’s definitely in bed with them lol.

Also, take responsibility and get my life in order?
I’ve explained my vulnerability, mental health issues and battles I’m facing and you are now well aware of it prior to your post.
Im permanently psychologically incapacited, I’m being treated by 3 medical practitioners and a psychiatrist for 13 months and you want me to just take responsibility and get my life in order?

Let me guess, that’s my fault too and I shouldn’t have the internet if I’m sick?
I shouldn’t have an email address? I shouldn’t have money?
That’s my fault too?

Your actually disgusting.

You are disgusting and pathetic.

If I back them, wouldn't I be, logically, not asking for the other cases against them? Why would I dig the dirts of the entity I back up and air their dirty clothes in public? I'll just let it go the first time I got a chance when you didn't talk about it anymore. Yet, I keep asking for the rest of these scam accusations. Why? Because, as I've said, I couldn't care less with proving cloudbet is the right one here, or, as it turns out, they have a lot of skeleton in their closet. Truth is truth. So? May I ask once again?

Marketing emails have an unsubscribe button most of the time, so unsubscribe yourself from such offers. Why you have started receiving such emails and why you still are is something you should know, not anyone else. Me not agreeing with you that you should receive the money you lost back is a completely different issue from what Cloudbet is doing. Both holydarkness and myself have tried to explain it to you.

Yes, that's correct. If you deposit money on any casino right now and lose it, it's your own fault. Look at me right now not depositing and playing on Cloudbet. Take responsibility for your actions and get your life in order, no one else will do it for you.

One thing is clear: They are aware that I’m in a prohibited jurisdiction, they are aware of my exclusions, my vulnerability and they are aware of my mental health problems now right?
Yet I still receive marketing emails, even after all this.

This is Cloudbet for you and the dodgy company you have decided to back on this matter.
https://imageupload.io/scyvcYBuZrplHky

Now based on your logic, if I were to now again go access my account, deposit funds and place bets - I’d be entirely accountable once again and to have no right to question Cloudbets responsibility on the matter? Despite them doing the wrong things and exploiting my situation, none of that matters right?

Boohoo me, tough luck, I lost - there’s no issue here…. Right? Pathetic.

This should have been the only focus of your thread instead of repeated requests to get your money back if you wanted to warn the community, but it wasn't.

I saw what you posted but it was several weeks ago. I took another look now and realized that what I believed was a screenshot taken from their website, is in fact the email you were talking about.

I have explained many times what I consider a scam. It doesn't involve not receiving a refund on the money that was lost gambling no matter how many times you are going to repeat it.

You're free to think whatever you like about how I see or feel about you, doesn't change the fact that if your claim is true --that from the start your intention is to warn the community and deter Cloudbet's scammy behaviour instead of for your own agenda-- then you'll gladly provide the rest of that list of 70+ accusation, as it's one of the way to warn gamblers on this forum, and because my feeling about you --whatever you think that is-- doesn't change what fact and evidence provided on those record of cases against Cloudbet. So, I'm waiting.

The amount of effort you put whilst simultaneously being ignorant of all  of the facts astonishes me.
It’s come to the point where  Your making more accusations than I am in this thread lmao.
One thing is clear, you don’t like me. Whether or not you support cloudbet, in this particular thread you want them to victor and get away with what they’ve done.

That is clear.

I shared the marketing emails, the false content on their website and communication with their online chat representative lying.
I also have evidence of their terms and conditions being changed and this can be proven with the new alert email that Australian accounts were suddenly restricted. Simultaneously this was added to their terms and conditions.
Perhaps you just havnt bothered to dive in and see what I’ve posted, rather you are only interested in isolated parts of this forum post.

I’m not questioning their reputation and whether or not their dishonest. I’ve blatantly proven it time and time again with evidence.
You continue to deny this being a legitimate scam accusation, when the meaning of scam is a “dishonest scheme” in most instances for financial gain. I’m not sure how many more times I have to write out the dictionary meaning before you acknowledge it.

It almost seems like you think a scam means someone putting a gun to another’s head, which just isn’t the case.

I have already answered this question to some degree. The name of this board is Scam Accusations. A scam needs to happen for there to be a valid scam accusation. A scam did not happen in your case. Your loss of money resulted from wrong betting decisions not from Cloudbet not paying you. There was nothing to pay because the money was lost.

Also the title of your thread is that you were scammed, and I don't see it that way. You have also stated multiple times you want your money back so I don't buy the story about you warning the community. That's way down on your priority list. 

Here is how this thread should have looked.
First of all, it should have been posted under Reputation. You are questioning the operator's reputation and honesty because they gave you the wrong information. There needs to be proof of all that that corresponds with the information posted on Cloudbet's site. I understand it's going to be hard to collect that if they changed their TOS. Unfortunately, that's the way it is. In a court of law, it's about what you can prove, not what you know. I can't remember, but I think you never shared those promotional emails you received from Cloudbet, did you?

If such a thread is created pointing out Cloudbet's dishonestly and not talking about wanting your money back, the responses could be much more positive.   

Umm... sorry, but... who goes to a witch hunt, again? Let's trace it back.

Your first thread is about how Cloudbet "exploited" your weakness, of which, within your opening post, you argued that they should void your loses since you're betting on prohibited jurisdiction.

And later, you also accuse CasinoGuru, an arbitrator, as a platform that's on Cloudbet's payroll because they're taking referral [of which the purpose had been made clear to you over and over]. The reason behind this? Because CG ruled your complaint as rejected, for the reason that's more or less as described on your previous thread [above] and this thread. Being asked why were you OK with AG to take the same "payroll" [i.e. referral], and was it just because they accepted your negative review so you're ok with that, the thread suddenly not attended anymore.

On your first thread too, I serve my findings of your accusation [from the thread about CG] that there are 70+ cases against Cloudbet, where, 35 out of 36 of it were solved, and the other 1 is inconclusive. I asked you to give the rest so I can take another look and gained better perspective of Cloudbet's situation.

Your answer? None. You didn't address that query at all. Nor that it ever being mentioned again. I guess we can assume it's another straw failed to be grasped.

Instead, you made another thread, this thread, under a reason that there is a development for your case. Though up to this day, I can't see why the need of another thread while you can simply edited the opening post with the development [you edited the first post on that thread earlier, so it's pretty much safe to assume you know how to edit a post].

Now, if your intention is simply and purely to raise an awareness about cloudbet and deter their bad behaviour, IMO, from my perspective, you can also move that topic about 70+ cases [I've told you that I am waiting for the second batch] here too. But no, the topic does not goes any further. Probably because with half of it turns out to be solved, it didn't serve as a good basis for your case, so you leave it.

So, who does a witch hunt, again?

While we're at it, if I may give voice to my opinion, I think your initial attempt is truly to peer pressuring them into paying your lost bet by voiding it, and when the story didn't work as you planned, you changed the narrative, just now, by saying that it's not in your intention at all to ask for the refund and instead, you simply tried to warn them.

But sure, let's put all those behind us, let's address what your heart truly desire. You care about the community from cloudbet's deceptive behaviour? Compile me that list, and see where the forum goes from that.

Just to make it clear, again, I couldn't care less with proving Cloudbet is the right one here, I am not on their payroll, not their staff, not affiliated by them by any degree. This is why I ask you to provide me with the list, to see if they're indeed proven to have bad reputation.

Exactly, if anything your proving my point. I’ve already initiated proceedings in my jurisdiction inseeking a foreign judgement to recoup my funds - so although attaining my money back is on the agenda, it’s  not here on Bitcointalk.

Posting here on bitcointalk is NOT an attempt to get my money back because there is clearly 0 chance of that given the circumstances. Cloudbet was asked to respond here and they didn’t, nor do they reply to emails or respond in any way that I have communicated in the past. That hope was long lost a long time ago. This is a scam accusation publically made about Cloudbets false advertisements, lies told by their live chat support and whilst claiming to be Australian, they swiftly then restricted Australian accounts after my complaint.

I’ve provided evidence for all of my claims and I’ve explained how these lies lead to me depositing and wagering 1BTC. This is exactly what the scam accusation thread is for.

The meaning of scam is a dishonest scheme - which ultimately refers to Cloudbets false representations I’ve outlined for Yous.

The only reason why we’re going around in circles is because you and PMALEK have turned this into a witch hunt and shifted this entire post into an attack on my decisions and gambling mistakes, rather than focusing on the issues I highlighted. This is why I came to the conclusion that your judgement and language has an element of spite towards gambling in itself or the amount of money that was lost.


I did prove that and gave a timeline of all of those things already, so why aren’t your replies any different lmao

Umm... Nope, it's pretty clear for anyone following your case from the beginning that you're aiming for a refund, these two snippets of your own words on this thread only, for example,



and then there's this attempt to sue them and using foreign judgement reinforcement to refund you. Were all those simply to deter other user from falling into the same trap? Not an attempt to get them to return your deposit?

This is what Pmalek and I say that your case and cloudbet's jurisdiction case should be two different things. Because if you simply has concern for the community, you'll probably meet with different reactions, what made you get into where you are right now is because you have your own agenda, namely to get a hand in your deposit, funds that you dealt in bad faith.

So, which is it?

The essence of your thread is that you think you got tricked and baited into gambling on Cloudbet, and that you feel that you should get back the money you lost gambling. I don't think you should, and I don't see anyone here saying anything else.

However, if the main points of this discussion were Cloudbet's wrong claims that they are a regulated online casino in Australia, and you could prove that Australians weren't allowed to gamble there at the time you received those marketing emails and signed up, my replies here would be very much different. But a player who bets, losses their bets, and then wants their money back is not something I agree with.   

Yes, except the terms and conditions can not be trusted and  cloudbet manually changing theirs during my complaint is a great example of that.

Also, that’s exactly what I’ve asked them to comment on, their false claims. Maybe your finally starting to get it

You are or you're, not your. Have you ever used a dictionary or seen the inside of a classroom? 

Anyone thinking of gambling anywhere should think twice about it and ensure they are doing the right thing. Checking a casino's reputation and reading its terms and conditions are the first things any player should do.

I see no point in them answering a player who gambled and lost and now wants their money back. A different and valid topic of discussion would be why they are claiming they were a regulated casino in Australia if they weren't.

I understand my part of the responsibility in this matter and I also understand that no one here can help.

I’ve shared my story because there is going to be someone out there thinking of throwing all of their money at Cloudbet, second guessing themselves and hopefully my post deters them from doing that.
I’ve also shared the link with Cloudbet in hopes for them to respond publically, which they chose not to do (which speaks volumes).

I didn’t ask nor do I need users to manipulate this forum post, clearly ignoring all of Cloudbets wrongdoings that I’ve shared and target me as someone who had bad intentions. These users clearly have a chip in their shoulder and based on their hostile language, I’m beginning to think it’s due to them pondering  all that they could have done with that kind of money, but don’t have it.

Then this goes back to you not understanding the meaning of “scam” to begin with lol and I’d be wasting my time replying to you until you pick up a dictionary and know what your even arguing about.

You said that you self-excluded yourself, meaning you can't gamble on licensed Australian bookies. You also knew that you couldn't pass verification on licensed Australian bookies because of your self-exclusion. Signing up in the first place, shows ulterior motives. 

Yes, it is because you weren't scammed. You lost your money gambling. I am not going to get tired of pointing out the difference. There is no scam because the money was lost. You lost the bets you made. If you won and wanted to withdraw but the casino didn't allow it, that's a scam. In your case, it's an example of a person who wants to get back the money they lost gambling.

If you have such serious health problems that can obviously result in serious financial losses, you should in some way limit access to your money in such a way that you cannot easily be tempted to throw away tens of thousands of dollars. As much as that online casino is to blame because it shouldn't have sent you an e-mail and it shouldn't have targeted users in a country where it doesn't have a license to operate, it's just as much your fault because you registered, made a deposit and gambled, and in the end you lost.

If there is a similar case in which the deposit was returned to another user, then you have to fight through legal means to achieve the same right - and the fact is that none of us can help that to happen.

You ask the same questions over and over again.
I answer everything you ask and it’s like it goes through one ear and comes out the other.
I’ve shared certified medical documentation saying that I am permanantly incapacited with mental health problems to the point where I am unable to work or fulfill tasks.

Do not ask me or question me why i signed up again. I am easily fooled and can be taken advantage of and I’ve proven that with medical documentation to LCB moderators.

Worry less about why I signed up, and focus more on why I was lied to by an operator who ultimately scammed me because they were dishonest for financial gain.

If you weren’t getting the support of each other, perhaps you wouldn’t be so hostile towards me in an attempt make me feel stupid and at fault. Your feeding off each other and it’s getting rather annoying.

Your either associated with Cloudbet or your broke and  feel spiteful that someone could “gamble” that much money and it’s effecting your judgement on the matter.

This whole scam accusation thread, and the condition you're in, will not exist if you didn't sign up with them on the first place, realizing that you shouldn't be able to play on them legally due to your own self-exclusion. You said that you have no bad intention when you sign up, then can you tell everybody here why did you still signed up although you know there's a restriction against you playing that you set yourself? And, as you stated yourself, you won't complain if you win.

How is that not a bad faith? You read an advertisement, you know you can't play, still play anyway. If you won and managed to withdraw your winning, you won't complain, if you experienced an issue, you'll... well, here we are.

So yeah, this whole scam accusation is flawed, you raise it simply because you lose on the "game" you tried to play them.

Let me correct you here. It’s both mine and the operators responsibility to abide by the laws of my jurisdiction (this is also included in Cloudbets Curacao license fyi).
They lied that they were legal, licensed and compliant - which ultimately lead to me signing up so although I share responsibility - that argument becomes flawed given I was fooled into a false representation by the operator.

You also called this a “flawed” scam accusation.
The meaning of scam is a dishonest scheme for your own gain. This is not a flawed scam accusation, I’ve submitted enough evidence and screenshots to prove Cloudbets dishonesty. Perhaps the reason you keep challenging is that you havnt grasped the meaning of a scam to begin with.

Also, The terms and conditions you sent becomes invalid when your actively lured into breaking those exact terms you shared by the operator who set them..

wow, i  agree 100%

Abzzy while i fully sympathise with  you, the money is gone and your time would be well spent  on your future instead of the past, There is very very low chance u will get the coins back and its not beneficial to waste more resources chasing it... all the best

No, the amount doesn't matter, and that wasn't the point of the post. What matters is your mistake in gambling with an amount you didn't want to lose, hence this flawed scam accusation.

No, it's not spite or jealousy, or the lack of a decent amount of collected BTC during the years. You can try to turn this into something personal of me against you but it's not going to work. Don't gamble what you can't afford to lose and then come here to say, you know what, I shouldn't have been allowed to gamble in the first place, so I want my money back.

It's your responsibility to adhere to the laws of the territory you reside in. If Australia prohibits online gambling in unlicensed online casinos, you are the one that needs to ensure where you can and can't play regardless of what anyone tells you on the street, online, or via marketing materials. You broke your nations gambling laws.

Here are two points you might find interesting from Cloudbet's T&Cs:
https://www.cloudbet.com/en/help/terms

What is $10 to one person may be 1 Bitcoin to another, so once again your logic is flawed as the amount doesn’t change right and wrong and certainly doesn’t mean I burdon the entire blame.

Perhaps your bias because you can’t imagine yourself ever having, let alone betting 1 Bitcoin so there’s a sense of spite? I’m not sure but that’s what I’m starting to feel based i. Your language and views throughout this discussion.

So, you are comparing your situation where you gambled and lost to a huge Ponzi scheme and its organizer who defrauded people of tens of billions of dollars? Apples and oranges.

Exactly, because he ran a Ponzi scheme and stole money. You gambled your money away on an online casino and now you want it back.

Dear Abzzy, you have a very serious problem with gambling, which is the reason you deposited not $1 or $10 but 1 Bitcoin and lost it. The sooner you realize it's your fault, the sooner the recovery process can start. You will never recover by blaming me or other people for your misfortunes.

So I guess everyone who invested with Bernie Madoff (google him if you don’t know) also isn’t owed anything.
Because they lost their money investing/stock market? NO
He lied to his clients, falsified facts of what he was doing/where  the money was going and ultimately got exposed. He got sentenced to 150 YEARS in prisons

No one victimised the investors for bad decisions, the Ponzi scheme liar was held accountable due to lying  for financial gain.
Which is exactly what I’ve proven Cloudbet to be doing.

You sound like you have a serious problem with the concept of gambling and it’s impacting your judgement on this matter. I can’t think of why else you’ve shoved all of the false statements and lies from Cloudbet aside and targeted me as at fault.

I have come to my conclusions based on everything I have seen and read here. I have no relationship with Cloudbet nor do I care about them one bit. If they owed you money, I would be one of the people sending them PMs asking for them to respond here. I have done that in the past several times. But they don't owe you anything because you lost it gambling. 

To both of you.

Using  statements like “not an innocent victim” , “intelligent enough to take advantage” , “got himself a loophole and tried to manipulate it”  is DISGUSTING after I’ve literally told you multiple times that I’m permanently incapacitated to the point where I am unfit to work a job or fulfil any meaningful tasks.

I’m not permanently excluded from gambling  strictly due to having a gambling problem but because I have psychological injuries and I’m mentally vulnerable.

I forwarded my certified medical documents to lcb.org moderators, my confirmation is in the thread and you can go ahead and ask them.

I didn’t lie to cloudbet, I signed up as an AUSTRALIAN, with my name, address and personal details.
I had no bad intent at the time like you suggest. They had bad intent and they blatantly lied and I’ve provided enough evidence and information to prove that.

I’ve provided this thread to Cloudbet and asked them to respond. If what you were saying were even the slightest bit true they would have came here and spoken out.
Instead their in hiding, whilst you two, not knowing a thing about them are the ones here standing up for them.

Depends on the detail of the case, either they do or they don't. When people are strictly fooled by the promotion, then I believe they deserve their money back. Your case, though, IMHO and sadly, no, because your case is not an innocent who got tricked by a promotion. As I --and Pmalek-- said before, Cloudbet's marketing and your situation should be treated as two different case.

Your case is about someone who realized he got himself a loophole and tried to manipulate it. Can you tell me in all honesty that you were compelled to play without fully realizing you shouldn't be able play there due to your own self-exclusion? As someone who take a length to be ID-based self-excluded, I believe you were not that naive that you didn't realize the implication of those marketing. And, if you do realize the implication and still played anyway, who's the victim now?


And... who lied to who here, again?

I don't think you were fooled at all. I think you knew what you were doing. I think you were trying to create a win-win situation when you saw those advertisements by Cloudbet. You are now using their miss-advertisement to play the victim here. I will repeat what I said earlier. You gambled and lost. That part is fair play.

You knew you couldn't gamble on an Australian-licensed casino. If you had won and withdrawn the money from Cloudbet, you would be perfectly fine with that scenario and wouldn't be complaining about your mental problems. Since you lost, you are now trying to pressure the casino into giving you the coins back.

I personally don't believe you. I am sorry if you are ill and hope you get better one day. Nevertheless, I don't see you as an innocent victim who was tricked here. I see you as someone intelligent enough to take advantage of it for self-benefit.     

Based on that logic, anyone who is  tricked or fooled into giving another party money based on false representations doesn’t deserve to get their money back.
The fact that the suspect lied to them and deceived them should not be tied to the fact their money is gone.
All scam victims must look in a mirror and accept their fate, and all scam suspect shall be forgiven.

I’m not sure where you reside, but in australia - that gets you jailed. Also in a civil court matter, the only person held liable is the person who lied.
I’m sure in your jurisdiction it’s the same, might wanna have a look.

That makes you dealing in bad faith.

There's a chance if a casino outside Australia's jurisdiction accept you and you lost significant bet, you'll quite likely complained that you lost hefty sum of fund on that casino despite you've made yourself self-excluded by Australian govt. and that casino should never be allowed to accept your registration as you've been ID-blacklisted by your govt. Thus, suing them just like this case.

For this case, though, the possibility of dealing in bad faith is even worse. You know you're forbidden by your govt., you've made sure you're self-excluded from any gambling casino with Australian jurisdiction, so Cloudbet's false advertisement "shouldn't be" matter as you should have know you'll ended up never being able to play with them. Suppose you didn't lose your bet, you win, and then on withdrawal phase you're forbidden from playing because they identified your self-exclusion after KYC, you'll still come here with the same complaint, this time the thread will titled "cloudbet refused my 1 BTC withdrawal". If you play, win, and managed to successfully WD, though, it'll be just like you admitted,


Was it not dealing in a bad faith? If you won and managed to WD, you won't be complaining. If you won and couldn't WD due to the KYC, you'll say they cheated you because you can't get your hand on it. If you lose, even without the false advertisement, you'll say they shouldn't allow you to play due to the nation-wide self-exclusion. The compulsion of the mislading advertisement is not necessary element here, you should have known that you can't play on that casino, no matter what, due to your ID-based self-exclusion. So, why did you?

I won't say Cloudbet didn't do wrong with the advertisement and jurisdiction, but I agree with what Pmalek said earlier on this thread, that Cloudbet's advertisement and your case should be separate case.

You are again targeting my mistake and lapse of judgement which I never denied. The only thing I could possibly respond to that with is I’m a previous problem gambler as well as someone who is medically deemed psychologically permanently incapacitated with mental health problems- it has prevented me from working a job for 14 months. So yes I did create an account and deposited under those circumstances.

That does NOT excuse  Cloudbet from false advertisements, lies told by their operators and the  manipulation of users to inevitably breach their terms and conditions, which should be seen none other than exploitation and scam practice.

OK, so you are fully aware that you wouldn't be able to register and verify your account on any regulated online casino in Australia. So what does a person who wants to gamble do in that situation? One way to get around that would be to register on a gambling site that isn't subject to Australian regulations. If you believed Cloudbet's words and marketing that they are licensed and fully regulated in Australia, why then would you sign up when you know that you can't verify your account and get your money in the end? It makes no sense.

Thank you for this added info about your activity as well as the "KYC"-tied self-exclusion. If I may change my question, other than cloudbet, do you still play on other online casinos after that self-exclusion?

I didn’t self exclude from each of them manually, there’s a form that gets submitted directly to the regulator.

It’s important to note that exclusions in Australia are not IP related or anything like that. You are basically unable to verify an account given that your identification will flag the exclusion.


I’m going to answer this for you again with something quiet logical.
I gambled a lot in my life, that would mean spending time on websites, finding tips/tricks, looking up articles and forums related to betting etc. God knows where I put my email address and how Cloudbet got it, but they did.

For an operator that I’ve proven has lied time and time again, I’m not sure why anyone would be surprised if they have some back room dirty tactics to get this sort of information.

If there was more to the story then what I’m telling you, why wouldn’t Cloudbet have used that against me in the ample amount of communication I’ve submitted in my post, rather than continuing to lie time and time again that they were Australian licensed?

I wonder how he has self-excluded himself in the first place. This is a register of licensed gambling sites in Australia, so according to OP, he is self-excluded from all of them and perhaps more in case the list isn't up-to-date. I doubt he has done it manually. Perhaps he has contacted the licensing authorities in charge of these casinos/sportsbooks and asked them for self-exclusion. @Abzzy?

Yes, I've read about his complaint on LCB, the issue to be highlighted here is that OP state he's proactively made himself self-excluded from gambling platform in Australia, as such, if he plays [played?] fair, his risk of being exposed to a targeted email for gambling market should be somewhat minimal, because he'll be "protected" from online and offline gambling platforms, he can't play on any offline casino [obviously] and can't sign up with any online Australia-authorized casino. Unless... he bypassed the Australia georestriction and played online somewhere else, from where his email address then leaked and expose him to the targeted marketing. Which means, in tone with what you said, it's fair to assume case similar to this one have happened before. Which lead us to a possibility there's more to OP's story than he repetitively tell us.

@holydarkness
The OP admitted in his lcb.org complaint that he is a problem gambler, meaning he has a gambling addiction. But even without saying that, it's quite obvious based on his 1 BTC deposit on a crypto casino he knew nothing about at the time. Cloudbet got his email from some of their partners, perhaps sister casinos that he used in the past or some other service related to gambling. If he has a problem with gambling, I think it's fair to assume things like the Cloudbet case have happened before. 

Why it's important to me is because I can only assume they get your email address from two possible ways. One, you subscribed to their newsletter or signed up to their platform [which you denied] or, as Lucius assumed, leaked from anywhere [which, as the other one became less likely, then this one become more likely].

Problem is, it's not too far fetched to think that a leaked email which target such a specific market, a gambler, will come from a gambling database. I don't think a leaked database from Myer membership will expose you to this targeted marketing. So, quite possibly a gambling database, perhaps online gambling database, as I don't think an offline, brick and mortar, gambling "platform" will ask email address for your membership, thus, less likely to become the source of a leak.

But, and here's what the fuss is about, you told us that you've never been on crypto gambling platform before, and further, you also repetitively said that you've been permanently self-excluded from any gambling casino in Australia, these two for example ^[1][2]. So it should be impossible for you to sign up on online gambling platforms, correct? Unless... you use VPN or other ways to bypass your own self-exclusion?

edit: adding missing and incomplete sentence, marked with underline. This is what happen when I take a leak when writing about a leak.

I agree and I am unsure what the fuss is about with the email - they obviously got it from somewhere.

Lucius, I suffer from Anxiety and Panic Disorder and it’s not unlike me to look for “escapes” and lose focus of where I am and what I’m doing. I sent certified medical documents to LCB.org during my dispute to provide an understanding of my vulnerability. I never denied my lapse of judgement. However that doesn’t mean that I need to ignore the wrongdoings of the operator, especially when they blatantly lied over and over again to me.
This isn’t just about an  email I received, I also provided a screenshot of the chat support lying about their legality in australia, as well as screenshots of website content targeting Australians  that they have now taken down.

If I was wrong, Cloudbet would not have now restricted all Australian accounts following my complaint.

The e-mail address could have been leaked from anywhere, the question is how long has the OP been using it and where did he register with it? However, for me it is not so controversial with the e-mail address, but with the fact that the OP claims that he has never used an online casino before, and then he sent 1 BTC to one of them only because he received a promotional e-mail...

Personally, that's a lot of money, and I would never think of gambling with that amount, especially if it's something completely new to me.

I don't think I understand the complete situation here correctly. Allow me to rephrase, you've never play on any online casino ever before cloudbet send you the promotional emails that lead us to this situation right now? At all? So where do they get your email address?

Yes that’s correct

So you've never visited their website as well prior to the email, and you barely even know a crypto gambling platform existed prior to the promotion email arrived at your inbox?

.
I didnt sign up to anything, not from what I can remember.
It was unsolicited, I had no intention of betting with them or creating an account - I didn’t even know what crypto betting was or that it existed.


I didn’t say the examples you gave were good things. They destroy lives, just like gambling. However they are legal and heavily regulated so it’s an irrelevant point your making. Although legal doesn’t mean “good”, it still provides a safer platform than that of illegal, unregulated, offshore suppliers of these bad products you mention.

No I wouldn’t be complaining if they were legal. Reason being, that would mean they’d be regulated in Australia, complying with the advertising and responsible gambling protocols (e.g in australia they stop allowing deposits when your betting patterns take a shift or escalate) creating a safer environment.
I also wouldn’t run the risk of having winnings confiscated should I had won from my jurisdiction, the way it appears to have been with  Cloudbet.

I need a refresher course because there are several cases on my mind and I'm... not that interested to dig into your post to find what I'm looking for, so I'll just ask. How did you get those advertising email on the first place, again? Did you sign up for newsletter or something, or did they just send you an email out of the blue?

You lost your bets fair and square regardless of how you arrived and registered at the casino. You placed your bets, you were wrong, and you lost the stake. That's fair and square. I am not talking about Cloudbet's advertising, but your betting.

So what if they are legal? How many lives have been destroyed and how many accidents have been caused because of drinking? How many lives have been negatively affected by cigarettes and caused cancers and negative side effects? Legal does not equal good, healthy, or acceptable and illegal doesn't equal bad, unacceptable, and unhealthy.   

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Cloudbet is indeed on the list of banned online gambling providers for Australians.
https://www.acma.gov.au/blocked-gambling-websites#list

Some gambling services in Australia are legal if they are licensed and regulated by national licensing authorities. There is a list of such brands here:
https://www.acma.gov.au/check-if-gambling-operator-legal

Despite the illegality of Cloudbet and your gambling problems, would you have asked a licensed gambling site to return your money after you lost it?

LCB.org : https://lcb.org/onlinecasinobonusforum/player-complaints/cloudbet-false-claims-lies-and-advantage-taken-of-my-mental-health-issues-from-prohibited-jurisdiction

Casinomeister : Their disputes are not public threads so the link will not work if your not logged in to my account.
I can provide screenshots if you’d like.

What he said should be separated was cloudbet's advertising and offering gambling service from you wanting a refund for your lost bet. The advertising and gambling service was referred as one issue instead of separate.


Do you mind telling us which ADR are these and provide us the link to your dispute progress on those ADR? I can look for them myself, but it'll be less headache-inducing if you'd provide them for us.

I’ve literally already explained why I signed up multiple times so not sure why your asking again.

How can you slander players like me as “free rollers” and use terms like “lost fair and square” right after I provided you the Araxio example. 3 seperate courts in 3 separate jurisdictions (including Curacao)  ruled against the operator.
 https://www.onlinegamingcuracao.com/2023/08/08/araxio-declared-bankrupt-on-appeal-by-the-court-of-curacao/
2 alternate dispute resolution casino forums have ruled in my favour and Cloudbet has refused to respond.

Your obviously not a facts driven person, and are emotionally vested in bringing people down and convincing them their at fault.
I’ve registered and posted here because this is a “scam accusation” thread… lol isn’t that the purpose?

Well well well, now that you have a problem you researched cloudbet and found cases where they didn't pay.
Why didn't you do that before? There are enough warning signs and still you deposited there, own fault.

I almost always side with the players here, but free rollers get no credit here.

Like me and others said, if you had won we would not hear about this. And if they refused due pay due to location you would have solid grounds to get help.
Why did you even register here? How come people think registering in this forum just for the sole purpose of sharing a controversial story might help them. Go to askgamblers, casinoguru, trustpilot.

Do you think people feel pitty for a story? If the site actually cheated you you can find help and support but not for something like this. You must admit, you lost your funds fair and square. Nobody forced you to play there and lose. And about the false advertisement, the tiniest of research would have helped there.

You didn't research and now you are here and complain.

You use terms like “free roll” and “extorting” . You disregard the ample amount of evidence online that Cloudbet don’t pay winnings when your playing from a prohibited jurisdiction, I even supplied an example in my post.
You ignore the fact that gambling is a REGULATED industry, given that an operators behaviour has serious impacts on a players decisions and his/her losses.

You ridicule “law suits” however Araxio was taken to court for this very same reason a few months ago, the court of Curacao executed foreign judgements and all players funds were to be paid, reason being the appropriate license was not held by the operator in the relevant jurisdictions Roelof Bijkerk was the lawyer, working with SBGOK, look it up.

He is the lawyer I’m currently dealing with, and he suggests funds would need to be paid back on the back of an Australian judgement - which is easily attainable yet time consuming.. I’m surprised that you know so much more about a players rights than legal representatives that have experience in this field and are based in Curacao.

I’m sick of people like you and the ignorant  blaming of the victimised players is getting boring.


In what world is, the wrongdoings in advertising and offering illegal gambling services a separate issue?
How did you come to the conclusion of losing “fair and square” when you just mentioned wrongdoings in advertising and illegal gambling services.

As per Cloudbets terms and conditions, betting from a banned jurisdiction gets your account closed and funds confiscated, so how exactly is baiting users in to breach your terms and conditions with false ads, to ultimately have the ability to close accounts and confiscate winnings betting  fair and square?

Also, all those examples you gave e.g awful foods, cigarettes and crap technology have a distinct difference and shouldn’t be given as examples, they are legal.

Same old story.
OP is trying to freeroll cloudbet.

Even though I don't it's ok to advertise under false pretences it's also not ok to try to freeroll a site or person.
If you would have won money you would not complain here.

We saw that with other clowns trying to extort for example stake because they are not allowed to operate in Australia and yet they played from there. We saw saw anything rom the "big upcoming lawsuit" . 

You being in Australia has no impact on you losing your money. You bet on the wrong horse, chose the wrong number or whatever. That's solely your fault and you will net get 1 satoshi back.

So sick of these people here. There are members that have real problems with casinos but these kind of stories are just so boring.

If it was the other way around and OP won his bets and withdrew his money successfully, do you think he would have returned the money if Cloudbet realized where he is from, that they made a mistake, and now want their winnings back? I don't think so. He most certainly wouldn't if they didn't take legal actions and sued him.

Cloudbet's wrongdoings in advertising and offering online gambling services to Australians should be a separate case from OP wanting back what he lost fair and square. They should face consequences for it. OPs request doesn't make sense to me. A world in which we can gamble, loss, and then ask for our money back because we were mislead and misguided.

Look around you. You are misguided by everything you consume. Awful food, sugar-infested beverages, alcohol, cigarettes, crappy technology you don't need... consumerism and false advertising on every street corner. Filter out the things you don't need in your life or live with the consequences. If you decide to gamble and lose, that's your problem. If you gamble and win but the casino won't pay you, you deserve your winnings and they are scammers. End of story.       

First of all, don't post multiple posts in a row, it's against the rules of the forum - you can reply to the posts of several users in one post.

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Regardless of everything, you can still ask the casino to return what you lost, especially if there is already a similar case that you can refer to, but it is obvious that they (the casino) will try to avoid it in all possible ways without breaking the law.

All you have to do is be persistent and use all available platforms in order to achieve what you want. Honestly, this is the first time I've come across a case like this, because first they allowed you to gamble even though by law you shouldn't have been able to, and now that you've lost you can legally ask them to return your deposit.

No matter how this case ends, everything that happened leaves the impression of unprofessionalism on the part of the casino, and I wonder if the Australian authorities will take any action, given that the casino operated completely illegally in Australia.

This argument lacks depth. Buying a BMW and later regretting it is not comparable to the situation with Cloudbet..
What if the BMW wasn’t as described? What if the car salesman actively lied to you at point of purchase and you have evidence? What if the car you were ultimately sold was actually illegal to drive in your country?

Would you still sit there and blame yourself or somehow shift liability to the party who made false representations?

I can’t believe this is even a discussion.

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Based on your response, I can tell that you didn’t actually read the entire post and didn’t click on the links provided. This is far more than losing money and that I “think” I was lured in.

[moderator's note: consecutive posts merged]

For reference, OP's aim is to duplicate the outcome of a redditor where he was allowed to withdraw his deposit and got his bets voided. Thus, OP argue, he should also get the same treatment and all of his lost bet got cancelled and returned to him [since it's cancelled].

As I already wrote, it is something that you can definitely blame them for, but it still does not lead to anything because there is no element of scam, considering that you lost your deposit in a completely normal way by gambling at an online casino.

Be that as it may, you cannot ask for someone to give you back 1 BTC just because you think that they lured you to gamble in that online casino, you lost and come to terms with it. Next time, be more thorough in checking the casino before you make a deposit, so if you lose again, at least you won't have to feel scammed.

Being responsible with your spending is the most important thing. You see, I don't dance the ballet or need a brand-new BMW. No amount of advertising to pay for ballet lessons or buy a new BMW will make me spend money on that. And if I were to do it, I would have to look myself in the mirror and say this is my doing. I wanted that beautiful car I kept seeing on the billboards everywhere. 

Cloudbet didn't make you gamble. You made that decision. And you didn't do it with 10 or 20 AUD, you spent a whole 1 BTC on it. Now you are angry and want the money back. If you had turned that 1 BTC into 2 BTC, you would have been happy and maybe posted a nice review about the casino. Sorry, but I don't support the notion I was tricked into gambling because I saw advertisements about it that weren't supposed to be there. You wanted to gamble to win, but that didn't happen. It's a harsh reality but it's the truth.

Yes but your disregarding the fact that I created the account and deposited funds on the back of their false predatory marketing, that put me in a position to bet from a prohibited jurisdiction and allow cloudbet at any point to confiscate my funds anyway should I have won.

I provided an example reddit post above, where it showed how Cloudbet handled a user who won, while residing in a prohibited jurisdiction.

If you lost your 1 Bitcoin by gambling, there doesn't seem to be any reason to lose your Bitcoin because of changing their T&C here. Now if they don't allow you to withdraw your winning funds and give the excuse that you are staying in prohibited jurisdictions then that would be a big concern. But here you lose your funds before you can reach that stage.

I actually don't know if they did what happened to you on purpose or not because there is no solid evidence to show that you are facing such huge losses due to being from prohibited jurisdictions. I really feel sorry for you for losing your 1 Bitcoin.

LCB.org moderators attempted to reach out to Cloudbet to have them refund me. In the complaints thread that can be found online  (prior to the 27th) the moderators confirm that Australia was not in the terms and conditions as a prohibited jurisdiction and that Cloudbet is at fault.

In my opinion, they did cost me 1BTC. I would never have dabbled on their website (eventually resulting in losses) if it weren’t for their marketing. In most first world countries there are strict rules with what you can and can’t advertise regarding gambling. It’s a sensitive subject given the amount of problem gambling that exists that’s ruining peoples lives. In this case, we have Cloudbets  maliciously false advertising with clear cut bad intent, any court would rule losses as a fault of the operator.

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Australia was added to their terms and conditions after I raised a complaint with Cloudbet and their master license holder.
They basically admitted guilt by doing that and removing all of their Australian targeted marketing content however chose to stop replying to me.

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Hi Lucius,

Warn players from my country? They did the opposite of that, lured us in which is why I believe they hold a fair amount of blame.

If you look at the screenshots I’ve posted, there’s website content targeted at Australians..
Theres also a screenshot of the chat operator falsely claiming that Cloudbet is licensed, regulated and fully compliant in Australia.

I also never used VPN. The way I found out I’m in a prohibited jurisdiction is when I lost access to their website, because the Australian government blocked the URL through the internet providers.

[moderator's note: consecutive posts merged]

What I found on their website is that this website is prohibited for gamblers from Australia. Now if they are also sending marketing emails to customers in prohibited countries in their T&C, then that is another matter which is not acceptable in any way. Because it is a crime to do marketing in the country where their site is prohibited. On the other hand, you didn't read the T&C before registering on this website, which is really a big mistake. Now it is difficult to conclude this allegation.


Source : https://www.cloudbet.com/beta/casino/en/content/help/terms

You should create complaint at LCB, Casino.guru. I had same situation in other casino, but the sum was less - they helped me. However, I don't think that 1BTC is a big deal for Cloudbet.

Sadly, that is not going to be easy to prove. I did see the screenshots you posted but there is no way to verify when they were taken. It's your word against theirs.

I understand what you are saying. And thanks for being honest about the fact that you wouldn't have problems taking the money while being in Australia. Still, you begin the thread by saying that Cloudbet cost you 1 BTC. But that's not completely true. You played and you lost. Cloudbet didn't withhold your winnings or refused to pay you any profits.

You shouldn't have been allowed there in the first place, and hopefully no Australian will find their way to Cloudbet in the future. If you had won and they refused to pay, I would be on your side and consider it a clear scam. Them not updating their terms or restricting Australian players is their mistake, and you shouldn't have to pay for their intentional or unintentional actions. 

I don't see any scam in the fact that you lost 1 BTC gambling, only to find out later that your country is on the black list, and then you thought what would happen if you made a profit. We can only guess what would happen then, but who says that you wouldn't be able to get at least your deposit back?

What is by no means disputed is the fact that that casino did not warn potential players from your country in a very clear way that they cannot open an account at their casino.

I'm just wondering if you created your account using the IP of your country, or maybe you used a VPN?

Hi dude,

It was added to their terms and conditions on September 27 2023 to be exact. On this same day they removed all Australian marketing content from their website and based on the automated email I received restricted all Australian accounts.

This was shortly after my complaint to Cloudbet and Curacao Egaming where they denied my allegations.

The 1BTC was deposited and lost. However the deposits were in response to the marketing email misrepresenting themselves as an Australian licensed operator.
Some guy inboxed me before asking, would you be complaining if you won. Not at all, however as per the reddit post I referred to, cloudbet initiate KYC after substantial wins and void bets if found to be playing from a prohibited jurisdiction. So I may have won, but who’s to say I would have actually been able to get my hands on it.

Wayback Machine doesn't allow me to load the saved pages from 2023 to see whether or not Australia was in the restricted territories list when you gambled. It is now, but it wasn't back in April 2022.
Regardless of that, what happened with that 1 Bitcoin? You didn't say a word about that. So you deposited 1 BTC, did you gamble, did you lose, did you win? What happened with the coins?

Yes some of it, however  the entire landscape of the situation changed since that post.
Cloudbet ultimately admitted to claims of wrongdoing, however refused to refund deposits.

Is this the same stuff you posted about here already? 

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.62835144

Cloudbet and their master license holder played a dirty game that cost me a whopping 1BTC (equivalent to $40,000 AUD).

I fell for Cloudbet's marketing email that boldly claimed they had been "serving Australia's crypto community since 2013." Their website further boasted as "Australia's best Bitcoin sports betting site." It all seemed legit, so I decided to dive in and start betting.
https://imageupload.io/Y2OEoBhqXPVsfDn
https://imageupload.io/RRQmFE7ewCCvPtK

But there was a twist: I later discovered that I was in a prohibited jurisdiction, it’s illegal to offer unlicensed gambling services in Australia and Cloudbet had been banned from operating in Australia for over a year. I felt deceived, to say the least.
https://imageupload.io/fTLhE7kUfnKUM3o

Naturally, I reached out to their support through chat, hoping for some clarity. The representative confidently reassured me that they were "fully compliant," "licensed," and "regulated" in Australia.
https://imageupload.io/p5Men0xV0phlSq2

Next, I decided to escalate my concerns to their master license holder. To my dismay, they seemed to take Cloudbet's side and firmly stated that Cloudbet did nothing wrong in code words (because I barely understood what the hell they said). It felt like a dead-end, and I couldn't make sense of it.
https://imageupload.io/sycGangvZDXnkhS

But then,  Just a week later, I received an automated email notifying me that Cloudbet was no longer accepting Australian players. They essentially restricted accounts to withdrawals only, scrubbed all Australian marketing content from their website, and added Australia to their terms and conditions as a prohibited jurisdiction.
https://imageupload.io/NlsyQWsUgovnFzQ
https://imageupload.io/IEt9FoHjiLuXWu9

I strongly suspect that the master license holder pretended to side with Cloudbet, only to bare them the burdon of having to return my money, then made them fix their act.

I also received an email stating that the chat representative who made false claims about Cloudbets legality in Australia was “misguided” and it was a mere “human error”.
What the hell how does that explain the Australian marketing emails and Australian targeted content on their websites homepage. They even had a blog post explaining how Australians can buy crypto to transfer to Cloudbet.
Despite this, they refused to take blame for anything or return my funds..
https://imageupload.io/MwiXTed5x6AYEi3

On Reddit, I spotted a response from Ronnie at Cloudbet to another user facing a similar ordeal. Ronnie claimed that they allow players in restricted territories to withdraw their deposits before closing their accounts. However, the results of any bets made are void. So why haven't I received my deposited funds back?

https://reddit.com/u/illermrmiller/s/O4U6ZmFsOc

Cloudbet now refuses to respond and so does the master license holder “Curacao Egaming”.