Author

Topic: Coronavirus hoax in Italy (Read 622 times)

legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 27, 2020, 06:09:42 PM
#55
The double hoax:
1. Coronavirus - 99% of those dead died from things other than CV;
2. No promised funds forthcoming, although this still could happen.


HALF of Italians Want to Leave the EU - Italexit Is Now a Real Possibility (New Polls)



This is particularly apparent in Italy, which has been the hardest-hit member of the bloc during the crisis.

Belgium, France, Greece, Ireland, Italy, Luxembourg, Portugal, Slovenia, and  Spain have been pushing for the issuing of so-called "corona bonds," which would distribute the debt among all countries in the bloc. The "Frugal Four," however — Austria, Finland, Germany, and the Netherlands — are rejecting the suggestion, and have called for the activation of the European Stability Mechanism, which would allow member states to take out loans in the form of bond purchases from the European Central Bank.

Nowhere has disappointment in the EU been stronger than in Italy, and new polls show that Italians are fed up with what they see as the bloc's inadequate measures to respond to the crisis. 49% of Italians are now in favour of leaving the EU and the Eurozone altogether, according to a poll conducted earlier this month by the Tecne Institute that was reported by Express. This represents a 20% increase from 18 months ago, the last time such a poll was undertaken.

Another recent survey conducted by Termometro found that nearly 40% of Italians are in favor of leaving both the EU and the Eurozone, suggesting that the Tecne poll is accurate, as reported by Il Sussidiario.


Cool
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 06, 2020, 01:16:41 PM
#54
But you had better learn the definition of "proof," and how it is found and attested to in court.
you'd never win in court. 3 months + of seeing how much investigative proof finding you have done (none). shows how unprepared you are for anything real world
Precisely the point. That's why I have all kinds of expert witnesses to show the truth. They would win for me.

social media influencers and cult gurus are not expert witnesses.
put your faux news guru against an ICU doctor.. ud lose

I'd win, because my gurus are way better than their expert witnesses.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 06, 2020, 01:12:53 PM
#53
But you had better learn the definition of "proof," and how it is found and attested to in court.
you'd never win in court. 3 months + of seeing how much investigative proof finding you have done (none). shows how unprepared you are for anything real world
Precisely the point. That's why I have all kinds of expert witnesses to show the truth. They would win for me.

social media influencers and cult gurus are not expert witnesses.
put your faux news guru against an ICU doctor.. ud lose
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 06, 2020, 12:50:42 PM
#52
But you had better learn the definition of "proof," and how it is found and attested to in court.

you'd never win in court. 3 months + of seeing how much investigative proof finding you have done (none). shows how unprepared you are for anything real world

Precisely the point. That's why I have all kinds of expert witnesses to show the truth. They would win for me.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 06, 2020, 10:37:53 AM
#51
But you had better learn the definition of "proof," and how it is found and attested to in court.

you'd never win in court. 3 months + of seeing how much investigative proof finding you have done (none). shows how unprepared you are for anything real world
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 05, 2020, 07:56:50 PM
#50
badecker.. atleast learn the definition of hearsay before continuing to act like a fool by over using it randomly and not for what it should be used for.

it sems like its just a new buzzword you want to use this month.. like king scorpios new buzzword is nazi and communist

But you had better learn the definition of "proof," and how it is found and attested to in court.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 05, 2020, 07:12:34 PM
#49
badecker.. atleast learn the definition of hearsay before continuing to act like a fool by over using it randomly and not for what it should be used for.

it sems like its just a new buzzword you want to use this month.. like king scorpios new buzzword is nazi and communist
sr. member
Activity: 1470
Merit: 325
April 05, 2020, 06:16:01 PM
#48
because of junk like this italy shouldn't be allowed to have the euro, they scam and abuse as much as possible to push italy.

italian nationalism can't exist in europes future.

italy should return to their nazi lira.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 05, 2020, 02:52:55 PM
#47
Your video sounds like Dawkins on evolution. We don't have any proof that it is the way he says. He doesn't have any proof. Evolution just has to exist this way for the fun of it.

your youtube videos are of non medical guys making opinions..
video i linked was of an active dotor showing scans of HIS patients HE has treated

i dare you try to actually speak to active doctors who only salary is for working in the ICU and actually seeing patients..
most of your conspiracy references are of non medica influencers and hiring ex-doctors who are now getting paid to do interviews. and have not personally themselves seen a patient with covid first hand

so as you love the whole 'take it to court' .. the link i linked shows more factual merit then your links..

here is an analogy
its like a retired mechanic who has not touched a car in 10 years. being paid to do an interview about how tesla cars are fake because his experience is that cars are only combustion engine and he has never had to repair an electric car..

you would stupidly then claim tesla is fake.. why.. because your an idiot that does not think about things
now go try and research

This is the exact thing that I have been saying all along. Get it to court, with a very stiff penalty for perjury, allowing no hearsay or assumptions, with witnesses and evidence, and with expert witnesses and expert-witness/attorneys on both sides.

Until you do this, the whole thing is only hearsay. It is hearsay that Coronavirus exists. It is hearsay that it doesn't.

The BIG point is, why do people base what they believe on HEARSAY?... especially when it's something that is destroying their lives and the economy of the world?

Cool
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 05, 2020, 12:24:12 PM
#46
Your video sounds like Dawkins on evolution. We don't have any proof that it is the way he says. He doesn't have any proof. Evolution just has to exist this way for the fun of it.

your youtube videos are of non medical guys making opinions..
video i linked was of an active dotor showing scans of HIS patients HE has treated

i dare you try to actually speak to active doctors who only salary is for working in the ICU and actually seeing patients..
most of your conspiracy references are of non medica influencers and hiring ex-doctors who are now getting paid to do interviews. and have not personally themselves seen a patient with covid first hand

so as you love the whole 'take it to court' .. the link i linked shows more factual merit then your links..

here is an analogy
its like a retired mechanic who has not touched a car in 10 years. being paid to do an interview about how tesla cars are fake because his experience is that cars are only combustion engine and he has never had to repair an electric car..

you would stupidly then claim tesla is fake.. why.. because your an idiot that does not think about things
now go try and research
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 05, 2020, 10:12:30 AM
#45
When everything cools down, most people will realize it was just a case of pneumonia.

The point is that it is not just pneumonia.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWn-pGf4B-M
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKuPNg-bops
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bt9KQ8q6WJE

this 2 minute segment of a video explains the process best
https://www.youtube.com/embed/Bt9KQ8q6WJE?start=803&end=906

to go into detail. the pneumonia (hard to breath due to fluid in lungs) is the bodies immuno response trying to react to the virus in the alveoli and flooding it with fluid trying to contain it and remove it.
however patients suffer from breathing issues.. so without having the immuno response treated and given air to keep the body alive. they die
if given just air. no meds,, the pneumonia takes over and floods the lungs = dead or deoxygenated for days
if given air and just antiimflamitories. pneumonia retreats but virus then can start damaging cells =dead or lung damage long term
if given air anti-imflamatories and antivirals. body can do more =best case survive with little or no long term damage
..
the long term damage (more then pneumonia) is if the virus gets to the cell destruction stage
pneumonia alone is just fluid reaction in the lung.
yes with a virus its more then just fluid that needs to be dealt with
but then saying that just at the pneumonia stage that lungs are going to be guaranteed to be cell destroyed is not accurate
its why swift treatment of air antiimflammatories and antivirals (no single magic one pill cure) to stop the person suffocating. stop the virus from cell destruction to hope to get the person recovered without long term effects.
..
the ground glass is not where there is actual glass like particles in the lungs.
its not describing an actual particle type. its just describing the visual look of a hazy image compared to a clear transparent image
i have seen too many people think that the lungs are filling with hard materials like glass/paving brick. no. its just a visual descriptor of how clear or hazy /pattern the pneumonia fluid build up is



Your video sounds like Dawkins on evolution. We don't have any proof that it is the way he says. He doesn't have any proof. Evolution just has to exist this way for the fun of it.


The whole Covid-19 scam is explained in Tash's video https://youtu.be/HodiDWSkTWU (https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.54156828) as reported on by tvbcof here https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.54161113.


Cool
sr. member
Activity: 1190
Merit: 305
Pro financial, medical liberty
April 05, 2020, 07:26:32 AM
#44

Great informational video, stay safe everyone
https://youtu.be/HodiDWSkTWU

This one was awesome.  Well worth sharing, and I have a couple of times.

I've seen this guy before, and have been impressed by his work.  I should put him on my list of to-visits.



This one is also top
Corona Virus (5G) Connections
https://youtu.be/M4smIaaRbq8
One the 16:24 mark, sure looks like a flu as he flew
https://youtu.be/M4smIaaRbq8?t=983

and that why you stay inside ( best is from 25 Jun 2019), download
https://youtu.be/Mpc5dX4qOOo

crrow777, another full hour
https://youtu.be/pPKpJgJE_Zw


Someone is terrible bad at social distancing
legendary
Activity: 4690
Merit: 1276
April 05, 2020, 05:07:30 AM
#43

Great informational video, stay safe everyone
https://youtu.be/HodiDWSkTWU

This one was awesome.  Well worth sharing, and I have a couple of times.

I've seen this guy before, and have been impressed by his work.  I should put him on my list of to-visits.

legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 04, 2020, 08:17:05 PM
#42
When everything cools down, most people will realize it was just a case of pneumonia.

The point is that it is not just pneumonia.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWn-pGf4B-M
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKuPNg-bops
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bt9KQ8q6WJE

this 2 minute segment of a video explains the process best
https://www.youtube.com/embed/Bt9KQ8q6WJE?start=803&end=906

to go into detail. the pneumonia (hard to breath due to fluid in lungs) is the bodies immuno response trying to react to the virus in the alveoli and flooding it with fluid trying to contain it and remove it.
however patients suffer from breathing issues.. so without having the immuno response treated and given air to keep the body alive. they die
if given just air. no meds,, the pneumonia takes over and floods the lungs = dead or deoxygenated for days
if given air and just antiimflamitories. pneumonia retreats but virus then can start damaging cells =dead or lung damage long term
if given air anti-imflamatories and antivirals. body can do more =best case survive with little or no long term damage
..
the long term damage (more then pneumonia) is if the virus gets to the cell destruction stage
pneumonia alone is just fluid reaction in the lung.
yes with a virus its more then just fluid that needs to be dealt with
but then saying that just at the pneumonia stage that lungs are going to be guaranteed to be cell destroyed is not accurate
its why swift treatment of air antiimflammatories and antivirals (no single magic one pill cure) to stop the person suffocating. stop the virus from cell destruction to hope to get the person recovered without long term effects.
..
the ground glass is not where there is actual glass like particles in the lungs.
its not describing an actual particle type. its just describing the visual look of a hazy image compared to a clear transparent image
i have seen too many people think that the lungs are filling with hard materials like glass/paving brick. no. its just a visual descriptor of how clear or hazy /pattern the pneumonia fluid build up is

legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 04, 2020, 08:14:03 PM
#41
your the bible believer and now ur saying some how that its me that thinks its fact and i said its fact?
you really do not know how to understand basics.

typical tactic.
when you cant prove something. you then deny that you said it or deny you referenced it and accuse the other person of referencing it and believing it..
you really have no sense of reality


Sometimes it's a little difficult understanding what you mean by what you say.

God wants us to believe Him through evidences of things that He says. He shows us proofs about things He said in the past that turned out the way He predicted them. This is so that we can be encouraged to believe Him for things of our future, especially salvation things. The Bible is Gods book of proofs.

What this means is that there are proofs, but the thing that God wants is simple trust in Him for many of the things He says.

As anybody can see, machine-universe proves God's existence. Machines have makers. The universe-machine is so complex that the Maker of it fits our definition of "God." But mere existence of God doesn't tell us much about Him.

Back it the first couple thousand years of the earth, complexity hadn't deteriorated as far as it has today. People back then understood God through the Holy spirit speaking to their spirits. Deterioration came about because of sin. God caused the Bible to be put together for us people who don't have the spiritual complexity of our thousands-of-years-ago ancestors.

But to see much of the proof, you need to look where the proof is located. The Bible.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 2702
Merit: 1468
April 04, 2020, 07:35:25 PM
#40
When everything cools down, most people will realize it was just a case of pneumonia.

Cool

The point is that it is not just pneumonia.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWn-pGf4B-M

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKuPNg-bops

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bt9KQ8q6WJE
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 04, 2020, 07:32:08 PM
#39
your the bible believer and now ur saying some how that its me that thinks its fact and i said its fact?
you really do not know how to understand basics.

typical tactic.
when you cant prove something. you then deny that you said it or deny you referenced it and accuse the other person of referencing it and believing it..
you really have no sense of reality

legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 04, 2020, 07:26:55 PM
#38
They didn't have priests back then, either. Why do you bring it up? And how do you know for a fact that they didn't have paper and pens back then? They were a lot smarter than we are.

your the idiot that brought up how you beleive the bible to be true fact first person account of stuff in the past..
now your saying you cant prove how such facts stayed factual..
Where did I say that? You are the one who said it.



which is it
the priests that wrote the bible were first person witnesses of adam and eve and they wrote it while observing the events..
or
paper and pen and priests did not witness it but came up with campfire stories centuries later and decided to write it down
I suppose you could call Adam and Eve priests after a fashion. But like I told you, scribes wrote the Bible. However, some of the priests were scribes, as well, in addition to being priests.

I don't think paper and pen witness anything. Priests do. But paper and pen are inanimate objects. They don't have witnessing ability.

I can't tell you for a fact that priests didn't have campfire stories. But God directed them to write what they wrote in the Bible.



come on, you love to pretend you enjoy first person witnesses and dislike hearsay.. so explain it using facts and proof.. or shut up
dont reply unless providing facts and proof that it was not hearsay.

Explain what? What is it that you want explained?

The fact that the Bible has been copied for 1,900 years almost exactly the way it was written? The Dead Sea Scrolls show this.

How about the fulfilled prophesies? Israel tradition shows that they don't report Bible things falsely. Study about them and how meticulous they are, to understand this.

That Moses did miracles way back 3,500 years ago? Again, study about Israel. And study about Ron Wyatt, and that he found the Exodus lands to be just as they were written in the Bible.

Best, read the Bible, slowly and continually, over a period of a couple months. God will show you, Himself.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 04, 2020, 07:02:08 PM
#37
They didn't have priests back then, either. Why do you bring it up? And how do you know for a fact that they didn't have paper and pens back then? They were a lot smarter than we are.

your the idiot that brought up how you beleive the bible to be true fact first person account of stuff in the past..
now your saying you cant prove how such facts stayed factual..

which is it
the priests that wrote the bible were first person witnesses of adam and eve and they wrote it while observing the events..
or
paper and pen and priests did not witness it but came up with campfire stories centuries later and decided to write it down

come on, you love to pretend you enjoy first person witnesses and dislike hearsay.. so explain it using facts and proof.. or shut up
dont reply unless providing facts and proof that it was not hearsay.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 04, 2020, 06:30:35 PM
#36

infact priests writing the bible were not witness to 'jesus'


Scribes wrote the Bible at God's direction. Many of them witnessed Jesus, right along with many priests and prophets, in His form as "The Angel of the LORD"...in Old Testament times.

Cool

they didnt have pen and paper back in adam and eves day

They didn't have priests back then, either. Why do you bring it up? And how do you know for a fact that they didn't have paper and pens back then? They were a lot smarter than we are.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 04, 2020, 06:25:36 PM
#35

infact priests writing the bible were not witness to 'jesus'


Scribes wrote the Bible at God's direction. Many of them witnessed Jesus, right along with many priests and prophets, in His form as "The Angel of the LORD"...in Old Testament times.

Cool

they didnt have pen and paper back in adam and eves day
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 04, 2020, 06:21:22 PM
#34

infact priests writing the bible were not witness to 'jesus'


Scribes wrote the Bible at God's direction. Many of them witnessed Jesus, right along with many priests and prophets, in His form as "The Angel of the LORD"...in Old Testament times.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 04, 2020, 04:50:36 PM
#33
When everything cools down, most people will realize it was just a case of pneumonia.

amungst a population number getting pneumonia thats more then the healthcare can cope with.
do you understand the situation yet
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 04, 2020, 02:41:12 PM
#32
When everything cools down, most people will realize it was just a case of pneumonia.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 04, 2020, 11:25:44 AM
#31

Great informational video, stay safe everyone
https://youtu.be/HodiDWSkTWU

the virus, does not itself eat at so much cells that you bleed out.. the virus is not the killer. the virus is the gun
its the respiratory distress that kills people, the immuno response triggers specifically by the virus in question

where the respiratory distress is not a simple symptom of a panic attach or asthma. .. where its show actual now known symptomology that cant be linked to just asthma or just copd or just a gun shot. but from corona known symptoms thn its treated as such

SARS and MERS although they were respiratory distress causing viruses. they also had a sight variant of other symptomology
its the combined symptomology, the combined severity and the incubation period and many other diagnostic things combined with even just a basic viral test that form the ultimate diagnoses..

its not simply, he has the flu, but he bled out from a gun shot.. but heck he has the flu so lets just blame the flu..
doctors do not work like that.

it might have worked like that in december 10th-january 7th.. .. but things have move on since then..
that was the whole point of china waiting until they got definite diagnostic results and proper virus tests done

.. there is right now no quick 2 minute litmus strip of paper that changes colour and is provided at a disposable cost to everyone.. but there actually is proper labs that can properly identify.

right now porton down in the UK have these proper labs and they are doing actual proper tests on a small community nearb. using it as a sandbox to get more stats to have more accuracy to the scope of the situation

but if you think that hospital doctors are just randomly daisy picking who is corona or not .. or over claiming that everyone is.. you are wrong. doctors have a protocol in place. and when you compare it to other hospitals, other countries.. the data stands up..
its not like there is some rogue doctor trin to fudge the numbers hoping for a bonus.

when everything calms down in many many many months.. there will be inquiries and if there have been any malpractices people will lose their jobs. so ofcourse people are not going to go against their medical oath of doing no harm or lie on legal documents and medical records.

and if a doctor did.. well just like how blockchain works.. you can spot the peer with the bad data and easily weed out the contraversial forks
sr. member
Activity: 1190
Merit: 305
Pro financial, medical liberty
April 04, 2020, 10:54:17 AM
#30

Great informational video, stay safe everyone
https://youtu.be/HodiDWSkTWU
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 04, 2020, 10:50:18 AM
#29
-snip-
Doctors are people. Some people lie. Some doctors lie. Media lies all the time. Politicians - like the ones in governments - lie.
-snip-

Losing your license to practice medicine that you spent 16 years and likely at least a half of a million dollars obtaining is pretty good incentive not to lie. I agree with the rest.

But when you are a doctor who is in a government position, making tons of money, the incentive to lie could actually be a whole lot stronger than the incentive to tell the truth.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 2590
Merit: 2156
Welcome to the SaltySpitoon, how Tough are ya?
April 04, 2020, 10:43:24 AM
#28
-snip-
Doctors are people. Some people lie. Some doctors lie. Media lies all the time. Politicians - like the ones in governments - lie.
-snip-

Losing your license to practice medicine that you spent 16 years and likely at least a half of a million dollars obtaining is pretty good incentive not to lie. I agree with the rest.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 04, 2020, 10:35:52 AM
#27
doctors did not travel back undreds of years and inform the priests to include corona stats in the bible.
infact priests writing the bible were not witness to 'jesus'

however. there are more than 1 doctor per country. .. there are nurses to witness.
the data can then be compared to other data from other hospitals, other towns, other countries.

and if the pattern of data shows correlation where by its not 100% death in one country and 0.01% death in another.. (which obviously would look wrong.. ) .. but instead all the hospitals have patient records, doctors reports, nurses witnessing the events. and where the results of these show the same pattern and similar ~% death. then its obvious that the data is good.

yea data does not include many of the mild symptom receivers that dont enter a hospital.. but to doubt the numbers of those in hospital.. well if you doubt them numbers. then you should definitely be doubting the supplement trials you are highlighting as miracle cures purely on the bases of only 62 case study

now just go away and grow up a little. then do some research

Doctors are people. Some people lie. Some doctors lie. Media lies all the time. Politicians - like the ones in governments - lie.

Now we have the info that the Italy CV is not really a CV problem. The whole CV thing is a scam.

However, until we get people who make claims into court, on the stand, threatened with 20 years in prison if they don't tell the truth, and clear evidence is shown, we won't know.

People love to sit around and watch TV. It's easy to tell them TV lies. Let's get it to court - a bunch of courts - so that we can find the truth... or aren't you interested in the truth?

Cool
legendary
Activity: 1134
Merit: 1598
April 04, 2020, 10:33:39 AM
#26
There's so much contradictory information out there I just don't know what to believe anymore.

I can honestly agree with both those who say it's a hoax and those who say it isn't. We just have enough arguments at this point to prove any of the ideas we believe in. I agree with the idea that the mainstream media is exaggerating - have you even seen any news (speaking about TV only) in the past few weeks about anything else but COVID-19?

Have you seen the footage of CBS talking about overcrowded NYC hospitals while using footage from Italy? I've turned on my TV a few days ago (I live in Romania) and thought.. why the hell do we have to report every single death and infection from the virus considering we have a population of +20M and at the time we had under 100 deaths in total from the COVID-19 pandemic? Like isn't it a bit too much to report every single case? I think it just feeds our emotions way too much. We're literally covered in pandemic news right now and at this pace, lots of us are not gonna be as sane as they were before the lockdown and strict measures.

I have personally heard doctors say they have no cases in their hospital. I have also heard doctors say they can't keep up with them. I have also seen recorded footages of empty hospitals in some of the most crowded areas of large cities. I think I've seen all the possible scenarios and now I'm confused AF. What the hell is the real scenario going on? Or are they all real? Are some hospitals overcrowded while others don't even have a single doctor inside anymore?

I personally know some people who've been infected with COVID-19 and nobody takes care of them or even calls to ask or for an update on their health status. I personally know someone who has had a death in their family completely unrelated to the virus or any respiratory disease, yet they have been reported as "another COVID-19 death" live on TV.

Have you seen the new hospitals from Wuhan (those that have been over-advertised on TV months ago)? They look like damn prisons, which makes me pretty skeptical about what's going on.

I don't even think it makes sense to come with arguments against each other's point of view anymore. There's just so much contradictory information. Like fuck it, I'm starting to give up believing anything related to the official AND unofficial information. I think my plan is: believe it's a horrific virus, protect yourself and continue following this path because nothing is certain anymore.



EDIT, and I'm going to put a larger font for this for more exposure.
Check this out.
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 04, 2020, 10:12:55 AM
#25
doctors did not travel back undreds of years and inform the priests to include corona stats in the bible.
infact priests writing the bible were not witness to 'jesus'

however. there are more than 1 doctor per country. .. there are nurses to witness.
the data can then be compared to other data from other hospitals, other towns, other countries.

and if the pattern of data shows correlation where by its not 100% death in one country and 0.01% death in another.. (which obviously would look wrong.. ) .. but instead all the hospitals have patient records, doctors reports, nurses witnessing the events. and where the results of these show the same pattern and similar ~% death. then its obvious that the data is good.

yea data does not include many of the mild symptom receivers that dont enter a hospital.. but to doubt the numbers of those in hospital.. well if you doubt them numbers. then you should definitely be doubting the supplement trials you are highlighting as miracle cures purely on the bases of only 62 case study

now just go away and grow up a little. then do some research
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 04, 2020, 09:24:18 AM
#24
^^^ The franky1 scam/hoax. But it is fun to watch. Grin

did you even research the data. and work out the difference between ONS and DHSC for the UK death stats..
or did you just wake up one morning and decide to call everything a hoax unless its a supplement, and if it can be sold as a supplement you will endorse it no matter what the side effects can be.

maybe next time try a new tactic and do some actual research. really study, really learn. and then.. take a few breaths and let it soak in and only then form an opinion
just try it, just once, you'll surprise yourself

Now, franky1. Did you ever research the data? What data? Some charts and language on the Internet? Something that anybody can make up?

Research the real data. The real data is found in the Bible. At least the Coronavirus real data is something that will have to be adjudicated in courtroom-like procedures and processes before we can determine if it is true.

So, did you research the data? Data outside the courtroom is contradictory. Coronavirus data is contradictory. I have researched it.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 2590
Merit: 2156
Welcome to the SaltySpitoon, how Tough are ya?
April 03, 2020, 11:51:22 PM
#23
Whether you believe Italy or not, check out the information every country in the world is publishing. Even if it doesn't kill you, there is an obscene amount of hospitalization required for healthy people with no underlying conditions. People that are showing as completely asymptomatic can show signs of lung damage when scans are done. Read a couple of articles from Iceland, they've done some of the most extensive testing by population %. I'll let you source them yourself so you don't have to bother finding counter articles, you can read them both at the same time.

Regardless of your background, you can look at the numbers that we have right this moment. While it doesn't take a whole lot of understanding of infectious disease or math to understand why predictions are fairly accurate (there is a contest to predict flu statistics before they happen each year, and the winner is normally +- 1000 cases worldwide) if you take a second to look at the statistics as they are now, you'll see that corona virus is more dangerous right now than drunk driving. We wear seat belts because cars are inherently dangerous. Even if you don't buy into any of the fear or potential scenarios, it is the reasonable measure to take precaution. We don't live our lives in fear of drunk drivers, but plenty avoid driving on New Years Eve or holidays where people traditionally drink to minimize their risk.  

Whether you think its overhyped media scare money mongering or whatever else, a few weeks of inconvenience is worth it. Even a fraction of a percent are not odds you want to bet against with your health. Make it a little bit less abstract by comparing your likelihood of having a bad time with the illness to your local crime rates or something that is more real to you.
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 03, 2020, 11:18:28 PM
#22
^^^ The franky1 scam/hoax. But it is fun to watch. Grin

did you even research the data. and work out the difference between ONS and DHSC for the UK death stats..
or did you just wake up one morning and decide to call everything a hoax unless its a supplement, and if it can be sold as a supplement you will endorse it no matter what the side effects can be.

maybe next time try a new tactic and do some actual research. really study, really learn. and then.. take a few breaths and let it soak in and only then form an opinion
just try it, just once, you'll surprise yourself
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 03, 2020, 09:59:30 PM
#21
^^^ The franky1 scam/hoax. But it is fun to watch. Grin
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 03, 2020, 03:04:11 PM
#20
I wish they would split the death stats into those who die with the Corina Virus, and those who die from it.

if you get shot with a gun, and die due to blood loss or blood infection due to a gunshot.. but have covid.. you will not be a covid death stat...

if your shot. and in hospital get co-vid from a nurse and unreated to gunshot symptoms. you start having respiratory imflamation needing ventilator and inflammatories that are linked to covid infections. you will be a covid stat if you die

if you have a heart attack and die from heart attack symptoms and not pneaumonia(respiratory imflamation). your not going to be a covid stat.

if you have a heart condition. and get covid. and your heart condition does not help you fight covid. and your lungs become imflammed and need respiratory support and anti-inflammatory and such. but you die because the pneaumonia just got too much for our body to handle.
you will be a covid death stat.

..
lets make it real simple
if you only have a fever due to covid. but get in a car, and end up having a car accident. you will be a road traffic stat.


what you need to know is this
the ONS (they dont report to the worldometer or the media) report it with death mentioned whether cause or not
ONS gather data from the office of death certificate registrations

but worldometer/media get reports direct from DHSC who get it from hospitals direct from doctors who have treated patients and know who died from corona related respiratory issues.

so while conspiracy theorists play mind games about things like the ONS..
the UK and government are getting their data from DHSC.. NOT ONS
legendary
Activity: 2814
Merit: 2472
https://JetCash.com
April 03, 2020, 02:56:23 PM
#19
I wish they would split the death stats into those who die with the Corina Virus, and those who die from it.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 03, 2020, 02:49:52 PM
#18
You forgot the part about if they fly in. And, this may have been cancelled lately. But if you are going to fly, call ahead to find out what will happen.

stupid idiots that want to go to texas to ramble/hike/tour randomly and lick door knobs. will find that they will not have an enjoyable vacation because they will be told to go find some hotel and stay there for 14 days or go back home out of texas.

so yea a-holes ignoring the self isolation will not get the vacation they are hoping for.
do you get what self isolation is all about yet.

this is not vacations time..

heck i travel the world alot. and i cancelled all my flights.. why.. because i know its not the right time to tour different countries. this is isolation time

i know you are or must be having withdrawal symptoms of not being allowed to be a window licker or doorknob sucker.. but this is time to wise up, be a man and actually do something for a responsible reason. not for a selfish reason

You lost.

But you don't have to start sounding like Vod. Do you lick, too?

News coming in shows that Italy CV was a hoax.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 03, 2020, 02:37:51 PM
#17
You forgot the part about if they fly in. And, this may have been cancelled lately. But if you are going to fly, call ahead to find out what will happen.

stupid idiots that want to go to texas to ramble/hike/tour randomly and lick door knobs. will find that they will not have an enjoyable vacation because they will be told to go find some hotel and stay there for 14 days or go back home out of texas.

so yea a-holes ignoring the self isolation will not get the vacation they are hoping for.
do you get what self isolation is all about yet.

this is not vacations time..

heck i travel the world alot. and i cancelled all my flights.. why.. because i know its not the right time to tour different countries. this is isolation time

i know you are or must be having withdrawal symptoms of not being allowed to be a window licker or doorknob sucker.. but this is time to wise up, be a man and actually do something for a responsible reason. not for a selfish reason
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 03, 2020, 02:34:30 PM
#16
In Texas, in major airports, if you fly in, the authorities quarantine you for 2 weeks on the spot. They won't even let you fly back home. People who check ahead don't fly... they drive. In the same way, people are staying out of the hospitals.

badecker. you dug another hole for yourself

at airports people are screened for it. and have to fill out a form of a location that the person chooses such as the hotel or friend/relative they came to texas in the first place to go to.. and say that they will stay in that location for 14 days or until they want to leave texas

again this is not texas locking people up in detention camps.
this is texas telling people to go straight to their friend/relative/hotel and stay there.
why

because thats what self isolation is

stop with your conspiracy theories. your trying to make it sound like peole are being arrested and detained in similar things to migration camps.. they are not. they are just being told not to go running around random places as if its a vacation..
to instead self isolate like other people

You forgot the part about if they fly in. And, this may have been cancelled lately. But if you are going to fly, call ahead to find out what will happen.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 03, 2020, 02:30:33 PM
#15
In Texas, in major airports, if you fly in, the authorities quarantine you for 2 weeks on the spot. They won't even let you fly back home. People who check ahead don't fly... they drive. In the same way, people are staying out of the hospitals.

badecker. you dug another hole for yourself

at airports people have to fill out a form proving info about a location that the person chooses such as the hotel or friend/relative they came to texas in the first place to go to.. and say that they will stay in that location for 14 days or until they want to leave texas

again this is not texas locking people up in detention camps.
this is texas telling people to go straight to their friend/relative/hotel and stay there.
why

because thats what self isolation is

stop with your conspiracy theories. your trying to make it sound like people are being arrested and detained in similar things to migration camps.. they are not. they are just being told not to go running around random places as if its a vacation..
to instead self isolate like other people

as son as you sai the word texas airport. i stopped and thought. i bet he has never been there and had first hand knowledge and is about to say some flawed conspiracy.... i read on.. and yep, you said another stupid thing that has no merit
legendary
Activity: 2730
Merit: 1288
April 03, 2020, 02:25:16 PM
#14
Here is an article right here that shows how many deaths happened in the past.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1201971219303285

In the 2016/2017 flu shot season they lost 24,981 people in Italy due to influenza, mostly elderly. As of April 2, 2020, they're reporting 13,915 deaths in Italy due to COVID-19. It still has a while to go to catch up to the 2017 season.

If you add to covid-19 deaths the people that died this year due to influenza you will for sure get way higher number as the one in 2017.
hero member
Activity: 2464
Merit: 519
April 03, 2020, 01:32:34 PM
#13
It was explained many times before.

Corona isn't going to disappear like flu unless there is an effective cure. The deaths are around only 10k in Italy... for now.

What's your excuse gonna be when we see 100k+ deaths in a few months?
Whenever i see the prediction of over 100k+, whereby expecting worse senerio,I like to ask if the death for the masses or the less privilege? If we understand that this crisis can hit anyone, old and young even those without underlining ailment unlike earlier predicted. We might have to have to give more urgency to adopt any provision for cure. China has given enough example and we understand that the whole country may not have to die before we arrest the situation.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 03, 2020, 01:22:17 PM
#12
But if the so-called pandemic were real, people would be dropping like flies, thereby being willing to get hospital help just to save their own lives. They aren't doing this. The CV panic is false, but it is being propagated by Media and Medical, both of which are tricking government people to believe it.

People do drop like flies. It is just, most of them are old people and old people are usually wealthy. That's what the panic is for. Wealthy old people are dying. Can you Imagine? Wealthy old white people in New York are dying in drones. You would panic af too if you were old. (and wealthy)

I know it depends on the viral load and a healthy young people can get sick too but these are exceptional cases. Old people usually suffer more and yes, they do die, a lot.

See ir yourself:
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

It's not any more than the past 10 years. In fact, influenza-like disease was worse in 2017. Watch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KCnpPjUvdLM.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 3276
Merit: 2442
April 03, 2020, 01:02:01 PM
#11
But if the so-called pandemic were real, people would be dropping like flies, thereby being willing to get hospital help just to save their own lives. They aren't doing this. The CV panic is false, but it is being propagated by Media and Medical, both of which are tricking government people to believe it.

People do drop like flies. It is just, most of them are old people and old people are usually wealthy. That's what the panic is for. Wealthy old people are dying. Can you Imagine? Wealthy old white people in New York are dying in drones. You would panic af too if you were old. (and wealthy)

I know it depends on the viral load and a healthy young people can get sick too but these are exceptional cases. Old people usually suffer more and yes, they do die, a lot.

See ir yourself:
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 03, 2020, 09:43:35 AM
#10
Reports are coming in from around the world that hospitals are losing business because there is nobody there. People who have the flu are staying away because they are scared they might be quarantined. In Italy, flu (CV) cases are down compared with normal at this time of year.

Cool

everyone is self isolating.. sick or fit
if you mean hospitalised.. no. only those who are in respiratory distress are being hospitalised for corona. most countries are telling those symptomless/mild to just stay home

seriously, get off the conspiracy websites

Thank you. But it isn't self-isolating from the CV scare. It's self-isolating from medical tyranny. Who wants to be strapped to a hospital forced quarantine?

In Texas, in major airports, if you fly in, the authorities quarantine you for 2 weeks on the spot. They won't even let you fly back home. People who check ahead don't fly... they drive. In the same way, people are staying out of the hospitals.

But if the so-called pandemic were real, people would be dropping like flies, thereby being willing to get hospital help just to save their own lives. They aren't doing this. The CV panic is false, but it is being propagated by Media and Medical, both of which are tricking government people to believe it.

So, we live in this stupidity like we are living in a Communist country of the 1960s.

Btw, get onto the conspiracy websites so you get the truth.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 03, 2020, 05:53:29 AM
#9
Reports are coming in from around the world that hospitals are losing business because there is nobody there. People who have the flu are staying away because they are scared they might be quarantined. In Italy, flu (CV) cases are down compared with normal at this time of year.

Cool

everyone is self isolating.. sick or fit
if you mean hospitalised.. no. only those who are in respiratory distress are being hospitalised for corona. most countries are telling those symptomless/mild to just stay home

seriously, get off the conspiracy websites
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 02, 2020, 08:58:59 PM
#8
Reports are coming in from around the world that hospitals are losing business because there is nobody there. People who have the flu are staying away because they are scared they might be quarantined. In Italy, flu (CV) cases are down compared with normal at this time of year.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 02, 2020, 06:23:23 PM
#7
Approximately 100% of the so-called CV deaths in Italy have not been certified that it was CV that did it.
approximately 100% of your posts were wrote without any actual thought, understanding or research
My IQ is so high that I don't have to think about stuff like this to know and write the truth.

high. . as in bleach induced mind altering experience
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 02, 2020, 05:58:25 PM
#6
Approximately 100% of the so-called CV deaths in Italy have not been certified that it was CV that did it.

approximately 100% of your posts were wrote without any actual thought, understanding or research

My IQ is so high that I don't have to think about stuff like this to know and write the truth.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 02, 2020, 05:54:24 PM
#5
Approximately 100% of the so-called CV deaths in Italy have not been certified that it was CV that did it.

approximately 100% of your posts were wrote without any actual thought, understanding or research
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
April 02, 2020, 05:44:05 PM
#4
topic creator mindset
'each year 365 stupid people of 365 stupid people die due to being stupid'
'i didnt die today so i can be stupid all year round and never die

have a nice day

The day isn't over, yet^^.

Approximately 100% of the so-called CV deaths in Italy have not been certified that it was CV that did it.

Cool
legendary
Activity: 4410
Merit: 4788
April 02, 2020, 01:51:33 PM
#3
topic creator mindset
'each year 365 stupid people of 365 stupid people die due to being stupid'
'i didnt die today so i can be stupid all year round and never die

reality.. results show maybe not today.. but one day this year you will

..
what im trying to say is a scope of 12 months of no isolation flu =~25k/year =~2k/month lets call it 3k for month and a half

..
well even with isolation.. corona this year.. with only a month and a half of stats.. again even with social isolation =14k
over 4x more.. deadly than the flu..
and it would be even worse without the isolation

so put them numbers into context
3k flu vs 14k corona same average time period

have a nice day
legendary
Activity: 3276
Merit: 2442
April 02, 2020, 01:19:55 PM
#2
It was explained many times before.

Corona isn't going to disappear like flu unless there is an effective cure. The deaths are around only 10k in Italy... for now.

What's your excuse gonna be when we see 100k+ deaths in a few months?
sr. member
Activity: 373
Merit: 262
April 02, 2020, 01:09:33 PM
#1
Here is an article right here that shows how many deaths happened in the past.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1201971219303285

In the 2016/2017 flu shot season they lost 24,981 people in Italy due to influenza, mostly elderly. As of April 2, 2020, they're reporting 13,915 deaths in Italy due to COVID-19. It still has a while to go to catch up to the 2017 season.

Now there have been sources stating that the amount of deaths has been under reported. I don't know what to think about that. But their official numbers are within what's normal.

Quote
Highlights

 In the winter seasons from 2013/14 to 2016/17, an estimated average of 5,290,000 ILI cases occurred in Italy, corresponding to an incidence of 9%.

    More than 68,000 deaths attributable to flu epidemics were estimated in the study period.

    Italy showed a higher influenza attributable excess mortality compared to other European countries. especially in the elderly.

Abstract
Objectives

In recent years, Italy has been registering peaks in death rates, particularly among the elderly during the winter season. Influenza epidemics have been indicated as one of the potential determinants of such an excess. The objective of our study was to estimate the influenza-attributable contribution to excess mortality during the influenza seasons from 2013/14 to 2016/17 in Italy.
Methods

We used the EuroMomo and the FluMomo methods to estimate the annual trend of influenza-attributable excess death rate by age group. Population data were provided by the National Institute of Statistics, data on influenza like illness and confirmed influenza cases were provided by the National Institutes of Health. As an indicator of weekly influenza activity (IA) we adopted the Goldstein index, which is the product of the percentage of patients seen with influenza-like illness (ILI) and percentage of influenza-positive specimens, in a given week.
Results

We estimated excess deaths of 7,027, 20,259, 15,801 and 24,981 attributable to influenza epidemics in the 2013/14, 2014/15, 2015/16 and 2016/17, respectively, using the Goldstein index. The average annual mortality excess rate per 100,000 ranged from 11.6 to 41.2 with most of the influenza-associated deaths per year registered among the elderly. However children less than 5 years old also reported a relevant influenza attributable excess death rate in the 2014/15 and 2016/17 seasons (1.05/100,000 and 1.54/100,000 respectively).
Conclusions

Over 68,000 deaths were attributable to influenza epidemics in the study period. The observed excess of deaths is not completely unexpected, given the high number of fragile very old subjects living in Italy. In conclusion, the unpredictability of the influenza virus continues to present a major challenge to health professionals and policy makers. Nonetheless, vaccination remains the most effective means for reducing the burden of influenza, and efforts to increase vaccine coverage and the introduction of new vaccine strategies (such as vaccinating healthy children) should be considered to reduce the influenza attributable excess mortality experienced in Italy and in Europe in the last seasons.

Jump to: