Topic: Cultural Appropriation and Acceptable Racism (Read 477 times)

The problem with you is that you read a bunch of total shit and believed it, and repeat it with minor variations.

That's assuming you are human. The other case is you are a simple rule based algorithm, with three hundred pieces of grammar that can be intermixed and selected based on key words, and auto pasted.

I favor the latter option, but welcome you to prove you are human.

I never said you were white.  I have no idea what anyone's identity is on the internet.

Its not surprising that the dominant identity has tendencies that often manifest themselves in minorities.

Actually, I'm a one legged mulatto bastard orphan child, that grew up to be a hermaphrodite, but don't worry. Each of my separate personalities has a unique sexual identity.

What in the world caused you to presume I was either white or fragile?

You have amazing capability for an entity with a brain capable of only two bit operations...well, compared to your brethren with one-bit processors. Can you explain the operation of input and output operations with a two bit processor, and the limitations thereof?

Your refusal to approach this with an open mind is what we refer to as white fragility.  You keep saying this is all made up and refuse to even consider the notion of "checking your privilege" as something that is based on reality. 

Here is an amazing paper on the topic.  Any open minded person would read it and critic the concept of privilege based on good reasoning instead of just denial.  Surely, the worlds' top academic institutions would not blindly embrace something that wasn't even real.
https://medschool.duke.edu/sites/medschool.duke.edu/files/field/attachments/explaining_white_privilege_to_a_broke_white_person.pdf

In your mind only, that is privilege....

I see now that the way the first quote is written can be interpreted two different ways and that you must have interpreted it as "because of their race I know that they have not been denied basic services or freedoms" instead of what the "because of your race" part of my post really meant that no one has told them "you cannot have X because you are white" and X is basic services or freedoms.

Privilege is not about what goes on in the minds of people but its about how society makes things more dificult for people with certain identities.  Have you ever had to go to school or work on a major christian holiday?  That is christian privilege. 

There's some variation between countries and cultures on this, but in the US as a traditional melting pot of cultures ....

First and foremost, cultural appropriation is kind of tricky and misaligning. When you first hear or read about it, it seems that it is positive and 'appropriate'. Cultural appropriation seems right since it is the act of taking the cultural ways of other people that is of course not your kind of culture just to be part of them but when you read between the lines, you may find it an offensive one and can also lead to acceptable racism. I think that acceptable racism is inapproriate since there is no such thing as 'acceptable' racism. Racism itself is a negative thing, and whatever word or group of words you add onto it, it will still for me unacceptable.  If you are just choosing what to show racism then selectiveness should never prevail in this instance.

NO YOU DO NOT KNOW THAT.


No, there is nothing "obvious" about what goes on in the mind, or the life, of such a person. You are making things up to assume otherwise.

So are you denying the history of systemic racism? because that is also irrefutable but of course you can't attribute individual differences to one single pillar of identity. 

Both (the absence of race and the history of racism) are irrefutable. No one ever challenged what you are saying about individual variability.  In fact, its actually part of the point of talking about privilege in general.  We should see people as individuals and there are so many pillars of someones identity that may or may not come with privilege. 

The thing with skin color though is that I can see it and know it about you right away.  If I see a white person, I know that they nor their immediate family have been denied basic services or freedoms because of their race.  That is white privilege and doesn't mean that they haven't had those things denied, it just means it hasn't been because of race. 

An good example would be a white trans female.   They obviously have a tough experience because they lack male privilege and cis privilege even though they still have white privilege. 

You can't just call something stupid because YOU don't understand it.  A lot of research has been done on people like this.

Then again, it could be because you have simply fallen for one of the stupidest social constructs ever promulgated by maniacs of the left.

This is far more likely than your being right. The reason I say this is that my first answer to your ridiculous assertions was quite scientific.

Because statistically, individual variability is orders of magnitude higher than variability attributable to visible groupings such as skin color.

It's actually irrefutable.

But you missed that entirely and went on with the lecturing. And I'll repeat my former conclusion.

Your demand for courtesy is an insult.

Particularly when you haven't the slightest clue what I know or don't know.

We in Russia have been shocked by the tolerance of the West for a long time. The problem is that the west does not create equality, but tilts the scales in the other direction. They allow shit on their heads, if only they are not considered racists.
About 170 nationalities live in our country. And although many have prejudices, racism has never been a big problem.

Why would you use the noun?  You have to be intentionally dishonest to claim we are using check as a noun.  It is clearly a command.  IF someone says "check your privilege" , there is no way a native speaker would think that "check" is a noun.  Basic sentence structure and context but the noun definition fits your argument so fuck it.   Pretend to have no understanding of basic english.

to examine (something) in order to determine its accuracy, quality, or condition, or to detect the presence of something.

That is because race is not real and is a social construct.  This doesn't mean racism doesn't exist and hasn't had real effects and perhaps you don't know about the systemic racism that has taken place in the US because you had the privilege to not need to know.  You would have to check your privilege to take the time to research practices that systemically penalized people based on race.  It would be uncomfortable and life is a lot more pleasant to just pretend it doesn't exist. 

That's one of the stupidest rationalizations I have ever heard.

Because statistically, individual variability is orders of magnitude higher than variability attributable to visible groupings such as skin color.

Your demand for courtesy is an insult.

check noun
\ˈchek
\
Definition of check

(Entry 1 of 3)

1 : exposure of a chess king to an attack from which he must be protected or moved to safety with his king in check

2a : a sudden stoppage of a forward course or progress : arrest the outbreak of war in 1939 gave a sudden check to the sculptor's work— Herbert Read

b : a checking of an opposing player (as in ice hockey)

3 : a sudden pause or break in a progression the invaders coming in without a check

4 archaic : reprimand, rebuke

5 : one that arrests, limits, or restrains : restraint against all checks, rebukes, and manners, I must advance— William Shakespeare


Yes, it has most definitely resulted in "you don't get _________ because you have privilege." Is it asking or is it demanding? Pick one. You can't even follow your own standards within a single paragraph.

Checking privilege doesn't limit anyone's opportunity.  Its simply asking someone to acknowledge the struggles of those who do not share their identity.  Its a demand for courtesy.  its not saying "you don't get _________ because you have privilege".

Oh but you have. You telling people to check their privilege shows very clearly you do not beleive in outcome of opportunity, because you think certain people should have limited opportunities to make up for the ones you think have more. It is at the very core nature of this privilege argument.

No one has suggested equality of outcome but nice strawman.

I don't think the White Privilege exists.  Majority of whites are not in the 1%.

They work their asses off like everybody else, actually, they have to work harder because of the affirmative action.

Try to get to Harvard if you are White or Asian.  

Affirmative Action is racist!!!

"I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character." - Martin Luther King Jr.

I guess that dream is dead for white folks.

What is next, segregation for whites?

What you are saying is true for the USA and the Euro. But not suitable for China or Russia.

Or perhaps he supports equality of opportunity and has the good sense to know equality of outcome is impossible.

I can't help but guess your pillars of identity on the basis that you automatically think the entire concept of privilege is "stupid".   Probably proves my point. Thinking this is stupid is highly indicative of privilege.

Thanks for explaining this. I admit I have truly struggled with understanding these concepts, because they are so stupid.

May I ask you next time I run into some totally stupid aspect of political correctness?

There is cultural appropriation and then there is getting influenced by a culture. People nowadays can't seem to see the difference between the two, in application and in recognizing it.

Any extreme is bad. And right now, that is what's happening.

It's a tough conversation, and a multi-faceted one. There are situations where it is being taken 'too far', but there was always going to be a push back, before (many years down the line) it settles down. There are huge advantages to being born white, but that's not to say that everyone will benefit. As coins4commies said, many other factors will dictate how much of an advantage you could potentially end up with.


Try any one of the following and see how it turns out for you...

* Leave everything else the same, just change your name to Mohammed/DeShawn on a job application.

* Be 'of pregnancy age' when attending an interview.

* Walk down the street holding hands with another guy/girl

* Spend a month in a small village in North India - eating, drinking, working, sleeping etc.

Plenty more ways you can find out how you are privileged or not, especially if you look further afield. It has improved to some extent, but there's still a long way to go, and it will be an even longer process unless those at the top stop to pull up those who could not get there otherwise. Equal amounts of hard work does not create equal opportunities.

Im starting to think racism is natural.. I suffer from vitiligo, where even my immune system hates my skin pigment; and tries to make me entirely white! 

No skin color is immune to compartmentalization and judgement. What were once considered minorities are on their way to becoming the majorities and considered more deserving of respect. It's our need to categorize and associate everything that is the root cause of this problem, as people are vain more than anything else. The only way around this would be to create a completely digital society where everyone has an avatar. Until then, there is no escape from this. There will always be racism in some form or another.

From ancient seafaring techniques, sugar trading, and slave trading, the white people really know how to exploit things. Forgive me with this statement, but I'm not talking in general here. There are good and bad white people, but bad things will always be more noticeable.

I may not know how Brits treat black people, but some of them really hates Muslim immigrants. On the other hand, some white American people always hate blacks, and there are many videos circulating of their discrimination all over the internet.

The sad reality is, some people think that whites are really privileged people, and most Asian countries will treat them nicely, except for this . Every time that a "mestizo" visit my country, they will always be head-turners. And a non-white child's eyes will always fancy white people. Watch this video if you have the time.

Well, no one can explain how things are used by random people on the internet.  You will always find people that misuse things but none of these phrases should make you cringe.  If you are against systemic opprression, you should think positively of all of these terms. 

No one is blaming anyone for being white.  White privilege is not something you should apologize for or feel bad about.  Its just something that you should be aware of. 

When we say "check your privilege" it literally means that you may not be able to understand the context of a struggle because you have never been victimized by this particular struggle.

Its also important to realize that race and religion are not the only pillars of identity before someone comes in here and says "just because I am a white male, doesn't mean I haven't lived through any struggle".  Right, it just means you didn't struggle because you are a white male.  There are so many pillars to someones identity, any of which could come with struggle or privilege.

Gender
Race
Sexual orientation
Religion
Family origin/class/makeup
Body image
Learning style
Geographic background
Language

These are all things that people are kind of just born into and don't have much control over.  We would never blame people for any of these but its important to acknowledge privilege.

Unless you are a Christian, cis-gendered, straight, white, male raised in the US with english as a first language, a traditional learning style, born to an affluent family with no physical defects, then the constructs of society have built-in struggles SOMEWHERE for you.  Otherwise, you should at least acknowledge that society is designed for you as the default identity.

It's really kind of funny.

Yes, those Muslims so often subject to angry stares or discrimination, those of them who are pretty much white, now get it double, sort of.

But that's all crazed political left thinking.

I'd ignore it.

Same cringe here. Judging by social media articles, now it somehow seems that you`re supposed to be ashamed of being infamous 'privileged white male'. Somehow you are to blame for not belonging to any minorities - which sounds extremely absurd. It is all the same old story - take an initially good idea: i.e. fighting racism, body positivity - and bloat it totally out of proportion.

For decades the media has vilified racism, bigotry, and prejudice; and rightfully so.  Of course I resent racism of any kind, regardless of who it's directed towards.  People should be judged on their character, personality, integrity and not on the color of their toe nails or the breadth of their nostrils.

But now I see a trend that makes me cringe.  Bigotry and prejudice are still ripe and getting pungent, but now it's being directed at white men.  And it's all coming from the Left leaning Progressives, who are the ones that spent decades screaming for racial justice.  Now they want to subject those who founded and built this great country to their brand of Justifiable Racism.

They create phrases like White Privilege, Affirmative Action, Diversity, Inclusion.  But the way the words are used is often the exact opposite of their meaning.  

More and more I'm finding myself in an Orwellian reality.  Double speak; four legs good, two legs better.

What do you folks think?