Topic: Delete (Read 639 times)

Copy and pasters are scammers. They're defrauding money from the campaigns they're meant to be advertising for whilst ruining the forum in the process, and when there's literally thousands of them doing it all that money adds up over the years.

I couldn't find anything in your recent post history. Point me to your threads in Scam Accusations and let's move this discussion there.


I would say that a shitposter in hand is worth than a hypothetical scammer "taking a lot of btc" in the woods but again - there is no reason to believe that both can't be caught.


It's not an assumption. I have gone through a large part of OP's post history. You keep claiming things based entirely on your own assumptions and projecting that onto me. Not cool.


Just do it.


Who's "you" again? No one who posted here except hilarious has much of a say in what happens to you. Deleting your thread before an admin could weigh in is not gonna help your case.

I had heard you can appeal your ban in here are you saying that is not correct?

How do you appeal a ban then?

There is no way to get your Account back ! You are banned perma !

Lol, I deleted it because I see that you dont want to find any solution and help me to get my account back.
I promised that I will improve my posts and will try to do my best to help this forum, but you dont want to hear that  .

I have done a lot of ANN scam busting in the past and always on the lookout when I get the time.

I would say 1 scam taking a lot of btc can be 100x more important than nitpicking some 3 year old instances of copy and pasting a few linked words that nobody would be proud to claim as their own work. I would only then investigate their recent activity to see if this is an ongoing issue.

The final comment is again assumption. Just because they saw no hope to get reinstated does not essentially prove they were not a useful member in recent years. Of course I have not gone through their post history so who can say. I am just saying you stating his actions as proof of non usefulness is not statistical proof that anyone can make optimal conclusions upon.

Head over to the reputation board. There is a member there whom is according to some here not useful at all and deserves a ban for allegedly claiming work is his own. Having read through a lot his post history I believe is a legit trader and therefore of great use to CC. I have not really had much time to look into many of these kind of cases. However like i say one good member deleted for a mistake or small lapse of effort is not what I would feel good about reporting to a mod. I would feel far better to find real offenders. If they must be plagiarists or nonsense posters (bots etc) it would want it to be a clear case not a one off period/mistake from an otherwise useful member.

I notice many meta hiders are very quick to be negative towards others. It is better to save that negativity for those that certainly deserve it. Perhaps this guy is such a person but on the basis of a few probable copy and pastes years ago of insignificant common place views I don't see much to be afraid of.

Anyway he is gone now it would seem. I am not here to defend wrong doers only try to shift focus to real scammers and persons that are destroying the alt discussion board so that we are not all cooped up in meta comparing merit and nitpicking on easy targets. Get rid of all sigs for everyone would be the best idea or introduce a junior board for alts.

I've done both so I don't have to assume anything. I can report 100 shitposters in the time it takes to create a simple scam report. And I'm quite certain we have 1000+ times more shitposters than scammers. So I choose to work on shitposting and send some merits to folks who dedicate time to scam busting. This way we can tackle both problems. Trying to favor one or the other isn't gonna work. None of us are getting paid and we just do what we think can help the forum. If you think ANN scam busting can help - go ahead and do it.


The OP deleted their appeal so apparently this wasn't one of those "useful members". Let me know when you find one and we can continue this discussion.

My point is quite simple and as far as I can see is not in any real doubt. So not worth arguing about.

Time spent on nitpicking on " probable copy and pasters from years ago" could be better spent either 1/ finding the plagiarists that are likely parts of a wider scam team that are still constantly offending to promote the scams 2/ analysing the ANN section for scams and scam teams before they take peoples bitcoin/eth
I'm not sure why you would assume these copy and paste sniffers are unable to spot obvious scams building in the ANN section with btc and eth being asked for with no escrows and other known accounts from other scams. Even just posting there comments like why no escrow why no team with backgrounds that are possible to validate. Also these should be able to use context before reporting and wasting mod time.

If this plagiarism hunt going back years can be automated then fine. I don't essentially assume because some copy and pasted back in 2015 something pointless for no personal gain they are worthy of a ban 2018 if in subsequent time they have behaved well .

Also i even question if this is a net gain for the board at all. I mean a person not behaving back in 2015 then behaving well for subsequent years is essentially a useful member now and spending time and effort going back years to nitpick them and kick them out could be altogether a waste of time and actually harmful to the board.

If does not need be even widespread I would prefer to see it not happen at all.  Although as you say if context and intent is considered (you believe) that is all that is need to be said really.

The only people wasting time here are you and me, arguing this pointless hypothetical situation. Let the OP appeal their case and see where that takes us.

As far as i can see there is no widespread punishment of "noob mistakes" or "innocent helpful persons" (the OP is certainly not an example of either) and it doesn't make any difference with regards to "real bad guys".

We have to realise also plagiarism is certainly not clear cut either as several recent cases have demonstrated. Also I don't believe it should be a black and white issue given the reasons I have stated.

Also the real bad plagiarists (repeat offenders and obvious text spinners , fake conversations) are much more closely related to real scams than you may think. I think teams of this type are organised and arranged by the scam icos to promote them in various sneaky ways to the board.

By wasting time of noob mistakes, innocent helpful persons we are missing the real bad guys here and that is a sad thing to see.

Anyway let's not derail further this guys thread I guess. I guess if there are multiple occasions of a sentence being semi copied from years back one could argue he must go. I wonder why anyone would bother doing this seems completely stupid unless it is a sophisticated bot that managed to remain under the radar for a time. I have not looked into his entire post history to really evaluate his contribution to the board.

Who's "you"? I'm not an admin and I don't make the rules, which as it currently stands don't do anything with regards to scamming. The main reason as I understand is to avoid having moderators make the judgement on what is scam and what is not, which is not always as clear-cut as it may seem. So can we stop derailing the topic now? Not yet?


Doesn't make any sense. There's almost nothing in common between catching a scammer and catching a plagiarising shitposter. So there would be a lot more "energy" required to start banning scammers should theymos decide to do so (don't hold your breath).

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Again, you're arguing something that doesn't exist or is extremely rare. Moderators have wide discretion in how they apply the rules and I'm sure they would consider the context. Then there is the appeal process and given how few of those appeals are successful I think it's safe to say that the process is quite solid.


It's not an either/or situation. There are scam-busting efforts and there are spam-busting efforts. The methods involved are completely different. What you're saying is akin to saying that we should focus more on DUI drivers than cleaning the streets. Yeah, DUI is probably more consequential but that doesn't mean we can't do both, otherwise we will end up with streets no one will want to be on, drunk or sober.


There is software that can detect plagiarism (e.g. Google). AFAIK there is no software that can't detect meritorious posts.


Or you can stop with the useless exaggerations and instead of typing walls of text and arguing imaginary problems spend that time to learn how to quote.

The two things are not isolated in all cases.

However the plagiarists I hope we want to catch are not the helpful people who make citing mistakes or those that just are a bit lazy to find the source whilst obviously trying to help others with no attempt to gain from it. We want to catch those bots, ico spammers that are shilling and faking activity on boards to suck people into scams. Or previously just power up accounts to resell.

Now there is no less incentive for them to make more accounts and just text spin a bit better than there is for scammers to rejoin. The only people that will not rejoin are those that made an honest mistake or were overly battered for being lazy one time after years of putting effort in.

I would rather be the only honest person in between a bunch of helpful lazy people or honest noobs making mistakes than I would be surrounded by hardcore scammers.

The worst real plagiarists will never be caught because a text spinner will be used and they are now not a plagiarist they are simply a scammer which is not on the ban menu right now.

Years ago there was not all this stuff about people copy and pasting if it was not blatant and repeated it's almost got nitpicking in some cases . Most people were reporting spammers and scams.

All am saying, once a scammer is caught, ban them too. By the time they are red-tagged, it means there is enough evidence that S/he scammed someone. They are not welcome here.
The same energy used to ban those who commit plagiarism should be the same energy used to ban scammers


"Just because someone has been a rapist or robber all his life doesn't mean they should just let it be, punish the bustard if caught"

Do you mean the fact if no reason is required to be given that that could lead to

1. the poster not knowing why he is banned
2. possible abuse by the banning agent for not having to have supply a reason (that would be valid) to ban people
3. Are their statistics for reinstated banned individuals getting banned again?


You have said that either a reason is given in the ban message or you can come and ask for the ban reason here which will be given to you (hence this thread as an example)  

That seems reasonable enough.

edit = = messed up that post not meant to be all different colours and replies inside and outside of boxes.

Both cases are different, in fact. Scammers will continue his/her scamming if s/he gets banned with creating a new account.
Now, imagine, you have made a Sr member account by plagiarism and you get caught and get banned. I don't think you will ever think of copy/pasting again. At present, it is a more scaring issue because merit is needed for rank up.
If a scammer gets a ban, s/he will create a new account, of course. So, this goes with the same rule of account buy/sell. There can be rules but no one can prevent account buy/sell. So, no rules there. The same is also applied in this case. There can be a rule of banning scammers but the scam will be continued.

It's worthy to have a look- Why aren't obvious scammers banned?

Oh, come on, why don't the identified scammers get banned then?
I have seen a number of scamming accounts getting identified in the scam accusations board with concrete proof but all they do is red tag them. Why don't they ban them too?
I find it quite lame... Zero tolerance on plagiarism but you leave a scammer scot-free as if scammers do not gravely destroy the quality and actual aim of the forum.

It takes a few seconds at most to quote and attribute properly. Those are the rules and everyone (including you) should follow them. Not doing that may make it seem like the intent was to pass the content as your own.


This has nothing to do with scams at all. Moderators are not involved in that. Users who research scams are good at what they do and generally that skillset is different from reporting shitposts. So what's your point?


Looking for a good post requires reading many posts, including shitty ones. Looking for plagiarism requires very little reading, if any at all, and you don't have to be a merit source for that. Apples and oranges, again.


You quoted my post improperly. So a few years from now some horrible person is going to search through all these threads and report you for plagiarism


The straw man is your attempt to raise some non-existent issues and to debate them, instead of the actual problem here, which is the OP's plagiarism and appeal thereof. The OP would likely get banned again because the OP has done this sort of thing more than once.

Lol. A classic bitcoin is good because it is profit and profit is good post.

Phase One: Copy and paste post
Phase Two: ? ? ?
Phase Three: Profit.
Phase Four: Get banned.
Phase Five: Cry coincidence?



Only really Global's can ban and they can ban anyone regardless of rank (except admins and possibly other mods). Copy and pasting is pretty clear cut, but if you want staff to moderate scams then petition theymos about it to chnage the rules, but it's likely something he doesn't want us to do. If you're concerned with scams though you can leave them feedback yourself.

@ bones and hilarious

thanks for explanation about edits.

I would have though plagiarism (taking work as your own)  would be like claiming you had a great or novel idea. I have often seen people ask a question and people post a reply they have cut from the net or some other post and post with no obvious gain to themselves at all they were just being helpful.

Would it not be best to rid ourselves of real scammers and scamming icos than these sort of people.

What sort of person is analysing threads of all these years previously? who would seriously even do that. Most merit sources admit the job of looking for a good post in alt section is just too much trouble.

Who has perma ban powers? all mods? can they ban even legends without a warning given first?

The unofficial rules are called unofficial for a reason I guess? who even listens to these appeals from members who consider their ban incorrect or overly harsh? who makes the final call?

I am not talking about this person specifically I mean if there are multiple cases of plagiarism even if minor and almost pathetic with no real damages to persons with original or novel thoughts/ideas then i guess this can be seen as deliberate. Although after a year of such well just lazy behaviour I would maybe dig deeper to see what else he had done in a positive note.


@suchmoon

There is always a reason even if it's not displayed in the ban message. The reason was given in this thread. The OP can appeal. If the appeal is successful the OP will likely be banned again. Put that straw man back in the barn.

Can you explain the straw man you refer to and also tell me why even after successful appeal the member will likely get banned again?

I am trying to understand exactly what you mean. Are you saying people who get bans over turned will be banned by the mod that banned them because they believe in their original decision or that they were genuine bad eggs whom could not help replicating the things that contributed to their ban?

Scams are not moderated.


There is always a reason even if it's not displayed in the ban message. The reason was given in this thread. The OP can appeal. If the appeal is successful the OP will likely be banned again. Put that straw man back in the barn.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.21707775

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      If someone edits their post after a few minutes, you can tell because the timestamp is underlined with little dots and when you hover over it with a mouse, you will get a pop up message informing you exactly when the last edit happened.

Some people are looking for abuses and going back through old threads. Just because they were missed doesn't make it ok. Far too many people have been getting away with copy and pasting because it was so easy to do and get away with, but it is pure laziness and greed. If someone edited their post then it would show up as edited.

Just wondering about this but those dates are back in 2017??

He just got banned right now for this or is he very late in discovering he was banned?

Also there must be a way to tell...

but how can we tell people can not copy and paste something we say and find an earlier dated post they made and copy and paste our post making it look like they posted it first? then reporting us for plagiarism?  even if it was requoted they could own the puppet account.

I have to say honestly if the rest of his entire post history looks legit that is quite a weak case

I must have seen "bitcoin is the king of currency" and " alts have no chance to beat it " by 1000's of persons here over the years i mean there is only so many ways to express this.

What is the obsession with people copying and pasting work of little worth I mean the above example is not an expression of a novel idea or something that has not been stated 1000 x before?  and not banning people that are serious scammers?

I mean surely over a year later is a bit strange.... who is looking up this stuff??

Who has the power to perm ban people here? do mods of each section have power to ban in their section?

Should not legends and heros deserve a ban with a clear reason at least. Imagine spending years here to be banned and not even realise why it happened?  I also worry that like some have said that if one individual has the power to perm ban with no reason then there is obvious worries that could be abused and people are silenced without fair trial.

I would have though legends should only be banned with very good reason that is clearly observable for others to see. Some people have spent a lot of effort on this board and should only be banned for clear intentional wrong doing or not a perma ban. temp ban or merit reduction yes but perma bans for legends should be for very serious offenses.

LOL

My weekend drinking is starting way too early. No, it's not "one". Not a coincidence either.

I didn't say email, but how do you know he won't respond? Have you tried it before?


It's not a coincidence. Stop playing naive. As I said above, the chances that you randomly posted the same content he did are astronomical.

No, it's a permaban.


Copy-pasting someone's post is unfair. It's not only unfair towards the original poster but also unfair towards all the other forum members
who have to dig through piles of plagiarized shitposts like yours every day.

On the email? He will never respond...
One coincidence and lost my high valuable account .

Do you have any idea what the odds would be that those are just coincidences that you just so happened to copy someone else's post almost verbatim in three different ways? Astronomical. Unless that's your alt account and you were just churning out the same drivel over multiple ones. Then it would be more believable. Contact an admin and see if they show you any leniency.

Reposting for visibility...seems almost identical to me.

He changed "replace" with "take over"

Added "potential" and "online shopping and money transfers"

Is there any chance how to compensate it?
I really didnt use someone else posts. I am sorry, but this is really little bit unfair. In 105 pages thread there is very big chance that you will have similiar idea with someone else...

Well, what I mean with thin, is if someone agrees with the general idea of the post he could come up with the exact same shitty post than he did without actually using the first one as reference.

I always prefer presomption of innocence to presomption of guilt.

However in present case the user is not a big loss for the forum, it is just a matter of justice/fairness.

Edit: Was comparing too fast. Evidence is pretty conclusive.

Doesn't matter how 'thin' it is but it's clear he just took the original and changed a few words as many people are doing to try avoid being detected. I'd argue it's a much worse crime than just a straight copy and paste as they've gone to lengths to try hide it. Either way it's still a shitpost.

I must admit, if this is the post because of which he was banned for plagiarism, this is really thin.

Any shitposter could post a line really close to this one in any BTC thread.

Well, I am so sorry but I dont see any copy paste or plagiarism, yes, there are some same words, but this doesnt mean that I copied others work! Please, is there any possiblity to recover the account?

Thanks, but what does it mean? Permaban? Why?

No, I didnt!

It is banned probably because of plagiarism,Did you plagiarize any content from this forum or anywhere from the internet?

EDIT: It was autobanned by mods,you can check it here : https://bitcointalk.org/modlog.php

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