Topic: DISCUSSION-How hard is it to beat a sportsbook? (Read 251 times)

The truth is that I would like to have that kind of peace of mind because when we see if you win or have made a living from sports betting, it is not bad, because you have to have enough money, or at least enough to guarantee a good retirement to be calm and maybe think about taking a good Caribbean Vacation every year, however I think that a person who makes a living in gambling, specifically in sports betting, well, at some point when he leaves, he will want to start over, and that it's somewhat understandable. , after so many years of betting and living and feeling the degree of adrenaline is something that should not be missed.

So if I made a living betting on sports, I think I would never leave it, because I feel that then it would not be me, I can do many things that I like, but I would be incomplete, and the reason is simple, we as human beings should always do what we like the most, never to please others, but to feel happy ourselves.

In our society sometimes ourselves, I include myself because it has happened to me many times, one tries to stop doing some things that I like just to please others and to make it look good, and no, one should not stop doing what one likes, and as long as one is healthy doing what one likes, well, one must do it, and if we like to bet on sports betting, that does not hurt anyone, in short, I think that if it does harm it would be to lose and that is to oneself as a player, the others should not care about anything.

They are soft and that is a fact. Every bookie which has betmax for normal level around 200e is soft bookie as it has small limits.
You are making wrong assumptions.
I already bet in crypto bookies, i already have runners in different countries for local shops and I am doing ok,just wanted to ask fellow colleagues how they deal with all changes.
Taxes on betting are high as ever..in uk rly low stake possible on terminals..new york 50% winning tax etc..really hard industry with noone protecting the bettors.

Considering complaints on bookies and why you dont see it on forums its bcs you dont want to see.
Even on this forum you have posts about stake.com not paying out,let alone sbr forum or askgamblers.com...everyone tries to solve firstly normal way with chat and support,then over forums and last step is witj lawyers and lawsuit. In that moment its not even allowed to post anything on forums anymore..

I agree, they didn't become soft or what, they just become smart base on past history and what not. That's why the odds the book makers are putting are really on the edge and if you look at it, maybe you will feel that you are in a lose-lose situation, unless everything has change when you bet on the underdogs won.


I'm not familiar with sports bookies that have license from British Virgin Islands, if this is what you meant. But if this is true then we should stay away from it.

As you claimed to be a sports bettor for 15 years I think you don't need any input as you should know what's the best thing to do.

If you think you can't handle anymore the changes you are referring to during the time you started from the current situation, then take a break. Why stress yourself for something that you don't want to do anymore or now become a lack of interest?

Supposedly, what else can we do about those changes you pointed out in the gambling industry nowadays?

We should be the ones to adjust rather than the gambling environment will adjust for us.

In fact, I see that betting sites are "regulating" to provide entertainment and not profit to players.
I've never played for money, and I know my story isn't what you want to hear.

However, it is necessary to verify that KYC is a requirement that is becoming global in any casino, forget the comparison with the past, this does not exist anymore and it is not the fault of the bookmakers.

Second, if you want to earn money not by luck but consistently then unfortunately you are in the wrong business for today, in fact you need to look for another way to guarantee your "keep".

Unfortunately the words are not easy, but in fact it is necessary to face that casino games are entertainment where you can or not win a lot of money by mixing your skills with luck.

Lol, if you’re making a “really nice” living, then I’d say it’s probably not time for you to change professions.  Sports books haven’t become “soft”, that’s not the right word to use here at all, they’ve simply become more conservative having learned from their past mistakes.

It’s true some operate out of places like the British Virgin Islands that harbor criminals and criminal activity. This is why you simply don’t use them.

To the best of my ability,  I've always seen gambling especially sport betting as strictly a game of luck and I've always believed that it has been programmed for games to always have greater house edge over players.
This very option  and opinion of mine is backed by the fact that the casino  is in business and anyone in business is expected to be making profits and not losses and if people are winning on them, then they should  be considered lucky  and not skilled because it is luck based to me and not skills.
And with all this been said, I believe it is hard to beat a sport book expect there is a great strategy  already in ground.

Well who doesn't gamble for money, I like to believe everyone who actually gamble has an intention to actually win some cash with his or her prediction but the only problem with this is that we should just try and have fun when doing this. Placing a bet and actually getting the desired result in any sport book isnt an easy task even if all the necessary information about the selected team is known like their head to head, last five games and so on it all still depend on if you are lucky.

I didn't know that and to be honest it's the first time I see someone saying that, I suppose you can prove what you're saying, in any case assuming that you were speaking the truth about this issue of limits of value that people can bet on a certain game of low level tennis leagues, I think that this is a rule that each casino has the right to place and before putting that rule they do market studies to see if they can or cannot place such a rule. about other accusations you made against stake.com if there were cases like the ones you are talking about

So why aren't we seeing many people talking about this on this forum? I believe that many people would be in this thread complaining about stake.com if they had problems, but what I see on the forum, I am talking about the scam section and the stake.com thread itself and that there are not many complaints, it even stays weeks for me see any complaints, then your case may be an isolated case. about your thread, I don't know how it was in your times when you managed to get better results, maybe if you could put in this thread the years when you had good results and which betting sites it would make the discussion easier

@OP
Like all industries, this one is also seeking to optimize processes and maximize their profits.
I fully understand and agree with your view (unfortunately)...

one option is offered by betting exchanges.
Ok if you win a lot you have a "premium fee" to pay but in general you have no limits on your account or bets to play. I usually never heard about problems with KYC.
However, the main site of this business does NOT offer crypto deposits...and some countries can't use these sites....

second option: play in physical bookmakers with cash! (obviously if we are talking about hundreds of dollars, higher figures are impractical in terms of personal safety / availability of the bookmaker).

Soon summer will start and all football leagues will start which you can use to bet because in a football match there are lots of betting options that can be your betting options.
Esport may also be quite interesting, but when you have tried betting on a football match and won, it can indirectly make you addicted to doing analysis in order to have betting predictions.

But if you really look at each casino, it will give different odds, even though it only has a small difference, but if the bet is a large number of bets, it can affect the amount of wins you get.

Betting in a sportsbook there are many choices and many strategies and ways you can do to beat the sportsbook bookie, all of this cannot be separated from the knowledge you have about the sportsbook so far.

There are many sportsbooks to open bets, such as: football, boxing, racing, basketball, baseball, golf, tennis and so on, it all doesn't escape the knowledge of the sportsbook that you have, understanding the sportsbook is very important in assessing success and beating the bookie.

There are some tricks and strategies about sportsbook betting, which you can do.
For example:
• Parlay: this bet people often call a single bet, for example: Odds: 2 x 1.5 x 3 = 9. One bet only.
• Odd Even.
• Handicap: it's common for the strongest team to bet.
• Over-under: this is a point/guess.
• 1×2: this is also common, the final count of the game.

My question is for you, how good are you at sportsbook tricks and strategies on Parlay up to 1 × 2, if you are skilled at one of the bets above, I'm sure it will be easy for you to beat the dealer, not difficult, the point is: understand sportsbook.

The most easy way to beat a sportsbook is through arbitrage betting, but this is illegal and the casino might terminated your account or only let you to withdraw your initial bankroll.

If you bet in legal way, the difficulty to beat the sportsbook is depends on you, all of your analysis, speculation and decision will determine the result about how much you will earn. However focusing to beat a sportsbook isn't good because it means you're gamble for money.

You are not correct.
Early lines of events aren't made or moduled by bettors stakes but by bookies and their alghoritms. Closer to the match start odds become more influenced by stakes.
For inplay is simillar. It takes huge number of stakes on one particular outcome to affect odds.
So yes, Pinnacle when open lines has limit 200e. If you hit it, it moves odds. If you hit again, moves again. In that scenario player stakes influence the odds but that is rarity.
Bookies have their lines, they have their juices(nowadays most bookies offer 1.83 on something which is odds 2) and they have sure profits longterm

When it comes to sports betting we usually don't play against the bookmaker, but rather against other gambler. That's the main difference to casinos, in a casino well play against the house and when we lose the casino wins. That is why the casino adds a house edge to all it's games to make sure they win in the long run. A bookmakers offers all type of bets, we can bet on a win, lose or draw of our team and the bookie has no preference what we pick. The bookmaker adds a spread to all his bets, that's why we can't just bet on every outcome and make a profit. He is not in the business of making good bets himself on which team is winning and losing, rather the bookie is trying to match all type of bettors against each other. That's why our goal shouldn't be to beat the bookmaker.

I have recently started betting on sports, I won't be able to provide you with my overall experience as in I am still a newbie in betting. I started with esports betting and I till now have not felt that it is hard to decide which odd to choose. I agree that the odds are similar on every casino as they might be sourced from one bookmaker. If you are lucky you might get different odds but that is very rare. I have been betting with cryptocurrency and I have not faced the issues that you are quoting in the OP. It is certain that with rapid change happening in technology in these times, things are very different from what is was when you started betting. The only option left is to adapt and work according to it.     

Well, the odds changes are really noticeable but I do love looking for that freebie where the winner is too obvious, and yet the odds are given in a decent amount.
We cannot beat a sportsbook, they always put it in a way where they have the upper hand. All we can do is take that little profit that we can and try to do it in a consistent way. It is difficult because there will be times when it looks like a trap.
You said you are a successful sports bettor so I guess you know how lesser the risk in betting there than in a casino would be. Most Casino and sports bookies nowadays take most of their profit from their casino games which we all know is where the house always wins. While those who really want to maximize their profits in gambling would just pick the sports industry because we could always increase the chance to win by observation and analysis.
That's the only way we could beat them, it takes a lot of effort to do all the research but it is all worth it when you win the bet.

My point is that whole area is non regulated. There is noone controlling those bookmakers, there is noone controlling or commenting how one Betradar(sportradar) has 90% of market which is actually monopoly.
When you mention fixed matches, how can one Sportsbook be sponsor of multiple clubs in same league?
They see how much is staked on each outcome, see their liability and potential profit and MAYBE influence it...

Of couse that sportsbooks adapt, it's normal but the fact is that they don't answer to anyone and can decide not to pay whenever they want.

Considering later replies, Pinnacle I use regulary while betfair also implements premium tax for constant winners and I use it regulary aswell. My post was intended for normal bookmakers, not sharps as Pinny/Betfair/ibc etc..

Stake.com is one of the worst out there. Using Celebs to promote themselves with huge sums while in real life you can't bet 500 usd on low level tennis. Their offer is sh1t and when they lock your account, it takes ages to answer or resolve issues.
For 99% of time their support doesn't provide answer but switch blame to another department etc..And to sue them, that's another pa1n in the ass..
Stake.com aims for gamblers who go in casino or ludomaniacs, not normal people as their offer is really poor.

Ehhh it's mostly because it's much more developed now compared to the past. There were some, if I were to describe it, loopholes that people were able to take advantage of before so they were able to profit substantially enough, to the point where "beating" the sportsbook can be a thing. That's just how things goes imo. Ofc this doesn't include scam casinos who can easily use Curacao licenses (I've seen them before) or just generally sites that don't provide anything good compared to existing reputable ones, they're just sites that exist thinking profit exists in hosting sports bets.

Same with the KYC issue. It's an issue of the past since it was untouched, but with how bookmakers operate nowadays and how laws were made around it, it's natural to feel that it's restraining a LOT of people, and that's their goal imo. So that they are in actual control of what's happening, or whatever it is that's happening, they know the limits of it. It's how they keep their business in the long term afloat imo. Tbf no one would like they're business to suddenly go under because of a no-limit bet their user made.

profession? What do you mean with over 15 years of experience? From my understanding, you made a living with gambling profits for the last 15 years.
Regarding the question, I think it is better to open several accounts with various bookmakers so you can set your own limits and apply whatever gambling strategy you prefer to play.
If you are afraid of account block by bookies, you should check Pinnacle and Betfair. Pinnacle never blocks winners and limits are higher than average bookies, while on Betfair you play against other users not house.

There are still lots of bookies that do not impose strict KYC requirements, though their legitimacy is always hanging in the balance and you do not know when will they screw you up with your winnings or deposits. There are still some local bookies here in our country that operate with huge sums, and are still raking millions per day and are consistently giving out winnings in a short time-frame. You cannot really beat those bookies, but you sure can get a lot of money out of them and they'll still pay - at least in my experience those of some high rollers that I personally know.

Everything you said is true but you are taking for granted that you win over time in these 15 years and I would love to see some real stats for these,I am sure a good gambler can have them and even if you don't I still believe you.Let me tell though what is difficult for real nowadays,I don't know what bets do you place,what sports and what odds but I mainly play soccer from some time now and today I was screwed by Chile Primera,Huachipato is first in the standings and was playing at home against last place Magallanes who came from at least 3 consecutive lost games in the Chile Primera,yet they got and equalized against Huachipato tonight,screwing many bets,this is for me the real difficulty and not the bet limit,in crypto casinos you have a much higher limit from what I have heard,not 100% sure about this though.

Sports betting is changing swiftly, and not necessarily for the better. "Soft" sportsbooks and stricter KYC regulations have made betting harder. These developments require new ways to beat the sportsbook. Crypto isn't widely acknowledged, but it's too early to rule it out. Scams are a problem, but like any new industry, the wheat separates from the chaff. Just wait—trustworthy crypto bookies will emerge. Bettors must be wary of "cheap licenses" and sluggish authorities. Bettors could band together to press for more regulation and accountability from these businesses. It's hard, but doable. Identical odds may make value betting difficult, but they may also inspire more advanced predictive models and statistical research. This could eliminate the same odds problem and restore the edge.

It is not soft but they become even harder in my opinion KYC is additional security, and prevents younger adults to play with gambling, and you can not compare online gambling back then and now because there are a lot of differences right now or you can not compare the casino's with online casino's because it is a very different thing if you don't like KYC then don't get into a certain gambling site that has one, gambling sites are now creating security measure for our money to be safe I think at least we could say is thank you,


It is your choice if you want to use crypto or not used crypto in playing casino and sports bets, for me, I choose betting sites that accept crypto, or it is a good thing to pay or make a tip with Crypto, that will be an easy transaction and to not convert at all,


Gambling is not a profession, at least it is not a long term thing, but just a short term only because eventually you will change it just like what you are saying right now, well it always good to have a regular job than making gambling as a source of profit because it can not work like that,

Agree with that. I don't see the motivation to topple a casino when he can always win if he is that good at betting despite the limit. He doesn't have to kill the business. I don't see anyone giving a reward to him after making a casino bankrupt unless he owns the other. Just cornering the market.  He can try the newer casinos but the competition ahead of them is already going to make a rough road for them.

But how hard is it to beat a sportsbook, it's not easy.

well, if he thinks he's not getting ahead anymore on this type of betting, even playing on reputable bookies, then, he can always change his profession and find another industry where he can earn a lot of money. bookies have their own way of getting ahead of this game, after all, they are in this business to earn as much profits as they can. they will go bankrupt if each bettor will beat the house. so do you think, bookies would let this happen? i don't think so.

I think his scam description to crypto bookies are those casino that limit a user when they are winning frequently that makes user like him doesn’t have enough time to play more in the casino to generate more profit. Most of the case of casino scam accusation usually involves sports betting. The reason for that is because user is placing only on valued bets or on matches that is flagged as fixed match.

I think he will experience that same even on Stake or other reputable bookie since he mention that he is always successful on having a profit by playing on bookies.

Well, they likely to have these measures because they learn from the past and this is likely that mitigating things are their priorities. I don't think that kind of soft but you probably have meaning on that but I think limitations are maintain due to casinos adhering on the rules set from where they get their licenses. Change is constant and casinos aren't an exception to this, this has been made and I know conservative folks out there are having a culture shock.

This is probably not the best forum for you since you're already discussing ways to beat the casino's terms and conditions like multi-accounting or other workarounds. You know that there are many platforms here offering sportsbook so I doubt someone profiting from all these will tell you their secret.

Years ago when information traveled slowly it was a lot easier to find a place to hit a line that hasn't moved.  With the availability of that information and automation to a degree on lines that it has been difficult to grab a good line.  In terms of beating a book it's doable for savy bettors and a well disciplined one who doesn't chase losses.

You probably didn't try your best to look for a bookmaker that is not a scam. Stake.com had been around for years. I'd be surprised if you hadn't heard of it.

What I'm not sure of is what you mean by beating a sportbook, they are pretty much rich and they limit how much you can bet if they are not able to pay you if you win. Thats sort of how it works and guarantees you may not be able to bankrupt them.

Perhaps you are an arbitrage bettors that’s why you are always having a problem on all the sportsbook that you are playing. This is the oly way you can beat a sportsbook since you are betting on casino error with positive EV on your bets. There’s no way to beat sportsbook because they just balance bets on both side by adjusting the odds in proportion to the amount of bets placed on each side.

Sportsbook is not a scam by just limiting you when you are winning. They are just a business that want’s profit by providing entertainment in the form of gambling. They are not a charity so a profitable user like will gonna hurt the casino profitability as business.

Gambling is not as same as betting.
When you gamble in casino, you have predetermined chances to win and house is always in advantage.
With betting it's different. There is plenty variables which affect odds and on long run you can beat the bookie.
If you know players from club from your city and you know they have been drinking all night before the match, you have the value of betting against them. Of course, it doesn't mean it will win, but bookmakers didn't have that information when created the odds and often won't have even closer to start so it's worth betting.
If you are on tennis tournament and see the player strugling with injury, you can make a bet against him  before he asks medical timeout and bookmakers adjust the odds. That's another example of getting the value bet and making profit on long run.
Even simpler, if there is friendly match and it's expected to be strongest lineup of one club but the moment the lineups are out you spot it's 2nd team, you can bet before odds adjust.
Please do not put gambling and betting in same basket.
I agree both can be devastating if you stake more than you can afford and both can ruin lives, but difference is that betting can also be profitable on long run while casino can't(excluding poker and p2p games)

You can not win more if you depend on gambling. Also have been some rich people that become broke while gambling can be one of the reasons.

Gambling should just be taken as fun and nothing more.

Even if you gambling and win, do not encourage others to do so because people are prone to lose while gambling than to win.

One thing I noticed about bookies is that you can see low odds, but if you are no more comfortable, try casinos. Casinos have greater odds, but we should be mindful of addiction or risking high amount of money because you can not win the house over a long time.

Well I am not talking about gambling for fun, when you do few hundred bucks and have fun. As the title says, I am talking about beating a sportsbooks. I am living of betting for long time and that's simply not possible with 1 account per bookmaker,especially lately. Everyone who says otherwise is a delusional.
Try hitting lets say low level tennis ITF. Lot of wrong odds there as lot of players don't even have ranking.
You can win maximum of few hundreds on such events and after you do some profits, you will get restricted to few bucks per bet.
Same is with lower basketball/football leagues.
Of course that major competitions are different story, but they are almost impossible to beat on the long run.

Probably you do not like KYC gambling sites, but the more the regulations and the more gambling sites are known to the public, the more the regulators are targeting the gambling sites. So it is not the gambling sites fault.

I started to bet in 2014, on local fiat sites, but decided to open a foreign gambling in 2018. I have noticed their odds to be different but just little and similar to almost the same would be the conclusion. When I started to make use of some bookies that have ANN thread on this forum, I compared it with the foreign site casino I was using, the only difference was that the fiat gambling site is lite to load and having some better UI. But the odds are almost similar and the crypto casino are also good and having good UI too, with in-play matches added. The opportunity I have more is the withdrawal which is very fast than on Bet365 which its wire transfer takes days for me and the only option to withdraw for people in my country.

Gambling as been like it was for me in the past, unless that I can say that I was an addict and lost money very well in the past, unlike now. I do not concern much about KYC, what I am concerned about is not to give my personal documents to the wrong site that may use it for something else. Gambling is still fun, but still a problem for addicts. Gambling is still enjoyable just like it was before if you do it responsibly.

Hi guys,
I just want to start a discussion here regarding the topic how hard is it to beat sportsbook.
As a sucessfull bettor for over a decade, I want to state that nowadays it's much harder than in past decade. The whole market changed, majority of sportsbooks became "soft" with low limits and quick limiting of account.
Opening new accounts has neven been harder as KYC are harder than before+everyone lacks normal wallets for such work. In past we had Skrill and Neteller while now those are not an option.
For all of you who will write "crypto", its not an option at all. Firstly lot of good bookmakers don't accept crypto and all crypto bookmaker which I have stumbled upon by now have proven to be a scam. If they suspect even a little, without any proof, they will close account and you can go on court for them forever.

Adittional problem nowadays are cheap licenses from Curacao,Malta or Giblatar. Everyone can open a bookmaker, not pay a customer and face no consequences as their govering bodies almost never respond to complaints, let alone solve them.
Most of the bookmakers use same odds provider Betradar(Sportradar) or Betconstruct which creates another obstacle in profiting from betting. Same platform for odds means often identical odds and reactions to stakes so there is not many sites where you can do value betting anylonger.

When it comes to beating a sharp bookie like Pinnacle(which isn't even a sharp anymore), their early limits are ridicilously low and with Early bets you help them correct the lines and remove the value.

I have tried everything in betting world and for the first time in over 15 years I believe that it's time to change profession. I am still making really nice figures but with way more effort and dificulties than before.
Reason for this post is that I want to hear experiences from other bettors and maybe we can help each other with advices