Do you believe they will give it back.
I mean one by one literally checking what IP they are using and pinpoint who is it.
Some users of that exchange wont care anymore. Even if those are just .01 bitcoin. They should matter right?
But that wont happen. They will just go to court, face the issue and maybe pay the fine that is needed without even some jail time.
Let us face it, there have been a lot of hacks and scams and still we dont see anyone paid that large to jail or any way possible.
Topic: Do you believe stolen funds should be returned to their owner? (Read 555 times)
Over $4 billion has been stolen or laundered in the first six months of 2019! This interview with CipherTrace CEO Dave Jevans is really interesting regarding details of the lost and stolen funds.
I was surprised to see that ransomware and scams are some of the biggest points of money loss over exchange hacks.
Worth while interview to watch and join in the conversation of what should happen to stolen funds. Do you get them returned or in a decentralized system are they lost forever?
https://blocktv.com/watch/2019-08-22/5d5ea9e847c19-scams-hacks-ransomware-run-amok-in-the-cryptosphere
I was surprised to see that ransomware and scams are some of the biggest points of money loss over exchange hacks.
Worth while interview to watch and join in the conversation of what should happen to stolen funds. Do you get them returned or in a decentralized system are they lost forever?
https://blocktv.com/watch/2019-08-22/5d5ea9e847c19-scams-hacks-ransomware-run-amok-in-the-cryptosphere
Are you really serious..? You think they stole your money for giving you back. I have who lost her all of token by hacking some stupid person. That was almost two years ago. She told them to return it because those coins/tokens are last hope for change her crises life. They didn't so it's better that not hopping to much from scammers. And we should work for that point because nobody want lose their money.
If the funds aren't be returned to the user, where did the funds go? Government? Police? Or something else who didn't have a right to owned them?
Just returned the funds because it will be something usefull in the future in order to the newcomer who still have a doubt to start investing on cryptocurrency will have a convince that the money will be back again if there is something bad happened. I'm not a lawyer who have an understanding against it, but it is just my perspective as the user.
Just returned the funds because it will be something usefull in the future in order to the newcomer who still have a doubt to start investing on cryptocurrency will have a convince that the money will be back again if there is something bad happened. I'm not a lawyer who have an understanding against it, but it is just my perspective as the user.
Who would’nt like to take money of yours that was stolen? The point is how would it will happen to return to their owner. The most case these days the stolen funds could’nt return because in the first place it is there motive plans to hack money from others.
Over $4 billion has been stolen or laundered in the first six months of 2019! This interview with CipherTrace CEO Dave Jevans is really interesting regarding details of the lost and stolen funds.
I was surprised to see that ransomware and scams are some of the biggest points of money loss over exchange hacks.
Worth while interview to watch and join in the conversation of what should happen to stolen funds. Do you get them returned or in a decentralized system are they lost forever?
https://blocktv.com/watch/2019-08-22/5d5ea9e847c19-scams-hacks-ransomware-run-amok-in-the-cryptosphere
I was surprised to see that ransomware and scams are some of the biggest points of money loss over exchange hacks.
Worth while interview to watch and join in the conversation of what should happen to stolen funds. Do you get them returned or in a decentralized system are they lost forever?
https://blocktv.com/watch/2019-08-22/5d5ea9e847c19-scams-hacks-ransomware-run-amok-in-the-cryptosphere
It depends on where the stolen funds were stolen. If they were stolen under the care of third-parties platforms such as cryptocurrency exchanges or other centralized platforms then the platforms have to compensate their customers. If they were stolen directly from the owners then the coins would be considered lost forever if the thieves are not found.
Base on simple morality, I'd agree that stolen funds should be returned to the owners. With the rate of thefts in the cryptosphere, security agencies would be interested in tracking these funds. Many crypto users do not like the idea of regulation - I don't too, but this is one of the problems regulation tend solve. We don't have to be nonchalant since we haven't lost any funds to these thefts.
It is doubtful if anyone who steals in the first place would want to return it because they already plan it. Why steal if they have morality. Except the thief is forced by law to return the loot they will not return it. This is simple maths.
Mostly stolen funds will not be returned to the owner. Maybe the owner of the exchange that has been hacked will give you a small refund. I have experience that my funds was stole but even now there is no refund back. They stole your funds because they want, not for giving back your funds.
They should give it back, but how?
Let us make Binance as an example. You could trade with them, deposit and withdraw for a limit of 2 BTC. Let us say many does that to avoid KYC. If a sudden robbery happen inside the company will they be held liable for all this funds?
I dont think so. You avoided the KYC so it is like avoiding the terms and agreement.
Question: Hoe will you prove you really own funds with them?
In other cases, they go through a lot of paperworks and jurisdictions. But giving back those funds to each user will be impossible.
Let us make Binance as an example. You could trade with them, deposit and withdraw for a limit of 2 BTC. Let us say many does that to avoid KYC. If a sudden robbery happen inside the company will they be held liable for all this funds?
I dont think so. You avoided the KYC so it is like avoiding the terms and agreement.
Question: Hoe will you prove you really own funds with them?
In other cases, they go through a lot of paperworks and jurisdictions. But giving back those funds to each user will be impossible.
I think that you have a very good point though. It is not only to give it back but it is whether it gets to the actually owner especially with the analysis you gave. If people have decided to boycott 2fas, KYC , how will they show proof in a case like this.
Crypto theft isn't like the physical theft where restoration can merely be done on radio, television by simply showing of identity card and the likes.
If they are able to recover the stolen fund, the right thing to do would have actually been to return the stolen fund, but how can they return it when they cannot even trace the owner, except maybe a case is filed with the police showing proof if their stolen funds, then maybe they can use their discretion to pay such person, but if not, the fund might be lost forever and the investor never get the chance of getting the money back again.
Moreover, I think it would even be very difficult to ever recover all those stolen funds, since there is no way there offenders can ever be traced, except maybe they were caught through a physical scam and then probably make a personal confession about it, so those fund would just be in the decentralized system and lost forever.
Moreover, I think it would even be very difficult to ever recover all those stolen funds, since there is no way there offenders can ever be traced, except maybe they were caught through a physical scam and then probably make a personal confession about it, so those fund would just be in the decentralized system and lost forever.
They should give it back, but how?
Let us make Binance as an example. You could trade with them, deposit and withdraw for a limit of 2 BTC. Let us say many does that to avoid KYC. If a sudden robbery happen inside the company will they be held liable for all this funds?
I dont think so. You avoided the KYC so it is like avoiding the terms and agreement.
Question: Hoe will you prove you really own funds with them?
In other cases, they go through a lot of paperworks and jurisdictions. But giving back those funds to each user will be impossible.
Let us make Binance as an example. You could trade with them, deposit and withdraw for a limit of 2 BTC. Let us say many does that to avoid KYC. If a sudden robbery happen inside the company will they be held liable for all this funds?
I dont think so. You avoided the KYC so it is like avoiding the terms and agreement.
Question: Hoe will you prove you really own funds with them?
In other cases, they go through a lot of paperworks and jurisdictions. But giving back those funds to each user will be impossible.
If people asked like that, their answer must be stolend funds should be returned to their owner. But my question is how, like in bitcoin wallet that is anonym, not talk about exchanges because we can know if address is from exchanges. And maybe if law enforcer who ask to the exchanges like who is own the address, maybe they can tell it. But if personal wallet, maybe can returned to that wallet itself. Luck for who not mix it yet because it is easy to trace which wallet is be source of transaction.
since it is 'stolen funds' it is not lost, it is kept and shouldn't be stolen forever. it can never be supported by law and it must have been to the detriment of certain people.
it should be given to the owners. if it is be lost to hackers, there is very little or nothing that can be done about that, everyone will silently bear the pain and let go.
it should be given to the owners. if it is be lost to hackers, there is very little or nothing that can be done about that, everyone will silently bear the pain and let go.
That brings in a lot of questions with it, how do you propose that "stolen" is calculated, I mean who will decide if something is stolen or deservedly given? Maybe one person bought a product using bitcoin and then they used the product but didn't like it, they want to return and get the money back but the company doesn't have that type of policy, whatever you bought has no return, what are we going to do in that case?
Do we claim it is stolen because the person who bought it doesn't like it anymore? I don't think so. That is why I think best case scenario here is not to touch the currently running system. Does it have downside to it? Sure it does, but that doesn't mean you have to really overhaul the whole system just because some people were idiots enough to get scammed.
Do we claim it is stolen because the person who bought it doesn't like it anymore? I don't think so. That is why I think best case scenario here is not to touch the currently running system. Does it have downside to it? Sure it does, but that doesn't mean you have to really overhaul the whole system just because some people were idiots enough to get scammed.
When something is decentralized there is no way to bring back the lost funds on hacks so the owner will never get any funds from the hacker but we see binace returned lost funds from the pockets when they got hacked so getting refund is owners right but exchanges will decide about that.
The only possible way that it can be refunded back to the owner is when the scammer confession the exchange for which the money was stolen from, and provided they can still recover the money back from the scammer, if they have not spent it on useless things that cannot even be sold for them to recover part, if they can recover the money, then it would be possible to refund it. Let us imagine that they were able to apprehend the hacker that stole from binance platform, and the money is still with such hacker, binance will be the one to take the money since they had already refunded them, but if they were yet to refund, then binance should be able to know those who were affect that will get part of the recovered money, but this will be on a rare case really.
When something is decentralized there is no way to bring back the lost funds on hacks so the owner will never get any funds from the hacker but we see binace returned lost funds from the pockets when they got hacked so getting refund is owners right but exchanges will decide about that.
The only possible way that it can be refunded back to the owner is when the scammer confession the exchange for which the money was stolen from, and provided they can still recover the money back from the scammer, if they have not spent it on useless things that cannot even be sold for them to recover part, if they can recover the money, then it would be possible to refund it. Let us imagine that they were able to apprehend the hacker that stole from binance platform, and the money is still with such hacker, binance will be the one to take the money since they had already refunded them, but if they were yet to refund, then binance should be able to know those who were affect that will get part of the recovered money, but this will be on a rare case really.
I was surprised to see that ransomware and scams are some of the biggest points of money loss over exchange hacks.
I'm not surprised at all to see scams as biggest losing points for exchanges. But ransomware seems to be a big shock to me. I recall reading that ransomware attacks only gain hackers very tiny amounts of funds because not everyone pays up. Those that do can't even afford to pay much.
And it this is about stolen funds why ransom stolen funds? I don't get it at all.
Over $4 billion has been stolen or laundered in the first six months of 2019! This interview with CipherTrace CEO Dave Jevans is really interesting regarding details of the lost and stolen funds.
I was surprised to see that ransomware and scams are some of the biggest points of money loss over exchange hacks.
Worth while interview to watch and join in the conversation of what should happen to stolen funds. Do you get them returned or in a decentralized system are they lost forever?
https://blocktv.com/watch/2019-08-22/5d5ea9e847c19-scams-hacks-ransomware-run-amok-in-the-cryptosphere
I will not only agree that stolen funds should be returned but I recommend that it should be returned for the interest of Justice and fairness! Because we are having a decentralized system does not mean we should keep our fellow men in poverty by hacking or scamming them. The decentralized(blockchain) has made it difficult for stolen bitcoin and other coins that are being stolen to be recovered as most of this hackers or scammers do transfer the funds to mixers and from there it became difficult to trance. I was surprised to see that ransomware and scams are some of the biggest points of money loss over exchange hacks.
Worth while interview to watch and join in the conversation of what should happen to stolen funds. Do you get them returned or in a decentralized system are they lost forever?
https://blocktv.com/watch/2019-08-22/5d5ea9e847c19-scams-hacks-ransomware-run-amok-in-the-cryptosphere
Is this even a question? Morality speaking, IT SHOULD BE RETURNED to the owner. And those thieves should be punished for what they've done.
The challenge here is how to retrieve the funds that were stolen and how to find the person/thieves.
That's a big challenge, trying to recover of punished those people who stole those funds, there's should be a good agencies who can work things out and run after those people/thieves to get them liable and be punished, there's no assurance whether it can be returned to original owners but what's best is to stop them and punished them so the system will go forward and be accepted and adopted without any doubts and worries.. The challenge here is how to retrieve the funds that were stolen and how to find the person/thieves.
Base on simple morality, I'd agree that stolen funds should be returned to the owners. With the rate of thefts in the cryptosphere, security agencies would be interested in tracking these funds. Many crypto users do not like the idea of regulation - I don't too, but this is one of the problems regulation tend solve. We don't have to be nonchalant since we haven't lost any funds to these thefts.
I never think such morality exist by now. They steal our funds in a certain purposes and not by returning it over. We can't expect that we can have it back once it lost, nobody could do that. In a particular reason why they stole our funds just because we let them to get it. How it sad, we can't get them cause of the anonymity we had in this community. We can only trace the transactions but not the person who make it.
Pretty perfect explanation and sad to admit hurt to heard, but it's comes in the reality the steal funds is very impossible to get back of the owners.
I'll never heard lost or stolen funds are returned it to the owner this issue is very difficult matters if the need to,talk about the honesty amd morality.
Is this even a question? Morality speaking, IT SHOULD BE RETURNED to the owner. And those thieves should be punished for what they've done.
The challenge here is how to retrieve the funds that were stolen and how to find the person/thieves.
The challenge here is how to retrieve the funds that were stolen and how to find the person/thieves.
Yes, it is. It' related to the morality of each people who gets the money. We hope that people are not stolen other people's money because that will be a bad thing and that breaks the law. The risk to do that will cause us to get jail, but that is if we get caught by the police. But I think for people who are stolen other people's money, they will not think to return the money to the owner. We can see the thief in public are that are trying to steal the money and then they are run away from that person because they want to use the money to buy something they want. But that is for an example and related to the cryptocurrency, it is better we are returned the money to the owner.
Base on simple morality, I'd agree that stolen funds should be returned to the owners. With the rate of thefts in the cryptosphere, security agencies would be interested in tracking these funds. Many crypto users do not like the idea of regulation - I don't too, but this is one of the problems regulation tend solve. We don't have to be nonchalant since we haven't lost any funds to these thefts.
I never think such morality exist by now. They steal our funds in a certain purposes and not by returning it over. We can't expect that we can have it back once it lost, nobody could do that. In a particular reason why they stole our funds just because we let them to get it. How it sad, we can't get them cause of the anonymity we had in this community. We can only trace the transactions but not the person who make it.
Pretty perfect explanation and sad to admit hurt to heard, but it's comes in the reality the steal funds is very impossible to get back of the owners.
I'll never heard lost or stolen funds are returned it to the owner this issue is very difficult matters if the need to,talk about the honesty amd morality.
Over $4 billion has been stolen or laundered in the first six months of 2019! This interview with CipherTrace CEO Dave Jevans is really interesting regarding details of the lost and stolen funds.
I was surprised to see that ransomware and scams are some of the biggest points of money loss over exchange hacks.
Worth while interview to watch and join in the conversation of what should happen to stolen funds. Do you get them returned or in a decentralized system are they lost forever?
https://blocktv.com/watch/2019-08-22/5d5ea9e847c19-scams-hacks-ransomware-run-amok-in-the-cryptosphere
for funds that have been lost there may be no hope of return, now thieves have taken advantage of the situation and I don't think it is a good thing to hope that the funds will return. I was surprised to see that ransomware and scams are some of the biggest points of money loss over exchange hacks.
Worth while interview to watch and join in the conversation of what should happen to stolen funds. Do you get them returned or in a decentralized system are they lost forever?
https://blocktv.com/watch/2019-08-22/5d5ea9e847c19-scams-hacks-ransomware-run-amok-in-the-cryptosphere
Is this even a question? Morality speaking, IT SHOULD BE RETURNED to the owner. And those thieves should be punished for what they've done.
The challenge here is how to retrieve the funds that were stolen and how to find the person/thieves.
The challenge here is how to retrieve the funds that were stolen and how to find the person/thieves.
When something is decentralized there is no way to bring back the lost funds on hacks so the owner will never get any funds from the hacker but we see binace returned lost funds from the pockets when they got hacked so getting refund is owners right but exchanges will decide about that.
Do you get them returned or in a decentralized system are they lost forever?
They are lost forever no matter how good they are on tracking into things of lost funds but still its useless.No keys=No funds and theres no magic on reverting those transactions been done that's why hoping into this
impossible thing will just stress you out.
If the stolen funds are somehow retrieved then the regular rule of ownership still applies if they haven't retrieve it though a company is still liable to its investors even if their funds are stolen from them I mean even banks have deposit insurance for their clients just in case a robbery or bankruptcy happens to them. The insurance of course doesn't cover everything there is a certain limit depending on each country or each insurer. And of course crypto exchange doesn't have one as they are not yet particularly covered by that kind of requirement but if the lawmakers decided to do so I believe that crypto exchanges will actually start tightening and improving their securities ones they know they are liable to the potential losses of their users.
Over $4 billion has been stolen or laundered in the first six months of 2019! This interview with CipherTrace CEO Dave Jevans is really interesting regarding details of the lost and stolen funds.
Quote
don't believe the stats that these companies that are doing "blockchain analysis" release. they exaggerate things and most of the times they release fake numbers that don't even make sense.
Totally agree, they tend to do that to somehow let investors or future investors lose faith in blockchain and for them to either sell in panic or not invest instead because of this fake statistics.Quote
Do you get them returned or in a decentralized system are they lost forever?
can you really prove they were "stolen"?lets say a transaction goes out of your wallet spending all your funds. can you prove that it was a hacker that stole it or was it you who sold those coins and now want to scam the other party by calling it a hack?
you see the problem here?
You have a point, no one can really prove it was stolen, it is so easy to say the coins were stolen when in reality they spend it all but we don’t have a way to track it because when the funds were spent or transferred you can really trace who transferred it and also cannot trace the real person who made the transfer, what we can only do is give them the benefit of the doubt that it was really stolen.
It depends.
If the one who stole the funds is a thief then don't expect that it will be returned. I didn't see any incident that the thief gave back what he stole. Yes they are some who returned the funds they get but with the help of some authorities but to return them intentionally, I don't think they will do it unless they are stupid thieves.
If the one who stole the funds is a thief then don't expect that it will be returned. I didn't see any incident that the thief gave back what he stole. Yes they are some who returned the funds they get but with the help of some authorities but to return them intentionally, I don't think they will do it unless they are stupid thieves.
Base on simple morality, I'd agree that stolen funds should be returned to the owners. With the rate of thefts in the cryptosphere, security agencies would be interested in tracking these funds. Many crypto users do not like the idea of regulation - I don't too, but this is one of the problems regulation tend solve. We don't have to be nonchalant since we haven't lost any funds to these thefts.
I never think such morality exist by now. They steal our funds in a certain purposes and not by returning it over. We can't expect that we can have it back once it lost, nobody could do that. In a particular reason why they stole our funds just because we let them to get it. How it sad, we can't get them cause of the anonymity we had in this community. We can only trace the transactions but not the person who make it.
Base on simple morality, I'd agree that stolen funds should be returned to the owners. With the rate of thefts in the cryptosphere, security agencies would be interested in tracking these funds. Many crypto users do not like the idea of regulation - I don't too, but this is one of the problems regulation tend solve. We don't have to be nonchalant since we haven't lost any funds to these thefts.
I never think such morality exist by now. They steal our funds in a certain purposes and not by returning it over. We can't expect that we can have it back once it lost, nobody could do that. In a particular reason why they stole our funds just because we let them to get it. How it sad, we can't get them cause of the anonymity we had in this community. We can only trace the transactions but not the person who make it.
You should be asking if the hacker or scammer has the consciousness of returning it back.
Most scammers and hackers are mind harden and when the succeed in hacking an exchange there is mostly no return.
Those stolen coins are most investors life savings and they will do anything to have it back.
Most scammers and hackers are mind harden and when the succeed in hacking an exchange there is mostly no return.
Those stolen coins are most investors life savings and they will do anything to have it back.
As I believe it also, the problem isn't in our ends but those who stole the funds from us. Scammers never exist if they never scam people and they think that this is a great opportunity for them to make money which people never agreed for this action.
We don't need to expect that we can recover those stolen funds cause surely it never come back to us.
We don't need to expect that we can recover those stolen funds cause surely it never come back to us.
The actual question you should ask is: why do people steal and that'll further simplify the question lol. Thieves are thieves buddy. Ah well, maybe people may hack just to prove a point and send back the money. Other than that, thieves don't steal si as to return, they because they're thieves and that's what they do. So just be careful in crypto so you don't end up a victim.
Base on simple morality, I'd agree that stolen funds should be returned to the owners. With the rate of thefts in the cryptosphere, security agencies would be interested in tracking these funds. Many crypto users do not like the idea of regulation - I don't too, but this is one of the problems regulation tend solve. We don't have to be nonchalant since we haven't lost any funds to these thefts.
What does regulation have to do with it?Even if the regulation happens there are a lot of anonymous coins as well as mixers,with which you can still steal funds.Generally my answer is-Yes, I believe the ability to return the funds (if their transactions can be tracked) must exist.In the version that I described above, this is simply unrealistic.
Once it is stolen there's no taking it back.
What kind of logic do the hackers/scammers have if they will have to return it then after taking it all?
If they want to trade it with some ransom money i don't think it will work both ways since we all know that the government doesn't negotiate with these people.
What kind of logic do the hackers/scammers have if they will have to return it then after taking it all?
If they want to trade it with some ransom money i don't think it will work both ways since we all know that the government doesn't negotiate with these people.
In an ideal world, everything should be returned to its owners, and all scammers should be punished. But, unfortunately, we do not live in an ideal world. In the cryptosphere, the return of stolen funds seems almost impossible. That's the price of anonymity.
It's true, we don't live in ideal world but that doesn't mean we have to give up justice. Everything that is stolen should be returned, that is only right. Yes, anonimity could be an issue but still it's not so big obstacle anymore, transaction could be traced great deal. Also, I think that regulation could also help against illegal crypto activities.
If after investigation and stolen funds belongs to someone(that got it true a clean and legal means) then it's right to return it to them.
Fewer are case of stolen funds becoming recovered and those of exchanges stolen funds that get recovered some exchange still do not compensate those who lost their funds
Fewer are case of stolen funds becoming recovered and those of exchanges stolen funds that get recovered some exchange still do not compensate those who lost their funds
I think if we have a proper technology that allows individuals to get their funds returned while protecting individuals privacy that would be an ideal situation. I believe wholeheartedly that is what companies like ciphertrace are trying to provide as a service.
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If that person has stolen funds, then I think he has a bad will because he wants to get the money from the illegal things. That is why I think he doesn't want to return to their owner because he wants to use the money for another thing that he wants. But if he gets the money by coincidence, then I think he should be returned to the owner because that is not his money, and it's related to the morale of the person.
There is no question that it is just right to return stolen funds (be they digital or fiat) to their real owners and then have the perpetrators prosecuted for the thievery. But then we know the real problems with this scenario: it seems that nobody has the power to get those funds back and yes using technology it is quite possible to locate where those digital funds are located yet it stopped there. This is in fact another big reason why there can be boom of hackers as years go by in the world of cryptocurrency. The prize or money that a successful hacking can get is quite enormous.
what should happen to stolen funds. Do you get them returned or in a decentralized system are they lost forever?
It depends if how the funds have lost . if the funds lost because of hacking then there is no way that it can be returned by the hackers but if ever they caught by the police or cyber crime units and the funds are still recovered then the there is still a chance that the funds can be returned to its owner .
Other scenarios that i think is when we send a crypto to a wrong address . the funds can be returned if the reciever is a good person but it will lost forever if the reciever is inactive or a bad person
Base on my experience when ever any found is stolen and the hackers are not traced and arrested it is gone forever, because the decentralized system does not allow any third party involvement and only the holder have the sole right to send found to any one.
Do you get them returned or in a decentralized system are they lost forever?
If the stolen funds are not moved you cannot really do anything about it but there are ways to track the tainted coins and if there is a crowd funded security team to monitor all the tainted coins and wallets and their movements and inform all the exchanges in real time, then these tainted coins will be useless, even now there will be a point of exit if these stolen funds are to be converted, there were instances in the past where stolen funds were recovered with the help of exchanges, so anything possible. 
Fighting money laundering, ponzis, thefts and other types of financial crimes is important, of course. I did not know about ransomware being so popular, honestly. People have to be educated about their money management, real and not real offers, risks of investments, security measures and stuff like that. If the authorities manage to confiscate some funds, I think it would only be fair to return the money to those who lost it. As for the idea of making definitely stolen money frozen - I don't think it's justified and will ever be approved by the crypto community because it allows abuses. Or at least the freezing decisions will have to be made by the community, not the authorities.
Nice to hear that financing terrorism is usually happening with fiat, not cryptos.
Nice to hear that financing terrorism is usually happening with fiat, not cryptos.
Depends. Are the stolen funds being recovered from the theif or another victim who received them in exchange for btc or something? Are the bitcoins retrievable too. If you take funds from the guy who sold bitcoins, with out returning the btc, law enforcement are essentially stealing from them. Its just moving the victim around. When in all honesty its the error of the victim /their financial institute that allowed access by the thieves. Without repercussions why would they bother to increase security in future. Maybe an insurance fund that covers 75% could be mandatory with the rest split between parties.
Depending on whether the person who receives Bitcoin is good or not, if they are good they will return it, but often all things are not returned, so sad 
It doesn't matter if their good or bad the thing is, Stolen money should be given back to it's rightful owner,
They worked for they earned it so they should be the one to spend it.
in this case, I'm not really sure that the money can be returned, only when they succeed in returning it, that would be one of the best points in this regard. Well, I think this is quite interesting to follow.
If there really is a way to return it I think they were tricked into a scam project they should get their rights back, but in fact they still lost. Especially for cases of fraud not theft., so I do not believe.
Depending on whether the person who receives Bitcoin is good or not, if they are good they will return it, but often all things are not returned, so sad
It doesn't matter if their good or bad the thing is, Stolen money should be given back to it's rightful owner,
They worked for they earned it so they should be the one to spend it.
In a decentralized platform something lost is lost forever. It'll get refunded only if the user who stole the funds need to have the mind to refund it back. In one case that happened in my country, there is a borrowing of certain amount of USD in bitcoin, and while returning back the borrower returned in terms of bitcoin as the market of bitcoin was down. This was taken to the custody of the police and a complaint has been filed. No result on the complaint yet. This way refund is completely an impossible thing.
It's simple logic if the hacker has been caught and the fund stolen was also recovered then it might return to the owner. Yeah, I know that crypto transactions are not irreversible but there is a high chance that it will trace/tract and become hacker caught. It would be returned by the authorities to the official owner.
That case if hackers been caught it will be returned, but if not it will be lost forever even you know where is the last drop address on it. (Majority of stolen bitcoin are not being recovered, so we don't expect it will return to the owner).
That case if hackers been caught it will be returned, but if not it will be lost forever even you know where is the last drop address on it. (Majority of stolen bitcoin are not being recovered, so we don't expect it will return to the owner).
Stolen and being lost forever is different from each other.
When your cryptocurrencies are stolen, obviously there is a way to return that the thing is that it is close to impossible to do that unless you know who done that. When you send your Bitcoin into a wrong address and hat address don't exist, the Bitcoin you sent will not be found or returned since that is already lost forever and that is deducted to the total supply, it can't be used anymore. For me, I hope that it will be returned to the owner since ethically speaking, that is the right thing to do.
When your cryptocurrencies are stolen, obviously there is a way to return that the thing is that it is close to impossible to do that unless you know who done that. When you send your Bitcoin into a wrong address and hat address don't exist, the Bitcoin you sent will not be found or returned since that is already lost forever and that is deducted to the total supply, it can't be used anymore. For me, I hope that it will be returned to the owner since ethically speaking, that is the right thing to do.
OP,you are formulating your question in the wrong way.
I guess that you are asking about whether or not crypto transactions should become reversible,in order to fight all the scammers,hackers and cheaters.Is that what you are trying to ask?
I don't think that making transactions reversible will solve the problem.Look at the fiat banking industry.Billions of dollars stolen every year,and yet they can't reverse those fiat transactions.
I guess that you are asking about whether or not crypto transactions should become reversible,in order to fight all the scammers,hackers and cheaters.Is that what you are trying to ask?
I don't think that making transactions reversible will solve the problem.Look at the fiat banking industry.Billions of dollars stolen every year,and yet they can't reverse those fiat transactions.
If you're making an open request for scammers of thieves to return funds they stole, then that is never going to happen, why did they steal the funds in the first place if they are simply going to return it, it's almost impossible to appeal to the conscience of criminals.
But in case of recovered funds which happens less frequently in this cryptocurrency environment, then the funds ought to be returned to the original owners, but when you take another look at it, how many stolen funds have been recovered, it's near zero, the technology makes it difficult for us to track down criminals.
But in case of recovered funds which happens less frequently in this cryptocurrency environment, then the funds ought to be returned to the original owners, but when you take another look at it, how many stolen funds have been recovered, it's near zero, the technology makes it difficult for us to track down criminals.
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Do you get them returned or in a decentralized system are they lost forever?
In an actual scenario, hacked funds do not usually returned to the owner. Hackers do their illegal job to get funds from a particular exchanges to sustain their financial needs. I do not think that they will reconsider their morality hence, they would ignore it and will not waste another time to returned what they've got.
But on the other side, yeah they should. It is because, user's did not easily get the money they have invested, they worked hard for it. If that would be the reason for the hacked victims to messed up their life, i do hope hackers will atleast return it.
The article is very different to what your title states, and your discussing 2 different things.
Regarding if funds should be returned to their owner, yes, of course. That was your money that was stolen, and you deserve it back, not in the hands of the government, or the hacker/thief. Is this viable though is the real question, and that is a definite no. Think of the number of resources that would be required to do such a thing, and it's near impossible to get funds returned correctly, and the government would never do such a thing if they caught the thieves.
Another big issue, how would you prove that funds were stolen? A transaction going out of your wallet isn't really enough, and BTC offers way less information compared to fiat money, so it'll be much harder to prove such things.
I think we are assuming that the thieves are caught, and the government or another entity holds the funds.
Regarding if funds should be returned to their owner, yes, of course. That was your money that was stolen, and you deserve it back, not in the hands of the government, or the hacker/thief. Is this viable though is the real question, and that is a definite no. Think of the number of resources that would be required to do such a thing, and it's near impossible to get funds returned correctly, and the government would never do such a thing if they caught the thieves.
Another big issue, how would you prove that funds were stolen? A transaction going out of your wallet isn't really enough, and BTC offers way less information compared to fiat money, so it'll be much harder to prove such things.
I never think such morality exist by now. They steal our funds in a certain purposes and not by returning it over.
I mean, I'm not defending thieves(fuck them), but it would be really unrealistic to expect thieves to return stolen money.
If there is anyway to get your stolen funds back then why not! Ofcours it is the proper thing to do, if funds where repprted stolen and the authorities are able to recover the funds, it would be only logically to return it to the owner's by following due process, but on a more serious note, is it really possible to get stolen crypto back? because i feel in most cases those funds are lost forever.
Ok, let's take this scenario :
Scammer steals 10 bitcoins from his mark and he immediately spends those bitcoins at a local online computer shop. The computer shop does not know where the bitcoins are coming from, but the coins can be traced back to their shop. The goods was picked up by the scammer, but the scammer used a fake ID to take the receipt of the goods and no copies was made of the ID documents, so the scammer cannot be traced.
Should the computer shop pay back the 10 bitcoins that was legally received for goods that was purchased at their shop? This is not as straight forward as it sounds, because a lot of scammer mix those coins or they buy online goods to launder that money.
Scammer steals 10 bitcoins from his mark and he immediately spends those bitcoins at a local online computer shop. The computer shop does not know where the bitcoins are coming from, but the coins can be traced back to their shop. The goods was picked up by the scammer, but the scammer used a fake ID to take the receipt of the goods and no copies was made of the ID documents, so the scammer cannot be traced.
Should the computer shop pay back the 10 bitcoins that was legally received for goods that was purchased at their shop? This is not as straight forward as it sounds, because a lot of scammer mix those coins or they buy online goods to launder that money.
This appears to me a simple case of logic and propriety. If a fund is stolen, it should be reported to the proper authorities. The authorities will have to investigate and employ all necessary legal measures to recover the funds. If the funds are recovered, it will be returned to whoever owns it. If the robbers are not caught and brought to justice, then it would be very hard to recover what was stolen unless the funds goes under the radar of the authorities and is tracked down. It will then be frozen with the cooperation of the site in which it is stored, and eventually returned to where they came from.
It does not mean that any stolen fund in a decentralized environment is lost forever. There were already cases of crypto robberies in the past where funds are successfully recovered.
It does not mean that any stolen fund in a decentralized environment is lost forever. There were already cases of crypto robberies in the past where funds are successfully recovered.
Over $4 billion has been stolen or laundered in the first six months of 2019! This interview with CipherTrace CEO Dave Jevans is really interesting regarding details of the lost and stolen funds.
don't believe the stats that these companies that are doing "blockchain analysis" release. they exaggerate things and most of the times they release fake numbers that don't even make sense.Quote
Do you get them returned or in a decentralized system are they lost forever?
can you really prove they were "stolen"?lets say a transaction goes out of your wallet spending all your funds. can you prove that it was a hacker that stole it or was it you who sold those coins and now want to scam the other party by calling it a hack?
you see the problem here?
I never think such morality exist by now. They steal our funds in a certain purposes and not by returning it over.
I mean, I'm not defending thieves(fuck them), but it would be really unrealistic to expect thieves to return stolen money.If possible stolen funds must be returned to their respective owners if they can still track its owners.
We can track every transaction in the bitcoin blockchain simply because it's transparent. While we can trace the coins being moved, it still doesn't guarantee for us to know the thief in the end; unless the thief does some really stupid stuff like sending the money on a custodial exchange with his/her name affiliated with the address, which is something that we honestly shouldn't expect them to be making. 
If possible stolen funds must be returned to their respective owners if they can still track its owners. Because these funds are earned by them it the hard way some people bought Crypto Currencies with all they have.
It is not a good idea to keep it to ourselves if we are some sort of authority because we know how hard to earn some cash these days. that's why if it's possible to return the stolen unds then return it.
It is not a good idea to keep it to ourselves if we are some sort of authority because we know how hard to earn some cash these days. that's why if it's possible to return the stolen unds then return it.
Of course yes!
But I also believe that the correct method should be like this: find out who the thief is, then use $5 wrenches to beat him until he returns the funds.
Then who should be responsible for carrying out those operations mentioned above?
My answer is the one who is responsible for the funds which means if you keep the funds in your own wallet then it is youreslf, else if you keep the funds in exchanges, then it should be the exchanges.
But I also believe that the correct method should be like this: find out who the thief is, then use $5 wrenches to beat him until he returns the funds.
Then who should be responsible for carrying out those operations mentioned above?
My answer is the one who is responsible for the funds which means if you keep the funds in your own wallet then it is youreslf, else if you keep the funds in exchanges, then it should be the exchanges.
Imagine being the person who got their money stolen. Wouldn't you want to get it back?
I don't expect it to be easy but if the hackers are caught and the money that they got from all the scamming that they are doing is recovered, wouldn't it be right to return them? Knowing cryptocurrencies and its irreversible transactions but it still could be tracked. Maybe from the owners themselves can sign a message saying that this is your wallet and got stolen. From that wallet, you could now follow the trail of the BTC. Proving the ownership, I guess.
I don't expect it to be easy but if the hackers are caught and the money that they got from all the scamming that they are doing is recovered, wouldn't it be right to return them? Knowing cryptocurrencies and its irreversible transactions but it still could be tracked. Maybe from the owners themselves can sign a message saying that this is your wallet and got stolen. From that wallet, you could now follow the trail of the BTC. Proving the ownership, I guess.
The topic is different from what you have posted.
Yep, I agree with this. In the real world, stolen funds will be returned by the authorities. However, that was possible because the police could recover funds.This becomes somewhat complicated with cryptocurrency because there is a possibility that the private key cannot be obtained. However, if waterboarding can recover the hacker's key, then they must return it.
Base on simple morality, I'd agree that stolen funds should be returned to the owners. With the rate of thefts in the cryptosphere, security agencies would be interested in tracking these funds. Many crypto users do not like the idea of regulation - I don't too, but this is one of the problems regulation tend solve. We don't have to be nonchalant since we haven't lost any funds to these thefts.
I never think such morality exist by now. They steal our funds in a certain purposes and not by returning it over. We can't expect that we can have it back once it lost, nobody could do that. In a particular reason why they stole our funds just because we let them to get it. How it sad, we can't get them cause of the anonymity we had in this community. We can only trace the transactions but not the person who make it.
Base on simple morality, I'd agree that stolen funds should be returned to the owners. With the rate of thefts in the cryptosphere, security agencies would be interested in tracking these funds. Many crypto users do not like the idea of regulation - I don't too, but this is one of the problems regulation tend solve. We don't have to be nonchalant since we haven't lost any funds to these thefts.
Over $4 billion has been stolen or laundered in the first six months of 2019! This interview with CipherTrace CEO Dave Jevans is really interesting regarding details of the lost and stolen funds.
I was surprised to see that ransomware and scams are some of the biggest points of money loss over exchange hacks.
Worth while interview to watch and join in the conversation of what should happen to stolen funds. Do you get them returned or in a decentralized system are they lost forever?
https://blocktv.com/watch/2019-08-22/5d5ea9e847c19-scams-hacks-ransomware-run-amok-in-the-cryptosphere
I was surprised to see that ransomware and scams are some of the biggest points of money loss over exchange hacks.
Worth while interview to watch and join in the conversation of what should happen to stolen funds. Do you get them returned or in a decentralized system are they lost forever?
https://blocktv.com/watch/2019-08-22/5d5ea9e847c19-scams-hacks-ransomware-run-amok-in-the-cryptosphere
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