Topic: Do you see individual satoshi becoming valuable? (Read 384 times)

No ....... it can never be possible  to have 1sat=> $15M (unrealistic)

From the calculation above
Currently 1BTC = 100M sats I.e 100,000,000 sats= 1 btc

 Let's  assume 1 Btc is on $40,000
 Then 1 sat = 0.0004

When btc is on $100,000
 1sat = $0.001

BTC = $100,000,000
 then 1sat = $1.

Therefore ,Bitcoin must get to a price range of $100M for 1 sat to be $1 .

In his calculation he used  $15million as a worth of BTC
Then 1sats=$ 0.15
In cents  $1=100 cents
                 $0.15 = 15cents
So at $15million  price range of BTC  1sats= 15 cents or $0.5

I think currently almost everyone knows how many satoshis per Bitcoin (except newbies who are new to Bitcoin) and when someone says $1 for one Satoshi, that means one Bitcoin is one hundred million dollars. This is still a very long way to go for Bitcoin so everyone doesn't need to hope that this can happen in a short time, because Bitcoin itself is still not too close to the $100K range. So the story of how one Satoshi can reach $1, I think is a story of hope that has to be waited for quite a long time.

It is a long road until we see that each satoshi is going to be valuable. But just like the pennies that we have, it's important to complete and entire thousand.

That's what I can see from it and it's just like a perspective of someone who values money. If you're going to look at the entirety of it, you see those calculations and that makes sense to see its worth.

Maybe a cent per satoshi might come but how much Bitcoin should be by that time?

Well, Satoshi is a unit of Bitcoin, so for me, overall it will really depend on the price of Bitcoin even in the future.
For me, it is becoming valuable for me especially if we will maintain the price and slowly increasing versus our fiat currencies right now that you can see the value are decreasing due to inflation.

When Bitcoin become the main currency used and there is no more fiat money, then people will definitely value 1 Sat. But as long as we still using fiat currency then Bitcoin should reach certain amount of price for Satoshi to be valuable, i.e Bitcoin need to be valued at $1 Million so the 1 Sat can be equal to 1 cents.

So, do I think this will happened?
Yes this could happened, but not in near future, it will be a long road.

One can certainly hope right?! It that is the case then all of us would surely be very well off to do as we please . That would be very cool to see happen, if we ever get to see that in our life time. That is a longgggg ways away though I mean we are talking nearly 30-40 years of HODLing, Bitcoin is not even this old yet. I suppose it is possible though! If each Sat was like $1 would be insaneee.

Right. Guessing when a satoshi might hit $1 is a bit like predicting the weather because. it depends on a bunch of stuff, like how much Bitcoin keeps growing and what's happening in the market. We can't say for sure which year this will happen, but it's a hot topic for folks keeping a close eye on the crypto scene. As Bitcoin gets more popular and valuable, the idea of a satoshi hitting $1 is causing some noise and making us wonder how it might shake up the money game.

If BTC becomes $1 usd per 1 sat that means it is 100 million a coin.

I simply do not see that in the next 12 years or even 24 years.

2024-2028 ATH pretend it goes to 430k that is 10x today maybe this is possible

2028-2032 ATH pretend it goes to 2 mill that is 45x today not so sure this will happen.

When we talk about one satoshi getting valuable...in my mind it must be $1 for each satoshi...and by that time we can say that indeed a satoshi can be worth something though by those years there are not a lot of things you can buy with $1. Anyway, the point is that as BTC continues to rise in terms of dollar price equivalent, so does a satoshi. On what year, will this happen that remains to seen and lucky are the people who are still alive for that big milestone.

well the dollar is less valuable.

one could argue that 19 k in dec 2017

is pretty close to  to 43 k in dec 2023 it is about +14.5%  gain but the dollar sank at least 6% a year since 2017

What kind of value are you expecting for a satoshi to reach? If the value gets too high we may need new smaller units in order to allow the purchase very cheap items, however it will take a very long time for a single satoshi to reach one dollar for example, and even then if this is achieved by the dollar going through a massive amount of inflation then even if the price of each satoshi was that high, you could still not buy much with it.

It is a conjecture to think that all the sats that we leave out there could mean a fortune, but perhaps the fortune is not enjoying it but having the invaluable time to see it, I think we have to reconcile balances and it would also make sense to deposit anywhere where there are a few Sat and remove them to wait 30, 40 years...

I have a hunch that in the future, when earning a triple decimal place bitcoin’s even harder than actually earning a bitcoin these days, Satoshis will be the saving grace of the people. For that matter, I see Satoshis as a great solution to bitcoin’s problem with scarcity no thanks to its immutable 21 million total supply. Sayoshis will also be great as a way for us to staunch the ongoing scalability problem by employing similar tactics (although correct me if this feels like a stretch to you.

In any case, satoshi’s going to be a pivotal utility token in the future for the bitcoin network. Today it wouldn’t be worth scat, tomorrow, it might go band for band with the US Dollar.

I greatly think that has been the idea behind creating a definite number (limited number of Bitcoins) with a formula to surround its decrease as per block reward and there by, ensure it remains a scarce asset through the ages.
While we have our world population grow, gradual adoption and valuation, you would find individual sats picking up values to be more accommodating of the populace that would buy the Bitcoin idea at a later time and phase in life.
We just need to keep up with the pace at which it’s running, through it might be slow, it’s a means to ensure it checks and balance every nuke and crevices that could make it seem like an inflated balloon or a bubble that is waiting to get burst.

Eventually yes, and especially as time passes by and as more and more bitcoins are mined apart from the halving. Satoshis are actually meant to prepare the whole network for such a time, cause they knew as early as decade ago that satoshis will become bitcoin’s end game basic token soon as the whole industry shoots up in value.

Anywho, the scalability conundrum proves to be a more vital topic to discuss rather than what sat’s role will be in the future, which already predetermined anyway in the first place.

Hmm... Potentially people would have to split Bitcoin into minor parts on that case, going beyond the currently 8 decimal houses BTC has today, or the fees should be paid in another currency, maybe an altcoin or stablecoin, because nobody is going to pay few satoshis for a transaction if each satoshi values 1$.

It must not be a big issue, though, because if we reach to that point, it means Bitcoin will be highly appreciated by the global community, therefore many specialists will act fastly on this matter to fix the issue immediately. Anyway, there must be a long time yet until we see this happening, as for now 1 satoshi still equals to only 0,0004$. It's not even equal to 1 cent from my local devalued currency yet.

I am more worried about the scaling problem to be honest. The price is gonna come by as per the Satoshi math. He already decided the fate when he was working on the entire Bitcoin project. That’s why there is bitcoin halving, that’s why there is ever increasing network difficulty. This helps minting of bitcoin very hard, thus more energy to mine thus more input of investment and thus more pricey it becomes.

So yeah that’s gonna happen. Maybe tomorrow or after 50 years. However, it would be interesting to understand how we are going to tackle the network congestion. The fees? Man it would take enormous fees by 2050, with inflated rates it would be worst to transact even thousands of bucks. What would we do about an individual sats worth 1 dollar or more.

I have seen it, I think it's gonna cost much in the near future, possibly 1 satoshi to 1 dollar, the only downside of that is that the transaction charges might be way to costly but I see the possibility as halving increases.

Today, 100 satoshi is almost 4 cents, what do you think will happen in the near future?

You're right, even if it's going to cost just a few cents then that doesn't change the fact that Bitcoin is going to be valuable by that time. Even a few satoshi's going to be cost a lot and could have a better price than what it is now, it's possible that we actually gonna see that in the future.

Well, that's a question that no one's gonna know the answer. We'll never know if we will be able to see it happen someday to reach that pricing because we don't know how long we'll be on this world.

Well, when I started out with my Bitcoin journey, Bitcoin faucets gave out 1000 Satoshi per hour.... and back then it was worth absolutely nothing to write home about. So, today those same satoshi are worth about $0.40 and if you sucked on those faucets for a few hours per day, you would have collected a significant amount for a poor person living in a third world country. (They survive on between $1 to $5 a day)

Take those same Satoshi in about 10 to 20 years from now.. and I think most people will dive into those "dust" wallets to grab every Satoshi that they can get their hands on. 

With these mining fees? Hard to tell. Even if they somehow become valuable, you won’t be able to move them probably. (Unless they are on lightning network but this is another topic) Right now the miner fees are pretty damn high. You need to pay like $5 to move your funds in a reasonable time and imo you should be moving at least $1000 to make that tx fee worthwhile. Otherwise legacy banking is cheaper and faster. (Sadly) Ordinals/nft’s should he rolled back imo. Btc was fine before that update.

Bitcoin will eventually be in the millions of dollars, which means Sats will eventually be worth cents. $1 mil btc = $0.01 sat.

I doubt you consider a few cents valuable so no, sats will not be valuable.

As for $15 million bitcoin as people on the thread are talking about for some reason, that's numerous decades away, depending on how much the dollar inflates over time. I'd be looking for Bitcoin to reach $1 million around 2040, passing $2 million by 2050, though by then $2 million might only be worth something like $1.2 million in today's dollars with 2-3% annual USD inflation. By that time of course Bitcoin's appreciation will be much much slower than today, but when $1 million is only a 50% gain it'll probably be gaining a million dollars every few years.

So in the 2040s and 2050s I'd expect to see 1 Sat worth 1 to 5 cents. Much much later when we're all dead a Sat may be worth dollars, but that's when dollars are nearly worthless compared to today.

It will become valuable but in long future, because there are around 8 zeros in satoshi for it to become more valuable in the Future, the value of overall 1 BTC should be in millions then the satoshi will become more valuable. We are wasting these small Satoshi to make payments but when the time comes and Satoshi will get more value.

It all depends on the demand and supply and I have seen it, like back in time I used to pay fees in ETH and I did not mind paying huge fees in ETH because $ was low but now when I look at them the prices of the same ETH has been increased.

I know in the future due to demand and supply each satoshi will have a higher value than now.

I prefer a 0.0001 minimum send and 0.00001 minimum fee. Right now today if possible.

I think BTC keeps try to fight scrypt LTC/DOGE and no matter what it does it can be match by scrypt.  Which means the 12 block to 1 block per 10 minutes will always favor LTC/DOGE for small value moves.

LN is a bad idea or a good idea or a neutral idea take yo pick. And if it is good LTC does the same and Doge does the same.

bigger block size good bad or neutral BTC goes to 16mb turns out good and LTC+ Doge goes to 16mb.

I think BTC needs to cut loose small transactions and give them over to scrypt.


But WTF do I know? I just mine BTC+LTC+Doge and all is safe.

Your question is valid and is of great importance but at the moment satoshi does not matter that much because if it would be of that importance then the websites that are giving free BTC in satoshies will not be giving them like they are giving it now. For example, many of us might have used the Avive app, I am not endorsing them just stating some knowledge that they give free satoshis weekly even if the wallet is custodial but they are giving it.
Left it, it is custodial and it might be fake but many BTC faucets are also giving free satoshies for little work. The thing is, in the past BTC was just like of the same value as Satoshi is today. That's why many platforms were giving away 1 or more than 1 BTC for simple tasks. If you think 1 BTC is a lot and I am wrong here then you can reduce it to half BTC.
The point is, in the past 1BTC was of not that important and the acquisition of it was easy but today it is impossible for us to acquire one using the same platform. A time will come in the future when this single satoshi will have the same value as of 1 BTC today have. But it will be after many long years. And in reality, 1 satoshi might not reach the price of 1 BTC but metaphorically speaking, it will.

it doesnt matter if 1 sat is seen as X value..
if people cannot spend as just one unit 1 sat. then people wont care..

if we get to a paradigm where a tx fee is 1sat and where people transact at a min of 100sat to feel the fee is fair(1%).. it would be a measure of 100sat people will want to value the price of things as.. because 100sat(1bit) is their minimum spend amount

EG if the cheapest product people can buy with a debit card without the merchant declining due to fees was $1.. then no one would care about how valuable a penny is even if it cost 3cents to make 1cent.. people just wont use or care about pennies if they can buy anything with it.

so if 100sat is the minimum spending amount of say $10. where yes 1sat =10cent and 1btc = $10m
people wont be looking at sat value. because they cant spend 1sat they will look at the 1bit(100sat) value

they would look at how many products they can buy with 100sat (1bit)

much like fiat. no one cares about the creation cost of penny or dimes (1-10cent). most look at a $10 bank note and think about how many loaves of bread it can buy

people dont care about pocket chance value of metal disks. they care about bank note value

Well, it doesn't have to reach $100 million (or $1 per satoshi) for satoshi to be considered valuable, although that depends on what the op means by valuable. If it's in a sense that even owning, say, 50 satoshi is a lot of money, then no, not very realistic. But if it's in a sense that it would be more convenient to refer to amounts in satoshis (say, 1 thousand satoshis), then I'd say that when Bitcoin is at $10 million (or 10 cents per satoshi), I think it would be a good time to switch. But I'm not sure if we'll ever see Bitcoin get there, so in the foreseeable future satoshis will remain insignificant.

I don't think a single sat will have much usable value as money against the USD but I could see a sat being used in other economies where the fiat currency is much weaker.

I could also see sats used by robots and AI as money where a sat was used for payment for micro services.

All of the Ordinals degens seem to think that some of these "rare" sats are worth a lot of money but I don't think NFTs are a viable tool for anything other than online trading cards that are verifiably scarce.

1 Bitcoin is worth 100 million sats coin. If one BTC is worth 15 million then 1 sats = 15 cents.

In future, if the BTC reach the price of 15 million per BTC then one sats will be worth 15 cents.

Highly unlikely IMO.

Maybe I am wrong. who knows. Future is unknown.

This math is a bit difficult for me to comprehend. But if I got you, do you mean that, 1 Satoshi will be worth 15 million dollar?

As long as bitcoin price continues to appreciate, the worth of each Satoshi will continue to increase with time. But achieving such a very big and reasonable amount that a Satoshi will worth will take several years for that to happen. For Satoshi to worth at least a reasonable amount, 1BTC must have worth at least a 100 million dollar, isn’t that not a long time to come from now? It can be possible, but for how long will it take for that to happen, maybe we will be no more to witness it.

Well, this whole frenzy about ordinals has shown that some people think that individual satoshis can be worth a lot of money, regardless of the current price of BTC, halvings or anything else. It's not something interesting to me personally, but I can understand that some people want to monetize everything possible that has to do with Bitcoin.

Besides, I don't see the reason why people are so obsessed with how much one satoshi will be worth in the future - why look at things at such a low level? Perhaps it would be easiest to conclude that every satoshi you have today will be worth a lot more in the future, and everything else is just speculation and throwing around random numbers.

If you are sensitive to the value of Satoshi itself, you will discover that it is increasing and this is normal. Satoshi is the smallest unit of Bitcoin, so it's Bitcoin itself but in a minute small amount, therefore as the value of Bitcoin appreciates, it's technically right for the value of Satoshi to rise. The same thing goes for when it decreases.

And now, Bitcoin appreciates and has good future prospects, so yes, Satoshi's value will rise in the future.

Earlier than this, if you noticed the value of Satoshi, let's say late last year till early this year, each Satoshi was worth about $0.03, but now, it's $0.04+. This is because the value of Bitcoin has increased, and it will continue to grow if Bitcoin grows.

this is just about 1 tx at 10sat per byte...
its not talking about the total fees for the block of all tx added up to whatever scaled blocksize of "every single transaction"

as i stated in other post without even figuring out scaling blocksize to fit more tx. we would need to scale down the sat per tx fee

the node software right now already is defaulted to start 'fee priority' bidding in whole sats and whole byte amounts
where its 1000sat/kb that increment in 1000sat/kb amounts.. to be the 1sat 2sat increments per byte

we need to start at 100sat/kb(23sat for lean tx) incrementing per 10sat/kb instead of 1000sat/kb
then in years
we need to start at 10sat/kb(3sat for lean tx) incrementing per 1sat/kb instead of 1000sat/kb

This is assuming that by that time no one has figured out a decent way of getting people to transact with bitcoin without paying base-chain fees after every single transaction, yea? If we're talking about decades from now, we should have figured something out by then.

lets inflate it
imagine tx fee this spring was 1x bread loaf earlier this year with not much complaint ($2) so consider that the "normal" feeling pre meme junk

2023 $2 breadloaf at a 2% inflation is $3.38 in 2050 so $339=100 loaves
2023 $2 breadloaf at a 4% inflation is $5.99 in 2050 so $339=56 loaves
2023 $2 breadloaf at a 6% inflation is $10.22 in 2050 so $339=33 loaves
2023 $2 breadloaf at a 8% inflation is $17.25 in 2050 so $339=19 loaves
2023 $2 breadloaf at a 10% inflation is $28.84 in 2050 so $339=11 loaves
2023 $2 breadloaf at a 20% inflation is $329.86 in 2050 so $339=1 loaf

inflation needs to perpetually be 20% a year for the next 27 years for a $339 fee to feel "normal" equivalent to a loaf of bread
where as rationally it would be 2-6% inflation of fiat. meaning tx fee's will feel 33-100x above "normal" use

Chances are low for each satoshi to become valuable. As someone else did the math in this thread, it requires Bitcoin to reach $15 Million before one satoshi is at $0.15 which is not even half a dollar. So that makes it individually not worth anything. However, keep collecting sats and soon it will be a good huge amount. And yes, TX fee needs to be low if you want everyone to use Bitcoin. That's also a problem that needs to be fixed.

It depends on how much $339 is worth
Considering how dedollarisation has been speeding up and how possible it is to see dollar value tanking hard, bitcoin reaching millions against dollar is not as far a you'd think. After all the current transaction fees of 1 sat/vbyte is about 300 in a bunch of currencies like the Colombian Peso

i dont care for merit. so when i give it i give big. just to use it up

if one sat became $0.15 (1btc=$15m)

if one tx was 1sat/byte and the leanest tx is 226bytes.. it would cost $33.90
if one tx was 10sat/byte and the leanest tx is 226bytes.. it would cost $339

who would use bitcoin if it cost $339 per tx even at just 10sat/byte

we would need to move the sat/byte to say/kb where tx priority bidding starts at xsat per 100byte
meaning a 226byte tx is 3sat per '1sat per 100byte' meaning $0.30
meaning a 226byte tx is 23sat per '10sat per 100byte' meaning $3.00

---

as for the math of 2050-2060 of a $15m btc .. is actually reasonable
but i do see people in many topics that think $10m will happen within the decade or next 6 years(2 halvings).
well im sorry it wont happen that soon

what people have to realise is that we are not going to see 20x per ATH cycle
we wont be $37.5k->$750k->$15m meaning 15m within a decade.. sorry i just dont see it

we are instead already seeing
$0.30->$30->$1200->$20k->$70k
           100x     40x      16k      3.5x

we are slowing down on the multiples
i dont see 2025 ATH being $750k or $15m.. i see it 2025 as 3x of last ATH so around $210k
i dont see 2029 ATH being $750k or $15m.. i see it 2029 as 2.5x of last ATH so under $525k
i dont see 2033 ATH being $750k or $15m.. i see it 2033 as 2.25x of last ATH so under $1.18m
and then just
     2x                     1.8x                     1.6x                   1.4x                    1.2x
2037: $2.36m    2041: $4.248m     2045:$6.8m      2049:$9.51m       2053:$11.41m

then flatlines (tx fee's take over mining reward)
meaning a $10m+ wont happen before 2050

It is practically difficult for individual Satoshis to become of great value in the future because we have large numbers of Satoshis, where every 1 Bitcoin contains 100 million Satoshis. This requires that the value of Bitcoins become millions of dollars in order for individual Satoshis to obtain great value.

According to the economic factors known to everyone, Bitcoin is difficult to exceed a million dollars by much, and even if we assume that it reaches 10 million dollars in the distant future, the value of 1 satoshi will remain rather low, not exceeding 10 cents.

I was born in 1957 in 2050 I will be 93. and in 2060 I will be 103.

Since the oldest male in my family reach 93 and was in good shape til he was 92 maybe I make 2050.

I do not think 2060 is in the cards 💳

this calculation is quite reasonable in my opinion. considering that it has been 14 years since bitcoin was introduced, but we are still trading in larger forms, and when we want to trade it in smaller forms it may take us decades to achieve that.

fortunately, if i count my age now, i still have the chance to live to see this happen. so i'm very optimistic to see this happen.

because of tx fees no one will be able to spend just 1 sat. where the recipient then sees utility/ability in that 1 sat.
its like metal pennies even though the cost to physically make 1 penny is more cost then the pennies price. no one wants to pay people in pennies
however gathering up pennies and making them into a larger bar. then has more value/utility


with the applications of ETF where they are selling shares in decimals of 1btc. people wont measure in "btc" but in bits(100sat) or bitcent(0.01btc)
much like no one measures gold in bars or Kilograms. but instead in ounces

however the utility of gold dust/grams is not something people value as single units

You even calculated that; I didn't think of that, but it sounds good. That's why I don't know if I'll still be alive in the year 2050; I'll probably be gone from this world when that happens.

Well, anyway, if we really think highly of Bitcoin, we will really appreciate every single sats of it and hold it until our last breath in this world, as long as we have a sense of what we are doing here in the Bitcoin industry field.

This probably sounds similar to this thread Can 1 satoshi be worth $1 in the future? because the value you're talking about is probably price so it kinda similar to me.

An individual Satoshi can be valuable in future if only BTC1 Bitcoin can reach a solid amount of $100 Million dollars per Bitcoin according to an estimate by @who is John Gait

Each satoshi will become more valuable with time with a condition that Bitcoin will be stronger with time and being stronger means bigger adoption and higher value.

The bullish case for Bitcoin. I believe you have been in Bitcoin market and the Bitcointalk forum long enough to know about this article but I share it as I see it is helpful for newbies.

Make your plan with future halvings: 2028, 2032, 2036, 2040, 2044, 2048, 2052, 2056 and 2060.

https://buybitcoinworldwide.com/halving/#calculator

See Controlled supply and see how many % of Bitcoin total supply will be left after each of those halvings.

As Philip is able to explain the sats to Bitcoin conversion for each sat into centavo. I also think that it's going to take time if each sats will have value in the future.

To make it short, and for other calculation. It's going to be with a dollar per satoshi.

1 BTC = 100M sats = $100M to make it at least $1 per sat.

And if it's going to be in cents as per philip's calculation, that's still going to require a lot of price and market cap for Bitcoin to achieve it.

No. I think BTC  tops out at 10 to 15 million.. Which means 15 cents per sat.

Check my math.

0.00000001.  100 million sats to a coin . so 100mill x 15 cents you got a 15 million dollar coin.

with a 15 cent sat. maybe in 2050 to 2060 it happens.

As each halving is passing and this block reward decrease has started sounding like a big deal to me. Does anyone else also see individual satoshi becoming valuable in future?