Does fiat currency count as collateral.

haploid23

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Quote from: gondel on June 14, 2014, 05:11:57 AM

Quote from: oppahdoggystyle on June 13, 2014, 12:04:44 AM

I am curious if fiat like USD count as collateral on bitcointalk's lending section.

Hello,
I think it can be accepted, but not sure if you need to provide the amount of the loan plus 10% or it is negotiable.. Cna someone explain exactly how it is done? I can provide small loan if you provide a stable alt crypto as collateral

BR
Gondel

You didn't bother reading the thread, why bother replying?

gondel

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Quote from: oppahdoggystyle on June 13, 2014, 12:04:44 AM

I am curious if fiat like USD count as collateral on bitcointalk's lending section.

Hello,
I think it can be accepted, but not sure if you need to provide the amount of the loan plus 10% or it is negotiable.. Cna someone explain exactly how it is done? I can provide small loan if you provide a stable alt crypto as collateral

BR
Gondel

haploid23

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I can escrow if you want me to. I'm in the US and have a BofA account. I've provided a few large loans and ran group buys before.

No hard feelings if you don't want me to Wink

monbux

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If you would like me to act as an escrow - I can try to see what I can do. What are your methods of sending the USD?
I believe Danny probably would accept USD as well.

bitpop

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Sorry I can't hold usd

oppahdoggystyle

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Quote from: tertius993 on June 13, 2014, 07:43:02 AM

Quote from: Killerloop on June 13, 2014, 07:30:55 AM

Quote from: tertius993 on June 13, 2014, 07:23:39 AM

I agree but the exchange rate moves of course. I guess if the borrower defaults they won't be getting their collateral back anyway; just thinking through scenarios in my head really.

Just a further thought if the intention is that the escrow holder buys BTC to compensate the lender, ensure they have sufficient for their fees and any exchange/similar fees; plus the headroom for exchange rate changes.

My "0% risk model" works exactly like that: I required a 5% edge to allow breathing room for the volatility.
I actually requested 10% but oppahdoggystyle was already comfortable with 5%

I will not wait for his eventual default at all, once the provided collateral (USD) is barely enough to purchase the expected amount BTC + escrow fees I'll seize the collateral and the loan will end.
I'm sure we will not come to this.

That sounds sensible.

I too am sure it won't come to that either, this has certainly been amongst the more grown-up conversations in this section ... Wink

Well, it is a loan so I think grown-up conversation is a basic requirement.

tertius993

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Quote from: Killerloop on June 13, 2014, 07:30:55 AM

Quote from: tertius993 on June 13, 2014, 07:23:39 AM

I agree but the exchange rate moves of course. I guess if the borrower defaults they won't be getting their collateral back anyway; just thinking through scenarios in my head really.

Just a further thought if the intention is that the escrow holder buys BTC to compensate the lender, ensure they have sufficient for their fees and any exchange/similar fees; plus the headroom for exchange rate changes.

My "0% risk model" works exactly like that: I required a 5% edge to allow breathing room for the volatility.
I actually requested 10% but oppahdoggystyle was already comfortable with 5%

I will not wait for his eventual default at all, once the provided collateral (USD) is barely enough to purchase the expected amount BTC + escrow fees I'll seize the collateral and the loan will end.
I'm sure we will not come to this.

That sounds sensible.

I too am sure it won't come to that either, this has certainly been amongst the more grown-up conversations in this section ... Wink

Killerloop

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Quote from: tertius993 on June 13, 2014, 07:23:39 AM

I agree but the exchange rate moves of course. I guess if the borrower defaults they won't be getting their collateral back anyway; just thinking through scenarios in my head really.

Just a further thought if the intention is that the escrow holder buys BTC to compensate the lender, ensure they have sufficient for their fees and any exchange/similar fees; plus the headroom for exchange rate changes.

My "0% risk model" works exactly like that: I required a 5% edge to allow breathing room for the volatility.
I actually requested 10% but oppahdoggystyle was already comfortable with 5%

I will not wait for his eventual default at all, once the provided collateral (USD) is barely enough to purchase the expected amount BTC + escrow fees I'll seize the collateral and the loan will end.
I'm sure we will not come to this.

oppahdoggystyle

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Because Killerloop requires a 5% edge, I believe there is compensation for any fees related. Please see terms of agreement.

tertius993

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Quote from: Killerloop on June 13, 2014, 07:08:10 AM

Quote from: tertius993 on June 13, 2014, 07:03:20 AM

Hmm, good point, thus introducing one (or two?) exchange rate variables ...

It can certainly work but it needs to be structured carefully, and agreed exactly what the loan is for (BTC or fiat)?

BTC loan backed by fiat using BTC/USD ratio of a certain exchange. All altcoin backed loans should work like this too

I agree but the exchange rate moves of course. I guess if the borrower defaults they won't be getting their collateral back anyway; just thinking through scenarios in my head really.

Just a further thought if the intention is that the escrow holder buys BTC to compensate the lender, ensure they have sufficient for their fees and any exchange/similar fees; plus the headroom for exchange rate changes.

oppahdoggystyle

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UPDATE:

Killerloop and I have come to an agreement for the loan structure. I think it would be best for the lender, Killerloop, to announce to the public the terms of the loan structure.

Also, we are awaiting for responses from people who may act as escrow. If you know anyone who can act as an escrow, and is trustworthy and has a BofA account, please let me know.

Killerloop

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Quote from: tertius993 on June 13, 2014, 07:03:20 AM

Hmm, good point, thus introducing one (or two?) exchange rate variables ...

It can certainly work but it needs to be structured carefully, and agreed exactly what the loan is for (BTC or fiat)?

BTC loan backed by fiat using BTC/USD ratio of a certain exchange. All altcoin backed loans should work like this too

tertius993

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Quote from: Killerloop on June 13, 2014, 06:56:15 AM

Quote from: tertius993 on June 13, 2014, 06:25:48 AM

I think the in country bit is important. At least within the UK person to person transfers are free and more or less instant. However, the amount of collateral would need to cover any wire costs if it eventually *had* to be sent to the lender.

Or, in the unfortunate case the borrower defaults, the trusted escrow could buy bitcoins with local currency and send it to the lender after appropriate fees are paid.
Are we dealing with cryptocurrency AND sending money overseas? This is enough to be burned at the stake imho Grin

Hmm, good point, thus introducing one (or two?) exchange rate variables ...

It can certainly work but it needs to be structured carefully, and agreed exactly what the loan is for (BTC or fiat)?

Killerloop

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Quote from: tertius993 on June 13, 2014, 06:25:48 AM

I think the in country bit is important. At least within the UK person to person transfers are free and more or less instant. However, the amount of collateral would need to cover any wire costs if it eventually *had* to be sent to the lender.

Or, in the unfortunate case the borrower defaults, the trusted escrow could buy bitcoins with local currency and send it to the lender after appropriate fees are paid.
Are we dealing with cryptocurrency AND sending money overseas? This is enough to be burned at the stake imho Grin

oppahdoggystyle

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That is actually a good point. That is why I am hoping an escrow holder has a BofA account so it will be a free transaction.

tertius993

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Quote from: Killerloop on June 13, 2014, 04:18:59 AM

Quote from: oppahdoggystyle on June 13, 2014, 03:49:55 AM

I am interested and more than willing to do escrow. But, I am curious if you have someone in mind who is trustworthy enough to escrow. Also, what kind of int rate and terms are you considering. I hope you don't mind making this lending terms/escrow discussion for public to see.

Feel free to propose the escrow terms/loan terms/etc. I am all ears

These are my conditions: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/offering-loans-5month-632483
I have more than 1 BTC now.

For escrow I had a positive experience with Monbux, but I do not know if he accepts USD and if it is feasible for you to send money to him. From my point of view any trustable escrow will do, but you should seek someone in your country as currency conversion may take a sensible toll on your collateral.

I think the in country bit is important. At least within the UK person to person transfers are free and more or less instant. However, the amount of collateral would need to cover any wire costs if it eventually *had* to be sent to the lender.

oppahdoggystyle

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Killerloop,

I contacted DannyHamilton to oversee the escrow process. According to Bitcointalk users, he is trustworthy and legitimate. Let me know if you are okay with me asking DannyHamilton.

oppahdoggystyle

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I have read your loan terms page. I will put out a thread to see if any trusted member can act as the escrow.

Below is the link to thread requesting trusted members to act as escrow.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/looking-for-trusted-member-to-act-as-escrow-usd-collateral-involved-650709

Killerloop

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Quote from: oppahdoggystyle on June 13, 2014, 03:49:55 AM

I am interested and more than willing to do escrow. But, I am curious if you have someone in mind who is trustworthy enough to escrow. Also, what kind of int rate and terms are you considering. I hope you don't mind making this lending terms/escrow discussion for public to see.

Feel free to propose the escrow terms/loan terms/etc. I am all ears

These are my conditions: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/offering-loans-5month-632483
I have more than 1 BTC now.

For escrow I had a positive experience with Monbux, but I do not know if he accepts USD and if it is feasible for you to send money to him. From my point of view any trustable escrow will do, but you should seek someone in your country as currency conversion may take a sensible toll on your collateral.

oppahdoggystyle

member

Activity: 118

Merit: 10

I am interested and more than willing to do escrow. But, I am curious if you have someone in mind who is trustworthy enough to escrow. Also, what kind of int rate and terms are you considering. I hope you don't mind making this lending terms/escrow discussion for public to see.

Feel free to propose the escrow terms/loan terms/etc. I am all ears

Killerloop

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Quote from: oppahdoggystyle on June 13, 2014, 03:38:41 AM

Damn... you're right. It might just be better if I put fiat in escrow and borrow. Cost of getting bitcoins is getting way too high for me.

If you deposit USD to a trustable forum escrow I will be happy to lend BTC to you.

oppahdoggystyle

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Damn... you're right. It might just be better if I put fiat in escrow and borrow. Cost of getting bitcoins is getting way too high for me.

Killerloop

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Quote from: oppahdoggystyle on June 13, 2014, 12:48:21 AM

WU fees = death. I just calculated how much money I spent on fees to obtain BTC in the past and it is embarrassing.

How much exactly? If you trade on an exchange you will pay wire transfer and trading fee... 0.5%?

oppahdoggystyle

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3-4 business days... is better than paying WU fees/other payment type fees and paying above market value.

Parazyd

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Space Lord

Quote from: DubFX on June 13, 2014, 01:23:13 AM

IMHO i wouldn't call it best form of collateral, wire transfers are expensive and take ALOT of time.

Depends what's expensive for you. It's cheaper than WU and it takes max. 3-4 working days.

DubFX

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IMHO i wouldn't call it best form of collateral, wire transfers are expensive and take ALOT of time.

oppahdoggystyle

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Good idea. Thanks for that. I'll be searching for credible exchanges then. I'm sick of paying 10%+ above market.

Parazyd

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Space Lord

Quote from: oppahdoggystyle on June 13, 2014, 12:48:21 AM

WU fees = death. I just calculated how much money I spent on fees to obtain BTC in the past and it is embarrassing.

Yeah... I'd recommend a simple Wire Transfer or a SEPA Transfer if you locate in Europe.

oppahdoggystyle

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WU fees = death. I just calculated how much money I spent on fees to obtain BTC in the past and it is embarrassing.

Parazyd

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Space Lord

Just ditch Western Union. They take sky-high fees. 10% I think Cheesy

oppahdoggystyle

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Fees and other Bitcoin-acquisition costs are reasons I am considering putting up fiat for a bitcoin loan. Of course, paypal would not be used as collateral. More like bank transfers or other secure fiat transfer methods

hilariousandco

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Join the world-leading crypto sportsbook NOW!

Yeah it would, but as long as it wasn't sent to the lender via a reversible medium like Paypal or something. If you've got the money though why don't you just buy the coins yourself?

Confessions

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Yes, and probably is the best collateral

oppahdoggystyle

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I am curious if fiat like USD count as collateral on bitcointalk's lending section.

Topic: Does fiat currency count as collateral. (Read 2221 times)