Economical Politics by an insane guy is the reason for this crash!

BrianH

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Quote from: davis196 on May 17, 2021, 12:50:09 AM

We all want the Bitcoin price to hit the moon,but we don't want all the crypto whales,who can help for pushing the Bitcoin price to the moon.This is a great dilemma.
Elon Musk is a government supported businessman.Without regulatory credits(basically government support) his company would have bankrupted years ago.His other company-SpaceX is basically selling products and services to a government agency(NASA).
Basically,Elon Musk can't exist without the US government. Grin

He is the biggest oligarch in the world.Even Russian oligarchs can't compare with him. Grin

You got it. Government pretends to cut NASA's budget. NASA gives SpaceX their technology and subsidies 2. Elon is the rotten pitchman.

Coyster

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Quote from: 2double0 on May 22, 2021, 05:45:08 PM

I'd wait for a much better opportunity at $20k instead of buying it at its current value because the sentiments have turned to neutral (neither bullish nor bearish) and there is a big chance btc may turn bearish if bulls don't hold its major support areas that are getting breached like peanuts when selling pressure enters the market.

Of course after seeing Bitcoin spike to over $60k, it'll be a total bargain to buy it at $20k if the opportunity presents itself, but the thing is, from this point, we could prolly not experience Bitcoin falling to that particular amount, thus the reason why buying now is still somewhat a bargain. The manipulation already occurred, and I don't think things can get any worse from this point on (at least for now), all the soft hands are already out of the network cause they are swayed with what they hear, thus the market could start it's recovery anytime from now.

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Quote from: 2double0 on May 16, 2021, 03:36:30 PM

All of these are examples which show how an insane guy's personal revenge on a whole community could lead to unexpected losses. I want to ask those institutions' lovers, do you still want them in crypto? Do you want them to make crypto their hedge all their losses and when they will take out their profits, everyone in crypto will lose? Isn't everything in crypto getting under their control, which means it is being centralized?

Anyway I thank Elon as he is selling all his $1.5 billion worth btc in the markets causing this correction, thanks to him we will be buying his btc more cheaper.

1. Tesla hasn't sold any more bitcoin, so you're not buying Elon's coins, and since he hasn't sold, that's not the reason bitcoin has fallen so far from its ATH.
2. Yes, Elon is a troll. Believe anything he tweets at your own risk.

Gyfts

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Quote from: bitmover on May 16, 2021, 03:58:10 PM

...

Joe Biden will throw Elon a bone no matter what his stance on Bitcoin was. As long as he is letting his followers know that he cares about the environment, that's all that matters. This isn't some giant government conspiracy, Elon has a shitty take on Bitcoin and he probably wanted to make a quick buck on it. No one buys that he divested from BTC because of the environment...

AndySt

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Quote from: 2double0 on May 22, 2021, 05:45:08 PM

Quote from: The Sceptical Chymist on May 18, 2021, 10:58:24 AM

<<>>
But the way I see it is that bitcoin's still at something like $44k, and that's impressive if you think of where it was earlier this year (and last year). Bitcoin is resilient, and this could be a damn fine buying opportunity.

I'd wait for a much better opportunity at $20k instead of buying it at its current value because the sentiments have turned to neutral (neither bullish nor bearish) and there is a big chance btc may turn bearish if bulls don't hold its major support areas that are getting breached like peanuts when selling pressure enters the market. As it's Sunday today, I would wait for the weekly close to see if it confirms a bearish pattern or bulls take over, I will not touch my usdt till then.

I am not sure that we can move to the $ 20,000 level in the near future, because I think that the recent sell-offs are related to the panic among Chinese bitcoin owners due to the negative statements of the representative of the Chinese authorities about bitcoin and mining. I think that after the exit of a significant part of the Chinese players from bitcoin, the exchange rate will be able to stabilize and hold at least at the level of 30-35 thousand dollars, especially since it seems that the other major holders of bitcoin are unlikely to come out of the asset in the near future. The correction is certainly overdue after such a rapid growth of cryptocurrencies in these months, but still not to such an extent.

2double0

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Quote from: The Sceptical Chymist on May 18, 2021, 10:58:24 AM

<<>>
But the way I see it is that bitcoin's still at something like $44k, and that's impressive if you think of where it was earlier this year (and last year). Bitcoin is resilient, and this could be a damn fine buying opportunity.

I'd wait for a much better opportunity at $20k instead of buying it at its current value because the sentiments have turned to neutral (neither bullish nor bearish) and there is a big chance btc may turn bearish if bulls don't hold its major support areas that are getting breached like peanuts when selling pressure enters the market. As it's Sunday today, I would wait for the weekly close to see if it confirms a bearish pattern or bulls take over, I will not touch my usdt till then.

verita1

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Even though we are buying his cheapest bitcoin. It is not appropriate to have a large investor like Elon Musk changing his mind like changing shirts. I always thought that Elon had more interest in doge than in bitcoin honestly. Between joke and joke he demonstrated it. Speaking in another answer, our thinking towards bitcoin should not change even if you have a good dominance in the 42% market. Michael Saylor is taking advantage of the dips he is a good defender of bitcoin forever.
Jack in one of his most recent tweets says:

Quote

#bitcoin changes * everything *… for the better.

And we will forever work to make bitcoin better.

https://twitter.com/jack/status/1393310054355451904?s=19

Which means that bitcoin will prevail there will be plans that will make bitcoin better and use cases more important.

Although with everything I have experienced with bitcoin it has been useful for me at all times.

slapper

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I do not see myself as an institutional investor even though I spend many years investing in different assets. Honestly, I want Elon and those maniacs to keep on playing their games because to me, they are perfect indicators which can cause a rapid sell-off, sudden reversal, or black swan. I love how to see those men driving the market insane while other people do not know what to do with their money

Well, I guess it is just a game of big boys and wise people. Those newcomers without knowledge can only be left with tears and pain

so98nn

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There are always two sides of the coin and its you who will choose which one to go with. I am choosing the one which will be profitable for me. If Elon is pumping the market then I will make sure I am not missing that train and getting as much profits as I could from the investment.
Once he reverses this train I will go for another side of coin, will wait and watch how much market drop (currently doing this), and will startgeically buy more coins. Whether it is bitcoin or doge, or shittest coin like SHIB, I dont care. The market only means way to grab the profits when it is giving you.

The Sceptical Chymist

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Normally I wouldn't think that bitcoin's price could be influenced by one man's opinion, but in this case I can't see any other reason for the massive drop in price we've seen as of late--though it might be Elon Musk's selling of bitcoin rather than his words; I'm not sure about that.

I don't think he's insane, but he does seem to be rather impulsive. He turned from bitcoin-pumper to bitcoin-nihilist seemingly overnight, and his touting of dogecoin defies explanation. Unfortunately a ton of people look up to this guy and listen to his opinions on crypto very closely, almost as if he were Warren Buffett speaking at a Berkshire Hathaway annual meeting.

But the way I see it is that bitcoin's still at something like $44k, and that's impressive if you think of where it was earlier this year (and last year). Bitcoin is resilient, and this could be a damn fine buying opportunity.

bryant.coleman

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Quote from: AndySt on May 17, 2021, 06:47:57 PM

The point is that this has happened before, and it is Elon Musk; D It is just that Elon Musk has been trolling like this for several times, and in the past he had problems with the regulator about the impact of his statements about Tesla shares and had to resign as chairman of the board of directors and personally pay a fine of $ 20 million. So I wouldn't be surprised if the financial authorities turn their attention to Musk again, this time because of the cryptocurrency market. And of course, you should not hang all the dogs on Musk ( Grin

) for the current fall in the price of bitcoin, especially then he clarified his statement, and the market was just waiting for an excuse to adjust and fix profits, but the black business of the tweet was done and the market fell.

This time, the cryptocurrency market will be under the scanner. Elon is the CEO of Tesla Motors, and therefore he is responsible for tweets related to Tesla. On the other hand, he doesn't own any cryptocurrency (either Bitcoin or Dogecoin), so he can't be blamed for all the chaos he unleashed as a result of his tweets recently. The first question that SEC is going to ask is - How is it possible to manipulate the cryptocurrency prices with a few tweets? If such tweets are banned, it goes against the freedom of speech. Also, we can't say with surety that his tweets caused the crash. A lot of people make similar tweets.

Psynthax

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He has confirmed that tesla didn't dump their btc but the market correction was simply because some people can't help themselves from stopping into trying to align themselves with elon's idea meanwhile that's itself defeats the point of someone investing into a decentralized platform.
Even if tesla did dump their btc "silently" i doubt it's gonna be anything more than a flash dump which gonna recovers in no time but elon's tweet kinda causes domino effect that even without him selling other people already misunderstanding of him but honestly this kind of thing shouldn't happen in the market that's said to be decentralized, i think people should start to make their own financial decision without external influence seriously.

AndySt

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Quote from: sheenshane on May 17, 2021, 06:14:10 PM

We've all here having assumptions about him which I don't think it's true.
However, this already happened before, it’s just that it wasn’t Elon Musk and the people that did this didn't do it with their personal accounts, they used people to troll. I'm pertaining with the whales possibly more powerful than Elon Musk.
I think this one is a wake-up call from Elon Musk. He might have a hidden agenda that would teach us how to decide better, handle our emotions, and not be carried away with public stunts. It's being said multiple times already, always get along with the whales, as for now, they have the right to drive the Bitcoin. Wait for your turn to become one soon and you’ll do the same, whatever the reason, just keep it on hold.

The point is that this has happened before, and it is Elon Musk; D It is just that Elon Musk has been trolling like this for several times, and in the past he had problems with the regulator about the impact of his statements about Tesla shares and had to resign as chairman of the board of directors and personally pay a fine of $ 20 million. So I wouldn't be surprised if the financial authorities turn their attention to Musk again, this time because of the cryptocurrency market. And of course, you should not hang all the dogs on Musk ( Grin

) for the current fall in the price of bitcoin, especially then he clarified his statement, and the market was just waiting for an excuse to adjust and fix profits, but the black business of the tweet was done and the market fell.

sheenshane

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We've all here having assumptions about him which I don't think it's true.
However, this already happened before, it’s just that it wasn’t Elon Musk and the people that did this didn't do it with their personal accounts, they used people to troll. I'm pertaining with the whales possibly more powerful than Elon Musk.

I think this one is a wake-up call from Elon Musk. He might have a hidden agenda that would teach us how to decide better, handle our emotions, and not be carried away with public stunts. It's being said multiple times already, always get along with the whales, as for now, they have the right to drive the Bitcoin. Wait for your turn to become one soon and you’ll do the same, whatever the reason, just keep it on hold.

Scripture

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Quote from: RealMalatesta on May 17, 2021, 01:35:25 PM

Quote from: 2double0 on May 16, 2021, 03:36:30 PM

Anyway I thank Elon as he is selling all his $1.5 billion worth btc in the markets causing this correction, thanks to him we will be buying his btc more cheaper.

People who still think that Elon is doing this for money have no idea how human brain works. Elon is a high end narcissistic person who never had to deal with anyone else because he was born rich and then struck gold with paypal, after that he wanted to do something that helps the world and get him a lot of love so he hired people and then used all of his money (and others money) to keep that love coming. Nothing he does is "just business", dude has all of Tesla patents open source so that others can build cars from his patents, you can literally create one to one exact copy of tesla cars using those patents with a few changes and have your brand new car, which nearly all other auto makers do use but deny using.

The only thing he cares about is to have power over something and be loved for it, that's it, if people love him then it is good enough for him, it is not money, it is not richness, it is not even everyday life changing, as long as he is loved and powerful that's enough for him.

He's already a billionaire so technically its not about money, there's a dip reason behind it and hopefully his real purpose is to help the crypto community, to provide real products and not just a hype. We know his story about putting up SpaceX into space, he worked hard for that and he succeeded. Now he's looking into cryptomarket, making statements about DOGE specifically, he's cooking something for sure. Elon didn't crash the market yet, people are just panicking for just a simple tweet.

2double0

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Even if I stop blaming him, the fact won't change that if Elon didn't sell his btc, then whom? The answer will be, his followers. And it is not his fault, because he is a businessman, I accept it as a valid argument. But what was the need for Elon to come on Twitter and shill a coin like Doge and say that it is greener than btc and he is going all in on Doge? Because he knew that a wave of panic sell will crash the markets and his intentions were fulfilled by his non sense followers.

Elon is a narcissistic, futuristic person, good. He is so futuristic, that he didn't knew about the energy that's being spent behind mining btc, before he started accepting btc as a payment method at Tesla?

batang_bitcoin

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Quote from: Kong Hey Pakboy on May 17, 2021, 01:59:07 AM

Quote from: batang_bitcoin on May 16, 2021, 05:35:26 PM

Whether we like them or not to be in crypto, no one can stop them from being in here. It's a very free market and they've seen opportunities that can made from here. And for Elon, that attitude isn't new to us. We saw it from those bitcoin haters like Jamie Dimon and then started to like it and then change again from disliking it. I think that strategy has been formed long time ago and we mustn't been surprise if they're going against to the likes of us because they have to sell and profit which is a norm in having a business mindset.

You are right but the problem with this people is that they think that Elon is bitcoin's savior that they go apeshit when he does this tweets that doesn't warrant any overreaction but people still go apeshit no matter because bitcoin has gone down. How long does it take for these kinds of people to realize that no matter how someone loves bitcoin, we should always remember that they will go for their own interests first before someone else who they don't even know exists.

They are the one who thinks that Elon is the savior. But not everyone of us thinks just like how they think of it. You are right, someone who stands with the influence will always protect their own interest first before anyone else. That's all what matters to them and people are forgetting about that because they're in FOMO mode. When someone is in that mode, they're going to forget the real intention of that person and even without them, the market will move on no matter what happens.

RealMalatesta

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Quote from: 2double0 on May 16, 2021, 03:36:30 PM

Anyway I thank Elon as he is selling all his $1.5 billion worth btc in the markets causing this correction, thanks to him we will be buying his btc more cheaper.

People who still think that Elon is doing this for money have no idea how human brain works. Elon is a high end narcissistic person who never had to deal with anyone else because he was born rich and then struck gold with paypal, after that he wanted to do something that helps the world and get him a lot of love so he hired people and then used all of his money (and others money) to keep that love coming. Nothing he does is "just business", dude has all of Tesla patents open source so that others can build cars from his patents, you can literally create one to one exact copy of tesla cars using those patents with a few changes and have your brand new car, which nearly all other auto makers do use but deny using.

The only thing he cares about is to have power over something and be loved for it, that's it, if people love him then it is good enough for him, it is not money, it is not richness, it is not even everyday life changing, as long as he is loved and powerful that's enough for him.

BrewMaster

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why do people ONLY blame him? you should all blame the idiots who follow him. he is just a business man who has seen a perfect opportunity to make profit. a lot of others have done the same thing in the past history. take a couple of years ago when someone who most people hadn't even heard of called McAfee started abusing the social media to scam people with his pump and dumps. all those idiots who lost money in those shitcoins are to blame too. double the blame if they both lost money to that pump and dumper and lost money to this new pump and dumper called Musk.

the reason for the crash is existence of sheep in this market. we get rid of them every now and then when they panic sell and get out but they keep coming back.

palle11

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Quote from: bosede1 on May 17, 2021, 10:21:30 AM

possibly these will give room for people who will buy their dumped coin chances while we continue from there.

It is all about business for the big guys and how much profit was made at every episode of dreamer, just like the one playing out with Elon musk after he is tweeting negative and dumping bitcoin. Surely he is going to buy back at the deep and that is the game to profit in the world of the whales. Who knows the coin Elon musk is going to push now, whether dogecoin . McAfee has come and we are in the world of Musk

bosede1

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I won't be on the critics side about these investors into bitcoin and the negative effect it will have on Bitcoin. The campaign and popular recognition these people are giving to bitcoin cannot be over-emphasized but because of the love for more profit and other relative conditions make them wants to sell, possibly these will give room for people who will buy their dumped coin chances while we continue from there.

Sterbens

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and this news will soon become a hot topic on CNBC, BBC, and several channels that frequently criticize the risks of investing in Bitcoin. We don't care because it's about time Bitcoin gave us enough room to buy cheaply. no Bitcoin damage. everything is in correction and it makes us buy more. But on the other hand, there are some people who queue at high prices. is a test as a form of training to become a long time holder.

Hydrogen

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I seem to remember Peter McCormack posting anti crypto content on social media in the past. He's no defender or supporter of cryptocurrencies. That twitter exchange between Elon Musk and Peter McCormack looks possibly staged or scripted. If only due to McCormack acting out of character, voicing a stance completely opposite and contrary to his normal content.

Peter McCormack never posts legit content, facts or truth. He's more like an financial industry mouthpiece and sellout as far as I know. He's the type of guy to say bitcoin cash is better than bitcoin core if someone will pay him $5 dollars for it.

I hope people realize how sketchy and suspicious many elements of this are.

Anonylz

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About time btc holders stop paying attention to trolls and decide what they really want out of btc, Elon and his co trolls are just a tiny percent of btc investors, the btc community should recognise this and stand their ground on their decission to hodl instead of panic selling and giving this trolls the satisfaction, btc has survived worst than this and will continue to do so. good riddance to bad rubbish Undecided

Wexnident

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Let him dump his coins. Not like it matters, Bitcoin lived for a decade without him, I'm pretty sure we can last longer than that. Heck I'd actually be glad if left the community for good. That means most of those who entered influenced by him would also stop influencing the market, making us, well, basically free. Not that he was much of a cage ofc, but heck as someone in front of the social media, his influence IS pretty huge whether we like it or not, though that's just solely based on influence.

Kong Hey Pakboy

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Quote from: batang_bitcoin on May 16, 2021, 05:35:26 PM

Whether we like them or not to be in crypto, no one can stop them from being in here. It's a very free market and they've seen opportunities that can made from here. And for Elon, that attitude isn't new to us. We saw it from those bitcoin haters like Jamie Dimon and then started to like it and then change again from disliking it. I think that strategy has been formed long time ago and we mustn't been surprise if they're going against to the likes of us because they have to sell and profit which is a norm in having a business mindset.

You are right but the problem with this people is that they think that Elon is bitcoin's savior that they go apeshit when he does this tweets that doesn't warrant any overreaction but people still go apeshit no matter because bitcoin has gone down. How long does it take for these kinds of people to realize that no matter how someone loves bitcoin, we should always remember that they will go for their own interests first before someone else who they don't even know exists.

davis196

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We all want the Bitcoin price to hit the moon,but we don't want all the crypto whales,who can help for pushing the Bitcoin price to the moon.This is a great dilemma.
Elon Musk is a government supported businessman.Without regulatory credits(basically government support) his company would have bankrupted years ago.His other company-SpaceX is basically selling products and services to a government agency(NASA).
Basically,Elon Musk can't exist without the US government. Grin

He is the biggest oligarch in the world.Even Russian oligarchs can't compare with him. Grin

mu_enrico

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What he did was unethical since he actually bought BTC and act as pumper, so there is a strong probability the SEC will fine him. Anyway, we don't need to worry since Bitcoin is bigger than any individual, and his holding is actually not that huge. If he dumps his BTC, we will recover.

Not sure why we "worship" institution since they are motivated by profits. It means their profits = our losses if we assume zero sum game.

cabron

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Elon will really go mad like John McAfee when people shout boo every time he is interviewed. He likes to be in the media all the time, getting booed will likely be the best response to him and he will turn mad like Mcafee.

There is nothing we can do if he sells his BTC though, and it's his freedom to do so. But once he does this and gets to be on the bitcoin side once again, he should expect anything again.

uneng

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Quote from: 2double0 on May 16, 2021, 04:13:32 PM

Quote from: uneng on May 16, 2021, 04:04:19 PM

I think we have only to thanks mr. Elon Musk and his *cattle herd* (insane followers) for a new opportunity to buy cheaper bitcoins they gave us. And I hope more of those institutional investors come in to play with crypto market's prices again, because in the end there will be always less coins on their hands and more cheap bitcoins for everyone else.

Institutions are already taking a move now as they wanted a cheaper btc. I don't know where this bang bang will stop but I am sure I will be having so many opportunities to fill my bags with some good choices instead of looking for btc and eth, they are very risky and I think I should now move my holdings to some better coins which may not damage my portfolio the way this btc and eth did.

My friend, I think nothing changed. Bitcoin isn't the most profitable currency these days in terms of percentage gains, but it is still the most trustful and safest crypto currency investment. I suspect many alt developers and big investors want people to really think bitcoin is slowly losing its status and fading out from the market, so their personal projects can be boosted, but meanwhile they are the ones going to buy the bitcoins dropped for sell.
Look at Elon Musk: he dumped bitcoin and keeps shilling for dogecoin, but don't forget 90% of his btc investment is still intact. He is surely holding for the future, while another investors sell their coins desperately. And who do you think is going to buy these coins soon?

batang_bitcoin

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Whether we like them or not to be in crypto, no one can stop them from being in here. It's a very free market and they've seen opportunities that can made from here. And for Elon, that attitude isn't new to us. We saw it from those bitcoin haters like Jamie Dimon and then started to like it and then change again from disliking it. I think that strategy has been formed long time ago and we mustn't been surprise if they're going against to the likes of us because they have to sell and profit which is a norm in having a business mindset.

Coyster

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Quote from: 2double0 on May 16, 2021, 03:36:30 PM

I want to ask those institutions' lovers, do you still want them in crypto? Do you want them to make crypto their hedge all their losses and when they will take out their profits, everyone in crypto will lose? Isn't everything in crypto getting under their control, which means it is being centralized?

I don't see any problems whatsoever with institutional Investors, neither is the network being centralized/controlled due to their influx into it; they are investors just like every other ones (just that they buy in larger quantities), thus they can buy and sell when they choose to, they do not control the market, there could be a little dip if they dump a large amount, but it is what it is, the correction that'll arise as a result of that will only be temporary, and the price will with time spike again.

Having said that, I believe institutional investors have a big role to play in Bitcoin networks rise to mainstream adoption, and the thing is even if some corporations pull out, others will join the network, the interest amongst institutional investors is already present, thus it's going to keep alluring more and more of them, notwithstanding how many others get disinterested.

2double0

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Quote from: uneng on May 16, 2021, 04:04:19 PM

I think we have only to thanks mr. Elon Musk and his *cattle herd* (insane followers) for a new opportunity to buy cheaper bitcoins they gave us. And I hope more of those institutional investors come in to play with crypto market's prices again, because in the end there will be always less coins on their hands and more cheap bitcoins for everyone else.

Institutions are already taking a move now as they wanted a cheaper btc. I don't know where this bang bang will stop but I am sure I will be having so many opportunities to fill my bags with some good choices instead of looking for btc and eth, they are very risky and I think I should now move my holdings to some better coins which may not damage my portfolio the way this btc and eth did.

uneng

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Quote from: 2double0 on May 16, 2021, 03:36:30 PM

All of these are examples which show how an insane guy's personal revenge on a whole community could lead to unexpected losses. I want to ask those institutions' lovers, do you still want them in crypto? Do you want them to make crypto their hedge all their losses and when they will take out their profits, everyone in crypto will lose? Isn't everything in crypto getting under their control, which means it is being centralized?

You have answered you own question:

Quote from: 2double0 on May 16, 2021, 03:36:30 PM

Anyway I thank Elon as he is selling all his $1.5 billion worth btc in the markets causing this correction, thanks to him we will be buying his btc more cheaper.

I think we have only to thanks mr. Elon Musk and his *cattle herd* (insane followers) for a new opportunity to buy cheaper bitcoins they gave us. And I hope more of those institutional investors come in to play with crypto market's prices again, because in the end there will be always less coins on their hands and more cheap bitcoins for everyone else.

bitmover

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Elon Musk is Just a business man

He wants to get more carbon credits from Biden administration. This is why he is bashing bitcoin publicly

Take a look

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-01-27/tesla-credit-revenue-may-rise-to-2-billion-credit-suisse-says

Quote

Regulatory credit revenue probably will rise to $2 billion from about $1.4 billion in 2020, analyst Dan Levy predicted in a note previewing Tesla’s quarterly earnings Wednesday. He wrote that his estimate for 2021 is higher than consensus of $1.3 billion.

Governments do not like bitcoin, and I doubt we will see too many libertarians who support btc in Biden administration . Bashing bitcoin will help him get that money he wants.

2double0

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https://www.twitter.com/PeterMcCormack/status/1393971202738302986

What's the level of trolls in front of these two, and specially Elon Musk?

https://www.twitter.com/CryptoWhale/status/1393981793813078017

https://www.twitter.com/michael_saylor/status/1393960667372310535

All of these are examples which show how an insane guy's personal revenge on a whole community could lead to unexpected losses. I want to ask those institutions' lovers, do you still want them in crypto? Do you want them to make crypto their hedge all their losses and when they will take out their profits, everyone in crypto will lose? Isn't everything in crypto getting under their control, which means it is being centralized?

Anyway I thank Elon as he is selling all his $1.5 billion worth btc in the markets causing this correction, thanks to him we will be buying his btc more cheaper.

Topic: Economical Politics by an insane guy is the reason for this crash! (Read 279 times)