Topic: Fed and Europe and Even Australia did rate cut but btc Still low (Read 612 times)

It seems to me that  euro will boost up ethereum.
And USA dollar will boost up bitcoin.


Fed cutted rates just before bakkt launched.
This time the fed money will go in bitcoins.

Bakkkt, ice its wall street,there is heavy Money.

One buy Order will make a bitcoin Going up!
As there is More money then bitcoins Everybody can undestood that bitcoin price will go higher!


Ethereum price is moving up coz of European kraken   exchanger trading!

2017 was more an anomaly. I even see more experienced traders here in the forum say they find it inexplicable.

I think btc have a lower demand for now. If predictions are right that we might get a crash around 2020 then maybe we can see a surge in prices.


This. ^

People were already panicking when it dropped to 3k so by comparison the current 9k don't look shabby. Some people would have already made a profit at this rate.

But cutting rates should be interesting for people who wish to invest or make some business, and that should affect the demand. This is a good move and it will affect the demand in long run, nothing happens over night, it`s what people don`t understand. Give it a time, like with most of the things it takes time to start working.
Most investors in ICO`s are from crypto world, people who have some bitcoins. New people start with bitcoin, not with ICO`s, I don`t know where you get that from.

Its about understanding the cause and effect on the increase in the price of bitcoin in 2017 and to a large extent, the low rates have little or no effect on price at the time except I read of a superior argument. At the time in 2017, several factors were responsible for the all time high among which include the era of ICO making waves which in turn led to the increase of fresh funds into crypto, another factor is the advent of forks which was so popular that people were moved in other to benefit from the ''free coins'' that would come from such activities. With all of these happenings, the media publicity was equally the loudest which gave more exposure and a lot of people came in until the downward trend start happening.

although there is good news like that I think the movement of bitcoin prices will not be easy to be able to go up because what makes prices go up is the good news stating that bitcoin can be used in every country or there is a halving bitcoin which can have a very fast impact on the price of bitcoin.

Thats a modern myth, I wish I could look it up on snopes and post the answer why we dont have to print money constantly.   Unfortunately in FIAT economics this has become doctrine but there is no requirement for modern economies to constantly maintain inflation.      That is a correct reflection of the Federal Reserve policy, I believe their target is 2% per year and their objective would be to avoid disorderly markets always as this results in loss and likely recession.
   The previous policy I was familiar with was to maintain no inflation and no deflation so 0% would be the target but governments have always missed this target, mostly too much inflation and then some deflation as the economy retracts.   Now we currently are trying to constantly outrun any retraction at all by ensuring the inflation is never ending.   I think it will spin out of control to put it  briefly as a fiscal surplus is required and balance in general but will never occur so we are going to see failure, possibly default on even the best rated debt similar in circumstance to 2008.

Strong currency leads to prices falling year on year, this phenomena regularly occurs in technology due to rapid advancement and its not a negative by itself but does require careful management of debt to reflect proper investment returns.    Inflation promotion on the other hand diminishes all debt and makes policy very easy, the currency in future is certain to be worth less then now.

True!  I agree with You!

Money printing is an intrinsic part of the modern economy. This economy can't stay at the same level all the time, it can either grow or collapse. Of course the process of money printing should be performed  in accordance with appearance of new goods and services, unlike in Zimbabwe and Venezuela, and for USD it is around 2% annually.

Yes, we choose strong economy over strong currency, but, actually, we have no other choice. Strong currency would lead to economic stagnation and inevitable collapse.

Theres been a net purchase of gold by central banks for over a decade, I'd say its likely to serve a greater usage then just a hedge.   Its possibly part of the transition away from dollar or to put it the other way round, Dollar has consistently detracted from its previous alignment with gold since departing a fixed ratio in the 1970's.
    Negative rates I think is part of the end game because it will become so obvious to every participant in the economy that this is a distortion of economics and is likely related to any problems we see.   If theres never any problems occurring then I guess people wont mind but I think there be side effects to the extreme measures like this that have become normal to all of us.

No its Not wrong!


Coz When the rates are cut the assets prices Going Up!


The 2017 was year of rate cuts! 

wrong  cause- effect chain you are building here , the global rate cut may or may not influence the price
but it is not a factor that makes it jump overnight or break trends
while the trade wars are brewing ( and some are ongoing ) capitol looks for a better place to be , with the rates lowered big players  might want to find some other investment opportunities
but bitcoin is not the only one and also it is very risky and not regulated enough
you have to understand that the big investors are not playing that low as to put their money into a bank and live off the %
the bank's clientelle is small and mid sized businesses and the common folks , ridden with debts
those categories would not have enough money to invest into something "wild" as bitcoin anyways
at least not on a scale where it affects its price

The USA dollar is stronger now then ever before.
Inflation is Down, but Economy in USA Not so Strong.
But Strong Economy is Nothing else then just bubble!!

But cutting rates its a addiction, everytime When u cut the Economy Will last shorter time When last time, the Money printing is like a drug.

But ASK Yourself do You Want Strong currency or Strong Economy? 

Im sure people Will choose Strong Economy!

Bitcoin lost 50% from 2017. It will take decades or even a century with this pace that we will have -50% interest rates.

But how many people will be affected by that? Probably not that many according to this:


We can wait for that, of course, but with the current knowledge not many people will invest in BTC instead of EURO/USD. Imo it is very important to surpass the previous ATH, so that no one could say investing in Bitcoin is unprofitable. If BTC crosses $20k that's when the real bull run begins, maybe one we've never seen before, but currently the very fact that BTC price was much higher in the past stops many investors from engaging with it.

If anything, people would rather invest in USD because

Those take time, I mean psychologically sometimes it doesn't take time and people do it right away however that doesn't matter because even if it doesn't happen right away eventually it will do some damage. We are talking about rates here, you need to actually start using it, like on loans, on interest rates, on credit cards, basically everything which means you really have to wait for it to be used by people and get more common, the more common it gets the more price will be affected.

We will see bitcoin going up again, maybe to 20k maybe more or maybe less but in the end it will go up. Don't get me wrong I am not saying 2017 was due to rates but even if it had any relation to it than the relation was due to people using it and not the news about it.

Ecb cutted rates Good

Now Let's Wait for the Good results for Bitcoin.


Europe starrting money printing, its a official now

Fiat inflation may have played some role but it's crazy to say it caused the 2017 bull run. BTC rose 2600% over that year. Were fiat monies being inflated that much? Of course not. The inflation rate of USD in 2017 was like 2%!


That's because rate cuts represent renewed capital liquidity, so banks can lend more to businesses. That keeps businesses from experiences liquidity crunches; it keeps fledgling and near failing businesses afloat and keeps more money flowing through the economy. That renews confidence in the stock markets.

Bitcoin doesn't share these direct correlations, though I believe it does benefit broadly from a healthy economy where businesses are liquid and investors have disposable capital.

In fact Bitcoin depends purely on supply and demand. World economy depends on governments, the value of fiat money, politics that many times come down to threats and pacts, being aggressive and submissive depending on the situation. Compared to all that Bitcoin is pure and almost perfect.
We could see a big spike in the value of gold and a smaller one in Bitcoin when the EU announced their money printing bond program. A bigger one will come, this is just a beginning.

We Know that world economy and stock market depends on this cuts


But Bitcoin depends?  Exacly?  What Reason?


Just Pure speculation?

There is nothing surprising here to understand, it is crystal clear that the market movement in bitcoin does not depends upon federal rate cuts. Bitcoin is not regional based like the stock exchange, it is a global market and if the funds are flowing into the market, you will see a rise, if not you will not find any difference in the market. We all hope that the market will rise after the halving, it is because of less coins coming into the market and we know with experience.

Price of bitcoin doesn't depends on anything so you expecting the price of bitcoin to increase when the interest rate reduced by the government is stupidity.

The price of bitcoin increasing on its own and the world economic structure can influence it but only the adoption will make the prices to go higher.

Indeed. The current trend is the movement to "perceived" safe assets such as gold, T-bonds and fiat currencies such as CHF and YEN. Some investors do have residuals in BTC, but these are already invested and won't move anytime soon.
This is in anticipation of a next bust of the global economy, and that capital will stay put for a while. This may or may not happen. If nothing comes to past, then the capital will re-enter the market in due time. If something does happen, well.. the same, but with a longer timeframe. Regardless investors want dry powder, and they want it now.

To put it simply, its unlikely BTC will reach a new high until the S&P500 reaches a new high.
A worldwide financial calamity may not be as positive for the health of BTC as many may think.

Interest rate is related to fiat money not bitcoin. Fed set the interest rates to control the amount of money that circulating in the market, if the interest rates is high then many people will save their money in bank so the inflation rate will decrease but if the interest rates is high then people will withdraw their money from bank because it is not so profitable and then invest their money to something else that more profitable. In my opinion, it is the impact of inflation due to interest rates cuts so that people's purchasing power is decrease.

The OP did the wrong assumption from the start and we don't need to judge him because of it, we are in a forum here and I don't think it will do any good to him if we are just  pointing out his mistake. It may have made him believe that rate cuts translates to more money for the people that leads straight up to the crypto market and that is the wrong assumption to make. First of all rate cuts increased their buying power but it doesn't mean it will all go to investments, you will barely see people do it that way and they just spend the extra cash they have. If investors opt out on putting more money in their investments not all of them are involved with the crypto market so there is really no significance of rate cuts when it comes to investment in the short term.

Americans are already investing into bitcoin, I don't know much about China and what they are doing right now, I know its legal to buy and sell bitcoin but illegal to do mine it? That is all I know and that means people can buy it and hold it which is sort of an investment. However I know Americans do invest into bitcoin, from all the way at the top of wall street to smaller players who invest just a portion of their income, all kinds of people are investing.

Not "all" people invest, I just mean all kinds of people, there is no demographic that doesn't touched bitcoin, which means bitcoin needs to get bigger in those communities instead of getting that communities involved which is a great way to start adoption. Price and adoption is not always hand in hand, just because price is low doesn't mean they are not investing.

In order to invest and Making profit we have to follow to some indicators!
Its Easy to undestood if rates are low the assets are high due the inflation.  Btc is asset, Right?



And Yes 2017 was btc bull run due to high Fiat inflation, offcourse a lot cryptocurrency scams was out there, 2018 scammers dumped profits, As whales.
Those are facts

Like what others have said there's no direct correlation between interest rates (whether it increases or decreases) on Bitcoin prices. I know it's expected that people are willing to spend more since their disposable income have increased but it doesn't mean that the money will be going all to the crypto market let alone buy Bitcoin from it. Disposable income can be spent in multiple ways not only throught investment so even the stock market cannot show an immediate effect when interest rates are down.

So who told you that it was the rate cut of 2017 led to the increase of bitcoin then, I believe that you must have picked up this mentality also from one of the Newspaper that you have on the media the which is not true. There were so many things that could have contributed to the increase of bitcoin in that 2017, and I really would not think it is because of this rate cut that t happened.

Rate cut is not enough to pull investors into cryptocurrency market, we have more investors in 2017 than we have now, the investor are still there, but not making much investment as much as the new ones will make. So what we need is investors and it is not all these rate cut that you people formulated out of nowhere or thin air. If rate was a good factor, I see no reason why it should not come to play this time around also.

Because the scenario that you got sold on is not necessarily true... You've been reading about how low interest rates, unstable stockmarkets, uncertain times for economies and national currencies, would all lead to normal people selling their stocks, withdrawing their savings and pensions, liquidating their gold, all to buy bitcoin.

Great idea isn't it and almost rational but you have to understand that bitcoin is still a larger risk to all these people with money.

It is still an unknown entity and still, no matter what we say, more immature and more uncertain than anything they know.

5 maybe 10 years from now, that might change. But not today.

I think now is not the time for American and Chinese entrepreneurs to invest in bitcoin now. because when the charts don't show the trend of the future, they won't put a lot of money into it.
That is why it still has to pay for many days in red but still no signs of going up. But believe me, in 2020, the price of Bitcoin will increase sharply in the near future due to the halving event.

They are not net positive when it comes to stuff like gold though, I mean people do not pick the "safer" option of gold because in the end because of the rate cuts the stock investments and even other stuff becomes much more safer and since they are safer people do not go for the gold type safe options.

This is why bitcoin will not be affected by this, I mean we are talking about people who are moving from a safe option to another safe option, bitcoin is so crazy we literally went from 1k on 2017 summer to 20k on 2017 December to 3k in 2018 November to 10k in 2019 June, that is like 1.5 years of INSANE movements which means those people who prefer stuff like golds or stocks and looks for rate cuts will not be actually going to bitcoin route. These are "safe" people and bitcoin is not for them.

There was, just thanks to rate cuts the Bitcoin was Going Up!
Remember many People borrowed money to buy Bitcoin at the 2017.
So 2017 was huge money printings.
Now the rate cuts are Even bigger, but the people Don't Invest just Through Exchangers they buy private ways!

That's the Only Reason what makes any sense!


If the btc investors Will Buy the btc Same ways like 2017 When many Middle class investors took a loans then by Now the btc Price would be at least 30k. 

My Only Question is what Next? 



Let's see the facts here:
Investors have stored a lot Bitcoins out of Exchangers... If they want to liquitade their btc then they Will transfer btc to Exchangers.
Large sell Orders Will crash the market! 

But we can also say that BTC has been devalued by 50% since December 2017. This fact keeps many investors out of Bitcoin, and they will hardly jump in until this is no longer the case.


Again, unless the purchasing power of USD drops by 50%, the effect can be zero.

However, I personally think that we will be over $19k soon, and then it will be a whole different picture.

Rate cuts are a net positive for stocks because they imply liquidity injections into businesses, due to banks having more excess capital. That increases market confidence.

However in theory, rate cuts should also represent a net positive for any investment asset (including BTC) because some of that injected capital will trickle into other markets. The USD has been devalued by 20% since Bitcoin was launched. That printed money is being spread all throughout the global economy. It's impossible to know exactly how much would trickle into the BTC markets, but I think we can assume it's a non-zero amount.

It's unlikely that there is any non-coincidental correlation, but we can't discard it either-- some investors tend to front run these events in the hope that an asset will appreciate in value, which to some lower degree might apply to Bitcoin.

This front running demand isn't any different from other forms of demand-- demand is demand no matter who the investors are, and no matter what their intention is-- price appreciation is what the end goal is for basically every buyer.

Buy the rumor sell the news is an example of front running. If the to be announced rate cuts this month will disappoint, speculative investments such as stocks will increase and gold decrease.

Bitcoin could actually benefit if stocks go up, but then again, we're currently stuck inside a nasty looking bearish pattern. The bias seems to be to the downside no matter what but there is always a probability that we break up.

You have answered your question by yourself but you did not notice, if the price of bitcoin was at its all time high when the cuts were lower and now the price is lower than that despite the bigger cuts then that means that bitcoin has no relationship whatsoever with whatever the Europeans do with their economy, in a way this makes sense since bitcoin is not a national currency, in fact it will be interesting to know why you thought otherwise since I do not understand how you came up with that theory.

Gold has definitely been extremely bullish, but that's not too surprising with how it broke out of an ascending triangle that took years to play out. I'm pretty sure that a lot of the bullish sentiment comes from that, which then makes people believe that everyone is looking for Gold as a safe haven, which I doubt at this stage.

As long as the stock market indicates that it wants to go up, which is definitely the case, Gold will not bloom as much as when investors are looking at Gold to park their capital there because they are wary of a looming recession. Speculative investments are hit the first, and that's something I'm waiting for as confirmation.

On top of that, when the mainstream media is screaming RECESSION IS NEAR, and even the average joes share that sentiment, it gives me reason to believe that the actual recession is still relatively far away.

I have another perspective about BTC price in 2017, not because ICO mostly because the same pattern after halving, BTC price will reach another ATH.

Rate cuts from FED, AU and Europe will affect another investment instruments, which they consider to be safer from price changes that are too fast, and they usually make more investments to secure their assets from impairment, as is usually the case when there is interest rates cut there are indications that the country is experiencing or will experience an economic recession.

Wrong! The 2017 price pump was mostly due to the ICO boom that was happening back then. When large social media companies started to ban Crypto currencies, the price took a 80%+ price nose dive and things has not changed since then.

Interest rate cuts will only have a small impact on the price, because informal traders will look for a hedge to protect their investments. We mostly have a debt driven global economy, so people with debt will not invest in Bitcoin, when there is a rate cut.. the majority of them will make more debt and some of them will pay back a higher amount on that debt to reduce  it. 

Why do you think that bitcoin will be benefited by these rate cuts?? When the economy slows down, central banks reduce interest rates so that their people can have more liquid funds in their pocket. So we all knew that rate cut was imminent from the beginning of US China trade war. But do you know what has been benefited by these rate cuts - it's none other than GOLD!

See the price chart for last two months and you will understand the truth!

I think Bitcoin price has already been affected by the rate cut.. the current price of Bitcoin is very good compared to last year, even the trend tends to be green until the end of 2019...


March 2018 to October 2018                                                         Sept 2018 to Sept 2019

Are you saying that there should be correlation here? I'm sorry but there are no correlation and the only thing that will make the price go up is demand. Every year people mature and obviously, right now speculators and traders and institutions are still waiting for some good news like the block halvening next year. And I don't know what do you mean that Bitcoin is still low, it went from $3000 to $10,000. If you are looking for the price to reach $20,000 again then I guess you have to wait till 2020.

The last ath had more to do with it getting pumped and people getting caught in a feeding frenzy. Basically word got out and everyone started buying. I don't think we'd ever see that $20k price in the near future.


True. I remember it even dipped below $3k for a weeks and people were already despairing. Funny how now people are still complaining at $10k.

I think what he means is that the global trend of "quantitative easing" or rather the printing of more fiat money should be bullish for the digital gold which is Bitcoin.  And he is expecting that the price of Bitcoin should be skyrocketing now. I think the OP doesn't see that the whole crypto industry is still a small sector of the whole financial world. Any reaction to low rates would reflect more on gold.

I don't understand why you're saying that Bitcoin is low. It's bravely holding its $10k barrier, which is amazing after more than a year around $6k and below. Bitcoin's price almost tripled over the last half a year, and I think it's an amazing success. When it surpassed the $6k-$7k barrier so fast, it was very impressive. And even though some people panic from time to time when the price starts going down, it actually does not go down significantly. I prefer Bitcoin being stable around $10k than around $6k or rising to $20k and then rapidly dropping to $6k once again.

People should stop thinking about Bitcoin as some perfect hedge against fiat economy, that reacts to every single negative events - years of data clearly show that there's no mechanism for that. Bitcoin is doing its own thing, it's volatile, it has market cycles, and most of the supposed examples of correlation are just coincidences. So, stop looking at unrelated things and trying to tie them to Bitcoin's price, you will only lose money if you'll trade to trade based on that assumption.

The Market Works by FOMO, once the People Will see the BTC Price goes Up like a 14-15k. They Jump in Same thing with GOLD market bull run the gold market is just a lot more bigger then Bitcoin thats Why Gold bull is so Long.


When investors Invest into something they Want to be confident about where they Invest... The People have no faith in stock markets coz People have lost faith into governments, Banks and corporations.  


Corporations, governments, Banks Will be less and less popular People have lost Trust and faith.

Investors Now Looking for new things and cryptocurrency and Gold is an option.

Banks and stock markets is about collapse Even governments are about stop functioning like they use to be its just a normal process, no regime or some sort of order cant exist for ever, changing is normal
As life is like alchemical process, When you have used  something then its used the energy of old object Will not disapere but it Will go into new things.

Like hot day the Water will Go to the sky and then it Will Come Down Again.


So Nothing is permanent Same with the markets and investment

It probably hasn't all been allocated yet. Cutting the funds rate just lowers the cost of borrowing for banks, allowing them to lend more. It doesn't mean banks have already lent out all excess reserves, or that borrowers have spent all the money.


The equity markets dumped when the Fed announced the rate cut a month ago but afterwards, they recovered nicely. Gold is also performing quite well. Those are your best bets.

Bitcoins is not the only option where the money can be invested as the others have already said we have more stable things considering how real estate is a boon for new naive investors and also how gold is easy and secure .. therefore we cannot expect all the money to actually go in cryptocurrencies and bitcoins.
Therefore it is not necessary that it would go hand in hand ..

Okay, If the money not Going into btc where?
Its a Construction/real estate/gold/...i dont think its a stock market coz When we look at the Geo political situation investors talking about safe hedge against everything against Fiat currency Bad reputation and against stock markets...


The most trusted hedge is somehow the Gold.

It's not that simple. Cutting interest rates pumps money into the economy, and some of that can trickle into the crypto markets, but the effects aren't realized overnight. There are also lots and lots of other variables affecting price.

In fact, the S&P 500 dumped 6 or 7% when the rate cut was announced, whether because it suggested an incoming recession or because the cut wasn't perceived as aggressive enough.

Bitcoin reached 20K in 2017 not because of the rate cuts. And even if you believe that bitcoin prices rises on these cut rates, even then bitcoin has jumped for 4000$ to 12000$ within few months which is enough i guess. What else you want to see? Do not expect bitcoin to rise 25-30K in days or weeks.

Sure, the Fed have cut interest rates a little from 2.5% to 2.25%, but they have been low for bitcoin's entire life. The genesis block was mined a month after rates were cut to a historic low of 0.25% back in December 2008. Only in 2016 did rates start to rise a little, generally by 0.25% every few months. 2.5% is still very low compared to historic rates, which sat around 5-15% for decades. A cut of 0.25% is pretty insignificant in the grand scheme of things. Rates elsewhere aren't even this high. The Bank of England rate, for example, is only at 0.75%. The 2017 bullrun happened while interest rates were going up. There is no direct correlation.

Cutting of interest rates will not necessarily lead to wider Bitcoin adoption(in the sense of a valuable asset), because people have seen with such an investment not only your rates can be low, but you can lose almost 50% of your initial investment(as of today for those who bought at $19k). It's only when BTC will surpass it's previous ATH, people can start buying it like crazy, regardless of any other news.

The way you think is wrong, and also BTC is not low currently, I think that's exactly where it should be in terms of price. If you want to see low price check data from last year, price was close to $3000 for months, and it go above $4000 in March this year.

Price depends on many factors, mostly about supply and demand like in any other market. Now we are in situation where most people trade only for short-term profits, but there is no high demand which would push the price up. But some feeling tells me that we might see some action in the coming months, which means that we should not be impatient.

I don't think the price of BTC has anything to do with rate cuts.
2017 pump was mostly due to the fact that most people didn't know about BTC back then, now the story is different - everyone's heard of it.

The glamour has sort of worn down a bit.

Fed, au and europe is about to cut rates.
But Why Bitcoin is Still low?
2017 was Even less rate cuts but btc was 20k.

Now everywhere is rate cuts but btc Price is Still low



Anyone knows Why its like that?