fox.exchange -- Coin to Coin exchange (Like shapeshift but no registration!)

Potato Chips

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yesssir! 🫡

Quote from: fox.exchange_is_a_SCAM on May 13, 2020, 06:30:56 AM

Ah, another centralized KYC/AML compliant exchange who advertises itself as "completely anonymous" just because they don't mandatory require their users to undergo the said procedure.

Quote from: https://archive.is/abLtL#selection-2757.0-2766.0

Completely anonymous

No registration, no email, no identification documents needed, only your crypto public address.

Quote from: https://archive.is/UY3bl#selection-517.0-535.226

Terms of Service

...FOX service reserves the right to apply the AML/KYC procedure to certain Users, addresses and particular transactions of crypto assets. Application of the AML/KYC procedure is based on FOX service internal policies and aimed at preventing and mitigating possible risks of FOX service being involved in money laundering as well as any other illegal activities.

Please be informed, that FOX service reserves the right to appoint Third-party service provider in order to fulfil AML/KYC procedure on behalf of FOX service. While processing your information, such service provider completely complies with our Privacy Policy in respect of your personal information.

During the AML/KYC procedure, we reserve the right to freeze and withhold your exchange transaction for any length of time necessary to complete the investigation and AML/KYC procedure. If you do not complete or pass the AML/KYC procedure FOX has the right to terminate the execution of your transactions.

FOX service will not enter a business arrangement with individual or entity suspected of or directly involved in money laundering, or in which the funds have been the source of illegal activity.

Another misleading statement is the "no custodial risk". They shouldn't say this bc at some point they have an access to their users funds hence does not completely eliminate "custodial risks"

Quote from: https://archive.is/abLtL#selection-2743.0-2747.112

Extremely safe

Unlike most other exchanges, we don't hold customer deposits. Like this, your funds don't suffer custodial risk.

I'd open a scam accusation (https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/scam-report-format-use-it-to-make-scam-reports-properly-260073) for their misleading statements if I were you.

fox.exchange_is_a_SCAM

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WARNING: FOX.EXCHANGE IS A SCAM

At first, they will process your smaller trades to gain your trust. Then when you deposit a bigger amount, they will ask for mandatory "KYC" and steal your coins for themselves. This is a common tactic by scammy exchanges.

What happened to me:
I have been successfully trading with them the past few days. They processed 50+ transactions for me.
Proof of successful trades:

Then I decided to increase the coins to be exchanged. I received en email from them saying that my order is suspicious. Really? After 50+ successful transactions, now they think my order is suspicious? Or is it because the coins I sent them is bigger this time and they want to steal it and keep for themselves?

Their "KYC" email:

I told them that I am not willing to send them my private documents and just refund my coins back if they do not want to process my transaction.
Proof:

Also fox.exchange owner post saying NO KYC: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.49528687

I only trusted them because they are being monitored at bestchange site. I do not trust them with my private documents. I hope bestchange admin will remove this scammer from their website to save other people from getting scammed.

WARNING: FOX.EXCHANGE IS A SCAM

I will update this post if they do the right thing, and refund my coins or process my transaction.

marcotheminer

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Quote from: figmentofmyass on October 06, 2019, 03:07:32 PM

Quote from: marcotheminer on October 06, 2019, 12:23:38 PM

Quote from: xbtx on October 04, 2019, 07:11:23 AM

Yes, I was asking as for the legality side of it, if in the US it is required for the platforms to enable KYC even for crypto-crypto only platforms

The law isn't clear on that yet AFAIK.

USA regulators removed any ambiguity a while ago. FINCEN repeated this past may that crypto-only exchanges are subject to the bank secrecy act, which has KYC reporting requirements at $3000, $5000, and $10k thresholds:

Quote

To address these and other issues, on March 18, 2013, FinCEN issued interpretive guidance on the application of FinCEN’s regulations to transactions involving the acceptance of currency or funds and the transmission of CVC (“2013 VC Guidance”). The 2013 VC Guidance described what CVC is for purposes of FinCEN regulations, and reminded the public that persons not exempted from MSB status that accept and transmit either real currency or anything of value that substitutes for currency, including virtual currency, are covered by the definition of money transmitter. The 2013 VC Guidance also identified the participants to generic CVC arrangements, including an “exchanger,” “administrator,” and “user,” and further clarified that exchangers and administrators generally qualify as money transmitters under the BSA, while users do not.

this is why binance gave american customers the boot---so they could retain unverified accounts on the exchange.

Thanks for the clarification .. No wonder crypto/blockchain will be slow to pick up (truly pick up I mean) in the States.. Bunch of anti-innovators..

figmentofmyass

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Quote from: marcotheminer on October 06, 2019, 12:23:38 PM

Quote from: xbtx on October 04, 2019, 07:11:23 AM

Yes, I was asking as for the legality side of it, if in the US it is required for the platforms to enable KYC even for crypto-crypto only platforms

The law isn't clear on that yet AFAIK.

USA regulators removed any ambiguity a while ago. FINCEN repeated this past may that crypto-only exchanges are subject to the bank secrecy act, which has KYC reporting requirements at $3000, $5000, and $10k thresholds:

Quote

To address these and other issues, on March 18, 2013, FinCEN issued interpretive guidance on the application of FinCEN’s regulations to transactions involving the acceptance of currency or funds and the transmission of CVC (“2013 VC Guidance”). The 2013 VC Guidance described what CVC is for purposes of FinCEN regulations, and reminded the public that persons not exempted from MSB status that accept and transmit either real currency or anything of value that substitutes for currency, including virtual currency, are covered by the definition of money transmitter. The 2013 VC Guidance also identified the participants to generic CVC arrangements, including an “exchanger,” “administrator,” and “user,” and further clarified that exchangers and administrators generally qualify as money transmitters under the BSA, while users do not.

this is why binance gave american customers the boot---so they could retain unverified accounts on the exchange.

marcotheminer

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Quote from: xbtx on October 04, 2019, 07:11:23 AM

Quote from: timerland on October 03, 2019, 08:30:45 PM

Some platforms require KYC even for signing up and trading crypto to crypto, but from experience, it's fairly easy to trade crypto to crypto, there are a number of platforms what will let you do so, or you could always VPN and use services that are closed for US IPs but still accept VPN's (like a couple mentioned in this thread.).

Yes, I was asking as for the legality side of it, if in the US it is required for the platforms to enable KYC even for crypto-crypto only platforms

The law isn't clear on that yet AFAIK. Crypto-Fiat operations are a certain KYC-must though. Also they sometimes do not take action against foreign based companies that serve US customers.

xbtx

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Quote from: timerland on October 03, 2019, 08:30:45 PM

Some platforms require KYC even for signing up and trading crypto to crypto, but from experience, it's fairly easy to trade crypto to crypto, there are a number of platforms what will let you do so, or you could always VPN and use services that are closed for US IPs but still accept VPN's (like a couple mentioned in this thread.).

Yes, I was asking as for the legality side of it, if in the US it is required for the platforms to enable KYC even for crypto-crypto only platforms

timerland

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Quote from: xbtx on October 03, 2019, 02:21:17 PM

Quote from: figmentofmyass on October 02, 2019, 05:21:15 PM

maybe. i honestly don't know how much longer that model will hold up. you've got american FINCEN closing in on one side and the EU commission on the other. they're picking off the low hanging fruit (like 1broker) first, but the CFTC is already investigating bitmex for allowing americans. bitmex doesn't do KYC and they allow VPN usage. so the CFTC probe is a sign of things to come IMO.

Does the US require KYC even for non-FIAT services? Most of the EU countries only require KYC systems on FIAT-handling services (which let you exchange for FIAT), not crypto-only services.

Some platforms require KYC even for signing up and trading crypto to crypto, but from experience, it's fairly easy to trade crypto to crypto, there are a number of platforms what will let you do so, or you could always VPN and use services that are closed for US IPs but still accept VPN's (like a couple mentioned in this thread.).

Quote from: AdolfinWolf on October 03, 2019, 09:27:20 AM

Quote from: figmentofmyass on October 02, 2019, 05:21:15 PM

last time i needed a service like this (a few months ago) i used flyp.me---worked very smoothly, no KYC.

Quote from: marcotheminer on October 02, 2019, 02:38:05 PM

ShapeShift probably wants to continue 'easy operations' in the US. If Fox.exchange says screw it and just requires VPN use then no need to listen to the US Wink

maybe. i honestly don't know how much longer that model will hold up. you've got american FINCEN closing in on one side and the EU commission on the other. they're picking off the low hanging fruit (like 1broker) first, but the CFTC is already investigating bitmex for allowing americans. bitmex doesn't do KYC and they allow VPN usage. so the CFTC probe is a sign of things to come IMO.

Meh. I don't think it matters much for these kind of P2P services. Fox.exchange will probably just keep operating, and as soon as an investigation is launched, they'll probably just close shop, - or open a new company using another shell on another island.

US will never catch them, or atleast, it will never be really worth to do so.

Bitmex though, yeah, that's a different story. I could see some compliance issues real soon.

I agree, as much as it sucks, a lot of companies like these are probably not worth the effort for the government to chase and have a lifespan to them, I'd probably guess they get shut down by the end of 2020, then come back as a different company in 3-4 months.

xbtx

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Quote from: figmentofmyass on October 02, 2019, 05:21:15 PM

maybe. i honestly don't know how much longer that model will hold up. you've got american FINCEN closing in on one side and the EU commission on the other. they're picking off the low hanging fruit (like 1broker) first, but the CFTC is already investigating bitmex for allowing americans. bitmex doesn't do KYC and they allow VPN usage. so the CFTC probe is a sign of things to come IMO.

Does the US require KYC even for non-FIAT services? Most of the EU countries only require KYC systems on FIAT-handling services (which let you exchange for FIAT), not crypto-only services.

1Referee

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Quote from: magneto on October 03, 2019, 07:57:07 AM

At the end of the day, shapeshift have basically lost out on a lot of customers because of the direction it took (probably forcibly, it seems) in regards to forcing people to get accounts and verify themselves.

I'm certain that they could have waited a bit longer before pushing it through people's throats, but it wouldn't change anything anyway with how much of a hit they have to suffer by that course of action. In the end, Shapeshift has a very strong brand and reputation, one that its competitors don't have. Most are drenched in complaints and scam accusations.

Interestingly, Shapeshift's Alexa rank continues to increase; https://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/shapeshift.io

You can choose very questionable services to avoid dealing with KYC, or do KYC, and use a service that's known to be reputable and has a well respected founder behind it.

AdolfinWolf

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Quote from: figmentofmyass on October 02, 2019, 05:21:15 PM

last time i needed a service like this (a few months ago) i used flyp.me---worked very smoothly, no KYC.

Quote from: marcotheminer on October 02, 2019, 02:38:05 PM

ShapeShift probably wants to continue 'easy operations' in the US. If Fox.exchange says screw it and just requires VPN use then no need to listen to the US Wink

maybe. i honestly don't know how much longer that model will hold up. you've got american FINCEN closing in on one side and the EU commission on the other. they're picking off the low hanging fruit (like 1broker) first, but the CFTC is already investigating bitmex for allowing americans. bitmex doesn't do KYC and they allow VPN usage. so the CFTC probe is a sign of things to come IMO.

Meh. I don't think it matters much for these kind of P2P services. Fox.exchange will probably just keep operating, and as soon as an investigation is launched, they'll probably just close shop, - or open a new company using another shell on another island.

US will never catch them, or atleast, it will never be really worth it to do so.

Bitmex though, yeah, that's a different story. I could see some compliance issues real soon.

Pearls Before Swine

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Quote from: figmentofmyass on October 02, 2019, 05:21:15 PM

i honestly don't know how much longer that model will hold up. you've got american FINCEN closing in on one side and the EU commission on the other.

I give it a year or two, maybe less, before they either shut down, require KYC from U.S. citizens, or drop support for the U.S. altogether. Can't say what will happen to their ability to provide service to the EU but these are the kinds of regulations we're going to see more of in my opinion.

I am a fan of instant exchanges but haven't used this fox.exchange one and probably wont. My trading days are over anyway, but I hope gov't regulations dont effectively destroy all of them since they're so much easier to use than standard exchanges. Faster anyway.

Quote from: magneto on October 03, 2019, 07:57:07 AM

At the end of the day, shapeshift have basically lost out on a lot of customers because of the direction it took (probably forcibly, it seems) in regards to forcing people to get accounts and verify themselves.

They had no choice as far as the U.S. was concerned so I can't fault them for that. Any exchange that wants to conduct legal business has to comply with regulators, so if they say the exchanges have to go thru the KYC process with customers they have to do it. There's only going to be more of this in the future, not less.

magneto

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Quote from: marcotheminer on October 02, 2019, 12:45:39 PM

Simple coin to coin exchange service. Anyone else used this?

My only complaint would be that it shaves off a little more than you expect (just now I was supposed to receive 0.0015 BTC and 0.00003 less was sent :/). Not a big enough deal to contact support / or negative review the site (love it - better than shapeshift imo) just an unexpected 2% less.

At the end of the day, shapeshift have basically lost out on a lot of customers because of the direction it took (probably forcibly, it seems) in regards to forcing people to get accounts and verify themselves.

However, this exchange seems relatively amateurish and has quite few pairs compared to more established exchangers such as changelly and Changenow, while offering similar rates.

While I'm in no way saying that Changelly or Changenow aren't shady entities (they are), if I had to choose, I'd still go with the former 2 given that they've been around longer and have more options.

carlfebz2

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Quote from: mk4 on October 02, 2019, 01:08:20 PM

If this site is actually working, probably take advantage of it already while they currently don't require KYC; because it's very likely that they will require KYC soon if this site gains traction and enough publicity to get the attention of the fed. Pretty much like what happened to ShapeShift. Since it's a pretty not-so-well-known service though and because of the fees being a little to high for me(even higher than ShapeShift like you said) personally, I'd stick with Binance.

Same goes for similar services as well but its just a norm for these FEDs behind their a**es if they do already making out too much noise.
Ive been using flyp.me when it comes to instant exchangers but this one isnt bad either.I might tried this one optionally.
They are indeed taking advantage yet most famous instant exchange are requiring KYC now.

mk4

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Quote from: marcotheminer on October 02, 2019, 02:38:05 PM

ShapeShift probably wants to continue 'easy operations' in the US. If Fox.exchange says screw it and just requires VPN use then no need to listen to the US Wink

Fees are comparable to (I've even gotten better than) ShapeShift imo.

Binance says otherwise though. They probably had the same thing in mind in the past, until they had no choice but to bend the knee and just open a separate version of Binance for the US users. Something similar could probably happen, but I doubt fox.exchange would get any famous as ShapeShift, as it looks like they aren't doing any that much marketing. They're likely to stay off the radar for a while.

figmentofmyass

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last time i needed a service like this (a few months ago) i used flyp.me---worked very smoothly, no KYC.

Quote from: marcotheminer on October 02, 2019, 02:38:05 PM

ShapeShift probably wants to continue 'easy operations' in the US. If Fox.exchange says screw it and just requires VPN use then no need to listen to the US Wink

maybe. i honestly don't know how much longer that model will hold up. you've got american FINCEN closing in on one side and the EU commission on the other. they're picking off the low hanging fruit (like 1broker) first, but the CFTC is already investigating bitmex for allowing americans. bitmex doesn't do KYC and they allow VPN usage. so the CFTC probe is a sign of things to come IMO.

marcotheminer

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Quote from: Slow death on October 02, 2019, 02:43:54 PM

Quote from: marcotheminer on October 02, 2019, 12:45:39 PM

Simple coin to coin exchange service. Anyone else used this?

they have an ANN Thread here in the forum:

[ANN] fox.exchange - Cryptocurrency Express Exchange - No Registration Required

in February you posted on their thread

Aha, thanks that's where it went.. I was looking for it in Service Discussion. I'll leave this open for comments about it - next time I use it I will update about the exact process / fees I had. EDIT: good thing you linked me, I was able to bump it with the new button haha.

Slow death

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Quote from: marcotheminer on October 02, 2019, 12:45:39 PM

Simple coin to coin exchange service. Anyone else used this?

they have an ANN Thread here in the forum:

[ANN] fox.exchange - Cryptocurrency Express Exchange - No Registration Required

in February you posted on their thread

marcotheminer

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Quote from: mk4 on October 02, 2019, 01:08:20 PM

If this site is actually working, probably take advantage of it already while they currently don't require KYC; because it's very likely that they will require KYC soon if this site gains traction and enough publicity to get the attention of the fed. Pretty much like what happened to ShapeShift. Since it's a pretty not-so-well-known service though and because of the fees being a little to high for me(even higher than ShapeShift like you said) personally, I'd stick with Binance.

ShapeShift probably wants to continue 'easy operations' in the US. If Fox.exchange says screw it and just requires VPN use then no need to listen to the US Wink

Fees are comparable to (I've even gotten better than) ShapeShift imo.

mk4

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If this site is actually working, probably take advantage of it already while they currently don't require KYC; because it's very likely that they will require KYC soon if this site gains traction and enough publicity to get the attention of the fed. Pretty much like what happened to ShapeShift. Since it's a pretty not-so-well-known service though and because of the fees being a little to high for me(even higher than ShapeShift like you said) personally, I'd stick with Binance.

marcotheminer

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Simple coin to coin exchange service. Anyone else used this?

My only complaint would be that it shaves off a little more than you expect (just now I was supposed to receive 0.0015 BTC and 0.00003 less was sent :/). Not a big enough deal to contact support / or negative review the site (love it - better than shapeshift imo) just an unexpected 2% less.

Topic: fox.exchange -- Coin to Coin exchange (Like shapeshift but no registration!) (Read 277 times)