Futures trading help | Bitcointalksearch.org

Wind_FURY

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Quote from: geegaw on October 06, 2021, 08:55:32 AM

Quote from: zulfi125 on October 04, 2021, 10:29:58 AM

First of all, I suggest don't invest in futures trading because most investors lose their all money when you will open an order at the price of $47000 and buy BTC then if the price will go down and you will select above 5% margin and will not set the stop loss then your position will automatically liquidate and your all funds will be lost, you can do open order long time but if you have more funds and you select minimum margin but you will pay interest per day on your position.

Agree, whether choosing a high or low margin, mostly stop loss is a rare occurrence while burning and liquidation of the entire account is the more received message because at high margin, liquidation is very fast and most participants do very little calculation of their position, almost consider the amount as a tuition for fun and entertainment. For low margin, subjectivity is a bad side but also a good side, good here includes in position and psychology, few people think that position can be burned but the accident does not spare anyone, such a low is also stuck with an extremely long pillar on the candlestick chart, betray our prediction

If the person who is “trading” actually knows that he’s actually gambling, and has a higher probabilty of getting stop-hunted/liquidated by the whales, then I believe it’s OK. Who are we but mere plebs to tell him/her how to use his money. But I will always encourage everyone to HODL.

geegaw

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Quote from: zulfi125 on October 04, 2021, 10:29:58 AM

First of all, I suggest don't invest in futures trading because most investors lose their all money when you will open an order at the price of $47000 and buy BTC then if the price will go down and you will select above 5% margin and will not set the stop loss then your position will automatically liquidate and your all funds will be lost, you can do open order long time but if you have more funds and you select minimum margin but you will pay interest per day on your position.

Agree, whether choosing a high or low margin, mostly stop loss is a rare occurrence while burning and liquidation of the entire account is the more received message because at high margin, liquidation is very fast and most participants do very little calculation of their position, almost consider the amount as a tuition for fun and entertainment. For low margin, subjectivity is a bad side but also a good side, good here includes in position and psychology, few people think that position can be burned but the accident does not spare anyone, such a low is also stuck with an extremely long pillar on the candlestick chart, betray our prediction

Wind_FURY

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Quote from: Oshosondy on October 06, 2021, 02:15:35 AM

Quote from: fullhdpixel on October 04, 2021, 10:02:25 AM

If you need help in futures trading, then you should not be futures trading, simple as that. The simplest fact is that if you do high leverage and the price goes against what direction you wagered on (and yes you wager this, not invest, it is total gambling) then you will be liquidated, which means all of your order will be gone and you will lose all of that money.

High leverage is highly risky, but your comment is opposed to 1x leverage which means no leverage, you will be able to go short or long but with your own funds. But leveraging is what is risky. But the reason many people are trading on future trading is because they want to leverage which is highly risky.

If you don’t want to use leverage, then why trade using futures at all? Trade, withdraw, and hold the Bitcoins in your wallet. Less risk.

OP, trade perpetual futures, you can stay in the trade for years as long as you do not get liquidated. My advice, use leverage wisely.

Oshosondy

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Quote from: fullhdpixel on October 04, 2021, 10:02:25 AM

If you need help in futures trading, then you should not be futures trading, simple as that. The simplest fact is that if you do high leverage and the price goes against what direction you wagered on (and yes you wager this, not invest, it is total gambling) then you will be liquidated, which means all of your order will be gone and you will lose all of that money.

High leverage is highly risky, but your comment is opposed to 1x leverage which means no leverage, you will be able to go short or long but with your own funds. But leveraging is what is risky. But the reason many people are trading on future trading is because they want to leverage which is highly risky.

zulfi125

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First of all, I suggest don't invest in futures trading because most investors lose their all money when you will open an order at the price of $47000 and buy BTC then if the price will go down and you will select above 5% margin and will not set the stop loss then your position will automatically liquidate and your all funds will be lost, you can do open order long time but if you have more funds and you select minimum margin but you will pay interest per day on your position.

fullhdpixel

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Quote from: marimanga on October 01, 2021, 12:39:23 PM

I like to hold coins for long term but right now im interested in futures trading and there is a thing i don't understand and cannot find answer on internet (lol).

Lets say i bought long BTC/USD at $47,000 and if bitcoin goes down like at $42,000 will my open order will be canceled automatically without my permission and lose my money. I know stop limit loss but im not interested at this right now because im always behind my computer. Also... Can you hold open orders like for a year and if it goes up i take alot of profits.. My concern is only if im at loss i don't like to sell and lose but im concerned if my open order will be canceled automatically if not set up limit loss and take loss, i always wait for the price to go up at the same price i bought. English is not my first language if my question is not clear please let me know i'll try to explain below in comments. Thank you.

If you need help in futures trading, then you should not be futures trading, simple as that. The simplest fact is that if you do high leverage and the price goes against what direction you wagered on (and yes you wager this, not invest, it is total gambling) then you will be liquidated, which means all of your order will be gone and you will lose all of that money.

So, let's say you put up 1000 dollars into bitcoin going to 55k until next week, and it goes down to 40k instead, all of that 1000 will be gone and you will not be able to wait until it goes back up, if that was an option then there would be a lot more people who do that and not enough people to lose so that others would profit. Long story short, if you are not sure about trading futures, and you have questions then you need to do a whole lot more regular trading and studying before you move to futures.

Oshosondy

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Quote from: tranthidung on October 03, 2021, 04:46:51 AM

It is a hook to attract gamblers. I don't call most of people who do Future tradings are traders. Most of them are gamblers and the loses they get from Future tradings are huge.

I agree, many people are complaining of losses on spot trading, I do not know how huge will be the liquidation and loss for future contracts, it will be so much, some people can even go 125x to buy and sell bitcoin on future contract trading platforms, the loss will be in few seconds or minutes for isolated trade.

Quote from: tranthidung on October 03, 2021, 04:46:51 AM

Reduce trading fee a little bit is not a matter of exchange because they can earn more from market liquidations.

Yes, also that exchanges can earn more from increasing leverage, the higher the leverage the higher the fee. For someone that go for 5x leverage, he will pay more in fee for future contract with the same value of coin traded with spot trading aside COIN-M maker fee while it higher for COIN-M maker fee for 8x leverage and above.

Beparanf

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Quote from: TheEconomists on October 02, 2021, 11:57:43 PM

Quote from: Dragonfund on October 01, 2021, 02:04:16 PM

It seems you know only little about future trading, it's different from spot trading. There are things you need to understand before you open a position in futures if not, you loose your funds before you realize.
Your liquidation depends on your leverage size, if your leverage is higher, there is more likely that your trade will be force to liquidated the moment your trade didn't go as plan and that's why by default, it's always set at 10x.
Your margin is also important to note, you can either Isolated margin and cross margin, isolated will have a single balance on a just a single position while cross will be for all margin balance.

You should watch more on video tutorials and also used testnet futures for test before using real money. Check Binance futures testnet, you will be given free fund for test, not spendable, just for test and familiarity

Many thanks for this explanation just that am out of Merit if not really worth my merit brother. I go straight to Binance futures testnet to have a look and learn more for I have trading with the use of spots all this while though I have a good knowledge Meta trade4 in forex.

In addition to the info you quoted above, You can use the built-in calculator tool on Binance future to determine the outcome of your trade such as PnL, Liquidation and Target price. This is really helpful to guide you to the possible outcome before you open a position. You can see it on the top right(3 dot) on Futures window when using mobile app and calculator sign when using Windows or browser app. GL and Happy swing trading.

tranthidung

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Quote from: Oshosondy on October 03, 2021, 04:39:13 AM

Maybe extra fee is added that I do not know about, but what I noticed according to binance but on binance (I do not know about other exchanges which can be different) is that the fee rate for future trading (both USD-M and Coin-M) is lower than spot trading.

It is a hook to attract gamblers. I don't call most of people who do Future tradings are traders. Most of them are gamblers and the loses they get from Future tradings are huge.

Reduce trading fee a little bit is not a matter of exchange because they can earn more from market liquidations. Exchanges don't stay outsider the market manipulation.

Oshosondy

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Quote from: GreatArkansas on October 02, 2021, 06:34:03 PM

So the majority of using 1x leverage is probably on short since if you just 1x leverage, you should just use spot trade so you can also avoid the huge fees.

Maybe extra fee is added that I do not know about, but what I noticed according to binance but on binance (I do not know about other exchanges which can be different) is that the fee rate for future trading (both USD-M and Coin-M) is lower than spot trading. But some people should not just learn about future contract because it is highly risky, some people can want to use 1x leverage, but seeing the opportunity to increase the leverage will make them actually increase it which can result to total loss of money in few minutes.

michellee

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If the market goes down or up in a year drastically, your order will still open as long as you are in the same direction as the market in a year. But that will not be possible because the market will change every day.

You buy long BTC/USD at $44,000 and from the day you buy bitcoin, the price still increases until a year, and the next year, the price reaches $100,000. You will make a big profit, even if you use small funds and small leverage because the price increases almost three times the price you bought. But once again, that will not always be possible.

It is better to activate stop loss in future trading to prevent a big loss. But that will be up to you.

Peanutswar

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In this kind of idea holding your bought coin for a year is not good with future trading. In trading, there's a two concept the short term trading and the long term trading. In short term trading could enter the world of futures trading because the market is volatile it could pump and dump for a short term period if you think your assets will not burn and not liquidated you are wrong. Those given by the OP holdings are ideal with spot trading. Could it possible you lessen the leverage to prevent getting liquidation good too if you put a take profit and stop loss preventing your assets becomes liquidated.

Victorycoin

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Investing in cryptocurrency futures provides more opportunities and possibilities to grow a portfolio an important advantage of crypto futures is the use of leverage allows for better capital efficiency because traders do not have to close the entire amount of capital. The use of leverage increases both potential revenue and risk users should always exercise caution traders should use a leverage amount suitable for them you are new to conservative or cryptocurrency trading 5x or 2x leverage would be appropriate.

tranthidung

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Quote from: marimanga on October 01, 2021, 12:39:23 PM

I'm new to futures trading but not in crypto.

Can I ask you a question?

Why did you want to trade?
Why did you focus on Future trading, not Spot trading?

Quote

I like to hold coins for long term but right now im interested in futures trading and there is a thing i don't understand and cannot find answer on internet (lol).

How long have you been in crypto market?
- If your experienced time in the market is less than 4 years, please skip Future trading as well as Margin/ Leverage trading
- If your experienced time is more than 4 years, let's move to the next question
With more than 4 years in the market, have you earned profit with Investment or Spot trading?
- If the answer is very limited profit or almost loses, please skip Future trading
- If you have earned good profit from Spot trading, how about the proportion of fund you assign to your Future trading?
  - It should be a very small part of your capital.
  - Future trading is very risky and you will get lost very easily

TheEconomists

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Quote from: Dragonfund on October 01, 2021, 02:04:16 PM

It seems you know only little about future trading, it's different from spot trading. There are things you need to understand before you open a position in futures if not, you loose your funds before you realize.
Your liquidation depends on your leverage size, if your leverage is higher, there is more likely that your trade will be force to liquidated the moment your trade didn't go as plan and that's why by default, it's always set at 10x.
Your margin is also important to note, you can either Isolated margin and cross margin, isolated will have a single balance on a just a single position while cross will be for all margin balance.

You should watch more on video tutorials and also used testnet futures for test before using real money. Check Binance futures testnet, you will be given free fund for test, not spendable, just for test and familiarity

Many thanks for this explanation just that am out of Merit if not really worth my merit brother. I go straight to Binance futures testnet to have a look and learn more for I have trading with the use of spots all this while though I have a good knowledge Meta trade4 in forex.

adaseb

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When you enter a position in the futures there is always some liquidation price listed. If you are using some crazy high leverage like 100x then you will be liquidated when the market goes 1% against you (minus trading fees and maintaince margin). If you don’t want to be liquidated at 42K you need to either use less leverage or put more margin in your account when it gets closer to $42K and you won’t be liquidated.

Like others have said here. It’s risky and you need to be careful. And always use a stop loss. You’ve seen how Bitcoin can have these 10-15% daily swings and take you out. It’s better getting stopped out then liquidated, if you don’t use a stop but rely on liquidation engine instead you will take a larger hit. Always use stops.

GreatArkansas

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Quote from: Oshosondy on October 02, 2021, 04:01:08 PM

Quote from: JeromeTash on October 02, 2021, 02:03:17 PM

What use is it to trade future with a less than 1x leverage, lol?

On future trading, if you use 1x leverage, you can sell, which means if the price is going down, you are making profit. On spot trading, you can only buy.

+1. The lesser leverage, the less risk. So the majority of using 1x leverage is probably on short since if you just 1x leverage, you should just use spot trade so you can also avoid the huge fees.
People should also consider the fee here, since we have funding rates, either people who are shorting the market will pay those who are long or vice versa.

Oshosondy

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Quote from: JeromeTash on October 02, 2021, 02:03:17 PM

What use is it to trade future with a less than 1x leverage, lol?

On future trading, if you use 1x leverage, you can sell, which means if the price is going down, you are making profit. On spot trading, you can only buy.

palle11

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Quote from: marimanga on October 01, 2021, 12:39:23 PM

I'm new to futures trading but not in crypto.

I like to hold coins for long term but right now im interested in futures trading and there is a thing i don't understand and cannot find answer on internet (lol).

Lets say i bought long BTC/USD at $47,000 and if bitcoin goes down like at $42,000 will my open order will be canceled automatically without my permission and lose my money. I know stop limit loss but im not interested at this right now because im always behind my computer. Also... Can you hold open orders like for a year and if it goes up i take alot of profits.. My concern is only if im at loss i don't like to sell and lose but im concerned if my open order will be canceled automatically if not set up limit loss and take loss, i always wait for the price to go up at the same price i bought. English is not my first language if my question is not clear please let me know i'll try to explain below in comments. Thank you.

Hahaha this sounds a typical challenge of a newbie trader on the one side because they don't understand the real dynamics of trading. And on another aspect, it sounds like the challenge of an experienced trader who knows almost everything on trading but decides not to do what is right. Like an experienced trader who is greedy. So you what to have everything? right, no way you can have everything not even in this world. The experience of the world where you don't have everything you need should teach you that's how trade it.
You are trading with leverage and when your account is running low, you know your broker has to automatically exit you from the market so not to lose their money because leverage is as a borrowed money to trade and when you are running low of your real money, they take out your borrowed money. Use stoploss to trade, it will safe you many stress and worry in the business, you can't monitor your trade hundred percent because you don't know the next minute direction.
If you are losing so much you can stop the trade instead you lose everything. Learn to be pragmatic and professional in trading business.

JeromeTash

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Quote from: Cryptoababe on October 02, 2021, 07:33:46 AM

My advice for you is not to bother to go into futures Trading. Its very risky unless you are going to use less than 1x leverage which is also a little bit risky.

What use is it to trade future with a less than 1x leverage, lol?

Even on a 1x leverage, one's position can still be liquidated if the mark price hits the liquidation price. I would rather trade spot where I don't get to pay funding rate and getting liquidated rather than using 1x leverage.

Tytanowy Janusz

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Quote from: marimanga on October 01, 2021, 12:39:23 PM

I'm new to futures trading but not in crypto.

I like to hold coins for long term but right now im interested in futures trading and there is a thing i don't understand and cannot find answer on internet (lol).

Lets say i bought long BTC/USD at $47,000 and if bitcoin goes down like at $42,000 will my open order will be canceled automatically without my permission and lose my money. I know stop limit loss but im not interested at this right now because im always behind my computer. Also... Can you hold open orders like for a year and if it goes up i take alot of profits.. My concern is only if im at loss i don't like to sell and lose but im concerned if my open order will be canceled automatically if not set up limit loss and take loss, i always wait for the price to go up at the same price i bought. English is not my first language if my question is not clear please let me know i'll try to explain below in comments. Thank you.

Its called liquidation as previous posters said. Its caused by over leveraging. Exchange is not a charity or gambling organization. If you used 10x leverage, longed 1 BTC at 47k, used 4k as collateral means that if BTC is down to 43k you collateral is equal to 0. If exchange wont close your positions means its exposed to currency risk. Its not your risk anymore. You have 0. Its their risk now. They have to close your position. If you dont want them to sell have to always make sure that your collateral is big enough. As big as your possition if you want to be sure that you are safe even during flash crash that happends from time to time especially on illiquid exchanges.

Cryptoababe

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My advice for you is not to bother to go into futures Trading. Its very risky unless you are going to use less than 1x leverage which is also a little bit risky.

TheUltraElite

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So anyway, I applied as a merit source :)

Quote from: marimanga on October 01, 2021, 12:39:23 PM

I like to hold coins for long term but right now im interested in futures trading

That is spot trading that are talking about.

Quote

Lets say i bought long BTC/USD at $47,000 and if bitcoin goes down like at $42,000 will my open order will be canceled automatically without my permission and lose my money.

When you open a long position, it means you are buying a contract where you say that the price will be going up and the exchange accepts that keeping your money aside. If you predict it correctly on a specific time span, you will win the contract and therefore profit. But if your prediction comes out wrong, then you will lose the money or have the keep the contract open for long in which case you need to keep paying liquidation fees to avoid getting your position liquidated.

Quote

I know stop limit loss but im not interested at this right now because im always behind my computer.

Are you a zombie? Roll Eyes

Logically speaking, you should have a social life. Making money in trading is not everything. Dont know where you are coming from, but usually people develop bots to track the movements and use smartphones apps to be mobile and trade on the go.

Quote

Also... Can you hold open orders like for a year and if it goes up i take alot of profits..

One phrase : Liquidation fees. This one phrase is the thing that futures traders hate and that is what the exchange will be cutting from your side if you have to keep the position open for a longer period.

Quote

My concern is only if im at loss i don't like to sell and lose but im concerned if my open order will be canceled automatically if not set up limit loss and take loss, i always wait for the price to go up at the same price i bought.

You are confusing spot trading with margin trading. You dont sell the position in margin, you open a short/long position.

JeromeTash

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Quote from: marimanga on October 01, 2021, 12:39:23 PM

I'm new to futures trading but not in crypto.

I like to hold coins for long term but right now im interested in futures trading and there is a thing i don't understand and cannot find answer on internet (lol).

Lets say i bought long BTC/USD at $47,000 and if bitcoin goes down like at $42,000 will my open order will be canceled automatically without my permission and lose my money.

Only if you have longed (predicted that the price will rise. Depending on the leverage you used, Yes, your position would be liquidated at some point). If you shorted (predicted the price drop), You would be making profits if the price dropped.

Please be very careful with future trading. Lots of traders have lost money in there. I suggest you thoroughly learn about futures trading before using your real money in it.

Quote from: marimanga on October 01, 2021, 12:39:23 PM

I know stop limit loss but im not interested at this right now

You might want to rethink about this. Stop limit usually help prevents you from getting your whole margin getting liquidated.

Quote from: marimanga on October 01, 2021, 12:39:23 PM

Can you hold open orders like for a year and if it goes up i take alot of profits

Unlikely, since funding rate could eat up your profits

Fesatmas

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In general, the market is divided into 2, namely the spot market and the futures market.
First: the spot market which is broadly speaking, is buying low, selling high. For this point I will not explain further maybe you already know.

The second is the future market that you are questioning. So in the futures market we don't buy the crypto, but we buy the contract which requires us to predict the price will go down or up. Simply put, when what we predict is correct then we will get profit.

Furthermore, in futures trading, of course there is something called margin and leverage (Margin is how much capital we save on certain cryptocurrencies, while in leverage itself is leverage (even with small capital we will get big profits) But there is something you need to note that If you want to be safe in futures trading, it would be nice if you don't have too much leverage.

Dragonfund

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It seems you know only little about future trading, it's different from spot trading. There are things you need to understand before you open a position in futures if not, you loose your funds before you realize.
Your liquidation depends on your leverage size, if your leverage is higher, there is more likely that your trade will be force to liquidated the moment your trade didn't go as plan and that's why by default, it's always set at 10x.
Your margin is also important to note, you can either Isolated margin and cross margin, isolated will have a single balance on a just a single position while cross will be for all margin balance.

You should watch more on video tutorials and also used testnet futures for test before using real money. Check Binance futures testnet, you will be given free fund for test, not spendable, just for test and familiarity

marimanga

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I'm new to futures trading but not in crypto.

I like to hold coins for long term but right now im interested in futures trading and there is a thing i don't understand and cannot find answer on internet (lol).

Lets say i bought long BTC/USD at $47,000 and if bitcoin goes down like at $42,000 will my open order will be canceled automatically without my permission and lose my money. I know stop limit loss but im not interested at this right now because im always behind my computer. Also... Can you hold open orders like for a year and if it goes up i take alot of profits.. My concern is only if im at loss i don't like to sell and lose but im concerned if my open order will be canceled automatically if not set up limit loss and take loss, i always wait for the price to go up at the same price i bought. English is not my first language if my question is not clear please let me know i'll try to explain below in comments. Thank you.

Topic: Futures trading help (Read 233 times)