Generating Seed words | Bitcointalksearch.org

icynote_original

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Quote from: Pmalek on July 05, 2023, 01:02:38 PM

Quote from: Sidney986 on June 20, 2023, 09:46:31 AM

I did generate my seed words on a air gapped computer but did not select bip39. Why does electrum not automatically create bip39 addresses at that would have made my wallets more compatible with other hardware/software wallets should there ever be issues with electrum.

Electrum was released 2 years before the BIP39 standard, so they had their own system long before BIP39 seeds became a thing. Electrum supports importing both types, but generates only Electrum-native seeds.

Quote from: icynote_original on July 05, 2023, 12:49:45 PM

I have 12 word seed, but I forget and only remember number 1, 11 and 12. Anybody here can try recovery Seed word?

You should create a separate thread and discuss your problem. But if you only have 3 out of 12 words with no information on the missing ones, I think it's pretty much impossible to bruteforce your wallet with today's technology. Don't throw it away, though. You never know what the future might bring.

you are very wise, maybe one day, there is a way to find the latest technology and we may not have thought of.
thank you very much Wink

Pmalek

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Quote from: Sidney986 on June 20, 2023, 09:46:31 AM

I did generate my seed words on a air gapped computer but did not select bip39. Why does electrum not automatically create bip39 addresses at that would have made my wallets more compatible with other hardware/software wallets should there ever be issues with electrum.

Electrum was released 2 years before the BIP39 standard, so they had their own system long before BIP39 seeds became a thing. Electrum supports importing both types, but generates only Electrum-native seeds.

Quote from: icynote_original on July 05, 2023, 12:49:45 PM

I have 12 word seed, but I forget and only remember number 1, 11 and 12. Anybody here can try recovery Seed word?

You should create a separate thread and discuss your problem. But if you only have 3 out of 12 words with no information on the missing ones, I think it's pretty much impossible to bruteforce your wallet with today's technology. Don't throw it away, though. You never know what the future might bring.

icynote_original

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I have 12 word seed, but I forget and only remember number 1, 11 and 12. Anybody here can try recovery Seed word?
maybe, please give information about that. my wallet at Electrum too. Sad

LoyceV

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Quote from: Sidney986 on June 19, 2023, 11:56:06 AM

Just for peace of mind. I know Electrum is open source, but there have been cases of wallet software generating known seeds. I think my extended words will give peace of mind.

Unless you're using Electrum for offline cold storage, none of this matters if the software is compromised.

Quote from: Sidney986 on June 20, 2023, 09:46:31 AM

I did generate my seed words on a air gapped computer

That's only useful if you keep the wallet itself offline too.

DireWolfM14

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Quote from: hosseinimr93 on June 20, 2023, 01:55:59 PM

Quote from: Charles-Tim on June 20, 2023, 10:14:13 AM

You can make use of iancoleman offline, on the airgapped device: https://github.com/iancoleman/bip39/releases/latest/

It's not a good idea to use iancoleman to generate a seed phrase even if it used completely offline on an airgapped device.
Read gmaxwell's explanation on why you shouldn't use a tool that generates keys through javascript.

One way to generate a BIP39 seed phrase (if you don't want to use any other wallet or tool) is to generate a seed phrase in electrum and change the last word until it passes BIP39 checksum.

I agree that browser-based seed generators should be avoided if possible, but Ian Coleman's tool does allow you to enter your own entropy. For a 24-word seed, a good way to generate your own entropy is to use Linux's built in random generator, urandom.

This code will generate a 256-bit random HEX code that can be entered into the Ian Coleman tool:

Code:

cat /dev/urandom | tr -dc 'A-F0-9'  | fold -w 256 | head -n 1

hosseinimr93

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Quote from: Charles-Tim on June 20, 2023, 10:14:13 AM

You can make use of iancoleman offline, on the airgapped device: https://github.com/iancoleman/bip39/releases/latest/

It's not a good idea to use iancoleman to generate a seed phrase even if it used completely offline on an airgapped device.
Read gmaxwell's explanation on why you shouldn't use a tool that generates keys through javascript.

One way to generate a BIP39 seed phrase (if you don't want to use any other wallet or tool) is to generate a seed phrase in electrum and change the last word until it passes BIP39 checksum.

Charles-Tim

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Quote from: Sidney986 on June 20, 2023, 09:46:31 AM

I did generate my seed words on a air gapped computer but did not select bip39. Why does electrum not automatically create bip39 addresses at that would have made my wallets more compatible with other hardware/software wallets should there ever be issues with electrum.

You can make use of iancoleman offline, on the airgapped device: https://github.com/iancoleman/bip39/releases/latest/

Make use of it to generate the seed phrase and import it on Electrum if you want a BIP39 seed phrase.

hosseinimr93

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Quote from: Sidney986 on June 20, 2023, 09:46:31 AM

I did generate my seed words on a air gapped computer but did not select bip39. Why does electrum not automatically create bip39 addresses at that would have made my wallets more compatible with other hardware/software wallets should there ever be issues with electrum.

There is no way to generate a BIP39 seed phrase through electrum at all.
You can check "BIP39" option, so that you can import a BIP39 seed in electrum. There is no BIP39 option when you generate a seed phrase.

According to the message displayed on electrum when importing a BIP39 seed, electrum doesn't generate BIP39 seed phrases, because BIP39 doesn't meet their safety standards.

Sidney986

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Quote from: BitMaxz on June 19, 2023, 06:28:43 PM

[quote

So I suggest do it on the offline environment you can install Electrum to the offline device and generate a seed there(or pick your own 12 words but make sure to enable BIP39) with an extended custom word and then add a passphrase and tick encryption.

I did generate my seed words on a air gapped computer but did not select bip39. Why does electrum not automatically create bip39 addresses at that would have made my wallets more compatible with other hardware/software wallets should there ever be issues with electrum.

nc50lc

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Quote from: Sidney986 on June 19, 2023, 11:18:45 AM

Is there a guide to make my own random seed phrase that will work with electrum wallet? Roll Eyes

Did you mean, custom words in your random seed phrase, Yes?
(what's with the roll eyes tho?)

This isn't much of a guide but it's basically the only step that you need to do:

Quote from: nc50lc on March 07, 2023, 10:57:26 PM

-snip-
you can even edit the english.txt with your own set of words
and it will produce a valid seed (given that there's enough to produce a valid one).
e.g. (SegWit - Can be imported to Electrum):

Code:

banana110206 banana110312 banana021413 banana061112 banana030713 banana130608 banana020311 banana010311 banana010306 banana101112 banana020705 banana091106

The "english.txt" file or other languages are in the source (github.com/spesmilo/electrum): "electrum\electrum\wordlist"
In your own copy, delete every word in the language of your selection (your PC's language) and type your own list.
Compile it or run from source.

Electrum will use that list when creating a new seed phrase during wallet creation.

Charles-Tim

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Quote from: Sidney986 on June 19, 2023, 11:56:06 AM

Just for peace of mind. I know Electrum is open source, but there have been cases of wallet software generating known seeds. I think my extended words will give peace of mind.

If a wallet is generating a known seed, it can also generate a known passphrase. Option for passphrase may even not be there. That is why it is good to use a reputed open source wallet.

Passphrase (extended word) can help against attack, for wallet not to be compromised by an attacker.

DireWolfM14

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Quote from: Sidney986 on June 19, 2023, 11:56:06 AM

but there have been cases of wallet software generating known seeds.

Using a passphrase in addition to the seed is a great idea regardless of what I'm about to say, but I do take issue with the quoted part above. There certainly may be incidents of sub-optimal programming in some wallets doing that (though I can't recall ever hearing of it,) but with proper use of a computer's ability to generate entropy (which Electrum does,) there is an infinitesimally small chance of that happening. You have better of odds of winning the lottery every day for the rest of your life.

BitMaxz

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Quote from: Sidney986 on June 19, 2023, 11:56:06 AM

Just for peace of mind. I know Electrum is open source, but there have been cases of wallet software generating known seeds. I think my extended words will give peace of mind.

Yeah, I agree but if you generated or pick custom words on an infected and online device with your extended word there is still a possibility that someone can steal your seed and extended word.

So I suggest do it on the offline environment you can install Electrum to the offline device and generate a seed there(or pick your own 12 words but make sure to enable BIP39) with an extended custom word and then add a passphrase and tick encryption. Once it's done Electrum generates an encrypted and password-protected wallet file that you can later transfer to the online device only if you want to use it on an online device it is way more safer from keyloggers than doing it all on an online device or completely use it on an offline device and use it only for signing transaction.

hosseinimr93

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Quote from: OmegaStarScream on June 19, 2023, 11:21:50 AM

Completely custom? You can do that, but it's not recommended and Electrum won't be able to read it either.

Electrum is able to generate wallet from any random characters or words.
All you need to do is to go to "options" and check "BIP39 seed" and enter your random characters or words. Electrum will display a message saying "unknown wordlist", but it will generate a wallet.
See the following image. I entered random characters and the "next" button is clickable.

To OP:
This method is not standard and I would never recommend anyone to generate a wallet in this way.

Sidney986

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Quote from: DireWolfM14 on June 19, 2023, 11:35:09 AM

Quote from: Sidney986 on June 19, 2023, 11:18:45 AM

Is there a guide to make my own random seed phrase that will work with electrum wallet? Roll Eyes

Curious why you want to do that?

Just for peace of mind. I know Electrum is open source, but there have been cases of wallet software generating known seeds. I think my extended words will give peace of mind.

DireWolfM14

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Quote from: Sidney986 on June 19, 2023, 11:18:45 AM

Is there a guide to make my own random seed phrase that will work with electrum wallet? Roll Eyes

Curious why you want to do that? For various reasons I like using Bip39 seeds for my hot wallets, but it's not something I recommend for newer Electrum users. If you have a hardware wallet, you can use that to generate Bip39 seeds, and import those into Electrum. There are also browser-based tools that can be used to generate Bip39 seeds, like Ian Coleman's tool, but I would figure out a way to increase the entropy if you use such a method

Electrum generates it's own native 12-word seeds with 128-bit encryption, which is plenty strong. Electrum can also generate 24-word seeds by using the command line commands. Electrum's native seeds are not Bip39 compatible, but there are ways to recover those wallets with other clients, like Sparrow for example.

Without knowing why you want your own custom seed, it's hard to make recommendations.

mocacinno

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you *could* use dice rolls to generate an electrum seed... The first google result that popped up: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2akdl5/howto_use_your_own_dice_rolls_to_generate_an/

Do be carefull tough... Read the full topic, including the potential logging of the console, the odd of your dice being not perfect, the entropy discussion...
Odds are your resulting seed is (much) worse than the one generated by electrum's built in functions!

Sidney986

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Quote from: OmegaStarScream link=topic=5456884.msg6242930

l1#msg62429301 date=1687191710

Completely custom? You can but the wallet won't be able to read it.

A better approach would be to generate a seed phrase using Electrum, and then add custom words to it.

Thanks.

I already have custom words on my wallets so I guess all is good.

OmegaStarScream

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Completely custom? You can do that, but it's not recommended and Electrum won't be able to read it either.

A better approach would be to generate a seed phrase using Electrum, and then add custom words to it.

Sidney986

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Is there a guide to make my own random seed phrase that will work with electrum wallet? Roll Eyes

Topic: Generating Seed words (Read 229 times)