Gigamining math | Bitcointalksearch.org

Monster Tent

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Quote from: Bigpiggy01 on September 12, 2012, 02:13:59 AM

Some people seem to be butthurt that Gigavps is actually looking after his bond holders. Provided that he does nothing for them and ASIC becomes a reality their initial investments end up close to worthless really really quickly at 0 fault to him and in no violation whatsoever of his initial contract.

As to his overhead etc it seems reasonable to me as A he's the guy with all the fixed costs and B he's the guy actively managing and working with the whole shebang. If anyone else would like to manage, provide location etc and guarantee uptime/payouts for less than what he's charging, get to work on putting together a better deal instead of moaning.

Provided you actually have the equipment...

DonChate

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Quote from: smoothie on September 12, 2012, 01:27:01 AM

Quote from: Littleshop on September 12, 2012, 12:08:59 AM

Quote from: smoothie on September 12, 2012, 12:04:23 AM

Quote from: FreeMoney on September 11, 2012, 11:53:43 PM

Calling it a scam because you think the price set by free participants spending their own money is wrong makes no sense.

You don't like the price, you don't buy it.

I met Giga, very nice guy, solid mining plan imo, I'm confident he'll be able and willing to deliver exactly what he promises. I bought no bonds because I thought they were priced higher than they were worth, that's all there is to it.

I call it a scam because of who he is associated with and how he is associated with pirate.

Gigavps probably got other investors' coins as "interest" payments given that pirate can't seem to bring things all together if this whole "business" he was running was sound and not some scam/ponzi.

Gigavps gives pirate ridiculous OTC rating given pirate hasn't delivered jack since closing BTCST.

"0.1/459 accounts paid" as an example of how ridiculous pirate is and giga supports him.

I call bullshit. Long-term gigavps will end up scamming people himself.

I find that you start to be like the people you surround yourself with. This situation with pirate is no different.

I agree with you about the OTC rating he did sucks but still you are getting to the point of guilt by association. I see no scam here, he does have a business model and is capable of fulfilling his agreements.

Please save this post for a year from now so we can revisit it.

It hasn't been quite a year but in light of the claims issues and scammy change of contract, probably time to revisit lol.

Bigpiggy01

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Some people seem to be butthurt that Gigavps is actually looking after his bond holders. Provided that he does nothing for them and ASIC becomes a reality their initial investments end up close to worthless really really quickly at 0 fault to him and in no violation whatsoever of his initial contract.

As to his overhead etc it seems reasonable to me as A he's the guy with all the fixed costs and B he's the guy actively managing and working with the whole shebang. If anyone else would like to manage, provide location etc and guarantee uptime/payouts for less than what he's charging, get to work on putting together a better deal instead of moaning.

smoothie

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Quote from: Littleshop on September 12, 2012, 12:08:59 AM

Quote from: smoothie on September 12, 2012, 12:04:23 AM

Quote from: FreeMoney on September 11, 2012, 11:53:43 PM

Calling it a scam because you think the price set by free participants spending their own money is wrong makes no sense.

You don't like the price, you don't buy it.

I met Giga, very nice guy, solid mining plan imo, I'm confident he'll be able and willing to deliver exactly what he promises. I bought no bonds because I thought they were priced higher than they were worth, that's all there is to it.

I call it a scam because of who he is associated with and how he is associated with pirate.

Gigavps probably got other investors' coins as "interest" payments given that pirate can't seem to bring things all together if this whole "business" he was running was sound and not some scam/ponzi.

Gigavps gives pirate ridiculous OTC rating given pirate hasn't delivered jack since closing BTCST.

"0.1/459 accounts paid" as an example of how ridiculous pirate is and giga supports him.

I call bullshit. Long-term gigavps will end up scamming people himself.

I find that you start to be like the people you surround yourself with. This situation with pirate is no different.

I agree with you about the OTC rating he did sucks but still you are getting to the point of guilt by association. I see no scam here, he does have a business model and is capable of fulfilling his agreements.

Please save this post for a year from now so we can revisit it.

Littleshop

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Quote from: smoothie on September 12, 2012, 12:04:23 AM

Quote from: FreeMoney on September 11, 2012, 11:53:43 PM

Calling it a scam because you think the price set by free participants spending their own money is wrong makes no sense.

You don't like the price, you don't buy it.

I met Giga, very nice guy, solid mining plan imo, I'm confident he'll be able and willing to deliver exactly what he promises. I bought no bonds because I thought they were priced higher than they were worth, that's all there is to it.

I call it a scam because of who he is associated with and how he is associated with pirate.

Gigavps probably got other investors' coins as "interest" payments given that pirate can't seem to bring things all together if this whole "business" he was running was sound and not some scam/ponzi.

Gigavps gives pirate ridiculous OTC rating given pirate hasn't delivered jack since closing BTCST.

"0.1/459 accounts paid" as an example of how ridiculous pirate is and giga supports him.

I call bullshit. Long-term gigavps will end up scamming people himself.

I find that you start to be like the people you surround yourself with. This situation with pirate is no different.

I agree with you about the OTC rating he did sucks but still you are getting to the point of guilt by association. I see no scam here, he does have a business model and is capable of fulfilling his agreements.

smoothie

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Quote from: FreeMoney on September 11, 2012, 11:53:43 PM

Calling it a scam because you think the price set by free participants spending their own money is wrong makes no sense.

You don't like the price, you don't buy it.

I met Giga, very nice guy, solid mining plan imo, I'm confident he'll be able and willing to deliver exactly what he promises. I bought no bonds because I thought they were priced higher than they were worth, that's all there is to it.

I call it a scam because of who he is associated with and how he is associated with pirate.

Gigavps probably got other investors' coins as "interest" payments given that pirate can't seem to bring things all together if this whole "business" he was running was sound and not some scam/ponzi.

Gigavps gives pirate ridiculous OTC rating given pirate hasn't delivered jack since closing BTCST.

"0.1/459 accounts paid" as an example of how ridiculous pirate is and giga supports him.

I call bullshit. Long-term gigavps will end up scamming people himself.

I find that you start to be like the people you surround yourself with. This situation with pirate is no different.

FreeMoney

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Strength in numbers

Calling it a scam because you think the price set by free participants spending their own money is wrong makes no sense.

You don't like the price, you don't buy it.

I met Giga, very nice guy, solid mining plan imo, I'm confident he'll be able and willing to deliver exactly what he promises. I bought no bonds because I thought they were priced higher than they were worth, that's all there is to it.

Littleshop

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I have no skin in this game, no business with gigavps. This is NOT a scam. Recommend that this get moved to service discussion.

smoothie

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Quote from: drakahn on September 11, 2012, 11:34:01 PM

Quote from: smoothie on September 11, 2012, 11:27:08 PM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: smoothie on September 11, 2012, 07:24:54 PM

You know what I find funny is that initially I wasn't addressing you.

Care to explain why you have anything to do with what I'm saying to Gigavps?

1) Because you don't know how to PM if you want to have a private conversation?

2) Since you were making some accusations that demonstrated that you had some knowledge of gigavps's BST earnings, the community would surely benefit from you continuing your research and posting the results.

1. I dont have to PM if I want to make an assertion. I will speak my mind and call it as I see it. Cry more.

2. What are you defending him? You in bed with him too?

Smoothie is trying to call out scam as often as possible, so when he tries to run his own scam he can say "With all the scams I called out of course I am trustworthy"

Thing is, I don't think he has ever brought any evidence at all to the table...

lol........who have i scammed lol....and what business/scam am i working on? hint: nothing

drakahn

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Quote from: smoothie on September 11, 2012, 11:27:08 PM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: smoothie on September 11, 2012, 07:24:54 PM

You know what I find funny is that initially I wasn't addressing you.

Care to explain why you have anything to do with what I'm saying to Gigavps?

1) Because you don't know how to PM if you want to have a private conversation?

2) Since you were making some accusations that demonstrated that you had some knowledge of gigavps's BST earnings, the community would surely benefit from you continuing your research and posting the results.

1. I dont have to PM if I want to make an assertion. I will speak my mind and call it as I see it. Cry more.

2. What are you defending him? You in bed with him too?

Smoothie is trying to call out scam as often as possible, so when he tries to run his own scam he can say "With all the scams I called out of course I am trustworthy"

Thing is, I don't think he has ever brought any evidence at all to the table...

smoothie

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: smoothie on September 11, 2012, 07:24:54 PM

You know what I find funny is that initially I wasn't addressing you.

Care to explain why you have anything to do with what I'm saying to Gigavps?

1) Because you don't know how to PM if you want to have a private conversation?

2) Since you were making some accusations that demonstrated that you had some knowledge of gigavps's BST earnings, the community would surely benefit from you continuing your research and posting the results.

1. I dont have to PM if I want to make an assertion. I will speak my mind and call it as I see it. Cry more.

2. What are you defending him? You in bed with him too?

smoothie

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: smoothie on September 11, 2012, 04:14:54 PM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: smoothie on September 11, 2012, 11:54:08 AM

No one should trust your ass. You are one of the closest people to pirate. Scam scam....you've profited the most from pirate's scam.

Sounds easy enough to prove with blockchain analysis. I'd be interested in seeing if this claim has merit.

I don't have to prove a damn thing.

He is practically in bed with PussyAt40.

He was one of the first participants in BTCST. Hence he made the most. I don't need to do block chain analysis to prove that. Just look at the forum postings back in November and December of 2011. Cheesy

Pffft blockchain analysis...

Did he withdraw? Did he actually put much in? If he was one of the first participants, based on imsaguy's statement and other explanations, he could have put in just a little bit, and maybe he rolled it over.

The blockchain would show the balance of payments. The facts, instead of creative invention, could be used to tie his balls to a tree. Full of fire ants.

Why are you so adversarial? Do a little work and you'll be a hero for uncovering another scammer.

You know what I find funny is that initially I wasn't addressing you.

Care to explain why you have anything to do with what I'm saying to Gigavps?

lol Cheesy

smoothie

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: smoothie on September 11, 2012, 11:54:08 AM

No one should trust your ass. You are one of the closest people to pirate. Scam scam....you've profited the most from pirate's scam.

Sounds easy enough to prove with blockchain analysis. I'd be interested in seeing if this claim has merit.

I don't have to prove a damn thing.

He is practically in bed with PussyAt40.

He was one of the first participants in BTCST. Hence he made the most. I don't need to do block chain analysis to prove that. Just look at the forum postings back in November and December of 2011. Cheesy

Pffft blockchain analysis...

jamesg

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AKA: gigavps

Quote from: conspirosphere.tk on September 11, 2012, 12:34:42 PM

Hi, in my view the point of accusations is to give a right of reply and defense to the accused, so that everyone can figure out their conclusions. That's why I reposted that message.

Thanks for clarifying consirosphere.tk.

Quote from: conspirosphere.tk on September 11, 2012, 12:34:42 PM

I am not so math inclined to perform my indipendent analysis, but those number I posted seems to me far excessive, even taking in account costs and risk. But I could be wrong, so I encourage you to post your numbers to contradict them.

I will make another post in the Gigamining thread with the appropriate risks and costs over the next 48 months.

Quote from: conspirosphere.tk on September 11, 2012, 12:34:42 PM

P.S. I invested the most of my BTC in Gigamining and other mining bonds (most of which already lost about 70% of their value since I invested, and are following a declining slope in dividends), so my only motivation is to try to not be scammed too much.

I am sorry to hear that. Both the free market setting the price of the bond and the difficulty changes are completely out of my control and am sure you realize this.

conspirosphere.tk

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Quote from: jamesg on September 11, 2012, 11:50:29 AM

Hi conspirosphere.tk,

I take this kind of accusation seriously.

Hi, in my view the point of accusations is to give a right of reply and defense to the accused, so that everyone can figure out their conclusions. That's why I reposted that message.

I am not so math inclined to perform my indipendent analysis, but those number I posted seems to me far excessive, even taking in account costs and risk. But I could be wrong, so I encourage you to post your numbers to contradict them.

P.S. I invested the most of my BTC in Gigamining and other mining bonds (most of which already lost about 70% of their value since I invested, and are following a declining slope in dividends), so my only motivation is to try to not be scammed too much.

dishwara

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Quote from: Puppet on September 11, 2012, 11:58:20 AM

Quote from: EskimoBob on September 11, 2012, 09:06:28 AM

so he thinks he is actually giving "bond" holders a present.

Truth is, he is giving them a present. Its a dead mouse, but its still a free dead mouse and he didnt have to give it. The ripoff already happened a long time ago when his investors were stupid enough pay 1.5BTC for those bonds (and still gullible today to hold them at current value).

So gigavps, starting another scam, by asking bond holders to pay 0.3 BTC per share to upgrade to TERAMINING?

Puppet

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Quote from: EskimoBob on September 11, 2012, 09:06:28 AM

so he thinks he is actually giving "bond" holders a present.

Truth is, he is giving them a present. Its a dead mouse, but its still a free dead mouse and he didnt have to give it. The ripoff already happened a long time ago when his investors were stupid enough pay 1.5BTC for those bonds (and still gullible today to hold them at current value).

smoothie

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Quote from: jamesg on September 11, 2012, 11:50:29 AM

Hi conspirosphere.tk,

I take this kind of accusation seriously. I have been running Gigamining for almost half a year and have met the contract 100% and have never deviated from it.

I have taken on more risks that anyone can imagine and things have not always gone my way, yet, you do not see me complaining. I believe those risks must be covered yet your accusation suggests that I have almost no risk and that my profit margins are too much.

On top of that, you are quoting someone else's analysis instead of doing your own or even asking any questions.

I would not have suggested these changes unless I felt it absolutely necessary.

Best,
gigavps

No one should trust your ass. You are one of the closest people to pirate. Scam scam....you've profited the most from pirate's scam.

jamesg

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AKA: gigavps

Hi conspirosphere.tk,

I take this kind of accusation seriously. I have been running Gigamining for almost half a year and have met the contract 100% and have never deviated from it.

I have taken on more risks that anyone can imagine and things have not always gone my way, yet, you do not see me complaining. I believe those risks must be covered yet your accusation suggests that I have almost no risk and that my profit margins are too much.

On top of that, you are quoting someone else's analysis instead of doing your own or even asking any questions.

I would not have suggested these changes unless I felt it absolutely necessary.

Best,
gigavps

EskimoBob

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Quote from: jamesg on September 11, 2012, 09:51:29 AM

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1181304

You show those numbers to equity owners, not debt holders. Got it?

jamesg

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AKA: gigavps

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1181304

EskimoBob

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Quote from: conspirosphere.tk on September 11, 2012, 05:23:55 AM

There is a threshold beyond which high profits become a scam. It seems this apply to the following math:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1178669

Quote from: Namworld on September 10, 2012, 03:54:04 PM

Quote from: jamesg on September 10, 2012, 03:34:34 PM

Quote from: Namworld on September 10, 2012, 02:50:22 PM

Can you give any explanation as to what your actual cut is in this, and why it seems you're taking a seemingly insane cut, barring there has been some major issues along the way you forgot to tell us?

I'm an running this bond to make money. I'm not sure where you got the idea that this was a charitable venture. Every bond sale thus far has netted 100% initial capital outlays. I would expect nothing less from the release of the Teramining bond otherwise there is no reason to do it.

I'm not saying I think you're not running this for profit. I'm saying that with 1.5 free terahash by trading your 3 current minirig for half a free ASIC each, and if selling your GPU rig would fetch you for about an extra half the price of an ASIC rig (already paid by investors), you only need another 2 terahash (2 rigs equivalent) to fund the remaining of the TERAMINING hashing at 100 mhash per share.

Or ~5500 BTC (2750 BTC / ASIC rig)

You're asking for about 40000 x (0.30 - 0.40) = 12 000 to 16 000 BTC. A 54% to 65% cut for you. And the new 90% PPS proposed would take 10% more of what's left (about 4% - 5% more). 60 - 70% cut total.

It just seems like the upgrade is actually charging us the full price of the ASICs + cut, completely ignoring the fact the FPGA rigs/GPU were paid for (40 000 BTC I believe?) by the investors on the initial IPO and can partially pay/be traded for the ASICs.

Your cut is seemingly more than twice to quintuple the cut others take, hence why I'd like to know the actual numbers on your side and your actual cut.

I ended up with a similar results right here:

Quote from: EskimoBob on July 09, 2012, 06:39:21 AM

This is one ugly rip-off but as you can see from the following posts, bond is not a equity blaa blaa blaa so he thinks he is actually giving "bond" holders a present.

conspirosphere.tk

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There is a threshold beyond which high profits become a scam. It seems this apply to the following math:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1178669

Quote from: Namworld on September 10, 2012, 03:54:04 PM

Quote from: jamesg on September 10, 2012, 03:34:34 PM

Quote from: Namworld on September 10, 2012, 02:50:22 PM

Can you give any explanation as to what your actual cut is in this, and why it seems you're taking a seemingly insane cut, barring there has been some major issues along the way you forgot to tell us?

I'm an running this bond to make money. I'm not sure where you got the idea that this was a charitable venture. Every bond sale thus far has netted 100% initial capital outlays. I would expect nothing less from the release of the Teramining bond otherwise there is no reason to do it.

I'm not saying I think you're not running this for profit. I'm saying that with 1.5 free terahash by trading your 3 current minirig for half a free ASIC each, and if selling your GPU rig would fetch you for about an extra half the price of an ASIC rig (already paid by investors), you only need another 2 terahash (2 rigs equivalent) to fund the remaining of the TERAMINING hashing at 100 mhash per share.

Or ~5500 BTC (2750 BTC / ASIC rig)

You're asking for about 40000 x (0.30 - 0.40) = 12 000 to 16 000 BTC. A 54% to 65% cut for you. And the new 90% PPS proposed would take 10% more of what's left (about 4% - 5% more). 60 - 70% cut total.

It just seems like the upgrade is actually charging us the full price of the ASICs + cut, completely ignoring the fact the FPGA rigs/GPU were paid for (40 000 BTC I believe?) by the investors on the initial IPO and can partially pay/be traded for the ASICs.

Your cut is seemingly more than twice to quintuple the cut others take, hence why I'd like to know the actual numbers on your side and your actual cut.

Topic: Gigamining math (Read 3179 times)