Government Taxing Bitcoin? Here's the Answer

ice098

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Quote from: Latviand on April 22, 2020, 12:08:29 AM

We have nothing to do with the government getting taxes with our bitcoin because in the first place, we should be thankful that they legalize cryptocurrency in a country and not all countries in the world have courage to make it possible. Some countries are still not implementing cryptocurrency that's why they don't understand how it works.

The only problem here is that the fees or taxes are far too high, but what can we do if that's the government's way to benefit to our bitcoin. We just need to accept the fact that the fees in the exchange are really high than having a government that is against to bitcoin. There purpose is for its people's sake and not for the corrupt politicians.

We do really have a fees in more aspects not only in exchange, taxes are necessary so that the government have funds and budget for their project and all of us will surely benefit to that.

Currently I lived in a country where bitcoin wasn't legally adopted nor announced as illegal and prohibiting its people to used or invest it. But if one of the reason why our government will goind to adopt bitcoin is because they wanted to serve a tax to any transactions or even in exchange then I guess there is nothing I can do than to comply of what was been set as regulation or law. Though, i hate the fact that our government will going to have a tax in bitcoin if ever because the tax percentage here in our country was high.

ropyu1978

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That is what the government continues to do and strive for by the government, the government always says bitcoin is a scam, bitcoin is damaging to the environment, bitcoin can destroy the economy, it's just their intellect to say all that ... because they have only one goal, the government just wants to tax us.
Bitcoin users, because they have seen bitcoin generate thousands of dollars, without paying any taxes ...

rodskee

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Quote from: chip1994 on April 22, 2020, 12:22:18 AM

Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

The fee for us to execute orders is the exchange's profit, then they pay taxes and that doesn't include our taxes. If true, the government's tax system will look at your account monthly to know your income and thereby collect your taxes accordingly. But now the governments don't seem to have a suitable tax policy yet because traders still trade in the black market quite a lot and can't control it. That's why many governments do not let people operate in the crypto market.

Yeah thats why the exchange must be legit and allowed by the government so
we are sure that safe is where our currency drives.
the Taxes paid by the exchange is where we are contributing the payment
but i think this must be extended so the government will
Not seek more for the crypto users.
there so maybe the system will respect our Needs in privacy and may also supports us in future .

chip1994

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

The fee for us to execute orders is the exchange's profit, then they pay taxes and that doesn't include our taxes. If true, the government's tax system will look at your account monthly to know your income and thereby collect your taxes accordingly. But now the governments don't seem to have a suitable tax policy yet because traders still trade in the black market quite a lot and can't control it. That's why many governments do not let people operate in the crypto market.

Latviand

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Quote from: Lucius on December 27, 2019, 08:45:13 AM

Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

~snip~

Different countries, different rules when it comes to paying taxes. But it is also important to emphasize that paying taxes is a completely normal thing, especially if the tax money goes to the right purposes (public schools, kindergartens, hospitals, courts, etc.), and something else if it goes into the pockets of corrupt politicians and ordinary people only gets crumbs.

Your idea that crypto exchanges collect tax would be good for users, but the whole thing doesn't work that way. Governments want the tax to be reported and paid directly to them, not through some intermediaries like exchanges. The problem is in fact that taxes are too high when we consider the total amount we need to pay.

If we take the example that the capital gain tax rate is 20%, and you pay that every year it is maybe within some normal limits. But if you have VAT on every purchase which is again 20% or more you pay extra tax again on fiat you get from selling crypto. Although there are ways to avoid paying taxes when it comes to cryptocurrency, any trader on exchange which requires KYC will pay it sooner or later.

We have nothing to do with the government getting taxes with our bitcoin because in the first place, we should be thankful that they legalize cryptocurrency in a country and not all countries in the world have courage to make it possible. Some countries are still not implementing cryptocurrency that's why they don't understand how it works.

The only problem here is that the fees or taxes are far too high, but what can we do if that's the government's way to benefit to our bitcoin. We just need to accept the fact that the fees in the exchange are really high than having a government that is against to bitcoin. There purpose is for its people's sake and not for the corrupt politicians.

We do really have a fees in more aspects not only in exchange, taxes are necessary so that the government have funds and budget for their project and all of us will surely benefit to that.

Ozero

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

Most likely, this will continue to be so in the future. Local exchanges will automatically calculate the tax from each transaction and for this we will have to leave their identification data there. This procedure for paying taxes is the most logical. But if we turn to exchanges located on the territory of other states, here the process of paying taxes will already be more complicated and, most likely, the government in this case will rely on the consciousness of its citizens.

CaVO32

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Quote from: Sithara007 on January 27, 2020, 10:04:13 PM

Quote from: Debonaire217 on January 27, 2020, 08:49:17 PM

Quote from: FanatMonet on January 27, 2020, 08:41:58 PM

On the one hand, various taxes on cryptocurrencies are not very good, because this is additional pressure from the government on people.
On the other hand, if the government thinks out some kind of policy regarding cryptocurrencies, makes them a legal means of payment, then you can think about this.

I quite remember one policy that Philippines has, which is the train law, taxes increase too high and it affects mostly those that earns profit. The higher your profit, the higher your tax. If this could be applied to cryptocurrencies, investors will be discourage to increase their profit that much. Though, in the first place, there is no concrete news concerning government taxing bitcoin aside from local exchanges.

In most of the countries, those with higher earnings have to pay a higher tax slab. Here in India, the tax slabs increase progressively from 5% to 42.5%. But even after all this, less than 3% of the population pay any income tax. The farmers are exempted from income tax and in India 80% of the population claims that they are farmers.

All that said, I have to disagree when you say that higher taxes will discourage people from earning profits. Because even after all these taxes, the individual is left with a good amount for himself. The exemptions may be countries such as Germany and Sweden, where the tax rate is around 60%.

And when it comes to cryptocurrencies, right now, it is hard to apply tax on them because most governments don't know yet how to deal with crypto. What they can do, is when someone convert their crypto to fiat and send to their bank or remittance, they can already get a small portion out of it. But it should be put into law what percentage are they scrapping from this conversion. Also, only regulated local crypto exchange can be subjected into this because those 3rd party services offering conversion crypto to fiat without government license are not covered by this. So if a crypto user wants to avoid such scrapping from his crypto, he will just go to this unlicensed ones, but not safe for his funds. Anyway, right now, it is still unclear how government can impose tax to its crypto users. It should at least be transparent how are they going to implement such regulations on crypto users.

gundala

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on January 27, 2020, 08:49:17 PM

~

I quite remember one policy that Philippines has, which is the train law, taxes increase too high and it affects mostly those that earns profit. The higher your profit, the higher your tax. If this could be applied to cryptocurrencies, investors will be discourage to increase their profit that much. Though, in the first place, there is no concrete news concerning government taxing bitcoin aside from local exchanges.

That means income tax, right?
The development and popularity of cryptocurrency are widespread, many people use it and this is like a new lifestyle, a new trend in earning money, investing, and doing transactions or payments. Government policies will provide trust, the legitimacy for digital assets increases, although everything depends on the behavior of each user. I agree with this tax, a kind of symbiosis of mutualism with the government, provided that it is transparent and appropriate.

AutomaticTrade254

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Though the government wants to get tax, who earns lots of money using Cryptocurrency. But they are unable to find out the technology, how they identify the targeted member who earned the money. That's why they are failed to get tex. But I think, Then tax will be added in futures. And Each country will be developed.

Mike Mayor

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We will have private corporations taking over and each one does a share of the work. Since there is no tax to pay each business can contribute through means of shares. Instead of paying tax for nothing you will own part of what you bought shares in. So you can own part of the road if you wish and sell it to others. If a road needs to be built people will invest in it like stocks and the people building the road will be paid. Then the stockholders can do as they wish with it. They would have to maintain it as well though so there would be a certain level of regulation.

kotajikikox

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Quote from: Sithara007 on January 27, 2020, 10:04:13 PM

Quote from: Debonaire217 on January 27, 2020, 08:49:17 PM

Quote from: FanatMonet on January 27, 2020, 08:41:58 PM

On the one hand, various taxes on cryptocurrencies are not very good, because this is additional pressure from the government on people.
On the other hand, if the government thinks out some kind of policy regarding cryptocurrencies, makes them a legal means of payment, then you can think about this.

I quite remember one policy that Philippines has, which is the train law, taxes increase too high and it affects mostly those that earns profit. The higher your profit, the higher your tax. If this could be applied to cryptocurrencies, investors will be discourage to increase their profit that much. Though, in the first place, there is no concrete news concerning government taxing bitcoin aside from local exchanges.

In most of the countries, those with higher earnings have to pay a higher tax slab. Here in India, the tax slabs increase progressively from 5% to 42.5%. But even after all this, less than 3% of the population pay any income tax. The farmers are exempted from income tax and in India 80% of the population claims that they are farmers.

80% claims to be farmer but the truth is not?and why not government take their gills on this stupidity?are the government having "Red tapes" on this issues?gaining from the tax evaders?so that is the problem why taxation is not successfully taking place.

Quote from: Sithara007 on January 27, 2020, 10:04:13 PM

All that said, I have to disagree when you say that higher taxes will discourage people from earning profits. Because even after all these taxes, the individual is left with a good amount for himself. The exemptions may be countries such as Germany and Sweden, where the tax rate is around 60%.

and also that is the problem from the people that don't know what is taxation all about or theya re justy greedy to oppose?even before our grand ancestors born from the oldest people when the human starts to learn trading,Taxation is implemented already and the truth is?it is much higher in past than in our generation now.

Sithara007

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on January 27, 2020, 08:49:17 PM

Quote from: FanatMonet on January 27, 2020, 08:41:58 PM

On the one hand, various taxes on cryptocurrencies are not very good, because this is additional pressure from the government on people.
On the other hand, if the government thinks out some kind of policy regarding cryptocurrencies, makes them a legal means of payment, then you can think about this.

I quite remember one policy that Philippines has, which is the train law, taxes increase too high and it affects mostly those that earns profit. The higher your profit, the higher your tax. If this could be applied to cryptocurrencies, investors will be discourage to increase their profit that much. Though, in the first place, there is no concrete news concerning government taxing bitcoin aside from local exchanges.

In most of the countries, those with higher earnings have to pay a higher tax slab. Here in India, the tax slabs increase progressively from 5% to 42.5%. But even after all this, less than 3% of the population pay any income tax. The farmers are exempted from income tax and in India 80% of the population claims that they are farmers.

All that said, I have to disagree when you say that higher taxes will discourage people from earning profits. Because even after all these taxes, the individual is left with a good amount for himself. The exemptions may be countries such as Germany and Sweden, where the tax rate is around 60%.

Debonaire217

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Quote from: FanatMonet on January 27, 2020, 08:41:58 PM

On the one hand, various taxes on cryptocurrencies are not very good, because this is additional pressure from the government on people.
On the other hand, if the government thinks out some kind of policy regarding cryptocurrencies, makes them a legal means of payment, then you can think about this.

I quite remember one policy that Philippines has, which is the train law, taxes increase too high and it affects mostly those that earns profit. The higher your profit, the higher your tax. If this could be applied to cryptocurrencies, investors will be discourage to increase their profit that much. Though, in the first place, there is no concrete news concerning government taxing bitcoin aside from local exchanges.

FanatMonet

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On the one hand, various taxes on cryptocurrencies are not very good, because this is additional pressure from the government on people.
On the other hand, if the government thinks out some kind of policy regarding cryptocurrencies, makes them a legal means of payment, then you can think about this.

robelneo

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

I should feel guilty if that is not the case, but I just have this thinking that my local exchanger already deducted the tax that should be due to me, since they are deducting a big fee from my trade and all my other transactions I'm getting from $1 to $5 from my transactions, so I guess that is the case.

tartibaya

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States have noticed the returning money in the bitcoin economy. However, they are not equipped enough to make moves. Claiming taxes from Bitcoin can lead to major economic damage. The informal economy can be triggered.

target

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Quote from: btccashacc on January 27, 2020, 10:55:48 AM

As long as you're holding bitcoin on your wallet then it can't be taxed, here in our country if you use local exchange and do trade or withdrawal then those transactions will be taxed. But this could be different if you use outside exchange the amount of tax will be taxed based on the regulation of the country where that exchange is running. I personally don't have any issue with taxing, it's good for supporting your country.

This is also the case in my country and this is why it makes sense for IMF to ask our government a data of cryptocurrency users and I mean who else will they ask for these information. Although many of us will take it a breach of contract to us users, its going to be easy for IMF and any financial authorities to watch out for people who engage in crypto.

Its really not easy to maintain a privacy when in all of the websites you got into will ask for KYC documents. And these KYC documents will allow them to check out backgrounds and financial status.

btccashacc

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As long as you're holding bitcoin on your wallet then it can't be taxed, here in our country if you use local exchange and do trade or withdrawal then those transactions will be taxed. But this could be different if you use outside exchange the amount of tax will be taxed based on the regulation of the country where that exchange is running. I personally don't have any issue with taxing, it's good for supporting your country.

angrynerd88

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Why still government ignore the power of crypto,Most of countries like dubai,canda,ukraine already in the game of crypto and encourage the technology of blockchain.Recently Iranian authorities issued 1000 licenses for cryptocurrency mining source by cointelegraph.
Pro active approach governments realized the crypto is source can generate record revenue in form of taxes to support the stable economy.

Eclipse26

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bullsvsbears.io

It's just normal for the government to add tax in Bitcoin. We cannot escape tax because that's where the government gets money for the whole country. If adoption takes place on a country, there's higher possibility that the government will regulate and add tax with it. They can't just let us to do what we want without paying taxes. Though my country doesn't have regulations and tax yet with crypto, sooner they might add taxes.

Warkop

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Here in our country our wallet is regulated by the government in some ways so there's a fees behind that like the permit or license of our wallet but not every transaction then i think that's really a little only like very affordable so no problem at all then if your account is regulated but not good like with KYC and high fees then better to find other

If there is a wallet that is better and safeguards our identity is also good. why don't we try it. but until now we have not seen a wallet like that and the cost is very expensive not necessarily safe for us to use then. if there is a loss of who will be responsible.

sisule

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I don't worried if government taxing bitcoin but they have use tax correctly and never use by some one else to make their assets, how ever my country bad regulation of tax where many institution from tax become richest and they look take many benefit from tax, I think better transparent with our tax from bitcoin donation to some institution need help.

BlackFor3st

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Betking.io - Best Bitcoin Casino

Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

Yes local exchange is one of the factors that can be tax by government if in case fiat will be replace by crypto in the future. And I believe the government will not stop from taxing local exchange only if crypto will be the main currency as they will surely look for other way on how they can earn because one of the main source of income from the government is the tax.

If tax will be lowered then the government resources will be limited, yes we love to be exempted from tax but let's face the truth also that without tax our government will run or effective.

bangjoe

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only transaction tax and that even happens to intermediaries from local exchanges, my government has not specifically directed it there. All still needs to be researched in calculations, if crypto users in each country are no more than 3%, then income tax cannot be imposed, the most important thing is how regulation can fully function, because tax is a form of systemic recognition.

ajeef

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Quote from: Cimmy_revenger on January 27, 2020, 07:08:17 AM

Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

This kind of thing already exists in my country, who has an exchange business, both crypto and fiat, there will be taxes incurred.
service providers usually charge it to their customers.

How it could be detected when people are trade it with fiat anonymously ? i mean if we cash out not from exchange but from each person doing transaction with escrow and without any exchange services. I think people still can hide their wealth and avoiding tax as long as the coin that they trade is decentralized

Cimmy_revenger

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

This kind of thing already exists in my country, who has an exchange business, both crypto and fiat, there will be taxes incurred.
service providers usually charge it to their customers.

Wintersoldier

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Quote from: HarmonyA on January 26, 2020, 05:50:04 PM

Yea, the reason why some person want to boycott tax payments is by investing in crypto, and doing their financial transactions with crypto.
No matter how we may criticize government policies, it in someway protect us from the dark web of frauds.
In my country, when you buy are sell crypto, tax is deducted from the transaction. That's how crypto is taxed

And basically that is the way how local exchangers work, they can't actually run and be tolerated by the government if they aren't coordinating well enough, to sustain taxes. We might not know but in the world of decentralization, we think that we've successfully escape taxes but no, though, what I don't like to these system is to provide the freedom for people to avoid paying taxes that is in fact, isn't true at all. In short, we've just made our currency more secured and efficient using blockchain and cryptography.

HarmonyA

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

Yea, the reason why some person want to boycott tax payments is by investing in crypto, and doing their financial transactions with crypto.
No matter how we may criticize government policies, it in someway protect us from the dark web of frauds.
In my country, when you buy are sell crypto, tax is deducted from the transaction. That's how crypto is taxed

JeffBrad12

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Quote from: kro55 on December 31, 2019, 11:35:45 AM

Tax collection is one of the most difficult things about bitcoin and one of the core reasons why authorities are against bitcoin and other anonymous cryptocurrencies. The only way the government can keep track of crypto is through crypto exchanges and bank withdrawal. If you keep crypto in your wallet and never disclose them there is no way the government can track your crypto assets.

not really difficult considering country like korea and japan have succesfully taxing people with cryptos there and it's just a piece of cake for US. it's just the decentralized nature which is not yet understood by the people that have the authorities there that makes them misleaded into thinking that bitcoin could be used to launder money easily which is actually quite the opposite. most of people are transferring fund converted from bitcoin to bank account from exchange and the government could get information from that.

kro55

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*STOP NOWHERE*

Tax collection is one of the most difficult things about bitcoin and one of the core reasons why authorities are against bitcoin and other anonymous cryptocurrencies. The only way the government can keep track of crypto is through crypto exchanges and bank withdrawal. If you keep crypto in your wallet and never disclose them there is no way the government can track your crypto assets.

marcous

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actually for tax issues, especially in the crypto world, an exchanger is under the auspices of a company. and certainly, the company must be registered and legalized. If so, the exchanger already represents to pay taxes. while regarding personal income generated from cryptocurrency for example trading results. we can see that trading results are not always profitable, and the tax is imposed on an income that does have a fixed income every month.

oktana

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Here in our country our wallet is regulated by the government in some ways so there's a fees behind that like the permit or license of our wallet but not every transaction then i think that's really a little only like very affordable so no problem at all then if your account is regulated but not good like with KYC and high fees then better to find other

which country has succeeded in such a complicated regulation?

I think you are talking about the exchange market, not the crypto wallet in person. There is one provision where taxes are also reported manually, cannot be accessed by the government transparently, if it is true it will be far more terrible than the tax provisions for citizens who use fiat.

darkangel11

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Quote from: rekinthis on December 30, 2019, 06:25:02 PM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Here in our country our wallet is regulated by the government in some ways so there's a fees behind that like the permit or license of our wallet but not every transaction then i think that's really a little only like very affordable so no problem at all then if your account is regulated but not good like with KYC and high fees then better to find other

wait what? your country government has actually a way to monitor all of your bitcoin transactions? How is that done and which country do you live in? In my opinion, it's a crime to do such things by the government because every person should have the right to privacy. It is crazy how governments themselves do not respect the peoples rights.

Privacy is long gone. Please read about Huawei, Google home and many other private companies that were gathering private data and listening to you through their devices. What about that spyware that allows the government to turn on the camera in your phone and record you? It's very much a real thing. There's no privacy and what is legal is decided by the lawmakers and lawmakers listen to the government.

The idea won't work because of how much some governments want you to pay. If the tax was 5% all around the world than maybe but 20-30% is too much to add it as a permanent tax to every transaction. Nobody would use such cryptocurrency.

rekinthis

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Here in our country our wallet is regulated by the government in some ways so there's a fees behind that like the permit or license of our wallet but not every transaction then i think that's really a little only like very affordable so no problem at all then if your account is regulated but not good like with KYC and high fees then better to find other

wait what? your country government has actually a way to monitor all of your bitcoin transactions? How is that done and which country do you live in? In my opinion, it's a crime to do such things by the government because every person should have the right to privacy. It is crazy how governments themselves do not respect the peoples rights.

johant123

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Here crypto currencies are definitely taxed. The exchange I am using even sends you a yearly report of your assets, to use for your tax filings. And if they can send it to you, they can also give it to the tax authorities on request.

I don't know about all EU countries, but it looks to me like they are accepting crypto currency, and taxing them as they do other assets (like gold, or stocks).

carlzec

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States would not demand tax on bitcoin. They officially declare the existence of Bitcoin if they require a tax on profits from Bitcoin. In this case, the number of businesses that accept bitcoin increases. And people start trading in bitcoin province. These are my ideas.

airdnasxela

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All of us are responsible for paying taxes. And we'll only pay tax of cryptocurrency becomes officially legal in your country. As for my country, it's not yet legal that's why there's still no specific law about tax. Your idea is nice, the government just need to legalized it so they can implement taxation. But you know, people who have more income are more afraid of taxes, they'll make way just to lessen tax they would pay. This is also possible in crypto, if implemented.

Gotumoot

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Actually here in my country not paying tax for bitcoin holding is crime and you will give penalty for not paying tax and the worst is to be jailed. But Goverment here in my country don't have enough knowledge on how they can implement tax from us especially they don't know how to track me or my other friends.

aomakun

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Quote from: crzy on December 30, 2019, 05:35:51 AM

If there’s no law about this one then government can’t collect taxes, regulation should be made first and if those exchanges really want a good business then they should follow the law. Tax is a must in my country, its sad that even big people are not paying the right taxes, the law should be implemented well and everyone should require to pay whether you’re rich or not.

tax becomes one of the state's revenues to develop their country, and I think if the state does tax collection then they make a new regulation and in this context we must first look at the legality of crypto. You are right because without legality the state cannot take taxes on crypto users, except the company tax.

bettercrypto

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

Deregulation sometimes is a bane. In terms of economic growth, taxes are the most helpful way to fund the government. To maintain and stabilize the countries uncountable needs, taxes is really needed. But due to the graft and corruption, the treasury fund will always be corrupted by politicians. They used it to buy their own things instead of funding a project that helps to boost the industry. And crypto is an answer to that question. We don't need to eliminate tax, we need transparency.

Reid

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Yes, that is the answer.
We keep our privacy and then the local exchange will provide for the government to keep on making money for the improvement of infrastructures and anything that is paid by the people taxes.

That is, if the local exchange will be faithful with it.
Now, it is still a risk they should be willing to take.
Bitcoin moves like crazy in price and when people keep on withdrawing funds they might also get bankrupt by it.
Needs a lot of support also from the government for their service to be used.

crzy

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If there’s no law about this one then government can’t collect taxes, regulation should be made first and if those exchanges really want a good business then they should follow the law. Tax is a must in my country, its sad that even big people are not paying the right taxes, the law should be implemented well and everyone should require to pay whether you’re rich or not.

buwaytress

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Quote from: kryptqnick on December 29, 2019, 03:11:38 PM

I think that it's justified to treat cryptos for tax purposes the way fiat currencies are treated. Normally it means only income tax. In my country the legislation is tricky with two different ways and amounts to pay depending on the type of business. Anyway, there are countries with reasonable progressive tax system which even allows people with very small income not to pay anything.
There are also small states which are tax-free, and some zones for crypto businesses that allow not to pay taxes or not to pay a lot for a while.
The exchange idea is also nice. It's kind of like we all pay VAT which is embedded into the prices of goods. Easy and useful.

I'll never understand why people are so against giving what's due. I do agree and get in that tax in my home country is annoyingly unfair, since a lot of it ends up in corrupt hands. But it doesn't prevent me from paying my dues. You want to live in a country, enjoy the privileges and rights, and expect reasonable public services and amenities, then you have to do your part and support it.

I do like the idea of VAT too. Everything priced in. People in my country are all angry about it but come on, suck it up and pay for it. Or go find a tax free country. Or live off grid.

samcrypto

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

That can be more possible to collect taxes from a crypto users and government really need to regulate exchanges not just for taxes but also for the protection of every users. I’m ok with taxes, I’m ok for its purpose but I don’t fully support the corrupt politicians and government. Cryptocurrency can be better, it should be supported by every government and their people will be more active financially.

killerfrost

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I don't understand why governments in the world want to tax this market, this is a decentralized market so no one will be able to manage and control all the transactions and actions of the investor. Up to now, I have not seen a country that has been successful in taxing investors. Korea and Japan have investor tax policies but it is not really thorough, there are still holes

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Quote from: meanwords on December 29, 2019, 09:35:28 PM

You didn't solve the government's taxation, you only made it simple! because as long as there's a centralized third party that is handling the information of the user and the connected wallet to him/her, then the government can do whatever they want.

In my opinion, the only way to avoid taxation is to use decentralized third parties like exchanges. That way, they can't track your earning as long as you don't report it.

But i don’t think we really need to avoid taxation? This is what i am asking for long time since we are profiting from this market,what is the main reason why people that getting money from something is wanting to be free from taxes?

And besides this is the only way for crypto to finally hit the top,but first we must be aware of the coming KYC if this taxing implemented .

Shasha80

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This is the reason why some countries do not legalize bitcoin, but also do not prohibit its citizens from using bitcoin. Because
The government of that country already gets tax from local exchanges, so it's not surprising that almost all local exchanges
require users so to do KYC. So the government can get tax from every user to withdraw bitcoin to the bank to convert be fiat.
Because for countries that have not legalized bitcoin, it is still forbidden to use bitcoin as a payment. So from that for its citizens
inevitably have to convert bitcoin that is owned into fiat, then inevitably also users of bitcoin have to pay tax.

Ozero

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Quote from: gweedo on December 29, 2019, 11:53:39 PM

Quote from: michellee on December 28, 2019, 06:40:30 AM

To be honest, I don't know how the government applies tax for bitcoin, but I am sure that they can do that because they will know people who already use crypto by checking on the bank account. They will search for the account who made a big transaction in a month, and I think they will try to ask that people about the money they sent. But maybe that will be related to the KYC that every exchange did for their members so the government can check one by one of the members so they can get the name of the people.

It's hard to know who uses cryptocurrency through checking bank accounts. I think the best idea is that they will create an exchange in their country and ask people to use it, then they can easily track and tax it as accurately as possible. But honestly no one can tax this market, it's really hard

The state can create local cryptocurrency exchanges. However, the terms of trade on them must be acceptable. Then people will be happy to use local exchanges. However, the government is unlikely to be able to exchange all types of existing cryptocurrencies. Now even the largest exchanges can not afford it. Therefore, at present, this idea is unlikely to work. Maybe in the future, exchanges will be able to automatically work with all types of cryptocurrencies. After all, the current exchange system for trading cryptocurrency, in my opinion, is very imperfect.

bitvalak

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There are already several countries that have local exchanges.
This should not be a problem because the owner of the exchange must have paid taxes on the exchange business.
Because every country must provide tax for those who have a business license.

gweedo

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Quote from: michellee on December 28, 2019, 06:40:30 AM

To be honest, I don't know how the government applies tax for bitcoin, but I am sure that they can do that because they will know people who already use crypto by checking on the bank account. They will search for the account who made a big transaction in a month, and I think they will try to ask that people about the money they sent. But maybe that will be related to the KYC that every exchange did for their members so the government can check one by one of the members so they can get the name of the people.

It's hard to know who uses cryptocurrency through checking bank accounts. I think the best idea is that they will create an exchange in their country and ask people to use it, then they can easily track and tax it as accurately as possible. But honestly no one can tax this market, it's really hard

Amel

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Your idea is very good but in my opinion it is very unresponsive to every tax need. In fact, we not only pay taxes when sending goods or make transactions at banks but there are many types of taxes that need to be paid such as house tax, vehicle tax, etc. And it cannot be adjusted to a local exchange when transacting.

On the other hand, it means that we must always pay taxes when making exchanges or trading, of course it will be expensive especially if added to the fee.

AjithBtc

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Quote from: Murat on December 29, 2019, 10:49:43 PM

There is a lot of ways of imposing a tax for the government's rising fund which is used for the expenditure for maintaining a state properly, I think only BTC is not their headache, Another thing is that, If Bitcoin would be included in the tax system then what is the problem, I don't see any problem at all, We are giving Foreign exchange when we convert BTC into USD and Covert into local fiat, so we have already given to them, so there should be a proper system which only once imposes tax for using BTC or Cryptocurrency, I think it's not a difficult thing anymore.

Every government tax based on the holdings we've got. This can be property, assets, shares, stocks and other valuables (Gold, bonds, policies). Here Governments find it easy to have every information added to their database as everything is centralized and subject to provide information to the government. With bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies information on holdings of people can't be found exactly until the person himself discloses. This way taxing of bitcoin isn't easy.

iram3130

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That is one of the major reasons for governments to not make crypto a legal tender. They think people will find ways to not pay taxes and there are people who do this. I just pay the tax according to what I have withdrawn or sold crypto for my local currency and thats how it should be.

Murat

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There is a lot of ways of imposing a tax for the government's rising fund which is used for the expenditure for maintaining a state properly, I think only BTC is not their headache, Another thing is that, If Bitcoin would be included in the tax system then what is the problem, I don't see any problem at all, We are giving Foreign exchange when we convert BTC into USD and Covert into local fiat, so we have already given to them, so there should be a proper system which only once imposes tax for using BTC or Cryptocurrency, I think it's not a difficult thing anymore.

bounceback

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the government in my country has made it clear that users of cryptocurrency or bitcoin are required to report ownership or profits we get through bitcoin investments, so they will collect annual tax on us, but they do not take tax specifically into our bitcoin ownership but rather from revenue between selling prices and the purchase price which is the object of taxation.

meanwords

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You didn't solve the government's taxation, you only made it simple! because as long as there's a centralized third party that is handling the information of the user and the connected wallet to him/her, then the government can do whatever they want.

In my opinion, the only way to avoid taxation is to use decentralized third parties like exchanges. That way, they can't track your earning as long as you don't report it.

KawBet

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In reality this is not possible unless you store your wallet in a thirdparty wallet.

diahsw

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I judge, from what you write, you conclude that taxes are allowed, to guarantee the sustainability of a development, but in my opinion, there are other things besides taxes, because the true tax is made so that we together feel the results ... !!

Gyfts

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Having decentralization means that taxation of funds is going to be an issue, probably why many governments have implemented hard regulations on Bitcoin. Back in the bitcoin boom in 2017, you were expected to pay capital gains taxes in the US similar to as if you had invested in a stock so it's not like the IRS has forgotten about crypto investors. The way I see it, governments are going to crackdown on tax evasion through crypto currencies if it becomes a big enough issue to the point that people are converting fiat into crypto for the sake of tax evasion. Clearly, bitcoin isn't mainstream enough to warrant any extreme measures but don't have any fear, if Uncle Sam is missing share of cash he'll go hunting for it.

Rengga Jati

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Taxes for Bitcoin or other cryptocurrencies have become issues in some countries. This also happens in my country after there is legal protection for all digital assets, including cryptocurrencies. However, the tax for BTC is not implemented yet. This is still within the framework of the formulation and consideration.

There are always pros and cons toward the taxing for BTC if it will be implemented. If the government really want to tax the BTC, they must have the crucial reasons and must be fair for all people who have the BTC. Additionally, the regulation as the basis of the tax-decision must be clear enough, not only getting tax for the country but also considering whether the BTC holder does not mind about the amount of the tax. IN my opinion why there are still many countries that do not tax BTC is that it is quite difficult to make the mechanism, issues, and also consideration.

But, if the rule is like what OP said:

Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchanges could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

I rather agree with this. It may be fair enough for all. But of course, consider the amount, for a fair decision.

luppecuppe

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It makes sense to think about taxes all the time. Did you earn enough money to get into trouble with taxes from this market? States are still insensitive to these markets. They ignore this market. I don't think it's important. In order to get tax from Bitcoin, it is necessary to declare it legal.

hatshepsut93

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

Same way as with cash - punish people for evading taxes, or introduce VAT that makes merchants direct targets of taxation. Bitcoin right now is less private then cash, so it would be quite hard to use it for tax evasion. Crypto isn't inherently anti-tax, it's anti-middlemen in payments and that's all, it's up to users to decide how they want to use crypto - follow the laws and regulations or not.

Findingnemo

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

For using currencies we no need to pay taxes, only if we earned more money than the limits we should pay the taxes to the government.

If bitcoin or any other decentralized cryptos used worldwide the transactions may not be recorded by banks or governments but each spending on that crypto will be recorded by somewhere so it's just same as the fiat money but without any centralized authority to increase the total supply which is happening with fiat.

You are proposing tax should be paid for every conversion, by these only governments own all the bitcoins after some time.

kryptqnick

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

I think that it's justified to treat cryptos for tax purposes the way fiat currencies are treated. Normally it means only income tax. In my country the legislation is tricky with two different ways and amounts to pay depending on the type of business. Anyway, there are countries with reasonable progressive tax system which even allows people with very small income not to pay anything.
There are also small states which are tax-free, and some zones for crypto businesses that allow not to pay taxes or not to pay a lot for a while.
The exchange idea is also nice. It's kind of like we all pay VAT which is embedded into the prices of goods. Easy and useful.

Blackdeath

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

I think in my country, the government is already using and putting taxes whenever i am withdrawing my crypto in banks and legal remittances or converting my crypto into fiat by adding fees, so crypto do really support tax when i used legal remittances and even i convert all of my fiats into crypto i still need to use legal remittances just to convert them.

isaac_clarke22

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Government could tax cryptos when it has an affiliation with any regulated or legal remittance centers in their country especially when we're gonna talk about converting BTC to fiat currency. I experienced those taxes and good thing it isn't recognized as like an "income" but rather an alternative currency.

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

I think it would be utterly ridiculous to convert all of ones money into cryptocurrencies, unless one wanted to loss the shirt off of his/her back and then some.
Cryptocurrency is way too volatile to dump an entire Bank account into it. Are cryptocurrencies the future, almost certainly, whether or not Bitcoin will still be around is highly debatable, but Fiat really isn't going anywhere anytime soon, you can count on that.
Maybe within the future once regulations and policies are much clearer for everyone involved, but to each his/her own! Fiat is way too easy to use whether physically or digitally, try explaining Bitcoin and Blockchain technology to my grandparents, they'll laugh at you then ask you does your president or local Congressmen support it? If not, it's probably a no go!

Youghoor

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

Considering the entire nature of the bitcoin ecosystem and the entire crypto space, its quite easier to set up a system that can help the government obtain taxes from people using cryptocurrencies for their transactions made of the blockchain network. Instead of the government accepting the use of cryptocurrencies, they can easily understand how to set up systems in place to actually tax people using cryptocurrencies in their transactions.

White Christmas

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Quote from: michellee on December 28, 2019, 06:40:30 AM

To be honest, I don't know how the government applies tax for bitcoin, but I am sure that they can do that because they will know people who already use crypto by checking on the bank account. They will search for the account who made a big transaction in a month, and I think they will try to ask that people about the money they sent. But maybe that will be related to the KYC that every exchange did for their members so the government can check one by one of the members so they can get the name of the people.

I don't think so that the government knows those person who are into the cryptocurrency by just having a large or huge transaction meaning that they are already making funds through the use of Cryptocurrency? It's a big No in which there so many people can have many transactions because of business and etc. I think the tax that are getting for those people who are into cryptocurrency is already built in the exchangers or the banks just for example if you are withdrawing your money from the banks, there also a lessen on your money because tax has been applied into it. But personally it really hard to know if how did the government are taxing bitcoin.

michellee

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To be honest, I don't know how the government applies tax for bitcoin, but I am sure that they can do that because they will know people who already use crypto by checking on the bank account. They will search for the account who made a big transaction in a month, and I think they will try to ask that people about the money they sent. But maybe that will be related to the KYC that every exchange did for their members so the government can check one by one of the members so they can get the name of the people.

peter0425

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what i believe is that is why KYC is implemented in some exchange is to take taxes from users of crypto.and also that is why the fee is too high when converting crypto to fiat because part of that will be for Central bank.

Quote from: ChrisPop on December 27, 2019, 09:14:54 AM

I don't see why would be an impediment for Governments to collect taxes. Companies will still have to invoice people and make filling within the tax authorities. People will have to pay taxes on wages if they have a contract no matter what currency they are payed in. However I think that should happen only once BTC gets adopted on a much larger scale. Nowadays you can't use Bitcoin at many things unless you convert it to fiat.

don't forget mate that many of us now are making money here in crypto and we are not employee to taxed by our company,so this is why we need to have taxes everytime we need to convert our crypto to fiat.

crossabdd

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one day there will definitely be a solution, right now the best solution is still using a central bank. by converting crypto to fiat. so that it can be taxed. dichina has prepared crypto currencies made by the government. so this is another option for taxation. I think if the country still uses decentralized cryptocurrency. it will be difficult to make taxes on users. in my country personally, there are no taxes for crypto holders.

Divinespark

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Once you use cryptocurrency, you don't need to care about taxes. Because no government in the world will be able to track and tax, and that is also the reason why many governments around the world are worried about the development of cryptocurrency. It is not easy to follow this market and apply taxes to it. Therefore most countries have banned cryptocurrencies

longyenthanh

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In my view crypto is never meant for things like tax collection. how can government tax an asset that cant be monitored or controlled by any single authority? There is only one way to tax bitcoin and that is by bringing regulations to bitcoin. I dont think many will prefer to use a regulated bitcoin.
The Tax Treatment Of Bitcoin And Other Cryptocurrencies

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Quote from: Wintersoldier on December 28, 2019, 01:53:11 AM

Quote from: sunsilk on December 28, 2019, 01:06:56 AM

This is the other way that they can tax bitcoin and other crypto transactions but there could be other ways that we haven't think of. It wouldn't be decentralized anymore if they will require everyone to be registered as a bitcoin and cryptocurrency enthusiast because it's against from what bitcoin is intended for. But we have no choice if this is going to be the system that they'll implement.

They'll ask for the record of that local exchange and file taxation for those users that have made profit on that exchange. If they'll not voluntarily go to the tax bureau, they'll be the one to inform the user that there's an associated bitcoin tax record that should be paid.

Imagine if government taxed bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies, what if all the fiats have already been converted to crypto? Where could the taxes could came from? That is why we need to devise a plan and law for the taxation of cryptocurrencies though, its quite ironic to tax crypto which in fact, on its protocol do not allow any third party to do so, I think we need a whole new civilization that could still propagate without tax if cryptocurrencies could be accepted world wide.

I can't think of that because it's far from reality that all fiats will be converted to crypto. It wouldn't be allowed by any government in the world and they don't have the balls to do it, they can't just push decentralization which they don't have control for it and especially, it's on the finance sector.

The other countries have already mandated some conditions that will allow people to be tax-free with crypto profits. And other countries that doesn't have a stand can simply rely on their terms and have a test run for about a year or two and see if it fits their economy or they have to change or improve the sample law they've inspired with.

AbuBhakar

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Quote from: arimamib on December 27, 2019, 07:11:34 AM

in my country, especially in the local market, every time I make a withdrawal of funds subject to tax that I know of the deduction of the other funds are used for my country's taxes. maybe it's one way for the country to get income from these taxes, but maybe the tax is still in a company name not from individuals who use bitcoin or altcoin

In my country too there's a certain fee for converting in our fiat, I think it's the only way now that they can get tax crypto transactions when it's officially converted in their own fiat or by using exchanges that are authorised or registered in that country. Anyway those crypto converted to fiat are have taxed when we buy stuffs locally. But holdings are no way to be taxed now that's why many still invest and hold to keep their investment untaxed.

Wintersoldier

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Quote from: sunsilk on December 28, 2019, 01:06:56 AM

This is the other way that they can tax bitcoin and other crypto transactions but there could be other ways that we haven't think of. It wouldn't be decentralized anymore if they will require everyone to be registered as a bitcoin and cryptocurrency enthusiast because it's against from what bitcoin is intended for. But we have no choice if this is going to be the system that they'll implement.

They'll ask for the record of that local exchange and file taxation for those users that have made profit on that exchange. If they'll not voluntarily go to the tax bureau, they'll be the one to inform the user that there's an associated bitcoin tax record that should be paid.

Imagine if government taxed bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies, what if all the fiats have already been converted to crypto? Where could the taxes could came from? That is why we need to devise a plan and law for the taxation of cryptocurrencies though, its quite ironic to tax crypto which in fact, on its protocol do not allow any third party to do so, I think we need a whole new civilization that could still propagate without tax if cryptocurrencies could be accepted world wide.

tianglistrik

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Quote from: Republikcoin.com on December 27, 2019, 07:36:59 PM

Since the first time, the government has been concerned about tax issues, where crypto users are very difficult to track and do not pay taxes. however, it is very difficult to enforce these regulations if the government does not know who owns the crypto. but you're right, there is a way for the government to impose a tax on crypto users, namely by working with exchangers.
however, at the moment the use of crypto needs to be converted into fiat, at that time, the government can take tax. however, it is a good idea, only if the government enforces it, then indirectly, the government supports cryptocurrency.

maybe when withdrawing funds becomes fiat then the government can take the use tax, but in this way I think is quite complicated maybe because some people will still refuse in the form of KYC. if it really happened then maybe this way is one of the middle paths between bitcoin users and also the government

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

This is the other way that they can tax bitcoin and other crypto transactions but there could be other ways that we haven't think of. It wouldn't be decentralized anymore if they will require everyone to be registered as a bitcoin and cryptocurrency enthusiast because it's against from what bitcoin is intended for. But we have no choice if this is going to be the system that they'll implement.

They'll ask for the record of that local exchange and file taxation for those users that have made profit on that exchange. If they'll not voluntarily go to the tax bureau, they'll be the one to inform the user that there's an associated bitcoin tax record that should be paid.

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Since the first time, the government has been concerned about tax issues, where crypto users are very difficult to track and do not pay taxes. however, it is very difficult to enforce these regulations if the government does not know who owns the crypto. but you're right, there is a way for the government to impose a tax on crypto users, namely by working with exchangers.
however, at the moment the use of crypto needs to be converted into fiat, at that time, the government can take tax. however, it is a good idea, only if the government enforces it, then indirectly, the government supports cryptocurrency.

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

you mean they should implement a tax on buying BTC, at the time of purchase? i reckon a thriving market for OTC brokers and p2p trading would develop to avoid those taxes.

there would need to be rules that allow capital losses to offset tax liability. otherwise people who buy (and pay tax) before a market decline are getting doubly screwed.

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I don't see why would be an impediment for Governments to collect taxes. Companies will still have to invoice people and make filling within the tax authorities. People will have to pay taxes on wages if they have a contract no matter what currency they are payed in. However I think that should happen only once BTC gets adopted on a much larger scale. Nowadays you can't use Bitcoin at many things unless you convert it to fiat.

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

In my own point of view, the government would really like to put a tax on bitcoin users because a lot of people are earning thousands of dollars to it without paying any taxes, that is why they are starting to think how they will regulate bitcoin and add taxes to it. But i think they are already adding taxes to it by giving us fees when we are about to convert our crypto into fiat.

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Quote from: sovie on December 27, 2019, 08:48:52 AM

The tussle between bitcoin and government will come to an end if both can find a way of how to tax bitcoin. Right now there is no way to tax anonymous transactions of bitcoins. It's possible to tax Crypto trade through exchanges but these exchanges are available in only few countries. That's why many small countries who cant monitor or control bitcoin in their areas have banned it altogether.

To find a way to tax bitcoin is really hard. Already several countries have tried to find a way to tax on the transactions based on the summary got from the exchanges. Though every exchange request for KYC, it is truly hard to tax. Few countries have already added bitcoin to the gold and other commodities list.

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes.

They'll tax you in any way they possibly can. The only thing constant and neverending in this world is this: death and taxes. Sure you can utilize crypto whatever, however, whenever you want, but as long as you live within their jurisdiction and you are benefiting from the services that the said government is offering, you will be liable to pay for taxes and if not, they'll jail you for not doing your part.

Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good.

The road to hell has always been paved with good intentions, so no matter how pure or how 'good' your intentions you think are, it will always end up being demonized and trashed some way or another. Also, converting your cash to crypto 100% is a dumb move in today's society--and that's not being a troll or a pessimist, it's just being realistic. You can't spend it anywhere you like. You can keep it, sure, but that's just about it.

You'll have to convert it to cash at some point when the need arises, so why do such thing?

Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

I'm pretty sure the accounting department of some exchanges already have that covered.

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The tussle between bitcoin and government will come to an end if both can find a way of how to tax bitcoin. Right now there is no way to tax anonymous transactions of bitcoins. It's possible to tax Crypto trade through exchanges but these exchanges are available in only few countries. That's why many small countries who cant monitor or control bitcoin in their areas have banned it altogether.

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

Government will simply not allow it. Even here in our country, they wanted to tax on what we call "underground economics". Sooner or later we will see some regulations, actually we have been seeing governments already implementing taxes on crypto.

Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

Well it could work, but I don't know if crypto enthusiast will agree on how much the tax government are going to impose.

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

?? Taxes are determined by LAW which is independent of currency. Currency is neutral, it's just a token of exchange.

Some states, like Arizona allow you to pay your taxes in bitcoin. But you still have to pay the tax - the penalty of not paying is jail. Can't evade the law of the land no matter which token you use.

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

~snip~

Different countries, different rules when it comes to paying taxes. But it is also important to emphasize that paying taxes is a completely normal thing, especially if the tax money goes to the right purposes (public schools, kindergartens, hospitals, courts, etc.), and something else if it goes into the pockets of corrupt politicians and ordinary people only gets crumbs.

Your idea that crypto exchanges collect tax would be good for users, but the whole thing doesn't work that way. Governments want the tax to be reported and paid directly to them, not through some intermediaries like exchanges. The problem is in fact that taxes are too high when we consider the total amount we need to pay.

If we take the example that the capital gain tax rate is 20%, and you pay that every year it is maybe within some normal limits. But if you have VAT on every purchase which is again 20% or more you pay extra tax again on fiat you get from selling crypto. Although there are ways to avoid paying taxes when it comes to cryptocurrency, any trader on exchange which requires KYC will pay it sooner or later.

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Quote from: Debonaire217 on December 27, 2019, 06:51:00 AM

I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

People could even voluntary add tax tools where necessary. The tools should make the deduction automatically, whether on decentralized platforms or not. Taxing should only be done where it is required. I wonder if people operating on decentralized platforms will be affected by national tax laws.. . This is assumption that the DEX platforms don't use government-taxed infrastructures

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Your idea is plausible, in fact, this is what I had in mind when thinking of taxing Bitcoin. Exchanges would be subject to regulation, and most likely to implement KYC. Every transaction would be taxed effectively in the platform, in the form of additional fees. Though one may create a wallet online and can even recieve Bitcoins, it would be pretty useless if not exchanged to fiat, and thus it still is not an exception to taxes.

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Presently, there are very few services where you can spend Cryptocurrencies, and this simply means that we constantly have to be converting Fiat to Cryptocurrencies and Cryptocurrencies to Fiat, so whenever this conversion is made, the Government still gets their tax amounts from the fiat part of the transaction and I guess this is why many of them are not bothered at the moment.

But it would eventually get to a stage where Cryptocurrencies can be used worldwide for the payment of goods and services and once someone converts fiat to Crypto, it would never likely be converted to fiat again and this is when they would really start worrying.

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in my country, especially in the local market, every time I make a withdrawal of funds subject to tax that I know of the deduction of the other funds are used for my country's taxes. maybe it's one way for the country to get income from these taxes, but maybe the tax is still in a company name not from individuals who use bitcoin or altcoin

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I always wonder how could an economy operate and run without taxes from cryptocurrencies. How could a government obtain taxes from people when people are completely utilizing a currency that is not supporting taxes. Would it be really good if we completely have our fiats converted to crypto? For me, there's always a way if our intention is good. We cannot really deny how government is providing regulation that is mainly for the betterment of us despite of some issues regarding corruption and frauds.

For me, the way we could still make it possible is to establish a local exchange wherein, if we convert our money to crypto, these local exchange could already have the portion intended for the tax of each transactions.

Topic: Government Taxing Bitcoin? Here's the Answer (Read 1063 times)