Topic: Hidding the Elephant (an idea for Satoshi and a better world) (Read 1947 times)

This week.


Thanks and honored.

@qwk YES I thought that too. You don't get rich with money, you do it with opportunity, intelligence, and knowledge. All of this might be lacked by the recipients because of malnourished, lack of education or proper market. Money won't solve works problems.

But... A) media coverage and satoshi's good will wouldn't be discussed. Social impact either. B) choosing the right recipient might be part of the game.

..not if by then they can buy their stuff with Bitcoins directly.
If Satoshi doesn't want to wait until then: Donate a part. Or better, create the Satoshi foundation. Don't laugh, even the Gates foundation is doing good things! ;-)
Put some million USD worth in it, get internationally renomated people to lead it, heck, use 1% of it to actively help with Bitcoins' development!

Ente

The idea of Satoshi as a benevolent donator to the "homeless, poor or malnourished people around the world" is in itself flawed.
Those poor people would immediately sell out their coins to buy food, housing etc., leaving the coins in the hands of speculators who would catch the falling knife in the immediate crash on the market.
Sorry for the negativity, but someone had to point that out.

I guess the best he could do in the interest of all would probably be to spend all his coins to an address that is known to be a black hole, thereby reducing the number of coins in "potential circulation". I'm not saying I would, if I were him, though

Yes, technically both of this is possible, for Satoshi to cash out.

So, psychologically, what would happen when suddenly coins start moving which are believed to be Satoshis? Even moving a single coin would have *massive* effects, just because some people would celebrate the return of the king, and others would fear that millions of coins will crash the exchange rate to sub cent levels. If this happened.. We would not name any other past event "turbulence", "rollercoaster" or "crash" again ;-)

*That* is the point of Narydu!
I love your plan. It probably would have to happen even more gradually, more gentle than that even. Start with rumors that Satoshi is, will be active again. Then some signs which can not yet be proven to be of Satoshi. Then some real, verificable message (signed by the adress of the genesis block? Oh yeah baby!). Then, after the crazyness settled, weeks later, announcing his plan to give away free, empty wallets. Then, after the new crazyness settled, actually do it.
This would still cause the most violent exchange rate fluctuations ever observed.

Narydu, I actually wish it would happen exactly like that. Maybe in some future time, when there is more infrastructure to actually give the poor the bitcoins, and a way for them to make use of them.

Ente

You are still missing the «whole picture».

Besides, using an exchange + debit card is absolutely the worst way to keep anonymity and leave no trace.

most effective way is for satoshi to do this.

put coins into BTC-E/bitstamp, then withdraw the dollars to something like OKPay and withdraw as a debit/prepaid card delivered to a temporary address..

he could easily put steps inbetween such as change the coins to another coin such as litecoin. withdraw that and then deposit into another exchange.

but it doesnt take that much effort to confuse people and get money out while still remaining anonymous.

all people will know is that satoshi finally moved his funds out from the original wallets.

he wants to keep his real identity a secret, so ofcourse he is not going to cause a big publicity stunt.

Effective, positive and beautifull way to do it. Obviously there might be others but perhaps they won't accomplish the world wide message about satoshi's intention to do with his power.

Nope. Read about Bitcoin from the wiki, then read into how many of the early coins were Satoshi's but he wants to stay anonymous so Narydu is talking about an effective way Satoshi could get access to the coins without being traced.

@Narydu

Hello !

I don't understand what are you talking about: is the whole BTC mining operation just a big scam ?

Interesting, however he could shift small amounts of his money off using CoinJoin once it because a mature system and no one would be able to track him.

Do this enough times and eventually he would be able to separate million of dollars worth of bitcoin from his known addresses.

I certainly hope they are reading this...

On the other hand, soon Satoshi and the rest of us will be able to use CoinJoin to create a historical, elephantine transaction. From then on, Satoshi will be all of us, and we will all be Satoshi.

Just posted your story on http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/2013/09/12/hiding-bitcoin-elephant/

Is there a link to the conference on your website? I will send it to a friend in Argentina.

As part of the Fundación Bitcoin Argentina, today we gave a talk at an University and after it finished I kept answering some questions to people about things like why the 51% is not that a threat or about the difficulty of being totaly anonymous and something came into my mind...

How do you hide an elephant?
In a group of elephants...

What if Satoshi wanted to cash out all or part of his money, let´s say $10.000.000 (100.000 btc) today using those well known wallets (the elephant) commonly considered his but not leave trace of who he is to any one? Well, why not Hidding the Elephant in a group of elephants.

Satoshi already once gifted the world a better place with his decentralised currency and moved away for every one to enjoy it. He could now repeat the story making a great gift to the world, and on the way increasing his world wide personal popularity, but no one knowing who he is and helping bitcoin and himself on his way...

So here is how...
Let´s supose we/he finds a way to help homeless, poor or malnourished people around the world gifting them money in the form of bitcoin (initially giving away empty wallets). Let´s supose this generates a worldwide possitive media coverage and conmotion about bitcoin possibilities and turns into a massive adoption, taking the price, let´s say, from $100 to $1000.

Now let´s supose that the bitcoins being gifted are the ones he keeps in the those wallets the community knows he controls. It would be extremly difficult if not impossible, to determine which of the new wallets to whom bitcoins are being gifted/sent are his or of individuals so let´s supose he transfers about a 10% of the 100.000 bitcoins to thousands of wallets under his secret control.

This would hide the elephant in a group of elephants but also Rise bitcoin adoption, Rise bitcoin´s price, Rise Satoshi´s world wide positive popularity, Make the world a better place, and allow him to cash out 10% of the BTC he used to own into the $10.000.000 he expected.

;-)

What do you think? Is this possible?
Do you want to make it happen?

What is this about his world wide personal popularity?
Some times I feel that holding bitcoins is holding some kind of future power if it get´s a worldwide adoption. I also think that we are changing the power from govern´s hands into the hands of unknown people who hold big ammounts of this new power, beign Satoshi perhaps one of the "chip leaders". This migh be a concern for some investors or players. This kind of action would not only give media press but would also lighten the power concentration and send a possitive signal about Satoshi´s intentions.

Finally, allow me some advertising...
The 7th and 8th of december the Fundación Bitcoin Argentina will host "laBITconf" the Latin American Bitcoin Conference, being the first one for Hispanic audience (with simultaneous bidirectional translation), and the first one in the southern hemisfere. We hope some of you can make it down to Buenos Aires. We will be doing an official anouncement very shortly.

Rodolfo.