Hide my money from my country | Bitcointalksearch.org

Webetcoins

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Quote from: leatutz on December 09, 2019, 08:32:35 AM

Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 12:34:13 PM

Hey, I sell some stuff online and I am looking for a way to keep my money for about 2-3 years. In my country we have to pay 19% from any income to taxes, so I was thinking fuck them. First I thought about PayPal, but I'm afraid they will freeze my account like they used to do randomly. then I thought about Bitcoin, but it's very unstable and I don't want to gamble on the money.

So I have read and found out about the stable coins, Im newbie but its looks like they might be the solution for me.
1. Tether is the most famous but doesn't have the proof of funds, so one day it can be a problem.
2. USDC coinbase is asking to validate the identity in order to use it, so I afraid my country will find out about that.
3. Paxos is also asking for a documents ID.

I am not sure that I understood everything correctly, so I will be thankful if you could help me to find the best option for me.
Thanks in advance.

edit:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.53294999

This really hard to accept 19% from your income to taxes. But this isn't your income that you have to pay taxes. Tether is very good coin from 2014 but if you don't like than swap your money to TAX, TUSD, Dai or Binance USD coin. It is up to you which wallet you prefer software or hardware.

There are countries that have even higher percentage of tax than this. For instance, Denmark is one of those where people have to pay high taxes. However these are also the one with most facilities and peace. In my opinion, it would be best for him to go for bitcoin instead of stable coins. First, bitcoin will return him huge profits which no altcoin can and second it has far brighter future than any stable or unstable coin.

sana54210

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I personally just exchange with people I know from the crypto community locally and that means I would never have to let the government in my finances at all. Think about it, if I get bitcoin somehow from someone using cash, than I also sell my bitcoins to someone using cash, that means there is no trace of what I have done anywhere in the world. Without any trace government could never know what I have done at all and that is how you can hide it.

For the past 2 years I gave up on that and now I use a local exchange and withdraw the money to my bank account but before that I always used the local ones personally. You have to decide how much you want to hide and how well, if you want super secret the first method I talked about is the best one you can use.

yulionoo

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where do you live op why tax payments in your country are high. if you want to save money then a stable coin is a good choice. because keeping money on a stable coin is the same as storing fiat money at a fixed value. and I suggest to save on USDT coins I think USDT is a good coin and has liquidity. and in my opinion if you have more money you should try to use some of your money to buy bitcoin. Don't be afraid of bitcoin volatility. if we can exploit the volatility of bitcoin we can benefit.

aamirsuh

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Avoiding taxes is not the solution. I don't think Bitcoin should go back to local currency. Bitcoin needs to be used as a means of payment. Don't buy dollars or euros. not Conversion. Not necessary. With Bitcoin you can meet all your needs.

darkangel11

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One important thing: don't advise him to evade taxes. In some countries this may be a criminal offense. You don't know who's reading this.

I'm not afraid to tell you my views, but this is what I'd do because I strongly oppose income tax. Some taxes are ok, but income tax is not as it punishes you for your work.
I would not disclose my bitcoins and I wouldn't pay them every year, but at the same time I'd think of a way to sell without breaking the law. What I mean by that is selling in a country where you don't have to pay 19%. I'd trade my coins in person for cash to make sure there's no paper trail.

How to trade? Sell stuff for cash and convert to cryptocurrency on DEX, or sell for cryptocurrency and then exchange crypto to cash in person or via DEX.
You can also try things like Revolut. I don't know what kind of money we're talking here. It's easy to hide 10k USD a year, but very hard to hide 100k.

To be clear, if I had over 100k a year to exchange to fiat, I wouldn't hide it from the government. I'd change the country to one that wouldn't take 20% but 0-10 and just pay my taxes because that few % is a small price for peace of mind.

leatutz

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Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 12:34:13 PM

Hey, I sell some stuff online and I am looking for a way to keep my money for about 2-3 years. In my country we have to pay 19% from any income to taxes, so I was thinking fuck them. First I thought about PayPal, but I'm afraid they will freeze my account like they used to do randomly. then I thought about Bitcoin, but it's very unstable and I don't want to gamble on the money.

So I have read and found out about the stable coins, Im newbie but its looks like they might be the solution for me.
1. Tether is the most famous but doesn't have the proof of funds, so one day it can be a problem.
2. USDC coinbase is asking to validate the identity in order to use it, so I afraid my country will find out about that.
3. Paxos is also asking for a documents ID.

I am not sure that I understood everything correctly, so I will be thankful if you could help me to find the best option for me.
Thanks in advance.

edit:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.53294999

This really hard to accept 19% from your income to taxes. But this isn't your income that you have to pay taxes. Tether is very good coin from 2014 but if you don't like than swap your money to TAX, TUSD, Dai or Binance USD coin. It is up to you which wallet you prefer software or hardware.

Zeke_23

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Quote from: cryp24x on December 09, 2019, 07:23:13 AM

That was a huge percentage for a tax but I think you have to decide well, the risks are too high and you may loose your money. What if you study first the best way to manage your money, whether you invest your money in Cryptocurrency or put it on a legal business that is paying taxes. I remember that there are ways to minimize your taxes and I think that is the safest way and will
give you peace of mind about anything.

I think the tax percentage in their country is reasonable. In our country, the tax percentage will depend on your income (5%-35%).
If OP will invest in crypto, stablecoins will be his choice since if he invests in BTC, the value of his money may decrease anytime. But I think your idea of putting it to a legal business is fine since he can also increase his money, but he can't avoid paying tax (that's the consequence).

Zackgeno96

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Quote from: robelneo on December 09, 2019, 08:09:11 AM

Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 12:34:13 PM

Hey, I sell some stuff online and I am looking for a way to keep my money for about 2-3 years. In my country we have to pay 19% from any income to taxes, so I was thinking fuck them. First I thought about PayPal, but I'm afraid they will freeze my account like they used to do randomly. then I thought about Bitcoin, but it's very unstable and I don't want to gamble on the money.

So I have read and found out about the stable coins, Im newbie but its looks like they might be the solution for me.
1. Tether is the most famous but doesn't have the proof of funds, so one day it can be a problem.
2. USDC coinbase is asking to validate the identity in order to use it, so I afraid my country will find out about that.
3. Paxos is also asking for a documents ID.

I am not sure that I understood everything correctly, so I will be thankful if you could help me to find the best option for me.
Thanks in advance.

edit:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.53294999

Risk and being unstable is part of any coins in the market, but it depends on the situation, and the time elements if you are following the future market potential of Bitcoin every predictions points to profit and another all time high, so by the time that youa re ready to withdraw your coin, you coins could be 50% of it's value.

This is the funny thing about the crypto market, if you don't time your exit well you can end up in deep trouble. Many people have lost their fortune in Crypto but also many of them gained a lot of money just by selling at the right time. What most people do is buy when the coin is everywhere in the news thinking that they could get rich by doing this. But what they should do is that wait for the market to take a dip and then invest in Bitcoin or other crypto.

robelneo

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Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 12:34:13 PM

Hey, I sell some stuff online and I am looking for a way to keep my money for about 2-3 years. In my country we have to pay 19% from any income to taxes, so I was thinking fuck them. First I thought about PayPal, but I'm afraid they will freeze my account like they used to do randomly. then I thought about Bitcoin, but it's very unstable and I don't want to gamble on the money.

So I have read and found out about the stable coins, Im newbie but its looks like they might be the solution for me.
1. Tether is the most famous but doesn't have the proof of funds, so one day it can be a problem.
2. USDC coinbase is asking to validate the identity in order to use it, so I afraid my country will find out about that.
3. Paxos is also asking for a documents ID.

I am not sure that I understood everything correctly, so I will be thankful if you could help me to find the best option for me.
Thanks in advance.

edit:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.53294999

Risk and being unstable is part of any coins in the market, but it depends on the situation, and the time elements if you are following the future market potential of Bitcoin every predictions points to profit and another all time high, so by the time that youa re ready to withdraw your coin, you coins could be 50% of it's value.

duuuuude

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Darknet to help you! You can find similar services there but always be vigilant and accurate because scammers are watching on every corner. But as for cryptocurrency, the market does not know how it will behave in the future, so I would not buy cryptocurrency for long-term storage of money.

cryp24x

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That was a huge percentage for a tax but I think you have to decide well, the risks are too high and you may loose your money. What if you study first the best way to manage your money, whether you invest your money in Cryptocurrency or put it on a legal business that is paying taxes. I remember that there are ways to minimize your taxes and I think that is the safest way and will
give you peace of mind about anything.

Xcode7

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Quote from: efxtrader on December 09, 2019, 01:23:07 AM

Saving assets so that they are not tracked by the government using cryptocurrency in my opinion is quite effective, but the problem is that the price is volatile. Stable coins might be an option but in my opinion gold is a good investment besides crypto so that the government is difficult to track our assets

This is also what I do, I keep some assets in cryptocurrency, I am very aware that cryptocurrency has not been accepted by my country, plus our government does not investigate and only looks at the negative side of cryptocurrency. Though many positive sides can be taken from here. But what else can I do? We can only accept their policies and go through all this quietly

Kupid002

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Quote from: efxtrader on December 09, 2019, 01:23:07 AM

Saving assets so that they are not tracked by the government using cryptocurrency in my opinion is quite effective, but the problem is that the price is volatile. Stable coins might be an option but in my opinion gold is a good investment besides crypto so that the government is difficult to track our assets

The question is how much big he want to hide gold is better idea but you know you still keep it at your home and every one can see it. Unlike crypto currency that no one know that xxx amount hiding in your wallet. Crypto currency will be the answer for him but what currency he want to use?

Wysi

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That's really a sad state policies in your country I would suggest you to go for Tether as it will not be volatile but yes they don't have a proof of funds but still I don't think USDT will disappear all of a sudden or cheat users due to its reputation moreover if you want you can convert it into bitcoin or ETH if you wanna take risk as it would either give you more returns or you will lose if the value dumps.

jossiel

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Quote from: mamahdedeh on December 08, 2019, 09:07:51 PM

Quote from: jossiel on December 08, 2019, 08:42:52 PM

He already said that he just can't. He can't the volatility of bitcoin, ethereum and other coins as well. He don't want to bet his money on bitcoin that's why he's looking for much stable coin that he can save his wealth with. It's the top choice that he can make but whether he'll follow the bitcoin advice, there's still some changes that might happen in the future.

What if the gov't becomes active in crypto, they won't ban it but regulate and get tax from profits there? so there are other things that op has to consider.

even though bitcoin or ethereum is a safe coin according to many people, high volatility is inevitable. therefore I don't think it is the ultimate solution to put all wealth in crypto. it would be better if all governments were to legalize, even though collecting taxes, would certainly be safer and get legal protection from the government

Volatility is bitcoin's character and it will never changed nor removed and that's why it's not his choice. He's not for the investment but he's just want to save the money and get back to it maybe years later.

OP is looking for a solution, I guess not that totally avoiding but probably might come up with something to lessen the dues that he has to pay.

TRONTON

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You avoid income tax and only pay transaction tax on online sales. You are not very wise as a good citizen

, but that doesn't matter because of a personal decision.

don't worry if you keep it in a stable coin, even though you have to enter your identity, news about things that tie assets is still limited to discourse, you can also buy through OTC as an additional option.

OasisDre

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Decentralized stable coins is what you need like DAI, you won't be asked for any verifications or your personal Identity cards but its really bad to avoid taxes because it can get you jailed

Coltpython

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I will advise you to just pay out your tax and try not to evade it. The consequences can be grim as you might be facing jail time depending on the laws of your country.

ajiz138

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Steady coins will be the best choice for saving your money to avoid taxes in your country. koun stable among them is USDT. But you do not save in the wallet exchange because you do not have full control, learn from the incident of burglary wallet exchange. So you have to buy a wallet hardware like Trezor or Ledger to store your assets very easily and will be safer, because you have full control over your wallet.

safari88

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Quote from: efxtrader on December 09, 2019, 01:23:07 AM

Stable coins might be an option but in my opinion gold is a good investment besides crypto so that the government is difficult to track our assets

gold might be an option but the OP said that he want to easly withdraw/exchange his coins whenever he want to spend money
so stable coins is option so IMO the only thing left is to buy hardware wallet for him to store his coins

efxtrader

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Saving assets so that they are not tracked by the government using cryptocurrency in my opinion is quite effective, but the problem is that the price is volatile. Stable coins might be an option but in my opinion gold is a good investment besides crypto so that the government is difficult to track our assets

Pamadar

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Quote from: fuer44 on December 08, 2019, 10:22:34 PM

very complicated, actually choosing bitcoin in order to avoid taxes is correct but you are afraid of fluctuations. in my opinion yes just dare to put your money into bitcoin, anyway if the value can go down, it can go up too. if it goes up, you actually get passive income from the money you entered earlier.

For all I Understood that OP is planning for some years of keeping his money inside this industry, we never know if from that time table there government
will not realize the benefits of crypto and sooner or later they will make some rulings in regards to this industry. Learning the potential of bitcoin might save you in realizing what would future can bring to your money.

airdnasxela

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Quote from: wajik-tempe on December 08, 2019, 11:45:34 PM

As a good citizen we have to pay tax for developing our county. But if you really want to hide , it's a must to have a hardware wallet to avoid hacks or phising to you wallet because a wallet with high amount of assets might targeted by hackers

This is also a good option if you don't want to risk your money on highly volatile currency, as well as hackings. Or just go with stable coin. But why do you really want to avoid tax when it's part of being a citizen? I see this as one of the reasons why the governments are either trying so hard to stop cryptocurrencies in their country, or trying so hard to regulate it so they can collect taxes because they know how big your asset in crypto can get. Because we're so persistent in avoiding tax

slashz9

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Quote from: Rodeo02 on December 08, 2019, 12:49:48 PM

Why not use bitcoin and create your own wallet ? The only problem is the price volatility of bitcoin ans if the price will drop but if the price will increase its a win situation to you.
Also i want to know if you are only looking for stable coin?

he, said he wont gamble with his money, you know the price of bitcoin is volatile.

he just want avoid tax from his country, oh man did u read carrefully what he said Tongue

Quote from: ?? on ??

Maybe stable coins are the best choice as suggested but try to check about Dogecoin, maybe you have a different view of the future. After all, nothing is really stable in this market, even though they are stable at least there are still price movements that make it go up and down all the time. But it's up to you, after all it's your money and you can make a better choice for the long term.

he dont expect anything in saving, so he want just avoid it,and keep his money, but yeah some coin have a great rises in longterm,OP just need to research.

safari88

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Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 12:34:13 PM

Hey, I sell some stuff online and I am looking for a way to keep my money for about 2-3 years. In my country we have to pay 19% from any income to taxes, so I was thinking fuck them. First I thought about PayPal, but I'm afraid they will freeze my account like they used to do randomly. then I thought about Bitcoin, but it's very unstable and I don't want to gamble on the money.

So I have read and found out about the stable coins, Im newbie but its looks like they might be the solution for me.
1. Tether is the most famous but doesn't have the proof of funds, so one day it can be a problem.
2. USDC coinbase is asking to validate the identity in order to use it, so I afraid my country will find out about that.
3. Paxos is also asking for a documents ID.

I am not sure that I understood everything correctly, so I will be thankful if you could help me to find the best option for me.
Thanks in advance.

Thanks all for your help.

why don't you just use a hardware wallet like trezor or ledger Nano?
because it's very safe and you don't need KYC to access the wallet

BlackFor3st

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Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 12:34:13 PM

Hey, I sell some stuff online and I am looking for a way to keep my money for about 2-3 years. In my country we have to pay 19% from any income to taxes, so I was thinking fuck them. First I thought about PayPal, but I'm afraid they will freeze my account like they used to do randomly. then I thought about Bitcoin, but it's very unstable and I don't want to gamble on the money.

So I have read and found out about the stable coins, Im newbie but its looks like they might be the solution for me.
1. Tether is the most famous but doesn't have the proof of funds, so one day it can be a problem.
2. USDC coinbase is asking to validate the identity in order to use it, so I afraid my country will find out about that.
3. Paxos is also asking for a documents ID.

I am not sure that I understood everything correctly, so I will be thankful if you could help me to find the best option for me.
Thanks in advance.

edit:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.53294999

Your option will be the top 5 in coinmarketcap in order to lessen the possibility to reduce your money but if you are worried where to put your money that are not asking for any details then it will be best if you try Ethereum as you are worried with bitcoin. It will be best also if you are going to mention your country so we can give a better suggestion for you like an exchange in your country that will not ask for any documents or something like that.

But with your current situation right now, it will be best if you will just pay the taxes so you don't have to worry anything and you can run your business smoothly especially if you are earning a decent amount from your business.

BigBos

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from what I understand, your country only takes 19% of your income. if you invest in something offline, like gold, that's pretty good I think.
I thought of many ways, but investing in USDT was also quite risky, moreover I heard that USDT was not backed up by 100% USD. however, if you are unsure about paypal, try with perfectmoney or other payment processor. It seems like you're the type that doesn't want to take the risk of fluctuations, so think about investments that have collateral such as gold, silver and others.

wajik-tempe

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As a good citizen we have to pay tax for developing our county. But if you really want to hide , it's a must to have a hardware wallet to avoid hacks or phising to you wallet because a wallet with high amount of assets might targeted by hackers

maydna

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I will still use Bitcoin to save my money, although the bitcoin price is volatile, I am not worried because I will hold my bitcoin for the long term. Besides that, I think that it's okay if bitcoin can go up and down because I can sell the bitcoin when the price is up so that I can have more USDT, and I will buy more bitcoin when the price is down. After that, I will send my bitcoin into the other wallet and hold it again for some time. And I can use the additional USD or bitcoin from the profit to trade so I can have a chance to increase my bitcoin amount. You don't have to tell your friend or other people if you have bitcoin because that is your secret and you can keep it for yourself.

bitvalak

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Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 12:34:13 PM

Hey, I sell some stuff online and I am looking for a way to keep my money for about 2-3 years. In my country we have to pay 19% from any income to taxes, so I was thinking fuck them. First I thought about PayPal, but I'm afraid they will freeze my account like they used to do randomly. then I thought about Bitcoin, but it's very unstable and I don't want to gamble on the money.

So I have read and found out about the stable coins, Im newbie but its looks like they might be the solution for me.
1. Tether is the most famous but doesn't have the proof of funds, so one day it can be a problem.
2. USDC coinbase is asking to validate the identity in order to use it, so I afraid my country will find out about that.
3. Paxos is also asking for a documents ID.

I am not sure that I understood everything correctly, so I will be thankful if you could help me to find the best option for me.
Thanks in advance.

edit:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.53294999

I think all countries will apply the same rules, you can't hide your money forever because you live in a country that has rules.
My advice is you better move to a country that has free rules as you expect, it will be better for you without having to look for solutions that are impossible to find.
Bitcoin is the best for now if you intend to exchange it for assets, because the capital is still the highest among other altcoins.

fuer44

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very complicated, actually choosing bitcoin in order to avoid taxes is correct but you are afraid of fluctuations. in my opinion yes just dare to put your money into bitcoin, anyway if the value can go down, it can go up too. if it goes up, you actually get passive income from the money you entered earlier.

inanilujimi

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For a long time like 2-3 years why be afraid to save your money in bitcoin ??
Rather than the money just saved but can't increase I think it's better to save your income in the depth of bitcoin.
It's true the price is very fluctuating but you can make more than just saving but not making a profit.

acdc

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Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 12:34:13 PM

Hey, I sell some stuff online and I am looking for a way to keep my money for about 2-3 years. In my country we have to pay 19% from any income to taxes, so I was thinking fuck them. First I thought about PayPal, but I'm afraid they will freeze my account like they used to do randomly. then I thought about Bitcoin, but it's very unstable and I don't want to gamble on the money.

So I have read and found out about the stable coins, Im newbie but its looks like they might be the solution for me.
1. Tether is the most famous but doesn't have the proof of funds, so one day it can be a problem.
2. USDC coinbase is asking to validate the identity in order to use it, so I afraid my country will find out about that.
3. Paxos is also asking for a documents ID.

I am not sure that I understood everything correctly, so I will be thankful if you could help me to find the best option for me.
Thanks in advance.

edit:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.53294999

In my opinion you should not find ways to evade taxes, if discovered you will have to pay a much higher price than what you get.
I think that you should obey the laws in your country, when you have clean coins you can buy whatever you like, I suggest you buy gold and USD. You can safely keep your gold and usd without having to worry about the risks that cryptocurrencies bring.

tsaroz

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It's not just tax people are afraid of. There are many autocratic countries around the world that can confiscate your money and property for no reason. Take and example of China. However high status you may make, differ in a small thing from CCP than you become a criminal. Even the foreigners working on such regime are caught and confiscated. They work for years for a better life and all they get for their effort is trouble.

xZork

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Quote from: jets567 on December 08, 2019, 01:37:58 PM

Bitcoin is great as well because it offers a great rewards in the future and you might miss the chance of doubling or even triple your money once the bull run happen.

As he said from the start, it's that he doesn't want to gamble with his assets, bitcoin is a risky speculation and he doesn't like it.
In this case maybe I would advise him on USDT, DAI, USDQ .. generally it is best to hold stablecoins.

Saisher

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Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 12:34:13 PM

Hey, I sell some stuff online and I am looking for a way to keep my money for about 2-3 years. In my country we have to pay 19% from any income to taxes, so I was thinking fuck them. First I thought about PayPal, but I'm afraid they will freeze my account like they used to do randomly. then I thought about Bitcoin, but it's very unstable and I don't want to gamble on the money.

So I have read and found out about the stable coins, Im newbie but its looks like they might be the solution for me.
1. Tether is the most famous but doesn't have the proof of funds, so one day it can be a problem.
2. USDC coinbase is asking to validate the identity in order to use it, so I afraid my country will find out about that.
3. Paxos is also asking for a documents ID.

I am not sure that I understood everything correctly, so I will be thankful if you could help me to find the best option for me.
Thanks in advance.

edit:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.53294999

Since you are going to keep it for 2 to 3 years my best bet is Bitcoin and Ethereum, on that time price will be much better now because it's already 2 to 3 years after the halving, you are in a much better position to withdraw your funds in a good profit, so better go for Bitcoin.

boris singer

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Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 12:34:13 PM

Hey, I sell some stuff online and I am looking for a way to keep my money for about 2-3 years. In my country we have to pay 19% from any income to taxes, so I was thinking fuck them. First I thought about PayPal, but I'm afraid they will freeze my account like they used to do randomly. then I thought about Bitcoin, but it's very unstable and I don't want to gamble on the money.

So I have read and found out about the stable coins, Im newbie but its looks like they might be the solution for me.
1. Tether is the most famous but doesn't have the proof of funds, so one day it can be a problem.
2. USDC coinbase is asking to validate the identity in order to use it, so I afraid my country will find out about that.
3. Paxos is also asking for a documents ID.

I am not sure that I understood everything correctly, so I will be thankful if you could help me to find the best option for me.
Thanks in advance.

edit:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.53294999

(paxos and usdc) they will not freeze your account unless you are suspended due to illegal trading in a criminal case. In the next 2-3 years it is still progressive, so the point is it needs more time for regulation and taxation.

You can monitor and take a stand as long as it hasn't happened, everything is still safe at this time even including usdt. The stable coin in question does not require an id document if you buy / convert it from crypto.

Do not hesitate to save it in crypto form, just assume there are two things you will get, depreciating assets or even vice versa is even more profitable.

mamahdedeh

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Quote from: jossiel on December 08, 2019, 08:42:52 PM

Quote from: pcfli on December 08, 2019, 06:58:05 PM

Instead of buying the stable coins without back up, you can go for the BTC or ETH. The volatility will not hurt you unless you have a hundred Bitcoins. It is a better choice than blindly following the advice of stable coin suggestions.

He already said that he just can't. He can't the volatility of bitcoin, ethereum and other coins as well. He don't want to bet his money on bitcoin that's why he's looking for much stable coin that he can save his wealth with. It's the top choice that he can make but whether he'll follow the bitcoin advice, there's still some changes that might happen in the future.

What if the gov't becomes active in crypto, they won't ban it but regulate and get tax from profits there? so there are other things that op has to consider.

even though bitcoin or ethereum is a safe coin according to many people, high volatility is inevitable. therefore I don't think it is the ultimate solution to put all wealth in crypto. it would be better if all governments were to legalize, even though collecting taxes, would certainly be safer and get legal protection from the government

karanggatak

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in my opinion it is better to save money in both types of coins, namely stable coins and bitcoin. I think it's very bad if we don't keep some of our money in bitcoin. so I will halve my money. half I will store in stable coins like DAI and the rest I will use to buy bitcoin.
keep money in a stable coin will not get a profit the value of our money will remain. but if we save our money in bitcoin there will be a possibility that our money will increase because the price of bitcoin rises.

jossiel

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Quote from: pcfli on December 08, 2019, 06:58:05 PM

Instead of buying the stable coins without back up, you can go for the BTC or ETH. The volatility will not hurt you unless you have a hundred Bitcoins. It is a better choice than blindly following the advice of stable coin suggestions.

He already said that he just can't. He can't the volatility of bitcoin, ethereum and other coins as well. He don't want to bet his money on bitcoin that's why he's looking for much stable coin that he can save his wealth with. It's the top choice that he can make but whether he'll follow the bitcoin advice, there's still some changes that might happen in the future.

What if the gov't becomes active in crypto, they won't ban it but regulate and get tax from profits there? so there are other things that op has to consider.

huu78

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Save the old money is suitable for a stable coin. But we need to know still them as time can die or be exposed to problems because of trivial. For Coinbase identity validation is useful to validate that you are actually a person and never will state know the files that are in Coinbase because all are anonymous. Better still you use USDT instead of the other.

maxreish

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Choose TETHER instead of anything else if you want some stable coins. Two to three years holding it, your money will gonna survived and so as the tether, too. That's the best choice you'll gonna have. Or you can consider some coins like Monero, xrp. Transactions are fast and fees are low but storing it for two-three years, you still have to watch and monitor the price for flactuations.

pcfli

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Instead of buying the stable coins without back up, you can go for the BTC or ETH. The volatility will not hurt you unless you have a hundred Bitcoins. It is a better choice than blindly following the advice of stable coin suggestions.

Duzter

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There are ways to buy bitcoin anonymously. If you can bear a 19% fluctuation just go with investing or buying and holding for long-term. Here you doesn't want to fear of any trust, and you need to concentrate on keeping it secure. Why I mentioned 19% fluctuation is, the taxes you supposed to pay. The fluctuation of bitcoin will happen in large scale, same will be the growth.

dimox

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Quote from: kro55 on December 08, 2019, 01:08:22 PM

Quote from: Rodeo02 on December 08, 2019, 12:49:48 PM

Why not use bitcoin and create your own wallet ? The only problem is the price volatility of bitcoin ans if the price will drop but if the price will increase its a win situation to you.

That's the key point OP is missing. Bitcoin is known for its wild swings in both directions. Who knows the speculated price of Bitcoin 50k or 100k may be achieved in the next 2 to 3 years. But for that one has to take risk.
Other risk-free investments in the crypto market are stable coins only as far as I know

i think its good if you choice on bitcoin, we dont know and cant speculate how great or how bad bitcoin in 2 until 3 years, but im sure if bitcoin still exist and sure if bitcoin price still good to be investment, im sure if still get profit in that time. and actually, you can buy or sell in the middle if bitcoin price more than your expectation.

jossiel

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Quote from: Rodeo02 on December 08, 2019, 12:49:48 PM

Why not use bitcoin and create your own wallet ? The only problem is the price volatility of bitcoin ans if the price will drop but if the price will increase its a win situation to you.
Also i want to know if you are only looking for stable coin?

You have to read the whole sentences made by op before ending up with these questions.

@op If you have an income tax with that percentage do you think that your government will not enforce a law for taxing crypto profits? they might consider you taxable in the future if changes come by if ever you choose to keep your money with stable coins or any crypto of your choice.

Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 01:44:45 PM

pixie85

You are right, if I will withdraw the money to my bank in few years I still will pay the taxes but there is always an option I will withdraw
small amounts for cash and never put it in my bank. Thats the basic of what I planned to do.

Any as someone suggested here, my country is not relevant right now but if I will keep the money on other bank account in different country.
Do you think it wil be a better idea? or there is high possibility the different countries can share bank information and find out.

Keeping it at your own vault is what's on my mind too. As for the offshore bank accounts, I don't have an experience with it but it's likely that they can't share your information unless there's an order from international court or something like that.

hirngespenst

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I think USDT wouldn't scam in the next 5 years or more. Though it has suspicious activities, but yet it has the highest trading volume, support from a large number of traders and much adoption than other stable coins. So, you may try USDT too if you can't process with the USDC.

Brunus

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Protecting one's money from legalized robbery perpetrated by states is certainly a laudable initiative.
For moralists, it is not a question of tax evasion, but of legitimate defense !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

gundala

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As a good citizen, it is better to obey the law and obey taxes, but that depends on each decision.
Well, the right choice if you choose stable coins because you don't want to be associated with high volatility, it's better to choose stable coins that are really decentralized like DAI. But later you will also be in direct contact with the Bank when withdrawing funds, right? so can you really avoid this tax?

tenakha

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Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 12:34:13 PM

Hey, I sell some stuff online and I am looking for a way to keep my money for about 2-3 years. In my country we have to pay 19% from any income to taxes, so I was thinking fuck them. First I thought about PayPal, but I'm afraid they will freeze my account like they used to do randomly. then I thought about Bitcoin, but it's very unstable and I don't want to gamble on the money.

Does not the government charges tax in the receiving moment? Or you charge in other ways when trading? I did not get it because the government must have taken their own tax when the money was included in your debit card.

Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 12:34:13 PM

So I have read and found out about the stable coins, Im newbie but its looks like they might be the solution for me.
1. Tether is the most famous but doesn't have the proof of funds, so one day it can be a problem.
2. USDC coinbase is asking to validate the identity in order to use it, so I afraid my country will find out about that.
3. Paxos is also asking for a documents ID.

Some of them may not be suitable for you, but from this list you can find the appropriate one: https://changelly.com/blog/best-stablecoins-2019-comparison/

Harlot

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Quote from: pixie85 on December 08, 2019, 03:26:46 PM

Quote from: Harlot on December 08, 2019, 01:49:30 PM

Isn't this called tax evasion already?

It's not evasion until he really evades. If his taxes are due by the end of the year he will not evade anything by asking or saying that he wants to hide his income. He will evade if he doesn't pay taxes before the deadline.

He said it in his OP that he will hide his earnings for two to three years and I don't know about you but taxes are to be paid by the end of each fiscal year. No matter how you want to circle it with words may it be hiding or avoiding it is still evading taxes you are literally falsifying your real earnings for the year just to avoid on paying your real tax obligation which is counted as tax evasion. Even if you are technically paying your taxes you aren't paying the real earnings you have for that year.

Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 12:34:13 PM

Hey, I sell some stuff online and I am looking for a way to keep my money for about 2-3 years.

pixie85

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Quote from: Harlot on December 08, 2019, 01:49:30 PM

Isn't this called tax evasion already?

It's not evasion until he really evades. If his taxes are due by the end of the year he will not evade anything by asking or saying that he wants to hide his income. He will evade if he doesn't pay taxes before the deadline.

Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 01:44:45 PM

You are right, if I will withdraw the money to my bank in few years I still will pay the taxes but there is always an option I will withdraw
small amounts for cash and never put it in my bank. Thats the basic of what I planned to do.

Most countries will only ask you to pay taxes on the profit. If you buy today and next year your coins are worth only $100 more then you probably won't owe any taxes because you'll be under the smallest taxable profit. If your coins are worth less it's the same you won't pay taxes. If you gain 10 thousand USD or something it would be fair to pay taxes and not have to worry about anything. Situation depends on how much money you're making each year.

thisnewcoin

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Quote from: Mammothcoin on December 08, 2019, 02:26:46 PM

You did make a valid point as regards bitcoin's value being unstable. Since you're interested in keeping your money safe from your country's government, I suggest you could get DAI while investing a portion of your funds into bitcoin(an amount you can feel comfortable investing, people's risk appetite differ), that way you can also profit from the potential appreciation in price of Bitcoin.

I think USDC would be better than DAI. He is wanting to hold it for 2-3 years, in these years, DAI even can get die, it has low liquidity and low support from the community. But yet DAI is better than USDT, and it's decentralized!

electronicash

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bringing your money outside your country is easy to do, do it with BTC. you are like a walking bank already by having a wallet in your phone with you. buying BTC is basically no just investing to BTC but also hiding your money from your country. is your country about to go war?

let us know because value of money always decline when you there is an impending war. the least you can do is support the government instead. pay your tax.

MATHReX

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You will also face issues when you're going to sell your items.
Majority of people usually use online payments with fiat to purchase any products.
As BTC is pretty straight forward for anyone to purchase, you can use that and prepare a bot to convert it periodically to stable coins using any exchange and then transferring it to your personal wallet.

Nadziratel

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Of course, the tax rules vary from country to country. But I'm not sure how wise it is to invest in stable coin. Sooner or later some crypto-based stable coins may disappear one day. Most of them don't have any money. USDC is considered one of the most reliable, because Coinbase is said to hold USD as much as USDC in reserve. It should be noted, however, that the purpose of stable coins is not to store value! The aim is to provide convenience in crypto trade transactions.

The decision is entirely yours, BTC and ETH are one of the other reliable investment types. (DYOR!) However, it is useful to be careful when buying such investments. There is always a chance of losing value.

So its your choice. Make your own choices.

Nolimitz84

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Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 12:34:13 PM

Hey, I sell some stuff online and I am looking for a way to keep my money for about 2-3 years. In my country we have to pay 19% from any income to taxes, so I was thinking fuck them. First I thought about PayPal, but I'm afraid they will freeze my account like they used to do randomly. then I thought about Bitcoin, but it's very unstable and I don't want to gamble on the money.

So I have read and found out about the stable coins, Im newbie but its looks like they might be the solution for me.
1. Tether is the most famous but doesn't have the proof of funds, so one day it can be a problem.

What makes you think the USDT has no money?I think they have already confirmed that their coin is tied to $ US.It seems to me a better way to save funds than in USDT you currently do not have.

thisnewcoin

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If you want to convert huge money in crypto for a long time like 2-3 years, that won't be easy for you actually. Exchanges are not safe to do it, Coinbase will ask the KYC for sure as it is about huge money. The only solution is a hardware wallet and USDC! In hardware wallet, you are free from KYC and you can create a USDC deposit address too. I would not recommend DAI, USDT!

Mammothcoin

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You did make a valid point as regards bitcoin's value being unstable. Since you're interested in keeping your money safe from your country's government, I suggest you could get DAI while investing a portion of your funds into bitcoin(an amount you can feel comfortable investing, people's risk appetite differ), that way you can also profit from the potential appreciation in price of Bitcoin.

Harlot

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Isn't this called tax evasion already? And what you are trying to do is illegal? I know taxes are a burden but everbody has to pay it and just hiding it whether it is from Paypal funds or with Bitcoin you are just getting yourself in a lot of trouble with the law solely because you don't want to pay any kind of tax. You might be shocked with the tax rate you have but you might don't know the real tax obligation you have so maybe you must ask a friend first the one who knows taxes if the tax obligation you know is the one you really have to pay. By the way in most countries tax rates aren't fix and it depends on how much income you are earning so 20% might be the tax rate for a higher bracket which you don't belong in.

bolepo

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Rodeo02
why not save it all on bitcoin. As I said, I can win a lot and loose a lot.
I prefer to just keep what I earn and not hope my money will be worth something in the future.

Balladtony77
Its not huge money, its about 2-4k each month. I thought that I don't have to use my own bank to buy crypro.
I planned to buy crypto with the money I got from my buyers. Thus these money will never step on my personal bank.

CryptoVzla
Thats is as important question actually, what will happen when I will want to withdraw my money.

aomakun
I don't want to invest the money as I said. Only to save it on a anonymous "wallet".

posi
I don't think there is an inflation coming in the next two or three years. But stablecoins which backed with gold can be also a good solution. what do others think about that?

K4C
Thanks thats very smart and safe plan.

diazepam666
Please read I don't want to invest the money. Just to keep it as is safe.

bitbollo
Thanks I will take that in my mind, after knowing the potential risk.

Ucy
Yes most of the replies suggest this DAI stablecoin, and of course I can pay the taxes once I want to withdraw.

pixie85

You are right, if I will withdraw the money to my bank in few years I still will pay the taxes but there is always an option I will withdraw
small amounts for cash and never put it in my bank. Thats the basic of what I planned to do.

Any as someone suggested here, my country is not relevant right now but if I will keep the money on other bank account in different country.
Do you think it wil be a better idea? or there is high possibility the different countries can share bank information and find out.

jets567

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Well if you're afraid in Bitcoin price fluctuation and doesn't want to take high risk then converting fiat currency to stablecoin is a good option to minimize the risk but since you want to hold it for 2-3 years then having some Bitcoin is great as well because it offers a great rewards in the future and you might miss the chance of doubling or even triple your money once the bull run happen.

Blue_oxen

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Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 12:34:13 PM

Hey, I sell some stuff online and I am looking for a way to keep my money for about 2-3 years. In my country we have to pay 19% from any income to taxes, so I was thinking fuck them. First I thought about PayPal, but I'm afraid they will freeze my account like they used to do randomly. then I thought about Bitcoin, but it's very unstable and I don't want to gamble on the money.

So I have read and found out about the stable coins, Im newbie but its looks like they might be the solution for me.
1. Tether is the most famous but doesn't have the proof of funds, so one day it can be a problem.
2. USDC coinbase is asking to validate the identity in order to use it, so I afraid my country will find out about that.
3. Paxos is also asking for a documents ID.

I am not sure that I understood everything correctly, so I will be thankful if you could help me to find the best option for me.
Thanks in advance.

So why not try trading with people who want to buy or sell coins? It is called OTC but you are not going through exchange intermediaries. You can hire a reputable intermediary and conduct transactions between the two sides, at that time, the coins are transferred from one wallet to another and there is no trace. Besides, the government cannot know where your income comes from, just a friend who transfers money to your account. everything is going smoothly and nothing happens, I have tried this method and it is quite effective.

StephenJH

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For avoiding tax, go to a foreign country and open a bank account. No one is going to trace your foreign bank accounts unless there is a specific agreement between the governments. On the other hand, using stable coins will give you a headache which can cost you more in case they found your tricks. Instead of using stable coins, you can buy LTC and hold it for the right time. In any case, just pass the KYC on big exchanges.

enhu

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BTC should be your first option since after all you will be keeping yours for 2-3 years. Holding stablecoin would just make it sleep so make it at least more valuable that by the time passby your money will be worth more than its value the last time.

Quote from: Ucy on December 08, 2019, 01:25:03 PM

Not sharing this to encourage you to avoid paying taxes. It's just so you know that there are safer alternatives to one of the stablecoin you listed, and that is DAI. It's a decentralized stablecoin. It's basically a stable version of decentralized cryptocurrencies. You can store your coins in stablecoin as long as possible until you need to convert to fiat and pay the taxes if necessary.

As much as we don't wanna teach him, he already learned it with stablecoin. I'm just not sure where he is from but BTC can be taxed.

pixie85

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Hiding your held bitcoin is pretty easy but you won't be able to hide them when you sell. What does it matter if you pay 19% after a year or 19% after 3 years when you finally sell? It will be all the same. Most countries know that it's very hard to prove somebody bought bitcoins so they don't bother to look. They just wait until you sell and tax your profits then.

If you want to buy anonymously do it on one of the exchanges that don't require KYC for smaller purchases and buy there or use a DEX.

Ucy

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Compare rates on different exchanges & swap.

Not sharing this to encourage you to avoid paying taxes. It's just so you know that there are safer alternatives to one of the stablecoin you listed, and that is DAI. It's a decentralized stablecoin. It's basically a stable version of decentralized cryptocurrencies. You can store your coins in stablecoin as long as possible until you need to convert to fiat and pay the taxes if necessary.

nekonyun

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I think tether is the safest for now because it is a stable coin and also a cryptocurrency, and for guaranteed security because it uses a blockchain system

bitbollo

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Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 12:34:13 PM

Hey, I sell some stuff online and I am looking for a way to keep my money for about 2-3 years. In my country we have to pay 19% from any income to taxes, so I was thinking fuck them. First I thought about PayPal, but I'm afraid they will freeze my account like they used to do randomly. then I thought about Bitcoin, but it's very unstable and I don't want to gamble on the money.

So I have read and found out about the stable coins, Im newbie but its looks like they might be the solution for me.
1. Tether is the most famous but doesn't have the proof of funds, so one day it can be a problem.
2. USDC coinbase is asking to validate the identity in order to use it, so I afraid my country will find out about that.
3. Paxos is also asking for a documents ID.

I am not sure that I understood everything correctly, so I will be thankful if you could help me to find the best option for me.
Thanks in advance.

Any "stablecoin" or coins linked to a "fiat" currency is able to freeze your found... and other things that are not the best for you. I don't know which is your country, but most of times it could be better follow these regulations, due other fine to pay, in some country they have also jail for that crimes.

Note: Btc value is stable! 1 btc will have the same value, 1 btc FOR EVER! Wink

diazepam666

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Better for your safety you can keep all the currencies in Bitcoin alone whenever you need you can exchange of Bitcoin with very little amount on localbitcoins.
If you do it very less you will not get any trouble from the government.
Please check the rules for cryptocurrencies and caching to fiat in your country before you plan for it.

K4C

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You could always purchase from other services like local bitcoin but if I were to suggest, I would say you should buy any Cryptocurrency you can get your hands on and then convert them to anyone of your choice in an exchange... For example if you could purchase Bitcoin without identity verification, you could transfer it to Binance exchange or any other reputable exchanges and easily convert it to USDC even without identity verification, the beauty of Cryptocurrencies is that you can exchange almost every major one with another one in almost all exchanges.

posi

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Quote from: bolepo on December 08, 2019, 12:34:13 PM

Hey, I sell some stuff online and I am looking for a way to keep my money for about 2-3 years. In my country we have to pay 19% from any income to taxes, so I was thinking fuck them. First I thought about PayPal, but I'm afraid they will freeze my account like they used to do randomly. then I thought about Bitcoin, but it's very unstable and I don't want to gamble on the money.

So I have read and found out about the stable coins, Im newbie but its looks like they might be the solution for me.
1. Tether is the most famous but doesn't have the proof of funds, so one day it can be a problem.
2. USDC coinbase is asking to validate the identity in order to use it, so I afraid my country will find out about that.
3. Paxos is also asking for a documents ID.

I am not sure that I understood everything correctly, so I will be thankful if you could help me to find the best option for me.
Thanks in advance.

Avoiding tax is not a good habit cause it can get you into huge trouble but the stablecoins you mentioned are still not a good option for you to keep your fund intact because they are all backed with fiat currency which can loose value due to inflation but there's a stablecoin which is backed with gold, here is there ANN thread and you dont need any sort of document or KYC to get one. However, i believe your money will be safe using such stable coin.

kro55

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Quote from: Rodeo02 on December 08, 2019, 12:49:48 PM

Why not use bitcoin and create your own wallet ? The only problem is the price volatility of bitcoin ans if the price will drop but if the price will increase its a win situation to you.

That's the key point OP is missing. Bitcoin is known for its wild swings in both directions. Who knows the speculated price of Bitcoin 50k or 100k may be achieved in the next 2 to 3 years. But for that one has to take risk.
Other risk-free investments in the crypto market are stable coins only as far as I know

aomakun

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Quote from: #Darren on December 08, 2019, 01:00:04 PM

Stable coins are the best choice, you are not taking part in any run, but your money is safe and decentralised. Put your fingers away from such garbage as Tether and use only decentralised stable coins like DAI.

it's good to use Stablecoin to save funds, if the goal is only to save then Stablecoin can be used as a reference. but if the goal is to invest maybe you need to see altcoin or bitcoin as an investment. and make sure you are absolutely sure to save your funds in crypto

#Darren

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Stable coins are the best choice, you are not taking part in any run, but your money is safe and decentralised. Put your fingers away from such garbage as Tether and use only decentralised stable coins like DAI.

CryptoVzla

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you can try stable coin named SAI / DAI , its fully decentralized stable coin!
ive use it for a year and nothing problem, no one can track you .. but the problem is when you gonna withdrawls the money to bank
i think they still can track your money

Balladtony77

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Forgive me if i am wrong, sounds like you are trying to embezzle some huge money? if yes you have to go through KYC, i haven't heard about using Fiat to buy crypto without the involvement of any third party, you will have to send out fiat from your account, that is a trace you can't escape

Rodeo02

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Why not use bitcoin and create your own wallet ? The only problem is the price volatility of bitcoin ans if the price will drop but if the price will increase its a win situation to you.
Also i want to know if you are only looking for stable coin?

Nalbo

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DAI is a USD stable coin that won't ask you for documentation.
It's a decentralized stable coin and can be store in a safe private wallet and access it only when you are in a favourable place.

bolepo

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Hey, I sell some stuff online and I am looking for a way to keep my money for about 2-3 years. In my country we have to pay 19% from any income to taxes, so I was thinking fuck them. First I thought about PayPal, but I'm afraid they will freeze my account like they used to do randomly. then I thought about Bitcoin, but it's very unstable and I don't want to gamble on the money.

So I have read and found out about the stable coins, Im newbie but its looks like they might be the solution for me.
1. Tether is the most famous but doesn't have the proof of funds, so one day it can be a problem.
2. USDC coinbase is asking to validate the identity in order to use it, so I afraid my country will find out about that.
3. Paxos is also asking for a documents ID.

I am not sure that I understood everything correctly, so I will be thankful if you could help me to find the best option for me.
Thanks in advance.

edit:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.53294999

Topic: Hide my money from my country (Read 756 times)