How about a solar power source for pop one price mining

Steamtyme

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Quote from: philipma1957 on October 30, 2018, 08:48:57 PM

No this was to be a portable setup to mine with say 1 or 2 L3+ or 600 to 1400 watts.

Mine only in the day.
The inverters are not any good.

Okay I see. That is a neat idea would have been cool if you had found reliable equipment. I could fishing shacks everywhere running these all winter.

Looks like your running into more and more competition for land to keep expanding the arrays. Nice to see Solar catching on, here's to hoping you can expand next year and don't have cycle as much equipment just keeping pumping that hashrate.

MoparMiningLLC

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Quote from: philipma1957 on October 31, 2018, 10:35:36 PM

Yeah I am taking a shot and pointing it to this pool.

http://solo.ckpool.org/users/1JdC6Xg3ajT3rge3FgPNSYYFpmf53Vbtje

the odds are slim

could use Nastypool as well - its not fully solo as there are a couple of people in the pool but I dont think they have found a block since May.

philipma1957

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'The right to privacy matters'

Quote from: MoparMiningLLC on October 31, 2018, 08:17:59 PM

ahh gotcha, yea that is a good deal!

Yeah I am taking a shot and pointing it to this pool.

http://solo.ckpool.org/users/1JdC6Xg3ajT3rge3FgPNSYYFpmf53Vbtje

the odds are slim

MoparMiningLLC

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Quote from: philipma1957 on October 31, 2018, 06:48:49 PM

No someone gave me a deal he is hosting 3 of my s9i for 130 a month total.

Which is under 5 cents a kwatt.

ahh gotcha, yea that is a good deal!

philipma1957

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'The right to privacy matters'

Quote from: MoparMiningLLC on October 30, 2018, 09:36:06 PM

man that sucks about the properties - I wish I could turn my spare lot next to my house into an array - its only about 1.5 acres though.

also, someone is paying 130 a month to host s9's is that per each one? or total for all 3?

No someone gave me a deal he is hosting 3 of my s9i for 130 a month total.

Which is under 5 cents a kwatt.

MoparMiningLLC

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man that sucks about the properties - I wish I could turn my spare lot next to my house into an array - its only about 1.5 acres though.

also, someone is paying 130 a month to host s9's is that per each one? or total for all 3?

philipma1957

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'The right to privacy matters'

Quote from: Steamtyme on October 30, 2018, 08:39:49 PM

Was this for the second Solar array you were planning? That sucks, as I feel you have a good model for what is available to people. How long does that kill the project for?

Not everyone has grants, investment capital or the right environment but it is a good project for those that do, especially if they want to mine with cheap energy costs. ( After the initial investment of course)

No this was to be a portable setup to mine with say 1 or 2 L3+ or 600 to 1400 watts.

Mine only in the day.
The inverters are not any good.

As for a big array a 73 acre site was too far and had a lot of setup issues.

A 28 acre site that was perfect we lost the auction.

We have an empty 7 acre site and the town won't give approvals.

So we have not expanded power the whole year.

I did get a very small contract for hosting 3 s9i's at 130 per month. Which is nice. as that is under 5 cents a kwatt.

I helped a guy with his 50 miner farm and he contracted 3/50 of it to me.

cheap power is tough to get.

Steamtyme

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Was this for the second Solar array you were planning? That sucks, as I feel you have a good model for what is available to people. How long does that kill the project for?

Not everyone has grants, investment capital or the right environment but it is a good project for those that do, especially if they want to mine with cheap energy costs. ( After the initial investment of course)

philipma1957

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'The right to privacy matters'

We got more bad invertors. so 0 for 2. pretty much a busted project.

qctechno_isback

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For current sharing, I use smart diode with only 26mV forward voltage drop at 8A
It can handle 15A max. Useful for DIY solar project.
Solve voltage drop and power dissipation, very nice.

PDF
http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/sm74611.pdf

Where to buy
https://www.newark.com/texas-instruments/sm74611kttr/hot-swap-controller-30v-to-263/dp/54Y4755?cjevent=d386339fcb1411e880dc00090a240610&CMP=AFF-CJ-7642757-Newark%20Product%20Catalog&source=CJ&CAWELAID=120185550002204491

MoparMiningLLC

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aight - thanks for all the advice everyone - I will work on them in the upcoming week and let you all know if I make any progress.

Hockeybum

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Quote from: MoparMiningLLC on October 06, 2018, 03:23:03 PM

my roof slants to the east on the back and to the west on the front - the house is lined up with one end facing south and the other end facing north. the only angle they have is to the east or west based on pitch of the roof. as close as they are together, can they angle them to the south? or would they need to space them out more? I would think that to optimize the opportunity - even if for a few hours each day for it to reach its full potential. So far, they are still stone walling me - but maybe move 4 panels from the 7.7 to bring it down to 27 panels - move those 4 over to the 3.8 inverter bringing that one to 10 panels and then ask for three more to bring it to 13?

On an east and west facing roof you would not want to angle them to the south because then you will be introducing shading to the panels closely spaced together, especially with the lower sun angles in winter. Also with tilting introduced it will destroy the aesthetics of a low profile system. With east and west facing orientation you will also have a certain percent power reduction, I think it would be about 85% but don’t quote me on that, it’s been 18 years since I designed my system.

philipma1957

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'The right to privacy matters'

Quote from: MoparMiningLLC on October 06, 2018, 03:23:03 PM

my roof slants to the east on the back and to the west on the front - the house is lined up with one end facing south and the other end facing north. the only angle they have is to the east or west based on pitch of the roof. as close as they are together, can they angle them to the south? or would they need to space them out more? I would think that to optimize the opportunity - even if for a few hours each day for it to reach its full potential. So far, they are still stone walling me - but maybe move 4 panels from the 7.7 to bring it down to 27 panels - move those 4 over to the 3.8 inverter bringing that one to 10 panels and then ask for three more to bring it to 13?

like I said there are specific string patterns when you wire panels and since there are a lot of panels involved across two inverters I can not tell you what is optimum . Also I am a knowledgeble but not licensed to do the work.

They did cheat you with just the 7.7 kwatt inverter installed

They added the 3.8 kwatt inverter and 5 panels at 295 = 1455

They should add more panels to the 3.8 kwatt inverter.

Tell you cheated me at first as 7.7 kwatt inverter was too small

and while you gave me a 3.8 kwatt inverter later you only gave me 5 panels with a total of 1455 watts.

I should get at leas 5 more panels or I will have to get a lawyer.

It is worth a shot. Tell them I don want to have to do face book and youtube attacks over 5 more panels. bottom line is you did cheat with the 7.7kwatt inverter it was too small. How many of the 400 installs did you do like that? I don't want trouble and I don't want to be an a-hole
but I am not the company that put in only a 7.7kwatt inverter .

Tell them You took a shot you got caught by me a simple fix is 5 or 6 or 7 more panels.

try 7 panels then drop a little . fact is they did not put in a proper inverter 7.7kwatts was to small.

the 3.8 is a good fix but it needs more then the 5 panels they added.

MoparMiningLLC

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my roof slants to the east on the back and to the west on the front - the house is lined up with one end facing south and the other end facing north. the only angle they have is to the east or west based on pitch of the roof. as close as they are together, can they angle them to the south? or would they need to space them out more? I would think that to optimize the opportunity - even if for a few hours each day for it to reach its full potential. So far, they are still stone walling me - but maybe move 4 panels from the 7.7 to bring it down to 27 panels - move those 4 over to the 3.8 inverter bringing that one to 10 panels and then ask for three more to bring it to 13?

philipma1957

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'The right to privacy matters'

yeah I read that 7.7 can do a max of 8100 watts in and it sends a max of 7700 x .975 =

7500 or 7.5 kwatts which was the most it could do at say 12 noon to 1 pm on a bright sunny day if and only if you roof allows for the perfect tilt say 30 degrees and faces south .

So they lied a lot when then set it up with only the 7.7 kwatt inverter

now they added a 3.8 kwatt and some panels.

but I have no idea of the way the panels are wired i really they should have under 7700/295 =26.1 or 27 panels

and 3800/295 = 12.88 or 13 panels

but panels have specific dc volts so a string of 7 works but a string of 8 does not

I also don't know how they tied the 2 inverters together .

but to me they certainly tried cheating you when they only put in a 7.7kwatt inverter.

they tried fixing it adding on. Ask for more panels to the 3.8 see what they say.

Hockeybum

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You probably don’t need to because you will never have those modules producing maximum power under ideal conditions.

And I need to make a small correction, your 7.7 kW inverter is CEC rated at 97%, the 3.8 kW inverter is 96.5%.

MoparMiningLLC

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Quote from: Hockeybum on October 06, 2018, 10:01:45 AM

Need Phil or Notfuzzy for this one to verify my numbers or correct me where I’m wrong:

Your 7.7 kW inverter has a maximum usable DC load of 8100 watts at 240 volts.
You have 31 solar modules each 295 watts = 9145 watts, with wiring losses ~8,230 watts going through that one inverter. It seems to me that you might have 1 solar module too many going through that inverter, or maybe the inverter is able to handle all that power your modules can produce under the most favorable conditions (full sun, cool day) for a short period. Your CEC rating, and I’m in California so I’m not sure if the rest of the nation uses CEC, is 96.5 so the most power that inverter can produce is 7,816.5 watts AC and with an average of 4.5 hours of sunlight per day over the course of a year, you should produce on average 35.2 kWh per day with just that inverter.

So you added 5 more 295 watt solar modules and a 3.8 kW inverter. That inverter can handle 4000 watts of DC power at 240 volts. 5 x 295 = 1,475 x .9 = 1327 watts so with the CEC rating factored in you can produce an additional 5.8 kWh per day for a total of 41 kWh on average per day.

The good news is that your 3.8 kW inverter can handle up to 15 solar modules at 295 watts so you have room to add 10 more solar modules to your system. Doing that will get you a total system of about 53 kWh per day on average, it will definitely get you close to a 60 kWh per day range this time of year if your existing system is giving you 45-46 kWh per day now.

so, you think it might help to shift some of the panels from the 7.7 to the 3.8? They did say the first inverter was maxxed and that is why they added the second one - so maybe the panels are producing more than the first inverter can handle? that would mean I am just losing that energy right?

Hockeybum

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Need Phil or Notfuzzy for this one to verify my numbers or correct me where I’m wrong:

Your 7.7 kW inverter has a maximum usable DC load of 8100 watts at 240 volts.
You have 31 solar modules each 295 watts = 9145 watts, with wiring losses ~8,230 watts going through that one inverter. It seems to me that you might have 1 solar module too many going through that inverter, or maybe the inverter is able to handle all that power your modules can produce under the most favorable conditions (full sun, cool day) for a short period. Your CEC rating, and I’m in California so I’m not sure if the rest of the nation uses CEC, is 96.5 so the most power that inverter can produce is 7,816.5 watts AC and with an average of 4.5 hours of sunlight per day over the course of a year, you should produce on average 35.2 kWh per day with just that inverter.

So you added 5 more 295 watt solar modules and a 3.8 kW inverter. That inverter can handle 4000 watts of DC power at 240 volts. 5 x 295 = 1,475 x .9 = 1327 watts so with the CEC rating factored in you can produce an additional 5.8 kWh per day for a total of 41 kWh on average per day.

The good news is that your 3.8 kW inverter can handle up to 15 solar modules at 295 watts so you have room to add 10 more solar modules to your system. Doing that will get you a total system of about 53 kWh per day on average, it will definitely get you close to a 60 kWh per day range this time of year if your existing system is giving you 45-46 kWh per day now.

MoparMiningLLC

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Quote from: Hockeybum on October 06, 2018, 12:57:01 AM

http://files.sma.de/dl/27676/SB30-77-1SP-US-40-IA-xx-14.pdf

Technical Data starts on page 65

Stryfe: assuming a 120/240 volt system, is that correct? Mine is 120/208 volts but I don’t believe that it’s as common as 120/240 volts.

yes 120/240

Hockeybum

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http://files.sma.de/dl/27676/SB30-77-1SP-US-40-IA-xx-14.pdf

Technical Data starts on page 65

Stryfe: assuming a 120/240 volt system, is that correct? Mine is 120/208 volts but I don’t believe that it’s as common as 120/240 volts.

MoparMiningLLC

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Quote from: philipma1957 on October 05, 2018, 12:58:27 PM

can you list the make and model of the inverter .. I may be able to find out what it is rated for and see if it is good enough for

12kwatts in panels

these are the inverters I have - https://www.sma-america.com/products/solarinverters/sunny-boy-30-us-38-us-50-us-60-us-70-us-77-us.html

the 3.8-US and the 7.7-US

NotFuzzyWarm

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Evil beware: We have waffles!

Quote from: MoparMiningLLC on October 05, 2018, 01:02:19 PM

if it comes to it and there is a need to show that the miners do not affect production - not sure how anyone with common sense would think that they do though - then I will shut them down.

If you do then I suggest you replace the load with electric heaters. That way you are comparing the same verifiable power consumption to any changes you see. Of course since kwh is kwh regardless of what the load is you should see the same numbers.

And before someone niggles, miner PSU's use power-factor correction circuits so they are NOT a significant reactive load which is different than a purely resistive load like heaters. Yes slightly reactive but typically corrected to better than 99% of 1:1.

Hockeybum

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Sometimes courts aren't about common sense. It's more about calculating risks and removing doubt. You don't know the judge's background, you don't know the other side's tactics. If you can remove one doubt from the equation you will be better off in court.

"The law, for all its failings, has a noble goal - to make the little bit of life that people can actually control more just" - Scott Turow

MoparMiningLLC

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Quote from: Hockeybum on October 05, 2018, 12:51:38 PM

I'm not sure about privacy laws in your state, but don't assume that you can bring in an audio (if you have)/video recording if the other party had an expectation of privacy. If the cameras recorded audio and video you may only be allowed to show the video portion without audio. If you only have video it will carry a little weight as it makes your side more believable. Remember in civil court you just have to show your case with a preponderance of the evidence. Again, not sure about the laws in your state, make sure to check on that.

And this next part won't make sense, but because the company stated that your miner was the cause of the lack of electricity production, you might want to remove it temporarily. By removing it you can show them and/or your attorney or the courts that it made no difference to the production of power of the solar panels. You want to remove all doubt in the judges mind, and the judge might be confused between production and consumption. If the solar company brings it up in court or even next week you can say that it's been disconnected on such and such date and it's made no difference to the production. I only say this because you stated that the reason for the solar installation was to keep you in Tier 1. You then installed a miner which uses 1,000 kWh a month which keeps you out of Tier 1, but without the miner you state that you would still be out of tier 1. It would just be cleaner to stick with your story of wanting to stay in Tier 1, the solar installation was designed for that purpose, you were promised 65 kWh per day to keep you in Tier 1, and the system isn't working as promised. It's a lot easier than jumping through hoops and defending your connection of a 1,000 kWh a month device that you'll need to explain in court, which nobody will understand.

yea the privacy laws state you cannot record someone's audio without their permission - my property does have visual signs announcing that property has cameras - whether their coming on the property upon seeing those signs amounts to consent or not - unknown.

if it comes to it and there is a need to show that the miners do not affect production - not sure how anyone with common sense would think that they do though - then I will shut them down.

Quote from: philipma1957 on October 05, 2018, 12:58:27 PM

This is good advice.

Also consider telling the solar company you would stop complaining and not take them to court if they add 5 more panels. With an appropriate invertor.

can you list the make and model of the inverter .. I may be able to find out what it is rated for and see if it is good enough for

12kwatts in panels

I will get the inverter make model when I go home today and update it here. There are 2 inverters on my system.

philipma1957

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'The right to privacy matters'

Quote from: Hockeybum on October 05, 2018, 12:51:38 PM

I'm not sure about privacy laws in your state, but don't assume that you can bring in an audio (if you have)/video recording if the other party had an expectation of privacy. If the cameras recorded audio and video you may only be allowed to show the video portion without audio. If you only have video it will carry a little weight as it makes your side more believable. Remember in civil court you just have to show your case with a preponderance of the evidence. Again, not sure about the laws in your state, make sure to check on that.

And this next part won't make sense, but because the company stated that your miner was the cause of the lack of electricity production, you might want to remove it temporarily. By removing it you can show them and/or your attorney or the courts that it made no difference to the production of power of the solar panels. You want to remove all doubt in the judges mind, and the judge might be confused between production and consumption. If the solar company brings it up in court or even next week you can say that it's been disconnected on such and such date and it's made no difference to the production. I only say this because you stated that the reason for the solar installation was to keep you in Tier 1. You then installed a miner which uses 1,000 kWh a month which keeps you out of Tier 1, but without the miner you state that you would still be out of tier 1. It would just be cleaner to stick with your story of wanting to stay in Tier 1, the solar installation was designed for that purpose, you were promised 65 kWh per day to keep you in Tier 1, and the system isn't working as promised. It's a lot easier than jumping through hoops and defending your connection of a 1,000 kWh a month device that you'll need to explain in court, which nobody will understand.

This is good advice.

Also consider telling the solar company you would stop complaining and not take them to court if they add 5 more panels. With an appropriate invertor.

can you list the make and model of the inverter .. I may be able to find out what it is rated for and see if it is good enough for

12kwatts in panels

Hockeybum

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Activity: 113

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I'm not sure about privacy laws in your state, but don't assume that you can bring in an audio (if you have)/video recording if the other party had an expectation of privacy. If the cameras recorded audio and video you may only be allowed to show the video portion without audio. If you only have video it will carry a little weight as it makes your side more believable. Remember in civil court you just have to show your case with a preponderance of the evidence. Again, not sure about the laws in your state, make sure to check on that.

And this next part won't make sense, but because the company stated that your miner was the cause of the lack of electricity production, you might want to remove it temporarily. By removing it you can show them and/or your attorney or the courts that it made no difference to the production of power of the solar panels. You want to remove all doubt in the judges mind, and the judge might be confused between production and consumption. If the solar company brings it up in court or even next week you can say that it's been disconnected on such and such date and it's made no difference to the production. I only say this because you stated that the reason for the solar installation was to keep you in Tier 1. You then installed a miner which uses 1,000 kWh a month which keeps you out of Tier 1, but without the miner you state that you would still be out of tier 1. It would just be cleaner to stick with your story of wanting to stay in Tier 1, the solar installation was designed for that purpose, you were promised 65 kWh per day to keep you in Tier 1, and the system isn't working as promised. It's a lot easier than jumping through hoops and defending your connection of a 1,000 kWh a month device that you'll need to explain in court, which nobody will understand.

MoparMiningLLC

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I own them outright. The system was 35k - or about $180 a month for 20 years. Their claim was that it would produce on average of $173-186 worth of electricity (65kwh - 70kwh) per month. And with rates going up each year (average for my company is 2% increase per year) the payment would be less than the electric cost.

as you put: 1380 kwatts a month - at .86 per kwh that would cost me 118.68 per month from the electric company. at 180 per month it is close to .13 per kwh.

That being said, I did get a $10.5k tax credit so the system really cost just under 25k. so for the cost should I use 25k or 35k? I used the actual cost without taking account for the tax credit.

philipma1957

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'The right to privacy matters'

Quote from: MoparMiningLLC on October 05, 2018, 11:31:46 AM

I will look at the contract more closely - Not sure if the average is stated directly in there - but I do have several emails - and I have the owner of the company in my house with 3 of his employees also stating it - all recorded on video (alarm system has built in cameras which record rolling 7 days) I saved the clips from when they were here.

Phil - I dont want an L3 and I dont have an issue with paying the electric cost - my only issue is they promised 65-70 per day and its averaging nearly 20 below that. Basically, it would be cheaper to buy the electricity outright than to have the solar. If I average out what I paid for the system into a monthly payment methodology:

The systems average output is 45.36 kw/h and that averages to 12.9 cents per kw/h in cost compared to the 8.6 cents per kw/h the electric company would charge. This is a 50% increased cost per kw/h.

cross post check other solution which is run s-9 8 hours a day

how did you get this number in bold?

they charged you for 10.5 kwatt of power in the panels .

you are making 1380 kwatts a month or 16,560 kwatts a year x 12.9 cents = 2136.24 a year in power.

or should I ask did you pay for a lease ? or outright ownership?

MoparMiningLLC

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Quote from: Hockeybum on October 05, 2018, 11:01:10 AM

I’m sorry for your frustration, but before you get a lawyer take a good look at your contract with them. Are they selling you promised pv production or selling you a system of modules and inverters? If 65-70 kWh average per day is stated in the contract then you will most likely win in court. If you have emails back and forth with them claiming your system will produce 65-70 kWh per day then you probably have a good case. If it’s not in the contract or an email then it will be your word against theirs, and the contract will probably decide the case. I’m not a lawyer but I do have a minor in business contract law and I have been involved in solar pv criminal and civil cases, and just recently a bitcoin mining case against a utility district. I’m not giving legal advice as to whether or not you have a case, just giving my opinion to look at your contract with the company before exploring legal options.

Also, as your system produces 1,380 kWh per month right now and just 1 S9 consumes about 1,000 kWh per month you might want to disconnect your asic miner if your goal is to stay within tier rate 1.

I will look at the contract more closely - Not sure if the average is stated directly in there - but I do have several emails - and I have the owner of the company in my house with 3 of his employees also stating it - all recorded on video (alarm system has built in cameras which record rolling 7 days) I saved the clips from when they were here.

Phil - I dont want an L3 and I dont have an issue with paying the electric cost - my only issue is they promised 65-70 per day and its averaging nearly 20 below that. Basically, it would be cheaper to buy the electricity outright than to have the solar. If I average out what I paid for the system into a monthly payment methodology:

The systems average output is 45.36 kw/h and that averages to 12.9 cents per kw/h in cost compared to the 8.6 cents per kw/h the electric company would charge. This is a 50% increased cost per kw/h.

philipma1957

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'The right to privacy matters'

he is better off with an l3+ it can use the free power software and pull 700 watts to do close to 500 mh which is around 1.60 a day in earnings

a s9 pulls 1400 watts does 14th and earns
3.10 a day

so one does 500 kwatts a month earns 1.60
the other does 1000 kwatts a month earns 3.10

if he powers the 1 l3+ off 12 hours he drops to 250kwatts earns .80 x 30 = 24 bucks

or he could run the s9 8 hours a day say 9 to 5 it would earn about 1.03 usd a day

and spend 333 kwatts a month this is his best move as he is 1380 -333 = 1047 kwatts better off

Hockeybum

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I’m sorry for your frustration, but before you get a lawyer take a good look at your contract with them. Are they selling you promised pv production or selling you a system of modules and inverters? If 65-70 kWh average per day is stated in the contract then you will most likely win in court. If you have emails back and forth with them claiming your system will produce 65-70 kWh per day then you probably have a good case. If it’s not in the contract or an email then it will be your word against theirs, and the contract will probably decide the case. I’m not a lawyer but I do have a minor in business contract law and I have been involved in solar pv criminal and civil cases, and just recently a bitcoin mining case against a utility district. I’m not giving legal advice as to whether or not you have a case, just giving my opinion to look at your contract with the company before exploring legal options.

Also, as your system produces 1,380 kWh per month right now and just 1 S9 consumes about 1,000 kWh per month you might want to disconnect your asic miner if your goal is to stay within tier rate 1.

MoparMiningLLC

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Quote from: Steamtyme on October 05, 2018, 09:26:17 AM

I've been reading through this thread, mostly because I wish I could be running with a Solar set up at the moment. Maybe in time.

Without knowing the specifics of the contract, wording can be a bitch sometimes. Phils suggestion of a Lawyer may be the best course of action. Arguably if the average that should be produced is 65-70 KW per day, shouldn't a system having been in operation since April have been showing an average equal to or greater than those number to date??

I say that because summer should be the higher generation period with the average being dragged down through the Winter.

I'm curious about this blame the Asic approach, do they give any explanation for why they think that?

I am close to getting a lawyer. their claim is that I should be getting 65-70, but as Phil's math shows, that is not possible based on what they provided. The reason that the goal was 65-70 is that prior to my running of ASIC's my average consumption was close to 85 kwh per day. Their promise was to produce between 82%-83% of my average usage - this would then keep me in tier one pricing of .05 per kw/h for the amount I use over the production of the panels - which would have been 20 - 25 kwh per day or 600 to 750 kw/h per month (tier one is up to 1,000 kwh)

however, as I now run the ASIC's I am using considerably way more power - so they think my frustration is because of the bill - when I am instead frustrated about that it is not producing what they claimed - their way of calculating was way different than Phil's - so because it falls short, they first blame the ASIC's and when I then state that is consumption not production - they then try to blame the weather or blame trees etc - the closest tree to my house is nearly 150 feet away and my roof is never shaded. So while weather may affect it, we simply have clear days 90% of the time. On the bad weather days, the average production is between 20-30 kwh per day. I do realize that brings my overall average down. This is a 10.6 kwh system, or as Phil pointed out after taking into account for loss from wiring/inverters etc a 9.5kwh system - it has only ever gotten above 6kwh at any given time maybe 5 times and never over 8kwh at any time, not even for an hour.

Quote from: Hockeybum on October 05, 2018, 09:10:02 AM

The calculation is quite simple. 18 kW x .9 for wire losses x .95 for efficient inverters x average sun hours per day where you live (about 4.5).

I do understand and I do appreciate the help - I just wish the company I used understood it. I think they are overcharging and overstating and for 99% of their clients this may work as it does keep them in tier 1 pricing so their bill is cheaper and thus they may never actually look at the production.

MoparMiningLLC

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Quote from: Hockeybum on October 05, 2018, 09:10:02 AM

There’s your first mistake, don’t count the hours the panels are generating electricity. Phil knows what he is talking about and is trying to help you understand PV production. I’ve had a 14 kW DC system since 2001. We are trying to help you understand what you will produce on average per day over a year. If you want to produce 65-70 kWh on average per day you will need about a 17-18 kW DC system in Florida depending on how efficient your inverters are. The calculation is quite simple. 18 kW x .9 for wire losses x .95 for efficient inverters x average sun hours per day where you live (about 4.5).

and I get that - have said that as well - again the angst here is that the company that did the install did not understand it this way and so when they explained it to me as to what it would produce was wrong - the problem is I paid based on their estimate not Phil's (Phil's is more accurate) and they refuse to see it that way. they simply blame the solar panels as the reason why it is under producing --- when in reality it is not underproducing - they simply overstated. but since that is what the agreed to provide, they should have to provide what they promised - a system that generates on average of 65-70 kwh per day.

Steamtyme

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I've been reading through this thread, mostly because I wish I could be running with a Solar set up at the moment. Maybe in time.

Without knowing the specifics of the contract, wording can be a bitch sometimes. Phils suggestion of a Lawyer may be the best course of action. Arguably if the average that should be produced is 65-70 KW per day, shouldn't a system having been in operation since April have been showing an average equal to or greater than those number to date??

I say that because summer should be the higher generation period with the average being dragged down through the Winter.

I'm curious about this blame the Asic approach, do they give any explanation for why they think that?

Hockeybum

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Quote from: MoparMiningLLC on October 05, 2018, 07:24:06 AM

sigh.... I am not sure how many times I have to say this ---- I am not counting Sunrise to Sunset --- I am counting the hours that the solar panels are generating electricity - I believe I have said this at least 3 or 4 times. The app shows me when it first starts generating and when it stops - though the first hour or so and the last hour or so are diminished - it is still producing for nearly 12 hours and has been April when it was installed.

There’s your first mistake, don’t count the hours the panels are generating electricity. Phil knows what he is talking about and is trying to help you understand PV production. I’ve had a 14 kW DC system since 2001. We are trying to help you understand what you will produce on average per day over a year. If you want to produce 65-70 kWh on average per day you will need about a 17-18 kW DC system in Florida depending on how efficient your inverters are. The calculation is quite simple. 18 kW x .9 for wire losses x .95 for efficient inverters x average sun hours per day where you live (about 4.5).

MoparMiningLLC

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sigh.... I am not sure how many times I have to say this ---- I am not counting Sunrise to Sunset --- I am counting the hours that the solar panels are generating electricity - I believe I have said this at least 3 or 4 times. The app shows me when it first starts generating and when it stops - though the first hour or so and the last hour or so are diminished - it is still producing for nearly 12 hours and has been April when it was installed.

Edit - and yes I understand about losing some to wiring/inverter etc and losing some because the angle will not always be perfect the full day.

They still are not producing what the salesman claimed - this was the first time I had gotten solar so I fell for their line of BS - I am still trying to hold them to their quoted estimates. Their claim is that they have installed over 400 systems and everyone else but me is producing what they say. They are not able to tell me why I am not anywhere near their estimates - all they do is blame the ASIC's but that is a consumption issue not a production issue. I have had that discussion with them at least a dozen times. They keep telling me to shut the miners off for 3 months and see if the panels produce more - that is the most retarded suggestion I have ever heard.

and @philipma1957 I do appreciate your break down - yours makes sense - the solar companies does not and that is my whole point with them. They promised me a system that would produce 65-70 kwh per day (on average) and have failed to do so but see the blame as mine and not theirs.

TheYankeesWin!

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yeah there are a lot of sunlight charts.

I suggest you shut the miners off 1 hour before sunset and turn them back on 1 hour after sunrise

that is 14 hours off or 420 off each month.

3x s9 use 4 kwatts x 420 = 1700 hours a month it will drop bill close to 170 usd

6x s9 use 8 kwatts x 420 = 3400 hours a month it will drop bill close to 340 usd

philipma1957

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'The right to privacy matters'

Sunrise to sunset is not how you count sunlight for the purpose of solar. First 90 minutes after sunrise and last 90 minutes count for under 1 hour of full sunlight.

If you are USA based you are inbetween 4.5 and 6 hours. For your year round average. Do you understand this.or do you not understand this.

Okay so let’s start over and try to understand basic rules.

You are stating 36 panels at 295 watts. Yes that is 10620 but you lose 10 percent or more due to wiring and inverters so drop to 9500 watts

Now those numbers are full sunshine at a perfect angle to your panels. Which is why I tell you you get 5 to 6 hours of sun a day. Even though the sun rose at 7 am and set at 7 pm.

So 6 x 9500 is 58500 watts at best. You are doing 5 x 9500 which is 47500

That is 47.5 kwatts. So the worse number would be you get 47.5 kwatts and should get 58.50 kwatts.

You should have a contract that states what you will generate 1 s9 uses 35 kwatts a day so you should run only one s9.

I have no idea what your contract reads or what you paid. If it reads you get 60 kwatts a day and you get 47 a day get a lawyer to fight them.

If it reads the panels do 10620 watts at peak you are not going to win. Since to do peak you need perfect placement like south on an angle that is just right.

That contract only states you can send 10500 watts to the inverters.

It does not say what leaves the inverters.

It is possible you have terrible invertors say 85 percent not 90 to 95 percent

Does this help you understand that you do not use 12 hours to calculate

due to clouds rain and sun angle you are in the 4.5 to 5 hour range so you can use the peak 10600 x say 5 to get 53000 and take off 10% for inverter loss

MoparMiningLLC

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well the panels are getting sun for about 12 hours - the "sunny portal" app that I log into shows when they are producing - and yes it is less at the start of the day and at the end of the day but it still is generating during the 12 hours.

and sorry - the count is 36 panels and as I corrected myself above, they are 295 watt panels so 31 x 295 = 10,620 - my average for the about 110 days I have had it is 46 per day. the system has only crossed the 6k kwh in a day maybe 3 times. I am in FL and yes, the excess can be sold back - but there is no excess. even with .056 (.086 with fuel surcharge) my bill is almost $800 per month after solar.

when they installed the system, it was originally 31 panels and they told me the panels were 290 watts and they said my average should be close to 52 kwh per day. but I was no where near that... So, they added the additional panels and a second inverter as the first one could not handle a 10 kwh system, they also told me that my panels were 295 watts each - they showed me the label from the ends of the boxes which did say 295 watts.

I attached two images - the first actually shows the system as 10.5
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1VFdz08q1ZgvsHGAs2CvbRNAnyzTQTZZC

this second one shows that my system never gets even close to 60 - all the while they state i should be mid 60's easily.
https://drive.google.com/open?id=14pdOyzn7cg8hG0iX47gr7G8Wp4s8-K-t

They are getting annoyed by me calling them so much - they claim it is working correctly and yet are not sure why it does reach what they state. Their excuse is the ASICs - though that does not affect production, it affects consumption... but that is what they always fall back to.

They wont refund the cost and remove the system and are beginning to ignore my emails and shift my calls directly to VM.

philipma1957

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Quote from: MoparMiningLLC on October 04, 2018, 10:50:55 AM

I am trying to use solar presently - I have 31 panels each are 290 watts so this is a about a 10 kw system - mine is tied to electric so if solar is not sufficient the electricity kicks in and i have no battery - however, I find it barely produces enough to power one miner for the month... I am told it should average between 61 and 71 kw/h in generation per day, but its only producing on average of 46 kw/h per day. I have zero tree cover - the panels face east to west and I get sunlight from as early as 7am and generally past 8pm each day. what am I doing wrong?

you sun does not count as 12 hours

in the usa most people are 4.5 to 6 hours.

so 31 x 290 = 8990 and with highest end inverters you have 95% so .95 x 8990 = 8540 maybe as low as .9 x 8990 = 8091

so if you are in the best state do 6 x 8540 = 51,240 or 51 kwatts max

at worst do 4.5 x 36409 or 36 kwatts

you are at 46 which is closer to 51

now here is the problem a s9i does 1.3 kwatts 24/7 so that is 31 kwatts a day.

looks like you are doing 5.5 rate to get the 46 kwatts.

So what state are you in? do you sell the excess back to the grid?

you have some excess for a few hours each day.

MoparMiningLLC

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Quote from: Hockeybum on October 04, 2018, 05:59:25 PM

Looks like you have a 9kW DC system, converting it to AC at some point. There are wiring losses and losses in converting from DC to AC. Assuming a 8.5 kW AC system with high efficiency inverters, I would average about 5.5 hours of sunlight per year in my area, not sure what your average sun hours are. So I would expect about 46-47 kWh per day on average over a year with a system that size. Granted my system is older and I’m not sure how efficient your inverter is, so I’m just guessing on the numbers. Assuming you meant you are facing directly south or at least in a southerly direction with panels in an east/west plane.

it is a 10k system - I think you say 9 because I put 290 for the panel watts - they are actual 295 I have 12+ hours of sunlight. I have 2 inverters - initially it was a smaller system, I added more panels and another inverter. as for the house, it points north to south, the panels are laying lengthways with their ends facing east/west. the sun travels unrestricted (unless bad weather) but even on a full on rain day, I still get something. The company that did the install is the one that stated I should get 62-72 kwh per day.

Hockeybum

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Quote from: MoparMiningLLC on October 04, 2018, 10:50:55 AM

I am trying to use solar presently - I have 31 panels each are 290 watts so this is a about a 10 kw system - mine is tied to electric so if solar is not sufficient the electricity kicks in and i have no battery - however, I find it barely produces enough to power one miner for the month... I am told it should average between 61 and 71 kw/h in generation per day, but its only producing on average of 46 kw/h per day. I have zero tree cover - the panels face east to west and I get sunlight from as early as 7am and generally past 8pm each day. what am I doing wrong?

Looks like you have a 9kW DC system, converting it to AC at some point. There are wiring losses and losses in converting from DC to AC. Assuming a 8.5 kW AC system with high efficiency inverters, I would average about 5.5 hours of sunlight per year in my area, not sure what your average sun hours are. So I would expect about 46-47 kWh per day on average over a year with a system that size. Granted my system is older and I’m not sure how efficient your inverter is, so I’m just guessing on the numbers. Assuming you meant you are facing directly south or at least in a southerly direction with panels in an east/west plane.

MoparMiningLLC

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I am trying to use solar presently - I have 31 panels each are 290 watts so this is a about a 10 kw system - mine is tied to electric so if solar is not sufficient the electricity kicks in and i have no battery - however, I find it barely produces enough to power one miner for the month... I am told it should average between 61 and 71 kw/h in generation per day, but its only producing on average of 46 kw/h per day. I have zero tree cover - the panels face east to west and I get sunlight from as early as 7am and generally past 8pm each day. what am I doing wrong?

philipma1957

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Quote from: qctechno_isback on August 22, 2018, 06:58:24 PM

I had this idea some times ago but find it hard to justify with grid-tie micro-inverter.
I have 2x 260W Solar Panel on my shed and 1x inverter feeding the Electrical Box, work great.

For your project, super capacitor or battery is probably needed.
If you don't eat / re-route all the current generated by solar you will blow your DC/DC. ( current source != voltage source )
You also need a MPPT circuit able to track max power from panels for best results.

Fun DIY doh, keep updating !

we finally have parts and will be testing it in the next 2 weeks.

qctechno_isback

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I had this idea some times ago but find it hard to justify with grid-tie micro-inverter.
I have 2x 260W Solar Panel on my shed and 1x inverter feeding the Electrical Box, work great.

For your project, super capacitor or battery is probably needed.
If you don't eat / re-route all the current generated by solar you will blow your DC/DC. ( current source != voltage source )
You also need a MPPT circuit able to track max power from panels for best results.

Fun DIY doh, keep updating !

philipma1957

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looks like 1000-1100 is more practical for various reasons.

working on a breakout board for a dc to dc psu that will give a stable 12 volts of power.

may need a cheap car battery to keep it 12dc volt stable

note the battery does not extend your mining over night what it does is help out during rain/clouds etc

A place like Houston would do 5-6 hours of mining a day on the average.

it may not be practical with margins so tight

Biodom

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A couple of points:

1. S9i solar panel 'doghouse' design with 1400-1600w output would be great, thanks for working on it.

2. I looked into Tesla roof...it is horrible, cost like 100-120K for my house (50% roof, before batteries) while solar panels install cost 25-30K for the same wattage. Unfortunately, i would have to replace roof before putting solar on (roof is 19 years old).

3. I am in Houston, so no local incentives, which sucks...oil men, etc.

philipma1957

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Is there any system to stay away from?

First off laws rules and incentives are different every place on earth.

Some states in the US are great and have lots of incentives other states are not good.

So you need to check where you live for incentives and rules for solar power.

philipma1957

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Quote from: R0mi on June 09, 2018, 10:52:11 PM

You may be right about shell LLC's designed to block all warranty claims, but it is possible to shield electronics from wind, wet, and snow.

I'm not saying it is street legal, but I have used your typical eBay inverters (sellers like: ChargerAngel) to backfeed power into my residence. The inverters are housed in marine battery boxes, with the top vents sealed with silicone. It's cheap, and the inverters have made it through snow, rain, Nor' Easters, and hurricane Sandy. Solar is pretty damn set it up right and forget it. Completely different than setting up miners.

If you can find a good spot to lean solar panels up against your dwelling, you can do this. You don't need to roof mount, you don't need fancy frames. Use the space underneath the panels to house inverters and whatever other electronics you are working with. Keep everything off the ground by a foot or two or three.

I haven't put a miner outside, but so long as it is elevated off the ground, and there is a decent plastic housing that is waterproof, I see no reason why this can't be done.

Also: spray silicone can help so long as you let it dry completely. As in apply it, go away for a week or more before applying power to what you sprayed. Yes, I have done this. All my Vega cards were stripped down, sprayed with silicone, Raijen Morpheus heat fins & 120mm fans applied afterwards. Very quiet, cooler than the reference blower, and running just fine.

Try the silicone spraying on something very cheap. Let it dry thoroughly. Test it.

the panels we use are these

http://sepbatteries.com/ecosolargy-230w-poly-crystalline-solar-module?gclid=CjwKCAjw9e3YBRBcEiwAzjCJuolmm5yZWCBbii562Sy355bQTVhVhQZCgbk4m4QsQCvCwwwL5c7LMxoCsYYQAvD_BwE

they are 39 by 64 inches

seven are about 23 feet wide by 5 foot 5

should do about 1610 watts which may do an s9i will certainly do 2 L3+ on a bit of a down clock

The game at the moment is cheap power. If you build the power source/panels for 1k it is viable plan with a path to profit.

Most people can't do this as they can not source parts cheap enough.

the cost for the panels on that website would be 7 x 100 = 700 so you would need to spend under 300 for inverter.

as for keeping the gear dry the big issue would be down time on the s9. as it would be turned off most of the 24 hours. and run for 6 hours or so each day.

in the winter cool air may prevent it from starting when sun comes up.

R0mi

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Theranos Coin - IoT + micro-blood arrays = Moon!

Quote from: 2112 on June 09, 2018, 06:26:42 PM

[...] Basically it has been tried already in the days when Bitcoin could still be mined by the GPU cards. Some guy did that in Germany or in Finland. It was linked on this forum, but either I can't find it or it is gone. He couldn't keep his setup working even a single full year.

The main technical point is that protection from the elements in a non-trivial undertaking. It is not only about keeping it cool, it is also about keeping it warm and dry when not operating or operating with constrained power.

The moisture condensation and icing will void any warranty for the electronics, unless you buy marine-rated equipment.

Additionally, the warranty on panels in the USA will probably be unenforceable. I've been told that those companies reselling and installing the solar equipment are intentionally created to go bankrupt, they may as well offer 100 years of warranty. That is apparently some political stuff more difficult to explain, which I don't fully understand. I didn't see the actual panels discussed in this thread, but I've seen some other sold and installed in the USA and they weren't designed to last.

I'm sorry for raining on your parade.

You may be right about shell LLC's designed to block all warranty claims, but it is possible to shield electronics from wind, wet, and snow.

I'm not saying it is street legal, but I have used your typical eBay inverters (sellers like: ChargerAngel) to backfeed power into my residence. The inverters are housed in marine battery boxes, with the top vents sealed with silicone. It's cheap, and the inverters have made it through snow, rain, Nor' Easters, and hurricane Sandy. Solar is pretty damn set it up right and forget it. Completely different than setting up miners.

If you can find a good spot to lean solar panels up against your dwelling, you can do this. You don't need to roof mount, you don't need fancy frames. Use the space underneath the panels to house inverters and whatever other electronics you are working with. Keep everything off the ground by a foot or two or three.

I haven't put a miner outside, but so long as it is elevated off the ground, and there is a decent plastic housing that is waterproof, I see no reason why this can't be done.

Also: spray silicone can help so long as you let it dry completely. As in apply it, go away for a week or more before applying power to what you sprayed. Yes, I have done this. All my Vega cards were stripped down, sprayed with silicone, Raijen Morpheus heat fins & 120mm fans applied afterwards. Very quiet, cooler than the reference blower, and running just fine.

Try the silicone spraying on something very cheap. Let it dry thoroughly. Test it.

philipma1957

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'The right to privacy matters'

Quote from: 2112 on June 09, 2018, 06:26:42 PM

[...] Basically it has been tried already in the days when Bitcoin could still be mined by the GPU cards. Some guy did that in Germany or in Finland. It was linked on this forum, but either I can't find it or it is gone. He couldn't keep his setup working even a single full year.

The main technical point is that protection from the elements in a non-trivial undertaking. It is not only about keeping it cool, it is also about keeping it warm and dry when not operating or operating with constrained power.

The moisture condensation and icing will void any warranty for the electronics, unless you buy marine-rated equipment.

Additionally, the warranty on panels in the USA will probably be unenforceable. I've been told that those companies reselling and installing the solar equipment are intentionally created to go bankrupt, they may as well offer 100 years of warranty. That is apparently some political stuff more difficult to explain, which I don't fully understand. I didn't see the actual panels discussed in this thread, but I've seen some other sold and installed in the USA and they weren't designed to last.

I'm sorry for raining on your parade.

dude I have been using a 1.5 acre array for years

works fine.

here is the thread https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1369207.0 the array has worked since april of 2016

we are simply looking at making a small version.

2112

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I did an edit of your post to get to the narrative.

Quote from: philipma1957 on June 09, 2018, 01:39:39 PM

I do have a prototype that can hold 2 L3+ or 1 S9i

It is outdoors a doghouse available at Amazon.com

I am going to take a photo or two of it now.

Sky has inverter/converter power source on order.

The power source should have a long life no batteries involved
Easy to setup no grid connection.

the panels rate 20 years
the inverter/converter is 5 or 7 years.

So if we can sell it cheap enough it could work out.

maybe it does not last the timespan it should

Basically it has been tried already in the days when Bitcoin could still be mined by the GPU cards. Some guy did that in Germany or in Finland. It was linked on this forum, but either I can't find it or it is gone. He couldn't keep his setup working even a single full year.

The main technical point is that protection from the elements in a non-trivial undertaking. It is not only about keeping it cool, it is also about keeping it warm and dry when not operating or operating with constrained power.

The moisture condensation and icing will void any warranty for the electronics, unless you buy marine-rated equipment.

Additionally, the warranty on panels in the USA will probably be unenforceable. I've been told that those companies reselling and installing the solar equipment are intentionally created to go bankrupt, they may as well offer 100 years of warranty. That is apparently some political stuff more difficult to explain, which I don't fully understand. I didn't see the actual panels discussed in this thread, but I've seen some other sold and installed in the USA and they weren't designed to last.

I'm sorry for raining on your parade.

philipma1957

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Quote from: andresrp on June 08, 2018, 04:10:50 PM

Phil, i met Sky at the training at Canaan in Beijing last April. I believe solar is a very powerful and possible idea for south american and central american countries. Excited to see the develop of this, and if you need to test this here just let me know

Sky has my contact info

I do have a prototype that can hold 2 L3+ or 1 S9i

It is outdoors a doghouse available at Amazon.com

I am going to take a photo or two of it now.

about 28 inches long

https://i.imgur.com/Q5PMo2x.jpg

about 25 inches high note air intake

https://i.imgur.com/Jgo42qb.jpg

note air leaving
https://i.imgur.com/th1HHmF.jpg

pair of L3+
https://i.imgur.com/vERn9pS.jpg

could use 1 s9i I am waiting to get some to check how well it cools.

2 L3+ doing voltage mod pull 1360 watts and run cool

https://i.imgur.com/CB8Phmg.png

Note to mods this is not about L3+ As my goal is to build this with s9i

s9i is cheap my tests show power and heat can be managed for L3+
the s9i come soon will show tests for it when it comes.

Sky has inverter/converter power source on order.

If we can build a solar power source with this in the 1500 watt range doing 5 hours per day in NJ where 13.7 to 16.7 cent power is common the source gives 7.5 kwatts a day that is 1.03 to 1.23 usd a day in power or 375 to 457 usd in power in a year.

The power source should have a long life no batteries involved
Easy to setup no grid connection.

the panels rate 20 years
the inverter/converter is 5 or 7 years.

So if we can sell it cheap enough it could work out.

Of course practicalities come in
maybe the ratings are too high .

maybe it does not last the timespan it should

we won't know till we rest a bit.

andresrp

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Phil, i met Sky at the training at Canaan in Beijing last April. I believe solar is a very powerful and possible idea for south american and central american countries. Excited to see the develop of this, and if you need to test this here just let me know

Sky has my contact info

philipma1957

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@ yankees I dont recall if the power supply is 5 or 7 year warranty.

And your numbers have some accuracy.

We may have to target a 20 cent or higher power area to be selling a viable product.

At the moment I have a wedding to attend and we wont be doing any real testing until next week.

The enclose I designed will work for 1400 watts or less with no overheating It can be secured or moved.

It lowers sound of the 2 L3+'s

I get the s9i's next week.

I like the idea of letting a higher power cost guy get in the game.

TheYankeesWin!

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Phil I cant wait to see it testing.

So if you run it in day only and I know NJ gives an average of 5 hours of full sun in a day your gear will average 5 x 1.5 = 7.5kwatts and you project 20 years for the panels , but what about the power source?

20 x 7.5 x 365 =55000 kwatts correct? at 15 cents a k-watt it is more then 8000 worth of pre paid power

10 x 7.5 x 365 =27500 kwatts which at 15 cent a k-watt is more then 4000 worth of pre paid power

5 x 7.5 x 365 = 13750 kwatts which at 15 cent a kwatt is more then 2000 worth of pre paid power

So if your power supply/inverter/converter is a five year warranty the panels and power supply need to be under 1500 maybe 1200 if you are a 15 cent kwatt user.

philipma1957

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Quote from: Thetaj on June 07, 2018, 11:55:05 AM

Please at least make it work with an S9. Also, it should be like a whole package including battery. Just a self-sufficient little mining-at-home kit. There is definitely a market for that!

Batteries are worthless. Not really but they make install harder.

The key is to keep it simple.

We can get new old stock panels at a good cost. The highest end panels cost far too much.

But 210-240 watts panels come up for auction at decent prices.

I have a prototype outside box that should work..

box\ right about where those ladders are.

we found a decent dog house the fits 2 L3+ or 1 S9i the box size is fine since panels are pretty big.

The test box is in my basement pulling 1350 watts running 2 L3+

Thetaj

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Activity: 402

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Please at least make it work with an S9. Also, it should be like a whole package including battery. Just a self-sufficient little mining-at-home kit. There is definitely a market for that!

Sandal_Hat

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Quote from: philipma1957 on June 05, 2018, 08:21:05 AM

Yeah we will be building a prototype soon.

The key will be how many panels we can get "new old stock" panels really cheap at auction.

This means 210 to 230 watts a panel panels are about 2 by 4

We can get a (dc or ac) to dc power supply rated at 1200 watts this allows 24 hour operation and tied to the grid
We can get a dc to dc power supply rated at 1200 watts this is for Day light mining only.

So a 6 panel 1 power supply can not do the s9 or 841 or t1

but it could do an L3+ or a 2 board s9

We will be testing 8 panel 2 power supply setup on and off grid

We will be testing 6 panel 1 power supply setup on and off grid

U mean u gonna just tie it to an L3 or S9? Wat about loud sound issues and most people wont be interested in mining?
If u can just install a solar roof that mines and auto sells the btc every month and sends it in cash to the persons bank account, they would sign up I would think lol. I wrote the last post just after reading only the thread title unfortunately. I thought u were going for the average person who is not even into btc, and not just miners.

Well, if u watch shark tank, u would realize things that are odd are not so odd after all lol. Good luck.

Sandal_Hat

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Activity: 462

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Hi Phil,

Their best target market would be California because it is mandatory to put solar cells on the roofs there
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/may/09/california-solar-panels-power-renewable-energy

https://news.energysage.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/Dow-solar-shingles-624x365.png
Perhaps it can be used with the tesla roof. The mining chips should be on the ceiling inside the house, shielding it from rain.
Maybe if only use few chips and the chips were located far apart enough, there can be enough airflow such that u dont need cooling or it needs some kinda setup,a quiet one.

It needs to be wifi connected via an app and the chips need to be auto-configured to mine on its own. The owner should not need to configure it as most are lazy and not into btc. Perhaps can just auto-sell the btc every month for the owner and send the rewards to their bank account. Most owners are lazy. U may wanna market "Buy our solar miners and receive monthly payments to your bank account"

And some might this is nuts but if u consider that someone created a way to mine bitcoin just from body heat lol, this isnt so crazy. Other crazier things have worked.

philipma1957

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Activity: 4326

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'The right to privacy matters'

Quote from: Thetaj on June 05, 2018, 03:52:51 AM

Hey Phil, this seems like a great idea if you can keep the cost down. Let me know if you're serious about it. I know many people in Asia that would like this if it makes sense economically. We get alot of sun all year round!

Yeah we will be building a prototype soon.

The key will be how many panels we can get "new old stock" panels really cheap at auction.

This means 210 to 230 watts a panel panels are about 2 by 4

We can get a (dc or ac) to dc power supply rated at 1200 watts this allows 24 hour operation and tied to the grid
We can get a dc to dc power supply rated at 1200 watts this is for Day light mining only.

So a 6 panel 1 power supply can not do the s9 or 841 or t1

but it could do an L3+ or a 2 board s9

We will be testing 8 panel 2 power supply setup on and off grid

We will be testing 6 panel 1 power supply setup on and off grid

Thetaj

full member

Activity: 402

Merit: 116

Hey Phil, this seems like a great idea if you can keep the cost down. Let me know if you're serious about it. I know many people in Asia that would like this if it makes sense economically. We get alot of sun all year round!

philipma1957

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'The right to privacy matters'

reserved

philipma1957

legendary

Activity: 4326

Merit: 8950

'The right to privacy matters'

reserved all this is from avalon 7nm thread

Code:

[quote author=philipma1957 link=topic=1931762.msg39145345#msg39145345 date=1527863708]
[quote author=Sandal_Hat link=topic=1931762.msg39139708#msg39139708 date=1527859476]
I think the only household like item that would work for mining is if they put mining chips directly into solar cells and it is probably gonna be a small amount of mining chips per solar cell since solar generates so little power. The chips should be working 24/7 and housed waterproof somehow lol. Or better still, do wat tesla does and put solar cells into roofing with the chips. That might actually work, where the solar is located on the roof outside and generates electricity and the chips are located on the inside of the house and creates heat and btc. The good news is that it will never turn unprofitable haha.
[/quote]

This is a good idea.  A long term rebate never ending.  Just declining a bit.

Avalon would do well with this idea.

my partner buysolar and I are looking to develop a Pay One Price  solar miner.

Your have something here.  Build chips into a panel and mine a bit. Not bad.
[/quote]

[quote author=Sandal_Hat link=topic=1931762.msg39253220#msg39253220 date=1528002417]
[quote author=philipma1957 link=topic=1931762.msg39145345#msg39145345 date=1527863708]
This is a good idea.  A long term rebate never ending.  Just declining a bit.

Avalon would do well with this idea.

my partner buysolar and I are looking to develop a Pay One Price  solar miner.

Your have something here.  Build chips into a panel and mine a bit. Not bad.
[/quote]

Pay one price solar miner? Buy solar is a solar company I guess
[/quote]

[quote author=philipma1957 link=topic=1931762.msg39287231#msg39287231 date=1528036625]
[quote author=Sandal_Hat link=topic=1931762.msg39253220#msg39253220 date=1528002417]
[quote author=philipma1957 link=topic=1931762.msg39145345#msg39145345 date=1527863708]
This is a good idea.  A long term rebate never ending.  Just declining a bit.

Avalon would do well with this idea.

my partner buysolar and I are looking to develop a Pay One Price  solar miner.

Your have something here.  Build chips into a panel and mine a bit. Not bad.
[/quote]

Pay one price solar miner? Buy solar is a solar company I guess
[/quote]

Buysolar is a forum miner here.

He owns a solar install company.

We want to develop a solar powered mining device.

Building chips into panel may work.
[/quote]

[quote author=sidehack link=topic=1931762.msg39289902#msg39289902 date=1528038654]
Just don't forget that the support-component costs scale per miner, not per chip, so tacking on controls and power regulation for "a few chips" costs roughly the same as for a few dozen chips which gives the "few chips" miner a much higher initial cost per hash.

You know I'm not a fan of super high power miners, but there are practical limits to how small a miner can be and still be cost-effective.
[/quote]

[quote author=2112 link=topic=1931762.msg39302459#msg39302459 date=1528048110]
[quote author=philipma1957 link=topic=1931762.msg39287231#msg39287231 date=1528036625]
We want to develop a solar powered mining device.

Building chips into panel may work.
[/quote]

This doesn't even look like science-fiction right now, it is more of a fantasy genre.

The solar cell manufacturers can't even reliably build-in the temperature sensors or other environmental sensors. Various radio-equipment manufacturers still can't reliably integrate electronics with antennas, even though the radio equipment isn't required to be maximally exposed to the elements. 

Quite a few roof-based solar installs don't survive single year without sprouting leaks or other problems. Having recently seen the quality of workmanship on some of the solar power installations I observe a market regression in quality. Lots of them will require major repairs or will be completely torn down in the coming years.

Currently the flat, thin magnetics that would be required for power regulators are very expensive and are used only in high-end high-power CPU chips.

I'm not the one that would try to prohibit daydreaming, but people need to be aware of the distinction between dreams and reality. Otherwise it gets into the realm of either psychiatry or fraud.
[/quote]

[quote author=philipma1957 link=topic=1931762.msg39306100#msg39306100 date=1528051033]
the word [b]may[/b] covers a lot of bases.

My device won't be doing that.

It would involve panels  and dc to dc invertors .

Most of all it would be a pay one price getting you panels ,invertors, and you use a miner on the market now.

Most people would no have space for my setup since  panels  are 2 by 4 and give 220 watts.  so to run a s9 at 1300 watts you need 7 panels maybe 8.

which is a 4 by 16 foot space.  The idea of  chips built into a panel may work has nothing to do with what I am looking to develop.

your power cost is up front and you get about 1-2 dollars  a day back in power for many years.

would work nicely with an avalon 841 since warranty is 2 years.

you would need space in your back yard to run the gear. panels would install like this
these are 190 watt panels so 8 would do 1 s-9 for 5 hours a day or about 8kwatts a day

[url=https://i.imgur.com/7U2QYBM.jpg][img width=200]https://i.imgur.com/7U2QYBM.jpg[/img][/url] [url=https://i.imgur.com/zqNOcLV.jpg][img width=200]https://i.imgur.com/zqNOcLV.jpg[/img][/url]
[/quote]

[quote author=TheYankeesWin! link=topic=1931762.msg39306937#msg39306937 date=1528051771]
So  the avalon 841 with a two year warranty and your setup never stops earning since power is paid up front.

But 8 panels = 16 foot wide and proper sunlight. So your customer base is limited.
[/quote]

[quote author=philipma1957 link=topic=1931762.msg39307513#msg39307513 date=1528052239]
@ yankees yes  I can not put this in my own back yard  I simply have too much shade.

Not enough space for eight panels 2x4 each.

But If I can get an avalon 7nm using 400,500,600 watt settings this is a viable idea.
At the moment the avalon 841 can be reduced just under 1000 watts at  a low power setting.
Ideally  a sha miner  that has 3 settings of 400 500 600 watts  would allow me to build a 4 panel device vs an 8 panel setup
the key to this is I am hoping that  7nm devices under 1000 watts  are built by avalon.

At 2112  my setups  will not involve roof mounts or permits since the mounts will be portable.

off grid allows this in most any state.
[/quote]

[quote author=2112 link=topic=1931762.msg39312836#msg39312836 date=1528056842]
DC to DC inverters?

Frankly, what you wrote isn't even sounding sane.

Trying to come up with a workable explanation:

1) DC to AC inverters
2) haul power off the field to some shed in a shade
3) rectify AC and regulate DC
4) feed miners short distance in the shed

could probably work if you buy recycled/re-manufactured/B-stock parts and still somehow manage to get politically-motivated subsidies for the cost.

I understand that not mounting on the roof would greatly simplify inspection for fire and electrical safety. But you would still require some inspection if planning on connecting to the grid or use the power in the residence/business abutting the field where all that is installed.

On a second thought I even don't think that the inspection would be easier to pass. Fire safety definitely easier; but the electrical safety would be worse: the field mounted electrical stuff would need to be made child-safe. I heard second-hand stories about that type of safety inspections and various lawsuits related to leaving dangerous equipment unattended.

[/quote]

[quote author=sidehack link=topic=1931762.msg39314273#msg39314273 date=1528058082]
Unless you have children, any children getting hurt would be trespassing anyway so sucks to them. Same reason I don't understand requiring extensive fencing around a backyard pool to keep other people's kids from drowning themselves - discipline is supposed to do that for me.

Anyway, I think the idea is to have a small enclosure (a doghouse was mentioned?) probably right at the panel, to reduce the need for inverters or long wire runs. Grid tie negates some of that, but if it's not required all you'd need is internet access and nothing else travels more than a few feet. Depending on how panels are rigged, voltages could stay relatively low/safe.
[/quote]

[quote author=philipma1957 link=topic=1931762.msg39317344#msg39317344 date=1528061057]
No dc to dc not dc to ac.  They exist and you would end up feeding 24 dc into 12 dc output.

They have one that can tie to the grid so it is techniqucally an inverter / converter.

Or a 12 volt output power supply that can use dc or ac.

It is more costly then the straight dc to dc converter. Which would only run in daylight.

You need to understand the value is getting. Up to  20 years of power with no additional cost.

And that it is not for an apartment dweller .  But it is for a person with some land,

If you are concerned about kids fucking with it then fence it like a dog run. After all the miner will be sitting in a doghouse :D

I will be starting a new thread on this soon. I brought it up here as we will be testing it the next few weeks.

Avalon says they want newer ways of using chips when they make the 7nm well a 400 500 600 watt miner would be good for this idea.

new thread link

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4415357.new#new
[/quote]

Here is a photo of panels these are 190 watt .

We have access to 220 watt now so 4 or 8 would be needed.

philipma1957

legendary

Activity: 4326

Merit: 8950

'The right to privacy matters'

I am in the midst of developing a power supply to be used primarily for mining.

It can be off grid mining in Daylight only.
It can come with grid tie option more costly
If can be used with batteries more costly.

First option Would be call "Daylight mining" option

Goal would be to have either 880 watt or 1760 watt setup

Would use a dc to dc power supply designed to convert the panels power to 12 volts.

Second option Is yet to be name but would have a more expensive dc or ac to dc power supply . It would mine for free in the daylight hours and you could pay for power at night or when profits are low just mine in the daylight.

Third option would be a battery pack but is costly and hard to implement. We may not build it at all.

Buysolar and I will be testing this over the next few weeks.

With an avalon 841
a two board s-9
and a L3+ note to mods please do not move this to alt coins due to the L3+ testing it is all I have that will let me test at lower power. note maybe I will test with a 1 board s-9 instead.

This idea is to pay one price for years and years and years of free power. the dc+ac to dc power supply has a five year warranty the solar panels last more then 10 years.

More to come.

Topic: How about a solar power source for pop one price mining (Read 1267 times)