Topic: How can we support Bitcoin if Satoshi demands life sentencing for non-violence (Read 354 times)

The ideals of the one you claim is Satoshi is completely opposite of what Bitcoin represents. This is part of the reason we believe he's not Satoshi, as Satoshi ideals are in his creation, works and writings. Whoever or whatever claims he/it is Satoshi but goes against the Bitcoin ideals/principles is fake satoshi  and should not be taken seriously. Even Bitcoin will not listen to such person as he doesn't speak the language it understands. Both (Bitcoin and fake satoshi) are incompatible.

In regards to demanding life sentences for ulbrich, well, if he actually purposely use his marketplace for evil especially for things that are very harmful to society then people like him typically reap what they sow which could be as bad as a life sentence. Other than that, his marketplace seems to be free as Bitcoin, maybe with lack of transparency which maybe necessary to expose evil. Tech like that are typically used by all kinds of characters  but they ought to be built responsibly to prevent bad behaviors or abuse. Fair rules, Reputation, Transparency, Moderation, etc would have made the tech more responsible and that could help the inventor avoid harsh punishment like maximum of 5 years imprisonment.


Bitcoin will remain decentralized and transparent p2p system for people who want to use money naturally and morally. But people who love money (the love of it is the problem) tend to ignore this important safe guards which is why money is often used as bait to get them trapped and enslaved in the fait system and restricted by its unpleasant features.

Alert! BS coming through! I mean, how much were you paid to come spew this rubbish? Like seriously? Peeps like you should get quarantined to avoid the spread of such hogwash. Craig is not Satoshi. His wannabe? Maybe.
You need reasons as to why your claims are just a desperate attempt to gain attention? Here goes; he NEVER signed any message on a known Bitcoin address that could be widely verified as Satoshi's signature..

One thing is that anyone can even come out and claim that they are Satoshi. For example, I can say that I am Satoshi, but does that mean I am the real investor in Bitcoin? The one person who would not know that Craig is not the investor of Bitcoin should be a newbie who is still learning about Bitcoin, but it's even simpler to know the founder of Bitcoin when you Google the question.
Perhaps the so-called individual claiming to be Satoshi doesn't even have a large amount of Bitcoin in their wallet, like some addresses that hold a large sum of Bitcoin, which they refer to as belonging to Satoshi.

I wonder what it is with you so-called OGs who wake up one day and decide to make fools of themselves after all that we could hear and read over the years when it comes to Faketoshi. There are people who believe in solid facts, and then there are those who believe in fairy tales, which is nothing bad if you are a 5-year-old child.

Nevertheless, for consolation, you are not alone in your beliefs, even the famous Gavin Andresen at one point shared the same opinions as you, which is even more strange considering that he is a man who was one of the closest associates of Satoshi Nakamoto. It might be a good idea to contact him (send him a PM on the forum) and ask him if he still feels stupid because of his statements.

If none of that helps and you still think that Faketoshi is the real Satoshi, I suggest you move to Colombia, because there they still think a little differently than the rest of the world.

Well, one thing is certain..... Satoshi Nakamoto never chased fame and fortune like CW is doing with a passion.    That in it self should be enough proof for anyone that has read any of Satoshi Nakamoto's emails and correspondence that still exist.

The mere fact that CW are constantly trying to be relevant and fighting over patents in court, shows that he is a snake oil salesman. He even conned a seasoned Bitcoiner and developer like Gavin, so it is understandable that he confused you too.

Just use your energy to focus on a future where CW will finally be out of the picture, because the truth will expose him. Satoshi can settle this issue with one signed message to say that CW is a scammer.... so let's hope this happens soon.  

Tend to agree, particularly as the precedent for Ross' sentencing implies that they would continue to go up the technology 'chain' to apply proportiante sentencing to Craig as he was also a non-direct non-violent participator in facilitating the Silk Road project.   That Craig was not summoned and to this day has not yet faced charges for his role is by some measures more proof he is not Satoshi. 


Thanks, it is nice to see a healthy debate & discussion of ideas and opinions after all these years.   Despite all of the new user growth this is still better than the cesspool known as Reddit!   May the original spirit of Aaron and Satoshi live on. 

How possible is it for someone who is anonymous to sent to a life imprisonment for non violence which means he committed nothing, how about the anonymity as well, how can you get an anonymous person, apprehend him and for doing a non violence act, we can by ourselves see that this is almost impossible to do, others have also made this attempts proclaiming Satoshi but they wouldn't have any proof on it, what can support Satoshi is it's network by being ever relevant.

If there's no reason for SegWit I believe the Bitcoin community won't have support and I can see that you pay much more attention to its disadvantages than the advantages and there's no way to a solution without coming up with its own problem.

The so-called passion of CSW you talked about was just a marketing and strategy pull-up to get the attention and trust of some of the Bitcoin enthusiasts. However, if you want to see the facts about his (CSW) true intention you'll agree that there's no reason for him to make a false claim about being Satoshi in order to drive community support to his trash coin (BSV).

If Craig was just the real Satoshi, he would have been arrested already and forced by the government to edit those codes, you know how much they are trying to control BTC to the extent that Blackrock is now buying the one asset they use to call scam.


It's a fact also. I think we can agree with the fact that Ross should have gotten a lighter jail time. It seems like they have really doomed the life of him. Other crimes he did I think weren't proven. Like the one where he gave a hit to an agent.

You are a true OG. It's great to try to use the technology in real life. Your worries about what Craig thinks about Ross Ulbricht and the morals of Bitcoin SV are valid. Many people in crypto find it hard to understand what those fucking leaders are doing. But, like you, many of us joined Bitcoin because of faith - freedom.

Using money is hard. Bitcoin is just another "system". Though, Can any monetary system ever be truly free from the human tendency to centralize power or authority? For decentralisation to work, you might have to give up your dream of going back to nature and living in a world of direct trade and trust. Even though it has flaws, Bitcoin is our best bet against fiat. Many people dream of a heaven where there are no third-party systems. It has problems, just like any dream. Time will tell how well Bitcoin can solve this problem, which is why it was created in the first place. Keep going in the same direction and see where this "current sea" takes us.

There is stupidly enough evidence that suggests CSW is a clown show, from altering old blog post to seem as if he was talking about cryptocurrency in 2008 and arguing he's Satoshi without cryptographic evidence, to having himself proved false by the actual owner of Craig-claimed addresses as shown in here and contradicting himself with actual Satoshi claims as shown by the Twitter post above.

just because ross used bitcoin.. does not absolve him of other crimes related to running a drugs market place. nor absolve him of desires to hire hitmen..

bitcoin is just currency. its not a law breaker.
scammers and tyrants and idiots and such still need to take responsibility for their actions

even if [people say] ross never touched drugs personally. wilfully and in full knowledge of allowing illicit trade to be done in your property can lead to you getting into legal trouble. personally profiting from these illicit activities definitely will get you in trouble


satoshi made bitcoin to be patentless.. he made it open source so there was no control. he even left the community to avoid being treated as a decision maker/owner.. he even stayed out of the press and declined interviews to hide from self promotion

CSW however wants to claim bitcoin(falsely) has his. he files patents and self promotes.

see the difference

My solution to this is the same as of many people: I don't believe that Craig is Satoshi, and thus I have no issue with what he says vs what Bitcoin stands for. I don't think Ross belongs in prison, I support the idea that he should be freed. Craig is an annoying person who failed to prove his claim of being Satoshi over and over again, and there's literally zero evidence that he is Satoshi. If you're serious, op, I hope that the overwhelming opinion that Craig is not Satoshi, which you can partly find in this very thread, will convince you. If you're looking for evidence, even starting with something as simple as sources below the English Wikipedia page on Craig can help with that.

You mean apart from literally everything CSW has ever said? Lol.

Fair enough, thanks for the link I'll read more into that.

Not shilling for him, primarily this was a shot at his backwards views anyway - from that point engaging in the resulting debate; definitely gathered a lot of input thankyou.

I vote for public execution and a walk of shame before  that, for the judge of course.

---

Anyone here knows how to contact this real Satoshi? I feel I am missing out on a lot of opportunities, what he needs is a few high rank members to constantly shill for him, shilling is my expertise.

Here is my resume :

OMG, Crai.. I mean the real satoshi is coming guys look! This is said when he walks in.

OMG, crai.. I mean the real satoshi is leaving the building guys, look!  This is said when he walks out.

Note, I'd need cheerleading outfit ( very short skirt is the best, preferably pink  ), I can also twerk all the way from court entrance to his car. 😉😅

Thanks @tbct_mt2 but those are just threads  mostly speculation and not actually Satoshi's words.

this is a better resource for those words:

https://satoshi.nakamotoinstitute.org

I haven't combed through everything but of the initial threads I've reviewed so far none have said anything out of Craig's character.

If you find or have something specific Satoshi says that would be out of  line with Craig's views, please share it ex: "fuck patents, fuck the government, you can use this to sell drugs" etc

It would not be hard to pinpoint some comments that are clearly out of Craig's character given Craig indicates Christian (Catholic then Protestant) background and demonstrates fairly strong morals (even if off base sometimes; ie- he is stubborn) along with IMO a few cringe boomer views on various global issues.

Craig is not Satoshi Nakamoto. He is one of Faketoshi.

Who is Satoshi Nakamoto ? Suspects, frauds and conspiracies on bitcointalk
I gathered every Satoshi Nakamoto thread.

Satoshi Nakamoto is alive or dead or get arrested in future, it won't be matter for Bitcoin network because he does not have a power to pull a request and shut down the Bitcoin network immediately by himself. The network is decentralized and Satoshi Nakamoto can not do anything.

Same here, The moment I read what you quoted, I came to the conclusion that I have to ready my popcorn because this will end up into a debacle especially when this kind of idea is thrown here in the forum   This might have a chance of success to garner a believer if posted in another forum but not here.  I stopped reading that wall of text and excitingly waited for the refute to the @OP's post.  This will be an educational and a good read thread, not because of @OP's post but the refutes on @OP's proposition of Craig being Satoshi.

Disagree here, he clearly does have passion for Bitcoin, or at least his vision for it, as evidenced by this talk from 6 years ago:

https://youtu.be/JdJexAYjrDw

He comes across as a smart guy with a few character flaws who's pissed off about people applying his ideas in ways that were not intended (not to mention the coordinated smear campaign that was just beginning to cook up against him but it does not appear he was so clever as to connect the dots there because if he was perhaps we would recoginize it is that same pattern of coordination that railroaded Ross to prison).

And where is that court decision you're talking about?
The only case is that of Craig vs Kleiman and even if Craig won as by not having to pay half of 1.1 million BTC to Kleiman no judge would be able to claim in that case that he is Satoshi,  they just ruled that he has to pay Kleiman $100 million in damages and not 500 000 BTC that's all, the rest is speculation.

https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.flsd.521536/gov.uscourts.flsd.521536.277.0.pdf

Infamous?  

I don't need to waste my time any longer in reading through the entire thread because this alone has made the justification to what the complete content would carry, people like you should not take much of our attention if over these time all you could derive is in conclusion that Craig Wright is Satoshi, then it's either you're one of the paid servants being loyal to Craig to have come this low by saying what is not just because you're been paid or maybe you just have a total zero idea of what has been going on since the beginning of this case.

Don't necessarily disagree that courts are most often shit but he has so far done more work to prove his case than you have against - since you did not provide any of the  signed messages claimed.   I'm gunna say you are so far neutral on the matter, but I appreciate your input and let us know if you do have a signed message proof at some point.


The only thing I'm trying to do is vent some frustration (Craig blocked me/ended our conversation on Twitter), some ideas and get some input - so I do appreciate your input.    I will look into the supposed evidence of forged documents in the meantime if you have a link or somewhere to get started on that regard please share it.

It is normal for people to be skeptical about new innovative technology at first until they see or learn about the problem it solves. I was once skeptical about Bitcoin before I saw the positive side of it and accumulated it.

There is no need to think that Craig Wright's propaganda is fraud because everyone said so when the evidence that proves him to be false Satoshi is available for the public to know. Besides, on 7th February 2023, Craig Wright lost Bitcoin copyright at the England and Wales High Court division.

Everything you see in him is something a professional thief and Ph.D. holder in Computer science can do. However, he didn't have passion for Bitcoin and it's writing all over his face.

Don't know if I'll be wrong to say it's a 12 wasted years and you just have to rewind the years and start afresh but this time tryna making it useful by refusing to buy this so-called shit you call a fact.

Do you think Craig would be the infamous Satoshi and he won't have revealed it long before now?

No one says he's not talented and neither is any questions his experience in cryptocurrency but he's  definitely not in the person of Satoshi.

Nobody has to prove anything in court, Craig Wright's lies are just too obvious for anyone who understands how BTC works. Whoever created BTC is a genius and they would not have to go from court to court to prove anything, even to the point of presenting different false evidences; they'll prove that they are Satoshi by using the network they created and sign a simple BTC message. I also don't think any court has 'conclusively' ruled in his favor, he is just trying to bully people into believing him and suing whoever 'hurts his feelings' by calling him out.

Ha ha - me too decodx as have almost everyone else who has visited this thread. Aleast
you have saved us the time of reading what I imagine is pure waffle by opening with that
first line.

OP, its obvious you are new here that you make this post and expect to be taken seriously,
you should know that faketoshi's house of cards has started to fall, the foundations
have been compromised.

If you are 11 years a Bitcoiner what was your thoughts before CSW started making
his fake claims, surely you would know that CSW's manner, claims, personality
goes against everything Bitcoin.

It simply never added up.

Craig isn't Satoshi and the same goes to every people that want the world to know that they are Bitcoin creator.

The real Satoshi doesn't want to be recognised and these bandits are fighting each other to grab the name 'Satoshi' for themselves, if truly they work hard to build Bitcoin they should know better that staying anonymous is the KEY. Something that only the real Satoshi Nakamoto will do.

Craig and others are fake and by trying to prove to the world that they are Satoshi makes them even more fake.

You make an assumption, do not defend or prove it in any way, then proceed to treat it like a fact in another sentence.
I hope everybody can see what you're trying to do in this post.

If you come up with something like that, trying to justify a lie that Craig is telling the world, at least have the decency of giving us some facts.
Writing things like "Craig's tech" here is going to get you nowhere. It's not Craig's tech, unless you, or him can prove otherwise. As far as I know Craig's been trying to do it for years and failing miserably.
Read about the forged documents he produced in court and maybe you'll stop kissing his ass and start thinking critically.

Nope, this is where I hit the pause button on your post. Ain't got time for this nonsense. Next!

A judge means nothing compared to cryptographic evidence. Nobody cares what a certain judge ruled somewhere on the planet.
You can fake almost everything by bullying people into lawsuits, but you can't fake a signed message. Although that is exactly how the troll started, except that nobody got to see the signature.

Did you provide these in court?   A judge ruled in his favor that he is Satoshi Nakamoto.   Evidently the judge needed to see these signed messages you have.

How not to be taken seriously, lesson 1. Is this really the best you can start with after 11 years?
I've seen more than a hundred signed messages that prove the delusional troll's claims are a lie.
If you want to try again, start over.

Good point!  Craig's choice of chain has a useful feature (unlimited block size, which happens to be particularly useful for my specific application devolopment needs) so I suppose even if he is a scamming tyrant who wishes his own users lifetime imprisonment... perhaps the tech should be given a chance.



Is the case of Ross Ulbricht a non-story/non-fact?   


Care to share this real evidence?    I admit my assesment on Craig is early and based mostly on gut and human impression so I am willing to be proven wrong with verifable facts.    Though I find his passion and the moral stance he took during pre Segwit fork rather good for his case - this was just as the smear campaign on him was heating up and he was pissed off the kind of vigor one can only summon when they are challenged on something genuine.

If I were I would sue your doctor in case he prescribed you anything weird lately.
You might win more in damages than trading or holding Bitcoin as it obviously caused you something pretty serious!


Told ya, this is something weird, next you're going to hear colors and smell sounds.

Now ignoring all the BS, it doesn't matter who invented what and what his views would be,Tor was developed by the US military, the NRL branch, does that stop you from using it?  And let's not even talk about who and why invented Fanta!
Satoshi can come back and be a racist transexual homophobic gun lover anti-abortion muslim communist Illuminati reptilian hater, the code won't change.

firstly CSW is not satoshi. never was him never was affiliated with him.. CSW first heard about bitcoin in 2011 and first bought btc in 2013.

end of that story

as for the actual satoshi. he wont be arrested or thrown in prison due to the fact that there is no back door satoshi owns to corrupt bitcoin which can be abused under threat by authorities.. also if you look at all the altcoin inventors that are personally known. none of them have been arrested or imprisoned for inventing their crypto.

so chill out on the drama. its a non story which you have been mis-informed about on many levels and then formed a opinion based on non-facts

that said.
CSW will someday get arrested, prosecuted and imprisoned at some point due to his scams and perjury.. its only a matter of time. but none of his antics are related to bitcoin

by the way CSW did not have any talent or credentials of provable intelligence. there is however real evidence that he plagiarised and used ghost writers to write his coursework and degree assignments

Am an OG Bitcoiner slowly coming around to the fact that Craig is Satoshi.   I was not extremely early (nor successful) but have been buzzing around since 2012  nonetheless.  

And I'm also an independent coder who's since built applications on Bitcoin and been paid in Bitcoin for services/hours rendered apart of consulting & software projects.   I also have a small brick & mortar shop & accept Bitcoin at the till.   In other words, I'm a rare but real user of Bitcoin using it for real world/day to day transactions.

Though I was skeptical of SegWit, like many I glossed over the attack/smear propaganda on Craig and just superficially thought that well he must be a fraud cause everyone says so.  

It wasn't until only recently, discouraged by the echo chamber that is BTC and inspired by the need to make some key technology decisions for upcoming product development, that I began to listen to his talks and more recently the interviews/podcasts.

He is clearly a passionate & talented individual with all of the credentials & experience needed to have created the original Bitcoin.   Not that it matters looking forward.

I wanted to give Bitcoin SV a chance particularly as I have a growing need for a secure endpoint / addressing system ie- blockchain for this product I have been working on for some amount of years.   Not to mention a couple related projects that will share the same tech.  I've built on BTC thus far but Lightning network breaks the chain IMO and I think this is disruptive for longterm application development.  Naturally I turned my attention to BCH and BSV.  

Then I heard Craig say something that concerns me deeply.   It was his response to regarding Ross Ulbricht here at 51:18

https://youtu.be/E9t63P3vdeA?si=s2YDcgTyvC68FoZv&t=3074

"Should he be in jail for consecutive life terms?"

"yes, I believe so"

he goes on to say that "if we ever have corrupt police, that is one of the worst things... corrupt police - public execution if you ask me"

Is he not being incredibly shortsightedness about the corrupt policing involved in Ross' case?  Someone tried to cookup a murder-for-hire story that was never applicable in court because it was so flaky.  Who was that... did it involve corrupt police?   And is the judge corrupt for the excessive sentencing?    If a corrupt cop deserves death what about a judge?


And regarding drugs, I respect that he is taking a strong moral position against the distribution of dangerous substances.    

But 2 wrongs do not make a right; if a freedom loving pie in the sky entrepreneur made the mistake of creating a market (using Craig's tech) that was a little too open - which paved the way for OTHER bad people to do bad things - where does Craig with his masters degree in law determine that said marketowner deserves to rot in a cage until death with the keys thrown away?    

And who will carry out this sentencing for Craig; he expects that 'the system' will just work out and handle this pesky criminal entreprenuer for him.   If Craig Wright wants Ross in a cage forever, Craig should be the one who tries to keep him there.  At least then his friends & family would have much more viable option to bust him out.  

Anyway,  I tried to engage with Craig directly on this, but he subsequently blocked me on Twitter without providing a satisfactory reply.  So here we are.

This is a bit of a wrench in my plans; I was keen to learn more about setting up a BSV node and the costs involved.  Not necessarily to run one myself but I wanted to experiment and test the features/functionality of BSV before saddling up and doing any serious product development on this.

And tangentiality I think this series of events naturally oerlaps with an internal philosophical struggle in using money altogther.  On one had we need a system better than fiat.  On the other, replacing one elaborate system for a new elaborate system does not seem like the solution human civilization really needs.

In fact, it seems money itself - aka root of all evil - really is the root of all evil.  Or stated otherwise, a cancerous idea that is going to wipe us out or at best - chain us forever.  The deeper problem even beyond money it seems is consent to third party authority: systems, people, technology ie- anyone who is not directly involved in fulfilling your needs.   For example, if Craig didn't consent his authority for force to third parties he would need to use force himself or at least his own resources to imprison someone for forever.   This is ironically the solution to that natural balance he himself says is necessary.

Today I just 'use money' and Bitcoin right now cause like everyone else it is the 'current sea' I find myself in.  More and more however, I just want to sail to a place where there is not this mass of consenting believers everywhere; I want to return to nature and exchange what I have for what I need with people without a third party system or shadowperson involving themselves in every transaction.   Of course, the ship may have sailed already as our world is torched around us by those who have for so long taken advantage of this critical flaw in human 'civilization' /end rant.