Topic: How to deal with shitcoiners without being harsh about reality. (Read 428 times)

There's no need to forcefully argue with things like this because in the end they also definitely won't accept reality.
Reminding is indeed one of the commendable traits and must be done as long as we know then we must try to warn if that person made a mistake especially when investing in shitcoin but when they try hard to argue with all forms of arguments I think we have to let it go because when he does something like that then indirectly he definitely knows the consequences.
I have experienced conditions like this with neighbors in my neighborhood regarding the discussion of the pi coin.
He tried to persuade some of my friends but I prevented him from getting into an argument because I rejected many of the pi ideas he brought up and tried to remind him that such a thing was pointless.
But in the end he came back again he also stayed with his choice so I didn't have the right to make him leave but in another condition I managed to bring my friend back not to deal with Pi.
In this case, what I can see is if he really insists then let it be but when we try to discuss and are ready to accept all forms of opinion I can still respond but if not why do I have to waste a lot of energy reminding.

People continue to belive that some coins can bring them big profit and they buy such coins hoping in their future growth. But only some coins with developed ecosystem and big community have some potential.

I feel like that's not the point though. I mean shitcoiners promote their shit and get mocked for it and they end up with a shame when it crashes or rug pulls. Sure they do bring in more money that way, and they make profit that way if they get out at the right time, but that doesn't mean that we are going to see it succeed anytime soon.

This is why it's a lot smarter if you could end up with a better result. It would be smart if people realized that it's going to make a big difference and should consider maybe we are doing the right thing already. Do not force people to get any decent coin, they should be able to do it themselves, and if they end up investing into a shitcoin that's their own issue and not ours, they will find the right path eventually.

We can't coerce everyone to do as we say since we have different belief. In this case, your friends are believing a particular shitcoin can outperform Bitcoin, then so be it. You don't have to insist what you think is right, what matter is you already inform them. Therefore the decision depends if they're going to take your advice or follow what they think is more realistic to happen based on their belief.

Anyway experience is still the best teacher since we can learn a lesson from it and that's also how we realized that investing in shitcoins are not a good idea. These people will realize their mistakes if they already experience this for themselves.

Just leave them. It doesn't even matter how hard you try and shitcioners will never hear your suggestion. They will never hear what you said. The fact that if these days there are so many shitcoins that being harsh to the reality.

The only best thing to let them being scammed by stupid shit scam token. They will be realize if they have been scammed.

Why fight with altcoins in this market, if it is better to try to understand the system of manipulation and earn money. You only need to fight with scam and warn newbies about it. I believe that any project should have a chance, otherwise it contradicts all the principles of decentralization, but competent risk management must be observed when investing in altcoins.

I understand your dilemma here. You are a good guy and want to lead your friends in the best investment possible.

In my case, my friends do listen when I tell them it's not a good investment. Simple, because they know that I know better than them being in the cryptocurrency industry for a long time.
Maybe, the best you could do is set yourself up to have a hierarchy of knowledge in cryptocurrencies. Once they see that then they will doubt buying just anything in the market. Better, they might seek you out for advice.

I don't like having arguments with people who already closed their minds in listening to others especially those who are buying meme coins and supporting them with all of their life. Most of the time, I just ignore them and let them get rekt and that's when I wait for them to come back.

being harsh is okay if you could easily prevent your friend from losing money that way, though if you don't wanna go through the harsh way for the sake of preserving your friendship then simply let them knows the overall charts of all the shitcoins over the course of the years and let them finds out themselves how these shitcoin in general gonna fare in the future reflected from the current charts.
i'd say some time some people just don't really care about the fact that shitcoins could harm them unless they got harmed for real, their speculation is pointless because shitcoin in general full of speculation that surely put them
at the disadvantageous position in which they are more vulnerable towards losing.
only then your friend would know why shitcoin got its name.

You don't need to go into fight with your friends. They are just having a wrong mindset and wrong orientation on bitcoin and therefore representing it falsefully. All you need is to reorientate them and show them the way to bitcoin. For all you may know some of those shit coins may not fall in 1-100 position in CMC, so send the link to CMC to your friend and let him view the position of the shits, price, volume and dominance and compare with bitcoin, the difference is clear.

Why not to be harsh about reality? If you want to face this matter and enlight your friends you have to be harsh about reality, there is no other way to deal with this issue. Of course you don't need to insult or offend anyone personally, but you have to be straight to show them the negative consequences they are going to suffer if they don't change their mindset regards crypto investments. Be polite while being true. They will thank you later!

The best and most effective learning comes only after your own failures and financial losses. I have repeatedly noticed that if a person is given a lot of different matrials on the topic of investing in altcoins and their dangers, he will still make these mistakes, naively believing that this will not happen to him. People tend to think that they are smarter and luckier than others, so at the beginning of their trading or investment path they always lose money, even if they have been warned a thousand times not to do so. Hence the conclusion that shitcoiners can learn only from themselves, they do not perceive the rest of the information.

Breath. I am not sure why are you grouping all altcoins as shitcoins. That's going to be hard pill to sell for anyone paying attention. It sounds like you have gone from deep end to another deep end with extreme views. Focus on the coins that you can prove to be scams and stop grouping them all as one. It's extremely hostile attitude to diss all altcoins and it makes you sound like you didn't do any research. So i am not sure who is delusional in this story.

Only thing you can do is accept and own your mistakes. Inform your friends about the scams by offering proof. After that let them make their own mistakes.

I don't think you are. You are just doing what good friends do for their friends when they see them going down the wrong lane of investment on altcoins. Since your friends are adamant about not taking the right step to invest in bitcoin other than shitcoin as you put it, allow them to be because it's their money and choice of investment. You can't force someone to invest in what he or she doesn't regard as a valuable asset. It is after the race that we would know which crypto investment comes out at the top as the most valuable or recognize asset. Whether it is their shitcoin kind of investment or our bitcoin investment.

Yeah its better for them to learn the harsh reality of crypto since if we disturb them while they are so committed on the shitcoin they are investing maybe they will just ignore us and worst they might think that we are stopping them to get rich. This is how newbie think and they always  think that those people invite them are trusted also the group they belong even if we know that they are scam are honest for them.
So better they realize that this is not how crypto supposed to be and research is always important to learn about what is good to invest and not for them.

I do not, let them learn the harsh reality themselves without us teaching them anything and if they are smart enough they will learn about it on the first try, if not then they are going to end up with a problem that will not be easy to solve and they will keep on losing until they learn. This isn't my job to teach them what to do, it is not going to end up with a good result for anyone and I think it is going to be very important to make a difference.

It is going to be something to care about, but what I do not fully understand is that if you are doing so many mistakes, then I need to get them and talk to them and make them understand the issue, I shouldn't be the one to care and I know people dislike that notion but it's the truth.

You seems to be not happy, the key of happy life is avoid to talk with people who will drain your energy. So if you don't like about people talking about shitcoins in this forum, you can click ignore on their account. If you talk about people in real life, it's either avoid those shitcoiners or avoid to talk about cryptocurrency because their mind are thinking about shitcoins.

I myself have come to an absolute conviction from my personal experience that all altcoin (not just shitcoins.) is just worthless rubbish, the only real value is in bitcoin.

So I decided to get rid of all the shitcoins and started my long-term Bitcoin DCA strategy.

This pretty much sounds like "how to deal with people and things I don't like anymore"... Well, the harsh reality is some people change and some don't, some people accept changes some fight against them, some people grow up, and some don't. That's growing up, we learn as long as we live... if we are smart, we question our actions, and we think about how to be better... Simply said we either make progress and we advance, or we are sinking.

So how to deal with this? Well, as some other people said with honesty! Share your honest thinking, provide arguments, and if someone accepts it's good... if not just move on.

I am not a religious person, but this explains a lot:

Just tell them straight facts if they cannot accept it and feel bad on what information you shared to them at least you try to warn them. But if they continue even you already share your thoughts and stated your concern then let them continue and they should see for theirselves that you are right then they messed up for the wrong investment decision they do and for sure next time they would be more careful on their decision making on investing on new alts they want to invest.

 it's essential to be upfront and honest. Educate them about the risks and drawbacks associated with 'shitcoins.' Show them the facts and encourage them to do thorough research. Sometimes, a dose of reality can be eye-opening.

Your observations reflect cryptocurrency investing's wild west. Its an environment where predators often pose as prey, with high peaks of possible gains and dangerous depths of loss.

While your buddies cling to their "shitcoins" hoping for a miracle, you've survived the storm and found your beacon in Bitcoin. Isnt that the ultimate irony - decrying Bitcoin's worth while supporting coins that depend on its pioneering innovation?

To "nicely" convince someone they're delusional, try a casual, non-confrontational conversation. Explain your position, offer proof, and let them decide. You'll give them something to think about.

One of the many things I realized in relation to cryptocurrency market is that this industry has now become a big paradise for scammers, hackers, fraudsters and those in between. We are always attracted to the idea of a coin or a token that will go x10 and even x100 so that we can experience financial freedom at the least cost. - unfortunately there are many risks involved here as we can also lost everything. I am always sorry for people who had been victimized by the promises and plans laid out by many shitcoins, only to realize one day that they are really living well with their names and that is being shit!

Yes you are, and if you think that we will blame you for that? no I will not because I find your greediness in the beginning of your investing in crypto ., instead of trusting bitcoin first yet you deal with Shitcoin and it is understandable as now you already knew what to do and use that a Lesson to "ONLY TRUST BITCOIN" when talking about security in crypto investing.
You must not feel mentally scammed because you are completely Scammed mate, yes scammed by your desire to earn Big in easy way.

But it is still not too late, now that we are approaching Halving and Bullrun is in the air? try to invest now in Bitcoin and trust me , there is a future on that.

We know how much dangerous it is to invest in such kinds of coins and that's why we quickly prevent even if not our friends or relatives when we know they engage in it. Still, we need to understand that we are only a clear warner and we cannot do anything about it if they will going to still pursue their goals of investing in some shitcoins. Most people will learn their lessons after they suffered it personally or when they finally learn the truth about it and lost their investment in such a decisive way. in that case, if you really want to help, consider doing something different approach rather than directly telling them about it.

To spoil their high expectations with reality. Indeed poop coins are profitable or I'd say highly profitable especially if you'd be able to pick the right coin but is not, it would be the other way around. Poop coins are having a too volatile market value wherein things do change in an instant which makes it risky in comparison with other cryptocurrencies in this industry. So if you can manage dealing with such market price behavior of an asset, then that would be good of course. But if not be prepared of the possibility for huge losses to occur. That is just how simple such concept works.

with shitcoin addiction you just couldn't help them unless the experience first hand the massive lost that they gonna eventually get.
but alas there's always chance that through your advice they would have some consciousness, but then again if their greediness is what motivates them in the first place then there's big chance that they would eventually flock back again to the shitcoins.
the worst thing about investing in shitcoin is that you have less than 80% chance of making your investments back, it's all full of manipulation and you exists in the market just to become food for the whales, you'd think you're smarter than the other and could somehow trick the market and comes out unscathed with massive roi but that's actually is what the whales planned all a long giving illusion such as chance of turning around your investments usually.

I don't really need that you need to make sure that you also save your friends from "shitcoin hell". You can tell them your opinion about it and if they are still insisting to ape into almost every shitcoin launch after that then there is nothing you can do because it's their own decision and their own money that they will lose. In general i have to say that i agree with you, that all those meme-coins are just shitcoins that were created by people that just wanted to make quick money without any effort. Of course i acknowledge that quite a few people became very rich because they invested very early in Shiba Inu, but that time is over. I think the long term trend for Shiba Inu is downwards and all those new meme-coins that are still appearing every day are all dead again within a few weeks at max.

Let them be. The context is If OP or someone genuinely wants to influence people with that kind of behaviour, then simply let them try. What I'm trying to say is we can't blindly force how we explain things to them without understanding their minds or way of thinking. Thus we can adjust how to explain things.

The problem with your idea is that just because people only spread about useful projects does not mean a worthless project wouldn't be heard. One example of the realities is people believe influencer who doesn't understand a thing which promotes a scam or worthless project.

Dealing with them is only a waste of time. Why can't we just focus on our own and then let's only spread the word about Bitcoin and other legit projects? This is the only way that we can help about those newbies so that they won't go in the wrong path. If you deal with shitcoiner, they will only like it and they will try to piss your more but if we ignore them, that's the time they can feel annoyance because they think that their efforts of giving a distraction is going into a waste.

There is no need to ask about their preference because it's already clear that their preference is different from us. They choose to be bad than to be good but good luck if you attempt to change them.

Your issue is flawed and there is no real answer.  Most people who dive neck deep into altcoins are doing so out of greed.  Looking to hit lightning.  It's like telling people not to play the lottery or gamble on slots.  All losing propositions but rarely do we get involved with their want to gamble on these things.  Ypu can tell them historically but it won't mean much.  If someone told you the odds of winning slots at casinos logic would tell you to stop but greed gets in the way of that.  Same here.  Enjoy the fact you understand the value of just holding bitcoin and move along.

Am I being delusional for thinking I can change their mind in an actionable way?

The problem you and all of us which at some point tried to discourage someone else from investing in a scam in any market is that those scammers can lie all they want while we only have the truth.

And the truth can be very bitter while lies can be very sweet, and we see examples of this all the time on even more important scenarios, like those which are diagnosed with a terminal disease and they are willing to believe that a scammer can cure them, those which join cults and so on, so it speaks nicely of you that you are trying to help your friends but you need to prepare yourself for the very real possibility they are not going to listen to you.

Can we have more confidence though? lets be constructive about this dillema. Shitcoiners succeed in pushing people to buy their shit, there is no reason we cannot do a better job with a legitimate currency.

You can lead a horse to water but you can’t make it drink, as the old saying goes. You can advise people, you might even make a big effort trying to explain & help people you care about but you can’t babysit people.

Sometimes you just have to let people live & die by their sword, make their own decisions on what they invest in. It’s hard enough controlling your own investments than to worry about what other people do with their money.

Ethereum clearly is a scam, they operate in extremely scammy ways that no Bitcoiner would ever support. By supporting Ethereum you are supporting a centralized insider controlled censorship enforcing funnel money to the 1% coin. The point is not the speculative price the point is NOT BEING AN UNETHICAL SCAMMER.

Dealing with such people requires a thorough patience. If you are up to that challenge, sometimes it is helpful if you adjust your thought to how their mode of thinking, by doing that, one might address how could they end up with some conclusion. If by any chance their thoughts have many logical inconsistencies and wrong comprehension of something, you can correct or inform them.

But, of course, it is not as simple as that. What I usually do is, beforehand, we should ask about their preference of how to learn and comprehend a piece of information, for example, by asking a question like, what proof or evidence makes someone able to comprehend things. Sometimes it works, sometimes it's not. The point is, if it is worth to achieve, constantly readjusting how they behave might help.

I remember 2014-15 and how many people screamed about how Ethereum is another ICO scam. And look where it's now...


Nicely said! Many crazy things happened in the crypto space... even Doge reached $0.7 at some point. And I am sure we will see many more surprises in the future, so it's better to let friends lose some money than to blame you for missing a big hit! That always turns into something very ugly.

Over the course of 7-8 months, eth went from reaching an ath with bitcoin of 0.156357 btc per eth in June 2017, by the end of December 2017, the price had reached a low of 0.023121. This is according to the data bitfinex gave tradingview at the time it happened. Afaik it got a lot worse on other exchanges too.

As if that wasn't it, the price took off again against btc to go over 0.12 just 2 months later (by the end of February 2018) before plunging even further dowards to a range of 0.017-0.04 until May 2021.

The fact technology has come to replace eth and it's still going strong says a lot for its community (I wouldn't call it good, I'd call it a lack of critical thinking).

Can you please detail for me what happened around 2017 with Eth?

I simply don't deal with them. If they are so dumb as to play roulette instead of betting on a sure thing with Bitcoin, I don't bother to refute them. Time puts everything in its place.

Betting on shitcoins makes some sense if you know what you are doing with knowledge and diversification, but this is not the case for most retail investors.

Or if you are one of the creators or promoters of the coin.

I only hold Bitcoin and don't worry about the rest.

You could always find a top 10 list from a few years ago when things looked a lot different and see how comfortable they are with their investments then.

You could show them what happened in the months after eth went to 0.1 last time (a few years ago, perhaps before or around 2017).

I feel eth and a lot of the eth based alts are well overvalued and I don't know why devs had an obsession with making so many alt chains of one coin. There are altcoins, though, where this is the case that seem to have a large and thriving developer community so you might want to consider that too (shorter term holdings are a lot safer but still risky).

I'd say "it's up to you and your altcoin", just show how much bitcoin market cap is right now how people value bitcoin so much over alts. Of the millions of bitcoin holders in the world, are 1000 of them not have a more smarter way of thinking than your online friend and how can they give bitcoin a value?

Definitely nothing wrong with that. It's just that your friends are probably adults, and are responsible for their decisions. Props to you for making attempts for talking them out of a potentially bad trade/investment. But then again — their money, their decisions.

YES I WANT TO CONVINCE MY FRIENDS NOT TO GET SCAMMED
WHAT ABOUT THAT IS WRONG?

Frankly, I already answered your question.


From what I've observed with your posts though, it's not necessarily that you want to voice your opinion — because there's definitely nothing wrong with that, and it looks like you've already tried talking your friend out of holding alts. It's just that you want to convince your friend to change his/her mind.

Right your point is still completely missing the point, which is that I did not ask and DO NOT CARE if you think I SHOULD or SHOULD NOT voice my opinion to my friends. I will do so. The question is HOW? If you cannot answer that then just shutup. The followup question for anyone who might care to actually provide a proper response, is if it is important to be nice to people who are not my friends about this issue. Is it important to set a reputation as a calm collected Bitcoiner or is it all just anarchy and should I instill the fear of Bitcoin into those who dare misjudge the power that they bestow in me?

I never said that altcoins were the right play for everyone(or that your friend made the right decision for holding alts), because I also think that just holding BTC is the better option in a r/r basis for 95% of people. My point was just that it's not up to you what your friend wants to buy, even if you extremely disagree with his/her opinions.

Alt-coins historically get MEGA outperformed by Bitcoin, I have dealt with TONS of alt-coins and so far it caused me to miss out on roughly 2k worth of value I would have achieved if I would have just held bitcoin. There is no worth to fragmenting people into these pieces of shit. You clearly just skipped all of the details I listed about WHY it's important.

You don't even need to try so hard. Just politely tell them why you think what they're doing is a bad idea, and if they don't listen, then let them be. It's their money not yours. You don't necessarily need to force your opinions down their throats.

If they ended up being wrong, then good because they learned a valuable lesson. The last thing you'd want is them actually picking the right altcoins (though unlikely) that would've performed really well but they missed out just because you forced them to go with BTC.

[context: I started out WAY too open minded about crypto shitcoins and now I feel like I am trapped in shitcoin hell and everyone around me is also]

I am in a difficult position. I feel more or less mentally scammed by tons of shitcoin producers in the space, there are some that are just putrid garbage like ICP which I was stupid enough to buy at one point.
There are things that seem to look like ponzi-schemes made BY ponzi-schemers FOR ponzi-schemers aka Hex token.
There are "DAOs" who instead of being decentralized are ran by like 5 dudes, one of which is Omar Danani who rugpulled peoples life savings off QuadrigaCX and was imprisoned for it aka Wonderland.
The spectrum goes on though and you get to the "Top 10" stuff like polkadot, cardano, ethereum, etc...
Now you can say "sir you are a moron for even thinking about touching that garbage" and you would be technically correct, however I have become aware that the situation being revealed to me is much deeper than how it affected me in the past, and actually is a systemic risk for how it will affect other people in the future.
I for the most part have realized this risk in my own portfolio recently following FTX, I am committed now more than I ever have been to Bitcoin.
However many of my friends are pretty firmly caught in the idea that their shitcoin is going to somehow outperform bitcoin. There is of course nuance to this but for this matter we will leave it at that. Most of them are exposed to bitcoin in some way but (rather delusionally) proclaim that the specific project THEY are following will beat Bitcoin in some shape or form. Not to mention some of these are not even the "Top 10" for which I will specifically get into later. I don't know exactly how to NICELY tell my friends they are being delusional. How can I do this?
More recently I discovered that an online friend/co-worker, whom I don't know and just do some dev work for, is not only delusional about their favorite shitcoin but they think that Bitcoin has NO value...
You read that right, someone who likes ETHEREUM thinks bitcoin has no value, I mean is that just the pinnacle of delusion or what? The bloated software that desperately copied things from Bitcoin would make Bitcoin have no value...
Seriously that is what he claims to believe. It should come at no surprise that this guy literally cannot develop hello world in python if I gave him an hour to do so. He is not a developer yet he wants to make outrageous claims about the value of Bitcoin, it makes me sad honestly to see this level of delusion.
Because of this I feel compelled to IMMEDIATELY disconnect myself from any thing to do with this guy, he is not my friend so I don't really care about what he thinks about my opinion. But I do wonder, is it important for me to make a calm collected statement to him (and potentially a bunch of other shitcoiners) about the value of bitcoin and why it is important? Or will my efforts just go wasted, I am honestly tired of fighting for it and having people ignore what I say so I really would value peoples input on that.
These "Top 10" proof of stake bullshit coins are probably the worst of the worst, they not only take every opportunity to (without evidence) make claims that they are better in x way than bitcoin. Meanwhile they enforce ofac censorship: https://www.mevwatch.info/ (60 - 90% of the network already enforcing it). Spend tons of pre-mined money on social media campaigns to lie about their level of decentralization: IOHK making posts claiming to be 100% decentralized (context: the founder of cardano claiming that Cardano is decentralized, like satoshi nakomoto sticking around for 20 years putting his name on everything bitcoin selling tons of bitcoin and claiming it is decentralized) [ https://heraldsheets.com/cardano-ada-is-now-100-decentralized/ ] They also kiss up to the SEC[ https://www.forbes.com/sites/stevenehrlich/2022/11/08/crypto-project-polkadots-three-year-engagement-with-the-sec-leaves-it-in-regulatory-limbo/?sh=5671b45cccf1 ] and PROBABLY (be honest with yourself) bribe those guys.
So let me know how I should deal with the several shitcoin-addicts in my life.
-recoveringShitcoinAddict / Bitcoin-most-imalist