How to find out the real execution (not sent) time?

Saint-loup

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Quote from: thoste on December 13, 2024, 03:46:32 AM

I am still confused.

1.) Ok, if the history tab in Electrum shows the timestamp of the first confirmation:
   Where can I see INSIDE Electrum when I sent initially the transaction to the mempool?

   Again: TWO timestamps are required: initial sent (to mempool) and 1st confirmation.
   I guess a (new) column "sent time" in History tab is missing. At least optionally
   That should be feasible in Electrum.

   I don't need absolute exact timestamps. Timestamps +/- 30 seconds would be acceptable.

Yes the date column of the history tab shows the date when you transaction has been mined actually and not when your transaction has been sent as you've finally understood.
I agree with you an option to show this data in the GUI interface or at least through the commands in the console is missing and would be welcomed. But if you really need it you can find this information in the logs files of Electrum (until they're deleted at least), the directory of those logs is normally located in the same directory as the one cointaing the wallet directory, but you need to have enabled them first. I hope it could help you.

NotATether

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Quote from: Frankolala on November 04, 2024, 09:21:21 AM

No one can tell the exact time that you transaction would be confirmed because it depends on the fee that you used and if the blockchain is congested or not. You can use https://mempool.space/ to monitor your transaction and know the exact time that it was confirmed. Copy paste your transaction i.d on the search space and you will get the details of what you are looking for.

If your wallet creates a transaction, signs and broadcasts it, then by definition it knows the time it was broadcast. However, this timestamp is not encoded inside the transaction - it can't be anyway as it isn't known ahead of time - only the block confirmation time is recorded. Electrum itself should have the broadcast time saved somewhere in the wallet file.

BlackHatCoiner

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You just check the time the block that includes your transaction was propagated to the network. There's no better way. I highly doubt Electrum keep this information somewhere. So, just run bitcoind, and keep track of when blocks are received by your node.

Is there any value in having this information, though?

pooya87

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Since all these different timestamps are not commonly useful for regular users, there is no point for Electrum or any other wallet for that matter to keep track of them. They will just be unnecessary data that would increase the wallet file size.
Not to mention that your wallet has to sync with the server it connects to and receives the tx history from that node, a node which will not store any additional timestamps.

nc50lc

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Quote from: thoste on December 13, 2024, 03:46:32 AM

1.) Ok, if the history tab in Electrum shows the timestamp of the first confirmation:
   Where can I see INSIDE Electrum when I sent initially the transaction to the mempool?

   Again: TWO timestamps are required: initial sent (to mempool) and 1st confirmation.
   I guess a (new) column "sent time" in History tab is missing. At least optionally
   That should be feasible in Electrum.

   I don't need absolute exact timestamps. Timestamps +/- 30 seconds would be acceptable.

The closest is the "locktime (height)" which is the tip (top block height) when you created the transaction.
But that block height may have been the already tip 10minutes (on average) before you created the transaction so it not a good indication of the broadcast time.
Like I've mentioned, you need a "timer", a real-time of that.

On the other hand, a proposal can be requested to Electrum's GitHub Repository as a new feature request issue.
But I doubt the niche use-case isn't worth it for the development plus additional feature that most of the users wont even use.
You're welcome to post it though.

Quote from: thoste

2.) The blocktime is a timestamp without a reference time zone and therefore useless.

Useful actually, the time in the blocks' 'block header' are just continuously counting number not represented by any time zone.
Technically; in "Unix Epoch time", Wiki: Epoch (Refer to Unix Epoch)

In Electrum's GUI and blockexplorers, it's just conveniently converted to your machine's local data/time so referencing timezone isn't necessary.
It's conveniently set to be relative to what you can see in your clock.

Cricktor

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Quote from: thoste on December 13, 2024, 03:46:32 AM

Where can I see INSIDE Electrum when I sent initially the transaction to the mempool?

You can't, because this is non-recoverable information and Electrum simply doesn't keep track of this information to my knowledge.

Quote from: thoste on December 13, 2024, 03:46:32 AM

2.) The blocktime is a timestamp without a reference time zone and therefore useless.
Its like if I say "I pay you 4000". Pay what? US-Dollar, Euro, Swiss Francs, British Pounds?

You're wrong as the blocktime is "recorded" in UTC and this is perfectly fine because any wallet could display it then converted to any local timezone if that is what is wanted.

Your comparison is flawed. When the timestamps are in UTC, that's unambiguous enough. And additionally it's not needed to disclose the local timezone of a Bitcoin user.

thoste

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I am still confused.

1.) Ok, if the history tab in Electrum shows the timestamp of the first confirmation:
   Where can I see INSIDE Electrum when I sent initially the transaction to the mempool?

   Again: TWO timestamps are required: initial sent (to mempool) and 1st confirmation.
   I guess a (new) column "sent time" in History tab is missing. At least optionally
   That should be feasible in Electrum.

   I don't need absolute exact timestamps. Timestamps +/- 30 seconds would be acceptable.

2.) The blocktime is a timestamp without a reference time zone and therefore useless.
   Its like if I say "I pay you 4000". Pay what? US-Dollar, Euro, Swiss Francs, British Pounds?

   A useful timestamp should have a visible associated timezone like "CET" (for Central European time) or PST (Pacific Time Zone)

   See here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_tz_database_time_zones

   Or at least an indicator like UTC+-XX See here:

   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_zone

   Usually globally oriented software append this information to each timestamp value.

Cricktor

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Quote from: thoste on November 25, 2024, 06:09:52 AM

But: when the "Date" column in "History" tab is the confirmation time from Blockchain then where is the send time (=time when I send the transaction request to mempool)?

The Date column in "History" tab is the blocktime, i.e. the timestamp written in the blockheader of the block that includes the transaction. The blocktime can differ from the "real" confirmation time when the block was published to the network and acknowledged by all nodes which confirmed the block as valid.

The blocktime must be less than the network adjusted time plus 2h AND it must be greater than the median time of the last 11 blocks. (Loosely quoted from here.)

This translates roughly to a valid range of about -1h and upto +2h from the time the block was published. But in probably most of the time the blocktime is somewhere +/- one or two minutes max. from block publish time.

The broadcast timestamp is not maintained and displayed by Electrum. There's only a course detail like the Locktime as block height when a transaction has been sent with a non-zero Locktime. Only then you can see the difference between block height when broadcasted and block height when confirmed.

Quote from: thoste on November 25, 2024, 06:09:52 AM

The timestamp in "Date" column: Which timezone is it?

It's in your local timezone of your OS running on your computer.

thoste

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Quote from: Cricktor on November 24, 2024, 03:34:24 PM

Yes, you can: the confirmation time is the blocktime from the block in which a transaction has been written to the blockchain. This is the timestamp that Electrum shows in the History tab, but of course only for transactions of your own wallet! Once a transaction is confirmed in a block, the blocktime shows up in the History tab.

Thats sounds exactly what I am searching for.

But: when the "Date" column in "History" tab is the confirmation time from Blockchain then where is the send time (=time when I send the transaction request to mempool)?

I though at first it was the opposite.

And one more related question:

The timestamp in "Date" column: Which timezone is it?
e.g. Central European time or US West Cost time or .....?

nc50lc

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Quote from: thoste on November 24, 2024, 02:08:41 PM

So ok. I cannot find out the confirmation time from within Electrum.

Instead I have to visit https://mempool.space/ webpage. And then?

Relying on mempool space's data isn't any different since it also shows the same block timestamp of the block where the transaction is included.
If it's just the confirmation time (1 confirmation), refer to the timestamp in Electrum's history as I've mentioned in my previous reply, however it's not accurate by the second.

Bitcoin doesn't have a clock so it relies on "good-enough" standard median time. (refer to the link I provided in my previous reply)
For accuracy, you need real time monitoring of the transactions like I've suggested.

Cricktor

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Quote from: thoste on November 24, 2024, 02:08:41 PM

~~~

Yes, you can: the confirmation time is the blocktime from the block in which a transaction has been written to the blockchain. This is the timestamp that Electrum shows in the History tab, but of course only for transactions of your own wallet! Once a transaction is confirmed in a block, the blocktime shows up in the History tab.

You can see these timestamps when you look at details of a transaction on mempool.space. If you have a transaction ID, enter it in the search box on mempool.space to dig up the specific transaction details.

I don't know exactly when mempool.space started to record the timestamp when a transaction was first seen by mempool.space and thus entered their mempool waiting to be confirmed in a block.

It's quite possible that this timestamp is not visible for transactions older than some months or so. There is maybe some notes on this in the changelog of mempool.space.

You can also search for any input and output address on mempool.space. When you search for public addresses, mempool.space will display the address history of the address you searched for. From there you can click on the Tx ID to get the transaction's details.

thoste

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So ok. I cannot find out the confirmation time from within Electrum.
Instead I have to visit

https://mempool.space/

webpage. And then?

Where EXACTLY do I have to enter the Input address (or output address?) to get the info as shown in the sample post from BitMaxz?

Cricktor

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Quote from: BitMaxz on November 04, 2024, 10:18:54 AM

Timestamp: This is the time and date when was the transaction is created.

To be precise: the Timestamp denotes the block's blocktime (which must lay within consensus bounds for a block to be valid) in which the transaction is included and therefore confirmed. It is not necessarily exactly the time when this block was published to the network, but usually it is within a minute or so on average.

For more details about allowed blocktime, see e.g. here: https://learnmeabitcoin.com/technical/block/time/

Quote from: BitMaxz on November 04, 2024, 10:18:54 AM

Confirmed: This is the time when the transaction received its first confirmation.

No, in your example this denotes that the node(s) of mempool.space received the transaction 27 minutes before it got confirmed into a block. So the transaction sat for 27 minutes in their mempool(s) waiting to be confirmed. Thus the transaction has been submitted roughly 27 minutes before Timestamp (+/- the difference between blocktime and actual block's mining and publishing time to the network).

hugeblack

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Quote from: thoste on November 04, 2024, 09:19:01 AM

I don't want average statistics for all orders from webpages.
I want the real execution/waiting time for my order.

In addition to what was mentioned above, this time varies according to the congestion of the blockchain. Therefore, if the average time for your transactions is 5-20 minutes with a certain fee, this average for the same fee will be wrong in the future due to the change in network congestion.

nc50lc

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Quote from: thoste on November 04, 2024, 09:19:01 AM

But how do I find out the exact execution time?

This is an issue if you didn't actually monitored it with a live counter
since the timestamp used in the blocks where you can base the time isn't always accurate.

Quote from: thoste on November 04, 2024, 09:19:01 AM

If possible inside Electrum.

The timestamp that you see in the 'History' tab is actually the updated timestamp based from the block where the transaction is included (1st confirmation).
Electrum doesn't immediately include a date/time when you broadcast a transaction that got it listed in your History tab as "Unconfirmed", the time is only until its confirmed.

So either set a timer to get an accurate stats or rely on the timestamp which is based from "median timestamp".
Explained here: en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Block_timestamp

BitMaxz

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Happy New year 🤗

I believe he meant the execution time, which is when the transaction received the first confirmation.

@OP The mempool.space as suggested above should be enough to give the information you need focus on these two "timestamp and confirmed" below:

Timestamp: This is the time and date when was the transaction is created.
Confirmed: This is the time when the transaction received its first confirmation.

Charles-Tim

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You mean you want to know the time the transaction got confirmed without opening Electrum. Like a notification after the transaction has been confirmed? Electrum is not designed to work like that. Unless you open the app.

But there are wallets that can notify you. I do not know much about them because I am very use to not checking the time the transaction is confirmed exactly.

Or you mean you want to know the time the transaction will take before it will be confirmed? You can not know that. Just check the mempool to know the fee rate needed that can get your transactions confirmed as early as possible and you can use blockchain explorer to know when new block has been mined and check if your transaction is included in the block or not.

OmegaStarScream

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If by execution time you mean the confirmation time, then blockexplorers like mempool.space do show that.

It will show both the timestamp the transaction was broadcasted on, as well as when was it confirmed (after how many minutes or hours).

Frankolala

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No one can tell the exact time that you transaction would be confirmed because it depends on the fee that you used and if the blockchain is congested or not. You can use https://mempool.space/ to monitor your transaction and know the exact time that it was confirmed. Copy paste your transaction i.d on the search space and you will get the details of what you are looking for.

thoste

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Assume I send a certain BTC order from Electrum to mempool on

2024-11-01-16:43

Afterwards its waiting in the mempool for a while (hours) until the execution.

The next morning I open Electrum again and found it executed. OK.

But how do I find out the exact execution time?

I want to get a idea how long it took for the fee amount I spent

I don't want average statistics for all orders from webpages.
I want the real execution/waiting time for my order.

If possible inside Electrum.
If not possible a blockchain monitoring web page is acceptable as well.

Topic: How to find out the real execution (not sent) time? (Read 255 times)