Huge Russian mining center in Ethiopia

merlyn02

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Quote from: Bright Venus on January 05, 2024, 12:13:09 PM

What do you think about big companies making huge mining centers? And what about when those companies make it in other countries? How do you think this impact on those house-made mining structures, if does?

I've just read something and this came to my mind. Because as we know, as more miners we have, less the payment we receive.

Do you think it will become a problem in the future and will be impossible to a regular person to start mining?

https://www.rt.com/africa/589461-russia-crypto-mining-center-ethiopia/amp/

The trend of big companies establishing large-scale mining centers for cryptocurrencies can have both positive aspects such as increased efficiency and infrastructure development, while also raising concerns about centralization, barriers to entry, and environmental impact, especially when these operations extend to other countries.

Assface16678

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Well, I think those who have house-made mining or only mining on their own property will not be affected by those who have companies just for crypto mining, and even if the authority or government wants to, what law is stating that crypto mining does need certificates or they need to register their mining activities? Maybe there will be a very big establishment that will be used just for crypto mining, as they will use a large space and they can't avoid the authority or government anymore, so yeah, in general, small miners to middle miners are safe from taxation or any other requirements needed or regulated by the government.

In fact, there are many hidden big miners out there that don't publicly announce their establishment, and that's the right thing to do, as crypto mining is not considered illegal, so they have no obligation to comply with the government or a charity.

NotATether

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Quote from: cryptosize on March 24, 2024, 01:07:45 PM

Do you live in Ethiopia?

Yes. We are in the rainy season now.

cryptosize

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Quote from: NotATether on March 24, 2024, 12:53:42 PM

Quote from: stompix on March 23, 2024, 12:29:49 PM

The dam is completed, and it's already filled for production levels, the flooding of the basin has started in 2020:
https://eros.usgs.gov/earthshots/grand-ethiopian-renaissance-dam-ethiopia

It does have only 700MW out of 5GW installed, but the trick is that the powerplant would have never produced that much, it has a capacity power below 30% so 2 turbines running full time will have the same effect as 6 installed over the year with the current debit being released.

Eventually, the dam will be completely filled with water, but for now they have to do it slowly to prevent water shortages, according to that report.

Which I can't wait for, I am sick of these thunderstorm-induced outages Angry

I am starting to wonder why we don't use solar power as much. Because now the weather is getting Sahara-like hot these days.

Do you live in Ethiopia?

Quote from: NotATether on March 24, 2024, 12:53:42 PM

Quote from: cryptosize on March 24, 2024, 10:12:32 AM

Plot twist: BTC will be the BRICs currency, not an actual basket of fiat currencies (like the ECU/SDR).

The BRICS countries always criticize and ban cryptocurrency. I doubt they will ever make one their primary currency.

Quite the contrary:

https://www.coindesk.com/policy/2024/03/05/brics-will-create-payment-system-based-on-digital-currencies-and-blockchain-report/

NotATether

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Quote from: stompix on March 23, 2024, 12:29:49 PM

The dam is completed, and it's already filled for production levels, the flooding of the basin has started in 2020:
https://eros.usgs.gov/earthshots/grand-ethiopian-renaissance-dam-ethiopia

It does have only 700MW out of 5GW installed, but the trick is that the powerplant would have never produced that much, it has a capacity power below 30% so 2 turbines running full time will have the same effect as 6 installed over the year with the current debit being released.

Eventually, the dam will be completely filled with water, but for now they have to do it slowly to prevent water shortages, according to that report.

Which I can't wait for, I am sick of these thunderstorm-induced outages Angry

I am starting to wonder why we don't use solar power as much. Because now the weather is getting Sahara-like hot these days.

Quote from: cryptosize on March 24, 2024, 10:12:32 AM

Plot twist: BTC will be the BRICs currency, not an actual basket of fiat currencies (like the ECU/SDR).

The BRICS countries always criticize and ban cryptocurrency. I doubt they will ever make one their primary currency.

cryptosize

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Quote from: WatChe on March 24, 2024, 09:38:20 AM

My findings were based on OP question that why Russian company is making a mining centre in Ethiopia not in Russia.

They already have at least one huge mining farm in Russia:

https://cointelegraph.com/news/russian-government-subsidies-crypto-mining-facility-in-siberia

Plot twist: BTC will be the BRICs currency, not an actual basket of fiat currencies (like the ECU/SDR).

But they have no reason to announce it yet, because BTC would easily skyrocket to 100k and no one wants that to happen so soon...

Bookmark/screenshot me for future reference.

WatChe

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Quote from: NotATether on March 23, 2024, 09:28:34 AM

MoU's don't mean anything. They basically just say: "We intend to explore the possibility of doing this and that, but it is not legally binding". It's when the contracts arrive and are signed that really matters.

Besides, I doubt Ethiopia government allows a bitcoin mining operation when the whole country is already experiencing rolling power outages.

Also, you can't mine Bitcoin with a conventional DC, as you should already know Undecided

My findings were based on OP question that why Russian company is making a mining centre in Ethiopia not in Russia. According to Forbes it's Ethiopian government project of setting up a data centre led by a Russian company BitCluster. The plan is to to host AI and other new technologies in that proposed Data Centre. Still it's not clear whether that Data Centre is operational or not. Moreover, not much details are available about the internal architecture of that Data Centre that's why it's difficult to predict whether it can support mining or not. May be it's a fake news.

Quote from: Bright Venus on January 05, 2024, 12:13:09 PM

What do you think about big companies making huge mining centers? And what about when those companies make it in other countries? How do you think this impact on those house-made mining structures, if does?

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Quote from: NotATether on January 10, 2024, 10:59:25 AM

That dam is not 100% built yet so it's only going to yield a fraction of the electricity that the article cited.

The dam is completed, and it's already filled for production levels, the flooding of the basin has started in 2020:
https://eros.usgs.gov/earthshots/grand-ethiopian-renaissance-dam-ethiopia

It does have only 700MW out of 5GW installed, but the trick is that the powerplant would have never produced that much, it has a capacity power below 30% so 2 turbines running full time will have the same effect as 6 installed over the year with the current debit being released.

Quote from: Asiska02 on March 23, 2024, 12:11:16 PM

And have you also thought about it that, as more miners increase, the higher the worth and reward value for their successful mined block.

Nope, that's not how economics work!
Otherwise, we would all just buy miners, dive the hashrate to 1 quadrillion exahashes and suddenly the Bitcoin price will be 2 trillion!
No, more miners doesn't mean higher prices!

Asiska02

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Quote from: Bright Venus on January 05, 2024, 12:13:09 PM

What do you think about big companies making huge mining centers? And what about when those companies make it in other countries? How do you think this impact on those house-made mining structures, if does?

Those aspects would have already been look into before giving the approval to such companies to set up a mining center in their country. No country will allow such without benefiting from it. Green house emission can be controlled and the energy emitted from those mining machine can be turned or converted into other renewable sources for consumption such as electricity generation.

Quote

I've just read something and this came to my mind. Because as we know, as more miners we have, less the payment we receive.

And have you also thought about it that, as more miners increase, the higher the worth and reward value for their successful mined block.

Quote

Do you think it will become a problem in the future and will be impossible to a regular person to start mining?

With the way the mining industry and the set up is becoming more expensive, It would be a problem for any regular person to mine.

NotATether

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Quote from: WatChe on March 23, 2024, 01:43:37 AM

It's March 23, 2024 now and there is still no confirmation that this proposed data centre [1] is operational or not. Moreover this data center is not only about Bitcoin mining but also about setting up facility for AI. Now is Feb 2024 [2], Ethiopia government has signed another MoU (with Hong Kong-based West Data Group) for development of infrastructure for data mining and artificial intelligence training operations in the country. Basically it's development of data centre where different cutting edge technologies will be hosted and Bitcoin mining will also be part of it.

[1] https://www.forbes.com/sites/digital-assets/2024/02/18/ethiopias-250-million-tech-expansion-in-bitcoin-and-ai/?sh=6031ac5f61f3
[2] https://www.reuters.com/technology/ethiopia-set-up-large-data-centre-amid-reported-bitcoin-mining-surge-2024-02-16/

MoU's don't mean anything. They basically just say: "We intend to explore the possibility of doing this and that, but it is not legally binding". It's when the contracts arrive and are signed that really matters.

Besides, I doubt Ethiopia government allows a bitcoin mining operation when the whole country is already experiencing rolling power outages.

Also, you can't mine Bitcoin with a conventional DC, as you should already know Undecided

WatChe

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Quote from: hugeblack on January 08, 2024, 06:03:22 AM

The text of the news says Russia to build crypto mining hub, and it did not say that construction has already begun. Also, by reading the details, we find that a 120-megawatt (MW) data center in Ethiopia was mentioned, and data centers differ from mining centers.

In general, I went to the news link from bitcluster.ru^[1] and found that the construction is supposed to be completed in January 2024, so by the end of this month we should get pictures of the data center. So let's wait and confirm this news.

[1] https://bitcluster.ru/mass-media/from-the-arctic-to-africa.html

It's March 23, 2024 now and there is still no confirmation that this proposed data centre [1] is operational or not. Moreover this data center is not only about Bitcoin mining but also about setting up facility for AI. Now is Feb 2024 [2], Ethiopia government has signed another MoU (with Hong Kong-based West Data Group) for development of infrastructure for data mining and artificial intelligence training operations in the country. Basically it's development of data centre where different cutting edge technologies will be hosted and Bitcoin mining will also be part of it.

[1] https://www.forbes.com/sites/digital-assets/2024/02/18/ethiopias-250-million-tech-expansion-in-bitcoin-and-ai/?sh=6031ac5f61f3
[2] https://www.reuters.com/technology/ethiopia-set-up-large-data-centre-amid-reported-bitcoin-mining-surge-2024-02-16/

FP91G

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Quote from: autoturn on March 19, 2024, 08:20:09 AM

That's too much work for little to no gain, anyone who runs a mining farm should be able to afford a PC or laptop of some kind, if the farm has many gears then tracking them on a mobile app is going to be a nightmare, if it has a few then monitoring apps are not really needed to begin with.

Not trying to discourage OP, but the best question to ask yourself before attempting to sell a new piece of software is "why would people use it", since 99% of the users won't be to able to safely check if the software is "honest", chances are -- most of them won't run it anywhere near their mining farms, all you need to have a miserable couple of months ahead is a nightswitcher or antbleed virus infecting a dozen miners on your farm.

I don't understand what you want to say about the laptop. Do you think that a large miner will not have enough budget for several computers?
The main control is usually on the computer, but the chief and duty engineers usually have an additional application on their phone that notifies about problems and failures during mining so that the staff can respond faster.

autoturn

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That's too much work for little to no gain, anyone who runs a mining farm should be able to afford a PC or laptop of some kind, if the farm has many gears then tracking them on a mobile app is going to be a nightmare, if it has a few then monitoring apps are not really needed to begin with.

Not trying to discourage OP, but the best question to ask yourself before attempting to sell a new piece of software is "why would people use it", since 99% of the users won't be to able to safely check if the software is "honest", chances are -- most of them won't run it anywhere near their mining farms, all you need to have a miserable couple of months ahead is a nightswitcher or antbleed virus infecting a dozen miners on your farm.

acquia

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It was interesting to see the latest difficulty adjustment lead to a decrease in difficulty.

Following many adjustments that lead a meteoric rise even while prices weren't close to record hghs it was weird to see that. Perhaps there's a tippping point somewhere around here, so if BTC prices also stagnate who knows.

I think if anyone is actually making a comeback though it's probably American miners. See foundry being the largest pool,.and many more are seeking to enter the mining biz. Bankrupt Celsius seeks to list a newco for mining for instance.

foggyb

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I believe the main reason companies are setting up mining operations in 3rd-world nations is because of the buying power of their currency compared to the host nation's weak currency.

Its probably true that electricity costs more to produce in Ethiopia than in Russia, but the relative state of their economies and currencies must be make enough of a difference that it is more profitable to setup a mining operations there.

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Quote from: hugeblack on January 08, 2024, 06:03:22 AM

The text of the news says Russia to build crypto mining hub, and it did not say that construction has already begun. Also, by reading the details, we find that a 120-megawatt (MW) data center in Ethiopia was mentioned, and data centers differ from mining centers.

In general, I went to the news link from bitcluster.ru^[1] and found that the construction is supposed to be completed in January 2024, so by the end of this month we should get pictures of the data center. So let's wait and confirm this news.

[1] https://bitcluster.ru/mass-media/from-the-arctic-to-africa.html

Your information is correct I also read through seen similar just as you have just stated, I think if there plan have been achieve the update would have been there as the set date is last month. If the Ethiopia government have enter such agreement I believe they will but not at this set date.

Gabrics

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Just digging around

The basin of the large dam will take many years to fill (even after built). Hence power production will only slowly ramp up.

Also, Egypt will have something to say about it... already fueling a civil war and a real war (at least air-strike) is also a possible (likely?) option. Egypt has great problem being cut off from water for many years, which they will need to survive.

I think going from Russia to this region is kind of bad to worse (or worse to bad). I would rather move to Paraguay.

FP91G

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Quote from: kuriboh on January 11, 2024, 01:09:44 PM

Quote from: Bright Venus on January 05, 2024, 12:13:09 PM

What do you think about big companies making huge mining centers?

The creation of large mining centers by big companies, particularly in cryptocurrency mining, has both positive and negative aspects.
Although the industry can benefit from the efficiency and innovation of large mining centers, issues with centralization, accessibility, and environmental impact exist. It still needs to be easier for the Bitcoin mining sector to balance the advantages of scale and the ideas of decentralization. The effect of massive mining centers on the larger ecosystem might remain a topic of discussion and debate as technologies and regulatory frameworks change.

Mining does not pollute the environment and has no harmful emissions. If 5 GW of power is used to produce goods, then from an environmental point of view it will be worse for the territory, but from an economic point of view there will be more jobs.

kuriboh

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Quote from: Bright Venus on January 05, 2024, 12:13:09 PM

What do you think about big companies making huge mining centers?

The creation of large mining centers by big companies, particularly in cryptocurrency mining, has both positive and negative aspects.
Although the industry can benefit from the efficiency and innovation of large mining centers, issues with centralization, accessibility, and environmental impact exist. It still needs to be easier for the Bitcoin mining sector to balance the advantages of scale and the ideas of decentralization. The effect of massive mining centers on the larger ecosystem might remain a topic of discussion and debate as technologies and regulatory frameworks change.

Bright Venus

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Quote from: NotATether on January 10, 2024, 10:59:25 AM

Quote from: logfiles on January 07, 2024, 04:51:07 AM

Ethiopia probably have cheap electricity as well because it's situated in the Nile basin. I did some research, and they have quite a number of hydroelectric power plants - https://www.gem.wiki/Category:Hydroelectric_power_plants_in_Ethiopia

in the article, they say

Quote

“100% of the data center’s electricity comes from renewable energy sources, specifically from the Grand Ethiopian Renaissance Dam, the largest hydropower project in Africa, with a capacity of 5.15 GW,”

That dam is not 100% built yet so it's only going to yield a fraction of the electricity that the article cited.

Let's hope they're not going to ursup all the residential electricity though, my neighborhood is farthest from the nearest power grid so we get more frequent outages.

and how are the electricity costs where you live?

NotATether

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Quote from: logfiles on January 07, 2024, 04:51:07 AM

Ethiopia probably have cheap electricity as well because it's situated in the Nile basin. I did some research, and they have quite a number of hydroelectric power plants - https://www.gem.wiki/Category:Hydroelectric_power_plants_in_Ethiopia

in the article, they say

Quote

“100% of the data center’s electricity comes from renewable energy sources, specifically from the Grand Ethiopian Renaissance Dam, the largest hydropower project in Africa, with a capacity of 5.15 GW,”

That dam is not 100% built yet so it's only going to yield a fraction of the electricity that the article cited.

Let's hope they're not going to ursup all the residential electricity though, my neighborhood is farthest from the nearest power grid so we get more frequent outages.

FP91G

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Quote from: Learn Bitcoin on January 06, 2024, 09:20:37 PM

Quote from: FP91G on January 06, 2024, 05:42:21 AM

In Russia, huge amounts of electricity are sold to China at very cheap prices, and a Russian company is building a data center in Ethiopia, where the civil war recently ended but the situation there is very difficult. In this data center, you can install 120,000 ASICs of 3.3 Kilowatt each, which will be a big investment.

If electricity is too cheap in Russia, what could be another reason that Russian companies building mining centers outside? Building a company outside of your own country is kind of expensive. As you mentioned, the civil war ended recently and the situation is difficult as well. Still, that company decided to invest there. I see two possible reasons why they are investing there. One, they are just trying to help Ethiopia unconditionally and the government will help those companies who will invest in their country. Two, Possibly that company is trying to escape VAT tax. I have heard that it's tough to move your money out of Russia.

BitCluster is not a state company and the Russian state does not really support mining, although it does not greatly hinder mining from developing. Perhaps this business protection is why the company invests in different countries.
Cash or non-cash money is difficult to transfer to other countries, so cryptocurrencies are often used

Learn Bitcoin

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Quote from: logfiles on January 07, 2024, 04:51:07 AM

Another factor could be the political climate in Russia and maybe the uncertainty towards crypto adoption. Russia is the kind of country that wakes up and bans whatever they want.

This could be the main reason. This makes much more sense. I know some Russian friends who don't like to be there and want to move to another country. But they couldn't. One of the main reasons is, that they have to abandon their house and the money they have. They said that they won't be able to keep their money with them. I don't know why it's too difficult when we have cryptocurrency. Some people live in Russia, but they don't like to be there.

A company may want to avoid any kind of possible future problems like a Mining ban, crypto ban, or Bitcoin ban. But I guess they have to pay fees as well for investing outside of the country.

hugeblack

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The text of the news says Russia to build crypto mining hub, and it did not say that construction has already begun. Also, by reading the details, we find that a 120-megawatt (MW) data center in Ethiopia was mentioned, and data centers differ from mining centers.

In general, I went to the news link from bitcluster.ru^[1] and found that the construction is supposed to be completed in January 2024, so by the end of this month we should get pictures of the data center. So let's wait and confirm this news.

[1] https://bitcluster.ru/mass-media/from-the-arctic-to-africa.html

logfiles

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Quote from: FP91G on January 06, 2024, 05:42:21 AM

In Russia, huge amounts of electricity are sold to China at very cheap prices, and a Russian company is building a data center in Ethiopia, where the civil war recently ended but the situation there is very difficult. In this data center, you can install 120,000 ASICs of 3.3 Kilowatt each, which will be a big investment.

According to the article, the mining center will be located in the Capital City Addis Ababa, which I believe did not experience the civil war. Besides, Russia is also engaged in some sort of war that we don't know when it will end.

Quote from: Learn Bitcoin on January 06, 2024, 09:20:37 PM

If electricity is too cheap in Russia, what could be another reason that Russian companies building mining centers outside? Building a company outside of your own country is kind of expensive. As you mentioned, the civil war ended recently and the situation is difficult as well.

Ethiopia probably have cheap electricity as well because it's situated in the Nile basin. I did some research, and they have quite a number of hydroelectric power plants - https://www.gem.wiki/Category:Hydroelectric_power_plants_in_Ethiopia

in the article, they say

Quote

“100% of the data center’s electricity comes from renewable energy sources, specifically from the Grand Ethiopian Renaissance Dam, the largest hydropower project in Africa, with a capacity of 5.15 GW,”

Another factor could be the political climate in Russia and maybe the uncertainty towards crypto adoption. Russia is the kind of country that wakes up and bans whatever they want.

Learn Bitcoin

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Quote from: FP91G on January 06, 2024, 05:42:21 AM

In Russia, huge amounts of electricity are sold to China at very cheap prices, and a Russian company is building a data center in Ethiopia, where the civil war recently ended but the situation there is very difficult. In this data center, you can install 120,000 ASICs of 3.3 Kilowatt each, which will be a big investment.

If electricity is too cheap in Russia, what could be another reason that Russian companies building mining centers outside? Building a company outside of your own country is kind of expensive. As you mentioned, the civil war ended recently and the situation is difficult as well. Still, that company decided to invest there. I see two possible reasons why they are investing there. One, they are just trying to help Ethiopia unconditionally and the government will help those companies who will invest in their country. Two, Possibly that company is trying to escape VAT tax. I have heard that it's tough to move your money out of Russia.

FP91G

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In Russia, huge amounts of electricity are sold to China at very cheap prices, and a Russian company is building a data center in Ethiopia, where the civil war recently ended but the situation there is very difficult. In this data center, you can install 120,000 ASICs of 3.3 Kilowatt each, which will be a big investment.

Learn Bitcoin

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Quote from: Bright Venus on January 05, 2024, 12:13:09 PM

What do you think about big companies making huge mining centers? And what about when those companies make it in other countries?

If they are licensed companies, there is nothing wrong with starting a business in a different country. There are too many factors that depend on such as electricity cost, manpower cost, and legality. Let's say mining is not allowed in my country, I can start a business in my neighbor country or another country if I want. If my company is licensed and I pay the taxes, there is nothing wrong.

Quote

I've just read something and this came to my mind. Because as we know, as more miners we have, less the payment we receive.

The mining difficulties have been increasing for years and it will grow further as more miners add to the network. Solo mining is not recommended for independent miners unless they have a bigger hash rate. It become impossible for a solo miner to find a block these days.

Bright Venus

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What do you think about big companies making huge mining centers? And what about when those companies make it in other countries? How do you think this impact on those house-made mining structures, if does?

I've just read something and this came to my mind. Because as we know, as more miners we have, less the payment we receive.

Do you think it will become a problem in the future and will be impossible to a regular person to start mining?

https://www.rt.com/africa/589461-russia-crypto-mining-center-ethiopia/amp/

Topic: Huge Russian mining center in Ethiopia (Read 634 times)