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Topic: I suppose Craig could have helped dev Bitcoin without being its mastermind . . . (Read 1045 times)

sr. member
Activity: 420
Merit: 262

That is a jumbled analysis which doesn't explain well the situation.

I already explained it more clearly:

Remember that Craig Wright had obtained funding for and was running a the largest Supercomputer in Australia. So what Craig has ostensibly done is he is used supercomputer resources to find the inverse of a hash function and then used one of Satoshi old transactions to pretend he has the private key:

The implication is that either Craig Wright has stumbled upon an infinitesimally rare occurrence of an SHA256 collision, or that he had used the signature from block 258 to reverse engineer a hash (the first shown in his blog demonstration) and hoped that nobody would notice. ycombinator user JoukeH noticed.

And with his access to a supercomputer, it is plausible he was able to reverse the hash in order to find a text that matched the signature that was already on the blockchain. Without that explanation, then he must have the private key! You seem to not understand the technology.  Roll Eyes

Let me unpack that more for n00bs. The point is that every Bitcoin signature signs the hash (of a hash) of the transaction. And so if someone can create two transactions that have the same hash, then one can use the same signature for both, i.e. no need to have the private key to generate a new signature.

What Craig did was reuse an existing signature from the block chain which is attributed to Satoshi, and supplied it as the signature for a new transactions. Specifically the new transaction is some text written by Sartre but the key point is that normally it should impossible to find a new set of data which can generate the same hash, because of the preimage resistance security property of the SHA256 cryptographic hash function.

Re-read my post, you didn't seem to understand it. Craig has not said he is Satoshi. Find a quote where he said that. You won't. He has always said it was his colleague.

Listen to the first few minutes of the BBC interview

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-36191165

"You're going to show me that Satoshi is you?"

Craig - "yes"

Remember Craig is a lawyer. Remember how Bill Clinton explained in court what the meaning of 'is' is.

Craig has consistently claimed he was backing "the persona behind Satoshi" and was part of a group involved with Satoshi, so the above statement is consistent with that, without him actually being the man who developed the code of Bitcoin with his own fingers. The interviewer did not ask Craig "are you going to prove you are the man who wrote the code of Bitcoin?" which obviously can't be proved nor disproved by any signature since Satoshi did not sign the code of Bitcoin.



Is Satoshi after all of Blockstream?

Quote
I have had no communication with Mr Wright at all, let alone signed anything. I understand that there is some information sheet Wright is giving reporters that specifically attacks me, however!

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/4hs2ca/can_all_core_developers_confirm_they_havent/



Hey dufus - why don't you look at the BBC article itself: http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-36168863

It says: "Australian entrepreneur Craig Wright has publicly identified himself as Bitcoin creator Satoshi Nakamoto."

Where did they get the information from - they got it from Craig Wright - still going to say he hasn't identified himself as being Satoshi?

You are quoting what a reporter has said, not what Craig has said. I said find a quote where Craig has claimed his is the man who wrote the code for Bitcoin. You will never find that.

Butthurt idiot. Bye.

I see you locked your thread again. You are an emotional basketcase.

I am replying to every topic where my post is relevant. I am not the one who created so many duplicate topics.

It isn't relevant and it is just spamming (you could start your own topic of course).

And if he was saying that he just knew Satoshi and is not Satoshi then why does Gavin come out this "meeting" saying that he is Satoshi (surely he would  have told Gavin it was his friend and not him).

You are just butthurt.

It is very relevant.

Craig has played Gavin. He knows Gavin needs support for his preferences for the block scaling debate.

Butthurt by what exactly?

(perhaps due to seeing your same post spammed in every topic?)

Don't pretend you've forgotten when you closed the technical thread where we were debating and told me in PM that you never wanted to talk to me again.

I don't have time for your melodrama. Bye.



It's increasingly obvious that despite not being able to present actual cryptographic proof Wright is putting a lot of effort into obfuscation and trying to sway the public opinion, whether it's for his business interests or something else.

You do not seem to understand the math. Either Craig broke SHA256 or he has Satoshi's private key.

Also by getting core Bitcoin devs and their tribe to claim that the proof Craig provided is not a proof, he has revealed them as being disingenuous. Very clever political game theory he has concocted.

Craig has astutely accomplished his goal, as only 42% of Bitcoiners conclude he can't be Satoshi. And when and if Craig signs coins from an early block of Bitcoin, the level of confusion will increase. Craig is playing a political game theory.

I think bringing in a dead person into this is just a scapegoat by Craig Wright to confuse spectators. If this is true, why would he pretend being Satoshi by signing a fake message? Until Craig comes up with this extraordinary proof he says, I refuse to believe anything that came from him.

Refusing to believe is not the same as proving he is not. Craig is winning the political game theory. He is a clever lawyer mofo.


One theory that is being floated on Reddit runs like this:

Kleiman is Satoshi, and had the keys to the ~1 million bitcoins. He dies, and his USB stick/computer/whatever went to a relative, who doesn't realize what he is holding. Wright knew Kleiman and knew he was Satoshi. So he invents this crazy story about being Satoshi, but that he can't spend the coins because they are all in a trust that was held by Kleiman.

So now Wright comes public claiming to be Satoshi - and sets himself up to launch a lawsuit against Kleiman's relative to get "his" bitcoins back. If Wright pulls this off, he gains the fabled treasure of 1 million bitcoins off Kleiman's estate.

Thoughts pro and con?



I just came up with another theory though...we might be missing the forest for the trees. Much of what CW has said has proven sketchy, or even downright lies (claiming multiple fake phd's for instance). We do know one thing that's incontrovertible: CW was very interested in high performance computing / supercomputing. Think about that for a minute.

Now what if Kleiman, being the typical computer geek, enjoyed the intellectual challenge of creating the code but had little interest in testing...and asked his friend CW to help test Bitcoin by mining. It's very possible that CW could own Block 1, and even if not, it's still possible that a significant part of Satoshi's stash...actually doesn't belong to Satoshi. What if most/all the coins we thought were Satoshi's were actually CW's?

It's also possible that Kleiman wrote the first version of the Bitcoin code, and that CW took over testing, bug fixing, and future development. Kleiman could have written the code, while CW could have been the "Satoshi" that communicated extensively with Gavin and others...

I think that CSW stumbled upon Bitcoin circa 2013 (late 2012 at the earliest) and started concocting a narrative to fit his long con. Stumbling upon the death of David Kleiman, a person who CSW co-wrote with, Craig saw that the pieces of Dave's life fit nicely in what's known about Satoshi. It was just a matter of creating docs to make it look like he and Dave were partners of sorts which I've demonstrated he's done.
sr. member
Activity: 420
Merit: 262
No - what Craig did was grab an existing signature used by Satoshi and pretend he had created it to sign a document by Sartre (which is fraud and even Gavin is not sure what on earth to make of that).

And he *is* claiming to be Satoshi (which is why he asked Gavin to come and *verify* his claim).

Also - why are you posting the exact same thing in multiple topics?

Re-read my post, you didn't seem to understand it. Craig has not said he is Satoshi. Find a quote where he said that. You won't. He has always said it was his colleague.

And with his access to a supercomputer, it is plausible he was able to reverse the hash in order to find a text that matched the signature that was already on the blockchain. Without that explanation, then he must have the private key! You seem to not understand the technology.  Roll Eyes

I am replying to every topic where my post is relevant. I am not the one who created so many duplicate topics.

I am replying to every topic where my post is relevant. I am not the one who created so many duplicate topics.

It isn't relevant and it is just spamming (you could start your own topic of course).

And if he was saying that he just knew Satoshi and is not Satoshi then why does Gavin come out this "meeting" saying that he is Satoshi (surely he would  have told Gavin it was his friend and not him).

You are just butthurt.

It is very relevant.

Craig has played Gavin. He knows Gavin needs support for his preferences for the block scaling debate.
sr. member
Activity: 420
Merit: 262
Quote
Craig "Satoshi" Wright said he was going to move them

hahah this guy is so funny lol. He doesn't need to move any coin to prove it, just sign the fcking message if he has the prive keys

Something is weird. He provided a message and a signature, but there's nothing in the message to indicate that he signed it himself, or when it was signed. It could have been signed months or years ago and there's no way to prove otherwise.

To understand what is really going on, you need to read carefully what Craig Wright has always said and continues to reiterate:

In his initial blog post, Wright noted that “Satoshi is dead... but this is only the beginning.” He also said that he would follow up with a more detailed mathematical explanation for the revelation. Now, the world will likely have to wait for “the coming days”—however long that may be—for more clues.

If I sign Craig Wright, it is not the same as if I sign Craig Wright, Satoshi.

I think this is true, but in my heart I wish it wasn’t.

Since those early days, after distancing myself from the public persona that was Satoshi,

Satoshi is dead.

But this is only the beginning.

You need to remember that Craig Wright has never claimed he is Satoshi Nakamoto. Instead, he has claimed that his former colleague (who died) was Satoshi. He claims he was backing his colleague's the development of Bitcoin.

This Australian Says He and His Dead Friend Invented Bitcoin



David Kleiman, Craig Wright's friend more likely Satoshi Nakamoto

OK so this might get a little meandering but I keep finding tidbits of David Kleiman's life that makes him a far more likely candidate for Satoshi than Wright. So here are some in no specific order.

Remember that Craig Wright had obtained funding for and was running a the largest Supercomputer in Australia. So what Craig has ostensibly done is he is used supercomputer resources to find the inverse of a hash function and then used one of Satoshi old transactions to pretend he has the private key:

The implication is that either Craig Wright has stumbled upon an infinitesimally rare occurrence of an SHA256 collision, or that he had used the signature from block 258 to reverse engineer a hash (the first shown in his blog demonstration) and hoped that nobody would notice. ycombinator user JoukeH noticed.

Realize that he has probably promised to endorse Andresen's block chain scaling preferences and thus probably why Gavin wants him to be Satoshi:

Andresen’s only attempt at an explanation for Wright’s bizarre behavior, he says, is an ambivalence about definitively revealing himself after so many years in hiding. “I think the most likely explanation is that … he really doesn’t want to take on the mantle of being the inventor of Bitcoin,” says Andresen, who notes that his own credibility is at stake, too. “Maybe he wants things to be really weird and unclear, which would be bad for me.”

That uncertainty, Andresen says, seemed to be evident in Wright’s manner at the time of their demonstration. Andresen describes Wright as seeming “sad” and “overwhelmed” by the decision to come forward. “His voice was breaking.

Remember that after his death, David Kleiman's family recovered his USB flash drive and gave it to Craig Wright. Thus likely Craig Wright may have an unpublished transaction but not the actual private key. So he may be about to fool the world into thinking he is Satoshi, or making some proof that he was the man behind the man who was the real Satoshi.
vip
Activity: 1428
Merit: 1145
TLDR - There is some secondary evidence that suggests Craig is competent enough to be Bitcoin's creator.  However, mystery persists notwithstanding that evidence.  For example, how can one explain the similarities between the substance of the BTC white paper and a certain 1969 article about transit networks.  Also, Peter Todd and others still seem like plausible Satoshis. At the moment, I'm interested in a fellow named David Birch as Satoshi - he currently fits my research (but I may be biased or experiencing confirmation bias).  
---------------

Third set of links from OP may be of some interest to folk today. Here they are again:

http://imgur.com/a/JuSha
http://seclists.org/basics/2006/Jun/67
http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=2023459&CFID=766007962&CFTOKEN=91523665
http://cypherpunks.venona.com/date/1996/11/msg01782.html (notable only b/c of particular mailing list + date)
http://seclists.org/pen-test/2007/Aug/166


The top link is a screenshot of the first page of a paper written by Craig in early 2008 next to the first page of the bitcoin white paper.  The comparison does not verify the identity of Satoshi Nakamoto as Craig, but it is interesting to note Craig was writing about the same type of thing (digial currency and digital signatures) in the same time period.

Personally, I'm not sure about Craig being Satoshi because there are too many other variables not yet explained.  For example, I've written about Peter Todd as possibly being Satoshi.  In those writings, I noted that my research was generating a lot of references to trains.  Initially, and still to some degree, I thought model railroads were thing of interest to Satoshi (originally inspired by LMGoodman of Newsweek, but I kinda took it a different direction).  See here: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/part-3-much-more-on-why-clues-suggest-peter-todd-is-probably-satoshi-1340867

Later, I found an article about transit networks from the 1960s that is eerily similar to the technology proposed by the Bitcoin paper.  See here: https://medium.com/@Felt/satoshi-s-inspiration-b948a5b17790#.8ago8bq3z and here: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.14274168

Subsequent to that, I've been researching those folks interested in payments and transit.  I've found a great candidate: David Birch of Consult Hyperion.  He consulted for Octopus Card (http://www.octopus.com.hk/home/en/index.html), for some similar dutch companies (IIRC), and worked with BART (SF/Oakland area) - all companies related to transit networks and payments.  In that line of work he probably worked with and encountered David Chaum of DigiCash: http://www.wired.com/1997/07/crypto-2.  He was/is a member of the Cryptography mailing list.  I believe Birch has written books about digital identity and possibly about trains (tbf - I can't verify same Birch here: http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=la_B00JA09EZI_B00JA09EZI_sr?rh=i%3Abooks&field-author=David+G.+Birch&sort=relevance&ie=UTF8&qid=1462228365)  

Mr. Birch had a digital wallet on his flip-phone in Jan 2008 and has been working on this type of stuff (payments; digital transactions) for as long as anybody has been in the industry: http://imgur.com/a/HYgjy.

He's also funny: https://twitter.com/dgwbirch/status/727138543957581825.  These links about Birch are only a small sample of what's out there.

For me, my gut tells me there is more to the Craig story than is known right now.  Maybe he connects back to Peter Todd or Mr. Birch.  Maybe he's a cover for Gavin and/or Birch.  Maybe they all know one another and are laughing their butts off at us/me right now.  



David's first tweet today was at 4:28 AM (NYC time): https://twitter.com/dgwbirch/status/727052066498174976



The previous tweet was at 10:22 PM (NYC time/EST)

That's an extreme maximum sleep time of 6 hours for an elderly man and having to prepare for CONSENSUS 2016 starting this morning.

https://twitter.com/dgwbirch/status/727188625604153347



hero member
Activity: 493
Merit: 518
TLDR - There is some secondary evidence that suggests Craig is competent enough to be Bitcoin's creator.  However, mystery persists notwithstanding that evidence.  For example, how can one explain the similarities between the substance of the BTC white paper and a certain 1969 article about transit networks.  Also, Peter Todd and others still seem like plausible Satoshis. At the moment, I'm interested in a fellow named David Birch as Satoshi - he currently fits my research (but I may be biased or experiencing confirmation bias).  
---------------

Third set of links from OP may be of some interest to folk today. Here they are again:

http://imgur.com/a/JuSha
http://seclists.org/basics/2006/Jun/67
http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=2023459&CFID=766007962&CFTOKEN=91523665
http://cypherpunks.venona.com/date/1996/11/msg01782.html (notable only b/c of particular mailing list + date)
http://seclists.org/pen-test/2007/Aug/166


The top link is a screenshot of the first page of a paper written by Craig in early 2008 next to the first page of the bitcoin white paper.  The comparison does not verify the identity of Satoshi Nakamoto as Craig, but it is interesting to note Craig was writing about the same type of thing (digial currency and digital signatures) in the same time period.

Personally, I'm not sure about Craig being Satoshi because there are too many other variables not yet explained.  For example, I've written about Peter Todd as possibly being Satoshi.  In those writings, I noted that my research was generating a lot of references to trains.  Initially, and still to some degree, I thought model railroads were thing of interest to Satoshi (originally inspired by LMGoodman of Newsweek, but I kinda took it a different direction).  See here: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/part-3-much-more-on-why-clues-suggest-peter-todd-is-probably-satoshi-1340867

Later, I found an article about transit networks from the 1960s that is eerily similar to the technology proposed by the Bitcoin paper.  See here: https://medium.com/@Felt/satoshi-s-inspiration-b948a5b17790#.8ago8bq3z and here: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.14274168

Subsequent to that, I've been researching those folks interested in payments and transit.  I've found a great candidate: David Birch of Consult Hyperion.  He consulted for Octopus Card (http://www.octopus.com.hk/home/en/index.html), for some similar dutch companies (IIRC), and worked with BART (SF/Oakland area) - all companies related to transit networks and payments.  In that line of work he probably worked with and encountered David Chaum of DigiCash: http://www.wired.com/1997/07/crypto-2.  He was/is a member of the Cryptography mailing list.  I believe Birch has written books about digital identity and possibly about trains (tbf - I can't verify same Birch here: http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=la_B00JA09EZI_B00JA09EZI_sr?rh=i%3Abooks&field-author=David+G.+Birch&sort=relevance&ie=UTF8&qid=1462228365)  

Mr. Birch had a digital wallet on his flip-phone in Jan 2008 and has been working on this type of stuff (payments; digital transactions) for as long as anybody has been in the industry: http://imgur.com/a/HYgjy.

He's also funny: https://twitter.com/dgwbirch/status/727138543957581825.  These links about Birch are only a small sample of what's out there.

For me, my gut tells me there is more to the Craig story than is known right now.  Maybe he connects back to Peter Todd or Mr. Birch.  Maybe he's a cover for Gavin and/or Birch.  Maybe they all know one another and are laughing their butts off at us/me right now.  



hero member
Activity: 1106
Merit: 521
Some really good links here, enjoy reading articles like that written by satoshi.... this will someday be every important historical links..... Grin
vip
Activity: 1428
Merit: 1145
It seems it was added very recently, check this:

https://web.archive.org/web/20150320122730/http://lumo.blogspot.com/2009_01_01_archive.html

This was very well researched and discussed a few months ago, search the forum you'll find more information about this hoax.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lubo%C5%A1_Motl

Quote
Luboš Motl (born December 5, 1973) is a Czech theoretical physicist. He was an assistant professor at Harvard University from 2004 to 2007. His scientific publications are focused on string theory.

http://lumo.blogspot.com/2009/01/bitcoin.html

Quote
Bitcoin

Well, e-gold is down the toilet. Good idea, but again centralized authority.

The Beta of Bitcoin is live tomorrow. This is decentralized... We try until it works.

Some good coders on this. The paper rocks. https://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf

My uncle lives in Melbourne but I have hired a fellow climate skeptic in Sydney who seems to be good at IT security issues, Craig Steven Wright, and told him to create a new fictitious Japanese identity, pay several coders, and complete the project.
Let us hope it will work. He also claims to be able to read e-mails of the climate alarmists in the U.K. which could be helpful to show what they're internally doing but I don't want to have anything to do with hacking.

http://motls.blogspot.com/2013/11/bitcoin-will-probably-keep-on.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+LuboMotlsReferenceFrame+%28Lubos+Motl%27s+reference+frame%29

Quote
I want to say one more thing. The very concept that "new bitcoins may be mined" was designed in order to allow an increasing number of people to be "sucked" into this Ponzi scheme. But for the actual value of the bitcoin, it's pretty much irrelevant already today because over 50% of the ultimate bitcoin number already exists. So the potential for drop due to new bitcoins is less than a factor of two while the speculative bubble may still add orders of magnitude. For this reason, it's already a good approximation to neglect the fact that new bitcoins are being mined. This fact is only important for the marketing – to make new people interested. The real question is what percentage of mankind's wealth people are ready to store in an alternative currency that may never become the "main currency" due to its intrinsic volatility which prevents it from being accepted by people and companies who have to financially plan (i.e. by almost everyone).
vip
Activity: 1428
Merit: 1145
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 0
Has Satoshi's coins ever moved. If they haven't then this Craig chap isn't him, given that he seems pretty materialistic and would definitely have been selling them.

I'm only new to BTC so I can't be 100% but I don't believe Satoshi's coins have ever moved.
legendary
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1088
CryptoTalk.Org - Get Paid for every Post!
Has Satoshi's coins ever moved. If they haven't then this Craig chap isn't him, given that he seems pretty materialistic and would definitely have been selling them.
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 0
I think if the real Satoshi Nakamoto came forward people would still be very skeptical, even if he/she/they weren't claiming anything and didn't even want to be treated differently people here would probably berate him/her/them. Undecided (I don't know if this makes sense, it's 4am and I'm a bit tipsy Smiley )
legendary
Activity: 1092
Merit: 1001
...
This was very well researched and discussed a few months ago, search the forum you'll find more information about this hoax.

Yes. A few months back there was much discussion about him, and much, if not all, was debunked.
He claimed to be Satoshi Nakamoto to the Australian government to explain his bitcoins that may
or may not have originated from ransomware payments. He claims to be one of the first miners.
legendary
Activity: 2786
Merit: 1031
It seems it was added very recently, check this:

https://web.archive.org/web/20150320122730/http://lumo.blogspot.com/2009_01_01_archive.html

This was very well researched and discussed a few months ago, search the forum you'll find more information about this hoax.
hero member
Activity: 493
Merit: 518
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