Topic: I tired of Banks my experince with nyc high value Property (Read 390 times)

At the same time it is difficult to know if the real estate market will keep being as strong as it was, on the past people needed to be close to their jobs in order to get there on time, this force people to buy properties for a high price they may not like simply for their jobs, but now that many people can work online then this trend is changing, as you can move out to a part of your country which is cheaper and still make the same amount of money, so if I were to guess those expensive properties on NY could eventually go down in value and not be a good investment.

For anybody with limited finances this is the best approach to investments in my opinion. Buying a property in New York sounds like a great deal, but this requires a lot of finances and for the majority of people this is not really an option. The advantage of investing in crypto currencies is that we can do this already with small amount. When saving a few hundred USD, or even 10k USD we could be building a nice crypto portfolio with good returns. Using that kind of money for a real estate deal would get us nowhere. It's hard to compare these two options because one requires to take out loans that might run for 30 years, whereas the crypto investments can be sold and bought everyday. Also using DCA seems the best approach for me to buy crypto currencies over a long period of time instead of making one big purchase today.

If he only put what he owes to invest in bitcoin, that will still be risky because the market is still unpredictable and no one will know when the market will get a bull run.
Meanwhile, he still needs to pay his debts to his banks and without having an income, he will find it difficult to repay his debts.
The interest from his bank can be higher depending on how much money he wants to borrow and how long the time he will repay the debts so he needs to search for a way about how he can have money to repay the debts.
If he wants to use DCA to invest in bitcoin, that will be fine but he needs to determine when to buy gradually.

There's no 100% guarantee Bitcoin price will increase after halving, so make sure you're invest in Bitcoin using borrowed money very carefully. You need to assume Bitcoin price will down to zero and what you will do after that to repay back the loaned money + interest rate.

Borrowing money from bank is good as long as you understand about it, watch Robert Kiyosaki's saying where he borrow money in order to evade paying tax.

You are giving advice to borrow money to invest in bitcoin rather than doing business, are you serious? You said you know about bitcoin, so what do you know about bitcoin? What evidence do you have to prove with certainty that bitcoin will rise again in the future, and when exactly?

Without history there is no future, but there is no guarantee that history will always repeat itself and history does not represent the future. Don't just look at history to be sure of something in the future, if investing in bitcoin is so easy, why do people lose so much?

Borrowing money to invest or do business is not a bad thing, but it will be bad advice when we do not know their economic situation and hastily give advice to borrow money. By the way, are you borrowing money to invest?

Borrowing money from the bank has a high interest rate that they will charge for sure if you build a business that you want. If you're just going to borrow from the bank, I think it's safer to put what you owe to invest in Bitcoin than to put it in a traditional business that you know.

At least with Bitcoin, we know something about it, somehow we are sure that the rise of its value in the market has a destination, yes, we have a risk due to volatility, but we know that the price value will really increase. especially since there is an upcoming Bitcoin halving and an upcoming bull run by next year.

I think you should re-read my comment again. I did not say all altcoins are useless, no, but perhaps many altcoins are useless.


I don't think I said anything relating to that, but then again, everyone has their choice of investment, and to avoid mistakes and regrets, they have to get informed first about the risk of any investment they are venturing into.


No, I don't bet on investments. I do my research before making an investment, and if I find out that an asset is not worth my funds at that moment, I don't go for it in a rush.

In essence, all parties will definitely seek a profit. And of course this includes banks. Every bank company always tries to attract more customers to their bank. With the aim of getting more profits of course. And every customer who comes to the bank actually has a different purpose. There are those who really want to secure their assets in the bank. There are those who ask for capital assistance and so on. What must be considered here is how to establish mutually beneficial cooperation between both parties. Both for the customer and also for the bank. There must be reciprocity between the two. And if there is no reciprocity in kind then of course there will be no cooperation. And many private banks currently have better offers to their customers than state-owned banks. And I think we just have to look for something that fits what we're looking for that can be mutually beneficial for both parties.

Recently, many threads on this forum have criticized banks, and it seems like no one is coming to their defense. Banks have indeed made significant contributions to the overall development of the world, generating substantial revenues for governments. They have also supported many successful entrepreneurs through loans, which has played a crucial role in economic growth.

When it comes to cryptocurrencies, it's essential to consider what they contribute to governments. Some individuals may still be benefiting from traditional banks, while others have found advantages in cryptocurrencies. I don't view them as rivals or competitors; they represent two distinct options for managing money and assets, one digital and the other physical. Even if cryptocurrencies become dominant, fiat currencies will likely continue to exist, as not all countries may adopt cryptocurrencies as their primary currency.

I was thinking the same, perhaps OP's credit score is not that good hence the 40% down payment requirement. Moreover, you're right about the interest system, at least in my country. Hence, I suggested to OP about trying other banks as they may offer OP something different. OP needs to understand that banks are businesses as well hence they have to ensure that they will have profit and leverage, they need to be sure that thier clients will pay them hence the downpayment.

After all they are a business, they need to pay their employee and they need to make money to survive, and their main business is loan, so yeah they provide you money but they will take advantage of it.


I don't know how the credit/mortgage system work in your country, but from where I came from. If you put more down payment, you will have lower total interest, and if you want to want to get the lowest possible down payment you need to have a good credit score. You should check whether that 40% down payment actually give you lower total interest that you need to pay or not, if yes then the bank is actually helping you.

A lot of people think that banks are there for us and to provide us with benefits, I know that we get to use their services and we need those services, but we are in no way getting any benefits from the banks, instead, they are using us to earn billions of dollars every year, and where does that money come from? From us, of course. We give them our money to keep and they use that money on loans and other stuff and earn money on that, and what do we get for that? Barely 10% of our money a year.

This is the biggest reason why banks and financial institutions find Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies as a threat because they know if people start taking their wealth from them into Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies, they will have a hard time since it's the money they get from us that they use to earn revenue.

Banks are profit making companies. Bank does not have a factory. A bank's factory is its balance sheet, which functions by lending out the deposits it collects. The bank has to make money and profit from this core business and its subsidiary businesses so that it can grow its capital and collect more deposits and lend more money.

It is useful to add a little macroeconomic information here. When banks are not making profits, their capital cannot grow and banks cannot grow their balance sheets. In an environment where the banking sector is not growing, companies cannot find the financing they need to grow or individuals cannot get consumer loans to buy houses, cars, vacations, technological devices and the like. As a result, the economy becomes more dependent on foreign funding. Therefore if you want to live without making money for the bank, you can live without using banks, but when banks are used, it is natural to know that the bank has various intermediation revenues in return for the services received from banks and to act accordingly.

Banks are a business model, the idea is not that bad and it could have done a lot of good for the people, it allows the ones that have too much to put in the bank and make a profit, and the ones who do not have enough to take and pay back a bit more to make the ones who give them the money a bit of profit.

This way everyone benefits from it and it works as intended. Long time ago banks realized that they could make a lot more profit if they stretch it bigger, like you give them 100 dollars, they loan that same 100 dollars to 10 different people to make a profit, that way while they pay you 5 dollars in profit, they get 50 dollars in profit themselves. This caused a lot of trouble for everyone and got them very rich.

So what about altcoins like ETH or BNB? Is it true that as you said, has ETH ever been dumped and never returned to its old ATH? Not all altcoins are useless or not worth investing in and DCA. Bitcoin is not the only profitable investment in this market and the rest are useless. Although altcoins have more risk, in return you cannot deny that their profits will be more significant than BTC brings. Do you dare bet with me, if you buy BTC from the bottom and I buy ETH during this bear season? I'm pretty confident that my profits will be higher than yours in the upcoming bull season. When talking about the risks of altcoins, we should not imply all of them because there are some that are worth investing in.

We also need to take into account the general area where we want to buy our property in order to understand the attitude of banks and realtors, when we are talking about such a exclusive area in which prices are some of the highest you can find all around the world then they can get away with being extremely cocky, as the main reason people are buying into those expensive areas is to show their wealth, so it is natural the OP encountered such a reaction and no one wanted to negotiate with them as there will always be someone else willing to buy the property and accept all their conditions.

buying properties in New york is one of the worst things you could do to yourself.

People are already catching up to the news. New York's not the concrete jungle it was made out to be. No innovation, the whole city's sinking every year, stupendous prices for rent which no one in their right minds will pay except out of desperation, rats everywhere, and the general fact that NYC isn't the most hospitable or habitable city on the planet. I say if you're really into real estate invest in those that are at the country side, never in crime-dense areas. Do yourself a favor and pull out of that investment (I know it's your own money and I have no rights to ever influence you but NYC is a massive honey trap you shouldn't be falling for). Otherwise you're practically commiting to losing everything over time.

DCAing cryptocurrency or Bitcoin? The DCA strategy is mostly used while investing in Bitcoin because it's the only crypto asset that doesn't have a pump and dump algorithm like altcoins. Also, lots of those altcoins in the market are so cheap and you don't even need to use the DCA strategy in order to invest in them.  Let's take for example you are DCAing a token that is trading for  about   $5, but as you keep DCAing, the price keeps dropping until  it finally falls to $0.8 which was never going to see another pump of even up to $2, that means you just lost your investment.

The thread title seems to suggest that you're talking about New York City property, but then the rest of your message is such rambling garbage it's hard to understand. The top cities in any country always have the highest property prices and it is hardly a surprise for anyone who would be taking out a mortgage in the area. As you've identified, they don't have any interest in gaining your business because you are just a high risk to them and you're unlikely ever to be able to pay off a mortgage in that location if that is your grasp of the English language. Nor do you need to buy a property in such a place, America is a vast place and you'll find cheaper property in many different areas, so adjust to that reality.

I think banks do have personal benefits for their business. Unless you are an investor there, if you are just a customer, maybe you will only get an offer from their business model. but don't worry, I'm sure you are on this forum, which means you know how much potential crypto has now. You have to take advantage of it to not lose out to the business owned by the bank. even if individually it is not as big as a bank, but personally you get a lot of benefits.

It is not just to DCA on cryptocurrency but what coin in particular is what matters because you could invest in shit coins and that leads you into regret.

I still prefer investment in property. Although the percentage interest of 40% is high but it depends on what value you have to offer in the business. Banks tend to increase their interest percentage if they don't see much value in your offer or they also use interest rate to scare you off from the business. But if you can, I would encourage you to invest in properties because it helps your retirement when you don't have strength for physical work anymore, you can rely on it and its durability is more higher than most investment you can think of.

Banks don't care about your feelings mate, because they are out for business, or do you think that they care about how you feel towards their service..NO. Let them be since you can't meet up to the loan requirement. It is better that you invest in bitcoin like you said and DCA when possible, because this is the only way you can avoid bank craps and make profit at the long run. Bitcoin gives you the privilege for you to be your own bank. Our traditional banks are extorting customers in every angle of their service to customers. I am not surprised but we still need them and we can't do without them, maybe this is the reason why banks do whatever they like.

Banks make profits from debt, which has been happening for a long time to make it big. Those of us who want to take housing have to owe them money so they can get the interest. Well, it doesn't make sense but that's how it happens and we can't deny it.

If you want to buy a house, maybe you don't need to buy it through a bank. I see there are lots of offers from people because they are also selling their houses so you can make transactions with them even though, in the end, you still use the bank to transfer the money.

However, housing prices are declining due to a problematic economy, so it may not be profitable for a certain period. And if you can choose Bitcoin as your investment, you can certainly make much greater profits than if you invest in property. But you should think about everything first before making a decision and don't rush into making a decision.

Much like what the others have already stated, banks are also businesses that seek to make a profit but also retain their clients. The 40% downpayment is probably due to a bad/low credit score that you have, or you probably just have a default one. If you cannot afford to give the 40% downpayment (which, if I am in your shoes I also wouldn't agree to it) you can try for a different property wherein they can offer you a lower downpayment. Or you can always try for a different bank because there are cases where other banks offer a different contract that might suit your financial conditions. Either way, they will always ask for a downpayment as collateral. It's been like that for so long so I'm not really surprised that they are doing so.

Cryptocurrency should never be your only choice if you want to be a successful businessman. Just because of one shit deal, you can not turn your face from real estate. There are people who are still making a good amount of profits from this. This is why you need to ask people who are successful in that section. They will be able to give you the best advice and show you some shortcuts and secrets that will help you to get better results.

I am not against cryptocurrency or anything. I am also an investor in crypto. But why stop there? If there's an opportunity, why not take that? The key is to keep trying. You can not find the best deal on your first try. Or the deal that will suit you. In order to find one, you will have to keep searching and approaching people for advice. You can buy cheap land that could have the potential to grow in value in the future. Or you can also make profits in the future by selling it.

My point is, don't stop on one thing when you can do many more. Keep trying till you achieve success.

Do you think that banks are charitable organizations that were created to facilitate people's affairs and financial needs? This is a huge mistake, if they do not earn from you exponentially, they will not give you a cent.

If you are going to pay 40% of the property price, it is better to buy a cheaper house in another area or invest in your own project, so I think that your decision to leave the banks and move towards the BTC DCA strategy is absolutely correct.

Investing in Bitcoin in the long term is much better than investing in real estate by taking a loan from the bank. At least you will not owe anyone and you will get your full profits, whereas if you get a loan, all your profits will go to the banks, and if you are late in paying, the property will be seized.

Banks make money out of debt out of thin air so i want to get that money also not just that they make money out of me when i make money they make money one day people will just use crypto and Even nobody dont take cbdc we choose btc it's our Free Will and that's then what bankers Will close their doors and what they do then ? Will they eat their own printed money ,here is the thing you don't mess with Strong ones If you mess with strong ones it's problem you need to see those who are strong better get them on your side.
The fact that they make money out of thin air means If they want to be more successful they need to share this with those who make business then they keep their income stream also good.

The second point is that no building no land worth of that kind of price they asking.
And If had to put down 40% down payment i could just buy my own Property without any mortgage so i hope they will finally work together with business mind person and we drink together expensive drinks and make good profit.

You are now talking about your impression or feeling about something that may be right or wrong, but you are not offering criticism of the idea. The mortgage is considered a financial instrument more than an investment in the property or related to it, and therefore it is risky to pay the price of buying an apartment on credit unless you calculate your steps properly. True, otherwise you will fall into a long spiral that will not be easy to get out of. Spending on real estate outside the residential framework is a long-term investment in the value of the property assuming that it will increase, or short-term speculation with the aim of achieving a large profit, so choose whichever of the two you want.

I don't think so that they remain laggards with their business. In fact, they're even implementing and trying to innovate to keep themselves in line with what's the current trend today, thus there's the CBDCs. Well, as for that liabilities, there's a balance into their management and they know how to handle that.

They do provide that for people like you but maybe you're not approaching them rightly or you're not eligible for the customers that they do help out to take loans. When you say provide money for you guys, they're a bank and a business and not a charity so basically you're obliged to pay them back if ever you're granted a loan request.

You know what, you're asking to buy through mortgage and that's a policy from the bank that you have to pay certain amount for the downpayment. You should have just negotiated well on them because they might give you some better rates and DP for that property you're acquiring. And you're trying to talk with the bank so, you're at their mercy and you can't do anything with that.

Compared to this, yeah, just DCA or stake or do whatever you want with your money because you've got more freedom doing it.

Banks are very aggressive and they want to assure that they have the collateral and that kind of downpayment is very normal, also the interest are high with banks.

We can’t do anything about this especially if we are the one applying for a loan, but if you can still live on a normal life then better to invest first before taking any loans, and instead of saving your money in a bank better to look for a good investment, crypto can be your option but you have to understand the risk so you wont regret it.

@OP, you do what is the strategy that is working for you.

If staking dca is working for you, I don't know how you'd do that but if it's working for you then you have to do that for your own sake.

DCA is the best strategy that many have been doing for years and no matter what the market status is, you'll have to keep buying without looking at the present.

I figure a lot of frustration was put into creating this thread and as such, it came with a hand pouring error or perhaps English isn’t your first language and maybe your getting on with the aid of a translator because, it wasn’t an easy read. I had to do my best to connect the dots to make sense out of some statements.

From what I get,
You went seeking a loan and you were offered a mortgage at an outrageous percentage, you as well sort out a property in real estate to invest in but, it’s been offered at yet another high price and they still won’t let you inspect the property for damages or devalue it.
Hope I got all that right though! If that be the case,

Then that’s just how crappy the situation could be when you’re hoping to make meaning of your life from the bank. It comes at a high price but, you can’t get that in cryptos. Loans offered are relatively very low given the fact that, trust is what is been worked with and it’s only on a forum such as this. You’ll always be better off having generated your own money.

Too high with a 'minimum' 40% down payment if you can't afford it then don't do it there are still offers that are below that because every bank is always different from what is conveyed to you.
The bank is already quite professional in terms of business especially with buying or renting property I think even with a 30% down payment it is still quite high if that is an objection then leave the bank.

I think not making money is better than staking, if this leads to altcoins then it will be very worthless later.
DCA percentages are better on bitcoin with a relatively good value term but you shouldn't get stuck on altcoins that only think your view is good.

To be honest the service you require from the bank is not a service crypto-currency can offer you so I don't see the relationship with this your experience with the bank and Crypto-currency.

Crypto don't offer mortgage payment or even loan. Although there are services that are based on loan via crypto-currency but still the terms are condition's are made by the service providers so I understand your point about the unfair service from the bank but you just have tk work hard to improve your finances to avoid it .

Look, op, if you're looking to buy property as an investment, as a businessman (and you say so yourself), surely you must understand that banks are also businesses, also looking to make profit. So of course they want to get as much money out of their clients as they can without losing the client and thus losing more money, and get away with as much vagueness as they legally can.
I'm glad you're a responsible investor who's looking at potential investments in detail, asking for relevant info to assess your own risks. It's also nice to see that you want to try crypto (hopefully, Bitcoin) DCA, as you'll see it's much easier, doesn't require negotiations, loans, or maintenance fees.

Banks will never go into any business which will not give them huge profits. Before a bank will agree to offer any credit or loan facilities they will do an in-depth evaluation of your business proposal, profit margin, and interest rate. If they are not sure of the business they will take collateral to serve as a guarantee. But to be candid, I didn't see any thing innovative in your business proposal. You just applied for a loan to buy a property which is very common among the populace. Although these bankers rend to be too greedy I won't blame them much, they have bills to pay.

There is no guarantee that you will make more money from cryptocurrencies. But if your target is to invest in bitcoin, you can make some money depending on how much you invest and how long you are willing to hodl your coin. I am not sure of altcoins but bitcoin is more stable and reliable.

If you're considering the banks then it's better to give it a second more thought that the are even worst as you have given, there's nothing you can perfectly secure with them which belongs to you, then finding an alternative to this financial corrupt system is a better way out of it by going decentralized


DCA is a good opinion for you to use, one can atleast make the possible and highest purchase and invest in bitcoin to hold over a period of time, it also provides a convenient means for its use while accumulating more of bitcoin than waiting long over time to accumulate much at ones.

You're a business minded person and that's the more reason business men like you are supposed to be more understanding about the impersonal  rules of getting loans than any stray across the street. What had you expected. That they give you what you're demanding for without a valuable collateral?

 Be honest with yourself, Is that how you would have run your own business as a business minded person?  In my opinion the bank is took a necessary financial decision/position.


The word cryptocurrency reverberate over many coins, and I'll assume you are talking of bitcoin.

You have made a valid point, I was thinking the same, no one wants to lose their earned money. Either its the OP or the Banks. They want to earn from each other as they can. But,  OP do have a point that by doing DCA in crypto he can earn more and could get more profits. But foe OP, I have only one suggestion, that if you are a businessman then you must know the rules of business.

You must have some expectations of profits and for how long you are planning to hold the assets you are going to buy. Either it is land, property or cryptocurrencies. Point is, BTC is a good hedge against inflation but you will get to see the results in the long run. So please make a mind set that is required to do earn profit by accumulating BTC. And it does not matter how you accumulte BTC, like you can do DCA and Lump sum too. But if you are planning to invest in some assets that could generate you high profits and you don't have to pay huge interest and you want full custody then investing in BTC is better then anything. But be aware that I am talking only about BTC. I will not recommend one to start investing in alts for holding purposes.

As you say, you are a businessman and your goal is to make a profit, so don't forget that a bank is also a business and they also need to make a profit. You are the one borrowing money from them and you need to comply with their regulations, if you feel dissatisfied with their rules, you just need to refuse, you don't need to badmouth them when you can't borrow. For example, if you were a lender and with the interest rate you offered, many people were dissatisfied and said bad things about you, how would you feel?

Banks don't need you and they don't force you to borrow money or deposit money with them. If you find them annoying, never use their services, that's it.

Hah? You finally said DCA cryptocurrency? When talking about hedging and asking for cheap taxes, why not far away Bitcoin offers an offer without any interest. In using the word cryptocurrency, it is too broad so what coin do you mean? if it's anything other than Bitcoin the risk is much greater than property. No matter how bad the property is, you can still use it as a place to do business, but in cryptocurrency which you yourself didn't mention, I assume the altcoin is rubbish, very easy to manipulate.

Interest rates depends on your credit score and ability to make repayment so f they are giving high interest rate then you have a bad credit history and even default. And you are right banks are here to make money so they are not going to appreciate the ideas and give loans based on that. In my experience, banks will chase you to give loans.

And if your only goal is to make money the ways are countless and of course, you can do it via cryptos too but no investments comes with zero risks and guaranteed returns that is why bank ask for collateral, guaranteer and a lot of legal procedures when they are giving you the money.

You call buy-to-let "innovation"? Lol.


Banks are not stupid, if they do not give you better conditions it is because of the risk/reward ratio of your profile, as usually a 10% down payment is enough. If you have that 40% you can look for another property that you can pay cash for that amount and forget about the banks.


If that's your conclusion, mine is that I'm not surprised that the bank won't give you a better offer.


Me too.

I will prefer people to DCA bitcoin. If they want to DCA altcoins, they should be careful and look for the good ones. Altcoins can be very volatile and some of them can become shit coins and later become dead. I will prefer bitcoin.

You mean people will borrow money from bank and bank will demand high profit from them to pay back. That is true. But some people borrow from bank and they are able to pay back after they use the money for the business they want to use it to do. Some  people use it for business and the business did not bring any good return and they have no other means than for the bank to sell what they used as collateral.

You can invest in bitcoin and make money, but have you forgotten that you need money to invest in bitcoin? If you can start a business without borrowing from bank, that would be better. Not also good to borrow money to invest in bitcoin or any other cryptocurrencies.

They don't give you nothing they get profit and they don't help with innovation.
And speciaially the big ones what they do is just they want you to have a lot liabilities responsebilities and a lot things you need to pay.
And instead of providing money for business mind people like me they just don't care about what is the idea but all they want is me to pay them.
Yesterday i was talking with one of the biggest USA bank they told to me i have to put down minimum of 40% down payment for buy to rent Property purpose of loan.
We has discussion about one of the condos apartments in park Ave area and 56 west so there is best area.
First of all i said i will never Ever pay that kind of % for the mortgage that's insane.
Second point is the pieace of land and a lot of glass with concrete not worth that much of money i would take risk.
Third, point i asked the proper construction building assestment scheme so i will see all the faults in Property aswell and off course they refused.
But i know it's a crap and i'll make my offer that i want they are not gona sell to me their crap with most expensive price Im here to make money and earn profit not to be the one who will put all my time and efforts for nothing Im businessmen my purpose of existence is to earn profit
The high end Property been pumped up hyped up and im not going to be bag holder...i don't follow this nonsense story like If you buy value Property it Will always going up and you hedge so that's what the rich people do this what i say "...just because you are rich doesnt mean that you are strong on finances and money you could be easy food for the bankers.




My conclusion is i'll just make Even better money with staking smart way dca % cryptocurrency.