Impact of USDC - Circle - & other Stable coins. Dangerous.

gembitz

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*Brute force will solve any Bitcoin problem*

Quote from: beerlover on December 12, 2018, 03:59:24 AM

Circle may not be as horrible as tether if you ask me. Tether was a standalone "company" that is working to get money as much as they can from you and sell their tether for dollars and when they get the dollars even if they really have one on one ratio of tether and dollars they can still make a ton of money from interest rates and investments if they are smart with it and that means even on a worse scenario 1% profit yearly from it.

However, Circle is not like that, circle is an app that is backed by wall street which means they have all the money in the world and even if you give them your money and they use it for investments like an insurance company it is still at safe hands because they are backed by wall street and you will get your money back from them one way or another. Circle has that "trust" aspect that tether will never have with their offshore banks.

printing money out of thin air >> tether 2.0 is not even needed Roll Eyes

meh disgusting

beerlover

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Circle may not be as horrible as tether if you ask me. Tether was a standalone "company" that is working to get money as much as they can from you and sell their tether for dollars and when they get the dollars even if they really have one on one ratio of tether and dollars they can still make a ton of money from interest rates and investments if they are smart with it and that means even on a worse scenario 1% profit yearly from it.

However, Circle is not like that, circle is an app that is backed by wall street which means they have all the money in the world and even if you give them your money and they use it for investments like an insurance company it is still at safe hands because they are backed by wall street and you will get your money back from them one way or another. Circle has that "trust" aspect that tether will never have with their offshore banks.

nur rochid

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Quote from: pedangrusak on December 10, 2018, 05:24:27 PM

I see a lot of daily traders using USDC when crypto prices go down a lot, and return the pair to crypto coins when prices rise. this will provide an important role for the USDC in the market and their volume will continue to expand and if it becomes very large it's like a time bomb for crypto. stable coins backed up with USD even though I'm not 100% sure it's true

of course people will take the road so that they can make as much profit as possible, I think it is only natural, although there are other effects that lurk cryptocurrency, but it is their choice and we cannot do much

CP_Processor

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Quote from: el kaka22 on December 11, 2018, 08:33:32 AM

Quote from: pedangrusak on December 10, 2018, 05:24:27 PM

I see a lot of daily traders using USDC when crypto prices go down a lot, and return the pair to crypto coins when prices rise. this will provide an important role for the USDC in the market and their volume will continue to expand and if it becomes very large it's like a time bomb for crypto. stable coins backed up with USD even though I'm not 100% sure it's true

Stablecoins are good only they are having exact value backup for their circulating coins. But, we need to consider that all the governments are printing money only based on their gold reserve ? As far as I am concerned, many big government also not doing so. They are simply manipulating based on their situations and requirements then why not those stablecoins devs too. Tether is showing out periodically their audit reports, but I'm not sure how crypto people are crosschecking it with respect to total circulating coins.

The rise of stablecoins may disturb the entire balance of this crypto-space but this also a part of this decentralized environment. and particularly we cannot do anything about that. Because, here even utter jokes are finding it's success and proper projects are failing down. Promotions alone are enough for achieving all the needed things.

Sadly, that is true. Noone is really checking the technology behind a project. Promotion is what matters the most

el kaka22

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www.Crypto.Games: Multiple coins, multiple games

Quote from: pedangrusak on December 10, 2018, 05:24:27 PM

I see a lot of daily traders using USDC when crypto prices go down a lot, and return the pair to crypto coins when prices rise. this will provide an important role for the USDC in the market and their volume will continue to expand and if it becomes very large it's like a time bomb for crypto. stable coins backed up with USD even though I'm not 100% sure it's true

Stablecoins are good only they are having exact value backup for their circulating coins. But, we need to consider that all the governments are printing money only based on their gold reserve ? As far as I am concerned, many big government also not doing so. They are simply manipulating based on their situations and requirements then why not those stablecoins devs too. Tether is showing out periodically their audit reports, but I'm not sure how crypto people are crosschecking it with respect to total circulating coins.

The rise of stablecoins may disturb the entire balance of this crypto-space but this also a part of this decentralized environment. and particularly we cannot do anything about that. Because, here even utter jokes are finding it's success and proper projects are failing down. Promotions alone are enough for achieving all the needed things.

riskyron

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So many stable coins are operating currently that it`s pretty hard to keep an eye on them. To tell the truth, I have already quit trying to do that, concentrating on the key players in the field. Among them is USDC, which seemed quite promising at the first gaze, but that impression was spoiled with learning more and more about it. Firstly, it is backed by a bank what totally runs counter to the whole idea of centralization and bank system. Secondly, has a backdoor allowing to freeze or seize funds if "it is believed illicit activity is involved". What can be more risky? One more thing: audits that were revealed publicly were not full and investors should keep in mind that fact. And last but not least - USDC was cloned from a real stable coin, so its image has been questionable from the very beginning.
We have come to the conclusion that there are no weighty arguments in its favour.

CP_Processor

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Quote from: stompix on November 05, 2018, 05:01:00 AM

Quote from: Betwrong on October 20, 2018, 10:52:26 AM

Quote from: stompix on October 18, 2018, 10:29:42 AM

~

First off, thanks for your explanations! Now, it's an understandable move on the part of the issuers of new "stable" coins, to make new ones for people to buy. But what makes them(issuers) so sure people would buy them? If there are people who love those coins so much why wouldn't they stick to the old ones? It is always risky to invest in something new and untried, and seeing that USDT has been around for some time, why look for other options? Normally, although taking risks, people expect big gains when investing in new altcoins. But what gain can one expect investing in a "stable" coin?

Oh really late on this ....

But you could easily force people to do so when you have an exchange to back you up and they can acquire it pretty easy.
Then you either force the other stable coins out and introduce your own or just make sure to manipulate volume so they move to it.

Then other exchanges will add your coin (via bribery or pure out of customer demand) and you're set.
And GS has both the power and the money to make it happen.
USDT has been around for a long time but...at 96 cents it was;t that much of a stable coin.

Quote from: timotron on November 02, 2018, 07:59:11 AM

I lost track of Stablecoins, how many are there now?

Too many

And be prepared to have some more.

A friend told me that some exchange in Romania has launched its own stable coin or stablelion. (god how this sounds in English Grin

).

Latest count said there are 150 stablecoins right now, but only a handful are active and trading

pedangrusak

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I see a lot of daily traders using USDC when crypto prices go down a lot, and return the pair to crypto coins when prices rise. this will provide an important role for the USDC in the market and their volume will continue to expand and if it becomes very large it's like a time bomb for crypto. stable coins backed up with USD even though I'm not 100% sure it's true

CP_Processor

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Dear community, here is the first in the series of stablecoin reviews performed of the USD COIN (#USDC).

The goal is to further raise awareness on stablecoins, and help people understand how they work and what is their overall potential.

Hope you will find them useful!

https://medium.com/cp-processor/stable-coin-review-usd-coin-usdc-c7cf78c81dfb

timotron

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Trooper Founder & CEO

Quote from: spongegar on November 20, 2018, 08:32:43 AM

I don't think these kinds of coins will be able tocdlourish in the market. Simply adding up multiple weak coins will not do the market any good at all. I mean it would've beeb better of they just focused and developed one strong coin and back it up financially. This will just end in a disaster especially now in this blooody market.

I even don't like the idea of one big control point with all the injection power...
in any case, With this bloody days is better to have access to some stable coins...for some people.

spongegar

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I don't think these kinds of coins will be able tocdlourish in the market. Simply adding up multiple weak coins will not do the market any good at all. I mean it would've beeb better of they just focused and developed one strong coin and back it up financially. This will just end in a disaster especially now in this blooody market.

timotron

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Trooper Founder & CEO

Quote from: gentlemand on November 02, 2018, 09:02:52 AM

The primary risk of ever more stablecoins is splintering their markets into a bunch of tiny and weak ones. I see no reason why any self respecting exchange would list multiple coins. All they're doing it creating an incomprehensible mess with piddling volumes.

So we are a bit more confused, newcomers will be even more confused.

Quote from: stompix on November 05, 2018, 05:01:00 AM

Too many

And be prepared to have some more.

A friend told me that some exchange in Romania has launched its own stable coin or stablelion. (god how this sounds in English Grin

).

Funny people there
Stable-lion Grin

stompix

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Blackjack.fun

Quote from: Betwrong on October 20, 2018, 10:52:26 AM

Quote from: stompix on October 18, 2018, 10:29:42 AM

~

First off, thanks for your explanations! Now, it's an understandable move on the part of the issuers of new "stable" coins, to make new ones for people to buy. But what makes them(issuers) so sure people would buy them? If there are people who love those coins so much why wouldn't they stick to the old ones? It is always risky to invest in something new and untried, and seeing that USDT has been around for some time, why look for other options? Normally, although taking risks, people expect big gains when investing in new altcoins. But what gain can one expect investing in a "stable" coin?

Oh really late on this ....

But you could easily force people to do so when you have an exchange to back you up and they can acquire it pretty easy.
Then you either force the other stable coins out and introduce your own or just make sure to manipulate volume so they move to it.

Then other exchanges will add your coin (via bribery or pure out of customer demand) and you're set.
And GS has both the power and the money to make it happen.
USDT has been around for a long time but...at 96 cents it was;t that much of a stable coin.

Quote from: timotron on November 02, 2018, 07:59:11 AM

I lost track of Stablecoins, how many are there now?

Too many

And be prepared to have some more.

A friend told me that some exchange in Romania has launched its own stable coin or stablelion. (god how this sounds in English Grin

).

gentlemand

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Welt Am Draht

The primary risk of ever more stablecoins is splintering their markets into a bunch of tiny and weak ones. I see no reason why any self respecting exchange would list multiple coins. All they're doing it creating an incomprehensible mess with piddling volumes.

Absolutely no way would places like Gemini or Circle gaily issue unbacked coins. It's not going to happen. They have heavyweight investors and regulators up their arse. They'll be a level of legitimacy higher than anything that's come before.

Another risk is running them on ETH. If you have another cryptokitties then your quasi dollar gets stuck in a swamp of txs. And I hope those contracts are watertight as well.

timotron

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Trooper Founder & CEO

Some news about Stablecoins:

https://ethereumworldnews.com/increased-competition-for-tether-as-another-stablecoin-goes-live-offering-better-transparency/

and a new Stablecoin soon: https://medium.com/stably-blog/stably-announces-early-access-launch-of-1-1-usd-pegged-cryptocurrency-stableusd-usds-990c538a8b8c

I lost track of Stablecoins, how many are there now?

timotron

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One more opinion about Stable Coins or Disney dollars has they call it.

I like this Disney name for the StableCoins, they are really similar to Mickey mouse.

https://bitcoinist.com/stablecoins-crypto-fiatcoins/

pumbum

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this is a new round of events, as in 2017 there were events around bitcoin forks. so you just need to get used to the fact that some events need to be discussed

setialovers

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I think some developers or company launching their own stable coin because they dont trust on others stable coin. Many stable coin in market right now and it will flooding market will stable coin. It will give good impact for bitcoin or others good coin but its hard to predict in long term because the world flooding with USD paper money too

timotron

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Quote from: Betwrong on October 20, 2018, 10:52:26 AM

First off, thanks for your explanations! Now, it's an understandable move on the part of the issuers of new "stable" coins, to make new ones for people to buy. But what makes them(issuers) so sure people would buy them? If there are people who love those coins so much why wouldn't they stick to the old ones? It is always risky to invest in something new and untried, and seeing that USDT has been around for some time, why look for other options? Normally, although taking risks, people expect big gains when investing in new altcoins. But what gain can one expect investing in a "stable" coin?

Gains with stablecoin are made by shorting most cases, but you can see the price is just stable to 1USD, not to some amount of Btc

The yellow line is VS BTC, and there are chances to make some profits

and here another example.

Yellow again for VSBTC

Got it?

Betwrong

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I stand with Ukraine.

Quote from: stompix on October 18, 2018, 10:29:42 AM

~

Quote from: Betwrong on October 17, 2018, 09:34:23 AM

With some effort I can understand the demand for one of them, but why there are so many of them and why even more are going to be issued? Does this mean that previously issued "stable" coins need improvement? Or, maybe, it means that older coins have compromised their reputation already and people expect that new ones will be more trusted?

Now, this one is easy...

https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2016/08/01/starbucks-holds-more-cash-than-many-banks-infographic/#43f481cb231a

Quote

Starbuck's customers in the U.S. have loaded at least $1.2 billion onto the company's cards and app.

Every guy that is losing his coins (and a lot of morons do) means coins that will never be redeemed, just like cash on lost or forgotten Starbucks cards. Add fractions of USDC that people will never bother to move around, some that will never be changed for $ again waiting for god knows what and if we think of those as only 3-5% of the total, when those are put against 10-20 billion, it makes one pretty nice sum of money.

And there are the fees...
Bank Wire - Redeem 0.1% ($50 minimum) and the tx fees.

First off, thanks for your explanations! Now, it's an understandable move on the part of the issuers of new "stable" coins, to make new ones for people to buy. But what makes them(issuers) so sure people would buy them? If there are people who love those coins so much why wouldn't they stick to the old ones? It is always risky to invest in something new and untried, and seeing that USDT has been around for some time, why look for other options? Normally, although taking risks, people expect big gains when investing in new altcoins. But what gain can one expect investing in a "stable" coin?

timotron

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not a week after launch and we see some FUD around stablecoins, Was this expected?

https://www.chepicap.com/en/news/4491/stabelcoins-accused-of-not-publishing-audits-cameron-winklevoss-steps-in.html

stompix

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Blackjack.fun

Quote from: Betwrong on October 18, 2018, 07:39:52 AM

This is what I really can't understand. What was the point of buying USDC for $1.11, like it was traded 3 days ago with almost $10 million daily volume, if it was obvious that the coin would cost exactly $1 soon, because it is a "stable coin" by definition? What were the expectations of those people who were buying at $1.11? Were they thinking that USDC would go to $2, or what? And today, when it is $1.01 can we say that they lost 10% of their investment, Or is it more complicated than that?

I swear, if I see only one guy posting that he has bought USDC at 1.0whatever but it will soon moon or mars or ur anus, I'll start searching for a script where you don't ignore people, you add those whose posts you want to read. One such post and I'll lose hope .....

Quote from: Betwrong on October 17, 2018, 09:34:23 AM

With some effort I can understand the demand for one of them, but why there are so many of them and why even more are going to be issued? Does this mean that previously issued "stable" coins need improvement? Or, maybe, it means that older coins have compromised their reputation already and people expect that new ones will be more trusted?

Now, this one is easy...

https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2016/08/01/starbucks-holds-more-cash-than-many-banks-infographic/#43f481cb231a

Quote

Starbuck's customers in the U.S. have loaded at least $1.2 billion onto the company's cards and app.

Every guy that is losing his coins (and a lot of morons do) means coins that will never be redeemed, just like cash on lost or forgotten Starbucks cards. Add fractions of USDC that people will never bother to move around, some that will never be changed for $ again waiting for god knows what and if we think of those as only 3-5% of the total, when those are put against 10-20 billion, it makes one pretty nice sum of money.

And there are the fees...
Bank Wire - Redeem 0.1% ($50 minimum) and the tx fees.

Betwrong

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I stand with Ukraine.

Quote from: jseverson on October 17, 2018, 10:31:19 AM

Quote from: Betwrong on October 17, 2018, 09:34:23 AM

With some effort I can understand the demand for one of them, but why there are so many of them and why even more are going to be issued? Does this mean that previously issued "stable" coins need improvement? Or, maybe, it means that older coins have compromised their reputation already and people expect that new ones will be more trusted?

Probably because issuers are making money out of them? Having their own must strengthen their ecosystem or something because they won't have to rely on someone else's.

Newer ones like Circle's USDC are apparently more trustworthy because they're issued by a regulated entity, but I'd have to read up more about them. USDC specifically is also trading above the dollar right now which might mean that people are dropping USDT for them.

This is what I really can't understand. What was the point of buying USDC for $1.11, like it was traded 3 days ago with almost $10 million daily volume, if it was obvious that the coin would cost exactly $1 soon, because it is a "stable coin" by definition? What were the expectations of those people who were buying at $1.11? Were they thinking that USDC would go to $2, or what? And today, when it is $1.01 can we say that they lost 10% of their investment, Or is it more complicated than that?

figmentofmyass

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Quote from: timotron on October 16, 2018, 06:02:39 AM

For me, it does not really make a difference if they back the stablecoins or not.

Backed by a non-limit printed dollar ?? makes 0 sense for me.

inflation welcome in crypto!

that's how it's always been. what do you think has been backing USD balances at bitfinex all these years? or for that matter, gox?

the only difference between your bitfinex USD balance and USDT is whether you can send it over a blockchain. exchanges could be run as fractional reserves and can inflate prices with unbacked trading as well---on top of backing their USD balances with "non-limit printed dollars". stablecoins don't really change anything in that regard.

Buttermellow

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This may seem possible that in the near future they could manipulate market price for cryptocurrency especially bitcoin but they will get some difficulties I guess for bitcoin has a huge market price already and hard to bring down its market price or to play with around. It may be possible to other altcoins in the market though.

jseverson

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Quote from: Betwrong on October 17, 2018, 09:34:23 AM

With some effort I can understand the demand for one of them, but why there are so many of them and why even more are going to be issued? Does this mean that previously issued "stable" coins need improvement? Or, maybe, it means that older coins have compromised their reputation already and people expect that new ones will be more trusted?

Probably because issuers are making money out of them? Having their own must strengthen their ecosystem or something because they won't have to rely on someone else's.

Newer ones like Circle's USDC are apparently more trustworthy because they're issued by a regulated entity, but I'd have to read up more about them. USDC specifically is also trading above the dollar right now which might mean that people are dropping USDT for them.

CryptoAssasin

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MenaPay - Crypto made easier than cash

Issuing those stable coins could bring positive or negative impacts on the long run and you actually have a point that it could use a manipulative acts, but will it? Will those stable coins willing to destroy their reputation just like what happened to Tether? Are they just created for that manipulative acts or here to stay for cryptocurrency to get a steady price in the long run? All we need is a stable coins that we can rely in times of bears attacks and it saves out butt for huge losses or higher profits right? I don't think that we should call it manipulative acts but a supportive act for crypto investors.

Betwrong

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I stand with Ukraine.

Quote from: jseverson on October 17, 2018, 08:40:19 AM

~

Quote from: timotron on October 17, 2018, 08:18:28 AM

Why do we HAVE TO trust them! (?)

Well you don't really have to trust anything and you're absolutely correct to be wary of them. I personally think they're bad news unless done correctly, which they aren't. I was just pointing out that they exist because there's demand for them.

With some effort I can understand the demand for one of them, but why there are so many of them and why even more are going to be issued? Does this mean that previously issued "stable" coins need improvement? Or, maybe, it means that older coins have compromised their reputation already and people expect that new ones will be more trusted?

Actually I'm not against those coins in general, because I think they can be a stepping stone towards wider crypto adoption. Most people can't trust something as unstable as current cryptocurrencies, so maybe for many of them "stable" coins can become first crypto they are really not afraid to buy. I just don't want those coins to fail people's expectations because if that happens, they will abandon crypto market for a very long time, if not forever.

jseverson

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Quote from: stompix on October 17, 2018, 08:12:36 AM

Well, it was supposed to not be an issue, although if you're pegged to a currency that experiences inflation it will also be affected. But in reality, because nobody was taken tether, people were trying to sell it at 90% of the value, just like Venezuelans do each day with their bolivar, offering more and more because nobody is selling goods in exchange at yesterday's prices. Imagine what is going in the heads of those that we're avoiding a bitcoin drop by holding tether on Monday

Yeah, I kind of meant that inflation doesn't matter in a sense that it's not a tool to escape inflation like other cryptos are (for some people anyway). But yeah these pegs are never going to work if they're not redeemable lol.

Quote from: stompix on October 17, 2018, 08:12:36 AM

If that would have happened we wouldn't have tether around anymore Grin

Lmfao touche.

Quote from: timotron on October 17, 2018, 08:18:28 AM

Why do we HAVE TO trust them! (?)

Well you don't really have to trust anything and you're absolutely correct to be wary of them. I personally think they're bad news unless done correctly, which they aren't. I was just pointing out that they exist because there's demand for them.

timotron

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Quote from: jseverson on October 17, 2018, 07:38:00 AM

Quote from: timotron on October 16, 2018, 06:02:39 AM

Backed by a non-limit printed dollar ?? makes 0 sense for me.

inflation welcome in crypto!

Well the general idea is that these stablecoins are far easier to trade than actual USD. Dealing with fiat balance can be tricky for some exchanges, so they would prefer to keep your fiat and track your balance with altcoins instead. This way, they're also technically not keeping your money for you. These are basically strictly for trading purposes and have little use otherwise, meaning inflation isn't an issue.

The issue has always been that they can simply be printed out of thin air without repercussions (if they're pegged to the USD, their supply and demand won't dictate their value), unlike actual fiat, if operated without transparency. If Tether had been transparent and open to audits, their reputation would be far better.

Yeah, the use case is there. But, Sorry, my intention with "inflation" was, in some way, referred to how, now we have a door open into the crypto sphere, more control, a cane of power. Indirectly the "money printer" now have an easy access to trading. Do you trust them?

Why do we HAVE TO trust them! (?)

stompix

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Blackjack.fun

Quote from: jseverson on October 17, 2018, 07:38:00 AM

Quote from: timotron on October 16, 2018, 06:02:39 AM

Backed by a non-limit printed dollar ?? makes 0 sense for me.

inflation welcome in crypto!

These are basically strictly for trading purposes and have little use otherwise, meaning inflation isn't an issue.
~

Well, it was supposed to not be an issue, although if you're pegged to a currency that experiences inflation it will also be affected. But in reality, because nobody was taken tether, people were trying to sell it at 90% of the value, just like Venezuelans do each day with their bolivar, offering more and more because nobody is selling goods in exchange at yesterday's prices. Imagine what is going in the heads of those that we're avoiding a bitcoin drop by holding tether on Monday

Quote from: jseverson on October 17, 2018, 07:38:00 AM

If Tether had been transparent and open to audits, their reputation would be far better.

If that would have happened we wouldn't have tether around anymore Grin

Quote from: Cryptomilz on October 15, 2018, 03:31:58 AM

I guess a lot of people where moving their assets to other stablecoins like TUSD

Oh, we have another ~~stable~~crapcoin out there?

jseverson

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Quote from: timotron on October 16, 2018, 06:02:39 AM

Backed by a non-limit printed dollar ?? makes 0 sense for me.

inflation welcome in crypto!

Well the general idea is that these stablecoins are far easier to trade than actual USD. Dealing with fiat balance can be tricky for some exchanges, so they would prefer to keep your fiat and track your balance with altcoins instead. This way, they're also technically not keeping your money for you. These are basically strictly for trading purposes and have little use otherwise, meaning inflation isn't an issue.

The issue has always been that they can simply be printed out of thin air without repercussions (if they're pegged to the USD, their supply and demand won't dictate their value), unlike actual fiat, if operated without transparency. If Tether had been transparent and open to audits, their reputation would be far better.

timotron

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Quote from: mu_enrico on October 16, 2018, 03:48:49 AM

What is with this double and triple posts mate? Couldn't you just sum up your comments in a single post?
Stablecoins are dangerous only if there is a condition like "bank rush" (or coin rush?) because I'm pretty sure they also implement the "fractional reserve" system.
For every USDT, USDC, etc., they won't back it 1:1 otherwise they won't get any profit.

Go it, Will try to resume comments. Sorry if this was annoying for you.

For me, it does not really make a difference if they back the stablecoins or not.

Backed by a non-limit printed dollar ?? makes 0 sense for me.

inflation welcome in crypto!

ophyrim

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Quote from: timotron on September 28, 2018, 02:28:37 AM

This spam of Stablecoins can impact the market in the short term very positive ->much more volume and Billions of "USD`S"

Prepare your selves for a nice $$ injection in the market by USDC.

But in the long run, I believe this can be very dangerous as we get a lot of manipulative power in the ecosystem.

Note: This is referred to USD "backed" StableCoins - Others like DAI still have nice fundaments.

1 year ago there was only Tether as a stable coin today we have trueUSD, USDC, USD gemini etc...
As you know there was always some rumor about the money that Tether has. This was one of the blackholes of this cryptomarket. This was very scary. But today I don't care to much about the reserve of Tether. Because there is some strong and better alternative.

timotron

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party non-stop!

https://cointelegraph.com/news/paxos-says-it-has-issued-50-mln-of-recently-launched-dollar-backed-stablecoin

jseverson

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Quote from: Cryptomilz on October 15, 2018, 03:31:58 AM

I guess a lot of people where moving their assets to other stablecoins like TUSD

Yeah it's kind of baffling to me. USDC is trading at $1.03 at the moment, which I guess means people really are moving from one stablecoin to another. I have no clue why people still believe these are a good idea, especially right after one just fell flat on its face.

mu_enrico

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What is with this double and triple posts mate? Couldn't you just sum up your comments in a single post?
Stablecoins are dangerous only if there is a condition like "bank rush" (or coin rush?) because I'm pretty sure they also implement the "fractional reserve" system.
For every USDT, USDC, etc., they won't back it 1:1 otherwise they won't get any profit.

timotron

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Quote from: timotron on October 16, 2018, 02:08:37 AM

did you saw the USDT at 0.80$ in Kraken?

What a difference in prices last day in BCT? - over ~500$ price difference between Kraken and Coinbase(USD)

Anyone knows a place for "short" you crypto alternative to the stablecoins?

I have used Vaultoro in the past, but I don't know any other option...

Any ideas?

timotron

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did you saw the USDT at 0.80$ in Kraken?

What a difference in prices last day in BCT? - over ~500$ price difference between Kraken and Coinbase(USD)

Cryptomilz

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Quote from: stompix on October 15, 2018, 02:21:24 AM

Quote from: stompix on October 09, 2018, 11:31:24 AM

Stable coins are not a danger to the market, they are a danger to anyone dealing with them!!!

Just quoting myself here... Grin

How do you like the "stable" coins now?
If I remember correctly, people claimed tether was a safe haven, to protect your assets and other stuff like this.

A 8% drop in a matter of hours, the "stable" coin acts like the Bolivar right now

If only they knew..there was consistent accusations of tether being printed in very questionable numbers over a period of time. This is definitely a red flag. Woke up to the to drop this morning, seeing BTC surge in price. I guess a lot of people where moving their assets to other stablecoins like TUSD

stompix

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Blackjack.fun

Quote from: stompix on October 09, 2018, 11:31:24 AM

Stable coins are not a danger to the market, they are a danger to anyone dealing with them!!!

Just quoting myself here... Grin

How do you like the "stable" coins now?
If I remember correctly, people claimed tether was a safe haven, to protect your assets and other stuff like this.

A 8% drop in a matter of hours, the "stable" coin acts like the Bolivar right now

timotron

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And the party gets bigger now with OKcoin!

OKCoin Founder Star Xu Announces Chinese Yuan-Backed Crypto-

https://cryptonews24x7.net/okcoin-to-issue-chinese-yuan-backed-crypto-are-there-too-many-stablecoins/

I am still thinking this is not good for the medium-long term.

timotron

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Quote from: stompix on October 09, 2018, 11:31:24 AM

Quote from: Harlot on October 08, 2018, 08:44:10 AM

I can't see why this stable coins will be dangerous in the market, I mean all of the traders are only shifting their funds to this coins as a safe heaven during big dips but I don't see the traders staying long on these kinds of coins.

How are those coins safer than the $ or the euro?
Yeah, a bank can freeze your account and so can those that issue those coins, but no way the real $ will turn to zero in a few hours, unlike what can happen if the authorities raid bitfinex.

Stable coins are not a danger to the market, they are a danger to anyone dealing with them!!!

the market is dealing with it very closely.

stompix

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Blackjack.fun

Quote from: Harlot on October 08, 2018, 08:44:10 AM

I can't see why this stable coins will be dangerous in the market, I mean all of the traders are only shifting their funds to this coins as a safe heaven during big dips but I don't see the traders staying long on these kinds of coins.

How are those coins safer than the $ or the euro?
Yeah, a bank can freeze your account and so can those that issue those coins, but no way the real $ will turn to zero in a few hours, unlike what can happen if the authorities raid bitfinex.

Stable coins are not a danger to the market, they are a danger to anyone dealing with them!!!

Robbio

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You have to know that the large number of stable coins is not bad news, which helps newcomers to join the cryptocurrency. Although this is not safe in your opinion, there are still many people ready to join the cryptocurrency.

timotron

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Quote from: Harlot on October 08, 2018, 08:44:10 AM

I can't see why this stable coins will be dangerous in the market, I mean all of the traders are only shifting their funds to this coins as a safe heaven during big dips but I don't see the traders staying long on these kinds of coins. Plus the manipulation you are talking about has always been there in the market, the price movements we are seeing right now are always influence with something and it won't change as whales will always be here making profits out of us. Stable coins are really not a threat for any of us.

Good point.

But stableCoins are a threat for me, and for everyone worrying about the environment surrounding us.

Is a new thing in crypto markets. And can be a relatively important thing.

timotron

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Quote from: setupbounds on October 08, 2018, 08:35:47 AM

Quote from: timotron on September 28, 2018, 02:28:37 AM

This spam of Stablecoins can impact the market in the short term very positive ->much more volume and Billions of "USD`S"

Prepare your selves for a nice $$ injection in the market by USDC.

But in the long run, I believe this can be very dangerous as we get a lot of manipulative power in the ecosystem.

Note: This is referred to USD "backed" StableCoins - Others like DAI still have nice fundaments.

I think they are useless and not dangerous. Why the hell do we have stable coins and even tokens for dollar in markets and all that. Why not just put up your REAL dollars into an exchange and when you want you can change it to REAL DOLLAR after trading and if you can withdraw it than withdraw it, if you can't than trade it to bitcoin and withdraw that.

We can definitely use REAL dollar instead of tokens and all that. Exchanges should start to consider putting real dollar instead of tokens and circles and all this useless and worthless stuff. The more we have of these the higher chance of manipulation by people who have it.

The stableCoins have a good use after all, but how transparent are they? Are we willing o trust these entities? Do we have an alternative?
At least you can keep your anonymity using this stableCoins, Can you stay private with real USD online?

timotron

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Quote from: naidray on October 06, 2018, 11:32:45 PM

Quote from: kryptqnick on September 28, 2018, 09:37:13 AM

I suppose, it is a lot like USDT, but from another group of people (company called Circle)? It's also about storing dollars in a bank and people owning crypto versions of dollars, right? I don't think that such coins are bad, because the current market situation is very unstable and generally bearish, so people might be interested in freezing their assets in cryptocurrency this way (since fiat-crypto exchange policies are not very nice as well). I don't trust these coins, however, because it's not safe to hold money in some real place that could be burned or robbed. Moreover, as is the case with tether, people cannot be sure that each coin truly is backed by 1 dollar and the revelation of such a thing could lead to sudden collapse.

I do not think they are bad either and yes you are right with the fact that it is just the same as USDT. Usually, sometimes, it is always a lot better when you just hedge in real fiat rather than using some of these stable coins, but over the years, they have really helped for most of the exchanges with people really trying to hedge their funds in USDT without having to go through the bank.

But, the question has been raised that the tether team keeps generating funds from thin air, without a backed currency to it, but at the end, I guess they were able to prove that wrong. Nonetheless, when people keep saying things a lot about some of these things not coming with a good scenario in the long run, I always prefer taking the preventive measures instead.

"but over the years, they have really helped for most of the exchanges with people really trying to hedge their funds in USDT without having to go through the bank."

Yes and, I ask my self, is this good enough for me? I don`t think so.

I can see a lot of future FUD about stableCoins, manipulation, not 100% transparent, our other unethical acts.

Harlot

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I can't see why this stable coins will be dangerous in the market, I mean all of the traders are only shifting their funds to this coins as a safe heaven during big dips but I don't see the traders staying long on these kinds of coins. Plus the manipulation you are talking about has always been there in the market, the price movements we are seeing right now are always influence with something and it won't change as whales will always be here making profits out of us. Stable coins are really not a threat for any of us.

setupbounds

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Quote from: timotron on September 28, 2018, 02:28:37 AM

This spam of Stablecoins can impact the market in the short term very positive ->much more volume and Billions of "USD`S"

Prepare your selves for a nice $$ injection in the market by USDC.

But in the long run, I believe this can be very dangerous as we get a lot of manipulative power in the ecosystem.

Note: This is referred to USD "backed" StableCoins - Others like DAI still have nice fundaments.

I think they are useless and not dangerous. Why the hell do we have stable coins and even tokens for dollar in markets and all that. Why not just put up your REAL dollars into an exchange and when you want you can change it to REAL DOLLAR after trading and if you can withdraw it than withdraw it, if you can't than trade it to bitcoin and withdraw that.

We can definitely use REAL dollar instead of tokens and all that. Exchanges should start to consider putting real dollar instead of tokens and circles and all this useless and worthless stuff. The more we have of these the higher chance of manipulation by people who have it.

naidray

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Quote from: kryptqnick on September 28, 2018, 09:37:13 AM

I suppose, it is a lot like USDT, but from another group of people (company called Circle)? It's also about storing dollars in a bank and people owning crypto versions of dollars, right? I don't think that such coins are bad, because the current market situation is very unstable and generally bearish, so people might be interested in freezing their assets in cryptocurrency this way (since fiat-crypto exchange policies are not very nice as well). I don't trust these coins, however, because it's not safe to hold money in some real place that could be burned or robbed. Moreover, as is the case with tether, people cannot be sure that each coin truly is backed by 1 dollar and the revelation of such a thing could lead to sudden collapse.

I do not think they are bad either and yes you are right with the fact that it is just the same as USDT. Usually, sometimes, it is always a lot better when you just hedge in real fiat rather than using some of these stable coins, but over the years, they have really helped for most of the exchanges with people really trying to hedge their funds in USDT without having to go through the bank.

But, the question has been raised that the tether team keeps generating funds from thin air, without a backed currency to it, but at the end, I guess they were able to prove that wrong. Nonetheless, when people keep saying things a lot about some of these things not coming with a good scenario in the long run, I always prefer taking the preventive measures instead.

Supercrypt

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A lot of things have been said about stable coins that are currency backed such as USDT in the past, and USDC coming into the show really does not make much difference and as long as it is really backed by a real live fund, I see no reason why it should backfire.

At least, when the whole USDT saga came into play with respect to them generating and printing tether from nowhere, we saw what the outcome ended up as, and they claimed with some proof or thereabout that they have fiat to back the tether up. If that is really the case and there is no false claim, I believe we should not really see any implosion regarding backed fiats stable coins. Manipulation however is something that is a norm anyway and being a decentralized and a non-regulated space, it just gets easy the more for the whales.

Globalbitcoinl

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another infopovod for an infinite number of news, I think every season there are such news. be prepared, there will be even more

timotron

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Quote from: timotron on October 04, 2018, 08:34:27 AM

And this one - just added to Binance:

https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/paxos-standard-token/#charts
https://twitter.com/PaxosStandard?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Eembeddedtimeline%7Ctwterm%5Eprofile%3APaxosStandard&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fcoinmarketcap.com%2Fcurrencies%2Fpaxos-standard-token%2F
https://support.binance.com/hc/en-us/articles/360016713791

The Web is not secure! Less than 150 followers. No info in coinmarketcap like Vol - Cap.

One more: https://www.basis.io/

This one is based on the Seigniorage Shares from 2014 with some improvemets.
It will burn tokens in the progres, but is not in the market yet.

At least this ones have over 5K+ followers and Telegram group is also active 3K+

Thanks to d5000 for sharing!

timotron

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Quote from: Jannn on October 04, 2018, 04:51:29 PM

There really isn't any huge injection of stablecoins as you mention, they've been around for a while and only seem to be gaining in legitimacy.

I think that it's unlikely we will see any negative influences of stable coins unless they become scam like, they can only bring stability to the market which is what we need.

Well, if you count the quantity of money what will move from this USDX stablecoins very soon into the Market you will maybe see what I mean. in any case time will tell.

And about your opinion what we need.
Let me tell you this;

Didn't we saw a negative influence till we have the oldest stable coin?

not only in Crypto, think about the unmeasurable inflation since 19XX...

a few main points with a lot of power are not good for the rest of us.
And don't get me back. I enjoy stablecoins. I just dislike the creators if they don't are 100% transparent.

timotron

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Quote from: green547 on October 04, 2018, 03:51:58 PM

Well since the government can print unlimited money why not let the people do it

I think most of these are actually backed up by enough USD for the amount they printed but I've heard a lot of negativity about Tether not having enough cash reserves to back up their USDT.

haha, I enjoyed this. Okay, let us all do a Stablecoin! Cheesy

Maybe I am a lunatic, but I don't trust these entities a little bit - Backed by air is for me reality.

figmentofmyass

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Quote from: Ucy on October 04, 2018, 03:36:21 PM

True. Looks like the central banks we all love to hate are slowly popping up in different form to start minting coins out of thin air.

but stablecoins are no different than the centralized exchange system they were spawned from.

think about it: what's the difference between "bitfinex USD" and "USDT"? they are both centralized IOUs issued by the same people and they are both withdrawable and redeemable by bitfinex. they are exactly the same thing fundamentally; the only difference is you can send USDT via blockchain ledger.

in other words, if you think stablecoins = printing money, then all fiat exchanges = printing money. a centralized IOU is a centralized IOU, no matter what name you give it.

Jannn

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There really isn't any huge injection of stablecoins as you mention, they've been around for a while and only seem to be gaining in legitimacy.

I think that it's unlikely we will see any negative influences of stable coins unless they become scam like, they can only bring stability to the market which is what we need.

green547

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Well since the government can print unlimited money why not let the people do it

I think most of these are actually backed up by enough USD for the amount they printed but I've heard a lot of negativity about Tether not having enough cash reserves to back up their USDT.

Ucy

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Activity: 2674

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Compare rates on different exchanges & swap.

True. Looks like the central banks we all love to hate are slowly popping up in different form to start minting coins out of thin air.

This's the kind of things the government regulators should be focused on not decentralized Cryptocurrencies.

Anything Centralized and Crypto-related should probably be regulated into extinction or closely monitored by the community, regulators and the world.

Nemoja

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Quote from: drm on September 28, 2018, 08:17:08 AM

We don't even need stable coins, just used to enrich the issuer and at some point the bubble will burst.

We do and we do not in the same time. Stable coins don't promote decentralized market but also it is a "pillow" in the market fluctuations that may harm people who have purchased a specifi amount of cryptos in order to use them for micropayments and everyday life.

timotron

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And this one - just added to Binance:

https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/paxos-standard-token/#charts
https://twitter.com/PaxosStandard?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Eembeddedtimeline%7Ctwterm%5Eprofile%3APaxosStandard&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fcoinmarketcap.com%2Fcurrencies%2Fpaxos-standard-token%2F
https://support.binance.com/hc/en-us/articles/360016713791

The Web is not secure! Less than 150 followers. No info in coinmarketcap like Vol - Cap.

timotron

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Quote from: kryptqnick on September 28, 2018, 09:37:13 AM

I suppose, it is a lot like USDT, but from another group of people (company called Circle)? It's also about storing dollars in a bank and people owning crypto versions of dollars, right? I don't think that such coins are bad, because the current market situation is very unstable and generally bearish, so people might be interested in freezing their assets in cryptocurrency this way (since fiat-crypto exchange policies are not very nice as well). I don't trust these coins, however, because it's not safe to hold money in some real place that could be burned or robbed. Moreover, as is the case with tether, people cannot be sure that each coin truly is backed by 1 dollar and the revelation of such a thing could lead to sudden collapse.

I like your thinking, thx for sharing. I agree.

kryptqnick

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Join the world-leading crypto sportsbook NOW!

I suppose, it is a lot like USDT, but from another group of people (company called Circle)? It's also about storing dollars in a bank and people owning crypto versions of dollars, right? I don't think that such coins are bad, because the current market situation is very unstable and generally bearish, so people might be interested in freezing their assets in cryptocurrency this way (since fiat-crypto exchange policies are not very nice as well). I don't trust these coins, however, because it's not safe to hold money in some real place that could be burned or robbed. Moreover, as is the case with tether, people cannot be sure that each coin truly is backed by 1 dollar and the revelation of such a thing could lead to sudden collapse.

coinanna

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Anyone interested in the topic of stable coins: don't miss the world's first stablecoin conference in London!

https://stableconf.com/

drm

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We don't even need stable coins, just used to enrich the issuer and at some point the bubble will burst.

timotron

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Quote from: stompix on September 28, 2018, 05:24:51 AM

Quote from: exstasie on September 28, 2018, 03:23:45 AM

Quote from: timotron on September 28, 2018, 02:28:37 AM

This spam of Stablecoins can impact the market in the short term very positive ->much more volume and Billions of "USD`S"

Prepare your selves for a nice $$ injection in the market by USDC.

But in the long run, I believe this can be very dangerous as we get a lot of manipulative power in the ecosystem.

Ah, I see Circle's new stablecoin has been launched. Gemini just launched one as well.

More will follow for sure as it basically means printing money that people might never want back, same as the 1.2 billion $ that sits quietly on the Starbucks cards.

Next will be an avalanche of other currencies like euro, pound, yen, yuan and for sure we're going to have also a large influx of scam coins by fake companies and the madness of useless alts will never end.

Quote from: exstasie on September 28, 2018, 03:23:45 AM

A stablecoin issuer, just like an exchange, could inject unbacked money into circulation.

Of course, nobody is stopping them to do otherwise.
And they could simply create a "stable" coin, buy BTC with it, sell the coins for $...and voilà the coin is backed. By their own money, made out of nothing.

Yes, And we are accepting this fact as it where normal.

But this is how things work - 0% logic

timotron

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Quote from: randythered on September 28, 2018, 04:28:09 AM

It seems like your thinking is based on the ideas around tether being used to manipulate market price but the basis of that theory is that tether is not backed by real dollars. If any stable currency is backed by real dollars then they aren't creating money out of thin air, they're only doing so when there's a real demand for it and we won't have any artificial money coming in to the market and inflating it

Yeah, but you point to trust these people. I prefer trustless ways of doing things, and there are ways to create Stablecoins without a central authority

I mean, anyone can believe anything, and I don't trust this big fishes.

Would you keep your fingers away if you had the chance to have few bucks extra without much risk?
I would have problems my self to stay back and don't try to make some extra profits.

stompix

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Blackjack.fun

Quote from: exstasie on September 28, 2018, 03:23:45 AM

Quote from: timotron on September 28, 2018, 02:28:37 AM

This spam of Stablecoins can impact the market in the short term very positive ->much more volume and Billions of "USD`S"

Prepare your selves for a nice $$ injection in the market by USDC.

But in the long run, I believe this can be very dangerous as we get a lot of manipulative power in the ecosystem.

Ah, I see Circle's new stablecoin has been launched. Gemini just launched one as well.

More will follow for sure as it basically means printing money that people might never want back, same as the 1.2 billion $ that sits quietly on the Starbucks cards.

Next will be an avalanche of other currencies like euro, pound, yen, yuan and for sure we're going to have also a large influx of scam coins by fake companies and the madness of useless alts will never end.

Quote from: exstasie on September 28, 2018, 03:23:45 AM

A stablecoin issuer, just like an exchange, could inject unbacked money into circulation.

Of course, nobody is stopping them to do otherwise.
And they could simply create a "stable" coin, buy BTC with it, sell the coins for $...and voilà the coin is backed. By their own money, made out of nothing.

randythered

full member

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It seems like your thinking is based on the ideas around tether being used to manipulate market price but the basis of that theory is that tether is not backed by real dollars. If any stable currency is backed by real dollars then they aren't creating money out of thin air, they're only doing so when there's a real demand for it and we won't have any artificial money coming in to the market and inflating it

timotron

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Yes you got it, didn't we saw something similar in December?

A lot of stablecoins coming up this days.
In any case I think this is a bullish signal.

I also wondering about Eth Ts cap, it is allredy overcrowded... Adding more and more demand could be destructive.

Maybe we see soon a waves or Eos Stablecoin.

exstasie

legendary

Activity: 1806

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Quote from: timotron on September 28, 2018, 02:28:37 AM

This spam of Stablecoins can impact the market in the short term very positive ->much more volume and Billions of "USD`S"

Prepare your selves for a nice $$ injection in the market by USDC.

But in the long run, I believe this can be very dangerous as we get a lot of manipulative power in the ecosystem.

Ah, I see Circle's new stablecoin has been launched. Gemini just launched one as well.

I guess they can allow for manipulation in the same way that Mt Gox (the Willy bot) could. When you get down to it, a stablecoin is an "IOU" in the same way that an exchange account balance is an "IOU". A stablecoin issuer, just like an exchange, could inject unbacked money into circulation. Is that the kind of manipulation you're talking about?

timotron

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This spam of Stablecoins can impact the market in the short term very positive ->much more volume and Billions of "USD`S"

Prepare your selves for a nice $$ injection in the market by USDC.

But in the long run, I believe this can be very dangerous as we get a lot of manipulative power in the ecosystem.

Note: This is referred to USD "backed" StableCoins - Others like DAI still have nice fundaments.

Topic: Impact of USDC - Circle - & other Stable coins. Dangerous. (Read 698 times)