Topic: India Expands G20 Membership to G21 During Its Presidency. (Read 394 times)

Canada already has a very large Indian Sikh community. In India, this separatist movement is fighting for independence and is considered enemies of India by the current government.

India renames itself Bharat in G20 summit invite, reviving nationalist rowIndia renames itself Bharat in G20 summit invite, reviving nationalist row
https://www.rfi.fr/en/international/20230909-india-calls-itself-bharat-in-g20-summit-invite-reviving-nationalist-row

For India, apparently the issue of unifying old territories is very important, so they will fight separatism very hard.

Is that all you could come up with? Weak argument. Anyone with a half-decent brain can tell that are improving their relations with other countries for sure, but still couldn't bring forth drastic developments in certain areas which is why most of the country is still poor.

Name one Indian city which is comparable with Beijing, Seoul etc. You can't! You need to work a lot harder to improve your brainpower.

This is the same "global shuffle" I talked about 1-2 years ago, of course back then I mainly focused on the energy field (customers changing, etc.) but it is happening in all aspects globally like geopolitics.

As the Old World Order dies, a vacuum is create where everyone will try to take "their piece of the cake of power". For example over the past decade China is trying to become the new US while India is trying to become the new China. This is exactly why China has been moving into high tech productions and becoming a more serious player globally in matters other than economy while India has been doing what China did 30-40 years ago by getting closer to the West trying to reap the rewards while they can since the West is once again desperate for "allies" just like they were back when the World Order before the last was changing (US vs USSR where China got close to US to reap the rewards and grow).
This is also the reason why we saw India attend G20 like this while China is no longer enthusiastic enough about it.

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As for the One Road One Belt thing, the Indian relations and any future trade routs is not going to go against the Chinese thing. You have to consider that the amount of goods to be transferred is too massive to only rely on "one route" not to mention that India is already connected to and will use a lot of the same routes.

The accusation made, on Trudeau's part, is very serious. Unless he has 100% proof of the crime he described, he should not make such statements. If there is, then a bilateral commission should be set up, and India will have to admit its guilt and take appropriate steps. Otherwise, India's reputation will be sullied for a long time.... And this is not good for India now ! India is trying to distance itself from such "toxic", totalitarian and terrorist regimes as Russian, Chinese, Iranian. And then it does such an unacceptable act !
I hope this is not true or the investigation is wrong, I don't want to realize that India is being likened to the same terrorist Russia....

The ruling government of India wants to make its citizens have a big finding with the G-20. For this India had spent much higher amount than other countries spend on this meet. The government have allocated a budget close to $120 million and what it had spent is really heart breaking. The government have spend a whopping amount close to $495 million. Whats the need for it, and the government tries to hype things and convert these summit as a big success to get votes as the election is scheduled for the year 2024. The previous G-20 summit took place in Indonesia and what they've spent is just around $44 million. What a difference and these are all the money of the common people.

This is going to confuse the hell out of people who struggle with the belief Africa is a country.  How we going to educate them on that now, I already got told BRIC is a country and a currency.  Things are going to get more confusing before they get any simpler it seems
  I'm interested how the newest member would compare vs EU.  This discussion is not quite as serious as if it were giving all parties equal trading rights, it just includes them within the conversation and we can talk for decades without doing anything.  Its good people talk but also Im not sure it leads to anything except beyond recognition.   Its a good  idea anyway, China has been including Africa for sometime in its attempts via 'belt and roads' initiative.  That means its strategic to counter that by including this Africa union, but why has it taken till now.  China is still ahead in actual infrastructure built, the biggest link between the largest countries to Africa is still the legacy of occupation and the colonial period of history not too long ago.  France being involved within the Niger coup news recently for example.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belt_and_Road_Initiative#:~:text=The%20Belt%20and%20Road%20Initiative%20%28BRI%2C%20or%20B%26R%29%2C,more%20than%20150%20countries%20and%20international%20organizations.%20

https://edition.cnn.com/2023/08/29/africa/french-ambassador-defies-niger-junta-intl/index.html

The main thing is not how many countries are in a particular association, but how effective the association is and how equal the countries are. In my opinion, when a large alliance is dominated by a few countries and the rest do their bidding, it is a certain deadlock. Sooner or later the other countries will seek to create new alliances that will compete with this big union.

After the G-20+1 summit, the relationship between Canada and India has changed. If you are not aware of what has happened between these two countries, then let me provide you with a timeline.

• Justin Trudeau Accuses India of a Killing on Canadian Soil
• Indian government rejected the allegation
• Canada then expels an Indian diplomat
• India retaliates by expelling a Canadian diplomat
• Canada comes up with a travel advisory for India
• Indian government comes up with a travel advisory for Canada
• Latest update: India suspends visa for Canadians

There are three questions that I would like to ask everyone here.

• When will it stop?
• Which leader is responsible for escalating this issue?
• Which country do you think is lying?

I agree with you that the countries of Europe and the USA are using India to fight economically with China, but I think that it is not so simple. But the quality of technology in India is not the best and the Indians are even more cunning than the Chinese. I don’t think I’m in a hurry to draw conclusions about who will win here.

It's a little different.
India, today:
- is one of the leaders of the global south.
- one of the largest economies in the world (in the top 5)
- the country is actively developing and actively integrating into the world economy.
- is not an aggressor country or a country with "militaristic fervor".
- India is building mutually beneficial relations with its neighbors and the world.
- India has no contradictions with neighboring countries, there are no conflicts unleashed by India, and it does not pursue an aggressive policy.

That is why, at least within the "global south" India is a leader in all indicators. Can you name another ?

PS Taxes are paid by everyone and everywhere. "The state does not have its own money, the state eats citizens' taxes"

What we have learned from Ukraine war is that never mess with your might neighbour no matter how much support other powers are offering you. I wont say who is at fault in Ukarine and Russia conflict as its the people of Ukarine who are suffering right now. Big powers are using Ukraine to carry out there proxy war against Russia.
Taiwan must learn from this war for betterment of its own people.

India is more closely affiliated with Russia than they are of Ukraine. Zelenskyy would have nothing to do with G20 even if provided the opportunity only for the reason that India was hosting the summit this year. India's been purchasing Russian oil, and they've repeatedly abstained from voting to condemn Russia's invasion of Ukraine on any UN resolutions that comes up.

As for Xi Jinping, he would not be affiliated with an organization that is heavy with western countries. China is on the UN security counsel along with the U.S., but they joined as permanent members post WW2. It's one of the exceptions. They're membership is laughable anyways.

Africa's huge, so of course African Union deserves a spot at G20 (G21). But saying that India's dominating global politics seems out of touch with reality to me, to be honest. India's a huge country, but it doesn't look like it has a major worldwide influence. It's too 'neutral', too self-oriented in international politics. And while G20 sounds big, I think it doesn't work efficiently because it tries to encompass countries that have incompatible agendas without condemning anyone. So there's no political will there, and it's hard to achieve things without it.

India is never closer to any country if you check the history of Indian geo-political decisions. It neither opposes nor accepts and it is what makes India unpredictable. China's global ambition and the views that it has about its neighbors are of great concern to India. Recently it released a map wherein it showed many Indian states as part of India. The map does not end with India, it also claims parts of Russia and those countries in the South China Sea.

China will attack Taiwan, it is inevitable. When it attacks what steps will India take is now being asked by the US. I am not an expert, but I know China would suffer and the US would be making a lot of money when the war starts in Asia. I hope it does not happen as a lot of innocent lives will be lost.

I guess thats the main reason, other than that India is also getting closer to the U.S now, so this is like the worst time for India to invite Chinese President. What might add another heat for China is since India change it's international presence to Bharat, there are some concern that they have hidden agenda, like expanding their influence in Southeast Asia, which is also the Agenda of China.

Yes, you are correct the cold conflict between India and the US is one the reason. The primary reason would be the IMEC corridor, as it is challenging the Belt & Road wherein China has heavily invested. The IMEC is just destroying what China wanted which was a complete monopoly over the global market.

The day Modi became the PM he has been facing backlash from the opposition. Some agitations were a succes but mostly he has been dominating over the opposition. The opposition now has formed an alliance to counter the Modi factor for which they gave their alliance name I.N.D.I.A. That was the reason why the government started using Bharat for the G20 summit.

China is now not trusted by the West. As for now a lot of big companies from the US and the Europe are slowly moving their manufacturing unit to India. For example the new iPhone 15 is the first to have Made in India tag. Slowly & steadily more companies would be moving to India. It would take some time and then it would effect the Chinese economy.

The conflict between China and the United States, as well as with India, might be included in speculations about President Xi's absence at the G20 Summit in India. The ongoing trade war with the U.S. and the border tensions with India are hot-button issues that are inevitably linked to Xi's absence from the meeting. However, as long as China fails to provide clarity, no one can be certain about the true purpose and intentions of his absence, leaving Prime Minister Li as the representative.

Is this detrimental to India? I believe not. Previously, Modi faced criticism from the opposition regarding his relationship with Xi Jinping, which ultimately backfired when it was followed by border clashes. Consequently, Xi Jinping's presence would never be seen as a sincere effort by India to resolve the border issues.

China wields significant authority and numerous countries still depend on China. In my opinion, Xi's absence from the meeting in India could be a strategic move to prevent the G20 nations from becoming overly fixated on China. Leadership becomes fragile when it relies solely on one individual.

As you said you do not understand geo-politics! It would have been great if you hadn't replied on this thread. Let me explain to you why it is a big win for India in 3-pointers.

• First country to hold G-20 Summit
• The joint declaration did not talk about the War on Ukrain
• India – Middle East – Europe Economic Corridor (IMEC)

Do a Google search on the above three pointers and you will understand why the G-20 was one of the biggest geo-political success for India. Another thing that I do not understand is, why are you saying India has the highest tax slab. India is not even on any list of the highest-taxed countries. Do your research before any stupid rants that have no logical proof on this thread.

China is being punished by the Western nations, for the help it is providing to Russia during the last few years. Also, the Taiwan issue is getting bumped up again and again. And it is easy to see who is benefitting from all this. A lot of western manufacturers are moving their factories from China to other Asian nations such as India, Vietnam and Philippines. India in particular is benefitting immensely. They are getting cheap hydrocarbons from Russia, and at the same time Western investors are also pouring their money into that country.

The G20 is a platform for the Bretton Woods system, which was created to extend the life of this system. India is the chairing country this year, so they cannot help but participate, and the presidents of China and Russia did not participate because there are no topics to discuss. The old economic system is beginning to collapse, and new models have not yet been provided, except for dividing the world into currency zones.

I don't really know a lot about this G20 stuff, but I do know that you are exaggerating by stating that India is dominating global politics and many countries are trying to get into their good books. Hilarious!

This is the same country that taxes the shit out of their citizens without offering much in return. Think!

It's pretty obvious, isn't it? India and China relations have been getting worse with time and Xi is just another pathetic dictator with a over-inflated ego which is why he didn't show up.

I have read before in several economic and societal insights that the biggest resource of India is indeed her people and education is essential if they expect to play a big part in the coming multy polarized world the BRICS is aiming to build.

Though, If you asked me, I still remain quite skeptical on how far friendly relations between China and India can go, keeping in mind those are countries which have current territorial disagreements. Also, even though we could argue that India should also keep their eyes on the energy market and not depend on Russia or China in the long term.

There is no difference between economic partnership and political partnership because they work together. If an economic bloc has political issues with another bloc, they are going to collaborate in support for one another. So it is also a clique that india is fostering whichever way that we look at it. India is gradually getting into competition with China and even US wiih her large population. The success of the summit is laudable since it has increased in numerical strength which will further give india space in competing in African economy.

Indeed, India has vast and dense population, that can be a valuable resource for its development and progress if educated and trained properly to meet the challenges of emerging technologies. Investing in education is crucial for India and African nations who have recently gained membership status of BRICS organization. This investment is vital to effectively take benefit of potential opportunities that this organization can bring among member counties in terms of mutual investment and trade collaborations.

India is a country that has a dense population, and this is a resource to build a better country by relying on human resources, India needs a lot of support and investment to become a prosperous country, we know that many intelligent people come from from India and now serving in big world companies, it shows that India has the motivation to make its country better.

This expansion aims to increase possibilities and increase cooperation with many countries. If the Indian people receive education like China during the development years, I think India will be more advanced than China itself through this event.

India's key advantage is that it is civilized and deliberate. India does not make itself the "navel of the earth", nor does it deny progress, development and universal values. It does not try to "make friends against anyone", but tries to bring other countries into the CIVILIZED world for effective and equal interaction. Especially now is a great moment - the "Chinese fairy tale" may be starting its sunset and slipping into totalitarianism and opposition to Western civilization, as well as using predatory methods of absorbing other countries' resources and economies. India is wiser and has a great chance to become the leader of the so-called "Global South"

India is a democratic country, it is one of the biggest democracies in the world. It does have the largest population in the world and small issues do happen which get reported in the media. Indian political focus under the Congress was to suppress the majority and uphold the biggest minority, which is the Indian Muslim. Under the ruling party that has been stopped and a lot of development work has been done for that community.

If you think the ruling party is indulging in divide and rule politics then you have zero idea about India. PM Modi is the reason why India a country from the Indian subcontinent had hosted the G20 summit. He is the reason why India is projected to become a third biggest economy in the world by 2030. He is the reason why every big global economy wants to invest in India. You won't understand anything as you put religion first in all the accomplishments India achieved under his leadership.

It's lovely to see all positive comments. I believe the current success of India is a very strong indicator of future growth. Especially the shipping corridor which will connect the EU and African Union from India. Smaller and economically poor countries have now understood that China is not their friend. They have learnt from Sri Lanka's failure and they have seen how India has extended a billion dollar support during the crisis. Also India has a history of non violance it is indeed one of the oldest civilizations in the world which used to control 37% of world GDP before British came in.

When it comes to a power balance game, everyone will choose a good partner and not an expansionist one like China.

A lot of drama is going on behind the curtains. For the last few years, India have been actively trying to move the manufacturing units from China to it's territory with a lot of success being achieved this year. On top of that, China believes that India is the reason why a number of participants have recently pulled out from the Belt and Road Initiative (BRI). And during the past few months, India managed to replace pro-China regimes with pro-India governments in smaller countries such as Nepal and Sri Lanka. China appears to be in the backfoot at this point.

Instead of viewing it as a mere numerical change, we should focus on the potential implications of extending membership to the entire African continent. This represents profoundly positive development that can potentially create new opportunities for the people of African nations to grasp, subsequently enhancing  the quality of life for themselves and their families.

When a country have got wider plans with the associated nations it is being praised. This is really a great move in terms of politics, but the person who had been praised for such an addition should have the same mind way of thinking ruling the people within the country. Everything is connected to electrol politics, but there should be humanity. The ruling government have been very clear with the divide and rule. The target is to divide people based on religion and win the elections. A leader that is being driven by religion can never make things successful and what he does is a show off. The addition or the discussion doesn't gonna make any changes. The ruling government have tried to change its name just because the name INDIA is used by the opposition alliance.

This is a good move from India, they can try to make an effective progress through this, it's not all about forming a clique that matters but seing governments coming together to a cause of a progressive unity and development among themselves, we are expecting them together with other leaders to form a leadership worth emulation, think more about the people than themselves, also make policies that will lead to massive development more than ever before, am so excited seing some of the African countries in attendance, this will give them more insights to what more is expected of them to deliver to the people they govern.

India's advantage is wisdom, compromise, and real achievements - both in economics, politics, including as a "manager" of whole groups of countries. And most importantly, India is not trying to oppose itself to the world, and not trying to plunge its friends and partners into "slavery", as China is trying to do now. This is a big plus for India ! When the BRICS countries and the African Union understand the renal essence of China's dedollarization-yuanization, they will have no other option but to turn to India, a wise and mutually beneficial country. It is foolish to deny that the BRICS/African Union countries have "complexes" about the Global West, and they will not soon turn there. And "between two fires" (the West and China with its enslavement plans), they will choose India !

The India Prime Minister Modi had done the diplomatic move,this may help the African union in different ways.Because as we now,the economy of African countries was not good now,So this will help them to do some export to the other nation and increase their economy.The African Union should use this opportunity in a good way to build their economy.As we know their was no good relationship with India and China due to the border issue.The Aksai Chin may be the reason for this move by the Chinese President,the Ukraine and Russia move was unexpected one.

India is doing alot these days. Aside from the expansion and BRICS initiative supposed to include them and other African countries, they recently made a successful landing on the moon among other countries who have previously done so like the U.S, Russia, China.
Chinese government is simply trying to stay put until it has successfully actualized its BRICs or yeunization as you sited.
Countries are just merely trying to be careful with their relationship these days as world tension is building up, and a new world order which will cause a considerable change is brewing.

Every year China renews the map and makes changes to it. This year they made a barrier to the sea in the southern part of the map and made it a border. On the western side, they came to the Indian side. The Indian foreign office protested to China. In fact, China does this every year and the states do nothing about China's expansionism. China is not participating in the G20 because it does not want to confront the US and other Western countries there. They don't want to answer to anyone while China's expansionist policy continues. We have moved to a bipolar world and the G20 and G10 need to be revised.

India is choosing the tactically correct path. While China is trying to yuanize and put the BRICS countries under its thumb, India is creating a new alliance. India is moving away from the bloc with China, which has growing problems, and from toxic Russia, and taking control into its own hands. My assumption is that India is building an alliance on the basis of BRICS+Arfrican Union to create a geo-economic and possibly political alliance for the new century. India is discarding the "sick, contagious and flabby" players of the world stage and taking its rightful place. At the same time, India is doing one more smart thing - moving away from ties with pariah countries, toxic countries, and similar "world losers", in favor of the Western vector, Western markets, and Western values!
I am sincerely happy for India, most likely - a new leader in the Asian-Southeast and African region !

You are right about the rail and port agreement between India, the United States, Saudi Arabia, and the European Union. it is meant to counter China's One Belt, One Road. That is the primary reason why the Chinese President did not attend the G20 summit. Another reason that I found out is that Xi Jinping suffering from a Cerebral Aneurysm. I saw on X that this might be another reason that he skipped the G20 meeting as he was not well. Well, there are other reasons that are circulating the Internet for his absence from the summit. Still, without his presence, India was able to successfully host the G20 summits.

The number was already meaningless for decades as one of the seats is held by the EU while the same EU has other 3 seats DE,IT,FR and also Spain is a permanent guest member while having the 15th largest economy in the world. So the whole G20  was just as inaccurate as G21 or G44.

But it's a bit of political stuff here, by changing the number is acknowledging them as a full member, not some random invite, it's the gesture that counts here. Anyhow, one big FY to BRICS, along with the new development rail and shipping corridor that rivals the Chinese Silkroad it basically showed the world again where the real money is.


Because he didn't want to be there and cheer and applaud at projects that left China sidelined, that's why! The whole thing was engineered as a Western response to the BRICS soup kitchen project and he won't want to stand there and be humiliated while seeing how his plans and influence go down the drain.

Just think how he could smile when seeing funding in the tens of billions of projects that are designed to take out the whole manufacturing from China and move it to India and middle east?

This is a very good development and I hope it will be able to achieve the reason why the AU and the old members agree on the term.

But instead of trying to make it G20 which disfigures the round figure of such like it, why not maintain the G20 irrespective of how many members they have? By the name, it would have easily defined the started member states.

As it is now, China is trying to do anti-US and Western states, it's possible the vacuum will still help in maintaining the G20 name without disfiguring it to G21.

It is done and dusted as India changes the status quo of G20 to G21 under its presidency. African Union is now part of the new G21 group, a brilliant geopolitical move by India. India is hosting the current G20 summit for the first time and being a host if a country can change the status quo of a powerful economic group for the first time, then it is a big achievement. 55 sovereign states are part of the African Union as per Wikipedia. I may be wrong if I am then do correct me.

In recent times India has been dominating global politics and every big economy has been trying its level best to get themselves on their good books. The next news that we all are waiting for from this summit is the G20 crypto regulation framework. This will be followed by all of these nations with some minor changes according to their local requirement.  

BTW, The Chinese president was not present in this meeting nor did Zelensky and Putin. I can understand the problem with Putin & Zelensky, what I did not understand was why the Chinese premier thought of canceling his visit. A few days back he was present at the BRICS summit which for me looks kind of awkward. Do you guys think he canceled his visit because of the existing border issue with India or something else?

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