Topic: Intentional or omission, Negligence or accident on covid-19 pandemic ? (Read 160 times)

USA/UK knew of the risk in first week of january once the isolation and identification was truly confirmed.
anything before january was speculation and too early to cause panic. due to low patient numbers and due to the small amount of cases being linked to one location (speculation that it could have been food poisoning or touch contact spread)
yes some chinese doctors were repremanded for trying to incite panic before anything was confirmed by science. confirmed respiratory virus. and then confirmed spread via non-touch-contact method.
but once the official and science confirmed details were public. USA/UK could and should have acted.

chin closed its own flights and went on a high grade track, trace and isolate process..
but USA/UK did not. instead USA/UK actually purposefully done repatriation flights.

yep UK/USA went against responsible guidelines

yes in hindsight some doctors unconfirmed hunches did actually come to realisation. but it could have also been equal chance of being wrong. so raising an alarm without confirmation can cause panic.. yes in hindsight people can view the 'whistle blow' of a hunch as a good alert to have raised, now we know for sure that it was a virus. but at the time it was an unconfirmed hunch/possibility.

USA/UK done bad stuff before too.. like the ebola outbreak years ago in africa. USA/UK actually brought infected people into US/UK. rather then just provide funding to treat them within the outbreak country.

you cant blame china for US/UK action/inaction

A lot of people hold the believe and opinion that  covid  was intentional enginneered in the lab and let out on purpose with intent. This believe is held because of the the virus rate of infection amd replication in the society. To me, I believe that we are at this standpoint in history because of negligence. Of the first suspecious cases were taken seriously, the scenerio of a pandemic would have been avoided.

You can't trap the dragon into a cage, the dragon will just go on fury and take out all the prey. You know what I mean, it means another global conflict again and if this happened a few will survive or even extinction will follow with the huge radiation effect of a nuclear war. I say we solve this slowly and peacefully.

IMHO the idea of taking China to court for this is absurd.

The virus arose and spread because China is a big country that is developing rapidly and unevenly. There are many people living 'Western-style' lives with lots of money in big cities, and travelling around the world. At the same time there are poor peasant communities living almost medieval lives. This is why you have people eating infected bats (or whatever) and also why the virus can spread. You can't blame China for this.

Where China is at fault is its initial suppression of whistle-blowers and that period of inactivity that followed, which allowed the start of the spread. But after this, once they acknowledged the problem, China's response was strong, lightning-fast and I would say exemplary. This is why all (or certainly most, depending on the accuracy of official figures) of China's new cases are from people entering the country. I don't think China can be criticised too harshly for failing to anticipate how this situation would evolve globally. There is no precedent in living memory. SARS and MERS are closest, but did not spread anything like as much as CV-19.

I think a lot of other countries, particularly here in Europe, are at fault. They saw what happened in China, and decided not to implement immediate lockdowns and quarantining. They gambled not to take the short-term economic hit - they gambled with the lives of their citizens, and lost. Now it is too late, they have put the lockdowns in place, but the economic damage is huge and people are dying. I'm sure that this will be brought under control, but nothing hides the fact that the West acted too slowly. They had the example of China right there in front of them, and did nothing until much too late.

If any country tries to take China to court, then they would be doing so purely in an attempt to mask their own failings.

from hindsight. here is the state of actions

patient zero. ecember10th
has mild/minor symptoms, just went to local clinic for normal flu meds. went back to work
(no harm, no sign of anything big, thus no problem)

same patient, december 18th
hospitalised with more severe symptoms
(this point, one case, no big deal)

it took 3 weeks from that point to start noticing other patients coming in with similar symptoms.

yes on december 30th, doctors were starting to see a patern. but without knowing how it was transmitted. EG was it food poisoning, localised gas attack, or touch/contact. no one knew. because it was still localised to sources of the wet market
thus still too early to raise an international alert for a local incident occuring in only 1 city

january 9th chin told the world

month later. china had made new hospitals

.. to me china did not do anything wrong. here

however.. the world knew about it january 9th. but the world was still asking its citizens to travel around the world back home.
even in march america was trying to ask americans in china to find a way back to america
to me this is america bringing the virus to the USA. not WUHAN forcing people onto planes

america in march only started making excess hospital bed capacity..
..

the other thing is. if america actually funded its healthcare properly. to always have excess provisions to cover any form of disaster, then it would not need to self isolate people to delay the spread while they prep hospitals for whats to come.
instead the hospitals would be ready to take ventilators out of store same day and put them bed side in many wards, and then just get going treating people, in standard herd immunity methods of letting people mingle and dealing with the marginal people who severely suffer

all of the isolation restrictions are not about curing people of a virus. there is no cure. people are not getting meds sent to them in the post to immunise themselves at home
this isolation is purely to delay a future mass spread so that they get extra time to make hospital capacity.

so again. its not china that causes local hospital capacity drops in the last couple decades. its the local governments under budgeting them

Not really slow buddy... The pandemic is at its pick now and the reason for the curiosity for the research to have an idea.
Meanwhile, most thread about it is less than a month. This is the focus at the moment and the reason to discuss it and help provide users with information and what to read on it here on the thread. Thanks

You are very slow.  I hope no one takes your advice, since we are 2+ months ahead of you.

I have been curious about the covid-19 pandemic that is spreading like wide fire. All the why's and oh! no have been on my head to understand at least a thing about this health calamity that has shut the world economy down and still spreading.

Therefore, I went into research trying to get my mind on something I could have a trace on about the virus.

Thus, I found something. It might also interest you to read about what I found that we can discuss.

It really took me some time to come to it.

https://swarajyamag.com/amp/story/world%2Fhow-china-can-indeed-be-sued-in-the-icj-heres-a-possible-case

This is a serious discussion. So please, don't ask or suggest to me to move it to legal board.

Is serious, hence my choice to bring it here.