Topic: Invest Bitcoins due to launch shortly!! (Read 2915 times)

Seems like another ponzi scheme.

This has to be the fucking worst idea I've ever heard of, even if it isn't a scam.

1st rule to investing: Never invest with anyone that guarantees a profit


This is obviously either a scam, or it will fail miserably. OP clearly has NO knowledge of investing. "Guaranteeing" a profit, opens you up to countless lawsuits. Say he guarantees 6% a year, you only get a 5.5% return. Take him to court, you will win every single time.

If you want to trust your money with rookie investors, be my guest, and enjoy the returns. You would likely get a higher return just by holding your BTC anyways... Much less risk.

Goodluck with your venture, but Im not touching this with a 10 foot pole

Where are you operating from ? If u run away where the investors should chase you ? You are saying about investment in Govt bonds. Are you at par with RBI & SEBI laws ? The moment you try to invest in Govt bonds, u have to convert in INR and u have to abide by either SEBI or RBI rules.

This is a far less riskier investment is probably where you did not get it on the spot.
Guess that the problem with this is going to be trust and as we know that nothing grows through the forums, I have advised him to look at different marketing opportunities.

always welcome constructive criticism, not saying I m the wisest investor in this forum...
Care to elaborate as to where I m mistaken?

It is not a well thought out opinion is all..

 ?

Hmmm... an opinion.. Valuable stuff that dope!!

On top of what Neo said...Why would I pay you to convert my exposure in BTC to exposure in INR, when in all likelihood, the odds of getting returns higher than 6% on BTC are much much higher. What you are really doing is protecting the investments in INR and not in BTC. Infact, even that's not the case because inflation in India is much higher than those fixed income returns.

You not only do not understand the exchange rate risk, your fund provides no real value to investors. On top of it the compliance issues that someone else also pointed above, makes this investment an almost sure shot loosing preposition.

The ONLY way a BTC investor would gain is if after investing in your venture, the BTC price goes down. And if an investor is willing to take that bet, he might be better off by selling his BTC.

I personally don't care how you got your bitcoins, mined or stolen from an old lady. I m not the bitcoin police  


What I am saying is that they WOULD ask questions, either to you, or to them. So you argument of using them as the middle man to avoid such eventuality, if it were to arise, is ludicrous.

What I do know is that investing in an unknown, unregulated company in India (I guess they must be  - otherwise they would have to prove provenance of funds) that will exchange BTCs into fiat to buy bonds, is far more risky than to use BTC-e myself and buy some Greek bonds.

But hey, that's my opinion. Caveat emptor.

EDIT: I m not saying this is a scam or not. I have no ways of knowing. I m just merely underlining this as a risky investment.

If you mined your coins, the blockchain makes that obvious (No Inputs (Newly Generated Coins)).  No red flags and no need to complicate things.
Claiming you mined your coins when the coins aren't freshly mined can be a bit tricky.  You'd be better off saying you found them under your couch cushions...

So what will be the payout in case we follow kittucrypt's example, if i choose for it to be in BTC -- considering you are asking for BTC investment? 2,65,000/27,500  = 9.363636 ...a 6.4% loss...why will someone invest with you again? Please dont say "protecting the current value of BTC" .....cause what happens if BTC value goes down below the current rate? Say 22,500 --- will you send me 11.78 BTC? Or just the 10.6 BTC?

So....

I invested my Bitcoins.

Period.

Now what?

Oh..  I mined my coins.. if that is going to be the next question.

But wouldn't that raise flags regarding their own bank account? I mean, wouldn't the indian government ask where this money is coming from? who the investors are? these would be legitimate questions to avoid money laundering. Being the middle man who takes BTC and converts them into fiat would make you an accessory to such scheme. Hence, why they would have to provide the financial body of the country they are operating in proofs that the provenance of such funds are clean. How could they do that since investors would be anonymous?   

This, added to the fact that they are unknown, makes this a very very risky enterprise.

My 2 cents.

Our effort lies in protecting the current value of BTC. In the example that you've quoted, what we would do is convert the 10 BTC at the time of investment to INR based on BTC-e prices and invest the same into the plan of your choice. Let's say you choose the plan which gave you a return of 6% - in that case you get 6% over and above on the INR value at the time of conversion, which means that you would get INR 2,65,000 in total at the end of the deposit term (using your example)

The final payout will happen either in BTC or fiat depending on your choice at the end of the term.

Regards
Invest Bitcoin

Here is a numeric example to highlight flaw in your so called "business plan".

Lets say I send you 10 BTC at current market price to invest. Now you cant invest BTC in any guaranteed return scenario. You have to invest the FIAT and like you said you choose to invest them in govt securities in India. Thus, you will go ahead and convert 10BTC-> INR and at current rates that would come to be around 250,000 INR.

Now lets say you put this money in whatever investment you intend to and generate a 6% return. Which means you will have 15,000 INR as retrn or 265,000 as total cash on hand.

Now you have to give me a 6% return on my BTC, which means you  have to give me 10.6 BTC back. The ONLY and I stress the ONLY way you will be able to do that is if BTC->INR exchange rate does not change. Even if BTC appreciates by 10% to say 27,500 , which is sooo much possible, you will need to cough up 291,500 to give me back my 10.6 BTC. Hell you will need 275,00 to even give back my 10 BTC. How will you get the difference?

Your plan is exposed to a significant exchange rate risk, which you are not even taking into account.

I suggest members to do their math before investing in this. I am not calling this scam. I believe its just poor investment

Circular reasoning is circular.


And yet you do it.


The securities you claim to be investing in are overseen, you're not.  I'm not worried about government bonds (you later changed this to "approved securities").  My issue is with *you*.

P.S:  I wouldn't normally bother to comment on something like this, but the patently absurd IPOs have gotten traction here make this worthy of comment.

While we know Benson, the guarantee of 6% comes from the fact that our investments provide that as a minimum. While we do understand that no investment can be guaranteed to such a great extent, our securities are overseen and have proven wise investments for huge part of the Indian population and this is our effort to open out this service to anyone interested in India and worldwide.

Regards
Team Invest Bitcoin

Well, his conviction has me sold
And I do see a small market for this as well.
May not be best for the internet, more like a Business Development drive may be needed to market this, but there will be users.

Am out of this. Cheers!

In other words, you don't care how plausible his "guaranteed 6%" promise is, he's your buddy, you trust him, and wish to support his business.
That's fine, and perhaps this is a reasonable investment for OP's other friends, but expecting to raise money on the internet simply doesn't make much sense.
And neither does justifying this scheme with "[it will benefit the] half of India [who] do not have access to banks or bank accounts."

From my perspective, all I am doing is putting a small part of my BTC into an investment, which I know can hold a steady return.
Am not looking at what he is doing with the BTC.

In that case, what's your motivation for "investing" in this?  Other than the guy being your buddy.

There are easier ways to launder money. I would not go through this if I wanted to launder money.

I was responding to OP's claim that his scheme would benefit the "half of India do not have access to banks or bank accounts."
You, on the other hand, are simply trying to launder money.
This scheme also fails at effective money laundering.

The securities that we are talking about are fixed deposits and bonds which have been very popular for generations in India. It's also one of the most sought after investment methods for many due to the guarantee of returns..

Regards
Team Invest Bitcoin

I do, but quite a few people I know have been questioned while using their bank accounts to trade.
Would rather not be one of them at this point in time.

Hmm... it seems weird as i do not believe anyone can handpick bonds with guaranteed success.

^
You do not have a bank account?

it seems like a smart way to bring money back into the countries banking system without raising too many flags.

I have problems converting my BTC to INR easily out here. I do not mind dumping few into this.
I know the guy running it, so will invest more out of that reason than anything else.

And these folks, sans bank accounts, managed to acquire so much BTC that they need to invest it back into fiat securities?  In the most efficient way possible?

Our handpicked schemes are top performing for sure and that's why we guarantee anywhere between 6% to 11% annually.

[/quote]


Just to be clear, what currency is this guarantee it?  We're providing BTC.  We'll receive BTC when cashing out.  That would suggest your guarantee is also in BTC.
But of course you are talking about a guarantee in fiat.  Which fiat?  What exchange prices are used?  You also have fees.  What does this cost?  Not Lambchop has a valid point.  People can do this themselves.  It's not a big deal to convert BTC to fiat or buy bonds at your local bank.  You may have a small opening for convenience, but certainly investors need more information.  And there currently is a HUGE risk investing with BTC.


[/quote]


Dear Elmwar,

  BTC can be paid during cashout or FIAT directly to a bank account. We use Btc-e exchange as that has been the most reliable exchange so far to deliver funds to India. Once we receive the BTC, we convert it into INR and store it in government approved securities. In the event that we find a better exchange, we will be glad to use it as long as the funds transfer to India is simple.

 This initiative comes from the fact that half of India do not have access to banks or bank accounts. While that is likely to change quite soon, BTC can help a lot with this right now.

It is more a matter of convenience for people who hold BTC and want to invest it directly without converting.  This would be a niche market product for people who are expecting the Indian Economy to work for them over the next 5 years (elections are underway and tremendous change is expected).

Regards
Team Invest Bitcoin

[/quote]

Our handpicked schemes are top performing for sure and that's why we guarantee anywhere between 6% to 11% annually.

[/quote]


Just to be clear, what currency is this guarantee it?  We're providing BTC.  We'll receive BTC when cashing out.  That would suggest your guarantee is also in BTC.
But of course you are talking about a guarantee in fiat.  Which fiat?  What exchange prices are used?  You also have fees.  What does this cost?  Not Lambchop has a valid point.  People can do this themselves.  It's not a big deal to convert BTC to fiat or buy bonds at your local bank.  You may have a small opening for convenience, but certainly investors need more information.  And there currently is a HUGE risk investing with BTC.

Nah.  It's totally retarded.  Why would anyone averse to risks intentionally send his bitcoin to a d00d who promises to make him rich by investing in ... handpicked government bonds

What's particularly lulworthy is your "guarantee anywhere between 6% to 11% annually."
Starting with purely structural analysis, this statement could be reduced to "guarantee of 6%," unless you're implying that you guarantee that your marks clients will never profit *more* than 11% per annum.
On a more contextual level, the road to poverty is paved with guarantees from random (in this case not very creative) d00ds from the intert00bs.

People who do not believe in Bitcoin divest from Bitcoin, not dump it with the latest halfass interwebs scammer.
Give it up. OP, this forum has all the clowns it can handle.

Dear Elmwar,

Thanks for taking the time out to share your thoughts... It was plunge in prices that actually got us to work on this, coz we know of a lot of people who bought Bitcoin when it was $1000+ and now they have incurred a loss! Would have loved to start this service much earlier, however, we're hoping that it's better late than never and would prove to be useful to at least the rest of the crowd who may want to make that investment now.

We are also working on launching gold and real - estate in the coming months, post our launch of bonds and deposits! Silver has not been on our list, but would definitely look into it..(+1 for the suggestion)

It's great to know that people in the community are opting for gold and silver as optional/ additional investments.

Thanks once again for writing here!

Regards
Team Invest Bitcoin

Dear notLambchop,

Seems like you've mixed up something somewhere... We are not talking about individuals who would convert their fiat to Bitcoin to invest with us in a government bond...(that we understand as retard!) We provide services to individuals and corporates who want to invest their Bitcoin in deposits/ bonds which would give them their guaranteed returns!! - so that's not retard after all

"The risk-averse individuals who invest in government bonds invest directly in government bonds" - that's up to the individual. (here, people are investing their fiat into bonds directly. Our service is for people with Bitcoin - convert them to fiat and invest them on their behalf).  Our handpicked schemes are top performing for sure and that's why we guarantee anywhere between 6% to 11% annually.

And as far as "some d00d on the interweb" is concerned, we completely understand that trust cannot be built in a jiffy. It's with time, that trust is built. And we are happy to go that route..

Regards
Team Invest Bitcoin

There could be an advantage for some long time bitcoin holders who wish to hold profit at the current fiat price.  If people did this 3 months ago, the could now sell and double their bitcoin.  If people did this themselves, there would be tax implications that would be hard to hide.  Using a service like this could be quicker and hide profits for a time, but you're also paying for the service.

One suggestion, instead of just fiat bonds, why not the option of gold and silver?  Bonds give a set return, however most bitcoin users believe it's not worth the paper it's printed on.  You could offer both and let them decide.  I've actually converted some profit to gold and silver recently.  There are several places that accept bitcoin.

There could be a small niche here for you, but it's not something I'm interested in at the moment.  Best of luck.

The risk-averse individuals who invest in government bonds invest directly in government bonds.  They do not convert their fiat into Bitcoin to send to some d00d on the interweb so that said d00d could convert it back to fiat and invest in government bonds for them.  That's retarded.

Thanks Benson Samuel

Regards
Team Invest Bitcoin

Hope you guys do well. All the best!

Hi minerpart,

Thanks for sharing your thoughts/ comments.

Not everyone feels the same way. There are quite a few people who still continue to invest in these bonds/ deposits which guarantee income, rather than taking the risk of fluctuating prices of Bitcoin.

And there are also a large group of people who accept BTC either for their services, miners who earn BTC over a period of time, etc. They do not always convert their BTC into fiat immediately, thus taking the risk of depreciating value of Bitcoin.

Our services cater to that group who want to invest in something that would give them guaranteed returns, rather than opting to take a risk with the Bitcoin/s in hand.

Regards
Team Invest Bitcoin

Hi Rannasha,

The investment is more for people who want to safeguard BTC at the current prices, thus saving from any sort of price crashes, if there are any.

Regards
Team Invest Bitcoin

Global financial collapse of debt-ridden countries is immanent and you propose investing in their Bonds?! Government Bonds are going to crash and burn and become almost worthless and at that time BTC is likely to be increasing in value as investors seek a safe haven.



And another thing, there is nothing Bitcoin related in your proposal you are just raising FIAT to invest in the FIAT system. It's bonkers if you see a future for BTC.

How will you guarantee returns in Bitcoin if you invest in fiat-denominated assets? What if the BTC/USD rate goes up by a factor 2, 5 or even 10?

Come on Sporket!!! We ain't hunting... Thanks for sharing that message though.. I must say that it's quite an interesting read

Our investments are gonna be the first of its kind, where we guarantee returns at the end of the term...

Hope that would help at least a wee bit....

Regards
Team Invest Bitcoin

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/bitcoin-investor-a-conservationists-perspective-563180
Hunt responsibly.

Hi All,

To give you a brief introduction, we are part of the Invest Bitcoin team.

We will be launching our services shortly in India and worldwide, where we encourage investors to invest their Bitcoin/s with us and we in turn deposit the amount in various Government bonds, deposits and schemes, which would enable our investors to earn guaranteed returns at the end of the term.

Would highly appreciate your support in making this a success. Do like us on our Facebook page and follow us on Twitter to get the latest updates.

PS: we are still in our pre-launch stage and hence, haven't published the link to our website. Will provide the details when we are ready for launch.

Facebook link: https://www.facebook.com/pages/Invest-Bitcoin/260184967486696
Twitter: https://twitter.com/Invest_Bitcoin (@Invest_Bitcoin)

Regards
Team Invest Bitcoin